# Busking



## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

I am doing some homework on the pros and cons of busking. I am planning on doing this at least once a week downtown TO.

Some ppl say that I shouldn’t use a backing track because it’s technically cheating!? I am so used to playing with a band. I need to have a full band to play with. It just sounds so much better to me with all the pieces in place. I can play without accompaniment and sound fairly decent but. 

I have personally seen and heard buskers using backing tracks and cheating never came to mind. 

I just need to get my playing fix on! 
Opinions pls


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Lola said:


> I just need to get my playing fix on!


Check out your local bar scene for 'open mic nights'.
Have you considered busking closer to home? Pickering Mall?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

use a looper, record yourself and it aint no cheating then


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Lola said:


> I am doing some homework on the pros and cons of busking.
> I am planning on doing this at least once a week downtown TO.


If I'm not mistaken, you have to audition for a permit to do that there.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

laristotle said:


> If I'm not mistaken, you have to audition for a permit to do that there.


For subway busking you have to audition but not for the streets of Toronto. You fill out your forms and your issued a permit the same day.

I will reach a bigger audience at the corner of Front and Yonge street as compared to an open mic. I want to be outdoors, playing on a beautiful sunny day downtown TO. That’s what I want. I really don’t like bars. I don’t care if I make any $. Maybe just enough to pay for my travel expenses and I am a happy camper.

I want to play more and this will help me to, as Stella put it, “get my groove on!”

My obsession to play never relents. I have to do something.


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## aC2rs (Jul 9, 2007)

IMO if you want to use a backing track just do it.
Alternatively, as per vadsy suggestion you can use a looper.
Bottom line do whatever you are comfortable with doing that gets you out there.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Whatever floats your boat. My buddy used to busque 5 nights a week. Usually outside of beer stores. He made some pretty good coin


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

Check out the older guy at Front and University wailing on classic rock. He uses backing tracks and it sounds fine. Would sound silly without it.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

I have a spot chosen already. It’s right in front of Union station. There is one guitarist there already but he’s on the backside of Union so I won’t infringe in his territory. 

I have a thick skin so any naysayers will not bother me at all. Don’t care who likes it or not. This is just for me! Selfish as I may sound. 

I will meet so many ppl and hopefully make some connections. 

This is very exciting.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

You might want to check with Union station. I would think if you could busk there people would be. I work right there and never see anyone busking on Union property. That guitar guy is across the street.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I can't wait to see (and hear) the videos! Good luck with it. I have seen some of the best busker videos from the UK and they use backing tracks.


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## oldjoat (Apr 4, 2019)

track / no track , it's up to you . ( get it on anyway you can )

agree with checking with the station first to see if there are any restrictions


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Guncho said:


> You might want to check with Union station. I would think if you could busk there people would be. I work right there and never see anyone busking on Union property. That guitar guy is across the street.


OMG I know exactly who your talking about. Hubby and I were downtown last summer and he was playing the most amazing blues song and I just had to stop and talk to him. What a really nice down to earth guy. I could of stayed all day and listened to him. Hell, I wanted to go home and get my guitar to play with him. I am going to try and hook up with other ppl to play with if they don’t mind and they would like some company. They can have all the money, I don’t want a cent of it.

There is a tall dude guitar player that is stationed in in front of the rear doors right at Union Station. I always stop and talk to him. I am going to talk to him about his location next time I see him. Next week.

Another time I went downtown and there was a 7 piece brass band right on the corner of Bay and Front street. It appeared to me that they were on Union property but maybe not.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

Yeah that guy wails. I've seen him ripping up some Zeppelin solo with fingerless gloves, a smoke hanging out of his mouth looking like it's the easiest thing in the world.

The guy at Front and University.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Lola said:


> I will meet so many ppl and hopefully make some connections


That's why I suggested the Pickering Mall or somewhere close to you.
You may meet some musicians in your area looking to jam.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

laristotle said:


> That's why I suggested the Pickering Mall or somewhere close to you.
> You may meet some musicians in your area looking to jam.


Thx Lar but I want to be downtown where the action is though. Personally, it’s magical for me. Everything that could bother me or does bother me evaporates when I step off the train. I would move down there in a heartbeat but hubby wouldn’t move and I can’t afford Toronto real estate prices.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

There are no rules. The audience response i.e. cash will tell you what works. Good luck. I've always wanted to try this but live in a small town. There are a couple of much younger people who busk here and I wouldn't want to take anything from them. One of the local buskers has a debit card reader attached to his phone. Not a lot of people carry cash anymore.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Here is that brass band I was talking about.





By laws change and not in favour of street Buskers.

It really doesn’t matter where I play really as long as I am playing and having fun.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Lola said:


> OMG I know exactly who your talking about. Hubby and I were downtown last summer and he was playing the most amazing blues song and I just had to stop and talk to him. What a really nice down to earth guy. I could of stayed all day and listened to him. Hell, I wanted to go home and get my guitar to play with him. I am going to try and hook up with other ppl to play with if they don’t mind and they would like some company. They can have all the money, I don’t want a cent of it.
> 
> There is a tall dude guitar player that is stationed in in front of the rear doors right at Union Station. I always stop and talk to him. I am going to talk to him about his location next time I see him. Next week.
> 
> Another time I went downtown and there was a 7 piece brass band right on the corner of Bay and Front street. It appeared to me that they were on Union property but maybe not.


You have the best attitude ever!


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

1SweetRide said:


> You have the best attitude ever!


Thank you for saying that!


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Make sure you know all the words to your songs forwards and backwards and be able to play the guitar parts without having to think about it. I've been playing open mics lately in a few bars and it's easy to leave out some words or bolix up a chord progression that you've been playing for a hundred years. 

Played at some sports bar last night and lots of very good players; some of them have CDs they can sell you .. lol. Anyway, lots of connections and people wanting to hook up but my preference is just take my acoustic guitar and go; that way I have more control over it. Just from going to one event awhile back I now have about six places to play at and could easily do 3 nights a week.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Wardo said:


> Make sure you know all the words to your songs forwards and backwards and be able to play the guitar parts without having to think about it. I've been playing open mics lately in a few bars and it's easy to leave out some words or bolix up a chord progression that you've been playing for a hundred years.
> 
> Played at some sports bar last night and lots of very good players; some of them have CDs they can sell you .. lol. Anyway, lots of connections and people wanting to hook up but my preference is just take my acoustic guitar and go; that way I have more control over it. Just from going to one event awhile back I now have about six places to play at and could easily do 3 nights a week.


Nah, I don’t sing. I don’t care to sing because I sound awful. Guitar playing is all I want to do. Cover songs and a couple of original tunes is more then adequate for me! And......I am using backing tracks.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Just walking the dogs on a beautiful sunny day and I got to thinking. I could take any spare cash I make busking and put it in the guitar fund. This just keeps getting better and better. Maybe I will buy the PRS 594 McCarty instead of an S2. Who knows.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

laristotle said:


> That's why I suggested the Pickering Mall or somewhere close to you.
> You may meet some musicians in your area looking to jam.


I already joined Bandmix.ca. I have already hooked up with a few like minded ppl there. That is a huge resource of ppl to investigate.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Lola said:


> I already joined Bandmix.ca. I have already hooked up with a few like minded ppl there. That is a huge resource of ppl to investigate.


What's this Bandmix thing of which you speak?


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

1SweetRide said:


> What's this Bandmix thing of which you speak?


I found my singer and drummer from that place. Also the bass player before Moe I also found him there. 

www.bandmix.ca


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Canadian Musicians Wanted - Canada Find Local Musicians Classifieds and Bands Online : BandMix.ca

You can look without paying but you can’t get phone numbers or email addresses without paying $35 for 3 months.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

As long as you aren't lip-syncing or faking your guitar playing, loopers, backing tracks, whatever the hell you want. I find the purist culture around playing with no backing music what-so-ever *annoying.*


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Just had a moment of clarity.

I can play what I want to play over and over again if I so desire.

The song choice will always be mine.

I am stoked.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Lola said:


> I can play what I want to play over and over again if I so desire.
> 
> The song choice will always be mine.


Unless someone sticks around past one song, you can do that all day.


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## bw66 (Dec 17, 2009)

I have a friend who is a licensed subway busker. He tells me that if you have three good songs, you can busk, but for the sake of your sanity, you should know more. Apparently "Gentle on my Mind" is money.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

bw66 said:


> I have a friend who is a licensed subway busker. He tells me that if you have three good songs, you can busk, but for the sake of your sanity, you should know more. Apparently "Gentle on my Mind" is money.


I have a repertoire of about 40 songs that I can play even without backing tracks. I know a few solos but not a lot. I also wrote two original songs and will definitely be playing them. I know there will be mistakes played along the way but all I can do is play to the best if my ability.

What I am having fun with now is changing the rhythm pattern of songs and making them sound different though similar.

As I stated before I am not in it for the $ just the glory! Lol

Got my “Rock star” attire ready to go. Not over the top but you know what kind of music I like to play by the way I am dressed. I read one website and they said “dress to impress”. So, I will.

I’ve decided to get a small rolling suitcase on wheels to pack my busking amp in, speaker, accessories, water, a hat, sunscreen and an umbrella for some shade. This will be so much easier to maneuver through the streets of Toronto.

I have to make trip to Toronto today for my permit.

Will check out Gentle on my Mind. Thx BW66 for the idea.


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## Doug Gifford (Jun 8, 2019)

Live music in venues may be a bit thin this spring what with plagues and all that. Busking outdoors just might be a good alternative.


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## jb welder (Sep 14, 2010)

The version used in _Talledega Nights_.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

I am looking at the big picture. I have to make sure that my skin remains as thick as possible. I know for sure that negative comments will be thrown my way. I just have to ignore them. It just pisses me off when you try your best and then a Debbie Downer walks into your life.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Lola said:


> I am looking at the big picture. I have to make sure that my skin remains as thick as possible. I know for sure that negative comments will be thrown my way. I just have to ignore them. It just pisses me off when you try your best and then a Debbie Downer walks into your life.


Just imagine what it would be like if they weren't a mere transient blip in your day. Imagine living with them??


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

1SweetRide said:


> Just imagine what it would be like if they weren't a mere transient blip in your day. Imagine living with them??


I can’t even begin to imagine!


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## Hammerhands (Dec 19, 2016)

I like the looper idea. A drum beat, octave down to get a bass-line, going. Building the song could be part of the entertainment. Some songs wouldn’t be evident until you started singing.

How about a band-in-a-box like the Digitech Trio (Plus) or the recently announced Bias Spark?

Still, you could organize a small group of musicians, whoever can show up. Maybe find a reliable keyboard player.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Hammerhands said:


> I like the looper idea. A drum beat, octave down to get a bass-line, going. Building the song could be part of the entertainment. Some songs wouldn’t be evident until you started singing.
> 
> How about a band-in-a-box like the Digitech Trio (Plus) or the recently announced Bias Spark?
> 
> Still, you could organize a small group of musicians, whoever can show up. Maybe find a reliable keyboard player.


Thx for the advice but somehow playing by myself would be more fun for me.

I have my set list on my phone. One right after the other and a blue tooth 100 w speaker. Btw I don’t sing all. I don’t have the voice.


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## reckless toboggan (Mar 9, 2019)

Lola said:


> Just had a moment of clarity.
> 
> I can play what I want to play over and over again if I so desire.
> 
> ...


Then this'll really blow your mind...

...if you want to, you can literally do that at any gig you ever play, not just busking.


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## marcos (Jan 13, 2009)

I dont see a problem using a backing track. Its only musicians that make comments on backing tracks. The rest of the world is fine with them. Use what makes you happy and ignore the others. Also, i make my own back tracks and have used them since 1992 with a trio that i have. No complaints .


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

I'm in Toronto fairy often and see buskers using loopers all the time. I don't think it's cheating at all. 

Let me know when and where you're doing it, and if I'm around I'll throw you a few bucks.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

butterknucket said:


> I'm in Toronto fairy often and see buskers using loopers all the time. I don't think it's cheating at all.
> 
> Let me know when and where you're doing it, and if I'm around I'll throw you a few bucks.


You don’t have to but just come an see me play.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

butterknucket said:


> Let me know when and where you're doing it, and if I'm around I'll throw you a few bucks.





Lola said:


> You don’t have to but just come an see me play.


BK, just walk around yelling 'you gotta see this chick playing at 'x' and 'y' corner!'.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

laristotle said:


> BK, just walk around yelling 'you gotta see this chick playing at 'x' and 'y' corner!'.


peas in a pod


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Trust me, I will definitely keep everyone in the loop. 

I can’t stop thinking about this. I am excited!


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

@Lola I'm curious...... If you don't/won't sing, where is the melody? If you are playing the vocal melody on guitar, where is the rhythm section? 

There are a lot of very cool instrumental arrangements of what were originally vocal tunes, (Jeff Beck's take on A Day in the Life for example), but he's got a great band backing him. In jazz, I don't think tgere is a finer solo guitarist than Joe Pass.

Busking is challenging, but some of my favorite moments in hearing live music are buskers. I first heard The Shuffle Demons on a street corner. I believe that in a band, music is a conversation among the musicians where the audience gets to eavesdrop. For a pure solo performer, that conversation is between the musician and the audience, but only the musician is talking. 

Good luck, I wish I had your energy and commitment.


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## GTmaker (Apr 24, 2006)

Lola said:


> Trust me, I will definitely keep everyone in the loop.
> I can’t stop thinking about this. I am excited!


As usual, I'm confused.
So you dont sing and you wont use backing tracks etc.....
I think there are 6 gazillion you tube videos...
can you find someone actually doing/playing as you intend to do on your busking tour.

Please dont post a music video of your favorite band....that's not what Im asking.
G.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Paul M said:


> @Lola I'm curious...... If you don't/won't sing, where is the melody? If you are playing the vocal melody on guitar, where is the rhythm section?
> 
> There are a lot of very cool instrumental arrangements of what were originally vocal tunes, (Jeff Beck's take on A Day in the Life for example), but he's got a great band backing him. In jazz, I don't think tgere is a finer solo guitarist than Joe Pass.
> 
> ...


I am playing backing tracks with the vocals in then!


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

GTmaker said:


> As usual, I'm confused.
> So you dont sing and you wont use backing tracks etc.....
> I think there are 6 gazillion you tube videos...
> can you find someone actually doing/playing as you intend to do on your busking tour.
> ...


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Lola said:


> I am playing backing tracks with the vocals in then!


So...are these music minus tracks, where the only thing "minused", is the part you are playing? In jazz I know guys who play restaurant dinner music using full rhythm tracks, but the melody and solo are all live. Not quite busking, but similar.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

I may use original tracks as well. The world is my oyster.

I have also been practicing with no backing tracks, just me and my guitar. One of the songs that I wrote sounds perfect with just guitar. This song really doesn’t need words as the dynamics of the song do the talking. It’s such a tear jerker all by itself. Just the rests in the song adds lots of tension and drama.


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## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

Paul M said:


> There are a lot of very cool instrumental arrangements of what were originally vocal tunes, (Jeff Beck's take on A Day in the Life for example), but he's got a great band backing him. In jazz, I don't think tgere is a finer solo guitarist than Joe Pass.
> ]


Off topic - but I didn't realize until now that Joe Pass invented "Guitar Face". Steve Vai owes him some royalties.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

butterknucket said:


> I'm in Toronto fairy often and see buskers using loopers all the time. I don't think it's cheating at all.
> 
> Let me know when and where you're doing it, and if I'm around I'll throw you a few bucks.


Why wait? Throw her a few bucks now. Momma needs a new pair of shoes.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

1SweetRide said:


> Momma needs a new pair of shoes.


or a set of strings.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

laristotle said:


> or a set of strings.


Forget the strings. Momma needs a PRS S2. Preferably Firemist Purple.

This shall be mine one day. I absolutely love this guitar. Nothing as beautiful to the fingers as playing an S2.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

If you play or busk often enough, you should be able to get one sooner than later. Since I've been gigging a lot lately, and mind you we don't get paid a lot of money, but I've noticed that I have earned enough money this year to a point that I could've probably bought a new PRS S2. : just saying. 
Also, maybe you can look for someone who could sing and start up a duo. I find playing in a duo is the most lucrative thing to do these days. Lot's of places to play and the money is not bad at all.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Chito said:


> If you play or busk often enough, you should be able to get one sooner than later. Since I've been gigging a lot lately, and mind you we don't get paid a lot of money, but I've noticed that I have earned enough money this year to a point that I could've probably bought a new PRS S2. : just saying.
> Also, maybe you can look for someone who could sing and start up a duo. I find playing in a duo is the most lucrative thing to do these days. Lot's of places to play and the money is not bad at all as well.


There is this 10 yr old neighbour of mine who plays drums and sings. He’s really pretty good for a young man of his age. I also am looking for compatible profiles in Bandmix.ca but then again who knows. I have quite a few connections from the past bands that I have been in.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Lola said:


> There is this 10 yr old neighbour of mine who plays drums and sings. He’s really pretty good for a young man of his age. I also am looking for compatible profiles in Bandmix.ca but then again who knows. I have quite a few connections from the past bands that I have been in.


That would be great fun. Bonus, kids aren’t affected by the virus.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

Lola said:


> There is this 10 yr old neighbour of mine who plays drums and sings. He’s really pretty good for a young man of his age. I also am looking for compatible profiles in Bandmix.ca but then again who knows. I have quite a few connections from the past bands that I have been in.


That's very interesting. He could busk with you, just bring a cajon... its also easier to manage a duo when you only have to deal with one person as opposed to having 3 or 4 people in a band.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Damn this Corona Virus. I am so ready to get out there and start playing.

I have been practicing with and without back tracks, polishing up my original songs, got the rock n roll clothes ready.

I am almost willing to start working at Loblaws as a temp.

Music is the key that can open strange rooms in the house of memory.


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## Doug Gifford (Jun 8, 2019)

Lola said:


> …I am almost willing to start working at Loblaws as a temp.…


My daughter got back from working checkout at the local Metro. Summer job. And she was so happy! The people she works with are pleasant and friendly and welcoming and she enjoyed being around them. Who'd have thought?


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Loblaws is not safe (in my opinion). They are exposed to people constantly. The company does not protect the staff, provide proper training, or do anything they should (in my opinion). There was a worker in Ottawa this week that was found to have the virus. Stay away unless you don't believe the virus is not real.


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## nman (Sep 14, 2019)

Your Independent, a non-union offshoot of Loblaws, has done a poor job too. They were perhaps the last store to use or provide any type of safety measures and to this day the management staffers go sans-mask. And they won't let me busk outside even if it's solo classical. "We don't do that" Speaking of busking I've found 3 locations where I won't be hassled by business owners or by beggars. I average 25-30 per hour, playing all styles of music, lots of looping. Ten years now. Gotta be tough to do this.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

nman said:


> Your Independent, a non-union offshoot of Loblaws, has done a poor job too. They were perhaps the last store to use or provide any type of safety measures and to this day the management staffers go sans-mask. And they won't let me busk outside even if it's solo classical. "We don't do that" Speaking of busking I've found 3 locations where I won't be hassled by business owners or by beggars. I average 25-30 per hour, playing all styles of music, lots of looping. Ten years now. Gotta be tough to do this.


I honestly could care less about the $ when it comes to busking. I am honestly addicted to playing in front of others. The band I play in is on hiatus until summer is over. I feel the need to rip into a big loud and raunchy Riff Raff rendition. To let my playing make someone happy/smile/have a better day whatever. That is the happy factor I am after.

I however must be patient until Toronto gets to stage 2.


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