# Worst Resale - Best Used Bargains



## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

Here's my list of the 3 guitar manufacturers with the worst resale going. Keep in mind, I'm not implying there is anything wrong with guitars made by these companies, other than the fact that their resale is simply terrible - which equates to fantastic buys on the used market.

1.) Hamer USA Guitars - they seem to sell for around 1/2 of what they cost new.
2.) Paul Reed Smith Guitars - sure, used Customs still fetch around $1500-$2000, but what did they cost new?
3.) G&L Guitars - Not too many around, but when they are up for sale, they seem to sit and sit and sit.

Any others worth mentioning?


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## Jaggery (Mar 12, 2006)

How about Reverend?

I think the average with case for most of their guitars is $400 +/- some.
Although they dont cost too much to begin with.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Jaggery said:


> How about Reverend?
> 
> I think the average with case for most of their guitars is $400 +/- some.
> Although they dont cost too much to begin with.


They are a deal, but they don't compare to some of the other companies listed, who as mentioned, products literally sell for less than half of what they cost new. The most expensive Reverend are only about $650 new. Most are cheaper than that. And they are a Korean made import, so it's not shocking. The other guitars on that list are all US made, high end instruments. But, I agree that they fall into the bargain category used for sure.

But the Agile guitars I guess are the same. You can pick them up, with a case, for well less than half of what they were new. And they are nice instruments. A great deal on the used market. They a a ton of guitar for the money new. So at half that price used, you are getting a great guitar.

What is the average loss you would take on even a newer (1-3 years old) Les Paul though? On any newer high end guitar like that, you are automatically going to lose the taxes on it. In Ontario, that would be over $400 on a $3000 LP.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

Paul said:


> The value of Heritage guitars plumet faster than the DOW index.


Actually, good call. I forgot all about Heritage guitars. I actually owned one years ago. I think it was the H140CM - basically a Les Paul with a pointy horn and a thinner body. I bought it used for a song and a dance, and sold it just for a song. :smile:


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

One major factor is that Hamer and G&L in my opinion are great used bargains. I don't care how much a PRS was new it would have to be dead cheap for me to buy one. I still have yet to pick one up that I thought was worth owning.


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## Mogwaii (Feb 16, 2007)

Anything just about that isnt tied to Fender or Gibson.

Danelectro's though, despite having a $300 new tag.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Mogwaii said:


> Anything just about that isnt tied to Fender or Gibson.
> 
> Danelectro's though, despite having a $300 new tag.


Ya the's 90's RI Danelectro's were about $150 new. Which is really all they are worth. I love playing them, but I would never pay $300 + (with taxes) for a new one. And you definitely are going to lose money when you sell one if you paid that price for it.


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## Mogwaii (Feb 16, 2007)

torndownunit said:


> Ya the's 90's RI Danelectro's were about $150 new. Which is really all they are worth. I love playing them, but I would never pay $300 + (with taxes) for a new one. And you definitely are going to lose money when you sell one if you paid that price for it.


I see alot of the new reissues going for a price of $200-$250 which isnt bad considering how much they are new.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Mogwaii said:


> I see alot of the new reissues going for a price of $200-$250 which isnt bad considering how much they are new.


Ya but the question is, do you see them sell for that much? I see them locally on Craigslist and Kijiji at those prices, but they sit for months. Then usually change to OBO before being sold. I have my doubts they are actually being sold at those prices. At least not frequently.

I have bought 2 over the years off Kijiji and Craigslist, and paid $150 and $175.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

Mogwaii said:


> Anything just about that isnt tied to Fender or Gibson...


Let me add however, that not all Fenders/Gibson hold their value. Pretty much anything that sways too far off the norm will get butchered in the used market. For example, a Gibson Les Paul 'Supreme' (which is basically a more expensive Custom, but with fancier inlay work) will sell for less than a used Custom.


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## david henman (Feb 3, 2006)

...i wish i had cash lying around - every so often i see a g&l going for $700-800. breaks my heart!

-dh


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

I would say Ibanez is in both the "terrible resale value" and the "ridiculously underpriced" categories.


I had an RG1570. I bought it used for around $400 with a hard shell case if I recall correctly.

I've played a lot of $2000 and up guitars that paled by comparison. Sure the pickups weren't great, but we're talking about a couple of hundred bucks max to correct that.


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

G&L puzzles me a lot. The Leo connection first, followed by the wicked good build quality on most of them. I've had an S-500 (Strat with hotter pups) since I bought it new in '93 and it's better than every one of the 6 or 7 Strats I've had since, the only knock being that it's a brick at around 10 lbs. Would never consider trading it, let alone getting $6-700 for it, it's way more guitar than that.

I question the Agile thing, don't they hold their value reasonably well? They're cheap enough and good value and have a good enough reputation to start with, I don't recall (hey, I'm getting a little shorter in the memory dept admittedly) seeing any going for 50% of new.


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## NB_Terry (Feb 2, 2006)

Godins and Simon & Patrick guitars seem to be quite the bargain on the used market as well.

I have a S&P Pro model. I was told this was their top of the line a few years ago, before it was replaced by the Showcase series. 

I see them all the time on ebay going for $400 or less, when new they're $1000 and up.

I also own a very nice G&L Legacy and a Hamer, so I guess I'm a bargain hunter.


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## dwagar (Mar 6, 2006)

there's percentage and there's dollar value. 

and also, some of the Gibsons and Fenders I see advertised, I wonder if they ever really do sell at those prices.

You can get a used R9 (LP '59 reissue) out of the US for $3000-3500. You may have to accept some rash on the back, etc. But what's a new one at L&M? About $6000? Buying used can save you a lot.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

I paid $500 Cdn. for Hamer P90 Special and a Vox Pathfinder 15R amp just over two years ago.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

Robert1950 said:


> I paid $500 Cdn. for Hamer P90 Special and a Vox Pathfinder 15R amp just over two years ago.


I remember that model selling for about $1099 in Canada. I also remember them selling for about $800 in Buffalo. You my friend, got a great deal!


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## Archer (Aug 29, 2006)

Prices on used USA Hamers have been increasing.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

I love Lado, but it doesnt hold its value on the resale market. Makes no sense to me....A handmade canadian guitar goes for 1/3 its original cost these days, but japanese knockoffs of Les Pauls go for 2-3x their orig cost? Uggghhh...


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## Brennan (Apr 9, 2008)

Carvin is another brand notorious for having quality products with very little resale value; Due in large part to the fact that they aren't available in retail stores (other than the Carvin stores), severely limiting their exposure to players.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

To branch into amps a little:

Add both vintage and new Ampeg amps to the list.

Vintage ones are a bargain.

New ones have brutal resale value, but from all reports are decent amps. You can get them for half of their new price.

Keto, to go into more detail about my Agile comment. You can find mid level Agile LP's (2500's) in Canada for around $200 pretty easily. I see them with the top end Agile hardshell cases for $200-250. In fact, I bought one for that much.

Take into account what people paid originally for them. They are about $279 USD new and the cases are about $60 USD. That is around $340 USD right there. That doesn't include exchange rate or shipping. Leaving shipping out, that would be about $425 CAD just for the guitar and case. So yes, people generally do take a beating on resale of these. Taking the shipping, taxes, and duty into account, they REALLY take a beating. But the guitars themselves are great and are a great price in the first place. Half of the price of a comparable Epiphone even with the exchange. So if you buy them to play, it doesn't matter.

But, Epiphones don't perform a lot better. You see them on Craigslist frequently in the $500 price range. Considering what they are new, that's a pretty drastic drop.


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## starjag (Jan 30, 2008)

dwagar said:


> there's percentage and there's dollar value.


Percentage-wise, most boutique guitars are great deals.


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## Jaggery (Mar 12, 2006)

Was reading over at the Reverend Forum that some shop in vancouver was blowing their stock for 399 and under.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

I should have mentioned that the Kramer Focus and American Series guitars are consistently fantastic value. The Focus line were made in Japan by ESP and had Original Floyd Rose Bridges as standard equipment. They can be had quite cheaply these days.

The American Series was predominantly fabricated by ESP Japan but shipped to Neptune New Jersey to be assembled and had Original Floyd Rose bridges, Seymour Duncan pickups and Schaller hardware all stock. Many of the models sold for $1400+ not including tax back in the 1986-1990 era and can be found for $500 today. They are absolutely stellar instruments. They aren't much to the anti-Floyd crowd but they are incredible guitars to those who don't hold anything against the locking trems.
Here's an '84 Pacer Patent Pending & an '85, an '86 and an '87 American Series:


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

smorgdonkey said:


> I should have mentioned that the Kramer Focus and American Series guitars are consistently fantastic value. The Focus line were made in Japan by ESP and had Original Floyd Rose Bridges as standard equipment. They can be had quite cheaply these days.
> 
> The American Series was predominantly fabricated by ESP Japan but shipped to Neptune New Jersey to be assembled and had Original Floyd Rose bridges, Seymour Duncan pickups and Schaller hardware all stock. Many of the models sold for $1400+ not including tax back in the 1986-1990 era and can be found for $500 today. They are absolutely stellar instruments. They aren't much to the anti-Floyd crowd but they are incredible guitars to those who don't hold anything against the locking trems.
> Here's an '84 Pacer Patent Pending & an '85, an '86 and an '87 American Series:



Nice collection! I've owned 2 Barrettas, 2 Pacers (Custom I and Custom II), 1 Nightswan, 3 Focus 1000's and 1 Focus 3000. I have to agree with everything you said - very decent quality floyd-equipped guitars. My favorites are the last versions made with the smaller body and contoured bottom cutaway - very hard to find.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Yes, indeed...In August I sold a pink Custom II with the contoured bottom cutaway (I think I'm on your page? The lower horn bevelled?) and a maple fingerboard. 

I also had a Custom I which is my least fav control layout (mini switch for each pickup and then blower switch). They are still nice but I like to have a tone control and I really don't care for all of the switches...it was pretty much put on the market (in my opinion) to make something available for people who wanted the Jackson that had those similar controls but didn't want to wait for a guitar to be built and the price was quite a bit less than the Jackson as well, although the necks were/are very un-Jackson-like. 

I have also had a Focus 1000 and still have a 3000...and a parts Baretta (Baretta body and custom neck). 

'80s Kramers are almost completely overlooked in today's guitar market.


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## Orcslayer (Feb 2, 2009)

Peavey made some excellent guitars in USA until the last few years. (I'm not talking about the Wolfgang).

Their "Reactor" Tele was especially nice - slightly different cut on the body & the pickups had the twang but were just a bit warmer than Fender. 

As well they had a good USA Strat copy called The Raptor. Some had what looked like Lace pups with interesting wiring & a very "quacky" sound. 

They still use the name but now they are cheaply made in the far east.

In the 70's & 80's they produced a unique USA made line of their own (not copies). Notably the T-60 with a wild looking "Strat does Texas Longhorn" look & amazing pickup wiring options. There were several other models in this group.

These are all good bargains used, although the T-60 & it's cousins seem to be being rediscovered lately & prices are rising.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

Orcslayer said:


> Peavey made some excellent guitars in USA until the last few years. (I'm not talking about the Wolfgang).
> 
> Their "Reactor" Tele was especially nice - slightly different cut on the body & the pickups had the twang but were just a bit warmer than Fender.
> 
> ...


There was a seafoam green Raptor (USA) with a maple fingerboard at the pawnshop across the street from where I work for under $250 about 4 months ago. I'm not a big Peavey fan, but I guess for a USA-made guitar, that's not too bad of a price. 




smorgdonkey said:


> Yes, indeed...In August I sold a pink Custom II with the contoured bottom cutaway (I think I'm on your page? The lower horn bevelled?) and a maple fingerboard.
> ...
> 
> '80s Kramers are almost completely overlooked in today's guitar market.


Yes, the bevelled/contoured bottom cutaway - but not like the earlier Baretta II models. The ones I liked had the sharper body contours as opposed to the rounded body shape that the Baretta was known for. The bodys were dead ringers for ESP 'MII Deluxes' and Jackson 'Fusions'.

Actually a buddy of mine (Satim) on here used to own a real nice Kramer Stagemaster Deluxe. It was basically a rebranded ESP neck-thru Horizon - meaning a very nice carved top. Full binding, ebony fingerboard, gold hardware and fancy inlays. My only gripe was equipped with a single humbucker.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

vds5000 said:


> Yes, the bevelled/contoured bottom cutaway - but not like the earlier Baretta II models. The ones I liked had the sharper body contours as opposed to the rounded body shape that the Baretta was known for. The bodys were dead ringers for ESP 'MII Deluxes' and Jackson 'Fusions'.
> 
> Actually a buddy of mine (Satim) on here used to own a real nice Kramer Stagemaster Deluxe. It was basically a rebranded ESP neck-thru Horizon - meaning a very nice carved top. Full binding, ebony fingerboard, gold hardware and fancy inlays. My only gripe was equipped with a single humbucker.


Yes...the similarities between the Kramers and ESPs are numerous and can still be seen today in some of the business practices and some existing design elements.

I think it was the Horizon that ESP released while Kramer had sent them the blueprints for their 'next model' and were waiting for a prototype from ESP. The Horizon was the exact specs...hmmm...so the outsourcing that partly made Kramer 'king' also contributed to making Kramer into 'pauper'.


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

vds5000 said:


> There was a seafoam green Raptor (USA) with a maple fingerboard at the pawnshop across the street from where I work for under $250 about 4 months ago. I'm not a big Peavey fan, but I guess for a USA-made guitar, that's not too bad of a price.


Could only be the King of Trade. I remember that Peavey too - I had like it in white that played like a dream. That seafoam one didn't seem to have the same feel to me but 150 bucks for a U.S. made fiddle .......


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

What are the resale values like on Yamaha guitars? They seem to be always under-rated as well.


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## puckhead (Sep 8, 2008)

Jaggery said:


> Was reading over at the Reverend Forum that some shop in vancouver was blowing their stock for 399 and under.


more info, please. :wave:


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

puckhead said:


> more info, please. :wave:


Ya if they had a Buckshot for that price, I would buy it even though I am broke. I love my Reverend Flatroc. It's the most versatile guitar I own and is a treat to play.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

smorgdonkey said:


> Yes...the similarities between the Kramers and ESPs are numerous and can still be seen today in some of the business practices and some existing design elements.
> 
> I think it was the Horizon that ESP released while Kramer had sent them the blueprints for their 'next model' and were waiting for a prototype from ESP. The Horizon was the exact specs...hmmm...so the outsourcing that partly made Kramer 'king' also contributed to making Kramer into 'pauper'.


At the time, I had a translucscent purple bolt-on ESP Horizon and he brought his Stagemaster over. We compared the two - the body dimensions/contours were identical.




allthumbs56 said:


> Could only be the King of Trade. I remember that Peavey too - I had like it in white that played like a dream. That seafoam one didn't seem to have the same feel to me but 150 bucks for a U.S. made fiddle .......


You betcha. I thought it was $249, but I stand corrected. I remember back in around 1989, I bought a USA Kramer Baretta for $110 at a pawn shop on St.Paul Street. Not sure if it was King of Trade or not. BUT, the mother of all pawn shops was East Main in Welland. People on here would weep like infants if they knew what kind of deals I got there.


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## GTFPDQ (Oct 31, 2007)

Well being a cheapskate, I only buy "priced to own" guitars. Resale doesnt really matter as long as the guitar plays well. You could spend your entire life looking for deals and fail. Some people are willing to pay that extra 0 or 00 for the guitar and never want to sell it. But every now and then, you will walk into a pawn shop and there it is, the $100 57' Strat...... Karma can be a couch.


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

vds5000 said:


> You betcha. I thought it was $249, but I stand corrected. I remember back in around 1989, I bought a USA Kramer Baretta for $110 at a pawn shop on St.Paul Street. Not sure if it was King of Trade or not. BUT, the mother of all pawn shops was East Main in Welland. People on here would weep like infants if they knew what kind of deals I got there.


Don't trust my memory either :smile: . If I recall correctly (see previous statement), King of Trade was originally on the opposite side at the corner back then.

You are correct about East Main in Welland. At least twice a month we'd take the sojourn to see them and stop at Central too. I bought a few interesting things at East Main - but mostly pedals ..... like a DM-2 for 25 bucks 

I also did well at the Hock Shop before Stan retired. I did buy a few guitars there and he always had some great vintage McIntosh stuff to look over too.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

allthumbs56 said:


> Don't trust my memory either :smile: . If I recall correctly (see previous statement), King of Trade was originally on the opposite side at the corner back then.
> 
> You are correct about East Main in Welland. At least twice a month we'd take the sojourn to see them and stop at Central too. I bought a few interesting things at East Main - but mostly pedals ..... like a DM-2 for 25 bucks
> 
> I also did well at the Hock Shop before Stan retired. I did buy a few guitars there and he always had some great vintage McIntosh stuff to look over too.


Actually, KOT was on that side originally, then it moved across the street, then it moved back.

East Main - I was so upset when the lady who owned it said she was retiring. She was nice - her son was a goof though. Often, they were too lazy to put out the good stuff, but as soon as she'd see me come in, she knew the kinda stuff I liked. I bought a 1986 Fender US '1962 Reissue' strat from them for $425. It was the exact same one Ostaneks had hanging up a year earlier for $800. It was a true relic, but I will say it was probably one of the best guitars I ever owned, period - regardless of cost. I also bought 2 Fender Japanese strats (72 Reissue and a 62 Reissue which I still own), a Gibson Les Paul Standard and a bunch of othet stuff. They had a Heritage hollowbody in there for $475 - MINT! I was kicking myself for a long time over not buying that. One Saturday, I just missed a blue tolex Marshall 30th Anniversary head that they sold for $400 - I missed it by a couple of hours actually.

Ah, the good old days.

Hock Shop at Pendale - that guy was a bit of a jerk sometimes. He sure knew watches though!


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## rollingdam (May 11, 2006)

used Ovation USA acoustics can be found at great prices-they remind me of Gibson acoustics-you will try quite a few and fins a gem


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

rollingdam said:


> used Ovation USA acoustics can be found at great prices-they remind me of Gibson acoustics-you will try quite a few and fins a gem


Yes! I knew there were at least a few more that I missed. My only beef with those is well, actually 2 beefs:

1.) Often, the tops are cracked.
2.) I find them hard to play without a strap - they keep sliding down (while sitting, that is).


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## Lemmy Hangslong (May 11, 2006)

Those are some nice Kramers on page 3... not sure if they were mwentioned yet but Music Man guitars are of excellnt quality and the resale is great for the 2nd owner.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

KHINGPYNN said:


> Those are some nice Kramers on page 3... not sure if they were mwentioned yet but Music Man guitars are of excellnt quality and the resale is great for the 2nd owner.


Unless the MM in question is the original issue EVH model.


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## Evilmusician (Apr 13, 2007)

Have to say maybe Washburns I bought a HB-35 335 copy for like nothing and I think there like 1299 new !


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

Evilmusician said:


> Have to say maybe Washburns I bought a HB-35 335 copy for like nothing and I think there like 1299 new !


Very nice. I remember when most Washburns were made in Japan. Where was that one made?


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## Evilmusician (Apr 13, 2007)

Was made in Korea ,I know the older ones were made in Japan ,this one is a 2000 ,and it plays better than alot of the Gibson 335 's I've played ,but I mean for $4000 as opposed to a 1200 it's quite a bargain!


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## Jaggery (Mar 12, 2006)

puckhead said:


> more info, please. :wave:


Sorry, just saw this. It might be too late.
I think the thread is deleted.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

*'Electronic Sound Products' Guitars*

Seriously, how many of you knew that's what ESP stood for? I bet not many :smile:

Horrid, horrid resale, although at least prices for their guitars are less now than 15-20 years ago.

- '92 transluscent purple Horizon Deluxe. List was over $1495 (US) at the time. I ended up selling it (in near mint condition) for $600 (Can) about 6 years ago.

- '92 MII Custom with the 'NYC Graffiti' finish. List was over $2495 (US) at the time. I ended up selling it (in mint condition) for about $650 (US) about a year after buying it new.

I didn't take as much of a hit on my other 2 ESPs (one being a neon pink neck-thru MI custom, the other being a cherry sunburst strat-style).

All I can say is thank God for student loan money!


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## sneakypete (Feb 2, 2006)

as little as 5 years ago I was buying old Japanese Fenders for almost nothing, most people outside the country still thought MIJ meant crap, like at the 5 and dimes back in the `60s. Well, I kissed those day goodbye, now with so many people after them prices are getting ridiculous for many models and sellers think any MIJ fender from that decade is worth big money. same goes for grecos, takais and now Burnys...these days? fogeddaboudit. Still, living in a smaller city I am occasionally able to find bargains but not on line with bidding services like Rinkya, makes it easy for people from any country to buy on line in Japan. Fortunately I got most of mine befroe the feeding frenzy started but can sometimes find a bargain but they`re getting fewer an farther inbetween. Yamahas have somewhat caught up but don`t sell for as much as I feel they could go, I own my share and love em to bits, top ends are as well made as anything available today.
Best deals for me today are still used Edwards from the Duncan series...got an SG recently for under $300.oo, for some inexplicable reason people here just don`t think those Edwards are very good, guess the stigma of being seen with one is too strong but hey, I ain`t that proud, I find them to be under rated in Japan and thats one reason I get em so cheap...those guys who sell them on e-bay are paying half...or less...than what they sell for to youse. Got a used Van Zandt strat for $700.oo a few years ago but now I never see them for under a grand. Used Seymour Duncans sell for as much as they did new too probably because they`re out of production. Bacchus is another maker than nobody wanted a few years ago...now they`ve been discoverd but again thats OK `cause I got mine years ago and they`ve doubled in value. Got that one piece Greco strat a couple of weeks ago for about $500.oo which to me was a deal but might not be to many outside Japan but they have become very collectable and 1 piece bodies are very rare so I`m surprised I got it so cheap...guess the economy has really affected many buyers over here.


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## sneakypete (Feb 2, 2006)

vds5000 said:


> Seriously, how many of you knew that's what ESP stood for? I bet not many :smile:
> 
> Horrid, horrid resale, although at least prices for their guitars


Electric Sound Products according to their catalogs...and some used models sell for a lot here but many don`t especially if you compare the prices to how much owners paid for custom mades. I picled up a used Navigator Les Paul type forunder $1000.oo last week...bargain, it has scratches and the frets are about 9/10 condition so I bought it for less than 1/3 of retail. Got it locally, on line those never show up at that price, very happy with it too...what a guitar.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

sneakypete said:


> I picked up a *used Navigator Les Paul type for under $1000.oo *last week...bargain, it has scratches and the frets are about 9/10 condition so I bought it for less than 1/3 of retail. Got it locally, on line those never show up at that price, very happy with it too...what a guitar.


Try to find a Gibson Custom Shop quality guitar around here at that price? I don't think so,


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## Younggun (Jul 2, 2008)

Washburn makes some quality guitars that are real bargains on the used market. I see them at less thean 50% of retail value all the time. On the Amp side it seems like Peavey are the bargain of 2009 in the used market. There seems to be so many of them for sale at prices that seem to be fire sale priced and yet not moving.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Younggun said:


> Washburn makes some quality guitars that are real bargains on the used market. I see them at less thean 50% of retail value all the time. On the Amp side it seems like Peavey are the bargain of 2009 in the used market. There seems to be so many of them for sale at prices that seem to be fire sale priced and yet not moving.


Ya Peavey and the newer Ampegs can be found for half of their retail prices. As far as mass produced amps go, both are supposed to be really good amps as well.


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## kazzelectro (Oct 25, 2007)

I think the problem with the poor resale value of a lot of the guitars mentioned is that folks who buy them really have got to have them. Demand for a Carvin for example is pretty low I think overall...they don't sell that well to begin with because they are specific to a certain type of player. Good guitars but low demand to begin with. Epiphones on the other hand are usually the choice for first time buyers and therefore the market is flooded with them. In this economy nothing is really reselling really well.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

I think that another one of the things that hurts Carvin is that they are available from California only so you buy direct and get great value but many people hate the thought of having to have it shipped back for any warranty stuff.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

torndownunit said:


> Ya Peavey and the newer Ampegs can be found for half of their retail prices. As far as mass produced amps go, both are supposed to be really good amps as well.


Peavey's have always seemed to have poor resale (other than pieces affiliated with EVH). I think Ampeg gets an unnecessary bad rap. I've owned 3 Ampeg amps from the late 80's/early 90's (VL1002 and 2 VT60's), and had no issues with any of them.




smorgdonkey said:


> I think that another one of the things that hurts Carvin is that they are available from California only so you buy direct and get great value but many people hate the thought of having to have it shipped back for any warranty stuff.


Another issue with Carvin is in most cases, you can't try before you buy, unless you fly down to California and visit their store/showroom. Most people are probably not too comfortable committing to purchasing an item without trying it (or one like it) first.


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## gerald guerrero (Oct 3, 2006)

1) Old Peavey Classic VTX and Heritage amps. 
Low Low Used prices.V ery Good amps.Cleans just Okay. Distrortion is Brutal, and cool, but NOT sophisticated.
2) Peavey Cabints- Have some good parts and and constructed well. Main problems are the cheaper Particleboard fronts and baffles- but even he older Peavy particleboard is pretty good . Cabs can actually be cut down, and also modified with Plywood sides and baffles( Its a lot of work and youve got to know how to cut speaker holes onto plywood). The back ofthe cabinte, which is sealed and tolexed is petty sturdy , makeing them pretty good cabs even 'as is' for the going price, which can be usually a hundred dollars or so.
3) Crate Lee jackson Amps; Soldano in a BOx. Great little amps noone seems to want but are built pretty well, and Sound absolutley Crushing, especially with NOS tubes.I jusyt bought the 1x12 50 watt 6v6 combo for 175.00. These origianllsold for 650.00. Not totally easy to find any longer.


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## vds5000 (Apr 14, 2008)

gerald guerrero said:


> 1) ...3) Crate Lee jackson Amps; Soldano in a BOx. Great little amps noone seems to want but are built pretty well, and Sound absolutley Crushing, especially with NOS tubes.I jusyt bought the 1x12 50 watt 6v6 combo for 175.00. These origianllsold for 650.00. Not totally easy to find any longer.


I'm guessing you mean the Crate 'Stealth'. I don't think they were ever advertised as 'Lee Jackson' models, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was involved with them. I used to own an Ampeg VL1002 (an actual Lee Jackson model). I believe this amp came out before the Mesa Rectos, and I think it pretty much set the stage for that 'chuga chuga' Recto sound. Resale value for this model is the pits. It originally retailed for $1350 (US) almost 20 years ago, but if you look around, you can find them for $400-500 (US) on the used market.


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