# Need help: metronome suggestions for whole band



## DaddyDog (Apr 21, 2017)

My hobby band suffers from tempo wars. I've heard of the Soundbrenner Pulse but each is $150 on Amazon (L&M doesn't carry it anymore). Everyone has a smartphone... so is there a metronome app where 6 devices can play the same tempo in sync? Your phone can vibrate the beat in your pocket, or sit on the pedalboard and flash.

Please send help. We waste so much rehearsal time on tempo!!


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

They have special watches for that. Vibrates on the beat


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## Derek_T (10 mo ago)

It seems to me you and your band mate would benefit more from practicing with a metronome (individually) rather than investing on gadgets.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Yep - everyone practice at home first. If your drummer cant play in time, find a new drummer.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

I don't think having a metronome will solve your problem. There is only one person who can control time in the band and that should be your drummer. If he can't consistently keep time, then he needs to be replaced. The drummer is the metronome of the band. Usually when I notice that the drummer is very passive, I tell them, look dude, you are the keeper of the time here, our band's metronome and every one should follow you. And one thing I always say, if the drummer decides we are going to end this song by slowing down or making it obvious that for him the song is finished, no one in the band can do anything about it.  And to add to this, the drummer and the bass player should be totally in sync. Once the 2 are in sync, it solves most of your problems. 

And one more advise, tell everyone to listen to each other. Listen to what everyone is doing. Unless everyone is just at the point of trying to learn the song which then opens up another can of worms. As arlready mentioned, band members should learn the songs on their own and rehearsal is for getting the band tight. In my band, if I say, we'll rehearse this song, when we get to practice, everyone should be ready to play it. If someone says no I am not prepared, I say then lets not play it. Rehearse your part and then we'll rehearse it as a band.


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## 2N1305 (Nov 2, 2009)

Budda said:


> Yep - everyone practice at home first. If your drummer cant play in time, find a new drummer.


IF such is the case that the drummer has an issue with timing and you want to keep him, then HE needs to practice and get a metronome. Heck, I'm sure there are visual metronomes, too, if he doesn't want to wear headphones.


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

As has been said, the drummer should be decent at least at keeping time. If he’s not, he needs to work at it.

What hasn’t been said is that there shouldn’t be any time wars. The other band members need to learn to follow.

That being said, there are bands where the drummer doesn’t lead the band. In the Stones, everyone follows Keef.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

2N1305 said:


> IF such is the case that the drummer has an issue with timing and you want to keep him, then HE needs to practice and get a metronome. Heck, I'm sure there are visual metronomes, too, if he doesn't want to wear headphones.


Exactly. Although I know a drummer who was a very experienced, was forced to use a metronome during recording and couldn't play the same way he had been playing the song. To the point that I had to scratch that track because it didnt sound as cohesive as it should be. He refuses to practice with a metronome. He thought he was too good for it. LOL
I think their issue is the drummer.


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## Derek_T (10 mo ago)

The drummer keep time for the band that's true, but if individual members can't keep time with a metronome you could be playing with Art Blakey it's not going to change anything.
Just sayin', before you start interviewing for drummers


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

2N1305 said:


> IF such is the case that the drummer has an issue with timing and you want to keep him, then HE needs to practice and get a metronome. Heck, I'm sure there are visual metronomes, too, if he doesn't want to wear headphones.


Depends on how much time you’re willing to invest/waste on waiting for improvement. I want practice to be practice, my patience for musicians who cant do that is pretty low. A friendly jam is a different story.


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

I took “hobby band” to be less serious and more likely to work with the drummer on his improvement rather than replacing him.


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## 2N1305 (Nov 2, 2009)

Well, I guess it's up to our friend DaddyDog to decide...


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## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

I'm not sure I understand what the issue is. Are you having trouble with the tempo changing while you are playing or are you having issues deciding what tempo to play at?

If it's a problem with everyone's ability to keep time that's a critical problem that will keep your band in the basement. It's every players responsibility to understand how to play in time and, as importantly, in the right groove. It's like when musicians refer to being " in the pocket" it's more than just playing in time. James Brown insisted that each player, no matter what instrument they played, was essentially a drummer.


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## jazzereh (Oct 25, 2016)

Yes to what's already been said about the drummer. But, you don't say what instrumentation your band has. And, as has been asked - what tempo issue are you having exactly?

Forget the gadgets. If you don't have a drummer put a metronome through a sound system loud enough for everyone to hear [ok, mostly kidding about that].


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## DaddyDog (Apr 21, 2017)

JBFairthorne said:


> I took “hobby band” to be less serious and more likely to work with the drummer on his improvement rather than replacing him.


You are bang on sir.

@Chito @Budda I agree and appreciate what you've said. As a 6 piece group of friends playing out occasionally, there is a wide range of commitment, time, and ego.

@zztomato we have both issues. We may start a song that is horribly dragging, or start a song that is way too fast. And just last night, something happened that demonstrated we sped up mid song.

Still wondering if there is a tool to help. Maybe a metronome into the PA is worth a try


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## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

DaddyDog said:


> Still wondering if there is a tool to help. Maybe a metronome into the PA is worth a try


I would definitely try that. But, everyone has to really commit to the click and understand that it _does not _change the way humans do. I used to play in a trio as a bass player. But, in certain sections of a tune, I would loop the bass line and switch to guitar for some jam band type improv stuff. The drummer in that unit knew to follow the bass line or it would completely fall apart. I've done this with another group of guys that was more just for fun and it works for about 8 bars or less before the drummer forgets he's supposed to be following the bass. 

The click can be both helpful and also a distraction because you have to focus a lot of attention on it. It sounds though that it will help you guys more than hurt.


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

DaddyDog said:


> You are bang on sir.
> 
> @Chito @Budda I agree and appreciate what you've said. As a 6 piece group of friends playing out occasionally, there is a wide range of commitment, time, and ego.
> 
> ...


If you get the drummer on time, he IS the metronome that everyone can hear. If the drummer can't play to a metronome, then there's no point giving anyone else one.


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## Hammerhands (Dec 19, 2016)

I haven't tried group counting since junior high, what would that sound like?


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

2manyGuitars said:


> If you get the drummer on time, he IS the metronome that everyone can hear. If the drummer can't play to a metronome, then there's no point giving anyone else one.


Sorry, edited to say "if the drummer *CAN'T* play...".

But just realized it works either way.


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## Powdered Toast Man (Apr 6, 2006)

I think running a click through the PA for the whole band is only really necessary when you're working with prerecorded backing track elements. 

Otherwise, it's completely on the drummer. I have seen things where drummers will use a click to START songs. Basically they can set the tempo and then that's that. Drummer puts click in his ear, starts counting with either stick clicks or closed hat, rest of band follows. If there's stops or breaks and the band has trouble counting then the drummer needs to keep time on the hat.


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## KapnKrunch (Jul 13, 2016)

Go stochastic. Could be the next big thing.


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

It may sound simplistic but when I practice alone I generally try to play along with the original. The tempo and the arrangement just kinda sink in my thick head. Then, when I go to jam, I usually have a pretty good feel for the speed we should be playing at and I mostly, instinctively know the arrangement. I’ve listened to it 50 time this week…

Very rarely, at jam, if we’re kind of stuck on something, or someone is trying to figure out a particular part (even though they should have already but meh…it’s a casual thing), we will push the original through the pa and play along bit. Sometimes it helps…sometimes our time is worse than the 4 of us just playing without the track.

Now I’m sure I’m probably in the minority here but I’m not overly sensitive if our time speeds up or slows down a little bit in a song…as long as it doesn’t slow to a point that it drags or speed to the point that it feels rushed. I’m far more concerned with our time as a group being in synch. To me, music is a living, breathing thing. It evolves, changes. It’s not always the same from one day to the next or from one run through to the next. I want to feel connected in a way that means our time all wavers TOGETHER. If we need to we can work on being better at keeping good time but it’s much harder to learn to play together. Some people you click with and that connection is easier than with others. Sometimes 3 guys can be connect and a 4th comes in and everything is a mess. It’s a funny thing.


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## Derek_T (10 mo ago)

DaddyDog said:


> Still wondering if there is a tool to help. Maybe a metronome into the PA is worth a try


I think the solution to your problem is quite simple: ask your drummer to take a nap, and play with a metronome only. Are you all on time ?
If yes, problem is the drummer.
If no, it's a practice issue.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

Get the drummer a Beat Buddy. They have kept many a drummer from turning a 3 minute song into one minute over the years.


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## isoneedacoffee (Oct 31, 2014)

Sometimes what's needed is a frank conversation about who is in charge of the time. There may be assumptions that are screwing things up. What if everyone is trying to follow the drummer, but the drummer is following the singer, who in turn is following the guitarist? I don't think things need to be the same for every band, but things need to be super clear. There's always a bit of push and pull from band members when it comes to timing, but someone has to have the reigns or it's a mess.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

I once auditioned for a band where the BL/guitarist had no sense of rhythm.
Couldn't even follow the drums. The beat was in his head and he wouldn't budge.
Playing 'knockin' on heaven's door' at metallica speed was interesting.


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## Sgtstiletto (5 mo ago)

I’ve played in both scenarios where only the drummer has a click, and also when everyone has a click. At the end of the day, drums and bass need to be locked in…. I don’t see why everyone needs a click if the drummer is on time. The instances where I’ve played with everyone having “ears” has been while at church… where not everyone is super familiar with the transitions… we don’t want the band going to the chorus, if they’re supposed to play verse2. If these are tunes you all are familiar with, the drummer should be the only one who needs the click, bass should lock in with him, and everything else layered on top, following their lead.


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## StringNavigator (May 15, 2021)

What we have here... is a failure to communicate.


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