# how long do tubes last...



## david henman (Feb 3, 2006)

...and how do you know when it's time to think about replacing them?


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## Rugburn (Jan 14, 2009)

It really depends on two things, how much you use them and how well they're made. Old school RCA tubes and the like typically last much longer than most modern production tubes. Tubes that are past thier prime sound quieter and less lively.


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## david henman (Feb 3, 2006)

...my traynor ycv15blue gets played almost daily, gigs at least once a month and put through weekend rehearsals that can last up to ten hours. i've had it for roughly five years - never changed the tubes.


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## jimsz (Apr 17, 2009)

david henman said:


> ...my traynor ycv15blue gets played almost daily, gigs at least once a month and put through weekend rehearsals that can last up to ten hours. i've had it for roughly five years - never changed the tubes.


After that amount of time and use, which appears considerable, would you appreciate and benefit from the change a new set of tubes might offer in the sound, especially for the gigs?


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## washburned (Oct 13, 2006)

I've read several opinions, but most agree as a rule for amps that are played daily for practice, rehearsing and gigging, power tubes should last at least a year and preamp tubes almost indefinitely. There are some amps out there that seem to have an appetite for power tubes, and others that hardly ever need a change.


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

Are we talking about new production tubes? NOS tubes? Pre-amp tubes? Phase Inverter? Power Tubes

There's a HUGE gap of quality between new production tubes and NOS tubes. I've had new production 12ax7 last 2 years and some 3 weeks as they went microphonic. The best investment in tube you can make are in your pre-amp section, with NOS tubes in your V1 and a balanced PhaseInverter tube (which feeds your power tube section). 

Power Tubes in the new production can be really "blah" and some of higher quality. I prefer JJ's and TAD STR for my EL-84s for their consistency in construction and realiability. Some like the GoldLion Genalex Reissue have been plagued with problems. I had 2 or 3 pairs go bad in less than 20hrs of use. I don't see the need/reason to pay for the higher price tag of NOS Power Tubes. They will most likely last longer, but if you like keeping your amp at it's premium performance, the 3x costs of will add up really quickly. Now how you use your power tubes section will dictate how they will perform and for how long. I always prefered the tone I get with the MV dimed on my amp as it opens them up (as they should IMHO). This drives them alot harder then if you only had them at 9-10 all the time.

Depending on your amp, it could benefit from having its PhaseInverter changed every second power tube change or every 10 power tube change. You will definately know its time!

Getting a good quality NOS Rectifier is also a great idea, simply for the quality of the construction of the tube and the lifelong reliability you will get from it. 

David - I find it absolutely mind bogglin' that you haven't changed the tubes in your amp in 5 years. I think you may fall flat on your arse when you do!!! It is to me pretty much unconcievable that you would not have heard a decrease in the amp's tone at all! But we all hear things differently of course.

Cheers
Ben


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## david henman (Feb 3, 2006)

...yep - that is the question.



jimsz said:


> After that amount of time and use, which appears considerable, would you appreciate and benefit from the change a new set of tubes might offer in the sound, especially for the gigs?


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## david henman (Feb 3, 2006)

...you wouldn't say that if you knew me, ben! i'm not exactly known for having great ears. passion? check. work ethic? check. willing to learn and take advice? check. but my hearing is, well, not so great. i'm not sure i would recognize "tone" if it walked right up to me and formally introduced itself.

anyway, based on your advice, i think i will contact the tube store and order a set of JJs. 

i have no idea what a phase inverter is, and have certainly never replaced one, so i'll ask about that, as well.

thanks for your detailed input.



CSBen said:


> Are we talking about new production tubes? NOS tubes? Pre-amp tubes? Phase Inverter? Power Tubes
> 
> There's a HUGE gap of quality between new production tubes and NOS tubes. I've had new production 12ax7 last 2 years and some 3 weeks as they went microphonic. The best investment in tube you can make are in your pre-amp section, with NOS tubes in your V1 and a balanced PhaseInverter tube (which feeds your power tube section).
> 
> ...


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

CSBen said:


> Are we talking about new production tubes? NOS tubes? Pre-amp tubes? Phase Inverter? Power Tubes
> 
> There's a HUGE gap of quality between new production tubes and NOS tubes. I've had new production 12ax7 last 2 years and some 3 weeks as they went microphonic. The best investment in tube you can make are in your pre-amp section, with NOS tubes in your V1 and a balanced PhaseInverter tube (which feeds your power tube section).
> 
> ...


I can attest to the wonkiness of the Genalex tubes. I had a pair of KT66s in my JTM45 and one went bad on me waaaaay early. Granted, I run my amp pretty much flat out with an attenuator, so those tubes are working hard, but I barely got 100 hrs out of one of them. I ordered a new pair, and hopefully they will be a bit better, otherwise I'll have to look for new KT66s, which would be a shame, since the Genalex Gold Lions really sound fantastic!

For EL84s, I agree, I like the TAD STRs quite a bit. Not such a big fan of the JJs though, although there's nothing wrong with them per se, it's just that I prefer the TADs. I like Tung-Sols in the preamp personally.


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## jimsz (Apr 17, 2009)

david henman said:


> ...yep - that is the question.


I guess what I meant was that it is only a question you yourself can answer by purchasing a new set of tubes and trying them out. If there is little to no change or you felt the change was not so beneficial, you would at the very least have an extra set of tubes in case the ones in your amp failed. 

There is also the option of trying out newer tubes from another amp, if that's possible.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

We plug tubes in as if all amps using that category of tube were the same, and they're not, or as if all tubes have the same range of safe-operation conditions, and they don't.

When I bought my 59 Bassman, it came with only one power tube, so I bought a pair of Chinese 5881s right away and plugged them in. They lasted about 2hrs. Why? because the 5F6-A uses a plate voltage that is in the very high range for 6L6-class tubes, and not all makes are guaranteed to take that high a plate voltage. And this is without the even higher plate voltage that might have arisen from retrofitting a SS rectifier or other rectifier tube in there. In this case, the Chinese bottles I had bought would have probably sounded great and lasted a while in another amp, just not when hit with a plate voltage in the high 400's.

By contrast, when I bought my 59 Princeton in 1976, it still had what I can presume were the original tubes and it sounded fabulous, continuing to do so with those very same tubes for another 2 decades or more.

I think before people get into any deep discussions about what tubes are "best", one needs to ask the preliminary questions:
- what is the plate voltage provided in my amp?
- what are the optimum operating conditions for this particular brand of tube?

Using it under unfavourable conditions will most certainly compromise any tube's lifespan.


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## bcmatt (Aug 25, 2007)

Within the context of this last post, you can also see amps with Power-scaling type of technology last a very long time due to the fact that the plate voltages end up being lowered considerably most of the time.

So, this would be the VVR circuits by Hall amplification that come in an inexpensive kit format, or London Power Scaling, or VRM that Trinity uses. I believe this may be what 65 Amps uses as well as those 2 new Marshall amp models (AFD and that Malmstein one).

My only amp that I don't have VVR installed on is my 76 Traynor that still is running strong on it's original quad of Mullard 6Ca7s. I chalk that up to well made tubes and low plate voltages.
So, unfortunately (or fortunately) I've never had the pleasure of knowing the experience of when one of my amps was in need of new power tubes.
I've sorted through some microphonic EF86 preamp tubes that basically came that way, but never had other tube problems.


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

david henman said:


> ...you wouldn't say that if you knew me, ben! i'm not exactly known for having great ears. passion? check. work ethic? check. willing to learn and take advice? check. but my hearing is, well, not so great. i'm not sure i would recognize "tone" if it walked right up to me and formally introduced itself.
> 
> anyway, based on your advice, i think i will contact the tube store and order a set of JJs.
> 
> ...


No offence intended Davide : )

I would really advise to get a full tube replacement for your amp, all pre-amp & power tubes. The guys at the TubeStore will hook you up, they really are top notch to deal with.

A Phase Inverter tube in a amp is the tube in the circuitry that handles the electrical feed to the power tubes. That is the reason that why I would highly recommend that your purchase a balanced, say 12Ax7, for your Phase Inverter tube. Even more, I would purchase a Long Filament 12ax7, such as the Sovtek 12AX7-LPS. I'm 98% sure your amp comes stock with a 12Ax7 in the PI position.

So you would need:
- 2 x 12AX7 in the preamp section (refferred too as V1 and V2)
- 1 x 12AX7-LPS in the Phase Inverter (v3)

For Power Tubes - EL84's. JJ's are solid, TADs are better and as also mentionned, TungSol are really nice also.

As for "Tone" bittin' you in the rear!...that is something that couldn't be more personal even if you'd try really. We all hear things differently, but that your hearing is shot or not, I can tell you that you'll feel a solid difference in your amp's "tone", responsiveness and clarity.

A side note on the power tube section - do some research online to see this model will need to have its bias adjusted or if it's self-adjusting. If it'll need to be adjusted, a good tech can do this for you quickly.

Cheers
Ben


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

CSBen said:


> Even more, I would purchase a Long Filament 12ax7, such as the Sovtek 12AX7-LPS. I'm 98% sure your amp comes stock with a 12Ax7 in the PI position.


Hey Ben, what's the reasoning for a long filament tube in the PI socket? What benefits does the long filament tube have over plain-jane 12AX7s in that spot specifically?


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## Lance Romance (Jun 4, 2009)

David, for your uses you need to change them more frequently. Those are EL84s in there, which are some of the fastest-wearing power tubes. Since it's cathode-biased, you just plug the new ones in; no need for biasing. That amp would sound best with JJs EL84s (and believe me I tried a bunch; David has my old amp). Call the Tubestore.


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

hollowbody said:


> Hey Ben, what's the reasoning for a long filament tube in the PI socket? What benefits does the long filament tube have over plain-jane 12AX7s in that spot specifically?


That main reason is that a proper spec* 12AX7LPS (long plate spiral filliment) will have proper drive current, having balanced triodes and each triode drives half of the output tubes. There really is alot more to it than just the "gain" of a tube. Regular plain-jane new production tubes just aren't built to the same specs as they used too, with the exception perhaps to the 12AX7-LPS from Sovtek - they've got that one right!

A note on EL84s amps - the EL84s are easy to drive, ALOT easier on your PI than 6L6, Kt's 88, EL-34s and the likes. So a PI can be good for a very long time, but to me its a no brainer for the cost - every 4-5 tubes change, out goes the old PI too.

Cheers
Ben

*The plate resistance is within spec if at 62.5K at 250 plate and 2 volt bias.


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Balancing the triode halves of the PI is another of those tube amp myths that get recirculated over and over. Since the long-tailed pair PI is inherently unbalanced to begin with and most modern tube amps use this style of PI, there's absolutely no point in using a balanced tube, in fact it might sound worse than an unbalanced one. EL84's tend to wear faster because they're usually in circuits that drive them extremely hard (VOX). Run within their design limits, they'll last as long as any other power tube. The PI tube shouldn't wear any faster than any of the other preamp tubes. Aspen Pittman of Groove Tubes started this myth so that he could sell more tubes.


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

WCGill said:


> Balancing the triode halves of the PI is another of those tube amp myths that get recirculated over and over. Since the long-tailed pair PI is inherently unbalanced to begin with and most modern tube amps use this style of PI, there's absolutely no point in using a balanced tube, in fact it might sound worse than an unbalanced one. EL84's tend to wear faster because they're usually in circuits that drive them extremely hard (VOX). Run within their design limits, they'll last as long as any other power tube. The PI tube shouldn't wear any faster than any of the other preamp tubes. Aspen Pittman of Groove Tubes started this myth so that he could sell more tubes.


That's quite an interesting point of view, given the fact that I know personally the guy who saw every single tubes while GT was in place - Myles Rose - and when it went downhill after his departure.

You're saying that using an unbalanced (never mind LPS), each half of the tube pushing each their own Power Tube differently is a good thing? I would be interested in knowing why having unbalanced current is better in your amps performance. I have tried unbalanced, NON-LPS, tubes in PI and my amps never sounded worst. Balanced NOS RCA 5751 Blackface sounds great, same with Mullards 12AX7 yellow label BVA designation, Telefunken also, etc..

A good read on PI:
http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinting.com/files/Phaseinverter.pdf 


No offence, but my money is on Myles and Mike Z @ Dr.Z Amps. Balanced triodes is #1, LPS is the icing on the cake and should be your 1st choice..

http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinting.com/

But hey, to each their own opinion. I do however agree with you that in EL-84 amps, the PI will last a real long time.


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## washburned (Oct 13, 2006)

Not anywhere the expert that you folks are but this guy might be:

"THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A PERFECTLY BALANCED PHASE INVERTER!!!

You could match the sections of a dual-triode, match the caps and resistors in the circuit, and all will still be imperfect. But, my friends, guitar amps are NOT hi-fi amps, nor do we want them to be. They are not about audio perfection, they are about tone, and the reality is that the inherent imbalance produced in the Phase Inverter results in more harmonic complexity, resulting in a more sonically pleasing end result. Remove the imperfections, and you sterilize the amp. You know, sometimes even people seem a lot more real with a few wrinkles on their face!

Now, go in peace. Tonight, you amp junkies can sleep, knowing that, together, we have solved one of the great mysteries of life!!!

John R. Frondelli is the Technical Services Director at DBM Pro Audio In New York. He has been a technician for 30 years and has repaired, restored and custom built all types of musical equipment. Part of his client list includes Bob Dylan, Lenny Kravitz, U2 and The Who."


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

I've a lot of respect for John R., read his posts on other boards. Myles Rose sells a lot of sizzle and the good Dr. Z has been known to rip off other people's designs and present them as his own. To each their own and remember, don't believe everything you read on the internet, including what I write.


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

washburned said:


> Not anywhere the expert that you folks are but this guy might be:
> 
> "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A PERFECTLY BALANCED PHASE INVERTER!!!
> 
> ...


The important point here is that tone is a personal preference. 

There is no universally perfect amp, everyone just has their own preferences. On top of that, many circuit designers seek to "improve" upon older circuits by making changes to component values, adding or removing part of the circuit, etc. but that doesn't mean that a fan of the original design will like the newer design. "New and improved" just means "new and different," but in marketing-speak, improved just sounds so much better, no?

Circuit mods, tube type and brand, NOS vs modern, etc. are all debatable specifically because we each prefer something different. I personally like JTM45 amps and I run Gold Lion KT66s and Tung Sol preamps with a Sovtek rectifier. I also LOVE my tone! But that doesn't mean I'm right and every one else is wrong. 

Even when it comes down to tech data, something may seem more correct on paper, but may translate to a practically unappealing design. Especially with guitar amps that we _expect_ to overdrive, compared to Hi-Fi amps that we _expect_ to run distortion-free. No one cares too much about frequency response, or how flat across the spectrum a guitar amp is. I never want to see tech data on a guitar amp. Plug in, turn up and listen! Hell, I usually don't want to see tech data on Hi-Fi amps either! Too many people make decisions with their eyes and brains instead of their ears.


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

WCGill said:


> I've a lot of respect for John R., read his posts on other boards. Myles Rose sells a lot of sizzle and the good Dr. Z has been known to rip off other people's designs and present them as his own. To each their own and remember, don't believe everything you read on the internet, including what I write.


As I am convince that all of your amp are never-before-seen circuitry, 100% original and not based on anything else out there from the past 60 years by Vox, Marshall, Fender, Hiwatt or else.

Such as the ElectroWreck Rocket and Express? Wouldn't know it to be two of Ken's best design if it'd bite me in the ass I guess : ) Cool projects none the less.

Or the Model 18? That wouldn't be Marshall 18watters now wouldn't it? Impossible I say.

Model30?

Right? 

I'm sure your amps are of good quality and built to dish out the tone – I will give you that. But your level of professionalism by the way you come across online, well…you’ve got lots to work on bud.


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Everything's based on something as there are only so many ways to hook up a tube but always interesting to find new ones. If I say my amps are original design, they are, although as you were so astute in picking up and pointing out, they are based on classic designs which are hard to beat for certain tones. I tried in my names to reflect and pay homage to these great designs. If the name is a direct copy, ie 5E8 or Express, they're clones although I'm really not interested in building yet another Bassman. Most of my amps are commissioned by musicians and I build what they ask for. If by lack of professionalism you mean clearing up misinformation and trying to increase the level of *true* knowledge for everyone who wants to learn, guilty as charged. End of discussion for me.


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

CSBen said:


> well…you’ve got lots to work on bud.


Someone here does, but I didn't see anything unprofessional posted by WCGill. Seems like you may have some issues though. 

By the way, to the OP, I have amps from the 40's, 50's and 60's that still have original tubes and work fine. Some may need other restoration work (caps, speakers, etc), but the tubes are still fine. New production tubes are not as good as the old ones, as a broad general statement.


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

Sneaky said:


> Someone here does, but I didn't see anything unprofessional posted by WCGill. Seems like you may have some issues though.


My only issue is seeing a company amp owner calling out a renowned boutique builder such as Mike Z @ Dr.Z Amps a builder who's been known for, and I quote: "good Dr. Z has been known to rip off other people's designs and present them as his own."; giving a statement such as that not backing it up is a great way to attrack new business and make a name for yourself. I am still waiting for some concrete back up proof. Show it to me and I'll believe you, plain and simple.

I would take the same reaction and position if he'd be saying that about Dan @ 65amps or Louis @ Louis Electric. I've owned amps from all of these companies, so yes, I do know these amps. You would NEVER see any of these 3 guys go online, on any forum, and bluntly call out another amp builder a thief : )

You say I have some issues, I say I'm standing up for builders who've earned alot of respect around the world in the music business.


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

CSBen said:


> My only issue is seeing a company amp owner calling out a renowned boutique builder such as Mike Z @ Dr.Z Amps a builder who's been known for, and I quote: "good Dr. Z has been known to rip off other people's designs and present them as his own."; giving a statement such as that not backing it up is a great way to attrack new business and make a name for yourself. I am still waiting for some concrete back up proof. Show it to me and I'll believe you, plain and simple.
> 
> I would take the same reaction and position if he'd be saying that about Dan @ 65amps or Louis @ Louis Electric. I've owned amps from all of these companies, so yes, I do know these amps. You would NEVER see any of these 3 guys go online, on any forum, and bluntly call out another amp builder a thief : )
> 
> You say I have some issues, I say I'm standing up for builders who've earned alot of respect around the world in the music business.


Fair enough. I missed that comment I guess, and I agree, it is a bit inflammatory.

I don't have a dog in this fight. I love Dr. Z's amps too. 

Cheers,
Pete


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## GTmaker (Apr 24, 2006)

ABout tube amps and some basic math....

BAck in the seventies and early eighties I had a number of bands that traveled across Canada and the USA on a fulltime basis.
During this period we played six nights a week 50 weeks out of the year.
I had Traynor , Fender, VoX and MArshal tube amps on stage with me.
BEfore I do some math I'll be fair and also say that at that time we traded and upgraded amps on a regular basis so I'll just math it out for a five year period.

4 hours a night X six days a week = 24 hours
Tuesday to thursday where rehersal nights (after the show and a late night dinner). 2 hours X 3 = 6 hours

so 1 week is 30 hours of operating time X 50 X 5 years = 7,500 hours those tubes where ON and working.

This next statement I will swear on a stack of bibles.
NEVER did I or any musician in my band EVER ( that I know of) replace a tube.
I dont know what to make of that. MAybe ignorance has its place after all.

HAving said all that, I just acquired a used Fender Super Reverb RI and within the first week I replaced every tube on the amp.
I dont know why, but that is also the truth.


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## Rugburn (Jan 14, 2009)

The simplest way to look at the "mystical/mythical" longevity of old production tubes is that they were used heavily for military purposes. They were required to continue performing under extreme circumstances. That this was a great benefit to musicians, guitarists in particular, is pure luck. The manufacturers of these storied tubes had durability in mind, not guitar tone. However, the great builders who designed these early amp circuits were looking at the many tube types availlable and making critical decisions on what worked best. We live in an era where the components of yesteryear are dwindling or gone. Yet many amp and effects builders continue to put out great "vintage" sounding tone machines with what components are availlable to them. If it sounds good. then it is good. Getting hung-up on tubes, chips, or certain proprietary designs is good news for the folks who sell musicians' gear, but perhaps less so for the musicians themselves.

Shawn


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

It's pretty common knowledge among builders that the Carmen Ghia is a reworked Hammond organ amp. Both use an incredibly arcane and complex circuit to set the bias of the phase inverter. I have the schematics for both and they're identical. Not to say that Dr. Z doesn't build great amps nor have his own designs, but give credit where it's due. I'm not a fan of the CG anyhow, just as well it isn't his. 
As far as the PI wearing faster than the other tubes, just do the math and you'll see the voltage swing isn't any higher nor is the dissipation any greater than the other preamp tubes, no matter which finals it drives. Patently false.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

GTmaker said:


> ABout tube amps and some basic math....
> 
> BAck in the seventies and early eighties I had a number of bands that traveled across Canada and the USA on a fulltime basis.
> During this period we played six nights a week 50 weeks out of the year.
> ...


When you say you replaced every tube in the super within the first week and don't know why, does that mean they were bad or you just changed them for no reason.


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

WCGill said:


> It's pretty common knowledge among builders that the Carmen Ghia is a reworked Hammond organ amp. Both use an incredibly arcane and complex circuit to set the bias of the phase inverter. I have the schematics for both and they're identical. Not to say that Dr. Z doesn't build great amps nor have his own designs, but give credit where it's due. I'm not a fan of the CG anyhow, just as well it isn't his.
> As far as the PI wearing faster than the other tubes, just do the math and you'll see the voltage swing isn't any higher nor is the dissipation any greater than the other preamp tubes, no matter which finals it drives. Patently false.


My oh my...where to start.

You do realise that Z has always been very up front as to what his inspiration for the CG right? This isn't news to anyone. Why issue with your inflammatory comment is still your referrence to "ripping off".

Interestingly enough, here's an article about this very subject:

http://www.tonequest.com/articles/dr-z.htm

Guess he has been hidding it all along after all...damm this Internet for revealing such hidden secrets!!

I guess you may as well go on every Fender board out there and tell everyone that Leo didn't ripped anything off anyone, you know, just to clear any misconception to the fact that his first amp design didn't come directly out of the RCA Tube Manual!

But back to the Hammond organ amp. You are telling me - and really to anyone who cares to reading this, as a professional amp building - that both schematics are the same?
The fact that the Hammond was designed to tap off a speaker and drive another through a reverb pan, but that Z designed the entire guitar front end, changed the whole purpose of the amp and added the Tone Control....yet they are identical?? I guess we must have a very diffenrent definition of the word "identical" : )

Plug into a Hammond organ amp and tell me if it'll sound like a CG? Right. 

I have not seen your amp designs, nor will I ever be purchasing one, but I'm pretty darn sure that they are built with/made of the same input sections, tone control networks, phase inverter designs, and output sections that have been used for the last 60 or more years - and you know what, there would not be anything wrong with that.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

I'd like to throw in a little "who cares" at this juncture in the Dr Z debate


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## CSBen (Mar 1, 2011)

GuitarsCanada said:


> I'd like to throw in a little "who cares" at this juncture in the Dr Z debate


Way to go for an Admin to bring something productive and intelligent to the discussion, but I guess it's easier for you simply throw in there a "who gives a shit", or as you politely put it, "who cares".

Thumbs up on that one.


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## GTmaker (Apr 24, 2006)

GuitarsCanada said:


> When you say you replaced every tube in the super within the first week and don't know why, does that mean they were bad or you just changed them for no reason.


BAsicaly, I changed them for no reason. Called theTUBEstore in HAmilton and got a new full set the next day.
WHY ?...cause I can afford it and wanted a fresh start with my "new" amp. The original tubes will be held as backups.

I realy cant speak to the idea that the tubes in the mid seventies where of better quality or not but I did try to point out that tubes do last a long long time. Do they work at optimum after a long period? I dont know. 
Now that I think of it, these days. folks use so many pedals in the chain ( overdrive, distortion, boosts etc.) I cant see how anyone realy notices if the amp is working as it should.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

GTmaker said:


> BAsicaly, I changed them for no reason. Called theTUBEstore in HAmilton and got a new full set the next day.
> WHY ?...cause I can afford it and wanted a fresh start with my "new" amp. The original tubes will be held as backups.
> 
> I realy cant speak to the idea that the tubes in the mid seventies where of better quality or not but I did try to point out that tubes do last a long long time. Do they work at optimum after a long period? I dont know.
> Now that I think of it, these days. folks use so many pedals in the chain ( overdrive, distortion, boosts etc.) I cant see how anyone realy notices if the amp is working as it should.


Ok. Maybe this falls under the category of always trying to make something better than it is/was. I am guilty of this as well.


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