# Is EMT payments safe



## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

This type of payment , can anything go wrong.. or is a good safe way to do business.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

I just started pushing my clients do it. I love it.

Is it safe? I just found out from a client who just retired (she was executive assistant to the CEO of a Hong Kong bank here in canada) that she wouldn't do it - ever.

I hope that helps you, 'cause I think I just confused myself.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

wow , i was thinking to was safer then paypal... like it seems you have to have a bank account to use it.. but who knows there are scammers out there that think up things you would never though existed.


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2014)

EMT over the Interac rails? Yes, it's safe. In so much as your account information is not exposed to the recipient. Is it safe in the "can I get my money back if I give it to someone and change my mind" way -- no, it's not. Once sent, recalling it is hard because the Interac rails move the money from one bank to another without holding it. PayPal, by comparison, holds the funds to mitigate risk (both to them and you as part of their value add).


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

As a seller - I don't see the drawback. Bank sends an email with a security question to you and the buyer sends you the answer via another method. I just can't see the risk.

As a buyer - a member here sent thousands to a 'buyer' and never got his item. No recourse. I see very scary possibilities there. Scammers everywhere try to get people to use EMT to send them $$ because there is nothing that can be done after they get it, I guess.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

I've used it and liked it but it was people I know. I had someone try to buy something using my credit card number recently and I had to have my card cancelled and a new one sent. I will not be giving my credit card number out as easily as I did before for online or phone purchases. I will go back to using Paypal. One thing I just found out is there is no charge for using Paypal for online purchases.


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

From a banking point of view, yes the transaction is secure. Having worked in the banking system in the US & Canada on secure computer bank systems and having used EMT transfers many times myself, I see no problems. The actual transaction is as safe as any online banking and safer than using your debit card in a store. It is a generic Interac transaction, so no banking information is exchanged.

Only a person who can open the email can have access to the transaction. After clicking on the link in the email, the recipient must choose their bank from a list and log into their online banking account just as they would to get a statement, pay bills, etc. Then they must go to the EMT (Interac) link within their account and answer the security question with the answer you provided them and embedded in the transaction when you sent it. So:

- The recipient must be able to receive the EMT email from Interac
- The recipient must know the answer to the security question you provide
- The recipient must be able to log into their personal online banking account to receive the transfer
- The recipient has no information about the bank or account it came from
- The sender has no information about the bank or account it went to
- The sender receives an automatic email from Interac that the transaction is complete
- If you like, the recipient can include an agreed upon response in the Interac email to be sure the correct recipient received the money

If you are comfortable with that and the security of Interac servers (which are as secure as any, more secure than most), EMTs can be considered a pretty safe way to transfer money.


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## DrHook (Oct 28, 2013)

Some great information above, the bottom line is that your personal information is safe going through the web. As a seller it's safer because there's no false Paypal/credit card charge backs when a customer buys something and then doesn't want to pay for it and keeps the item. As a buyer, it just means you have to be a little smarter and not take the risk if anything about the seller or the item seems dodgy because the transaction is final. Lately I've been using Squareup when I sell on Kijiji as an option. I get a credit card reader that attaches to my smartphone or tablet and the buyer has the option of using his credit card on the spot. It can't do debit because that would involve being a registered business, but for a hobby buyer/seller it's ideal.


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2014)

DrHook said:


> Lately I've been using Squareup when I sell on Kijiji as an option. I get a credit card reader that attaches to my smartphone or tablet and the buyer has the option of using his credit card on the spot. It can't do debit because that would involve being a registered business, but for a hobby buyer/seller it's ideal.


Whoohoo Square! (Sorry, I work there now...)


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

The wife uses it to send money to the grandsons for birthdays etc.. Seems to work. She also sends money to "help out" 'cause the son in law is an idiot. He works but figures that a new iPhone is a necessity. Not too sure if a lot of businesses use it. I know the place I'll probably break down and buy some parts from doesn't use it. For that I'll figure out what my order will cost and then get a prepaid credit card and use that. As has been said, as long as the person on the other end is 'honest' you should be ok. One other problem that might come up is the e-mail thing. Supposedly one person one e-mail acct., right? Wrong. I have an acct. I've used for years. In the last few years I've found out that the same acct. is also registered to 5 or 6 other people around the world. 
The card reader on the phone thing seems to be secure, as far as I can tell, but if I'm buying off Kijiji I pay cash. Do you increase the price of an item to cover the service charge?


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## bolero (Oct 11, 2006)

I use EMT all the time & have never had any problems


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

same here, there's an element of trust involved if you're the buyer so I try to limit it to GC. Not one issue to date.



bolero said:


> I use EMT all the time & have never had any problems


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Rick31797 said:


> wow , i was thinking to was safer then paypal... like it seems you have to have a bank account to use it.. but who knows there are scammers out there that think up things you would never though existed.


That's exactly my point. I don't know what the scammers are up to. I figure I'm small potatoes and there's some protection in numbers, so the likelihood of something happening to ME is slim.

The lady I spoke with said that information was snagged and just under 2 million was stolen from the bank's client. Yikes.

I know a guy who heads IT security for one of the major canadian banks. He's a super brilliant asshole that I can't stand, but I should be able to get some good info from him through another friend of mine. I'll ask my good friend to forward the inquiry. I'll be back.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

Thanks all, good information... 

Here is what's going on, i am the seller, its a guitar i am selling and the buyer i think is near Toronto, because he answer my Toronto ad, but who knows he could be anywhere.If he is in Toronto we are 2 hrs from each other........

We have had 3 emails, the first email from him was , is this still available.. second one was, can you tell me the condition and your best price..3rd email was price sounds good, give me your information and i will paypal you.

We never even got to talking about shipping and he wants my paypal acount info.. that was a red flag to me..

I told him i dont do paypal and EMT would be good, he replies because of security reasons he prefers paypal... and he ask me to consider opening an account..
Thats the last email..

I can understand him wanting paypal as if i send him the guitar and its garage he has a recourse.

But the whole thing just doesnt sound right...


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

^^^ Correct ^^^

He doesn't know you at all and has no protection through EMT. You know where he lives, he has no idea who you are or where you live. I wouldn't do it if I were him and it was a reasonably high priced item. I usually like to actually talk to someone in this kind of situation.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

As far as Paypal goes, i do have an account, but it was compromised 3 weeks ago.I was sitting here one night and i get a paypal transaction message..You have just made a purchase of 1299.00. for an iphone 6.Before i got to papal, i get another one for 855.00 and a 3rd for 299.00.Then the credit card calls me asking me if i made these purchases.. so my card was cancelled, and i phoned paypal, in the USA at my expense.. and between the two of them they got it straighten out..
so since then i have not put in any of my credit card info to paypal... just changed my password..


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

I'd say you're being scammed.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

I agree... he actually knows the city i am in...but i have no idea were he is....but saying that would you ever buy a guitar and not talk about shipping and shipping costs.. the ad does not say i will ship... and he never asked.. just wanted to send payment..

So my problem is , he sends me paypal money.. and ship guitar, a week or to goes by and he claims he didnt get it and put in a claim through paypal.. then there is a mess.. he has my item, i have nothing.





davetcan said:


> ^^^ Correct ^^^
> 
> He doesn't know you at all and has no protection through EMT. You know where he lives, he has no idea who you are or where you live. I wouldn't do it if I were him and it was a reasonably high priced item. I usually like to actually talk to someone in this kind of situation.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

I sent a message asking him his location or city... his reply

I'm in state

ok is this a strange answer or what.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

I've only used EMT to purchase items from members of this site, and send my kids money. I find I trust the people here, where I would never EMT with a stranger. Any Kijiji, CL, want add type of transaction is strictly CASH and always meet in a public place to receive/release the goods. Way too many scammers in this world.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

I think that's were i am at, cash and in person.......if they want the item bad enough they can drive... the people here are good, like family.......





Lincoln said:


> I've only used EMT to purchase items from members of this site, and send my kids money. I find I trust the people here, where I would never EMT with a stranger. Any Kijiji, CL, want add type of transaction is strictly CASH and always meet in a public place to receive/release the goods. Way too many scammers in this world.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Rick31797 said:


> I sent a message asking him his location or city... his reply
> 
> I'm in state
> 
> ok is this a strange answer or what.


He's in state of don't trust. Tell him that after you receive the money you will ship the guitar, with a tracking number and sign on receipt. At his cost. Or, tell him that you meet in the middle, he gives you the cash and you give him the guitar. Don't go alone.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

My last message to him was what city are you in.... and his reply is USA.... ok i did not ask him for his address, but if i am shipping a guitar i would certainly need it.... but anyway his answers are short, and none specific... so this is a bust.. no dice scammer.


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

Good decision. The culture of trusting strangers on their word or a handshake or a signature on a cheque are long gone. Even most IT guys worth their salt will tell you that no online transaction or communication is bulletproof safe. It's a world full of predators out there and you and I are nothing but tasty treats for them. One must always be vigilant, be aware of our vulnerability and reserve trust for only people that have earned it.

That being said, I think that for buying and selling with people you don't know, Paypal is the best way to go. It provides some insurance that the agreed on purchase will happen the way both parties expect.

As for unexpected Paypal emails, they are 99% most likely scams. If something says it comes from Paypal, delete the email (don't even bother opening it and definitely don't click on any links). Log into your account from your browser as you usually do, check your account for anomalies and change your password or even your email if you need peace of mind.


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2014)

Rick31797 said:


> I sent a message asking him his location or city... his reply
> 
> I'm in state
> 
> ok is this a strange answer or what.


It's probably been said (I'm not reading ahead on the thread): but this is a classic scam.


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## LexxM3 (Oct 12, 2009)

Electraglide said:


> One other problem that might come up is the e-mail thing. Supposedly one person one e-mail acct., right? Wrong. I have an acct. I've used for years. In the last few years I've found out that the same acct. is also registered to 5 or 6 other people around the world.


Huh? Can you please explain the background of this situation. Are you saying you gave up an email address in some service (e.g. stopped paying, deleted account, etc.) and someone else took it after you gave it up -- that's the only way I can imagine this description could make any sense -- or something else?


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

The emails i got from paypal were real..i thought for a sec it was a scam email, then i got two more, then the bank called me, asking if i had made these purchases , by they way they are fast, the bank must have some type of program.. that monitors credit card user activity , and if something is out of normal spending.. they get an alert.. my guess..
so i went to my paypal account and sure enough 3 transactions over 2500.00 was charge, items bought off ebay...






bluzfish said:


> Good decision. The culture of trusting strangers on their word or a handshake or a signature on a cheque are long gone. Even most IT guys worth their salt will tell you that no online transaction or communication is bulletproof safe. It's a world full of predators out there and you and I are nothing but tasty treats for them. One must always be vigilant, be aware of our vulnerability and reserve trust for only people that have earned it.
> 
> That being said, I think that for buying and selling with people you don't know, Paypal is the best way to go. It provides some insurance that the agreed on purchase will happen the way both parties expect.
> 
> As for unexpected Paypal emails, they are 99% most likely scams. If something says it comes from Paypal, delete the email (don't even bother opening it and definitely don't click on any links). Log into your account from your browser as you usually do, check your account for anomalies and change your password or even your email if you need peace of mind.


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2014)

Electraglide said:


> One other problem that might come up is the e-mail thing. Supposedly one person one e-mail acct., right? Wrong. I have an acct. I've used for years. In the last few years I've found out that the same acct. is also registered to 5 or 6 other people around the world.


This is not possible. You might have *smiliar* email addresses, but not *the same*. I can go in to a lengthy description of the MTA protocol used to move email around the globe each and every day, but it's probably better you just take my word for it. 



> The card reader on the phone thing seems to be secure, as far as I can tell


In the case of Square I can say with the utmost authority that is. Can't speak to any others. The risk isn't in the card reader -- the data it's reading is just the data that's on the front your card, it's not *secret* data at all and it's not encrypted in the magnetic stripe of the card.



> Do you increase the price of an item to cover the service charge?


No. I like when people give me their money and if I'm willing to accept their money in some form other than cold, hard cash, I accept that using that other form incurs a service charge. It is the cost of doing business so to speak.

FWIW: If you're in the US you can Square Cash, which uses Square's secure rails, and doesn't cost you any money. There's a dispute mechanism to it, but it's closer to EMT than PayPal. We don't have EMT (because we don't an overseeing interchange company like Interac in the US) in the US the way you do in Canada -- the interchange landscape is really fractured here.


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2014)

Rick31797 said:


> his reply is USA


If he pesters you. Tell him you wont ship because it might 
get confiscated at the border. Then you're both s.o.l.


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

Rick31797 said:


> The emails i got from paypal were real..i thought for a sec it was a scam email, then i got two more, then the bank called me, asking if i had made these purchases , by they way they are fast, the bank must have some type of program.. that monitors credit card user activity , and if something is out of normal spending.. they get an alert.. my guess..
> so i went to my paypal account and sure enough 3 transactions over 2500.00 was charge, items bought off ebay...


That is why I said to log into your Paypal through your browser, even manually typing www.paypal.com rather than use a favorites link if you are really suspicious. Look for 'HTTPS' and the little closed lock in the address bar that shows you are on a secure web site.

The persistent emails may be an alert that something is up with your account. No major financial institution in Canada will provide a link to your login in an email. Hover your mouse over any links without clicking and look at the address at the bottom of the screen if you want to see where the link will really take you.

You will be alerted to genuine suspicious activity when you do manually log in through your browser.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

LexxM3 said:


> Huh? Can you please explain the background of this situation. Are you saying you gave up an email address in some service (e.g. stopped paying, deleted account, etc.) and someone else took it after you gave it up -- that's the only way I can imagine this description could make any sense -- or something else?


Nope....for years I've had the same hotmail acct.. Never gave it up and still use it. A few years ago I started to get the occasional e-mail sent to a retired school teacher in England. Then some started to show up for a person in Miami. And Spokane and Perth Aus. I've sent out emails and got answers back from the ones in England and in Spokane. I got in touch with hotmail and "they're looking into it" because it does happen, especially with older accts. The e-mail is one I use for registering software, Kijiji etc.. I checked earlier and there's one from a BMW dealership in Illinois so I suppose that the one from the Kia dealership in Miami And the Winnibago place will show up soon.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

In my dealings with Paypal in the last few days, I was told by them that any emails from them(Paypal) will start with Hello(your name). If it doesn't, it's not Paypal and you should delete it.


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

I found several people using my hotmail email address to create an identity soon after Microsoft bought Skype. You can search for contacts using your email to see if it has been used this way. They couldn't access my email account, they were just using it for ID for Skype and probably spam.

Communicating with Skype support to delete the bogus accounts was futile, so I just logged into them by using the 'forgot password' link at login to change their Skype password so they couldn't log in to Skype anymore. Just for fun, I also bastardized the Skype accounts with names like Dick Wadd and fake addresses and phone numbers so I could at least identify activity that used them that might actually track back to me. Nothing came of it.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

bluzfish said:


> Good decision. The culture of trusting strangers on their word or a handshake or a signature on a cheque are long gone. Even most IT guys worth their salt will tell you that no online transaction or communication is bulletproof safe. It's a world full of predators out there and you and I are nothing but tasty treats for them. One must always be vigilant, be aware of our vulnerability and reserve trust for only people that have earned it.


I wouldn't go so far as to say that. I don't believe there are any more scammers in the world than there used to be in the "good old days". Just like there aren't pedophiles and kidnappers on every street corner now. I believe we live in a culture that promotes fear to promote products and build empires - I've seen the latter firsthand. When I look at the world through that lense, I realize we spend a lot of time scaring ourselves. There are a lot of things that are possible, that doesn't mean they're going to happen.

Having said that, I am prudent with online payments - I use PayPal for Int'l purchases and EMT for Canadian purchases where I am reasonably confident that the seller is legitimate. Let's face it, if you pay someone the old fashion way (by cheque), the technology exists to forge it. 

I Just try to remember that if something is too good to be true then it probably is. For example: I don't respond to emails from Nigeria informing me that I've inherited money from a long lost relative.


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

No, it really is a different world than it was 100 or even 50 years ago. There are billions more people who are extremely mobile with access to advanced technology unheard of back then. Even if the actual percentage of con men in the world has not increased, their proportionate numbers have, as have the avenues for their nefarious schemes.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

I agree, they are figuring out new ways to scam people, and the police are always a step or few behind them..Because they cannot predict what they will do next..so buyer beware.








bluzfish said:


> No, it really is a different world than it was 100 or even 50 years ago. There are billions more people who are extremely mobile with access to advanced technology unheard of back then. Even if the actual percentage of con men in the world has not increased, their proportionate numbers have, as have the avenues for their nefarious schemes.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

iaresee said:


> This is not possible. You might have *smiliar* email addresses, but not *the same*. I can go in to a lengthy description of the MTA protocol used to move email around the globe each and every day, but it's probably better you just take my word for it.
> 
> 
> In the case of Square I can say with the utmost authority that is. Can't speak to any others. The risk isn't in the card reader -- the data it's reading is just the data that's on the front your card, it's not *secret* data at all and it's not encrypted in the magnetic stripe of the card.
> ...


For the most part you're right about the e-mail addys. The one in Spokane has one large case letter, mine is all small case. E-mails still get switched at times. As far as duplicates.....there's a lot of hotmail accts out there. I've had mine since 2000. Odds are pretty good that duplicates will happen. All I know is that on occasion I get other peoples e-mails and they get mine, with the same e-mail address. As far as taking your word.....sorry, I'll take what I see. Just because something is not supposed to happen doesn't mean it won't happen. Flip a coin against a wall, odds of it landing the third way are pretty slim. Flip 10 million coins, the odds go up quite a bit. 
As far as your card reader goes, as I said, it seems to be secure. But, from the looks of it, to use it you have to read the magnetic strip. Then the holders cell phone sends that info to what I assume is your place of employment who get in touch with the credit card company, receives the funds and transfers those funds minus 2.75 % to the holders acct.. Umm, I bet the company has a fairly big R/D/security division. I also bet that the info you receive off the card is all the info anyone needs to make a bogus purchase or two. Not knocking your product, the reader as provided by your employer is just a 'go between'.
I prefer to deal in cash. It's quick and easy. No questions asked. No service charges. FWIW, there's a service charge in Canada. If I had a business I would include any and all service charges incurred in the price I was charging. That's the cost of doing business.
As far as the EMT thing in the states I've noticed that the suppliers I was looking at don't take pre-paid credit cards either. The one says that as an international buyer I have to provide a copy of header of my credit card statement that shows my name, address, etc. etc.. I don't get a statement that I can fax to them. So I guess I'll be dealing with cash and local people.
Strange, another page where the ad at the top of the page has to do with something in the part of the thread on that page....Square to be exact.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Stratin2traynor said:


> I wouldn't go so far as to say that. I don't believe there are any more scammers in the world than there used to be in the "good old days". Just like there aren't pedophiles and kidnappers on every street corner now. I believe we live in a culture that promotes fear to promote products and build empires - I've seen the latter firsthand. When I look at the world through that lense, I realize we spend a lot of time scaring ourselves. There are a lot of things that are possible, that doesn't mean they're going to happen.
> 
> Having said that, I am prudent with online payments - I use PayPal for Int'l purchases and EMT for Canadian purchases where I am reasonably confident that the seller is legitimate. Let's face it, if you pay someone the old fashion way (by cheque), the technology exists to forge it.
> 
> I Just try to remember that if something is too good to be true then it probably is. For example: I don't respond to emails from Nigeria informing me that I've inherited money from a long lost relative.


In the "good old days" there were probably as many scammers/1000 as there are now. But, for the most part, a lot of the time the scammer was at some time close enough that you could smack him upside the head instead of being in nigeria or toronto or the bay area...too far away to touch in any form. As far as word and handshake go bluz, in my community, world, (call it what you will) they still stand. If Strat is selling something and I tell him someone I trust will be there at a certain time with cash in hand (no the check isn't in the mail) she will be there with the cash.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

bluzfish said:


> No, it really is a different world than it was 100 or even 50 years ago. There are billions more people who are extremely mobile with access to advanced technology unheard of back then. Even if the actual percentage of con men in the world has not increased, their proportionate numbers have, as have the avenues for their nefarious schemes.


I totally understand that. Makes sense. That is still no reason to believe we are nothing but prey. 

I think it's common knowledge that there are hotbeds of scammers in the world. If we avoid dealing with anyone in those areas of the world, we have a lot of the problem beat and just have to deal with the degenerates within our reach. Furthermore, I would suspect that people who are most often scammed are the ones enticed by the sweet deals they are offered or found online (read con-men of days past). They get you hook line and sinker and then move on. Once again, if things are too good to be true, they likely are. I've been shopping online for around 15 years and have never had a problem (except once on eBay which was taken care of in less than a week). The moment things appear to be somewhat shady whether in person or by email, I say "nevermind, I'll pass".

There have a been a lot of good points raised in this thread. I think if we are diligent in avoiding the "to good to be true" deals, we have 95% of the problem licked. Why, because thieves are generally lazy. If they have to try too hard, they'll move one. 

PS - I better knock on wood before my electronic accounts get drained. Lol.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Funny thing is, at least in this part of the world, you stiil hear of a lot of people getting caught in the refinish the driveway and reroof the house type of scams. Aluminum siding is not as popular but there still is a lot of stuff bought out of the backs of trucks in parking lots also. The over run/over stock/clear the warehouse kinda stuff. 
It wasn't that long ago, in the Edmonton to Calgary corridor that there was a ''gold'' thing going on. These are oldies but goodies and people still fall for them. They'll ignore the prince from nigeria and the buy 'grandmas' ring from some young thing at the door who's car broke down and who needs busfare to Vancouver. Then let her in to use the phone and/or the bathroom. 
As far as the old days I grew up in a small town. Lots of open range and cows. One year the same half dozen cows got sold a few times. As I recall the guy got caught and was in rough shape when he got turned in.


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

I guess being a downtown city boy for the last 40 years has taught me several things:

- A handshake is only good for passing on the flu virus

- A signature is just a personal scribble when it comes to legal documents

- A person's word is just, at best, well intentioned babble

- Honour is just a term one uses to address a judge

(One may exclude one's mother and/or wife from these rules if applicable)

:smile-new:

Just kidding, sort of. I did grow up in a small community where a person's word, handshake and signature were sacred. But I do have to always think twice about that in whatever I do to avoid being a gullible sucker because I also believe that when it comes to people, I still have to hope for the best but be prepared for the worst.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

Do you think scammers have a conscious. Is it something they do, and later feel bad, but they cant help themselves, like a drug getting you high.. I know a guy that has scammed people he knew, out of money...and his reason, was these people are well off and wont miss it.


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## LowWatt (Jun 27, 2007)

Rick31797 said:


> Do you think scammers have a conscious. Is it something they do, and later feel bad, but they cant help themselves, like a drug getting you high.. I know a guy that has scammed people he knew, out of money...and his reason, was these people are well off and wont miss it.


The ones I've seen up close see it as a business. It's a cold calculating attitude they have. Just hitting as many scams as they can handle and if you happen to fall for it, they consider it your fault and their job to take money from the stupid. It's a very gross sociopathic lifestyle where they are convinced the victim is at fault.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Finally back.

This is what the head of IT security had to say about it (please note that I was mentioning my client's issue with EMT, hence the 'her' and her bank'):

_Kidding aside my good man…It's bloody safe…they even give you a confirmation # when you send….a security ? that only you should be able to answer. 
Ultimately, though if you wanna give her the proof from the pudding, I would just call her bank and ask what kind of insurance/assurance they offer on a transfer? 
Also, Any large transfers or unusual transfers are flagged and tracked by FINTRAC (it's a government agency which all banks must comply with for anti-terrorism/laundering).

_I'm still a bit confused about what my client was going on about. I may inquire further with her to see what exactly happened in that particular case of fraud. Perhaps it's as soon as you start performing your transactions on-line that you become a target - regardless of the activity.


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## LexxM3 (Oct 12, 2009)

Electraglide said:


> Nope....for years I've had the same hotmail acct.. Never gave it up and still use it. A few years ago I started to get the occasional e-mail sent to a retired school teacher in England.  Then some started to show up for a person in Miami. And Spokane and Perth Aus. I've sent out emails and got answers back from the ones in England and in Spokane. I got in touch with hotmail and "they're looking into it" because it does happen, especially with older accts. The e-mail is one I use for registering software, Kijiji etc.. I checked earlier and there's one from a BMW dealership in Illinois so I suppose that the one from the Kia dealership in Miami And the Winnibago place will show up soon.


Wow, ok, that is one serious set of bugs/effectively database corruption that Microsoft has going there. I definitely get now how that could happen and I've seen other Microsoft online systems stupidities to completely believe they can be/are this idiotic. Just wow.


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## Guest (Nov 2, 2014)

I don't doubt you've seen some weird behaviour but:


Electraglide said:


> For the most part you're right about the e-mail addys. The one in Spokane has one large case letter, mine is all small case.


Email addresses are usually not case-sensitive. Hotmail, as far as I know, does not provide case-sensitive email addresses. It's generally not done. Edit: found a forum post for Hotmail support that confirms they don't have case-sensitive address portions, so [email protected] and [email protected] are delivered to the same inbox.



> As far as duplicates.....there's a lot of hotmail accts out there. I've had mine since 2000. Odds are pretty good that duplicates will happen.


That's not how it works.  That's like saying, "This street has been here for 25 years, odds are there are a few houses with the same number on it now." Email addresses, for any domain (the part to the right of the @ sign) are always unique. [email protected] is [email protected] and isn't ever some other [email protected]. If it ever didn't work like that an email would be undeliverable.



> All I know is that on occasion I get other peoples e-mails and they get mine, with the same e-mail address.


As before, multiple people can't have the same email address. They might look the same but they can't actually _be_ the same. The _entire_ email system would collapse if that was ever able to happen. What does "look the same" mean? Well: some characters, in certain fonts, look alike. For example [email protected] and [email protected] can appear the same despite one ending in a zero and one ending in an O. And, the "name" you put as metadata on your email address is freely assignable. It's not used to route the email on the internet so you can put whatever you want there. For example: I could put my name as "[email protected]" for my email address [email protected] and if you didn't look at the address, only the name, you might think it came from [email protected] when in fact, it didn't.

Typos, especially when your domain has given out a lot of email addresses like Hotmail has, can also happen. You could be [email protected] and it's pretty easy for someone else to be [email protected] and then their auntie transposes the 6 and 7 and suddenly you're getting her cat pictures.



> As far as taking your word.....sorry, I'll take what I see. Just because something is not supposed to happen doesn't mean it won't happen. Flip a coin against a wall, odds of it landing the third way are pretty slim. Flip 10 million coins, the odds go up quite a bit.


I have no doubt you've observed some strange things, but that doesn't mean you've drawn valid conclusions based on your observations.



> As far as your card reader goes, as I said, it seems to be secure. But, from the looks of it, to use it you have to read the magnetic strip. Then the holders cell phone sends that info to what I assume is your place of employment who get in touch with the credit card company, receives the funds and transfers those funds minus 2.75 % to the holders acct..Umm, I bet the company has a fairly big R/D/security division. I also bet that the info you receive off the card is all the info anyone needs to make a bogus purchase or two. Not knocking your product, the reader as provided by your employer is just a 'go between'.


Yes, it has all the same things in it that every card read in every store has in it.



> Strange, another page where the ad at the top of the page has to do with something in the part of the thread on that page....Square to be exact.


Google AdWords are very good at scanning and placing relevant content. You'll start to see the ads everywhere now because you have tracking cookies that will associate your browser with those ad words. Scary, eh?


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

Yep, this pretty much sums it up for me. I've had no issues with Paypal use for TGP or other online sales/purchases so I'll stick with it for now. Kijiji/CL would be in person cash only.



Lincoln said:


> I've only used EMT to purchase items from members of this site, and send my kids money. I find I trust the people here, where I would never EMT with a stranger. Any Kijiji, CL, want add type of transaction is strictly CASH and always meet in a public place to receive/release the goods. Way too many scammers in this world.


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