# Notre Dame Cathedral, Paris, France is burning



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

This is so sad.


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

not just burning but burned down


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Error...tried to post media unsuccessfully


----------



## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

900 years old. It's a sad day in Paris.


----------



## JazzyT (Nov 1, 2017)

I know it's historic and beautiful, but I have to keep it real. Religion is one of Man's big mistakes. It's time to move on.


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

JazzyT said:


> I know it's historic and beautiful, but I have to keep it rea;. Religion is one of Man's big mistakes. It's time to move on.


easy big shooter, its a historical building,., Jesus doesn't live there.


----------



## JazzyT (Nov 1, 2017)

vadsy said:


> easy big shooter, its a historical building,., Jesus doesn't live there.


See, even you have heard of him!


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

JazzyT said:


> I know it's historic and beautiful, but I have to keep it rea;. Religion is one of Man's big mistakes. It's time to move on.


You don't have to view it through a religion lens. It's a magnificent piece of architecture that people from all walks of life and religious backgrounds appreciate. Moreover, how many buildings are there on this continent that are 900 years old? It's history. That it's also a church is secondary.


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

mhammer said:


> You don't have to view it through a religion lens.





mhammer said:


> That it's also a church is secondary.


 @mhammer Thanks very much for these statements. 
That is how I am hoping most "see" this

I don't want this thread progress into some religious debate and then end up "locked" by admin.


----------



## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

What a tremendous historical loss


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

A catastrophic fire engulfed the upper reaches of Paris' soaring Notre Dame Cathedral as it was undergoing renovations Monday, threatening one of the greatest architectural treasures of the Western world as tourists and Parisians looked on aghast from the streets below.

The blaze collapsed the cathedral's spire and spread to one of its landmark rectangular towers, but Paris fire chief Jean-Claude Gallet said the church's structure had been saved after firefighters managed to stop the fire spreading to the northern belfry. The 12th-century cathedral is home to incalculable works of art and is one of the world's most famous tourist attractions, immortalized by Victor Hugo's 1831 novel "The Hunchback of Notre Dame."

The exact cause of the blaze was not known, but French media quoted the Paris fire brigade as saying the fire is "potentially linked" to a 6 million-euro ($6.8 million) renovation project on the church's spire and its 250 tons of lead. The Paris prosecutors' office ruled out arson and possible terror-related motives, and said it was treating it as an accident.


----------



## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

My kids have been there, so I texted them this afternoon as soon as I heard and they were already aware and shaken. I wish I could hug them from here.
The place makes an impact on people.


----------



## BSTheTech (Sep 30, 2015)

I never got there. Was hoping to go next year. I didn’t see the point either until I saw it’s little brother in Montreal. A friend dragged me in and we were both speechless. I’m now looking forward to being speechless again in Italy and Greece this May.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

greco said:


> A catastrophic fire engulfed the upper reaches of Paris' soaring Notre Dame Cathedral as it was undergoing renovations Monday, threatening one of the greatest architectural treasures of the Western world as tourists and Parisians looked on aghast from the streets below.
> 
> The blaze collapsed the cathedral's spire and spread to one of its landmark rectangular towers, but Paris fire chief Jean-Claude Gallet said the church's structure had been saved after firefighters managed to stop the fire spreading to the northern belfry. The 12th-century cathedral is home to incalculable works of art and is one of the world's most famous tourist attractions, immortalized by Victor Hugo's 1831 novel "The Hunchback of Notre Dame."
> 
> The exact cause of the blaze was not known, but French media quoted the Paris fire brigade as saying the fire is "potentially linked" to a 6 million-euro ($6.8 million) renovation project on the church's spire and its 250 tons of lead. The Paris prosecutors' office ruled out arson and possible terror-related motives, and said it was treating it as an accident.


Though certainly not quite the incalculable loss that Notre Dame is, we had a substantial blaze in an old portion of the By Ward Market last week. And, like the renovation of Notre Dame, there were repairs being done to the roof of the restaurant that was destroyed. The materials up on that roof were flammable, and heat is involved in the use of those flammable materials. Investigators ruled it an accident.

I hope both of these tragedies make the folks working on the restoration of the Centre Block here attentive to their use and storage of any flammable materials.

And even if one harbours no great love for "the Church", when you see buildings of that age, you're immediately struck by the level of detail and sheer number of tradesmen and craftsmen required to build it, and the incredible attention to detail by architects who did not have benefit of even a Dollarama calculator, let alone 3-D modelling software. Generally the first question to pop into your head is "How on earth did they DO that?", the second is often "How did they manage to coordinate all the folks involved?", and the third is usually "How did they afford that?".


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

greco said:


> @mhammer Thanks very much for these statements.
> That is how I am hoping most "see" this
> 
> I don't want this thread progress into some religious debate and then end up "locked" by admin.


he basically said what I did, lets give a little credit where its due, he just got long winded which he tends to do.

no admins, so no locks. don't worry about it


----------



## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

mhammer said:


> You don't have to view it through a religion lens. It's a magnificent piece of architecture that people from all walks of life and religious backgrounds appreciate. Moreover, how many buildings are there on this continent that are 900 years old? It's history. That it's also a church is secondary.


My views on religion belong in another forum entirely, but I stand with Mark's sentiment. 

That building embodies some of the finest architecture, art, and craftsmanship in the history of civilization.


----------



## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

That sucks.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

It's a funny thing about historic structures. We value them because they are old, but at the same time, because they have been around for so long we tend to think of them as somehow indestructible, take them for granted, and let them lapse into disrepair. And when they reach a point of desperately needing repair, we hem and haw because we haven't spent very much on them over the years, and the repair bill strikes us as prohibitively expensive. In one sense, I don't blame current citizens for asking "It's going to cost HOW much?". After all, they didn't ask to have a historic building that needed expensive repairs and restoration; they just inheritted the tab. On the other hand, it costs money to have heritage and history, and when your heritage and history gets scrubbed clean, it's easy to feel lost and floating. Frankly, it costs money to have roots.

Interesting short video clip regarding the pre-fire state of Notre Dame and how badly it needed restoration work: (https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-43258266/notre-dame-cracks-in-the-cathedral)


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

I've walked its halls, as for future generations.,. they can take a virtual tour on their phones.

in the meantime..,


----------



## Guest (Apr 16, 2019)

vadsy said:


> he basically said what I did, lets give a little credit where its due, he just got long winded which he tends to do.


Feeling a little milkmanish are you?


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

laristotle said:


> Feeling a little milkmanish are you?


colour me confused


----------



## Jim DaddyO (Mar 20, 2009)

Not many buildings made in the last 100 years will last that long. The time, skill, and craftsmanship, all done by hand, can never be equalled. The skills of that era is pretty much lost to time.


----------



## keto (May 23, 2006)

It happens I like historical fiction (Edward Rutherford anyone?), and he and others have told in great detail essentially what you also said very well. It’s basically almost unthinkable in modern day manpower terms to begin to imagine.





mhammer said:


> Though certainly not quite the incalculable loss that Notre Dame is, we had a substantial blaze in an old portion of the By Ward Market last week. And, like the renovation of Notre Dame, there were repairs being done to the roof of the restaurant that was destroyed. The materials up on that roof were flammable, and heat is involved in the use of those flammable materials. Investigators ruled it an accident.
> 
> I hope both of these tragedies make the folks working on the restoration of the Centre Block here attentive to their use and storage of any flammable materials.
> 
> And even if one harbours no great love for "the Church", when you see buildings of that age, you're immediately struck by the level of detail and sheer number of tradesmen and craftsmen required to build it, and the incredible attention to detail by architects who did not have benefit of even a Dollarama calculator, let alone 3-D modelling software. Generally the first question to pop into your head is "How on earth did they DO that?", the second is often "How did they manage to coordinate all the folks involved?", and the third is usually "How did they afford that?".


----------



## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

mhammer said:


> It's a funny thing about historic structures. We value them because they are old, but at the same time, because they have been around for so long we tend to think of them as somehow indestructible, take them for granted, and let them lapse into disrepair. And when they reach a point of desperately needing repair, we hem and haw because we haven't spent very much on them over the years, and the repair bill strikes us as prohibitively expensive. In one sense, I don't blame current citizens for asking "It's going to cost HOW much?". After all, they didn't ask to have a historic building that needed expensive repairs and restoration; they just inheritted the tab. On the other hand, it costs money to have heritage and history, and when your heritage and history gets scrubbed clean, it's easy to feel lost and floating. Frankly, it costs money to have roots.
> 
> Interesting short video clip regarding the pre-fire state of Notre Dame and how badly it needed restoration work: (https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-43258266/notre-dame-cracks-in-the-cathedral)


The Nova Scotia Agricultural College also burnt as the result of a roofing restoration accident.


----------



## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Glad I have memories and picture of it from my time in Paris. If this is another fire caused by construction workers it will be the third one that made the news this week.


----------



## Jim DaddyO (Mar 20, 2009)

French president Macron is saying they will rebuild (and asking for international aid. It is a UNESCO world heritage site). That is going to be a tall order as some of the wood in the original structure were nearly 1000 year old trees when they were cut. Not many of them to be found these days. Then the skills to work them to the beauty that they had become may be just as rare as the wood itself.


----------



## 12 stringer (Jan 5, 2019)

I remember being there in the early 70s and being mesmerized and humbled just thinking of the history 800+ years make. A very sad day indeed - religious or not.


----------



## Frenchy99 (Oct 15, 2016)

Sad... so very sad...


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

While very sad, this isn't a life-changing event except for a very small portion of Paris residents. It will hit tourism far harder than the locals.

The bar in my little hometown burned down a few years ago. It was the only bar in town - and for about 30 miles. That is a tragedy for a significantly larger portion of the population there. And no 'Unesco' accreditation or anything, so no one's lining up to repair it or build another one. 



vadsy said:


> easy big shooter, its a historical building,., Jesus doesn't live there.


But what about Quasimodo? Why does no one care about those that can't stand up for themselves. Well, stand up straight, in any case.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

High/Deaf said:


> The bar in my little hometown burned down a few years ago. It was the only bar in town - and for about 30 miles. That is a tragedy for a significantly larger portion of the population there. And no 'Unesco' accreditation or anything, so no one's lining up to repair it or build another one.


Every community, no matter how small or insignificant (for the rest of the world) has a "place", whether a building, a square, a store, a park, or just a vacant lot used for playing games, that holds special memories and significance for them. Sometimes it's what makes where you live special, and gives it a sense of identity. And when they disappear, whether by structural decay, natural disaster, industrial accident, deliberate demolition, or simply developers, as Ray Davies says "Part of my childhood died".


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

mhammer said:


> Every community, no matter how small or insignificant (for the rest of the world) has a "place", whether a building, a square, a store, a park, or just a vacant lot used for playing games, that holds special memories and significance for them. Sometimes it's what makes where you live special, and gives it a sense of identity. And when they disappear, whether by structural decay, natural disaster, industrial accident, deliberate demolition, or simply developers, as Ray Davies says "Part of my childhood died".


As you said: "Part of my childhood died."

My grandpa built the place in the 30's. That old wood floor absorbed more spilled liquids than the deck planks of a 17th century frigate. And lots of townsfolk all dressed down with nowhere to go now.


----------



## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Actually Quasimodo was the first thing that I thought about .. lol


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Wardo said:


> Actually Quasimodo was the first thing that I thought about .. lol


From what I understand, he is Suspect #1 on Chief Inspector Dreyfus' list. 

Pretty good motive: "The Bells! The Bells!"


----------



## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

High/Deaf said:


> From what I understand, he is Suspect #1 on Chief Inspector Dreyfus' list.
> 
> Pretty good motive: "The Bells! The Bells!"


And by this time he’d be pretty pissed off with his employment situation - no opportunity for advancement in how many years ?


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Wardo said:


> And by this time he’d be pretty pissed off with his employment situation - no opportunity for advancement in how many years ?


Yea, they shoulda had a hunch he wasn't happy.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Gentlemen, I think you want this thread instead: https://guitarscanada.com/index.php?threads/puns-you-really-like.153265/page-33#post-2433448


----------



## keto (May 23, 2006)

Never heard of him, but his face rings a bell.


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

quick look inside after the fire


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Wow. As the camera pans around horizontally, you think "Well, thank goodness, that's not TOO too bad." And then it pans up...

Thanks for that...I think.

(P.S.: To see the video, copy the link that shows up when you mouse over "


----------



## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

mhammer said:


> You don't have to view it through a religion lens. It's a magnificent piece of architecture that people from all walks of life and religious backgrounds appreciate. Moreover, how many buildings are there on this continent that are 900 years old? It's history. That it's also a church is secondary.


no, it's not secondary. it's the ENTIRE reason it was built. it's secondary to the sentiments of some here, and nothing wrong with that if they aren't catholics. i'm not either. but the truth is, it was inspired by devotion to their god, and built as a place of worship. 



cboutilier said:


> My views on religion belong in another forum entirely, but I stand with Mark's sentiment.
> 
> That building embodies some of the finest architecture, art, and craftsmanship in the history of civilization.


which is why it doesn't make alot of sense to me that folks want to minimize it's inspiration and it's purpose. 



Jim DaddyO said:


> The time, skill, and craftsmanship, all done by hand, can never be equalled. The skills of that era is pretty much lost to time.


this is not true. we CAN still do that, but we don't. it's deliberate. the intent of people is not the same now as it was in times past. it's not a criticism, just a truth. we can build things of great beauty, and we have technology enough to make it last a long, long time. we have craftsmanship available today that is every bit as good as then. actually, more so. but no one builds monuments intended to last for ages these days. it's not the focus of people who supply money to do these things. we also have other factors to consider these days, like environmental concerns, safety practices, labor laws, etc. regardless of the reasons, we can do these things, but do not


----------



## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Yeah, building isn't exactly a lost art it's just that we generally don't build massive pyramids these days just for one dead guy and so on.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

cheezyridr said:


> no, it's not secondary. it's the ENTIRE reason it was built. it's secondary to the sentiments of some here, and nothing wrong with that if they aren't catholics. i'm not either. but the truth is, it was inspired by devotion to their god, and built as a place of worship.
> 
> which is why it doesn't make alot of sense to me that folks want to minimize it's inspiration and it's purpose.


No dispute with respect to the initial motivation to build it. Lots of things were built for religious or political reasons that may not pertain any more. Machu Pichu wasn't exactly built to be convenient, but the reasons for its construction don't stop us from being impressed. And whatever antipathy one might have towards the Chinese Communist government, or apathy towards the dynasty that used it as defense to maintain their empire, likely doesn't stop one from being impressed by the Great Wall. Religion is, however, secondary to Notre Dame's place as a structure, a landmark, an accomplishment, and a piece of work that would be nigh impossible to replicate. I'm sure that very few people who appreciate the pyramids in Egypt or Mexico have any particular feelings regarding Egyptian or Aztec religion; they're just impressed by the structures

So, was religion fundamental to it being built? Certainly. We are in complete agreement, there. Is it fundamental to _appreciating_ it as a piece of architecture? Nah. And that was my point: You don't have to be French Catholic to think it is a world heritage site, and be saddened by its damage and fire. Appreciation of design and workmanship is universal.


----------



## Frenchy99 (Oct 15, 2016)

mhammer said:


> You don't have to be French Catholic to think it is a world heritage site, and be saddened by its damage and fire. Appreciation of design and workmanship is universal.


No, We cant all be perfect,,, but it helps ! …


----------



## Frenchy99 (Oct 15, 2016)

On a serious note, its sad to lose such history. it withstood so many wars to just Accidently burn down ? 

I have a problem with the Accidently...


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Frenchy99 said:


> No, We cant all be perfect,,, but it helps ! …


ahh, the sin of pride. someone is going to have a private meeting with a priest ...


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Frenchy99 said:


> On a serious note, its sad to lose such history. it withstood so many wars to just Accidently burn down ?
> 
> I have a problem with the Accidently...


it’s been rebuilt plenty and they’ll do it again. it needed the work anyways. 

what in your investigative inkling tells you that it wasn’t an accident?


----------



## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

i hope it was an accident, and not related to the recent desecration of churches in france. 
that said, can you imagine being THAT guy? the guy who's sitting home right now knowing that because of his negligence, there was a catastrophe that made world news? it's a weight i wouldn't wish on anyone

not even this guy, the biggest asshole i ever knew


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

vadsy said:


> it’s been rebuilt plenty and they’ll do it again. it needed the work anyways.


In fact, the most likely cause was some sort of accident or oversight occurring by those engaged in the badly-needed restoration work. That's why all the scaffolding around the roof was there in the first place. And, while the stuff we see from the outside is primarily stone, there is apparently one heckuva lot of old dry wooden beams in the roof.


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

cheezyridr said:


> this is not true. we CAN still do that, but we don't. it's deliberate. the intent of people is not the same now as it was in times past. it's not a criticism, just a truth. we can build things of great beauty, and we have technology enough to make it last a long, long time. we have craftsmanship available today that is every bit as good as then. actually, more so. but no one builds monuments intended to last for ages these days. it's not the focus of people who supply money to do these things. we also have other factors to consider these days, like environmental concerns, safety practices, labor laws, etc. regardless of the reasons, we can do these things, but do not


I agree. It comes down to what is practical, not what is possible. CBA's and all that.

In a world of distraction like pro sports, internet, 420 celebrations with live bands, etc. this kind of thing has become somewhat irrelevant. Fascinating but hard to fund/justify. 

This is the Notre Dame Cathedral if they had electricity/internet/strip bars in the 11th century:


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Reading between the lines, the French government seems to be mostly worried about the tourist dollars that will be lost.


----------



## Frenchy99 (Oct 15, 2016)

Steadfastly said:


> Reading between the lines, the French government seems to be mostly worried about the tourist dollars that will be lost.


I think it's more about they're identity. It's a monument.


----------



## SG-Rocker (Dec 30, 2007)

Maybe they can take a page from 9/11 and build a mosque at the disaster site.


----------



## Frenchy99 (Oct 15, 2016)

A man arrested with a gas cannister at St-Patrick Cathedral in new York. A pattern is spreading.

Un homme arrêté à la cathédrale Saint-Patrick avec des bidons d'essence


----------



## Guest (Apr 18, 2019)

Man with gas cans arrested at St. Patrick's church in NYC


----------



## Jim DaddyO (Mar 20, 2009)

With the amount of money raised in such a short time, by just a few of the very rich, one wonders why they haven't come forward sooner with help for other issues that are important also? Are they hoping they can buy their way into heaven? I don't think it works that way.


----------



## TB2019 (Mar 14, 2019)

Jim DaddyO said:


> With the amount of money raised in such a short time, by just a few of the very rich, one wonders why they haven't come forward sooner with help for other issues that are important also? Are they hoping they can buy their way into heaven? I don't think it works that way.


Think again


----------



## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

Jim DaddyO said:


> With the amount of money raised in such a short time, by just a few of the very rich, one wonders why they haven't come forward sooner with help for other issues that are important also? Are they hoping they can buy their way into heaven? * I don't think it works that way*.


It has always worked that way.


----------



## Guest (Apr 18, 2019)




----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Frenchy99 said:


> I think it's more about they're identity. It's a monument.


Yes, I guess that is part of it too.


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

The Vatican has billions. Have they made a pledge?


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Jim DaddyO said:


> Are they hoping they can buy their way into heaven?


I'm saving up with the goal of _buying a stairway to heaven._


----------



## Guest (Apr 18, 2019)




----------



## TB2019 (Mar 14, 2019)

It's hard to deny that religions are just businesses. If you can't buy your way into heaven why the 10% tithe?


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

laristotle said:


> View attachment 251662


Rex Murphy includes a similar thought in his National Post article below.

http://nationalpost.com/opinion/rex-murphy-this-is-why-notre-dame-matters?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1555608674

_We spin through life in ever more swift revolvings — the brief, transient, immediate and ever-refreshing present moment — refreshing in the computer sense of endless “updating” of the screen for the newest new thing, song, list or image.

We marvel at our toys and apps but the marvel is not deep, more a glow from the novelty of the latest “upgrade,” the latest facile convenience — life lived through apps and caught on Instagram. Here now, gone the next minute is, to some degree in our web-congested lives, the pace of life. This is how we moderns experience time, not as a continuous stream, but in successive bits, fragmented and discrete. Our diminished sense of wonder, so essential for the imagination of human beings, is easily indicated by how the common use of “awesome” in our time is precisely the opposite of what the word really means.

Awesome now is a shallow tribute to mini-explosions of satisfaction for matters eminently trivial and momentary — the latest Captain Marvel movie, or some pathetic putdown on Twitter. The cellphone camera freezes the life all around us into stored images of what is happening, mere mechanical glimpses of life, which we will “get back to” when the event of the moment is, in its own time, over. It’s a little like we’re “taping life” so that we can watch it later. Our eyes and minds are saturated with the small novelties of each passing moment, which decimates any possible sense of a vision of the order and pattern of things, the beauty which only emerges from a full, not fitful, apprehension of experience.

We catch our wonders, such as they are, with cellphone cameras to post them later — which counts as experience — on Facebook. Reality is glib. All is surface and transient display.

Notre Dame, by the fullest standards of human achievement, is remarkable. Longevity was at play even in its building, a common endeavour over 300 years, and its existence — beyond time’s decay or external ravaging — near 900. Centuries cluster around that building, and thereby the motions of history, events great and small enacted so to speak within the great shadow of its long presence. People coming to view the cathedral are by it put in mind of the great flow of history, the accumulation of events, achievements, sorrows and joys of art and life that played out around its magnificent towers, and within its vast ornamented spaces.

They are put in mind, too, of the “small” history of the place, given to wonder how many prayers from ever so many worshippers ascended its grand spaces, how many the Masses, weddings and funerals, celebrated under its enduring vaults, all in counterpoint with the unfolding history of Paris, France and the wider world?

A building of this splendour positions the mind to the exercise of real contemplation, not to “glimpse” at life but to take in it. A famous aphorism has it that “architecture is frozen music,” by which is surely meant only great architecture and great music. The implied analogy is a good one. I find it very natural to think of Notre Dame as one would think of Beethoven’s mighty works, the Fifth or the Ninth or the Missa solemnis, works of such awe and beauty that summon the full mind to (however unfashionable this phrase may now be) higher thoughts; and to a sense of gratitude for the artists and builders that have given us the great monuments of human creativity. Losing Notre Dame would be like somehow erasing the Ninth Symphony or casting Michelangelo’s Pietà into a gravel pit.

Some remarkably small minds questioned the “fuss” that was being made over the possible destruction of Notre Dame. Is there so much that is great and wonderful and beautiful in this world that we should not lament the loss of any of its unquestionable marvels? Is there such a surplus of the very best that human minds and human hands have created, art or artifact, which have nourished the better, wiser, noble side of our nature, that we should view with indifference or scorn any subtraction from our greatest creations?
_
[Those here who are reducing this to an argument of "let the Catholic Church pay for it or let it fall down" seem churlish, and unable to see beyond Notre Dame's association with religion. It is ever so much more than a building for religion! (And by the way it is not even owned by the Catholic Church, it's owned by the French government.)]


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

boyscout said:


> Losing Notre Dame would be like somehow erasing the Ninth Symphony or casting *Michelangelo’s Pietà *into a gravel pit.



Extremely well written!

Does anyone remember this?

In 1972, Hungarian-born Lazlo Toth took a hammer to the *Michelangelo's Pieta* in St. Peter's Basilica, disfiguring the face of the madonna and shattering the left arm. The assailant spent two years in an insane asylum, and the reconstructed Pieta is now shielded behind protective glass.








Before and after restoration...








The woman I was dating at the time burst into tears when she first heard this news.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

boyscout said:


> _Losing Notre Dame would be like somehow erasing the Ninth Symphony or casting Michelangelo’s Pietà into a gravel pit._





greco said:


> Extremely well written!


I didn't write that, Rex Murphy did.


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

boyscout said:


> I didn't write that, Rex Murphy did.


Yes, I knew that.

Rex Murphy's writing almost always appeals to me.
He certainly is a thinker and expresses himself extremely well.


----------



## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

greco said:


> Extremely well written!
> 
> Does anyone remember this?
> 
> ...


I choked up a bit just looking at it now.


----------



## Guest (Apr 19, 2019)

Detail-minded architect left guide in mid-1800s for restoring Notre Dame


----------



## leftysg (Mar 29, 2008)

TB2019 said:


> It's hard to deny that religions are just businesses. If you can't buy your way into heaven why the 10% tithe?


To help others get there?


----------



## Chitmo (Sep 2, 2013)




----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

And now the scams appear.

*Watch out for scams*
_The heritage foundation has mounted an aggressive media campaign in France to warn potential donors of scams. Fraudsters have been trying to capitalize on the renown of the fundraising effort by posing as legitimate charity workers.

"Many scams have been flagged in France and abroad," the foundation said in a statement. "The Fondation du patrimoine does not send appeals by email, post or phone. All these efforts are fraudulent."

The organization says scammers have created fake Fondation du patrimoine pages on social media, or even sent out appeals for donations by email, posing as the foundation's president, Guillaume Poitrinal.

"Some crooks were swindling our compatriots," French Culture Minister Franck Riester acknowledged Thursday on BFM TV._


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

laristotle said:


> Detail-minded architect left guide in mid-1800s for restoring Notre Dame


Great story! Reminds of another one, certainly of lesser significance but again about heroes of foresight.

In the 1960s when Toronto wanted to extend the Bloor subway line eastwards across the Don Valley which splits the city, the city hired a consulting firm to estimate the cost of reinforcing the existing very busy Bloor Viaduct bridge to support the subway rather than building another bridge for the subway trains.

The consulting firm soon reported that the bridge needed very little work. When it was designed in the early 1900s, even though it was designed to support street car rail lines on its road deck, it was also designed to support two rail lines beneath the road deck despite that subways were over 40 years in the future. It was built that way at considerable extra expense and against resistance due to the urging of project managers, but this fact had become all but lost to the city's institutional memory. It saved the city many millions of dollars 40+ years later.

(I just looked it up... another interesting fact is that its budget in 1913 was $2.5 million and when it opened five years later its final cost was...

$2.48 million! Why can't our public institutions budget like that anymore?!)


----------

