# Alright, I'm doing it! Help me make some cables with pancake jacks...help me!



## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

*Here's the skinny:*

I've got a pedalboard loaded up, and I've been using solderless George Ls for quite some time. I want to upgrade to soldered pancake jacks because my board isn't changing nearly as often as it used to, I want to save some space, and I think the pedalboard will look more tidy.

My soldering skills are average, or maybe slightly below average. I have a good soldering gun, several tips of varying sizes, and solder. 

I picked up some mono pancake jacks from the local supply store (A1 Electronics).

*Questions:*

Are these (seemingly no-name) pancake jacks ok, or should I buy a particular brand?
If so, where do you buy your jacks (Canadian retailer strongly preferred!)?

What cable do you recommend?
Where do you buy your cable (again, I'd much rather purchase from a Canadian supplier)?

Do you think, realistically, that I'll even be able to make these cables, or is the soldering really hard to do?
If you recommend I don't make them myself, do you know someone in the greater Toronto area (or Canada for that matter) who would be willing to make them for me (at a cost, of course)?

Any other advice you can offer will be greatly appreciated!

Thanks in advance!


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## zurn (Oct 21, 2009)

This probably not what you want to hear but this is what I chose  (the easy way)

View attachment 754


http://stores.ebay.ca/EARS-Pro-Audio/_i.html?_nkw=evidence+audio+melody&submit=Search&_sid=18200618


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## Guest (Apr 1, 2012)

zurn said:


> This probably not what you want to hear but this is what I chose  (the easy way)
> 
> <img src="http://www.guitarscanada.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=754"/>
> 
> http://stores.ebay.ca/EARS-Pro-Audio/_i.html?_nkw=evidence+audio+melody&submit=Search&_sid=18200618


Did you really pay $140 for that much cable?


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## grumpyoldman (Jan 31, 2010)

I am in the exact same position. Those here on the Forum from whom I have purchased pedals over the last year may be pleased to find out that I am FINALLY going to assemble my pedalboard! I searched for some pointers on how to go about it, and chose to do the DIY method with an IKEA shelf (GORM is the name of the particular shelving system). In checking options for this project, I came upon this link embedded in a thread (in another Forum) dealing specifically with the making of the jumpers between the pedals.

Make Your Own Guitar Pedal Coupler Cables - YouTube

Hopefully, this will be helpful (I know it gave me ideas to consider....).

John
thegrumpyoldman


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## zurn (Oct 21, 2009)

iaresee said:


> Did you really pay $140 for that much cable?


Yes I did! Worth every penny to me. You spend 1000$+ on pedals, 140$ for some quality cables doesn't seem that much.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

Evidence makes a nice cable. The Monorail is very popular for boards and racks


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## kat_ (Jan 11, 2007)

Clean Channel said:


> Do you think, realistically, that I'll even be able to make these cables, or is the soldering really hard to do?


Yes, you'll definitely be able to make them. No, soldering really isn't hard at all. You might mess up the first two or three while you're practicing but after that you'll get it and you'll be able to make or repair any cable you ever need within minutes. It's totally worth learning how to do and it will open the door to being able to repair or build pedals and other things too.


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## Guest (Apr 1, 2012)

zurn said:


> Yes I did! Worth every penny to me. You spend 1000$+ on pedals, 140$ for some quality cables doesn't seem that much.


I've got some land in Florida you'd love...


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

Thanks for the suggestions so far fellas!



zurn said:


> This probably not what you want to hear but this is what I chose  (the easy way)
> 
> View attachment 754
> 
> ...


Good to know. I'm not adverse to paying some money to just get 'em and be done with it. I would like to be able to cut several lengths though. And, if I can make them, I'd think I'd enjoy that a little better; just a fun DYI job.



grumpyoldman said:


> I am in the exact same position. Those here on the Forum from whom I have purchased pedals over the last year may be pleased to find out that I am FINALLY going to assemble my pedalboard! I searched for some pointers on how to go about it, and chose to do the DIY method with an IKEA shelf (GORM is the name of the particular shelving system). In checking options for this project, I came upon this link embedded in a thread (in another Forum) dealing specifically with the making of the jumpers between the pedals.
> 
> Make Your Own Guitar Pedal Coupler Cables - YouTube
> 
> ...


Great vid! Looks to be exactly the instructions I'm looking for. I see he also links to a detailed blog post about making cables. I'll be sure to study all his suggestions later today... Thanks again!



GuitarsCanada said:


> Evidence makes a nice cable. The Monorail is very popular for boards and racks


Good to know! Any suggestions on where to buy them? Any thoughts on Mogami (if my memory serves me, I seem to recall that being mentioned somewhere as a good option)?



kat_ said:


> Yes, you'll definitely be able to make them. No, soldering really isn't hard at all. You might mess up the first two or three while you're practicing but after that you'll get it and you'll be able to make or repair any cable you ever need within minutes. It's totally worth learning how to do and it will open the door to being able to repair or build pedals and other things too.


I agree! I had just heard that soldering pancake jacks (and cables in general?) can be particularly frustrating. 

For a little background: in the past I've repaired some solder joints in my pedals (just did another one yesterday), have removed the board from my Sustainiac guitar to send away for an upgrade (then soldered it back in when it was returned), and replaced an entire broken foot switch in one of my pedals (required unsoldering then soldering several connections). So I'm not completely new at soldering, I'm just not all that confident, and I think my work is messy compared to the pros.

Any other advice anyone can add will be welcome. I'll be spending most of the today with my family, but will check back in this evening. Thanks again everyone!


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## zurn (Oct 21, 2009)

Clean Channel said:


> Good to know. I'm not adverse to paying some money to just get 'em and be done with it. I would like to be able to cut several lengths though. And, if I can make them, I'd think I'd enjoy that a little better; just a fun DYI job.
> !


YOu can chose the lenght and direction of the cables when you buy from that seller on ebay.


"***After your purchase, please let us know:*


*The length cable you need for each patch cable (6, 8, 10, or 12"), and *
*same or opposite facing plugs (listing photo shows 'same' direction plugs)"*


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## J S Moore (Feb 18, 2006)

Clean Channel said:


> My soldering skills are average, or maybe slightly below average. I have a good soldering gun, several tips of varying sizes, and solder.


First thing. If you actually have a soldering gun put it in a drawer and go get a 40 watt pencil style. Save yourself the aggravation.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

You can also go solderless if you want. Either the Lava kit or the Core One kit. I have them both at the GC Shop. I used the Lava myself for my board. Very nice cables and plugs. They are not pancake mind you.

PedalBoard Cable Kits/Bulk Cable : GuitarsCanShop, The GC Gear Depot


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## zurn (Oct 21, 2009)

iaresee said:


> I've got some land in Florida you'd love...


mkay...lol


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

Actually, with a little practice, making perfect cables is not difficult. But you do need the right tools and technique.

First off, dump the soldering gun. They can be great for electrical work where you need a lot of heat on large solder joints, but they are clumsy, the tips are generally too large and they can overheat small joints or even melt the structure around them. It's best to use a low wattage pen type iron ($10 to $20?) or, if you can afford and justify it, a nice soldering station is ideal.

Another useful tool is a small table-top vice to solidly hold the connector in a convenient position. In a pinch, a set of large pliers with an elastic band to squeeze the handles together will also hold the connector in a good position, although not so reliably.

Use thin, resin core solder, not the thick electrical solder and use as little as possible on the connection. Be careful to not use too much heat. Wire stripping is an art and will take some practice to get it right. Strip and "tin" the wires in the cable by heating the stripped wires and touching the the solder on them until the solder just melts and flows over the bare, exposed wire. Then heat the metal on the connector's solder joint until it is hot enough to melt the solder, then touch the tinned wire to the melted solder until the solder flows neatly over the wire and connection. DO NOT blow on the solder to cool it or the moisture in your breath may cause a "cold" solder joint. A cold solder joint is easy to spot and will make for a poor electrical connection. It will look dull grey from crystalization. To correct a cold solder joint, just reheat it and let it cool naturally. Do the same if the solder joint has gaps or uneven flow.

On pancake connectors, you can either solder the braided ground to the casing or just fold it back over the cable casing so that the clamp squeezes it against the connector casing on reassembly. Soldering the ground to the casing is more difficult as it takes a lot of heat to get the large mass of metal to the right temperature. You may also want to flatten the braid with a pair of pliers before tinning it so it will fit inside the casing of the connector. So if you are soldering the shielded wire, do that first.

Do a few practice connections to perfect the technique. Stripping and tinning the wire to the precise lengths is the trickiest and most critical skill you will aquire. Once you have it right, just keep doing it that way. You can desolder a practice connector with a solder sucking tool or solder sucking braided wire. OR you can do my messy method by heating the solder on the connector and smashing it against your work surface. Be aware that hot solder will splatter everywhere but it works well and is quick and easy.

The zen of cable making is actually quite theraputic and may save you a fortune on future psychiatric sessions. OOOOMMMM.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Patch cables for pedalboards do not need to be as physically robust as the cable that follows you around with your guitar. However, to be able to fit spaces neatly, turn corners well, and solder properly, it should be of a suitable gauge and physically strong enough to turn a 90-degree corner.

Having made dozens of pedalboard patch cables, I can suggest the following guiding principles:

1) The short and more awkward the distance to travel, the more helpful it is to have somewhat narrower gauge cable.

2) The trickiest part of using "pancake" right-angle jacks is making good contact with the shield. The hot lead will easily solder to the tab in the middle, but the shielding will not want to solder to the outside portiong of the plug, largely because it is big enough that it sucks away all the heat, making for cold joints. Use the little pry-up tab in the jack to your advantage. YOu can either take a portion of the shield and pinch it inside the tab, or scrape the tab and apply solder to it. If the cable is big enough to permit, another common approach is to peel the shielding back over the insulation and simply let the compression of the plug chassis force contact with the shield.

3) Get yourself some heat shrink in different sizes. It will do a few useful things. First, it can provide some strain relief when slipped over the end of the plug and cable. Second, it can fill in space so that things don't jiggle around/ Note that you can sli the end of your needlenose pliers into a piece of heatshrink and stretch it a little to accommodate things that are juuuuuuuuusssst a little too big for the diameter you bought.

Here are some shots of a pedalboard I'm nearly done assembling for myself. Entirely homebrew, with the exception of the Washburn chorus.
















Yu can see that it uses some fairly short "cables" with pancake jacks to permit very close spacing. Between the plastic (but shielded) boxes, the absence of batteries, and the $1.50 plastic bootmat from POrincess Auto for the "pedalboard", the whole thing probably weighs about the same as a guitar, despite having 10 pedals on it when fully stocked.

The Washburn chorus and \some of the pedals (One not shown) have their jacks in locations that prohibit use of the ultra-short cables so I made some special ones to accommodate that. here is a sample of the types of connectors I'm using:








Some are stubby, some are longer. There is thicker cable, and thinner. On the right you will also notice a pair of offset solid male-to-male connectors for use with pedals that have their jacks sidemounted. Here's a close up, and a bit of an inside view of one.:








You can see that it is basically two half-plugs (the top part is unused), with a piece of solid-core wire soldered between the center tabs of each plug. I screw the two halves together, one screw going in each direction, and there you go. As you can see, they have a VERY slender profile and permit closer spacing of pedals on your board. Shielding is more than adequate.

Probably the biggest downside of these, however is that they require that the pedals themselves be slightly offset (i.e., one a little closer to the front, one a little closer to the back) to use. Depending on how you have your velcro (e.g., if you use a strip, rather than piece of carpet or a sheet of the fuzzy side) this can create some difficulties. Apart from that,however, grow-your-own male-to-males are dirt cheap.


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)




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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

Hey guys, thanks for all of the detailed responses!

First off, to be clear, I used the wrong nomenclature in my original post. I don't have a soldering gun, I actually already have a proper soldering pen (made by Weller), as you all have suggested.

Glancing over the posts, I must admit, I feel more intimidated than ever! I remember reading that stripping the wire is tricky; that certain layers should be exposed, and others not. I'm also having a hard time visualizing the descriptions of soldering to the tab and the shield. I'll need to get some wire and try it with your descriptions in hand.

Does anyone have any suggestions on where to buy the cable? Is this stuff available at my local electronics supply store (where I bought the jacks) or should I order it from a special retailer online?

Again, I appreciate all of the pictures, links, and descriptions! I'll go through all of this with a fine tooth comb over the next few days!


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

Clean Channel asked "Does anyone have any suggestions on where to buy the cable? Is this stuff available at my local electronics supply store (where I bought the jacks) or should I order it from a special retailer online?"

I personally have a supply of Beldon cable of various guages suitable for analogue audio signals and even the lightest guages would be suitable for such short runs in a pedal board. However, with pancake connectors, do consider that if you are using the foldback method of the shield for the grounding, the cable casing has to be thick enough to perform in the compression of the connector chassis on the shielded braid against the casing when assembled.

mhammer has suggested merging 2 pancake connectors into one, back to back. This also works with regular Switchcraft type straight connectors by trimming the ground shaft connections with wire cutters and soldering the pins together directly and then putting a layer or 2 of heat shrink to insulate it all. This leaves somewhere between 1/4" to 1/2" gap between pedals. Of course this only works best when all pedals are from the same manufacturer so all the jacks line up.

I would suggest that you learn to use an exacto type knife or razor blade for all your wire stripping. The trick is to not cut completely through the casing or stop cutting the second you feel metal against metal. Then gently twist the casing back and forth until it breaks. Then just pull it off. Be gentle and patient and you will soon be stripping cables like an artisan. Wire strippers or even your teeth may work in a pinch but will provide less control over not cutting any of the many fine wires that comprise the cable. This is especially critical when soldering connectors to a multi-cable connector assembly like a 40 pair snake.I know it doesn't apply here, but when you get to connection number 120 and find your stripping doesn't reach, you have no choice but to cut it all off, desolder, restrip and start over. But if you develope your skills on a simple pedal board, you can solder anything. Plan ahead, measure twice to cut once and all that.

Most importantly, any soldering and wire stripping skill you aquire will serve you well for the rest of your GASsy life.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Clean Channel said:


> Hey guys, thanks for all of the detailed responses!
> 
> First off, to be clear, I used the wrong nomenclature in my original post. I don't have a soldering gun, I actually already have a proper soldering pen (made by Weller), as you all have suggested.
> 
> ...


Pop over to the corner of Matheson & Dixie, and there is a small strip mall there, on the northwest corner, with 3 or 4 electronics places, including Sayal and Active. You should be able to find what you need there, including soldering iron, appropriate tip, and cable. If running a 40ft cable, you might want to be pickier and find their choices insufficient. But for ultra-short patch cables between buffered devices, the criteria drop down in stringency.

The "tab" refers to the little "tongue" hanging off the middle of the plug. The "shield" refers to either the outside of the plug chassis itself, or to the braided/stranded material on the outer layer of the cable. With more standard phone plugs, you will see a "tongue"solder-tab for the hot contact, and another larger contact, often with a hole and two interlocking tabs to fold over around the cable to provide strain relief. The cover for the plug fits over the whole thing. 

For "pancake"/right-angle plugs, there is no ground thingie to solder to that is separate from the cover. What you'll see is a little "tooth" sticking out from the plug half (i.e., NOT the cover). If the cable is thick enough, and the shielding on the cable braided, it becomes possible to simply fold the braided shield back and hook that tooth into the braid. because the tooth points towards the middle of the plug a,d not away, it serves to anchor the cable inside the plug assembly. Such cable is generally thick enough that, between the hook and the compression provided by squeezing the cover against the cable when you screw it in place, there is sufficient strength to hold the cable in place even though it is not soldered to anything other than the little tongue for the hot lead.

The challenge arises when yu use cable that does not use a braided shield, or that is slender enough that pressure won't hold it in place. here, you canpry up the little tooth a bit, scrape it a bit and solder directly to it. Here is where your "gun" might actually come in handy. Normally, they are too blunt an instrument to use for electronic installation, but in this instance they are perfect for laying down a "bed" of solder around the tooth to secure the cable shield to. The final soldering of the shield to the plug will likely benefit, however, from use of a finer tipped soldering iron, and preferably something higher than 30W (side-note: as more and more things are going lead-free, higher soldering temperatures are required to do good work; you probably want to buy something that is 40W or higher).

As noted earlier, if the cable itself is not thick enough to be securely gripped when you screw the two halves of the plug together, you can easily build up the outside diameter of the cable by using a layer or two of heat shrink tubing. It also provides some insurance against wire breakage when you need to turn tight corners. If you are doing one plug and the other end of the wire is free, you only need to slip on the heat-shrink as yuo need it. When it comes to soldering the other plug, you need to remember to slip the heat shrink on first, and slide it well down the cable to be away from the heat, while you work on the plug.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

bluzfish said:


> I would suggest that you learn to use an exacto type knife or razor blade for all your wire stripping. The trick is to not cut completely through the casing or stop cutting the second you feel metal against metal. Then gently twist the casing back and forth until it breaks. Then just pull it off. Be gentle and patient and you will soon be stripping cables like an artisan. Wire strippers or even your teeth may work in a pinch but will provide less control over not cutting any of the many fine wires that comprise the cable. This is especially critical when soldering connectors to a multi-cable connector assembly like a 40 pair snake.I know it doesn't apply here, but when you get to connection number 120 and find your stripping doesn't reach, you have no choice but to cut it all off, desolder, restrip and start over. But if you develope your skills on a simple pedal board, you can solder anything. Plan ahead, measure twice to cut once and all that.


Good advice. An alternative is to hold your utility or X-acto knife steady while rotating the cable, so that the knife scores the entire circumference of the insulation. That will allow you remove the insulation with wire strippers or end-nippers, without having to apply quite so much pressure. It is exasperating to measure the cable out just so, and then find you've unintentionally yanked off too much of the shielding by pulling too hard. You'll want to find ways to make the task more precise, and less dependant on yanking.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

You can also buy a cable stripper that has an adjustable knife that you spin on the cable, cutting only as deep as you set it. I bought mine years ago at Radio Shack but the Source should have them.


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Last month I bought 100' of guitar cable and a dozen Swichcraft plugs from www.loudspeakers.ca , my usual source for such things. They ship fast, and have what I want. I still have cables I made 15 years ago, same product source.

I use a soldering gun, having lost my iron, but it works fine as long as I shape the tip, let it come up to heat, and solder the joint quickly. Usually I'm only doing a couple at a time and the gun is quicker.

Peace, Mooh.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Un-huh. Guns can be fast and efficient. Their appropriateness will depend on the physical properties of what it is you're trying to solder. Sometimes the blunt tip and sheer brute force of a gun is precisely what the doctor ordered, and sometimes not. Pays to have BOTH a gun and an iron around the house.


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## keefsdad (Feb 7, 2006)

Clean Channel said:


> *Here's the skinny:*
> 
> I've got a pedalboard loaded up, and I've been using solderless George Ls for quite some time. I want to upgrade to soldered pancake jacks because my board isn't changing nearly as often as it used to, I want to save some space, and I think the pedalboard will look more tidy.
> 
> ...


Those things can be a bitch to solder, in my experience, and I've been doing it a long time.


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

keefsdad said:


> Those things can be a bitch to solder, in my experience, and I've been doing it a long time.


Yeah, that's what I've heard! And, despite the very good intentions and advice of several CG users, I have to admit, I feel more hopeless than ever. I know I'm just no good with solder and wire, and I'm absolutely certain I'll never find peace or pleasure soldering!

I also have to consider my time, and I'd rather do something work or pleasure related, than go nuts trying to make cables work.

So (I'm sure to the dismay of all the helpful posters in this thread), I have to admit that I found a person in Toronto who makes custom cables for musicians. I've contacted him, sent him a list of what I need, received a quote, and am going ahead with it. 

For any other quitters who might be interested in the easy way out, here's the link:

Nice Rack Canada :: Guitar Technician & Tonesmith Service :: Custom Cable, Racks & Pedalboards

My sincere apologies to all who took the time to write out their detailed responses; I feel like I've let you all down! I hope, at least, that others intrepid souls might stumble upon this thread via the search function, and perhaps put your advice to better use!


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

They're a "bitch to solder" because they are not *meant *to be soldered. At least not the shield. The hot lead is, but the shield is assumed to be folded back, like the neck of a turtleneck sweater, and squished into place.

Where it gets tricky is when you DO try to solder it without preparing the surface, or when using the sort of cable the plugs were never planned to use.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Clean Channel said:


> My sincere apologies to all who took the time to write out their detailed responses; I feel like I've let you all down! I hope, at least, that others intrepid souls might stumble upon this thread via the search function, and perhaps put your advice to better use!


No need to apologize !! 

It is just that some of us enjoy the acrid fumes of soldering and the occasional stench of our own burning flesh. 
Try to understand.

Cheers

Dave


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

...oooommmmm...


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## Farbulous (Dec 8, 2009)

I just made a whole bunch of patch cables for my board and then a few instrument cables as well.
I bought GLS pancake plugs for the board and Amphernol plugs for the instrument cables. 
Bought some Mogami 2319 for the patches and 2524 for the instruments.
Most of the equipment I got from Welcome to TubeDepot.com!
The cable and GLS plugs I think I got from Redco Audio - Custom Audio Cables - Recording Studio Supplies - Custom A/V Panels - Redco Audio Home Page

Tube Depot also has an excellent video on how to put them together if you search YouTube.


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

Just another heads up to those who would rather buy them than make them:

It appears that used cables with pancake ends are frequently for sale used in the TGP emporium. You can get them for great prices this way!

Also, appears this fella has very reasonable prices: http://www.etchworkcableco.com/

Cheers!


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## zurn (Oct 21, 2009)

Clean Channel said:


> Just another heads up to those who would rather buy them than make them:
> 
> It appears that used cables with pancake ends are frequently for sale used in the TGP emporium. You can get them for great prices this way!
> 
> Also, appears this fella has very reasonable prices: Etchwork Cable Co.Cheers!


Wow those are pretty cheap, 7.50$ for a Mogami path cable up to 12". 

 Mogami 2524 Patch Cable

Or 8.50$ for a Evidence Audio Monorail:

Evidence Audio Monorail Patch Cable


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