# Neunaber Slate -- "boutique" digital, programmable effects pedal



## Guest (Oct 6, 2014)

There have been a couple of big-name programmable pedals in the past but I think this is the first "boutique" entry in to this space maybe?

http://neunaber.net/collections/pedals/products/slate-stereo-effect-pedal-2

It's a 3-knob, stereo in, stereo out pedal with a DSP that you can program to become any number of effects from their library. Not a unique idea but Neunaber gets accolades for having really nice algorithms, maybe that's what'll set it apart?


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## the5chord (Oct 7, 2011)

It looks like an interesting idea. Would like to see a demo of what it can do. I am not sure why he would go this route rather than just build a big space/big sky type pedal. By the time you are done buying everything it's going to cost as much.


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## Guest (Oct 6, 2014)

the5chord said:


> It looks like an interesting idea. Would like to see a demo of what it can do. I am not sure why he would go this route rather than just build a big space/big sky type pedal. By the time you are done buying everything it's going to cost as much.


Form factor re-use would be my guess. He already produces this box, this DSP, these knobs, these jack pedals. This just empties the EEPROM contents and adds a programming interface that's user accessible. I'm wondering if he'll open up the programming software for user tweaking that's far beyond what you'd normally be able to.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

The closest thing I've seen to that was the Line 6 Tonecore development system, that sadly didn't go very far.

http://line6.com/tcddk/


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

....and the TC Electronic TonePrint stuff, which is still out there.

Great for mod type effects, but will these ever really catch on for gain-type effects? Will the Klon or KOT (or Timmy or OCD) user ever swap their analog pedals for a digital facsimile thereof? Many advantages to the digital tech - but one huge disadvantage, IMHO. They just don't sound or respond as good.

I see more and more of this DSP tech coming down the pipe. 

I also see more and more builders of analog booteek gain pedals. 

Is this gonna be like Terminator? The computers vs the ludites? Will it end with a guy singing about a six-string appliance he found in 2112? Things that make me go: hmmmmm.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I was going to mention the Toneprint system, but my understanding is that one gets to play with the parameters of the particular _kind_ of effect the pedal is intended to be, and not more than that. So a vibrato pedal can't be turned into a flanger or reverb.

We've been having a lengthy discussion on the future of analog over at the DIY Stompbox forum. My own firm contention is that distortion represents the last frontier for digital. The reason, as I see it, is that digital processing requires that one first be able to _describe_ the phenomenon you want to produce, I terms of algorithms. It is much easier to describe what a delay, phaser, or filter does, than to describe how a distortion behaves in response to pick attack, battery-age, string gauge, and temperature. It's not _impossible_, mind you, just an order of magnitude or two more complex than translating most other effects into algorithms. 

Initially, the limit was primarily the speed of DSP, but I think we've gotten past that now. At present, the limitation lies in being able to specify all the touch sensitive aspects of old fuzzes and such, mathematically. And if we can't exactly quantify our own pick attack and hand movements, then I can't imagine being able to capture the variation in sound we get from a Fuzz Face or similarly simple, but responsive, circuit based on how we play and the weirdnesses of germanium.

As for the wholesale migration by manufacturers to the digital domain, there are a few very solid reasons for doing so.

1) It is easier to squeeze out more features for less money and package size from digital.

2) It is more flexible with respect to improving the sound quality or feature set.

3) It is easier to protect IP in the digital domain than it is to protect an analog circuit from reverse engineering.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Just like the hi-fi world. Wav files were going to be perfect. Everyone could throw away their turntable. 

Now we're up to flac and other lossless formats, including the one Neil Young is pushing. And LP's are making a comeback. 


Meanwhile, the public is happy with a more compressed, more convenient, more lossy version of mp3. A billion songs on a thumbdrive - who cares if they sound like crap.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

High/Deaf said:


> Meanwhile, the public is happy with a more compressed, more convenient, more lossy version of mp3. A billion songs on a thumbdrive - who cares if they sound like crap.


Not to suggest it is equivalent to something like satellite radio or even normal FM, but AM radio never stopped people from enjoying popular music. Indeed, the first 20 years of rock were almost exclusively via even _more_ compressed AM radio.

It's an entirely different discussion, and probably one we should take to another thread, but I think one needs to distinguish between what digital can and can't provide the p_erforming/recording musician,_ in terms of a whole responsive electronic instrument (where the accuracy and realism in processing is fundamental to the "feel" of the instrument), and what digital does or doesn't provide _the passive listener_. 

Though it's not everything, a substantial part of music is the mere audibility of melody, harmony, and beat. If I can hear all of those, I can readily enjoy the music. Certainly, greater realism and fidelity helps enhance the experience, but as so many elevator rides and grocery store trips can attest, you don't *need* high fidelity to be pleased, motivated, or entranced by music. You can still be moved by stuff with 300hz-3khz bandwidth coming out of a 3" speaker.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Yep, and I could play an amp modeler - and probably no one in the audience would notice. But I would.

You can watch a movie with the TV's built-in speakers. But if you've ever heard a good 7.1 system, you know what you've been missing. NYoung laments how kids today probably don't know what they're missing because they never heard it (good quality sound). Truth be told, I didn't hear anything but 8-track and AM until I was about 18 (oh yea, and crappy console stereos). So I think I'm like the kids today - and yet I appreciate good sound. Don't NEED it, but appreciate it. And will pay extra for it.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

True dat.

But back to the Neunaber thing...

If one looks at the graphics on the top surface of the pedal, beside where it says "9V", there is a round dot with a dash in the middle. Is this some sort of new graphic standard for conveying centre-negative in a more compact way?


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## Guest (Oct 6, 2014)

So...with that tangent done. Mark: I'm not sure what it is about drive pedals that make them such tricky things to model, but I don't disagree that they represent the last frontier. Even the Axe-Fx has...fine...drive models but not stellar models like it's amp and cab portions. Partially it's because they don't get the same amount of attention as the amp and cab algorithms, but also, I think, partially because the topology of drive circuits is actually pretty varied -- so you've got a much bigger space to cover to implement some of the classics.


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## noman (Jul 24, 2006)

I am a huge fan of Neunaber pedals and his algorithms are incredibly good. I use his software with my stereo Wet and it is very easy to use. He also backs up his pedals and did a repair for me free of charge a few years back. Really good guy and I'll probably be getting one of these.....


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

I understand about the Slate, but how much is he charging for each algorithm to download? If you can just buy the Slate & have all 4 pedals (given with a download each time you want to swap them around)
Did we all just give up on the istomp idea? Is handmade/hand wired pedals the "tone"?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CMCRAWFORD (Mar 17, 2014)

There is no charge. 



bzrkrage said:


> I understand about the Slate, but how much is he charging for each algorithm to download? If you can just buy the Slate & have all 4 pedals (given with a download each time you want to swap them around)
> Did we all just give up on the istomp idea? Is handmade/hand wired pedals the "tone"?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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