# Another Dead Guy Guitar



## rollingdam (May 11, 2006)

Besides Fender,who will profit from this?

Fender® Kurt Cobain Jaguar®


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

bah, who even wants it? There are literally hundreds of guitars I'd buy before this one crossed my mind.


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2011)

rollingdam said:


> Besides Fender,who will profit from this?


Courtney Love. Francis Bean Cobain.


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## Cdn_Cracker (Oct 7, 2006)

I would hope that Francis receives it... but I would not hold my breath. I think that it will probably go to Courtney/Courtney's dealer and Fender...


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

man, if that guy gets a sig guitar, i wanna know why any one of the 5 trillion other guys who are better players than cobain was don't get one. i can't tell you how much i wish he never died. that way he could have become the passing thing he was meant to be, and all the QRFLW71 who worship him would be blissfully silent.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

I'd rather have a stock Jag.

I've played a few very nice Jags and Jazz Masters.

Pretty slick.

I wouldn't pay extra for a Cobain signature model though.


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## jimihendrix (Jun 27, 2009)

Cobain already had the short-lived Fender Jagstang that he "invented" by combining the Jaguar with the Mustang...He used cut up photographs...


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## Ti-Ron (Mar 21, 2007)

If you compare his pic with the originale the Jagstang made by fender is wrong...!


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

how many kids picked up a guitar after hearing eric johnson?
he's had a signature guitar for some time.
how many kids picked up a guitar after getting into nirvana?
50 times as many? 100? 10,000 times as many?
those kids are in their thirties now, many have made some money, and fender is in the business of selling things.
at least its not gibson making it lol.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

I'm still pissed off Schecter hasn't made my signature guitar yet. I mean, really, I must be the only guy left out there that they haven't made one for. LOL


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

fraser said:


> how many kids picked up a guitar after hearing eric johnson?
> he's had a signature guitar for some time.
> how many kids picked up a guitar after getting into nirvana?
> 50 times as many? 100? 10,000 times as many?
> those kids are in their thirties now,



Great point!

Listening to Nirvana now I don't remember what it was I liked about them at the time. It probably had a lot to do with the fact they weren't shredding on ugly guitars in spandex trousers.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

say, what was up with them spandex trousers anyway?
and the band "loverboy"- whats up there? 
did a guy just show up to band practice one day and say "hey i know! lets call ourselves "loverboy!"?
and everyone else just went along with it?


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

fraser said:


> say, what was up with them spandex trousers anyway?
> and the band "loverboy"- whats up there?
> did a guy just show up to band practice one day and say "hey i know! lets call ourselves "loverboy!"?
> and everyone else just went along with it?


Mike Reno still wears the leather pants.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

zontar said:


> Mike Reno still wears the leather pants.


nobody wears leather pants anymore. you made this shit up.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Loverboy was a band full of really talented players.

and I hated pretty much every song they released. To this day, I get less than 12 bars into any Loverboy track and I'm reaching for the dial.

Nirvana....well they don't get played much on the stations I listen to. I can take them in small doses.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

fraser said:


> how many kids picked up a guitar after hearing eric johnson?
> he's had a signature guitar for some time.
> how many kids picked up a guitar after getting into nirvana?


for some reason, i cant think of even one well known guitarist who ever even slightly suggested that he was inspired to play the instrument because of cobain. i notice that no one else has already mentioned one.
truth is, he wasn't a great guitar player, it's a fact, it's not opinion. he wasn't even a nice guy. i knew several people who personally knew him, and they all said he was a d**k. funny,_ all 3 of them used the same word._ coincidence? probably not. worst of all, he openly showed contempt for his audience.
in my mind, this is unforgivable. any performer who has gotten richand famous, owes everything to their fans. period, end of story. his attitude disgusts me, and if there is any justice in this universe, he has been re-incarnated as a cockroach somewhere.


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## Guest (Sep 7, 2011)

cheezyridr said:


> for some reason, i cant think of even one well known guitarist who ever even slightly suggested that he was inspired to play the instrument because of cobain. i notice that no one else has already mentioned one.


Logical fallacy. Just because you don't know it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. You hate the band, ergo you're more than likely to avoid new bands that follow from Nirvana and list them as influences. Keeping you well away from anyone who would ever claim they picked up the guitar because of Cobain. These people in exist. Apparently in numbers that would scare you.



> truth is, he wasn't a great guitar player, it's a fact, it's not opinion.


Great is subjective. So it's an opinion. By what measure are you determining greatness? He clearly wrote great songs -- they sell in quantities Eric Johnson can only dream of. And he wrote them on a guitar. It follows he was a great guitar player then, by some measure of greatness. See how subjective that is?

I've got you pegged for a _hate-everything-you-don't-understand_ type of person now. Truth?


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## iblastoff (May 14, 2011)

who gives a shit if he was a dick or not. lol @ "3 ppl said he was a dick so it must be true"

He wrote great pop songs and nirvana definitely inspired me to play. 

Come as you are = tons of people's first songs learned on guitar.


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

fraser said:


> nobody wears leather pants anymore. you made this shit up.


hahahahahaa



cheezyridr said:


> for some reason, i cant think of even one well known guitarist who ever even slightly suggested that he was inspired to play the instrument because of cobain. i notice that no one else has already mentioned one.
> truth is, he wasn't a great guitar player, it's a fact, it's not opinion. he wasn't even a nice guy. i knew several people who personally knew him, and they all said he was a d**k. funny,_ all 3 of them used the same word._ coincidence? probably not. worst of all, he openly showed contempt for his audience.
> in my mind, this is unforgivable. any performer who has gotten richand famous, owes everything to their fans. period, end of story. his attitude disgusts me, and if there is any justice in this universe, he has been re-incarnated as a cockroach somewhere.


yeah, I get this, but what fraser was saying is that he inspired lots of people to play guitar period. Doesn't matter if any of them went on to be famous or not. Fender's in the business of selling guitars, not providing artists with the tools needed to make music (although it would be awesome if that was their mission statement). Sure, they'll sell some to the 30-somethings who were rocking out to Nevermind 20 years ago and that's all they want.

I never really liked Nirvana either. My favourite Nirvana track is the one release posthumously (figures). I didn't get the whole approach and didn't care. I loved grunge when it came out, I was big into Pearl Jam, STP, Bush, etc. but Kurt and his boys never really did anything for me.


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## Swervin55 (Oct 30, 2009)

fraser said:


> nobody wears leather pants anymore. you made this shit up.


now that's funny!


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## rockinbluesfan (Mar 3, 2008)

Who is Nirvana?


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

I was past 40 when Nirvana came out. I enjoyed the video "Smells Like Teen Spirit" but that was about it. I didn't really pay attention to them. I spent more time listening to another guy from Seattle who also died at 27 some 25 years or so earlier. 

But as has been pointed out. Nirvana influenced a lot of people to pick up guitar. A lot of these people are now middle aged and have some $$$. Fender is in the business of selling guitars. Odds are that it will be successful for Fender.

As for Cobain being a dickhead. I do not think that is relevent. There has been lots of press over the years that Richie Blackmore is a dickhead, but that didn't stop Fender from issuing his model, more than once I believe.


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## 4345567 (Jun 26, 2008)

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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

cheezyridr said:


> worst of all, he openly showed contempt for his audience.
> in my mind, this is unforgivable. any performer who has gotten richand famous, owes everything to their fans. period, end of story.


My understanding is that Cobain hated the types of guys "who used to beat him up in school" becoming fans of the band. There was also a story of some guys raping a girl while listening to a Nirvana song. Can't blame him for hating them.

Roger Waters' initial concept for touring "The Wall" was that Pink Floyd play behind one so they wouldn't have to look at all the idiots in the crowd. Floyd hated the hooligans that had started coming to their shows.

Lennon and Harrison both showed contempt at the hysteria that followed the Beatles everywhere. Paul Weller felt the same during "The Jam" years. I will also add that Weller seems like a dickhead but is a fine guitar player.

An artist creates because he has to, not to become famous. I can totally see why Cobain might have shown contempt for his audience, but once you're in the middle of the machine how do you stop the mania? You have employees and bandmates who have families to feed, you can't quit.

I can't imagine it's easy to just walk away from fame. Thankfully I'll never find out!


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## Astroman86 (May 6, 2010)

haha i hope they do a better job on this jaguar than the jagstang. the jagstang was my first real guitar, and what a POS. I bought it off a friend cause i thought it looked cool. lol. Id hit the switches while playing, plus i had to replace one after it burnt out! body wasnt contoured like cobain asked, no sustain, the tremolo was useless... i guess i just hate mustangs.
anyways i started off learning tourettes because it was a local standard. and then breed cause i liked it.
I wouldnt say Kurt influences me at all now, but he was important when I started out.

I remember hearing about how they had to get someone to play his guitar parts towards the end of his career. Lots of guitarist got trashed before going on stage but they still had the skills to deliever... er at least enough not to require a replacement haha.

And didnt he play a strat too? Are they giving him a sig Jaguar because theres so many damn sig strats already? or was the jaguar his main guitar?


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

I was a Nirvana fan and I still am. 
I too was grateful for the grunge scene killing the hairband/ballad era.

Though he wasn't the greatest guitar player, you have to admit that he crafted some pretty catchy tunes.
That in istself takes some degree of talent on an instrument.
Even if someone is a so called d*ck, doesn't diminish the fact that he made a living off of his music.

Back to the OP, why didn't they just reissue the Jagstang?


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

I don't hate Nirvana, but I think the "hair bands" were light years ahead of the grunge players in terms of chops AND composition.

Nevertheless, I wouldn't buy a signature guitar with ANYone's name on it, unless it was mine.

Add to that my general distaste for relic'd guitars and it's not hard to understand why I would prefer a new stock model. Nothing wrong with a nice Jaguar.


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## 4345567 (Jun 26, 2008)

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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

nkjanssen said:


> Never much cared for "chops" per se, unless those "chops" actually translate into good music.
> 
> Not sure about "composition", but I do know that I like Nivana's songs better than Winger's or Warrant's.


Agreed. Chops are only one element and as I have indicated in another thread, composition is more important to me than the performance.

But, there are much better "hair bands" than Winger or Warrant.

Personally I'd take a night of Whitsnake or Van Halen over Nirvana, but that's just a matter of personal taste.


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

nkjanssen said:


> Milkman said:
> 
> 
> > I don't hate Nirvana, but I think the "hair bands" were light years ahead of the grunge players in terms of chops AND composition.
> ...


I agree. I like songs not solos. The Kinks and The Jam made me want to pick up a guitar, not Hendrix or Beck. I never got into a virtuoso shredding, but seeing footage of the shear power of The Ramones made me want to start a band.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

hardasmum said:


> I agree. I like songs not solos. The Kinks and The Jam made me want to pick up a guitar, not Hendrix or Beck. I never got into a virtuoso shredding, but seeing footage of the shear power of The Ramones made me want to start a band.


LOL,Well I sort of agree about the Ramones. Seeing a band that bad make it big gave me hope.I'll take Jimi and Jeffy.


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## 4345567 (Jun 26, 2008)

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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

nkjanssen said:


> Yah, I always kind of thought of Whitesnake as a watered-down corporate-rock tribute to Zepplin. Sort of "Zepplin meets Toto". I used to love Van Halen. Old Van Halen still has a certain nostalgia factor for me, but even back in the day I don't think it ever hit me in the purely visceral way that The Ramones previously did or that Nirvana subsequently did. I can appreciate "artistry", but I've always tended to lean towards music that relied more on attitude.


I can respect that. To tell the truth I'm not a big fan of either Van Halen OR Whitesnake. Those are just two bands I could think of that could be called "hair" bands.

I'm more into the 70s stuff (Pink Floyd, Deep Purple, Rush, Queen, Yes, Gentle Giant).

I find the Ramones fun and can understand the appeal. For me, perhaps because of the bands I listened to as a teen (see above list) I found it hard to overlook the musicianship thing. I'd say I'm more tolerent (believe it or not) in that regard these days.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

When I was young, I used to go to see bands and concerts and stuff to see guitar solos. I could never play them, but hey. I've expanded on what I like to see now. Mind you lyrics go in one ear and out the other, but I can still appreciate the human voice as a musical instrument.


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

If the person has any class they would donate the Royalties too help kids stay or get off drugs.


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## DarthElvis (Feb 14, 2011)

Who cares. Cobain was a selfish, cowardly, whiny little bitch. Offs himself because he was oh so depressed and couldn't handle his fame and his drug habit. *Leaving his child* and girlfreind(to be fair, I'd want to leave her too) behind to pick up the pieces. Millions of people kick heroin everyday, thousands get rich and/or famous, you don't see them whining to anyone who'll listen and offing themselves. Some do, but they're wastes just like Cobain. No excuse. The world is better off without scrubs like that around. Besides, Grohl's band is twice the band Nirvana ever was.


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

DarthElvis said:


> Who cares.


Wow. 

First off if you don't care why did you bother to post?

Secondly, do you actually know anyone with a substance abuse problem? Kicking heroin is a little complicated and substance abuse in general usually indicative of other underlying issues. 

I do agree with you about the Foos though.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

DarthElvis said:


> Who cares. Cobain was a selfish, cowardly, whiny little bitch. Offs himself because he was oh so depressed and couldn't handle his fame and his drug habit. *Leaving his child* and girlfreind(to be fair, I'd want to leave her too) behind to pick up the pieces. Millions of people kick heroin everyday, thousands get rich and/or famous, you don't see them whining to anyone who'll listen and offing themselves. Some do, but they're wastes just like Cobain. No excuse. The world is better off without scrubs like that around. Besides, Grohl's band is twice the band Nirvana ever was.


Ouch! I thought only politicans, oil companies and lawyers deserved that kind of shark attack.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

hardasmum said:


> My understanding is that Cobain hated the types of guys "who used to beat him up in school" becoming fans of the band. There was also a story of some guys raping a girl while listening to a Nirvana song. Can't blame him for hating them.


 for what ever reason i can no longer find the image where he is on the stage with that crazy look on his face giving everyone the finger. what i remember was he was pissed at all the people adoring him when he felt he was putting on a lousy show that night. i highly doubt he recognized his former playground bulies or rapists in the audience. and yes, i can absolutely blame him for hating them, because he took big piles their money. as for what i said about him being a d**k being irrelevant, ok, point taken. ritchie blackmore was a good enough example that i agree, it is irelevant. 



iaresee said:


> Logical fallacy. Just because you don't know it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. You hate the band, ergo you're more than likely to avoid new bands that follow from Nirvana and list them as influences. Keeping you well away from anyone who would ever claim they picked up the guitar because of Cobain. These people in exist. Apparently in numbers that would scare you.
> 
> 
> Great is subjective. So it's an opinion. By what measure are you determining greatness? He clearly wrote great songs -- they sell in quantities Eric Johnson can only dream of. And he wrote them on a guitar. It follows he was a great guitar player then, by some measure of greatness. See how subjective that is?
> ...


 ok, i'll concede the logical phallacy thing. it sounds sensible to me, although i don't cop to the scared thing. hahaha
on your next point, you are clearly wrong. ability and proficiency are not subjective. they are measurable attributes and therefore not subjuective.
lastly, you may label me any way you wish. however, i don't see any reason to attack me personally, unless you've run out of ammo before running out of annoyance for my opinion


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

Occasionally guitar forums remind me that just because I play guitar and bleed music doesn't mean I will have anything in common with someone else who does the same. 

"Oh Rachel's husband will be at the party, you guys will get along great! He owns and iPod and plays guitar!"

Not bloody likely.


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## Scottone (Feb 10, 2006)

cheezyridr said:


> on your next point, you are clearly wrong. ability and proficiency are not subjective.


Please explain how these can be quantified.


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

Scottone said:


> cheezyridr said:
> 
> 
> > on your next point, you are clearly wrong. ability and proficiency are not subjective.
> ...


Using an Alesis X900 Talent Detector


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## Guest (Sep 8, 2011)

cheezyridr said:


> logical phallacy thing.


Was your misspelling intentional? It made me laugh.



> on your next point, you are clearly wrong. ability and proficiency are not subjective. they are measurable attributes and therefore not subjuective.


And I gave you an measurement of his ability that was in direct opposition to the measure you want to enforce -- the _measure_ is subjective, it's not that it cannot be measured, but that the scale by which you choose to measure "greatness" is open to many interpretations. nkjanssen also pointed this out. Greatness isn't just playing a lot of notes quickly. Greatness can also be writing songs that lots of people want to pay you money to own copies of, and he did that very, very well. That you and I disagree on "the measure of greatness" makes it pretty clear it's a subjective measurement.



> lastly, you may label me any way you wish. however, i don't see any reason to attack me personally, unless you've run out of ammo before running out of annoyance for my opinion


I do apologize if you feel attacked. You stepped in to this thread with some strongly worded opinions and a whole lot of fight behind them. You can't expect soft replies when you're swinging the big stick, can you? Feel free to ignore that if you like.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)




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## Guest (Sep 8, 2011)

Celebrity guitar or not, that's a sweet looking ride. I'd rock it.


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## rollingdam (May 11, 2006)

Time to put this thread to bed-much too serious

Here is something to lighten things up

Smells like Teen Spirit - The Ukulele Orchestra - YouTube


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## Ti-Ron (Mar 21, 2007)

iaresee said:


> Celebrity guitar or not, that's a sweet looking ride. I'd rock it.


+1 I would rock it too! The only down side, for me, is the relic job...


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2011)

Ti-Ron said:


> +1 I would rock it too! The only down side, for me, is the relic job...


The $2k price tag is ruining my fantasizing.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

fraser said:


> nobody wears leather pants anymore. you made this shit up.


But I saw him.

Wish I'd taken a picture or two.

Well, not really--but it would be proof...

But nice response--made me laugh.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

zontar said:


> But I saw him.
> 
> Wish I'd taken a picture or two.
> 
> ...


hey zontar- i believe you, i was just trying to be funny is all.


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## iain (Sep 4, 2011)

I thought this one was a little odd too.

Making a really expensive clone of a cheap old guitar which was owned by someone who is not particularly popular anymore during hard economic times is certainly a curious marketing idea.


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## Guest (Sep 11, 2011)

iain said:


> who is not particularly popular anymore


Got a reference for that?


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

iaresee said:


> iain said:
> 
> 
> > who is not particularly popular anymore
> ...


http://www.musicradar.com/news/guitars/jackson-announces-new-scott-ian-signature-guitars-404602

I can't imagine Anthrax is more "popular" than Nirvana?! 

Besides I see ten year old kids wearing Nirvana t-shirts the same way they wear Sex Pistols or Beatles shirts.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

hardasmum said:


> http://www.musicradar.com/news/guitars/jackson-announces-new-scott-ian-signature-guitars-404602
> 
> I can't imagine Anthrax is more "popular" than Nirvana?!
> 
> Besides I see ten year old kids wearing Nirvana t-shirts the same way they wear Sex Pistols or Beatles shirts.


yeah, i ride the bus to work, and its full of high school kids.
not only do you see the shirts, you hear it coming out of their headphones.
still a popular band.
i know some kids, 16, 17 year olds who are fanatical collectors of live nirvana recordings and videos.
not so different from myself as a kid, only for me it was hendrix- and he was 10 years dead before i discovered him.
the thing is, nirvana is entirely more accessable compared to the stuff i was inspired by.
its funny, because i remember listening to "bleach" over and over, and thinking to myself, this band is never going to get anywhere- but i like them.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

fraser said:


> hey zontar- i believe you, i was just trying to be funny is all.


And you did make me laugh.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

fraser said:


> and he was 10 years dead before i discovered him.


Being older than you and making that statement.....makes all the signature guitars jazz boxes.... 

and no leather pants.... but lots of skinny ties...


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

Well...here is how "I" see it. to me, and that's just my personal view on this subject, but Nirvana was kinda like the "pop" version of Grunge. I also see a lot of kids listening to them...why?...and i asked a few, and the answer was..."'Man...it's Dave Grohl on Drums"....so i realize, kids are going back....Kinda like when i got into a certain Band..and realized a member had a band before..and went to get his previous work basically. 

I never got into Nirvana myself, and specially not after Cobain off'ed himself...someone else said it best about suicide in this thread. As for the Guitar, it's fender's business to sell guitars. like any companies really. When is the last time you saw Clapton playing a LP?...yet Gibson made the 60's Historic Clapton, and they sold like hot cakes. But why buy these expensive guitars?...when you can get a real one for a lot cheaper?..specially in fender's case?...Got to be a REAL Nirvana fan i guess...


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

iain said:


> I thought this one was a little odd too.Making a really expensive clone of a cheap old guitar which was owned by someone who is not particularly popular anymore during hard economic times is certainly a curious marketing idea.


While I would never buy a signature guitar, I don't think the Jaguar was ever considered a "cheap" guitar.Please correct me if I'm wrong.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

Milkman said:


> While I would never buy a signature guitar, I don't think the Jaguar was ever considered a "cheap" guitar.Please correct me if I'm wrong.


To quote a June 66 ad I have from a Halifax paper...Strat $235.. Jaguar "only" $320


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

shoretyus said:


> Being older than you and making that statement.....makes all the signature guitars jazz boxes....
> 
> and no leather pants.... but lots of skinny ties...


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

Dat's what I'm talkin' 'bout Fraser.....


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

Here's another. Can you which dead guitarist signature model this is?


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

Mark Bolan/T-Rex?


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## jcon (Apr 28, 2006)

That would be a Mick Ronson LP... Google is my friend 



Robert1950 said:


> Here's another. Can you which dead guitarist signature model this is?


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

Yep. Mick Ronson. Died of Liver Cancer at age 43 in 1993. Sad.


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## screamingdaisy (Oct 14, 2008)

Astroman86 said:


> I remember hearing about how they had to get someone to play his guitar parts towards the end of his career. Lots of guitarist got trashed before going on stage but they still had the skills to deliever... er at least enough not to require a replacement haha.


Not exactly...

The dude's name was Pat Smear (formerly of the Germs and currently with the Foo Fighters). Cobain had a thing about not wanting to produce albums that he couldn't play on stage and on In Utero he started using layered guitar parts. Cobain is obviously not talented enough to play two guitars at the same time so in 1993 he hired Pat to cover second guitar duties. You can see him on their second SNL appearance and he's the dude with the striped acoustic on MTV's Unplugged.



> And didnt he play a strat too? Are they giving him a sig Jaguar because theres so many damn sig strats already? or was the jaguar his main guitar?


The Jaguar and Mustang were his main guitars throughout his career. I'm pretty sure he bought both using the recording advance he received for the Nevermind sessions. The Mustang became more famous because it's what he used in the Teen Spirit video and the Strats tended to get photographed more because they were usually the ones that got smashed.


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