# Selling your own home - tips



## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

My house has been on the market since April, we've had about 10 showings and 1 offer. The offer would have been acceptable, but the realtor fees made it a no-go, unfortunately.

At the end of this month, we have an opportunity to get out of our contract - and I will. The laziness and greediness of realtors I've dealt with over the years is ridiculous (I dealt with about 50-100 per year for work), and these ones are no exception. 

I've heard of com-free, flat fee, plus another I can't recall.

I am seriously considering this and want to make sure all my bases are covered. 

Obviously, we'll have a lawyer do all the paperwork, title search, etc. I'm not sure what paperwork comes with a DIY, but I already have a copy of forms 320, 100, etc filled out.

I just want to know what to watch out for, what to consider, and ultimately, if it's the right move.

edit: other one is The Property Guys


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

This is what I did. I put up a For Sale by owner sign on my lawn. Within minutes realtors starting knocking on my door. Of course they said they had people interested in my house and wanted to show it. I said of course, bring them by. They asked what I would pay for commission. I told them "nothing" but they were welcome to bring their clients by. 99% of them walked away at that point. Then a 1%er showed up and continued the conversation after I told him "no commission". I eventually agreed that I would pay him $5000 to sell my house and I would use him to purchase my next house. My house was sold within 3 weeks. (And I saved over $12,000 in realtor fees)

That's my story. I'm not sure about the rest of the new age realtors I'm seeing today. I've heard a lot of okay things about The Property Guys (fixed commission and easy to follow guide for the paper work). I'm not sure what your house is worth but you may want to throw up a for sale by owner sign and see who shows up at your door begging for your listing. Then you are in a good position to negotitiate.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

I had a friend sell their home within a few weeks by Com-Free.


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## Alex (Feb 11, 2006)

The reality is that in the GTA, it's pretty hard to sell a home without a realtor. Not to dissuade you but it may mean significantly less traction and, the buyer offers tend to be lower to factor that the home is selling without any commissions. It depends on the value of the home as well - If you put efforts into it, it can work but i'm not sure the net benefit outweighs the efforts and time spent.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Stratin2traynor said:


> This is what I did. I put up a For Sale by owner sign on my lawn. Within minutes realtors starting knocking on my door. Of course they said they had people interested in my house and wanted to show it. I said of course, bring them by. They asked what I would pay for commission. I told them "nothing" but they were welcome to bring their clients by. 99% of them walked away at that point. Then a 1%er showed up and continued the conversation after I told him "no commission". I eventually agreed that I would pay him *$5000 to sell my house and I would use him to purchase my next house*. My house was sold within 3 weeks. (And I saved over $12,000 in realtor fees)
> 
> That's my story. I'm not sure about the rest of the new age realtors I'm seeing today. I've heard a lot of okay things about The Property Guys (fixed commission and easy to follow guide for the paper work). I'm not sure what your house is worth but you may want to throw up a for sale by owner sign and see who shows up at your door begging for your listing. Then you are in a good position to negotitiate.


That's not bad. And that realtor took care of all the MLS and advertisements?


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Alex Dann said:


> The reality is that in the GTA, it's pretty hard to sell a home without a realtor. Not to dissuade you but it may mean significantly less traction and, the buyer offers tend to be lower to factor that the home is selling without any commissions. It depends on the value of the home as well - If you put efforts into it, it can work but i'm not sure the net benefit outweighs the efforts and time spent.


My commission is comparatively high, so it seems worth it to me. I would be selling at a price slightly higher than what we've already been offered. Our incentive is transferring our 20 years of solar income to the new homeowners as a bonus. We are coming in at about 20% higher than our GIS projection which will result in a cash bonus of about $100K. This house will be completely bill free (less Bell/internet) due to the solar income and geothermal.

My schtick is selling service at a premium and convincing clients they are making the right decision (they are. 

They truly are buying a gem here, so it shouldn't be too difficult - I hope. The agents at our open house didn't even know we had solar or geothermal. Abysmal.


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## JCJ (Jan 3, 2008)

adcandour said:


> My house has been on the market since April, we've had about 10 showings and 1 offer. The offer would have been acceptable, but the realtor fees made it a no-go, unfortunately.
> 
> At the end of this month, we have an opportunity to get out of our contract - and I will. The laziness and greediness of realtors I've dealt with over the years is ridiculous (I dealt with about 50-100 per year for work), and these ones are no exception.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry that you've had bad experiences with so many Realtors over the years. There are some out there that really do give us an image problem. I bought and sold properties for 10 years before going into it professionally. So, I've been on both sides of the desk.
I'd be happy to give you some straight facts about the market, and marketing if you want to follow up with a PM. No obligation or other nonsense.

Otherwise, good luck. It's still a seller's market in the GTA.

James


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

boomer said:


> I'm sorry that you've had bad experiences with so many Realtors over the years. There are some out there that really do give us an image problem. I bought and sold properties for 10 years before going into it professionally. So, I've been on both sides of the desk.
> I'd be happy to give you some straight facts about the market, and marketing if you want to follow up with a PM. No obligation or other nonsense.
> 
> Otherwise, good luck. It's still a seller's market in the GTA.
> ...


Thanks, James.

I knew you were on this forum and was hoping you'd chime in, so I could mention that not all realtors are the same. It's just hard to find them - especially in my area. 

I have a realtor friend who owes me a solid, and she says she'll offer advice, if I need it. But, if I need more info, I'll definitely get in touch.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

Remove loved ones, all gear and prized possessions, dog is optional.
Burn it.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

About a month ago a realtor put the sign up for the house across the street. That was monday at 7 am. at 5:30 p.m. he put the sold sign up. The house sold for more than the asking price. That's fast. Lately the houses in this area take about 3 to 4 days to sell. At more than the asking price. It's an older area with large lots but still affordable. The people who are selling have raised their families and those that are buying are raising theirs. I tried to sell a house on my own, once.....a divorce thing. Never again. It cost more time and effort than a realtor. Before we bought this place we looked at a "private" sale. Too many hassles and it took to long to see the house.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Electraglide said:


> About a month ago a realtor put the sign up for the house across the street. That was monday at 7 am. at 5:30 p.m. he put the sold sign up. The house sold for more than the asking price. That's fast. Lately the houses in this area take about 3 to 4 days to sell. At more than the asking price. It's an older area with large lots but still affordable. The people who are selling have raised their families and those that are buying are raising theirs. I tried to sell a house on my own, once.....a divorce thing. Never again. It cost more time and effort than a realtor. Before we bought this place we looked at a "private" sale. Too many hassles and it took to long to see the house.


When you sold your home, did you have any assistance (like comfree, property guys, etc?). If I had no help whatsoever, I don't think I would be able to do it.

We're in a very different market, it seems. Statistically, the average home in my area takes 4-6 months to sell at a fair price, because we are on the sideroads.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

adcandour said:


> That's not bad. And that realtor took care of all the MLS and advertisements?


I don't know. I suspect he had someone interested in the house and was fishing for a commission. He mentioned that during our negotiation but I stuck to my guns and said $5000 is what I'm paying - no extra costs.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

adcandour said:


> My commission is comparatively high, so it seems worth it to me. I would be selling at a price slightly higher than what we've already been offered. Our incentive is transferring our 20 years of solar income to the new homeowners as a bonus. We are coming in at about 20% higher than our GIS projection which will result in a cash bonus of about $100K. This house will be completely bill free (less Bell/internet) due to the solar income and geothermal.
> 
> My schtick is selling service at a premium and convincing clients they are making the right decision (they are.
> 
> They truly are buying a gem here, so it shouldn't be too difficult - I hope. The agents at our open house didn't even know we had solar or geothermal. Abysmal.


In my experience, most realtors are extremely lazy. They rely on average pricing I your market area, price your home just below the market to sell it as fast as they can. They don't want to expend the energy to actually learn about your home or the complicated things about it. Anytime I've asked a realtor a question about their listing, they would look at me with a blank stare then give me some spiel about something unrelated. Likely in an attempt to distract me but I am immune to that technique now. When I say "that's not what I asked you" and repeat my question, they usually say "I don't know".

There are good realtors out there that work hard for their clients, it's just tough to find them.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

adcandour said:


> When you sold your home, did you have any assistance (like comfree, property guys, etc?). If I had no help whatsoever, I don't think I would be able to do it.
> 
> We're in a very different market, it seems. Statistically, the average home in my area takes 4-6 months to sell at a fair price, because we are on the sideroads.


When I tried to sell my home there was no ''private sale'' kind of thing other than put it in the newspaper yourself. I finally said screw it and gave the house,,,,and the motgage...to my ex. . When we tried to buy from private the seller used one of the sell your own places that supplied a few signs etc.. it took quite a while to get an apt. to see the house and that fell thru, twice so the wife got a friend ofhers who was a realtor in on the deal. That's all it took. 
Around here homes on the sideroads usually have sections and oil leases. If you're close to the city with acerage the developers don't care about your house. It gets pushed down.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

When I sold my first house over 20 years ago, I offered for sale privately.

When we found the home we wanted to purchase, the listing agent of that home brought us a buyer for our home (no commission) to facilitate the sale of the larger home... respect for that guy for delivering a win-win deal for all.


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

I tried selling a house privately once. After a few months and receiving one offer, we hired a real estate agent. She sold our house in a month or so for more than we were able to bring in the offer we received privately. In fact, the proceeds net of her commission were more than our private offer, so I was pretty happy about it. Also, she brought the buyer, it was her client, so it saved us a bit of commission too. 
I would never try to sell a house myself again, it was a massive waste of time.

Sent from my Z30 using Tapatalk


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## urko99 (Mar 30, 2009)

I just sold home using an agent. She did a virtual tour and virtual GPS mapping of my home and made it accessible from the MLS listing.
In 6 days I had 11 showings, and sold it within $1000 of asking Price. Windsor area. However, I bought Privately Because of the sellers market, and had my Lawyer handle everything, and Purchased $10,000
under appraised value. A win both ways and Moving in 2 weeks.


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## Ti-Ron (Mar 21, 2007)

Whatever path you choose, just clean the g*d d*amn thing before each visit.
My GF and I are on the hunt for a house or a duplex and we saw some terribles things.

- Dog/cat piss/poo on the floor.
- Crowded room, impossible to walk in.
- Room with no light or windows.
- Houses with too much personnal stuff (really personnal stuff...) around.
- Ads with no pics of the actual rooms.
- Obvious issues not repaired.

And finally, the best. The know it all guy, that can't respond a simple question like the actual size of the land.

Do your homeworks and everything will be fine! 
For what I read here, you're good with your hands, show it off, people (like me) are dumbs with their hands and are ready to pay big money for good works, modern looling kitchen... use that at your advantage!


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

One thing you can do is get the place inspected. (You can add the inspection cost to your selling price). If you've got one include a survey for the property with your paperwork. This place was vacant, had been inspected 3 months before and did have a survey, from 1992 but still good. We bought when there was 4" of snow on the ground. One other thing, doesn't matter which way you go, stick around until the deal is done. Everything was going good until the people who owned the house went south for the winter. Every time it took more than 36 hrs for them to get back to our realtor I dropped our offer. because of the mods made to your place, geothermal unit etc., include every manual etc. that goes with the house. Be prepared to leave things that you were going to take. If the buyer's wife wants the drapes and the washer/dryer, so be it. That might be the closer for the deal. You can always get new drapes. If they want to buy your guitar and amp, charge at least triple what it would cost to replace, new.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

I've read a lot of negative stories on this thread about selling your home yourself. But really, how many people did all the work that you would need to do to sell your home? It's just a sales job. The only advantage the typical realtor offers is a potential market. Granted that can be a huge advantage but most people I know identify a neighbourhood they like and drive through it to see if there are any homes for sale. The more adventurous (me and my wife) see a house for sale and go knock on the door. More often than not the owners are happy to talk to us and some have even showed us around the house. IMO, if your home is clean and you don't mind doing some marketing work like making certain rooms appear bigger, getting rid of any clutter, having a hand out with photos and pertinent details etc...there's no reason why you couldn't sell your house yourself and avoid realtor fees. Or get a heavy discount from a realtor once they show up at your door. And they will. 

Here's a little story against using a realtor. I had to sell a home in a hurry about 4 years ago and was not able to do any of the work because I was working ridiculous hours - mostly out of town. My wife called a realtor, he came over and made big promises about "being there for us" and "being able to be reached at any time" blah blah blah bullshit. After signing us up, I was never able to reach him directly. I could only speak to his assistant (secretary) and never got any of the answers I was looking for. He priced our house just below market value and within a couple of weeks, a buyer (who was driving through the neighbourhood) called him because of his sign on the lawn. We eventually sold to them - but get this - I had to do the final negotiations with the buyer who was extremely difficult. Their realtor wanted me and my realtor to be there for their third viewing. My realtor didn't show, he sent another assistant from his "marketing team" who was a f*%&ing deer caught in the headlights. Useless. Actually beyond useless. Anyways, long story short, I finished the sale and he got $24,000 or so for doing f*&%all. I wasn't very happy and wasn't able to tell him directly because he was too busy to take any calls according to his assistant. I was able to lay out my complaint to his "marketing team" though. Then I let it go and went on with life.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Lord-Humongous said:


> I tried selling a house privately once. After a few months and receiving one offer, we hired a real estate agent. She sold our house in a month or so for more than we were able to bring in the offer we received privately. In fact, the proceeds net of her commission were more than our private offer, so I was pretty happy about it. Also, she brought the buyer, it was her client, so it saved us a bit of commission too.
> I would never try to sell a house myself again, it was a massive waste of time.
> 
> Sent from my Z30 using Tapatalk


Since our home is listed with an agent at the moment, I have a fairly good understanding of where we stand in the market and I know how many showings to expect. 

My main concern with selling my home is "missing something" and shooting myself in the foot, legally. Another concern is that there are scam artists who see a private sale as an opportunity. I'm not hearing many stories about it, which is good.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

urko99 said:


> I just sold home using an agent. She did a virtual tour and virtual GPS mapping of my home and made it accessible from the MLS listing.
> In 6 days I had 11 showings, and sold it within $1000 of asking Price. Windsor area. However, I bought Privately Because of the sellers market, and had my Lawyer handle everything, and Purchased $10,000
> under appraised value. A win both ways and Moving in 2 weeks.


I think you may have won from the one end only. You lose when using an agent to sell. I always think if your market is that hot, you shouldn't have an issue selling on your own. If those were the stats here, I wouldn't have hesitated to sell on my own from the start. All this said, you'd have to be comfortable being a salesman.

Comfree will put your home on the MLS for you as well as allow HD pics, etc. We have all of this already, since our home is listed. We have all the paperwork, pamphlets, etc. I'm not sure I can keep the video they made on youtube - it was fantastic, but I'm not sure that matters much.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Ti-Ron said:


> Whatever path you choose, just clean the g*d d*amn thing before each visit.
> My GF and I are on the hunt for a house or a duplex and we saw some terribles things.
> 
> - Dog/cat piss/poo on the floor.
> ...


Thanks T,

Our home is spotless. The only thing I'm upset about is our pet odour. We're diligent, but the odour is always there (mild, but there). We have to run the HRV before a showing. At least it's just rugs that aren't staying with the home.

Haha, our kitchen is FAR from modern. We even have a fake old wood stove.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Electraglide said:


> One thing you can do is get the place inspected. (You can add the inspection cost to your selling price). If you've got one include a survey for the property with your paperwork. This place was vacant, had been inspected 3 months before and did have a survey, from 1992 but still good. We bought when there was 4" of snow on the ground. One other thing, doesn't matter which way you go, stick around until the deal is done. Everything was going good until the people who owned the house went south for the winter. Every time it took more than 36 hrs for them to get back to our realtor I dropped our offer. because of the mods made to your place, geothermal unit etc., include every manual etc. that goes with the house. Be prepared to leave things that you were going to take. If the buyer's wife wants the drapes and the washer/dryer, so be it. That might be the closer for the deal. You can always get new drapes. If they want to buy your guitar and amp, charge at least triple what it would cost to replace, new.


Thanks.

We are prepared to walk away and leave a fair bit. I'll even leave a couple of big screens, if it'll help sell. The tractor, drapes, clocks, whatever.

I will take them through the house myself, I think. I have a great understanding of everything we've done to the home. I'll let them get an inspector. The chances of me knowing him - and training him are very good (if he's registered)

I have all the manuals - for everything down to the shower and kid's swing-set.


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

Sold ours via ComFree 2 years ago. We were asking/expecting too much so it took a while. But it was in need of fairly extensive updating, we knew that and made the decision to sell as-is and update via buying new(er). I'm comfortable with paperwork, so that was no big deal - they provide the forms it's just fill in the blanks. Lawyer bill wasn't big, they still do the land titles thing and make sure the other sides lawyer isn't doing anything wierd. Still had several realtors trying to steal the listing, one in particular was wayyyy over the line and I tried to report him but the local board didn't seem interested.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

keto said:


> Sold ours via ComFree 2 years ago. We were asking/expecting too much so it took a while. But it was in need of fairly extensive updating, we knew that and made the decision to sell as-is and update via buying new(er). I'm comfortable with paperwork, so that was no big deal - they provide the forms it's just fill in the blanks. Lawyer bill wasn't big, they still do the land titles thing and make sure the other sides lawyer isn't doing anything wierd. Still had several realtors trying to steal the listing, one in particular was wayyyy over the line and I tried to report him but the local board didn't seem interested.


Did you do the walk-through with them, or did you leave it to their agent?


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

adcandour said:


> Thanks.
> 
> We are prepared to walk away and leave a fair bit. I'll even leave a couple of big screens, if it'll help sell. The tractor, drapes, clocks, whatever.
> 
> ...


Getting it inspected covers your ass. You include the inspection in the paperwork. Also, it could remove the, "we'll sign the papers depending on the inspection" sort of thing. Here, the inspectors have to be registered.


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

adcandour said:


> Did you do the walk-through with them, or did you leave it to their agent?


We (mostly I) did the walk throughs. Being a straight shooter, I showed it warts and all not just the highlights. Several prospective buyers didn't have agents.

The down side was that we had 2 unqualified buyers suck up a bunch of our time with offers they couldn't support. One of them I called from the get-go, and just rolled with it on faint hope....nope. The other one was frustrating though, they were just below the borderline financially and we worked with them and their bankers multiple for weeks trying to get it done. A realtor might have weeded them out.

In the end, our buyers didn't speak English so it was (fun, interesting, challenging) working through a (local guy) translator. He ended up being extremely helpful even after the deal was done, so we gave him a generous gift card for a nice restaurant. We had to do some work (fair sized fence project) as part of the deal, but it was getting done whether we sold or not.


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## jayoldschool (Sep 12, 2013)

adcandour said:


> Thanks T,
> 
> Our home is spotless. The only thing I'm upset about is our pet odour. We're diligent, but the odour is always there (mild, but there). We have to run the HRV before a showing. At least it's just rugs that aren't staying with the home.
> 
> ...



Get the rugs out. NOW. Besides the smell (which will instantly push away buyers), rugs like that big one in the kitchen just make a space look smaller. That wine rack is doing the same thing, and looks completely out of place.

Sometimes your first offer is your best one. It might have been a mistake to pass. 

I agree with the experience others had with realtors. I also wanted to sell our place ourselves, but decided to try a recommended agent. Our house set a record for the street, and was sold before the sign went in the lawn. She had people waiting to buy a place like ours as soon as it was listed.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

jayoldschool said:


> Get the rugs out. NOW. Besides the smell (which will instantly push away buyers), rugs like that big one in the kitchen just make a space look smaller. That wine rack is doing the same thing, and looks completely out of place.
> 
> Sometimes your first offer is your best one. It might have been a mistake to pass.
> 
> I agree with the experience others had with realtors. I also wanted to sell our place ourselves, but decided to try a recommended agent. Our house set a record for the street, and was sold before the sign went in the lawn. She had people waiting to buy a place like ours as soon as it was listed.


I've brought the big guns from work to deal with the odour. It's working very well.

We had a stager come in as part of the "package" and they said to leave everything as it is. They actually really liked the wine rack cutting board thingy. It's usually covered with crusty breads, specialty oils and spices, so it really suits the country vibe. The kitchen bigger than it looks, so size wasn't a concern with the kitchen. The bedrooms however...pretty small (imo - but only one person commented).


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

So, today was our last day with the realty firm. They didn't contact us to let us know or to re-sign with them. 

After all the issues, the receptionist said she doesn't blame us at all (it's been laughable). The broker wants to take on the property now and "market the shit out of it", ugh. She's been working my wife to try and get back in our home for some sales time. I had to set her straight; I needed to be very clear with her.

I've already contacted comfree.

One of my questions/concerns to comfree was about the general distaste from buying agents towards comfree sellers. She said my plan to compensate them is good and can be put in the "back end" of the listing that the realtors see. She said it's attractive enough that there won't be resistance if they have an interested buyer.

Because I already have all the paperwork from the previous offer, I know what's reasonable to ask and accept, so I think I'm in a good place.

It's going to be interesting.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

jayoldschool said:


> Get the rugs out. NOW. Besides the smell (which will instantly push away buyers), rugs like that big one in the kitchen just make a space look smaller. That wine rack is doing the same thing, and looks completely out of place.
> 
> Sometimes your first offer is your best one. It might have been a mistake to pass.
> 
> I agree with the experience others had with realtors. I also wanted to sell our place ourselves, but decided to try a recommended agent. Our house set a record for the street, and was sold before the sign went in the lawn. She had people waiting to buy a place like ours as soon as it was listed.


First thing I thought as well.
im sure they look ok in real life, but in a picture, it looks cramped, cluttered and busy.

fwiw, every 1st offer I've gotten has been a lowball. Never understood that buying logic. Why would I be desperate to sell when the listing has only been up for 1 day? Try back in 30 days .

chuck, at this point, I think it might be worth while keep an open mind to change things up, as things haven't worked for you so far.
when selling houses I found it useful to not take things personal....whether it be decorating tastes or otherwise. The mission is to sell the house, not fish for decor compliments.

but what do I know, my rental house in Oakville sold in 6days at full asking price 2 months ago 

ld also say your timing to get more dogs wasn't great. they all do have smells even if you're used to them and don't notice. When we were selling our personal residence, we sent our pets to live at the in-laws for a couple months so they wouldn't get in the way during showings, clear the smells a bit, and ensure that someone walking the yard didn't step in a mess.
we also rented a storage space and moved out half our stuff so that the house was essentially staged with as little furniture,personal effects as possible. That sacrifice meant packing up photos, all my music gear etc. but it was worth it...and actually made moving day easier. Minimalism sells.

ive never gone the route of selling privately. My concern has always been that a buyer will expect to reap some of the reward of such an arrangement by low balling/haggling aggressively. I'd only do it in a situation where I know the house will sell itself. But I know where you're coming from. Some realtors are on the ball, others are lazy, entitled parasites.
id personally still offer 2% to the buyers agent, just to keep them from shunning your property.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

adcandour said:


> My commission is comparatively high, so it seems worth it to me. I would be selling at a price slightly higher than what we've already been offered. Our incentive is transferring our 20 years of solar income to the new homeowners as a bonus. We are coming in at about 20% higher than our GIS projection which will result in a cash bonus of about $100K. This house will be completely bill free (less Bell/internet) due to the solar income and geothermal.
> 
> My schtick is selling service at a premium and convincing clients they are making the right decision (they are.
> 
> They truly are buying a gem here, so it shouldn't be too difficult - I hope. The agents at our open house didn't even know we had solar or geothermal. Abysmal.


Open houses are a waste. Very few homes sell as a result. But they're a great way for agents to generate business in the form of finding new buyers to hook up with. I put zero value in open houses.

I might be concerned that not enough people understand the solar mods you've done and would value them accordingly.
perhaps print up some resources on how it works, what it costs etc and put them in a binder for showings. And in the end, you may have to revisit how much value you've added from them as well. 
Reality is, peak home shopping season has already past, and the market has spoken, in a way.
im surprised your agent wasn't more flexible on his fees to be get the deal done on the previous offer. I've had an agent drop off a percent in order to close a deal. They can even appeal to the buyers agent to do something similar as well, or split the difference...each side gives up a half percent commission.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Electraglide said:


> Getting it inspected covers your ass. You include the inspection in the paperwork. Also, it could remove the, "we'll sign the papers depending on the inspection" sort of thing. Here, the inspectors have to be registered.


Conflict of interest. A sellers inspection is never a substitute for getting one yourself.
id laugh if a seller gave me their inspection report and said "see, now you don't have to get one done yourself". Yea, right.
its amazing how many things an inspector misses that I've found myself...or expected them to notice 
it can't really hurt to get one done, but 99% of the time I'm sure the buyers will still get their own, so prob a waste of your money.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Diablo said:


> First thing I thought as well.
> im sure they look ok in real life, but in a picture, it looks cramped, cluttered and busy.
> 
> chuck, at this point, I think it might be worth while keep an open mind to change things up, as things haven't worked for you so far.
> ...


We will be getting new pictures (I think) for the comfree listing. If we go that route, I'll get that stuff out of the kitchen, snap a shot and check both options out. 

Yes, this is strictly business to me. The comments didn't really hurt the ego. The wife gets a bit pissed - which is to be expected, I think. I'm more frustrated with the agent not being able to sell. 

Yeah, we're stuck with the dogs, since they're so young, but seriously - a hydroxyl generator, a vaporshark, and all the products I have access to leave this home smelling better than most. For real. My dads an an honest asshole about it and he couldn't complain. It does take a lot of work (which I avoided until one guy commented), but I do it. I'm IICRC certified to specifically deal with odours (including dead people, dead animals, mould, sewage back-ups, etc.) and also have professional carpet cleaning equipment in my arsenal (we only have two areas rugs in the whole home that the dogs have access to, so it's not too much work). This, plus the HRV cranked, deals with it well.

Actually, putting the dogs food in a green bin has helped a lot.

We have our stuff packed away very well. I leave the music gear out, but it is set up like a home studio now, so it gets a pass from the stager.

My basement and everywhere in the house looks like the pics below (Attila's work. Very clean. The only issues are my son's toys and my office mess. The rest is a bit of straightening up. I also posted a different angle of the kitchen. Not sure if it helps with the perception. We opted to leave photos on things, since the house looked weird without it (maybe just to us though).

The important thing is that we our 'BATNA" (best alternative to a negotiated agreement) is that we don't_ really_ care if we move. We want to, but not enough to sacrifice anything during an aggressive haggle.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Well done, chuck. Basement looks great.
for the kitchen, I'd lose the rug and wine stand (it still gives off a really old vibe in pictures), and update the 2 hanging light fixtures to something more contemporary. Prob $150. In total.
living room looks good to me as well, cozy and welcoming. I'd just pack the photos up. They're a subconscious reminder to someone that it's someone else house, not theirs. Art is good, personal photos, not. And lose the yellow pages books on the coffee table, lol. 1993 called and wants them back. Your agent/photog should have caught stuff like that. But it happens. The agent for our cottage has my daughters slippers in the foreground in some pics. Idiot. But he was cheap. 
Did you buy that place in the subdivision in Barrie?
hope you aren't having to carry 2 places, or a messed up school year start.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Diablo said:


> Well done, chuck. Basement looks great.
> for the kitchen, I'd lose the rug and wine stand (it still gives off a really old vibe in pictures), and update the 2 hanging light fixtures to something more contemporary. Prob $150. In total.
> living room looks good to me as well, cozy and welcoming. I'd just pack the photos up. They're a subconscious reminder to someone that it's someone else house, not theirs. Art is good, personal photos, not. And lose the yellow pages books on the coffee table, lol. 1993 called and wants them back. Your agent/photog should have caught stuff like that. But it happens. The agent for our cottage has my daughters slippers in the foreground in some pics. Idiot. But he was cheap.
> Did you buy that place in the subdivision in Barrie?
> hope you aren't having to carry 2 places, or a messed up school year start.


Haha, those are decorative book things that store stuff. Again, they look better in person. 

Okay, I'll definitely remove the kitchen stuff for the next batch of photos - and I'll take down the personal pics during the walk throughs. I'll be taking the potential buyers through the house myself, but maybe I'll give off the "I'm just like an agent" vibe.

Your "YOLO" comment from a while back had a pretty big impact on me. First, I had to look up what the hell YOLO meant, then I had to go look at YOLO type houses. And, NOW, we have a new build in mind where you can see the lake from the front door - right by the marina (and my kid's school). I've been f'n pontoon shopping, because of you, haha.

We will be waiting until this house sells though. Since it is a new home, we can't buy on the condition that ours sells.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Diablo said:


> Open houses are a waste. Very few homes sell as a result. But they're a great way for agents to generate business in the form of finding new buyers to hook up with. I put zero value in open houses.
> 
> I might be concerned that not enough people understand the solar mods you've done and would value them accordingly.
> perhaps print up some resources on how it works, what it costs etc and put them in a binder for showings. And in the end, you may have to revisit how much value you've added from them as well.
> ...


I've got all the solar paperwork out. I had to print it myself - which is fine. The main point now with the soler/geo is that they get an average of $500 a month for the next 20 years. They have no heating or water bills. The $500 will more than cover the electric and possibly tv/Internet.

Our agent texted us the offers. We didn't even talk. We had to call her to follow up. I guess that's what they do now. I talked to her about commissions and she said that they all get split amongst their team and it doesn't go far. Bullshit. 

We did an open house in the final stretch, so they could use it as a scapegoat. It was pointless.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

adcandour said:


> I've got all the solar paperwork out. I had to print it myself - which is fine. The main point now with the soler/geo is that they get an average of $500 a month for the next 20 years. They have no heating or water bills. The $500 will more than cover the electric and possibly tv/Internet.
> 
> Our agent texted us the offers. We didn't even talk. We had to call her to follow up. I guess that's what they do now. I talked to her about commissions and she said that they all get split amongst their team and it doesn't go far. Bullshit.
> 
> We did an open house in the final stretch, so they could use it as a scapegoat. It was pointless.


It sounds like you had a bad agent.
ive had one like that before. Full service commissions but cut rate service. After he got the listing he suddenly became way less available/responsive and all I ever saw was his junior lackeys doing open houses gathering up business cards of home shoppers for themselves, only too happy to show them something else they might be interested in. Our home never even got into his glossy ads until it was already sold a few months later...again, promoting himself more than his listings.
When it came time to list my rental this year, I was happy to inform him he wouldn't be getting the listing. His response was, to offer a reduced comm rate instead of addressing my concerns with his past performance. I used that negotiated rate to get a lower rate from the agent I really wanted to use, and had a terrific experience with, but unfortunately not in this area so I won't pass his name along.
according to an old friend of mine, who is an agent downtown, they do have to split about 50% with the broker, and of course have advert fees etc. But it's still pretty good money with little effort if they get quick sales.

shop around more, ask ppl you know for referrals.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

adcandour said:


> Haha, those are decorative book things that store stuff. Again, they look better in person.
> 
> Okay, I'll definitely remove the kitchen stuff for the next batch of photos - and I'll take down the personal pics during the walk throughs. I'll be taking the potential buyers through the house myself, but maybe I'll give off the "I'm just like an agent" vibe.
> 
> ...


nice! 

id still lose the books...too big and distracting.
if you must have something there, those free magazines from the LCBO are awesome. They always have big bright pics of fruity refreshing cocktails or food that inspires and appeals to the senses. You want ppl to think about relaxing, entertaining etc in the house. Sell the dream! And again, they're free 
But from my experience, the closer you can get your house to look like a high end hotel room, the better. There's a reason they look that way, so follow the money 
But I think your house still looks great from what I see. It'st the low number of showings thhats concerning.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Just a quick update: concerning comfree.

I'm really happy with the way it is set-up. 

They have a realtor show up and explain everything to you. What I really liked is their "Offer Assist" option. For an extra $1300 (only if house sells), they will take care of the offers/paperwork, so I don't have to deal with anything. It takes a good amount of pressure off of me.

The other great thing is that they offer to get involved in the purchase of our next home (since we obviously don't have representation). BUT, when they get that 2.5% commission they cut us a check for everything above $5K. So, for some of the houses we are looking at, we'll be looking at about $15K (for doing nothing)

This will help us offset the commission for the realtor who brings people to our current home - so far realtors have been pushing for 2% (which is fine and much better than 5%).

The only argument realtors have against comfree is exposure (among other realtors). We have had a few come through to check the place out and they were happy that I'm willing to co-operate. No one is going to go for a $5K finder's fee it seems (the market is too hot for them, I guess).

The showings are few and far between, but the potential for success seems much greater. It's almost like realtors bring in kijiji quality buyers while comfree is forumesque - in that they know what they want and are more serious.

I also have better access to information. I called up a realtor yesterday to follow up - our other realtors kept us in the dark. I know exactly where we stand from our last showing.

I also got to be around to answer the MANY questions of the potential purchasers. I have no idea how any realtor could have answered them properly: ex: why do you have a massive fender amp in your garage? (ans: cause you have no neighbours here and it'll come with the house) :slash:


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

adcandour said:


> I also got to be around to answer the MANY questions of the potential purchasers. I have no idea how any realtor could have answered them properly: ex: why do you have a massive fender amp in your garage? (ans: cause you have no neighbours here and it'll come with the house) :slash:


This broke me up!! Thanks for the morning laugh!

Very interesting and informative post.

Cheers

Dave


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## Merlin (Feb 23, 2009)

My house is going on the market in a week. The past month and a half has been spent gutting the place, painting and doing minor fixups. Staging happens Wednesday, then pics on Thursday, on MLS on Friday. Houses around here have been selling for asking, and usually within 3-4 days.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

We are moving to NB and will be putting our house on the market soon. Lots of good information here. I appreciate all those posts.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Hope things are going well.

If it's any consolation, sometimes even rock stars have a hard time selling properties.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/11/07/gord-downie-house-toronto_n_8494410.html


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## puckhead (Sep 8, 2008)

Diablo said:


> Hope things are going well.
> 
> If it's any consolation, sometimes even rock stars have a hard time selling properties.
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/11/07/gord-downie-house-toronto_n_8494410.html


really nice light in that place. That house would never sell (at full price) in Vancouver though - stairs headed straight for the door = bad feng shui.

as for using a realtor vs. not... depends on the realtor, depends on the market.
I used one this past summer not for the paperwork, and it turns out not for volume of traffic, but for marketing and negotiating skills.
Fairly big house, 6 years old, in the hottest area of the city. But it was European design, when the money coming into the neighborhood was predominantly mainland Chinese.
I had my place listed for 7 months with one realtor, she must have brought 100+ parties through. Only two low-ball offers in that span (like, $700k below asking).
When she started suggesting that we consider those offers (selling basically at land value), we switched agents. Within 12 days of meeting the new agent, we sold for $200k over asking.

so for us, the commission was definitely good value.


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## fredyfreeloader (Dec 11, 2010)

Just in case you need a good For Sale By owner Sign you can use this one.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)




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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

adcandour said:


> View attachment 18757


So your home sold, finally? And I take it you more or less sold it by yourself? That's what 8 or 9 months....about as long as it takes someone to pop out a kid. Just wondering if it was worth it as compared to using a realtor. Not so much in dollars in or out of your pocket but in time spent or wasted sitting around waiting to show your own home, especially when you no longer live there.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Electraglide said:


> So your home sold, finally? And I take it you more or less sold it by yourself? That's what 8 or 9 months....about as long as it takes someone to pop out a kid. Just wondering if it was worth it as compared to using a realtor. Not so much in dollars in or out of your pocket but in time spent or wasted sitting around waiting to show your own home, especially when you no longer live there.


That's right. About 9 months (the average for this type of property in our region). 

Yes, I would be at the home instead of a realtor working on my behalf.

If you don't live there, you could get a lockbox and have the potential buyer's realtor give them the tour, so you don't waste any of your time.


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## jayoldschool (Sep 12, 2013)

How much more did it sell for than the original offer?


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

jayoldschool said:


> How much more did it sell for than the original offer?


I'm not sure what you mean exactly, but this is how much better I did versus my first realtor: $35K (based on the best offer they brought in)


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

you can buy a lot of guitars & amps for $35K


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

jayoldschool said:


> How much more did it sell for than the original offer?


I reviewed your older post - so, my answer is correct, I made an extra $35K doing it on my own (offer was $20k higher -they were in love with our home and didn't want to negotiate). The commission we saved was $20k, but I had to put $5k into a new well.

FYI, they asked to keep all the rugs - they loved them. They look old, but to some people they really add something.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Lincoln said:


> you can buy a lot of guitars & amps for $35K


Definitely.

BUT, that's a lot of money wasted confirming that I sound the same on most rigs 

(okay,...maybe not wasted)

It's all going into the next home.


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## ed2000 (Feb 16, 2007)

I sense a future homewarming GC guitar jam party...anyone else?


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

I once sold my home--wow--was my landlord ever mad at me!


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

ed2000 said:


> I sense a future homewarming GC guitar jam party...anyone else?


Housewarming gifts from guitar forumites? I like where this is heading.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

so, where r u going now? that place by the lake in Barrie?
ive noticed a lot of stuff in our area has moved FAST this spring, and most for near or above asking. this real estate market is quite the juggernaut.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

adcandour said:


> Housewarming gifts from guitar forumites? I like where this is heading.


don't get your hopes up. probably lots of leftovers from 6 packs of beer (domestic) and not much more.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Diablo said:


> so, where r u going now? that place by the lake in Barrie?
> ive noticed a lot of stuff in our area has moved FAST this spring, and most for near or above asking. this real estate market is quite the juggernaut.


The market is so crazy, that the builders up'd the price by $200k for a couple months. Now they dropped them by $100k. Still, more than I can comfortably spend. 

Then, we were ironing out a deal with another builder in the area, and they decided to up there price. They also raised their prices by $200k. They said they'd build with low grade finishes and I buy and install a kitchen myself. You've got to be kidding me.

Now we're getting outbid at above asking prices. 

I f'king hate barrie. 

BTW, if my wife hears me reference you and 'YOLO' again, we'll be buying separate homes


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Diablo said:


> so, where r u going now? that place by the lake in Barrie?
> ive noticed a lot of stuff in our area has moved FAST this spring, and most for near or above asking. this real estate market is quite the juggernaut.


Out here too. I've never seen it like this. I think many older owners are cashing out - hoping it's the top of a bubble. But they still got to buy somewhere in this crazy market. Places are regularly going up for sale and sold in 2 weeks. It is spring which is traditional a hot time for real estate, but still??????

A place around the corner from me (mind you, one the nicest houses in the neighborhood) just went for $250,000 over asking price on the first weekend it was for sale.


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