# Jazz tone...suggestions?



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

I'm trying to get closer to that "warm" type of jazz tone.

I don't want to get a jazz box and an amp (e.g., Roland JC 120) that has a good reputation for jazz tones as I don't have the cash (unless....someone knows of an inexpensive amp that delivers great jazz type tones) and,to be honest, I have a loooooong way to go with my playing to even be thinking about the complexities of jazz. 

...I'm just messing around with some "jazz" types of chords and I'm enjoying it.

My gear purchases (and playing interests) have been oriented to the blues (as you will see)

I have a 335 copy and a selection of Seymour Duncan (SD) pickups. (Seth Lover bridge, Pearly Gates set, Phat Cat neck, Custom and Custom Custom, and an old set of Gibson pickups). I also have an Epi LP Ultra (chambered) but the stock pickups in it are quite hot.

The amps I'm playing through are a '65 bandmaster into a 1 x 12" cab with a Weber AlNiCo speaker and a Traynor Base Master YBA-2A head. I have a Verbzilla reverb pedal for the heads as I like a *bit* of reverb. I also have a '76 SF Princeton Reverb with a Weber 12" AlNiCo. 

So...if you owned this gear, how would you go about "organizing" (pickups, tone settings, etc) it to get closer to jazz tones? I wouldn't hesitate to look into getting another pickup if that would help (thinking SD Jazz neck) as I intend to sell some pickups as it is. 

Do jazz players often use specific pedals to *help* them get their tone?

Please don't tell me that most of this is tone is "from my fingers"....I agree and understand that part, but I will need a couple of centuries if I depend totally on my fingers to get this tone....LOL 

Thanks

Dave


----------



## NB-SK (Jul 28, 2007)

I'm just learning jazz, but when playing a guitar with humbuckers I get a really nice jazz/blues tone by using the neck pickup only. I turn down the volume knob on the guitar to 2 and the tone knob to about 4-5....but you probably already know that trick.


----------



## SinCron (Mar 2, 2006)

Peavey Pacer gets good jazzy stuff. The overdrive is layered on top of the clean so you still get both. Quite nice.


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Thanks NB-SK.

Actually, Yes, I usually play using the neck pickup only. 

However, I have been dropping the tone control back but not the volume control. I've just been used to leaving the volume control up as a friend told me that doing that gives the fullest (i.e., most complete) audio signal from the pickup, thereby getting the most a pickup has to offer. Can't wait to try your suggestion...again, many thanks for such a simple idea. 

Dave


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

SinCron said:


> Peavey Pacer gets good jazzy stuff. The overdrive is layered on top of the clean so you still get both. Quite nice.


Thanks

Dave


----------



## SinCron (Mar 2, 2006)

greco said:


> Thanks
> 
> Dave


People have also said to use a cheap amp like a Peavey Rage and just hold back on the guitar volume or amp distortion. I forget. The best thing is when the distortion is layered like that. My Pacer is like that, as are my two Yamaha amps but the distortion/OD on the Yamaha amps are useless IMO.


----------



## jcayer (Mar 25, 2007)

greco said:


> ...
> However, I have been dropping the tone control back but not the volume control. I've just been used to leaving the volume control up as a friend told me that doing that gives the fullest (i.e., most complete) audio signal from the pickup, thereby getting the most a pickup has to offer. Can't wait to try your suggestion...again, many thanks for such a simple idea.
> ...


Actually, dropping the vol pot a bit will darken the tone a _little bit more_. On my telecaster (equipped with a CC Rider neck pickup - see my signature for the details) I found that turning the tone pot almost to zero will give me the best tone for jazz (Barney Kessel style). 

As my teacher told me, in a band situation; he said that you should turn your vol. pot to about 3 - 4 and turn it up for the solos. He call this giving yourself a reserve. Don't know if the sound guy likes it tho... :smile:


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

So...would you say that SS amps more popular among jazz players, in general, than tube amps?

Some of the websites that discuss gear for playing jazz are suggesting the Roland Cube 30 or 60.

What about pickups ...any specific suggestions? (I'm most familiar with SD humbuckers)

Dave


----------



## jcayer (Mar 25, 2007)

For some amps suggestions, check these links out:

*EDIT* this one seems dead ... I'll leave it here just in case...
http://www.jazzguitar.be/forum/guita...uitar-amp.html


http://www.jazzguitar.be/jazz_guitar_amps.html


----------



## suttree (Aug 17, 2007)

um. flatwound strings will make a huge difference. 

also most jazz players do roll the volume back from full, and the tone as well. with a standard gibson style neck pickup, you should be in the realm at least. you'll want a relatively low output humbucker (of which you have a few examples), no screamin demons.


----------



## Geek (Jun 5, 2007)

Hi Dave,



greco said:


> So...would you say that SS amps more popular among jazz players, in general, than tube amps?
> 
> Some of the websites that discuss gear for playing jazz are suggesting the Roland Cube 30 or 60.


I dunno, I'm a real Smooth-Jazz fan and not-a-one of the artists that list their equipment use SS. Usually vintage Fender tube stuff.

Cheers!


----------



## devnulljp (Mar 18, 2008)

jcayer said:


> As my teacher told me, in a band situation; he said that you should turn your vol. pot to about 3 - 4 and turn it up for the solos. He call this giving yourself a reserve. Don't know if the sound guy likes it tho... :smile:


I gigged a bunch with a sound guy who would automatically cut you in the mix if you turned up much on stage after soundcheck. I used to do this neat little artificial harmonics thing and use a boost channel on my amp with compression to stop it just dying--he used to just kill my levels and the whole point of the boost.


----------



## suttree (Aug 17, 2007)

devnulljp said:


> I gigged a bunch with a sound guy who would automatically cut you in the mix if you turned up much on stage after soundcheck. I used to do this neat little artificial harmonics thing and use a boost channel on my amp with compression to stop it just dying--he used to just kill my levels and the whole point of the boost.


hmm... if his job is to mix the band and the one guitar just comes screaming out all of a sudden, then of course he's going to turn you down, would he turn you back up after you quieted down? this harmonic trick, how did his changing your levels out front change the guitar sound? 

the thing about sound guys is: we've all done one too many gigs with a 14 year old punk band that brings 2 mesa/boogie rectifier full stacks to play a gig at a community hall with a 200 person capacity. who then proceed to bitch at you because "we can't hear the vocals" (to which i answer, "dude i can't hear your _drums_"). so um yah, we get a little antsy about volume over the years.... but if your band has its volume well under control, then the soundguy is happy, and he doesn't care how you go about it. frankly if you can boost yourself a few dB for a solo without my help? i get paid the same for pushing less faders, so i'm happy.


----------



## Geek (Jun 5, 2007)

suttree said:


> ....brings 2 mesa/boogie rectifier full stacks to play a gig at a community hall with a 200 person capacity.


I think that's part of the reason for the demise in the live music scene out here. When clubs did have live bands, they were so insanely loud we could hear them from four blocks away. Cities started making bylaws against live bands after 10PM, regardless of venue


----------



## washburned (Oct 13, 2006)

the bandmaster should be a great amp for jazz....try this for a starter; turn all tone controls up full, presence (if there is one) control about 1/2 way, guitar on neck PUP, guitar vol about 3 - 4, guitar tone rolled off. Use the amp volume for overall volume and guitar volume for soloing. Tweak the guitar and amp tone controls one at a time until you get a sound you like.


----------



## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

First, replace the first 12ax7 with a 12au7 in one of your tube amps. Next, buy my Agile Cool Cat Prestige Hollow body. Viola, jazz tone . . .!

TG


----------



## pattste (Dec 30, 2007)

Jazz tones vary a lot, from Larry Carlton to Martin Taylor to John Scofield. But if you want a cleaner sound, I think you should be able to get it with your current gear. A 335 is a perfectly fine jazz guitar and almost any Fender tube amp played clean will get you a good jazz tone. Most jazz guitarists don't use any pedals or effects beyond reverb. In any case, I encourage you to find your own sound rather than try to copy someone else's, which is normally a losing proposition in more ways than one.


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Thanks for all the links, info and advice !!

I'm going to try some of the suggestions and see if I can get closer to a tone that seems jazz-like to me. 

I'm not trying to duplicate anyone elses tone, specifically.

Cheers

Dave


----------

