# Well, I just got ripped off on kijiji. Figured I'd at least post a buyer-beware...



## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

I bought what was supposed to be a vintage Boss DS-1, long dash, silver screw. Stupidly, took the seller at his word, so didn't take a close look while there and didn't test it. Turns out the internals have been heavily modded, and very poorly at that. I paid a bunch of money for a pedal that's essentially worthless.

I've contacted the seller and he's wholly unapologetic. It looks like he's looking to buy or trade for some vintage Traynor gear, so if you're a seller, beware as well.

Here's his current listings: http://toronto.kijiji.ca/c-PostersOtherAds-W0QQUserIdZ14413482

I'm tempted to post his name and address, but I'm worried that might violate forum rules, I dunno. PM me if you're interested.

Oh well, you live you learn.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

Yep, I would stay away from posting any personal information


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## Voxguy76 (Aug 23, 2006)

I see he's selling an old Boss CS-1 and oddly enough he mentions in the ad it is all original and not been modded. Was that stated in his ad for the DS-1 too? Either way that's a really shady thing to do. Does he even acknowledge it's been modded?


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

I can't remember the exact wording of his ad (now deleted), but I did find this text cached on google, which is from his post. Externally, the pedal is "mint", and thus I assumed internally as well. He didn't outright say the pedal wasn't modded, but I thought that was implied with "mint". Had I realized he had another Boss for sale, where he specifically states that it hasn't been modded, then perhaps I would have become suspicious.

Here's the cached text:

_"_Up for sale... Vintage MINT condition Boss Distortion DS-1 Pedal Black Label, Made In Japan LONG-DASH DS-1 Logo.... early version Rare... SILVER SCREW s/n 9300 .... April, 1980 (made from 1978 to present) works perfectly... no issues at all no box, manual or adapter *SEE " View Poster's Other Ads " FOR Additional Equipment for Sale_*"*_


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

"mint condition", "works perfectly" and "no issues" are intentionally deceptive IMO.

I would at least contact him from another covert email address and ask him to meet you at a location a distance from his home to purchase one of his items...then not show up.

Sometimes...I have daydreams of lofting rocks through the windows of people like him (while wearing gloves and something that preserves the anonymity of my identity)...not that I am suggesting anything like that.


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## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

is this guy also selling an Epiphone Elitist LP?? There's a guy who has one listed but the photo isn't of an Elitist...and wont send me better pics...I'm skeptical

Buyer beware on Kijiji. Not to add to paranoia, but lets not forget Tim Bosma. Gonna buy or sell high dollar stuff? Take a buddy with you if anything feels off


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

mint implies unmodified. report him to kijiji as fraud. send him an email and tell him you have a cached copy of the ad, and you know his address. see if he wants to make good after that.


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## Guest (Dec 2, 2013)

or post a 'beware' ad on kijiji. 
I've seen others who do this.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

Kijiji is rancid with thief's


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

All good advice, thanks guys.

I'm not sure I want to go any further than at least warning my fellow GCers. It gives you good guys a heads up, and me a place to vent a little.

I should have been more cautious. I'll have to eat a few bucks, but at least it was a relatively cheap lesson. I'll be more careful in the future!


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Sorry about that Clean Channel.

I'm one of those people who you might say are easily fooled.

Once.

That's because I assume everyone is being honest until I have reason to think otherwise.

I don't often deal with someone a second time if they screw me and I do have my network. Rip off tendencies, like any shitty characteristic will quickly destroy a reputation.


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## Morkolo (Dec 9, 2010)

Sorry to hear about that Clean Channel, your topic only makes me more weary of an ad that I'm trying to get a hold of more though. I can only get vague answers and blurry pictures for anything I ask except for his price, wouldn't bother me so much if it was local but I'm looking at a 7 hour drive one way just to look at the thing. I might have to pass on this one.


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## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

How does it sound? Any gut shots?


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

LydianGuitars said:


> How does it sound? Any gut shots?


Good questions! I actually unplugged until I coud be sure what voltage it takes. But I did snap some gut shots and head over to the Boss forum. Here's the thread: http://www.stompboxzone.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2672&sid=a19e2dc7f5d36e9f7076bff4812e67cc

Here are the gut shots for reference:

What a MIJ DS-1 should look like:










What this one looks like:


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

Sorry to hear about your experience. I had one experience with kijiji when I bought a set of congas. Never bought anything again in kijiji after that. Pretty much all of my dealings buying used gear in the last few years have been here at GC.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

That sucks. I got burnt with an Armani suit once (yeah, I know). Now I really investigate any serious purchases.

I think it's time we start a gang called the KILLjijis. I'm willing to head the Toronto chapter. 

We swarm. Beat the perp with old shitty guitars and walk away.







Of course, I'm kidding - we don't own shitty guitars


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## TheRumRunner (Sep 29, 2011)

I've had dealings with this dude, he is the biggest pain in the ass I've ever seen. I was trying to help him when he posted a "looking for a YBA" on kijiji. I had just traded one away and I knew that the new owner "might" be willing to sell it. This dude hounded me and my friend for over two weeks with like 6 emails a day, question after question after question. 

I don't mind posting his email address so that he can get his bad karma fill.

DW


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

bastard, bastard, bastard. "Mint" means just that, exceptional original condition. Anything other than that is fraud.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Over on the diystompbox forum I coined the term B.U.M. syndrome: Blind Urge to Mod. People get a pedal, get consumed by the very notion of the _possibility_ of modding, and start by asking "I just bought a XXX. What mods can I do?", as if there is something implicitly *wrong* about a pedal that thousands of folks have also purchased and used, as is, with complete customer satisfaction.

For all you know, the guy may have attempted to do just that, and either botched it, or decided it wasn't any better, and done a crappy job re-installing what was there in the first place. I'm not rushing to the guy's defense, because he could have at least said it was tinkered with and restored. But I *am* saying that there are plenty of guys out there who think that because they took the parts out, sloppily, and then put them back in, just as sloppily, that the thing is still "vintage" and "mint". It may well still BE "vintage", but if the guy has placed the circuit at any risk by virtue of that monkeying around, YOU should not be paying collectible prices for it.

And while I don't want to kick anyone while they're down, one shouldn't get sucked into the vintage thing unless you know exactly what to look for, and why it matters. The DS-1 ain't all that. I just hope the sting only had two digits attached to it and not 3.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

I'm sorry you didn't get what you were expecting from the ad. The only part that he had right was "rare". It's very rare; it's one of a kind. 

At least I hope you can use it and find that it works for you.


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## puckhead (Sep 8, 2008)

smorgdonkey said:


> I would at least contact him from another covert email address and ask him to meet you at a location a distance from his home to purchase one of his items...then not show up.


first thing I thought of as well. at least cost him some time and gas.


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

TheRumRunner said:


> I've had dealings with this dude, he is the biggest pain in the ass I've ever seen. I was trying to help him when he posted a "looking for a YBA" on kijiji. I had just traded one away and I knew that the new owner "might" be willing to sell it. This dude hounded me and my friend for over two weeks with like 6 emails a day, question after question after question.
> 
> I don't mind posting his email address so that he can get his bad karma fill.
> 
> DW


Damn, didn't take long to find someone else right here on GC who's also earned a sharp pain in the ass after dealing with this guy. 

Thanks again for all the kind posts fellas, it takes plenty of the sting off my botched kijiji deal. This actually ended up being a kinda fun thread!

When all's said and done, it was just $135 bucks, so nothing to lose sleep over. Now if it was over $1000+ amp or something, I'd really be losing my s#!t right now!


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

Clean Channel said:


> Damn, didn't take long to find someone else right here on GC who's also earned a sharp pain in the ass after dealing with this guy.
> 
> Thanks again for all the kind posts fellas, it takes plenty of the sting off my botched kijiji deal. This actually ended up being a kinda fun thread!
> 
> When all's said and done, it was just $135 bucks, so nothing to lose sleep over. Now if it was over $1000+ amp or something, I'd really be losing my s#!t right now!


ya small world eh. I have done ok buying on Kijiji. I haven't bought much music gear but have killed it with sailboats... but ya gotta know what you are buying.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Very sorry to hear this Clean Channel. 

Send me a PM as I'd like to send you some "strings" to help relieve the pain and frustration of the "sting".

Cheers

Dave


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Now that I'm looking at the gutshots, the seller actually improved the pedal. Can't see the copper side in the pics, so I have no idea what sort of solder job was done, but from the component side, the essentials are all still there. What he's done is to replace many of the original poly film caps with another type of plastic cap (I'm guessing probably the same sort that Keeley or Monte Allums would use for whatever reasons), and also stick in an LED in place of one of the clipping diode to give it a little more dynamic feel. I can't say for sure whose specific set of mods he's done, but it appears he's done some set of mods that he's found on-line or had someone do for him. Given that he shelled out money for that, he probably feels little hesitation in charging you as if it was a collectible. So, not a thief, but more than a little deceptive and inconsiderate.

You might even contact the seller and ask whose mods were done to the pedal. Monte Allums charges between $22 and $28 for the parts, and Keeley charges $75 to actually DO the mods. Admittedly, $135 for a measley DS-1 is a little pricey, considering what they go for new. But if he HAD gotten Keeley mods done, knock $75 off what you paid. You may have actually gotten a bargain. A frustrating one, but the sort of thing that, if you could detail or pitch the mods that HADS been done, you could turn around and fetch your purchase price if you don't like the pedal.

If it's a sow's ear, then it's a sow's ear. I'm just trying to see if there's some silk there.


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## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

mhammer said:


> and also stick in an LED in place of one of the clipping diode to give it a little more dynamic feel.


... but not all LEDs are created equal. Depending on manufacturer, vintage and color, the forward dropping voltage can change a lot.


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

mhammer said:


> Now that I'm looking at the gutshots, the seller actually improved the pedal. Can't see the copper side in the pics, so I have no idea what sort of solder job was done, but from the component side, the essentials are all still there. What he's done is to replace many of the original poly film caps with another type of plastic cap (I'm guessing probably the same sort that Keeley or Monte Allums would use for whatever reasons), and also stick in an LED in place of one of the clipping diode to give it a little more dynamic feel. I can't say for sure whose specific set of mods he's done, but it appears he's done some set of mods that he's found on-line or had someone do for him. Given that he shelled out money for that, he probably feels little hesitation in charging you as if it was a collectible. So, not a thief, but more than a little deceptive and inconsiderate.
> 
> You might even contact the seller and ask whose mods were done to the pedal. Monte Allums charges between $22 and $28 for the parts, and Keeley charges $75 to actually DO the mods. Admittedly, $135 for a measley DS-1 is a little pricey, considering what they go for new. But if he HAD gotten Keeley mods done, knock $75 off what you paid. You may have actually gotten a bargain. A frustrating one, but the sort of thing that, if you could detail or pitch the mods that HADS been done, you could turn around and fetch your purchase price if you don't like the pedal.
> 
> If it's a sow's ear, then it's a sow's ear. I'm just trying to see if there's some silk there.


Laurie is a well-know Boss aficionado (Roland even did this article about him: http://www.roland.ca/default.asp?c=277), and also he's also the one who started the Dingotone Pedals. Here's his assessment of the modifications done:

_Poly caps and LED clipper obviously. Interesting that they didn't change Q9. It is right in the signal path and leaving it kind of (but not completely) negates changing all the others._

_It's hard to tell from the pic but the LED could be around the wrong way... making it irrelevant. Is the flat of the LED closest to Q7 (hard to see - use a magnifier - one of the sides will have a small flat area)? If so the LED is around the wrong way. This would make it in the same direction as the diode and the diode will clip much earlier than the LED, and there would be no clipping on the other half of the waveform making this pedal very harsh. Does it light up with a big chord and distortion on full (it should)? This is a common mistake made by amateur modders (this pedal was done by one)._

_No other mods that I can see._

_A couple of those solder joints look really crappy... one (near pad 8) is almost certainly dry. _

_This is a VERY poor job and should really be fixed.
_
In some happy news, one of the other Boss experts on there (he mods Boss pedals as a side gig) has generously offered to return the pedal to original condition free of charge! So it looks like I may get my MIJ DS-1 after all!


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## Guest (Dec 3, 2013)

That sucks.

Other than the LED in place of a diode for what I'm guessing is an assymetrical clipping mod at D4, and the caps being orange poly instead of green mylar or aluminium electrolytics, what's different? Resistor values look the same across the board. Are the cap values off from the mylar or aluminium counterparts? I'm going blind in my old age...

Edit: read through to Mark's second post. I don't disagree these screw up the mint-ness of it. But they look like reasonable tweaks and like Mark said: unless the other side shows a soldering job from hell, they're done clean and neat.

Edit 2: I think your pal's call on the solder being dry a little strange and I wouldn't call the mod job "VERY poor" either (caveat: I haven't seen the other side of the board, but it looks fine from the side you posted). Honestly, I'd be more suspect of your quoted expert and his flip visual inspection than whoever did the mods!


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## Guest (Dec 3, 2013)

greco said:


> Very sorry to hear this Clean Channel.
> 
> Send me a PM as I'd like to send you some "strings" to help relieve the pain and frustration of the "sting".
> 
> ...


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

greco said:


> Very sorry to hear this Clean Channel.
> 
> Send me a PM as I'd like to send you some "strings" to help relieve the pain and frustration of the "sting".
> 
> ...


Very kind Dave, but you've already helped me more than I could have ever hoped in the past. If it wasn't for your help, I wouldn't have my PN-2, which LOVE and use constantly!


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

adcandour said:


> That sucks. I got burnt with an Armani suit once (yeah, I know). Now I really investigate any serious purchases.
> 
> I think it's time we start a gang called the KILLjijis. I'm willing to head the Toronto chapter.
> 
> ...


i dont get the part where guys are willing to just let it go. if you lnow where he lives, even if you are afraid of him you can throw a brick through his window and drive off. you wont never see me make a post where somebody burns me and i let it slide. i dont care how long it takes.


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

Wow, I was close to contacting him about the 7027s he is selling. Thanks for the heads up.

TG


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

As an addendum, there is no a priori reason why the added LED _ought_ to light up. It _might_, but it can still function as a clipping diode with a higher threshold, whether it is efficient enough to light up with small voltage/current, or not.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

cheezyridr said:


> i dont get the part where guys are willing to just let it go. if you lnow where he lives, even if you are afraid of him you can throw a brick through his window and drive off. you wont never see me make a post where somebody burns me and i let it slide. i dont care how long it takes.


I hope you were kidding. Something like this really isn't worth violence. Aside from the fact that throwing a brick through his window is a criminal act regardless of what the reason is, its very likely that you'd hit someone else innocent inside the house. I think the OP has it right to take some of the responsibility that he didn't pay as close attention as he should have.


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## Clean Channel (Apr 18, 2011)

cheezyridr said:


> i dont get the part where guys are willing to just let it go. if you lnow where he lives, even if you are afraid of him you can throw a brick through his window and drive off. you wont never see me make a post where somebody burns me and i let it slide. i dont care how long it takes.


Over the past several years I've managed to snag countless deals on craigslist and kijiji. I know however that by taking this route I sacrifice the buyer protection I can expect from acquiring new or used equipment at reputable retail shops. Eventually I'm gonna get burned somewhere, and it's a risk that I knowingly take. In the end, I have to accept that any bad deal going to be, at least in part, the fault of my lack of due diligence.

Escalating this deal-gone-bad with some kind of direct retaliation or get-even mentality only wastes more of my time and energy, and runs the risk of starting some kind of war with this stranger, who might very well be a bigger nut-job than any of us. 

I try to remember that in life you gotta take the good with the bad, and there ain't no benefit to sweatin' the small stuff.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Clean Channel said:


> Over the past several years I've managed to snag countless deals on craigslist and kijiji. I know however that by taking this route I sacrifice the buyer protection I can expect from acquiring new or used equipment at reputable retail shops. Eventually I'm gonna get burned somewhere, and it's a risk that I knowingly take. In the end, I have to accept that any bad deal going to be, at least in part, the fault of my lack of due diligence.
> 
> Escalating this deal-gone-bad with some kind of direct retaliation or get-even mentality on wastes more of my time and energy, and runs the risk of starting some kind of war with this stranger, who might very well be a bigger nut-job than any of us.
> 
> I try to remember that in life you gotta take the good with the bad, and there ain't no benefit to sweatin' the small stuff.



Don't sweat the petty stuff and don't pet the sweaty stuff?


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

I found an ad on kijiji today and I was interested in the merchandise. 

I asked three specific questions.

Three.

The seller replied back with the answer to one of the questions.

One.

When people are that ignorant/stupid/uninterested in what a potential buyer is questioning, it just isn't worth my time. Answering one of my three questions and then finishing off by saying 'drop by' doesn't even come close to take me from 'interested' to 'sale' - I could see it if the seller was down the street but the seller is in another town so to speak.The other 2 questions were specific but the seller should have been able to answer them off the top of his head.

You'd think that this close to Christmas, people would actually be interested in selling their items. My contact emails in no way can be mistaken for a typical kijiji tire kicker. Oh well...thing is, I can buy anywhere but this guy will probably still have his stuff for months.


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## Roryfan (Apr 19, 2010)

Milkman said:


> Don't sweat the petty stuff and don't pet the sweaty stuff?


If it's not getting sweaty then you're not petting it right.


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