# Peeling off the Poly



## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

I've been reading a few threads about guys peeling off the poly coating on their Agile guitars so I took out the sand paper and had at it.

Man, this stuff is THICK. I takes forever with 100 grit sandpaper just to get down to the wood. In the pic you can see where I have hit wood, where some of the poly is gone, and where it still remains in its entirety. 

I'm hoping the guitar becomes more resonant and lively once I get all this crap off. As it is, the guitar sounds amazing thanks to SD 59s and a complete RS Guitarworks electronics package.


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## Guest (Jun 11, 2007)

I know what you mean. I did not enjoy
sanding the MIM strat I'm workin' on.
After the back was done, I used a heat
gun on the rest with a scrapper. Found
it to be much easier. Gotta be careful
you don't nick the wood.


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## elcabong (Mar 6, 2006)

May I know why you guys do that? Do you do it on the back only? Sure looks like a drastic operation !


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

If it's that thick and you're taking it down to the wood anyway, wouldn't a chemical stripper be more efficient?

That's what you do with fine furnature. It can be done gently and man does it save a lot of elbow grease!


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## LaRSin (Nov 27, 2006)

I'm sorry I think it's shame to mess with a beatiful instrument, unless it 's a mess .


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## bRian (Jul 3, 2006)

From all the posts I've read on the net with regards to removing a poly finish; there is no easy way. The harshest strippers are messy and slow. If I was to do one I'd use stripper on the edges and this on the top and bottom.










I made my living learning to master these puppies.


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## dwagar (Mar 6, 2006)

what kind of wood is the body made out of? If it's fairly soft, you might want poly on there.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

try this 

http://www.woodzone.com/articles/scrapers/index.htm


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## esp_dsp (Feb 27, 2007)

keep at her and post if its any better


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

esp_dsp said:


> keep at her and post if its any better


Ok, the guitar is completely stripped of the poly. Wow, what a difference! The guitar has way more upper mids, resonance, and attack. Maybe not day and night when you first play, but it is totally real and you start to appreciate it the more you play.

You really wouldn't believe how thick this stuff is until you peel it off. I gave up on sanding and switched to a heat gun; much more efficient.

Try it out if you are wondering

TG


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## bRian (Jul 3, 2006)

> You really wouldn't believe how thick this stuff is until you peel it off.


I've seen some finishes on Fender Standards as thick as a dime. There is absolutely no need for any finish to be that thick UNLESS it's put on to bury sins.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2007)

elcabong said:


> May I know why you guys do that? Do you do it on the back only? Sure looks like a drastic operation !


Hey Bubulouee..I'll do the thinnin' around here.....

Here's why I did








It's hard to tell but the guy put a belt sander
to it before painting it this faux grain finish.

Here's how she's looking so far








I bought this only because it has texas specials
and I always wanted an Oly white strat.
BTW any of you strat guys know the 
reason for the holes in the body and
neck pocket? I figure for a micro switch.
The one in the neck pocket can't be for
a micro tilt.....it's too central.......right?


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## elcabong (Mar 6, 2006)

Hi Laristotle, now I can understand why. It is either to change color or put something lighter than poly.

What product type have you used tp paint it back OW?

I was also dreaming of an OW Strat with a rosewood neck a long time ago (Jeff Beck Wired era). I ordered one from the States and got it vintage white, maple neck and black pick guard. I hated it for years until I sold it.


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## Lowtones (Mar 21, 2006)

I also don't understand why they put it on so thick. I put on a coating about as thick as a piece of paper. I then wet sand with 2000 grit to make everything even. Then I buff with two different buffing compounds. It comes out looking like glass and about an 1/8 of an inch thick but it is really very thin. I've actually wet sanded through the finish with the 2000 grit a couple of times. Anyway your strat is looking good.:banana:


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

Lowtones said:


> I also don't understand why they put it on so thick.


I think it simply cuts costs. It is a lot less time consuming to basically dip the guitar in a vat of poly then apply it carefully, sand it, buff it etc etc. I'll post some pics of my guitar later, but it made quite a difference in sound.

TG


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

> BTW any of you strat guys know the
> reason for the holes in the body and
> neck pocket? I figure for a micro switch.
> The one in the neck pocket can't be for
> a micro tilt.....it's too central.......right


i could be wrong, but i believe those are tooling holes, used to align the body as it is bieng shaped


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## Guest (Jun 30, 2007)

elcabong said:


> What product type have you used to paint it back OW?


I used 4 cans of off the shelf Krylon from the hardware store.
As *Lowtones* mentions, I wet sanded between every 3
coats ( 1 can). Never empty the can, you don't want it to 
spit near the end. I was intending to clear coat it, but I think
I'll investigate your buffing idea. 

Tooling holes makes sense *fraser*. Tnx for the info.


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## Falcatarius (Apr 23, 2006)

I loathe poly with a burning passion. I find it deadens the tone of any guitar and I hate the fact that the instrument won't age with you. (i like my guitars to build character over time)

I'm using an SRV sig strat that has a poly layer as thick as clotted cream. I would NEVER consider trying to remove it and messing up the gorgeous sunburst on it. But lately i've considered switching out the body with one of the "thin-skin nitro finish" hot-rod strat bodies. Not only would it let her age, but it would keep the original body in great condition so if i wanted to sell her I could just make the swap and have a mint SRV strat again.

My only question is, does anyone know if these "thin-skin" nitro strat bodies by Fender really are ONLY nitro? I know that with the 52' tele reissue the claimed it was nitro when in reality it was a thin coat of nitro and the usual load of poly underneath. I don't want to switch the body if it won't make a difference.

Cheers
-Falcatarius


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## DaleH (Feb 4, 2006)

Those holes are to hold the body and line everything up when the machine cuts it out..


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

Ok, here are some pics. The guitar has way more attack, resonance, and upper mids than it did before. I still need to sand and take all the hardware completely off and stain. Actually, I kinda looks cool as is but I should get something on to help protect the wood. It was hard to capture how thick the polly actually is. I kept a piece of if and took some photos but they didn't turn out too great.




























TG


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Looks great with the natural finish. How did you avoid wrecking the binding?

Does you camera have a 'macro' mode on it? You will be able to get clear closeups using that.


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## I_cant_play (Jun 26, 2006)

I was actually just wondering about the binding myself. I don't even know how binding is done (I've never built a guitar) but I imagine removing thick layers would cause problems with it?

The guitar looks really really gorgeous by the way. I really like that plain wood look.


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

The binding on this guitar is like a thick plastic that goes around the outside edge. I dinged and scuffed it a bit while clearing off the poly but people who are more "handy" would have no troubles (some of the nicks subsequently sand papered out).

The other "binding" is the black lines you see on the guitar. These almost seem like deep ink or injected paint. You can sand right over them and they don't really come off; I'm sure they would eventually disappear but you would have to sand way further than I am.

I had actually assumed all the binding would come off so it was a nice surprise to find that it remained in place.

TG


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

Oh yeah, I've been thinking of just leaving the guitar oh natural and just applying some tung-oil. 

A lot of people have been commenting that the guitar looks cool in its "raw" form. I think if I added some dark wooden pickup rings and knobs it would look tres cool!

TG


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## I_cant_play (Jun 26, 2006)

also, what's this about it sounding different? I read on another forum that the finish influences the tone but if I recall correctly, the vast majority of people claimed that the difference was negligible or non existent. Can anyone explain the effects of finish on tone for a gear newbie?


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## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

traynor_garnet said:


> Oh yeah, I've been thinking of just leaving the guitar oh natural and just applying some tung-oil.
> 
> TG



Tried that, wasn't so good. The oil keeps leeching out onto everything (clothes, guitar stand, case) for months and your case smells like tung oil forever...it was bad, really bad. I had to throw the case away I was so sick of the smell. Its ok on just the neck, and fingerboard if you do it lightly, but the body was a terrible idea.


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## sartana (Jun 9, 2007)

*Wow*

Wow, I am stunned seeing the thickness of the finish!
Nice work you did and I agree with the others it looks tres cool with the natural wood,it (wood)would be nice to keep the natural look.:rockon:
I really think you have done a great job and have been following this interesting thread as you move forward.
Traynor what exact model of Agile is the project guitar?
Did you buy it direct from Rondo and if so how did the brokerage fees and charges end up costing you in addition to the guitar?
I really want to buy a couple of his guitars but he appears to precharge the brokerage and its way higher than even the greedy UPS is, I should drop a dime and see if he will send it UPS and let me worry about the brokerage,disbursement fees and taxes etc.
When I build a cart on his site every guitar I add he charges anothere 45 bucks us and thats not how UPS charges, they use a dollar value as I have discussed on another thread.

Thanks


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## Yerffej (Feb 7, 2006)

I took the paint out from under the bridge on my 50's classic strat recently. I started sanding, but ended up actually chiselling the stuff off. it flaked easily enough, but it was SUPER thick


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## Ripper (Jul 1, 2006)

I stripped a BC Rich ST-3 a few years ago, and it was a painful experience. I've got alot of background with stripping and refinishing this type of stuff (I do french rubbed finishes on gunstocks etc) but nothing prepared me for how tough it was. The commercial stripper I use barely even loosened that stuff and it was so thick. I ended up using a combination of the stripper and heat gun. It looked good when it was done, but honestly I am not sure I could really tell the difference in sound. I redid it with a mixture of a tinted boiled linseed oil to get the colour I wanted and then a couple of coats of linseed oil/spar varnish mixture with finishing/sanding inbetween coats and a fine polish afterwards.


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

I_cant_play said:


> also, what's this about it sounding different? I read on another forum that the finish influences the tone but if I recall correctly, the vast majority of people claimed that the difference was negligible or non existent. Can anyone explain the effects of finish on tone for a gear newbie?


I'm hardly an expert on this stuff but it seems that the difference between a nitro or well done poly finish may be negligible. Some will argue that a nitro finish will age better because it lets the underlying wood breath and age better.

With inexpensive guitars, the poly is THICK. Many people argue that getting this stuff off is important. On my guitar there is a noted difference but it may be more noticeable because my guitar is a semi-hollow (not sure about solid body guitars). Poly can be done in a good way (Fender USA uses polly) but when it starts to get pilled on it is really just a cost cutting measure. Many argue the wood cannot age when covered with this much plastic.

Again, I'm not an expert but this is my general impression.

TG


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

I too was stunned by the thickness. BTW, thanks for the complements I like how the guitar is turning out. :food-smiley-004:

The Agile model is an AD-820 (335 clone). I bought it used on ebay and arranged for it to ship USPS. For Canadians there is no better deal than a used Agile because Rondo will only ships UPS and the brokerage is killer. I bought a guitar new from Rondo once and the shipping/handling was almost as much as the guitar. I've now had about 5 different Agiles, all but one were used.

I'll keep your informed as I progress.

TG




sartana said:


> Wow, I am stunned seeing the thickness of the finish!
> Nice work you did and I agree with the others it looks tres cool with the natural wood,it (wood)would be nice to keep the natural look.:rockon:
> I really think you have done a great job and have been following this interesting thread as you move forward.
> Traynor what exact model of Agile is the project guitar?
> ...


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## I_cant_play (Jun 26, 2006)

thanks for the clarification. It will probably be years until my ear is good enough to tell differences between these kinds of things...


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## erikm5150 (Mar 3, 2006)

what safety precautions do you guys take when stripping or sanding poly?
isn't that stuff toxic?

i've been wanting to strip the finish off my Fender Am std Strat, but i'm afraid of the difficulty and health hazards...


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## Guest (Jul 8, 2007)

erikm5150 said:


> what safety precautions do you guys take when stripping or sanding poly?
> isn't that stuff toxic?
> 
> i've been wanting to strip the finish off my Fender Am std Strat, but i'm afraid of the difficulty and health hazards...


Wearing a mask is a definite when sanding.
Here's a helpful link, http://home.flash.net/~guitars/index.html

Here's an update of my project.
This is after using 320, 400, 600,
1000 and 2000 grit wet sanding.








Another pass with the 2000 grit, then
I'll buff 'er out.


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## Guest (Jul 29, 2007)

Project complete! It took longer than I
expected (due to cataract surgery, I had
to lay back and relax), but here she is. I
still want to strip/refinish the neck or maybe
replace it with a 22 fret. That'll come later.



















100 POST. WOO-WHO!


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