# Looking for help to decide what to buy



## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Hey fellow forum users!

I need your help!

I am in the process of creating a small band with some friends. It's nothing serious, we are mostly going to jam together, learn our instruments and show the others what we learned. We probably aren't going to gig, unless it's in a couple of years, when we'll be better (or at least decent) at playing.

So for now I'm looking for an amp. Since we'll only be jamming at a friend's place, I don't need a super expensive amp. The only problem is that I still need to have an amp that's loud enough to play with drums. I'm pretty new to amps, since I've played electric guitar without one for almost a year now.

My budget is about 600 CAD. I'm looking for an amp that could give me good sounds in the cleans but also in the more driven tones. Not really interested in playing super distorted sounds for now. + I may get into my school's jazz band next year, so I need something that could give me some warm smooth tones (I can get reverb from a pedal if there's a good amp with "meh" reverb that I should get)

I'd rather have my effects coming from pedals (the 600 is only for the amp. pedals will come later), so keep in mind I need a pedal friendly amp. With that said, I don't mind having the effects coming from the amp.

Solid-states, valves/tubes and Modelling amps are all welcome!

Thank you very much to everyone who helps!

P.S I've got a decent pair of arms, so if there's an amazing amp that's a bit on the heavier side, you can still tell me about it!


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## seadonkey (Feb 9, 2008)

My first thought would be to suggest a Rivera Clubster. Great cleans, good crunch. Plenty loud enough and if I remember correctly, a nice reverb. I sold mine a few years back for $600.

Rivera is a great tube amp that doesn't seem to hold a lot of value on the secondary market.

You could also look at getting a used Deluxe Reverb and just have your crunch come from a pedal.

Fender Prosonic is a great all in one amp as well. They can be found in your price range if your patient.

Lots of options out there on the used Market.


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## seadonkey (Feb 9, 2008)

*Here is a killer amp for $349. $349 at the London, ONT L&M. If you are interested you can get your local shop to do a store transfer so that you get free shipping. ***I am in no way affiliated with L&M***

Traynor YCV20WR
CUSTOM VALVE 20 WATT ALL-TUBE 1X12 GUITAR COMBO AMP - WINE RED*
Class "A" Cathode bias amplifier
DC filaments on preamp tubes eliminate hum
Fully regulated power supply with tube rectifier emulation
Long spring reverb
Classic Celestion G12M "Greenback" speaker
Wine Red leatherette finsh with oatmeal grille
Speaker jack and selectable defeat for disabling the internal speaker
D.I. Output for connections straight to the board
All plywood enclosure
Heavy gauge perforated grille with cloth cover
Custom design "Chicken Beak" knobs
*Sale Price: $349.00Original Price: $855.00*
Model: YCV20WR


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## colchar (May 22, 2010)

Yeah that Traynor would more than fit the bill.


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## seadonkey (Feb 9, 2008)




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## seadonkey (Feb 9, 2008)

The video above is the 40 watt version but the 20 watter is great too.



colchar said:


> Yeah that Traynor would more than fit the bill.


Yeah, and with G12-M Greenback I'd be all over it if i were in the market and on a budget.


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

seadonkey said:


> *Here is a killer amp for $349. $349 at the London, ONT L&M. If you are interested you can get your local shop to do a store transfer so that you get free shipping. ***I am in no way affiliated with L&M***
> 
> Traynor YCV20WR
> CUSTOM VALVE 20 WATT ALL-TUBE 1X12 GUITAR COMBO AMP - WINE RED*
> ...


Wow, thanks for the help! Took way less time than expected! I'm watching some videos on the amp and it sounds great!


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Fender hot rod, peavey classic 30/50 or delta blues, traynor ycv50 or YBA series, egnater rebel or renegade, jet city combo, roland jc-60, marshall dsl 40 (not the reissue), theres a ton to choose from.

Grab your guitar, hit some stores and try some gear.


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Budda said:


> Fender hot rod, peavey classic 30/50 or delta blues, traynor ycv50 or YBA series, egnater rebel or renegade, jet city combo, roland jc-60, marshall dsl 40 (not the reissue), theres a ton to choose from.
> 
> Grab your guitar, hit some stores and try some gear.


I appreciate the help, but all of the amps you listed are out of my price range. I'm looking for amps that will cost no more than 600-ish after shipping (if I need it), taxes, etc.


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## BSTheTech (Sep 30, 2015)

I have the ycv-20. I'd aim higher. 30-40 watts if you want to keep up with drums in a big room. Good amp otherwise.


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## BSTheTech (Sep 30, 2015)

Fender Blues Deville 4x10 seems like a great all around amp. This guy showcases guitars for Norm's. He's always playing through one and no matter what he plays it sounds great. 

"All the eq's at noon and just a bit of reverb".


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## BSTheTech (Sep 30, 2015)

Shpee said:


> I appreciate the help, but all of the amps you listed are out of my price range. I'm looking for amps that will cost no more than 600-ish after shipping (if I need it), taxes, etc.


Hold out for a deal, and keep saving. You're right on the border of junk and good stuff.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Get a 50 watt boss katana.


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

adcandour said:


> Get a 50 watt boss katana.


That's exactly what I was going to suggest. Or the Boss KATANA100 - 100watt, 1-12inch speaker. Reviews are really good on these. Look them up. 

In the same state of mind, there's also the Vox VT80+ Valvetronix to consider.

You might not want to bother with tubes, once you've tested those two.


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## Guest (Jul 5, 2017)

It really depends on your drummer. I have played with a few that are quieter, but most are loud. I would like to try a drummer with midi drums and see if the room volume could be super low. A 20watt tube amp won't keep up to most drummers as stated by others. Solid state amps need more wattage than tubes usually. If you are practicing with a drummer I recommend getting some musician's hearing protection. Most musicians develop tinnitus and/or hearing loss...


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## Guest (Jul 5, 2017)

Rent a few different ones over a 6 month span.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

seadonkey said:


> My first thought would be to suggest a Rivera Clubster. Great cleans, good crunch. Plenty loud enough and if I remember correctly, a nice reverb. I sold mine a few years back for $600.
> 
> Rivera is a great tube amp that doesn't seem to hold a lot of value on the secondary market.
> 
> ...


Agree with this recommendation but I think you're going to have a hard time finding a used one at that price. It's also heavy. If you're going to be lugging the amp around then I'd get a solid state. Everyone seems to love the new Katana and Fender GTs. You should explore those options.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

If a maxed out Traynor YCV20WR won't keep up to your drummer, I'd keep the amp and get a new drummer.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

Player99 said:


> If you are practicing with a drummer I recommend getting some musician's hearing protection. Most musicians develop tinnitus and/or hearing loss...


Good point. Years ago when we were playing on a small stage that our 5 piece band would barely fit on, I was seated playing my piano on the right hand side of the stage. I looked to my left and realised the drummers crash cymbol was about 6" from my left ear. Too this day, I can't understand why my hearing is still ok but hearing protection is a must. Even if it's just those cheap foam plugs. (which by the way, I would have paid $100 for at the last Tragically Hip concert I went to). Later on, when you've got little more cash, you can get those expensive one's like Budda has.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Shpee said:


> I appreciate the help, but all of the amps you listed are out of my price range. I'm looking for amps that will cost no more than 600-ish after shipping (if I need it), taxes, etc.


Aaah shucks, I forgot to preface my post with "buy used". All the amps mentioned should be doable on the used market with $600


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## Guest (Jul 5, 2017)

Guitar101 said:


> Good point. Years ago when we were playing on a small stage that our 5 piece band would barely fit on, I was seated playing my piano on the right hand side of the stage. I looked to my left and realised the drummers crash cymbol was about 6" from my left ear. Too this day, I can't understand why my hearing is still ok but hearing protection is a must. Even if it's just those cheap foam plugs. (which by the way, I would have paid $100 for at the last Tragically Hip concert I went to). Later on, when you've got little more cash, you can get those expensive one's like Budda has.


There are a number of low cost musician style earplugs available now.


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Player99 said:


> It really depends on your drummer. I have played with a few that are quieter, but most are loud. I would like to try a drummer with midi drums and see if the room volume could be super low. A 20watt tube amp won't keep up to most drummers as stated by others. Solid state amps need more wattage than tubes usually. If you are practicing with a drummer I recommend getting some musician's hearing protection. Most musicians develop tinnitus and/or hearing loss...


Hey, thanks for the tip! I don't want my hears going bad after some years. What do you recommend? Some ear filters by Fender and such?


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Earpeace is what I use. Note, my 40 watt Cube GX has no problem being heard over the drummer.


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Budda said:


> Aaah shucks, I forgot to preface my post with "buy used". All the amps mentioned should be doable on the used market with $600


I'm a bit scared of used gear, to be honest. I'm never lucky with used stuff, so I try to stay far from it.


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Many people talked about ear protection. What do you guys recommend?


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

So from what I can see in the conversation so far, if I choose a valve amp, I should get a used one, since my budget isn't enough to get good enough new valve amps. On the other hand, there are some solid-states that are in my price bracket that are pretty good for the price.


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

Yep, that's about it.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Shpee said:


> Many people talked about ear protection. What do you guys recommend?


Look a few posts up.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

I suggest a Peavey Classic 30. There's a couple in Montreal right now. I have one and have gigged with it and I've had no issues with it. 

Peavey Classic 30 - 400$ | amplificateurs, pédales | Ville de Montréal | Kijiji

Peavey Classic 30 | amplificateurs, pédales | Ville de Montréal | Kijiji


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Shpee said:


> I'm a bit scared of used gear, to be honest. I'm never lucky with used stuff, so I try to stay far from it.


Bring someone who has amp experience and knows what to look for. You can also buy used gear from stores which will have a limited warranty in most cases. 

As for earplugs, get molded ones once and never worry about it again.


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## Frenchy99 (Oct 15, 2016)

If you dont mind the weight, get a Traynor YGL Mark 3 212 combo

The only amp youll ever need !


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

Yep. Buy used. Save money. You'd be amazed at what you can get together for cheap. I'm running a vintage Fender tube amp, with a vintage Jensen speaker, in a modified vintage Fender cabinet, and all for under your budget.

I'd be looking at Traynor and Fender for tube amps. Also Peavey. Just note that the Hot Rod/ Blues Deluxe series are stupid loud. 

For non-tubes id be looking at Roland Cube, Boss Katana, and the Fender Mustang series


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

1SweetRide said:


> Look a few posts up.


Yeah, saw that right after writing the message haha. Thanks for the info!


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Chito said:


> I suggest a Peavey Classic 30. There's a couple in Montreal right now. I have one and have gigged with it and I've had no issues with it.
> 
> Peavey Classic 30 - 400$ | amplificateurs, pédales | Ville de Montréal | Kijiji
> 
> Peavey Classic 30 | amplificateurs, pédales | Ville de Montréal | Kijiji


Do you think this amp is loud enough to play over drums? My guess would be yes, since it has 30 watts and it's tube (does the number of tubes affect the volume?). But I wouldn't trust only my opinion/guess.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Yes, the number of tubes as well as tube type has an effect on what the output wattage will be.

30W can keep up with a drummer, but not all drummers. Also consider buying an amp stand (or making one) - fairly affordable, easy to move, and they really increase perceived volume. A lot of fender amps come with kickback legs, which are basically the same thing.

A classic 30 in decent condition for $400 is a good buy - got any friends who can check it out with you?

Store Specials - Long & McQuade Musical Instruments that should show you a traynor YGL2 at the top of the page for $575. It comes in a little over budget with shipping and taxes but would also provide what you're after.


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## Guest (Jul 5, 2017)

Shpee said:


> Hey, thanks for the tip! I don't want my hears going bad after some years. What do you recommend? Some ear filters by Fender and such?


So the difference between regular foam ones and musician earplugs is the flatter eq. The foam ones will reduce the lows, mids and highs at different levels so when you play or listen to music it sound weird because of this imbalance of noise reduction. The musician style plugs are supposed to have a flatter eq, so in theory it is more like just turning down the volume.

These ones were on Shark Tank recently: Home
Here they are on Amazon.ca Amazon.com: (As Seen on Shark Tank) Vibes Acoustic Filter Ear Plugs - High Fidelity Decibel Reducing EarPlugs for Live Music Concert Events- Helps Prevent Damaging Tinnitus - Ultra Comfortable Hearing Protection: Health & Personal Care
There are some others that show up there as well.

I have Docs Proplugs if you want to buy some. (I was selling earplugs a number of years ago and still have inventory.) There are 2 types, which I have both in most sizes.

There are some others but this is a good start. Buy a couple of sets so when you lose them or forget them you won't go without. Also buy a bunch of the foam earplugs. The good (but cheap) ones for industrial workers will sound like sh1t but knock out the most db.


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## Guest (Jul 5, 2017)

Also the old solid state Peavey Bandits are a great amp to start with. You can pick them up for as low as $150 -$200 bucks.

This type:


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

Shpee said:


> Do you think this amp is loud enough to play over drums? My guess would be yes, since it has 30 watts and it's tube (does the number of tubes affect the volume?). But I wouldn't trust only my opinion/guess.


Yes it would be. Even with a loud drummer. I gig with a 22 watt DRRI and it's loud enough for me to drown out the drummer if I wanted to. I've played with too many loud drummers that's why I'm now close to being deaf. LOL


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

Actually someone is selling a Traynor YCS50 here. I was very tempted to get it. That would be more than enough for what you need and that is an excellent price too.

FS/FT: - Traynor Custom Special 50 again


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Budda said:


> A classic 30 in decent condition for $400 is a good buy - got any friends who can check it out with you?


no one close to me, but I know some people who make a living out of guitar playing, so I guess I can find someone (if any of these people are willing to spend some time of their lives)


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Chito said:


> Actually someone is selling a Traynor YCS50 here. I was very tempted to get it. That would be more than enough for what you need and that is an excellent price too.
> 
> FS/FT: - Traynor Custom Special 50 again


Would love to talk to the guy to get to know the amp better, but I lack the privileges to talk to him.


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Just keep in mind that I need to be able to play at home on the amp too


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## Roryfan (Apr 19, 2010)

Here are some random musings:

Avoid any of the solidstate or hybrid Marshall amps at all cost, they sound like *a$$*

The OD channel on Fender Blues & Hot Rod Deluxe amps is garbage, but they are plenty loud, sound decent clean & take pedals fairly well. 

This being said, the Peavey Delta Blues series are as good or better at a lower price, I especially liked the 210 combo.

Unless your drummer is a John Boham wannabe, a 15W Class A amp will be plenty loud. Check out the Vox AC15 CC, Fender Blues Jr. & Orange Tiny Terror.

L&M offers an extended warranty if you're reluctant to buy used. FWIW reliability is a bit of a crapshoot with any modern circuit board amp, but you're north of $2K to get anything point-to-point, although they are easier to maintain & cheaper to repair.

Also, if you rent from L&M and end up liking the amp enough to buy it, you get 1/2 of the rental cost towards the purchase.

P.S. For maximum versatility the Traynor YBA1-MOD1 is hard to beat - straddles Fender & Marshall territory, the built in attenuator goes from 40W down to <1W


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## Roryfan (Apr 19, 2010)

BSTheTech said:


> Hold out for a deal, and keep saving. You're right on the border of junk and good stuff.


Yup. A used Fender Custom Vibrolux Reverb or Deluxe Reverb Reissue can be had for $800-900 and will meet all of your needs. You can also get into head/cab territory for that kind of dough. 

Don't forget that a more efficient speaker will be louder. I once replaced the stock Celestion Blue with a period-correct vintage Jensen (P12Q?) in a 5E3 clone & lost ~1/2 the volume.


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## Roryfan (Apr 19, 2010)

This should fit the bill, esp. with the attenuator for home use.

FS/FT: - Traynor Custom Special 50 again


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Roryfan said:


> This should fit the bill, esp. with the attenuator for home use.
> 
> FS/FT: - Traynor Custom Special 50 again


Yeah, it's an interesting offer, but I don't have the necessary privileges to talk to the guy apparently... (is it because I'm not gold, which I have no idea what that is, btw)


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

small question about tubes: do you have to change them often? if so, that could be a deal breaker for me. I'm not yet old enough to work, so that means I only have money around twice a year. Plus, if an amp needs 4 tubes or even more, that's almost 75$ per times the tubes "blow up"!


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## LexxM3 (Oct 12, 2009)

Shpee said:


> Would love to talk to the guy to get to know the amp better, but I lack the privileges to talk to him.


Send @vokey design a PM (private message). He's a solid guy and you can't go wrong with that deal. Only challenge will be getting the amp to you: you're in Montreal, he is near Kitchener. Perhaps another member will help if they happen to be travelling that route.


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## Roryfan (Apr 19, 2010)

You can't post in the F/S section but you can send him a private msg. 

Unless there's an issue with the amp (i.e. an amp that is biased too hot will burn through tubes quicker, esp. EL84s), tubes don't need to be changed that often, depends on how many hours you play. I have some amps from the 60s that still have what appear to be the original tubes.

EF86 preamp tubes (found in many Vox amps) sound great but can be finicky. 

Your best bet is to contact www.thetubestore.com and ask them for advice to find a good quality tube that will last. JJs sound good & seem to be decent bang for the buck.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

I'm not sure what drummers you guys are playing with that 30 won't cut it.

I played for years with a hard hitting drummer with a Twin set at 25 watts, loads of volume.
The last band I was in, much quieter drummer/band and the 15 watt YGL1 was lots.

That YGL2 linked above would be more than enough, good clean platform.
YGL1s will run around $400 used, they're $700 new.

The Twin still has it's original tubes, but there was an issue last time it was used.
Years of use with that amp, many hours on those tubes.

The YGL1 has it's original tubes, used that for almost three years with the last band.

Probably regular gigging musicians would change tubes out yearly, or sooner.
So plenty of life with tubes, though the reliability has waned in the latest production tubes.
Buy tubes off a reputable dealer, or at least have been tested.
The Tubestore was linked above, you can search tube sets for a lot of amps.

Check L&Ms "Deal Center", there could be something in there.
Sale

Good luck in your hunt!


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## vokey design (Oct 24, 2006)

Shpee said:


> Would love to talk to the guy to get to know the amp better, but I lack the privileges to talk to him.


Talk away 
Pm sent


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Shpee said:


> small question about tubes: do you have to change them often? if so, that could be a deal breaker for me. I'm not yet old enough to work, so that means I only have money around twice a year. Plus, if an amp needs 4 tubes or even more, that's almost 75$ per times the tubes "blow up"!


There are two major 'types' of tubes in the amp, pre-amp tubes (most often 12AX7) and power tubes (the larger ones).

The only tubes that wear out are the power tubes. And you've got to work them hard regularly to wear them out in less then a year. Like regular a-few-times-a-week gigging at bar levels. 

The pre-amp tubes don't wear out from playing - they can easily last 40 or 50 years, but physical handling is hard on them (all tubes, really - and especially the much rarer EF86 tubes). If you have roadies throwing your stuff around, you may end up with microphonic preamp tubes that will need occasional replacement. But if you move your own gear, they will last a very long time. Lots of people like to try different pre-amp tubes because they slightly change the sound of your amp, especially in certain positions (the first pre-amp gain stage). 

Don't worry too much about the long term costs of a tube amp. If you get a reputable amp (Traynor, Fender, etc), you will want one or two spare pre-amp tubes and a spare set of power tubes, but that will most likely be all you need for 5 to 10 years. Unless you play a lot, in which case, it is worth the expense anyways. You don't need to eat if you're a hardcore musician.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

One of our members has a vintage traynor for sale in quebec as well.


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## Shpee (Jul 4, 2017)

Thanks to everyone for the help, but I may stop looking for an amp for now. I know someone who owns a studio, so I'll probably be trying some amps there (even though they're probably going to be triple my price range). Point of the Reply here is that I wont need an amp anymore, because I'll have access to some. Everything you guys said helped me a lot and I hope I can remember all this information when I'll need to buy my first amp. If I don't remember, well I guess I'll have to come back


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Good luck! No need to be a stranger.


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