# TCM guitars?!?



## Maxer

Question for you guys. I recently acquired a TCM guitar that's been through the wringer. Judging by its looks, electronics and construction, this looks very much like an early 80s Matsumoku factory guitar (I have one 1981 Vantage and two Aria Pro IIs from 1980 and 1981). This one is a Strat shape but it's neck-through. Beyond the logo on the front of the headstock there's no other serial number on anywhere, though I've not yet popped either of the cavity covers.

There was a thread here from last year in which it was claimed that TCM guitars were the house brand of Ottawa's Continental music but that the guitars were Japanese imports made in the Matsumoku plant. I've tried researching this thing but there's not a helluva lot of information I can find on the web. This thing is probably too toasted to fix at a reasonable cost but I'm going to check anyway and at the very least salvage what I can. Looks like someone confused it with a baseball bat and went smashing stuff up with it. It's too bad, because it was a very nice player, I'm sure. Just wondering if anyone had ever seen one of these before and what they might know. Cheers.


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## Maxer

Nothing? I mean, I know it's an obscure brand and all. LOL!


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## Diablo

<looking at broken neck and hearing a Mythbusters voice saying "Well theres yer problem...."> lol



Sorry never heard of TCM. Looks like an interesting piece though.


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## Destropiate

Sorry, I don't know anything about TCM's. It does look like too nice of a guitar to get a beating like that though. Kinda looks like someone was living out a Kurt Cobain fantasy or something


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## 4Aaron GE

If nothing else, it would make a very nice wall ornament.


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## xbolt

TCM were just a Continental brand they imported from Japan and later probably Korea.
I believe he as many other off-brands either ordered specific models or bought overruns, etc...including Sanox and other stuff.

Like today's Chinese guitars, they had some good, ok and crappy production runs.

The early TCM and Sanox guitars definitely look like Matsu/Aria stuff as did many of their models and associated hardware.
I would place yours as a midrange import that probably had Dimarzio copies, Gotoh tuner or copies, etc.
All a bit of a mistery in general but TCM did not build anything...just an importer not unlike like Dillion or Vintage today.
Not sure how consistent today's importers product is but the missing link back then was any hint of a QA department to reject the bad units...Some needed a lot of work to be decent players.

Although not really on topic, the other issue was the store policies which still hold a legacy of their own.


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## Guitar-n00b

I bought an Orange strat shaped one from Kijiji, there are tons of people who they give the guitars to to sell from their own home, I got the Humbucker-Single-Single one, It's actually ok, I repainted it to something of Van Halen's guitar, Also, they say they are made from 100% recycled materials plus some cheap pickups.


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## Maxer

Yeah, it _would_ make a nice wall ornament.

Xbolt, yeah, thanks - you were the guy who had mentioned the Matsumoku connection in that other thread. And I agree - it's probably something mid-range. If it was anything like my other guitars from that place and time, it was built like a tank. Someone had to be very pissed off to do that to it. The fact that it apparently has no SN makes me doubtful too, suggesting the sellers didn't exactly get behind their product. No-name mid-range guitar comes off the line in Japan somewhere around the early 80s, they slap one of dozens of 'local' badges on it, and it's shipped out in a hurry, end of story. I should try out the electronics, just to hear what the quality is. My other Matsu gear has great stock pups and other nice quirky additions like active boosts and coil-tap mini-toggles.... they sound and play great. This one is a looker too but man, what a drag it had to end up like this.

Still, I like these old beaters. I don't know what I'll end up doing with it. I'm betting someone skilled could patch up the neck but it would be very costly. I don't mind fixing up cool old guitars but there's a limit. There's also a fine but deep crack where one of the wings is splitting from the centre woods. I think this thing was swung against something hard more than once.

OK guys, thanks for the feedback. 'preciate it.


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## rollingdam

TCM is Truglia Continental Music-the store went belly up along with all the rest of the family's commercial real estate holdings and the old fool started up again as Intercontinental Music. Avoid TCM like the plague and their other brands like Intex Baron etc. This idiot has acoustic guitars hanging in the windows of his store absorbing all that sunshine. This guy has no repeat customers and his ego cannot fathom why he is disliked.
The Ottawa Kijiji and used Ottawa sites are full of his offerings.


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## karl

Sorry to resurrect this thread, but i was just doing a search on TCM guitars and find Terry C McInturf has a TCM line of expensive LP copies that look a lot like the Arie PE series. Nice neck joint!

Hopefully Incontinent Music in Ottawa has closed by now?


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## rollingdam

karl said:


> Sorry to resurrect this thread, but i was just doing a search on TCM guitars and find Terry C McInturf has a TCM line of expensive LP copies that look a lot like the Arie PE series. Nice neck joint!
> 
> Hopefully Incontinent Music in Ottawa has closed by now?


Unfortunately he is still in business


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## Cdn_Cracker

For what its worth... for the love of god... never mix up this piece with a Terry C McInturff... IMHO... Terry's are outstanding. I bought a used Royale II and his build quality is really impressive - but his prices are really steep, so I would definitely recommend buying used. I swapped out the stock P-90s for a set of Lollars and it is amazing.

I still get the shivers whenever I drive by Intercontinental.... and can't understand why he is still in business after all these years! I went in there once and pretty disappointed.


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## adonadis

*Tcm*

TCM guitar's are a piece of crap.. never buy one. same goes for Baron and the other brand they sell at intercontinental music... and yes they are still there.
i bought a guitar (LP KNock off ). the price was nice the guitar looked nicesounded ok. my plan was to buy it and replace the electronics .. brought it home the intonation went out. brought it back to the store they had it for 2 months. when i picked it up the stings weren't event placed properly and the intonation was worst than when i brought it in. He claimed that i messed it up and that his guitar tech was great at what he does.. BULL... The guitar does make nice firewood..... NEVER BUY ANYTHING FROM INTERCONTINENTAL MUSIC>>> NOT EVEN STRINGS..


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## jimmyd

That guitar shop has many many complaints. It's actually an old jewish guy and his wife that own the place, they just sit there all day being rude to people who walk in the door until you put cash in there hand and leave. Most items in the store are not even good enough to be call garbage. Surprisingly I thought they would have closed up shop years ago, but no, they just renovated and doubled the size of there store...i think they used all the old guitars they couldn't sell as building material. If in Ottawa go to Steves, St. Johns, Long and McQuade, or Spaceman music....avoid all others, they never give ya a kiss after they _[insert dirty word] _ya.


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## karl

oh well, i still have a nice old yamaha 12 string i bought used at the montreal rd location in 1980. i remember when they were downstairs fro the drug dealer pinball arcade on rideau st.


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## guitar_mortal

I found my way to this page after checking out TCM guitars at Intercontinental Music in Ottawa. I had a difficult time communicating with the elderly owner due to his heavy accent and he became agitated when I told him I needed to do some research on TCM amps and guitars online before buying - I thought they were more than a house brand at the time - the TCM guitars he has in the store are tagged at $2000-$3000 and appear to be at the quality level of Squire or entry level Epiphone. His customer interaction skills were not at a level suitable for dealing with the public unfortunately. I also found their products, at least the guitars and amps I looked at, over priced compared to retailers like Long and McQuade and Steve's. I just cannot see them being able to remain in business unfortunately


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## Gordie

My buddy has a beautiful TCM 355-style guitar. I wonder if it's "McInturf". I recall that name from the murky depths...


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## FormerBlonde

I made it into the store yesterday and there are some good looking guitars in there. I was particularly taken with a Natural Telecaster copy.... just gorgeous. I was told some models were 50% off so I should ask if I like anything. But the $699 price tag coupled with the unwelcome feeling I had put me off trying it. I may get up the interest and go back to give it a try. 

I'm pretty sure they have different levels of quality. I saw some guitars with nice binding work and I swear I saw some where the binding was just painted under the finish. It's difficult to get a sense of what's what when you go in there. But again...some nice looking stuff in there.


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## berniebee

FormerBlonde said:


> . I was told some models were 50% off so I should ask if I like anything.


The perpetual 50% off/ Liquidation Sale is the only way that Intercontinental music stays in business. 
People love to see 50% off tags, so suckers, er, customers keep coming in. 
It's an example of a business model based on ripping off budding musicians (Or their parents.), with no repeat customers. 

If you know nothing about guitars, Ottawa's Intercontinental music store certainly looks impressively large. (Mind you, the cramped, gravel parking lot should be your first clue.) They have a large selection of guitars, amps, and band instruments too. The owner hangs many pretty guitars in the broad windows, and lookee! There's a sale goin on!

The truth is that the owner knows enough to source his crap cheaply and directly from China, and he knows enough to import good looking, shiny, colourful crap.
He has three exclusive brands: Baron, Intex and TCM. TCM is the "top of the line", ie: it has the highest price tags and of course the highest profit margin for him.
He puts an outrageous price on all his stuff, and then "gives you" 40- 50% off. Customers don't realize that his "50% off" price is still too high, given the mediocre quality of the instrument. 

The icing on the cake is the customer service. If you've ever been in a Long & Mcquade store and experienced the friendly atmosphere there, I am here to tell you that the owner of Intercontinental music is Long & Mcquade's evil twin. He has extremely poor customer skills. (Google the Seinfield's "soup nazi" for a good comparison.) 
If you say "I'm only looking today", he will tell you to leave immediately. This actually happened to me. I'm over fifty. Was he worried about shop lifting?

Ottawa's Kijiji, Craiglist and Used Ottawa are littered with used Baron and Intex brand guitars. (Though few TCM's. Probably few TCM's ever sell, because Intercontinental sells to beginners and naive bargain hunters.) 
The Baron/Intex owners, thinking that they lucked out with the 50% deal, often find that the resale value of these is very, very low. If they can find anyone to buy it at all. 
There is a post on Kijiji today where the owner/seller claims he spent $400 on his Intex acoustic guitar. I don't doubt it. It's an all laminate guitar, equivalent to a Yamaha F310, which costs $150 brand new. He wants $250 for his used Intex and a used hard case. Never, ever, ever- to quote Taylor Swift.

That rude jerk at Intercontinental Music has spread an incredible amount of misery to guitarists over several decades with poor quality products and horrific customer service. Don't go there -ever!


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## rollingdam

I used to deal with him on a business level other than musical instruments.

He is Italian and claims to be a famous Neopolitan Accordian Player. His previous business Continental Music went tits up due to his sons' misguided purchases of commercial real estate-one son now hustles TV's at Future Shop and the other one sells life insurance.

The so called luthier is his equally absurd brother.


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## Rollin Hand

This isn't a business dealing, but I am pretty sure my cousin dated his daughter (granddaughter?) for a while......


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## cheezyridr

i think i just accidentally down thumbed you. sorry, the screen jumped. but anyhow, so someone said they are italian jews. that means she was either pretty darn hot, or she may have had a mustache. hahahahaha


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## Adcandour

cheezyridr said:


> i think i just accidentally down thumbed you. sorry, the screen jumped. but anyhow, so someone said they are italian jews. that means she was either pretty darn hot, or she may have had a mustache. hahahahaha


Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


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## Rollin Hand

cheezyridr said:


> i think i just accidentally down thumbed you. sorry, the screen jumped. but anyhow, so someone said they are italian jews. that means she was either pretty darn hot, or she may have had a mustache. hahahahaha


If it is the one I am thinking of, I only met her once or twice back in the mid 90s, but can confirm hotness.


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## OldGuitarPlayer

I was looking around recently for a cheap nylon string guitar to bang around on and found a used TCM model #12 for $60. It's actually not too bad for a plywood guitar with a slightly slimmer neck width than most classical guitars. The action is nice and comfy and the rosewood fret-board looks and feels nice as well. It's not "overbuilt" and is pretty light in weight.
It appears to have either a laminate spruce or cedar top and fake rosewood back & sides. It also has a very nice two ply body binding. I can find no info about this particular guitar on the internet so I am guessing at what it's made of. It's certainly not made of press-board like some Estaban guitars I have seen.

The only thing that is a concern are the frets that are very low and flat. However it stays in tune quite well and the intonation is fine up and down the neck. Before I bought this I had looked at some cheap Yamaha classicals and I am pretty happy I picked up this used TCM model instead. 

That being said I would never buy a new TCM guitar since they are very overpriced from what I have seen over the years.
I bet the original retailer wanted several hundred dollars for this guitar when it was new. As it's already been mentioned, they have little resale value.


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## Scotty

berniebee said:


> That rude jerk at Intercontinental Music has spread an incredible amount of misery to guitarists over several decades with poor quality products and horrific customer service. Don't go there -ever!


This guy goes totally opposite to my philosophy that a well treated and respected customer who feels they got good value for your purchase is a repeat customer. If you don't have this very important thing going for you, then you spend all of your time searching for a NEW customer. The latter is foolish. Building relationships and loyalties for the future...customer service *IS* EVERYTHING


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## crippled corey

adonadis said:


> *Tcm*
> 
> TCM guitar's are a piece of crap.. never buy one. same goes for Baron and the other brand they sell at intercontinental music... and yes they are still there.
> i bought a guitar (LP KNock off ). the price was nice the guitar looked nicesounded ok. my plan was to buy it and replace the electronics .. brought it home the intonation went out. brought it back to the store they had it for 2 months. when i picked it up the stings weren't event placed properly and the intonation was worst than when i brought it in. He claimed that i messed it up and that his guitar tech was great at what he does.. BULL... The guitar does make nice firewood..... NEVER BUY ANYTHING FROM INTERCONTINENTAL MUSIC>>> NOT EVEN STRINGS..



well im a fender guy myself but i also have been gifted an acoustic baron as well as a strat copy electric,both guitars were decent when i got them which surprised having heard horrible reviews on them for years...after setting up both guitars,straightening their necks,rewiring and adding a 60s humbucker to both guitars,i gotta say both have a beautiful thick deep sound! maybe i got lucky or im better at being a guitar tech than i thought,either way theyre at least not a bad guitar for the price after being set up...


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## Lincoln

Maxer said:


> Nothing? I mean, I know it's an obscure brand and all. LOL!


TCM used to make forklifts. They were really hard to keep in tune though......


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## jbealsmusic

Lol. This thread is now a full decade old.


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## Rollin Hand

I am proud of my minimal involvement many years ago. 

(P.S. This store's stuff is mostly crap)


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## player99

Surely it is closed now?


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## terry h

karl said:


> Sorry to resurrect this thread, but i was just doing a search on TCM guitars and find Terry C McInturf has a TCM line of expensive LP copies that look a lot like the Arie PE series. Nice neck joint!
> 
> Hopefully Incontinent Music in Ottawa has closed by now?


i have a les paul copy and it also needs a bit of work but it plays well and sounds great, i guess i got a decent one


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## 2manyGuitars

Yes, I know this is a necro-post...

So the whole reason behind his mystery brands is because of “Manufacturers” Suggested Retail Price. Let’s go back to the Ottawa music stores of the ‘80s. There’s a factory in Japan that builds Strat copies and one of their best sellers is the BrandX model S3. It’s a decent, mid-level guitar and the MSRP is $399 and a standard dealer cost is 40% off (so cost is $239). Steve’s, Domenic’s, Metro, and Lauzon all sell them and the standard back then was a 20% discount so they’re tagged at $319. You can call any store across Canada and the price of a BrandX S3 is $399 MSRP but they sell them for $319, maybe $325, $349, hell... they may even try for $399. But there’s a common baseline.

Now, Mr. Truglio calls up that factory and asks to buy 50 of them but he wants TCM on the headstock instead of BrandX. Similar to the BrandX, his cost is also $239. As the “manufacturer” he decides that the MSRP on the TCM model X3000 is $1499.

Uneducated buyer walks in and (skipping over the lengthy, high-pressure sales job) has narrowed it down to this $1499 Strat which looks like a great deal at only $749. But wait!! Today is his lucky day!! “Don’t tell the boss, but because I like your face/shoes/the smell of your hair, I‘m going to knock another 200 bucks off.” says the friendly salesman. What a steal at $549.

Truglio has just sold a $319 guitar for $549 and the customer was elated to pay it. He made a $210 profit while every other store only makes $80. Yeah, he doesn’t sell nearly as many, and once the customer eventually realizes that he got screwed, he’ll never go back, but at those margins, he manages to stay in business for decades.


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## 2manyGuitars

A perfect example of TCM/Intex/Baron quality just popped up on kijiji today.










Here’s the text from the ad...

_Intex Classical guitar (nylon string) with fully functional pickups & electrical hardware (passive pickup so no batteries needed).
As you can see in the last 2 images, the neck is cracked where it meets the body (so the neck itself is not damaged, *the glue has just came off due to not mounting it properly*) As of right now this guitar is barely playable but it would be a very easy fix. You would litteraly just have to take the strings off, re-glue it & the hardest part would be re-stringing it (these bad boys are harder to re-string than your epiphone).

Only reason i do no fix it myself is i dont have a wood clamp, and barely played classical guitar to start with. It was an impulsive buy at the time but it played extremely well & had a fantastic sound before i messed up the action‍.

Perfect buy for anyone looking for an easy project with big results I forget the exact price I paid for this new in store but it was between 300$-400$_



















That’s some quality workmanship right there.
And BTW, how the hell would that passive pickup with preamp even work? And talk about cutting corners where you won’t even spring for an endpin jack and just throw a plug in the side..


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## Lutherieguy

This thread is becoming epic, and multi-generational. LoL. We can share with our grandkids how the mean guitar nazi oppressed musicians all across the land. I will add only a couple of technical facts dug up with google.

Read the 3 angry reviews from the Better Business Bureau page hahaha:








Intercontinental Music Ltd | Reviews | Better Business Bureau® Profile


View customer reviews of Intercontinental Music Ltd. Leave a review and share your experience with the BBB and Intercontinental Music Ltd.




www.bbb.org










Canadian Trademarks Details: BARON DESIGN — 0557098 - Canadian Trademarks Database - Intellectual property and copyright - Canadian Intellectual Property Office - Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada







www.ic.gc.ca










Détails de la marque de commerce : TCM DESIGN — 0509351 - Base de données sur les marques de commerce canadiennes - Propriété intellectuelle et droit d'auteur - Office de la propriété intellectuelle du Canada - Innovation, Sciences et Développement économique Canada







www.ic.gc.ca





I've never had this terrible type of experience at a music store but I had the IDENTICAL type of mistreatment at a sporting goods store in Toronto. Giovanni's gun shop about 25 years ago. He thought I looked like someone who was not buying or whatever and gave me a very rude 'bum's rush" out of his (EMPTY!!) store. Sorry for him, as I have spent prob $100,000 in shooting sports and outdoor activities since then. Some idiots just don't know how to run a business. They are closed now, no doubt.

I have had great luck with Steve's in Toronto, Cosmo Music in Vaughan, The Arts in Newmarket, and many many little mom and pop stores over the years. Luckily, the @$$holes are few and far between especially in the musician scene IMHO.

Be safe everybody!


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## Fuzzy dagger

I used to go into continental music back in the ‘70’s. I kind of remember the old dude, but I really remember the Chet Atkins super axe he had in there. It was one of the most beautiful guitars I’ve ever seen. I still think about it to this day.


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## Lutherieguy

I am glad they had something nice! But that is the trick right.. have something real and amazing that no one can afford, while selling questionable quality instruments to naïve buyers. Here is a real gem. Look at the lovely finish! Note the delicate way the tuners protrude through the rough holes in the headstock, or the artistry involved in screwing on (presumably) a wood slab neck with a single screw.. Who would not dream of a 'floating neck' joint like this on their own guitar. lol sigh. Probably some kind of kitsch collectible now! Baron guitars


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