# First 2 days with Bogner Shiva



## TimH (Feb 4, 2006)

I have had a lot of amps in the past 5 years. Most of them haven't lasted more than a couple of months with me for one reason or another (didn't like it, changed bands etc). This has left me pretty disillusioned with amps in general. I've always wanted a high gain amp that was capable of higher gain marshall tones and a GOOD clean channel in one package. Not too modern but not to old school either. Well, I may have found that amp in the Bogner Shiva. 

The clean channel is great...it's not the stiff, lifeless clean you find on most high gain, el34 amps. It's beautiful with equal parts marshall, vox and fender (really...it's hard to nail down the sound as just "fender" or something) feels great, has tonnes of head room if you want it and breaks up nicely as the master is pushed. It has lots of charachter, depth, bounce a sparkle...I don't if that means anything or not but it's good. 

The gain channel has a great versatility to it. I don't know why someone would say it's dark (mines not a 2006 with the bright switch...it's older) because it's not. It's not icepicky or thin like many amps but it's not dark! Highs are seated right where they ought to be IMHO. Lots of gain on tap and this channel can feel really agressive or sort of vintagy depending on how it's set. Just lovely. Cleans up pretty well too with my strat. I spent most of my 5 hours with this amp on the gain channel using the volume pot and occasionally hitting to boost for some extra gain.

Suprisingly the amp is not very loud...80 watts and it feels less loud at noon than my DRRI does at 5 (and the drri has a new speaker, bright cap clipped and NOS tubes to darken it up...but it must still be a frequency thing). It's a great feeling amp...not too easy to play but not to hard either. Just right. For me it's as close to perfect as I care to spend money to get. Maybe a CAEOD100 is a better fender/marshall amp but the Shiva is so good that I don't care to look. The Master Volume works really well too...played it last night at noon for an hour just to let the amp make it's best first impression but played with it at 9 oclock for 3 hours this morning and i was still loving it.


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## Jeff Flowerday (Jan 23, 2006)

TimH said:


> Suprisingly the amp is not very loud...80 watts and it feels less loud at noon than my DRRI does at 5 (and the drri has a new speaker, bright cap clipped and NOS tubes to darken it up...but it must still be a frequency thing). It's a great feeling amp...not too easy to play but not to hard either. Just right. For me it's as close to perfect as I care to spend money to get. Maybe a CAEOD100 is a better fender/marshall amp but the Shiva is so good that I don't care to look. The Master Volume works really well too...played it last night at noon for an hour just to let the amp make it's best first impression but played with it at 9 oclock for 3 hours this morning and i was still loving it.


Not sure how he gets 80 watts out 2 EL34s. That might be why it doesn't seem as loud as you think an 80 watt would be.


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## TimH (Feb 4, 2006)

Jeff Flowerday said:


> Not sure how he gets 80 watts out 2 EL34s. That might be why it doesn't seem as loud as you think an 80 watt would be.



Actually there was a gear page thread on this...check it out.

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=182811&highlight=shiva


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## Mr. David Severson (Feb 3, 2006)

Hey Tim,

I'm curious what you beast can do..Do you have any clips of the amp in action?


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## zoomed (Nov 10, 2006)

Mr. David Severson said:


> Hey Tim,
> 
> I'm curious what you beast can do..Do you have any clips of the amp in action?


that would be so awesome...i've always wanted to hear what this amp can do!!


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## TimH (Feb 4, 2006)

hey guys...sorry I really don't have clips. I do think the Bogner Web site covers most of what the amp will excel at. There are clips there showing great cleans, broken up tones and over the top gain. I'll say this...at both high and low volumes this is easily the most satisfying amp I've played in the past 2 years.


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

Pete Traynor got over 90 watts out of two EL34s so it _can_ be done 

TG




Jeff Flowerday said:


> Not sure how he gets 80 watts out 2 EL34s. That might be why it doesn't seem as loud as you think an 80 watt would be.


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## Jeff Flowerday (Jan 23, 2006)

traynor_garnet said:


> Pete Traynor got over 90 watts out of two EL34s so it _can_ be done
> 
> TG


Published output or actual? :tongue: :tongue:


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## washburned (Oct 13, 2006)

*80 watts from 2 EL34s*

My Orange OR 80 is advertised as 80 watts; but the OR 120 with four EL 34s was only 120. ??? Maybe something to do with the ignition temperature of wood/tolex?


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## TimH (Feb 4, 2006)

did anyone read that thread I liked to. It's well documented (apparently) that a single el34 can put out 50 watts as long as the tube is built robustly enough. Since it's safe in an amp design to run a tube to 90% of it's capcity, 2 el34's doing 80 watts is just fine. I know Bogner is VERY specific about el34's that will work in the Shiva and I'm guessing this is why. This is my laymans understanding of this topic after some amount of reading so take it for what it's worth. I don't see why Reinholdt would need to advertise the Shiva at any higer wattage than it's capable of...50 watts in their line would actually make more sense as they now have 18, 30, 80 and 100 watt amps...50 would be more traditional and appealing I think.


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## Jeff Flowerday (Jan 23, 2006)

TimH said:


> did anyone read that thread I liked to. It's well documented (apparently) that a single el34 can put out 50 watts as long as the tube is built robustly enough. Since it's safe in an amp design to run a tube to 90% of it's capcity, 2 el34's doing 80 watts is just fine. I know Bogner is VERY specific about el34's that will work in the Shiva and I'm guessing this is why. This is my laymans understanding of this topic after some amount of reading so take it for what it's worth. I don't see why Reinholdt would need to advertise the Shiva at any higer wattage than it's capable of...50 watts in their line would actually make more sense as they now have 18, 30, 80 and 100 watt amps...50 would be more traditional and appealing I think.


But 90% of the tube capability isn't going to be seen directly at the speaker. The output transformer just isn't that efficient.


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## TimH (Feb 4, 2006)

Jeff Flowerday said:


> But 90% of the tube capability isn't going to be seen directly at the speaker. The output transformer just isn't that efficient.


How efficient is the OT? I'm not defending the rating really but is it possible then the tubes are running 90% and then you're losing another 10% on the OT? Just curious...I'm really not the authority here...I bow to your knowledge :bow:


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## Jeff Flowerday (Jan 23, 2006)

TimH said:


> How efficient is the OT? I'm not defending the rating really but is it possible then the tubes are running 90% and then you're losing another 10% on the OT? Just curious...I'm really not the authority here...I bow to your knowledge :bow:


No special knowledge. Know enough not to zap myself and that's about it.

Just get a little gun shy on manufacturer specs with the way Class A gets thrown around.

From your gear page link I get the impression that the sun, moon and stars would have to align to get that much power to the speaker with two EL34s.

:smile: 

Someone with some knowledge needs to get inside one, I guess.


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## stever67 (Jun 30, 2008)

Well, I'm not sure if I I can add to any of the technical chatter, but I will say that my Shiva is just perfectly loud and perfectly quiet! I've had dozens of amps come and go, but the Shiva ain't goin' anywhere any time soon. I have an older EL34 head and a couple of Bogner cabs - a Shiva 212 and an OS 212. TimH did a great job of the description of what the amp will do. A little messing with the TMB and presence knobs on the drive side will make this amp do just about anything you want. It cops all the classic Marshally tones, with all the gain on tap you might want without going over the top. I usually pop a Super HardOn in front (double entendre maybe intended!) which pushes it a bit and brings some clarity to individual notes. 

Anyway, +1 for the Shiva. My buddy brought his Ecstasy over a couple weeks ago and, as awesome as it is, I think I'd take the Shiva in a head to head. I also have to say, that as great as the Shiva is in a jam space, it really opens up and does its thing in a big room. Mine's a keeper. 

PS Bogner is really great with tech support - I've had to email and call a couple times about a couple things and they've been fantastic. E-mails were replied to within a couple of hours, and phone service has been polite and helpful! I've had lesser experiences with some other manufacturers...


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