# Wet/dry, moving to wet/dry/wet



## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

So hear me out.
I’ve been having fun splitting my signal with a Fulltone true path ABy to send my stereo reverb, delay and modulation pedals to a vox (output signal A) and fender (output B) which gives a deep, spread out sound with panning effects. 

I am also running compression on everything and sending drive and fuzz pedals only to the vox (A). Kind of the love child of a stereo setup meets wet/dry sort of thing going on.

I had the idea to add another fender as second wet channel, send only drive and fuzz up the middle to my vox, And split my stereo reverb/delay/funky modulation to both fenders for a fun panning/depth effect on my “wet” effects, essentially making a type of wet/dry/wet setup. I was going to do this with a stereo pedal that has 1 in 2 out to split my B signal coming from my true path ABy splitter to both “wet” fenders.

Essentially, mono signal to ABy (A output) add drive and fuzz up the middle to vox

Mono signal to ABy - B output is then split into to two with something like a boss chorus that has 1 in 2 out, through my stereo pedals and then to their respective amps. 

however I realized I will then be faced with the same issue that made me buy a buffered, isolated ABy switch to begin with. My stereo “wet effects” will then have issues with ground loop isolation, and phase, right?

do I essentially need to have ANOTHER buffered ABy switch after the first one to split/handle the stereo wet side? There has to be a better way? Is there such thing as a buffered, isolated ABC with phase correction? What are other guys doing to good effect ?

I hope you can follow. Thanks for input in advance.


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## CathodeRay (Jan 12, 2018)

Interesting.

Would it be possible for you to draw a block diagram of the setup and post it here? 

Sent from my A3_Pro using Tapatalk


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

CathodeRay said:


> Interesting.
> 
> Would it be possible for you to draw a block diagram of the setup and post it here?
> 
> Sent from my A3_Pro using Tapatalk


Will do, tonight


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

You might need the gizmo they use on that pedal show. they have a few videos on wet/dry rigs


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

knight_yyz said:


> You might need the gizmo they use on that pedal show. they have a few videos on wet/dry rigs


Which gizmo?

going to rewatch those episodes when I get time over the next couple of days


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

I think it is the gig rig humdinger, you can reverse phase if you need it. Best to watch the videos again though


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## beachbuminthesun (Nov 4, 2019)

Why do you think you will have a phase issue? You need to check if any of your pedals reverse phase when engaged. Depending where they are in your chain can affect phase coherence. You need a transformer isolated output to remove ground loops caused by sending the same signal to multiple amps in the same circuit.


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

beachbuminthesun said:


> Why do you think you will have a phase issue? You need to check if any of your pedals reverse phase when engaged. Depending where they are in your chain can affect phase coherence. You need a transformer isolated output to remove ground loops caused by sending the same signal to multiple amps in the same circuit.


Thanks for the reply. I assume phase correction is useful to future proof in case I switch out amps to one with that needs to be flipped 180 degrees. Most but not all are. Also in case like you mentioned, I have a pedal thats always on that flips phase. This way I can just keep that pedal and flip the phase at the splitter. 

Transformer isolated output from where? Sorry but I'm not following. What does that entail and where in my chain are you suggesting it go?


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## beachbuminthesun (Nov 4, 2019)

Grounding loops happen when your 2 amps share a common ground. When you split your signal, the cable going to one of the 2 amps can go through an isolation box to isolate.
If you’ve ever seen those fancy junction boxes on pedalboards, they’ll usually have this function when multiple outputs are present. Check out the one from LA sound design that appears in reverb every once in a while.


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## beachbuminthesun (Nov 4, 2019)

Like this

Something like this can work toohttps://reverb.com/item/35113482-dpfx-pedals-2-way-isolated-buffered-splitter-mini-enclosure?utm_source=rev-ios-app&utm_medium=ios-share&utm_campaign=listing&utm_content=35113482


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

CathodeRay said:


> Interesting.
> 
> Would it be possible for you to draw a block diagram of the setup and post it here?
> 
> Sent from my A3_Pro using Tapatalk


Here ya go. Hopefully you get an idea of what I mean. I don't have the second ABy splitter but just want to make sure that what I'm setting up will not have ground/phase issues. 

Does this make sense? Compression and the option of drive to everything. Then drive and fuzz to amp A, 

With stereo "wet effects" sent to amp B,C


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## beachbuminthesun (Nov 4, 2019)

That looks fine, you wouldn't need the second ABY splitter assuming the first pedal in your chain can split the signal. If you're only planning on playing in one place (no gigs, always at home) you might not need the iso depending on how your electricity is wired. If you're getting a lot of uncontrollable hum, then look into a splitter with a transformer isolated output (like from the brand Lehle or custom affordable see below) instead of a regular splitter like the morley one.

If you need something custom made on a budget, I can recommend these two:









CopilotFx


Shop CopilotFx on Reverb




reverb.com












DS Custom Audio Electronics


Shop DS Custom Audio Electronics on Reverb




reverb.com


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## beachbuminthesun (Nov 4, 2019)

By the phase issues you mention would happen if you are using different amps or speakers. You mention that you will be using the same amps for your stereo signal correct? If that's the case, you can check your phase with splitting your dry signal in 2 between the vox and one of the stereo amps. Check if your phase is being flipped by your pedals one at a time when engaged. I think if you need, look into a phase switch then. Here is a (old) list of pedals with phase flipping!






list the pedals that invert phase....................


in a parallel or stereo setup pedals that invert phase can be a real menace. (depending on which side of the camp you populate it may or may not be an issue in a mono setup/rig) either way, i thought it would be handy to list phase inverting pedals here as a reference. i'll update this...



www.thegearpage.net


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

beachbuminthesun said:


> That looks fine, you wouldn't need the second ABY splitter assuming the first pedal in your chain can split the signal. If you're only planning on playing in one place (no gigs, always at home) you might not need the iso depending on how your electricity is wired. If you're getting a lot of uncontrollable hum, then look into a splitter with a transformer isolated output (like from the brand Lehle or custom affordable see below) instead of a regular splitter like the morley one.
> 
> If you need something custom made on a budget, I can recommend these two:
> 
> ...


My original plan was just to use a chorus pedal that has 1 input and 2 outputs. But then I thought that going to two different amps could give me possible issues with phase since id be splitting one signal and then going to two different amps. I guess if my two amps are the same phase than I would be fine though...

So if amp B and amp C are different phase, when i flip them with the first splitter, both amps will flip (and still be out of phase). That was my concern with not getting a second splitter, as well as ground problems.

My first ABy splitter is the fulltone true path. Has ground lift, buffer, and phase flip. Will having this one splitter in the signal chain address all issues of ground hum at the amps?


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

beachbuminthesun said:


> By the phase issues you mention would happen if you are using different amps or speakers. You mention that you will be using the same amps for your stereo signal correct? If that's the case, you can check your phase with splitting your dry signal in 2 between the vox and one of the stereo amps. Check if your phase is being flipped by your pedals one at a time when engaged. I think if you need, look into a phase switch then. Here is a (old) list of pedals with phase flipping!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


For my stereo amps, I will most likely not be using two of the same amps for now , as I already have an Allen brown sugar that I've really started to like and finding another would be tough. I'd also like to experiment with using different character amps to make the sound even bigger/more layered


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

I believe this would also work? To split the wet side signal, buffer it, and also offer phase correction. Its not a switcher, so I wouldn't be able to toggle between lines, but that won't matter as both wet amps will always be on

Suhr Buffer Pedal Suhr Buffer Pedal | Cosmo Music - The Musical Instrument Superstore | Reverb


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## matt-griffin (Jan 17, 2021)

This sounds like a lot of fun! I say go for it. My two cents on the phase issue: phase is easily solved by flipping speaker terminals. Don't overthink it too much. : )

And also, if you're going 3-way stereo ... why not expand the palette and throw a Supro in there? Might be fun for the drive channel.


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## Wootang (Oct 6, 2020)

I'm plugging away this is where I'm at 



















Vox ac5hw on the left
Allen brown sugar in the middle 
And tossed a hot rod deluxe on the right 

Looking for a mixer so I can run my wet effects in parallel as the drawing shows.


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