# Propose a guitar for me ....



## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

So I am on the market for a new acoustic. I have a few criteria and must-haves.

What do you suggest that has all these? New guitar only.

$600 - $1000 range
OM size
14 frets
Non-cutaway
1 3/4" nut (flexible ... for flatpicking)
Solid B&S (mahogany or rosewood)
Solid spruce top - natural
No sunbursts or colors
No on-board pickup (unless it's a really good one)
No Martins or Taylors (I have a Martin and I don't like Taylors)

Anyone?


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Is this close? 

I didn't compare all the specs you listed...you can do that.

Good Luck with your search. 

Yamaha LS16 ARE Small Type Acoustic Guitar - Acoustic Guitars - Right Handed - Acoustic Guitars - Guitars & Amps | Cosmo Music


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## StratCat (Dec 30, 2013)

greco said:


> Is this close?
> 
> I didn't compare all the specs you listed...you can do that.
> 
> ...


+1 on Yamaha LS16


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## Larry (Sep 3, 2016)

12 stringer said:


> So I am on the market for a new acoustic. I have a few criteria and must-haves.
> 
> What do you suggest that has all these? New guitar only.
> 
> ...


I think the Biggest & Best Bang for your spending range is in the GODIN Family, look thru their website, ( Godin, Seagull, Simon & Patrick, Art & Luthrie )

YAMAHA has some fantastic sounding guitars in that price range also.

Happy Hunting,
Larry


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

I have a Yamaha LL16M. The Yamaha solid wood bodies are very nice guitars. I'm currently in the middle of a purge but my Yamaha will not be part of the purge. It is one of four that I am keeping. I highly recommend you give some Yamaha's a try. They do have a pickup, which I am not a fan of, but it doesn't seem to affect the acoustic sound. The pickup on mine is completely passive, no battery, no controls, nothing, just an under saddle piezo with a jack in the back strap button.

The Godin family would also be a good choice. My La Patrie Etude will also survive the purge.


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## bw66 (Dec 17, 2009)

Except for the 1-3/4" nut, you are looking for a Simon & Patrick Showcase series. IMHO, they are tthe best kept secret in acoustic guitars.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Does anyone in Canada sell Washburn anymore? They've got some cool stuff going on lately, but I never see them hanging in any stores.


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

bw66 said:


> Except for the 1-3/4" nut, you are looking for a Simon & Patrick Showcase series. IMHO, they are tthe best kept secret in acoustic guitars.


Showcase Rosewood Concert Hall...not sure about solid b/s but an excellent guitar nonetheless. The Seagull Concert Hall guitar is also excellent...not sure about your price criteria.


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## Guest (Feb 17, 2019)

Mooh said:


> not sure about your price criteria.





12 stringer said:


> $600 - $1000 range


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## Hammerhands (Dec 19, 2016)

If I was in Ontario I would own this one.

$700 if you were to have bought it today.

Yamaha FG-580.

There's a broken one someone is selling in Kingston.


(3 days offer) Yamaha FG 580 Acoustic Guitar | Guitars | City of Toronto | Kijiji


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

greco said:


> Is this close?
> 
> I didn't compare all the specs you listed...you can do that.
> 
> ...


Yeap. Very very close. I just need to find one in an Ottawa or Montreal store to go and try but a definite contender.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Hammerhands said:


> If I was in Ontario I would own this one.


As long as it doesn't need a neck reset, as many old Yamahas do. 
I have owned a few from that time and they all needed resets.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Mooh said:


> Showcase Rosewood Concert Hall...not sure about solid b/s but an excellent guitar nonetheless. The Seagull Concert Hall guitar is also excellent...not sure about your price criteria.


The Simon & Patrick Showcase is $1079 + tx. It has solid rosewood B&S no pick up. I have one in my sight to go try but a bit stiff money wise. I also have tried the Seagull Concert Hall (solid mahogany) with p/up. It was new but a B stock and at $800 it is a really guitar which is also in my sight.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Lincoln said:


> Does anyone in Canada sell Washburn anymore? They've got some cool stuff going on lately, but I never see them hanging in any stores.


There's a whole slew of them in Renfrew at Mill Music. Never could warm up to any of them, though.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Kerry Brown said:


> I have a Yamaha LL16M. The Yamaha solid wood bodies are very nice guitars. I'm currently in the middle of a purge but my Yamaha will not be part of the purge. It is one of four that I am keeping. I highly recommend you give some Yamaha's a try. They do have a pickup, which I am not a fan of, but it doesn't seem to affect the acoustic sound. The pickup on mine is completely passive, no battery, no controls, nothing, just an under saddle piezo with a jack in the back strap button.
> 
> The Godin family would also be a good choice. My La Patrie Etude will also survive the purge.


Are you referring to the SRT pick up? I am surprised you are not keen on it as they have a really good reputation and I would definitely consider a Yam ARE with one - although I have not tried one (yet). Agreed on the La Patrie Etude. I bought a used one for a couple hundred bucks and is it awesome.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

12 stringer said:


> Are you referring to the SRT pick up? I am surprised you are not keen on it as they have a really good reputation and I would definitely consider a Yam ARE with one - although I have not tried one (yet). Agreed on the La Patrie Etude. I bought a used one for a couple hundred bucks and is it awesome.


In order to get good sound with the SRT system you need to add a decent active DI. With a passive DI it is a horrible treble buzz/screech. I use a LR Baggs Venue DI and it sounds awesome but it added almost $500 to the cost of the guitar. At a minimum you’ll be spending $200 to $300 to get a decent sound from the pickup. I love the guitar. Mine is the LL16M with mahogany sides and back. The acoustic tone is deep and rich. Without a good DI the amplified tone is not. I use the guitar for open mic’s where you have no control over the PA. I get funny looks when I show up with my own DI and XLR cable but so far they’ve always let me plug it in.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Sigma


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Since we are avoiding the two big names, Have you looked at any Takamine? I've got a G series 12 string and it's a great guitar. Stable, good sounding, and trouble free.

Don't waste any time looking at Luna

Ibanez sound good plugged in, not as good acoustically though.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Kerry Brown said:


> ...Without a good DI the amplified tone is not. ...I get funny looks when I show up with my own DI and XLR cable but so far they’ve always let me plug it in.


I got the DI thing covered, thanks. You might be well served using one of these Shatten mini preamps for open mics as opposed to dragging a full blown DI. It's a mere $70 cdn and it's from an Ontario company which makes the HFN pickups which are all the rage these days (cheap and really good - a rare combo). That is what I plan to use in my next guitar.


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## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

I know the Godin brands are well though of particularly here in Canada and up until recently I would have recommended a Seagull but lately I have noticed the import Sigma guitars are giving outstanding tone and playability for less money and my budget minded recommendations have swung. I suggest giving them consideration. That said, it is hard to place a dollar value on supporting a Canadian company.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

I agree with many answers you got...

Taylor Academy ?


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## Guest (Feb 19, 2019)

mawmow said:


> Taylor Academy ?





12 stringer said:


> I don't like Taylors


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

mawmow said:


> I agree with many answers you got...
> 
> Taylor Academy ?



I'll pass. I had a Taylor once and became very frustrated with it over time so I got rid of it. They are grossly overpriced and overrated, but that's just me.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

The suggestions on the Yamaha, Seagull and Takamine I have to agree with. That Yamaha has sustain like crazy and just rings. I found it a little on the bright side for my liking but it may suit you to a tee. The problem may be the 1 3/4" nut. Some of the Seagulls are now 1.72 and 1.8". Both are close. Personally, I would prefer the 1.8" nut. I would add to the list an Alvarez AD-60 or 70. The 60 is mahogany b/s and the 70 is rosewood b/s. As for sound, the AD-60 is going to be a bit like a D-18 with a little more balanced tone and slightly less bass. The AD-70 I would describe as being a little softer with slightly less volume. I own an MD-60 wich is similar to the AD-60 but with solid mahogany b/s rather than the laminate. 

I know you said new but if you could find and MD-60 or MD-70 used in good condition, you should seriously take a look at them. .I will put them against any Martin. They are just plain fine guitars. It all depends on the tone you want. 

Happy hunting and let us know what you end up with.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Good choice if you’re looking for a dread. I am after an OM and I am keeping a semi-open eye out for Alvarez.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

12 stringer said:


> Good choice if you’re looking for a dread. I am after an OM and I am keeping a semi-open eye out for Alvarez.


Right! I forgot about that. What would an OM size be in the Alvarez line, a folk?


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Steadfastly said:


> Right! I forgot about that. What would an OM size be in the Alvarez line, a folk?


No, more like Auditorium or Concert I would think, if not OM (not a big Alvarez follower). Folk sized guitars are usually called that by pretty much all manufacturers, from what I have seen. Ditto Dreadnoughts. The confusing bit comes to OM-sized guitars. Many don't call them "OM". They have Grand Concert, Auditorium, Grand Auditorium, Concert Hall, Concert (not to mention OOO which is really, really close to OM), so "OM" can actually be a slew of names for more or less the same thing. Rather confusing at times.


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2019)




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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

12 stringer said:


> No, more like Auditorium or Concert I would think, if not OM (not a big Alvarez follower). Folk sized guitars are usually called that by pretty much all manufacturers, from what I have seen. Ditto Dreadnoughts. The confusing bit comes to OM-sized guitars. Many don't call them "OM". They have Grand Concert, Auditorium, Grand Auditorium, Concert Hall, Concert (not to mention OOO which is really, really close to OM), so "OM" can actually be a slew of names for more or less the same thing. Rather confusing at times.


Yes, there was a discussion of body sizes over on AGF the other day and it showed how confusing it is, trying to match sizes from one manufacturer to another. It seems this is one area where patents have made things difficult for buyers as standard sizing has gone out the window in many cases.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

Probably outside your price range but I find Larrivee L body guitars to be a very comfortable size. You may find a used on in your range.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

12 stringer said:


> No, more like Auditorium or Concert I would think, if not OM (not a big Alvarez follower). Folk sized guitars are usually called that by pretty much all manufacturers, from what I have seen. Ditto Dreadnoughts. The confusing bit comes to OM-sized guitars. Many don't call them "OM". They have Grand Concert, Auditorium, Grand Auditorium, Concert Hall, Concert (not to mention OOO which is really, really close to OM), so "OM" can actually be a slew of names for more or less the same thing. Rather confusing at times.


I think their parlour size is actually an OM. Here is a link you can check out. The MP series is the one you would be looking at.

Masterworks Series - Alvarez Guitars


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## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

Any luck on the guitar @12 stringer ?


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## brucew (Dec 30, 2017)

Great thread, thanks everyone.

edit: played a few guitars while on holiday, best playing one(suffered soundwise) was a 200.00 recording king parlour size. Thing played itself. Not much range to it, but it was a 200.00 guitar. No idea if there's others in the line that would suit the OP or not?


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Dorian2 said:


> Any luck on the guitar @12 stringer ?


I have a used Sigma OOOR-28V lined up to try next week. We’ll see how that goes. I cannot find any new or used LS16ARE Yamahas to try and the Seagulls are scarce as all get out too. I am not in a huge hurry so I might hold out a bit longer till something pops up.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

I'm surprised you are having a problem finding those Yammies and Seagulls. May I ask where you are living?


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Steadfastly said:


> I'm surprised you are having a problem finding those Yammies and Seagulls. May I ask where you are living?


Close enough to Ottawa and Montreal kind of thing. Saw one lonely Seagull in Ottawa but nothing else after visiting ALL the dealers. Montreal's next.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

12 stringer said:


> Close enough to Ottawa and Montreal kind of thing. Saw one lonely Seagull in Ottawa but nothing else after visiting ALL the dealers. Montreal's next.


I am really surprised you only found one Seagull. You should do much better in Montreal.


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## ottawa_adam (Feb 23, 2019)

12 stringer said:


> Close enough to Ottawa and Montreal kind of thing. Saw one lonely Seagull in Ottawa but nothing else after visiting ALL the dealers. Montreal's next.


I was in Steve's Music in Ottawa last week and they had lots of Seagulls in stock. I can't remember if they carry Yamaha there. Their web site may indicate.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Well, I got me new to me "Guit-R"... It has everything I was looking for - except - it has laminated rosewood as opposed to solid. Tried many, but ended up finding this one on kijiji, used but mint. It's a Sigma 000R-28V and it is a real beauty. Sounds and plays great and a mere $500! I plan on installing a Schatten HFN pick up in it and I have no doubt it's going to be as good as any of them high end guitars. Thanks for the suggestions, all.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

I think your choice was a very good one. Here is a video clip if anyone wants to hear one.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Steadfastly said:


> I think your choice was a very good one. Here is a video clip if anyone wants to hear one.


Thanks for this, Steadfastly. Yeap ... that's it, exactly. Sounds MUCH better live. I have been playing it the last few hours and I am stunned by it, really. I am mainly a flat picker with some fingerstyle thrown in (next to no strumming for me, though). It has Martin lights on now and they sound good but I am very partial to Elixir so they will be going on next. I looked at it up down and sideways and I swear, it looks like new. And, all for a lousy $500 (with hard shell case)! Bought is from a guitar teacher who really looks after his instruments and knows how to tweak them. He only sold it because he's in the midst of a separation (his loss, my gain,). I tried a $4700 Martin OM28 Custom the other day and, frankly, I just cannot hear a $4200 improvement. I love Martin guitars (I own one) but I have to say this Sigma is a hell of a bang for the buck. I am tickled pink right now!!!


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

12 stringer said:


> Thanks for this, Steadfastly. Yeap ... that's it, exactly. Sounds MUCH better live. I have been playing it the last few hours and I am stunned by it, really. I am mainly a flat picker with some fingerstyle thrown in (next to no strumming for me, though). It has Martin lights on now and they sound good but I am very partial to Elixir so they will be going on next. I looked at it up down and sideways and I swear, it looks like new. And, all for a lousy $500 (with hard shell case)! Bought is from a guitar teacher who really looks after his instruments and knows how to tweak them. He only sold it because he's in the midst of a separation (his loss, my gain,). I tried a $4700 Martin OM28 Custom the other day and, frankly, I just cannot hear a $4200 improvement. I love Martin guitars (I own one) but I have to say this Sigma is a hell of a bang for the buck.* I am tickled pink right now!!!*


Well, all I can say is you better stay out of any direct sunlight!


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## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

Glad you found what you were looking for.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Sigma guitars are good value.

I have a Sigma DR28V - it’s an HD28V copy which cost about as much as the tax on a real HD28V. If the Sigma was the only guitar that I had I really couldn’t complain too much.


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## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

Wardo said:


> Sigma guitars are good value.
> 
> I have a Sigma DR28V - it’s an HD28V copy which cost about as much as the tax on a real HD28V. If the Sigma was the only guitar that I had I really couldn’t complain too much.


Good point. And, since they are essentially the "same" guitar, how would you honestly rate them against each other if you did not know their price or their name. My point is, if you are made of money, go for the big names. If you are not (like me) you can do more than alright nowadays with terrific imports.


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