# Bell Caught Pushing Unethical Services



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

'They tell me they're blind, and I still have to sell them internet': Bell insider on high-pressure sales

*Bell insider reveals high-pressure sales tactics required on every single call*
*Bell says allegations are 'completely unfounded and untrue'*
By Erica Johnson, CBC News Posted: Nov 19, 2017 9:00 PM ET Last Updated: Nov 20, 2017 8:28 AM ET









Bell call centre employee Andrea Rizzo says she had to take a stress leave because of the constant pressure to meet sales targets or face possible termination. (Tina Mackenzie/CBC)

A longtime Bell Canada employee describes working in the company's Scarborough, Ont., call centre as "a non-stop nightmare," where she says she is forced to sell customers products they don't need, don't want, and may not understand, to hit sales targets and keep her job.



Andrea Rizzo, 50, has worked for Bell — Canada's largest telecom service provider — for 20 years, and says the pressure to upsell customers who call in has become relentless.



She says employees are expected to make a sale on every call.





Rizzo is currently on stress leave, and worries about the repercussions of making her concerns public, but says the status quo has to change.


*Been wronged? Contact Erica and the Go Public team*


"I feel bad," says Rizzo. "I'm not really listening to what the customer called about. All I'm thinking in my head is, 'Oh wow, this customer just said they didn't want the service, it's too expensive. And I've sold a service to them that they will not know how to use, or really need.'"









Andrea Rizzo, seen here in a photo taken in 2001, around the time she was switched from Bell's billing department to sales. (Andrea Rizzo)



*Every customer a target *


Rizzo says many of the customers who call in are on a limited income, and clearly can't use the products she is pressured to sell.



"We have a lot of seniors who call," says Rizzo. "They tell me they're blind, and I still have to sell them internet."

"I've sold a service to them that they will not know how to use, or really need."- Andrea Rizzo, Bell client representative


She says she talked a 90-year-old into signing up for internet service knowing the woman was blind and couldn't use it.







When she first started with Bell in 1997, Rizzo handled calls from customers with billing issues. 

She now works as a client representative in what Bell calls the "Serve to Sell" department — helping customers with billing and technical problems, while expected to sell products and services. 



"They're very distraught," says Rizzo. "Their phone lines have been disconnected and I'm expected to turn around and ask this customer, 'Are you interested in internet, TV, or home phone service?'"



*Bell disputes allegations*


No one from Bell Canada would give Go Public an interview, but in an email, spokesperson Nathan Gibson writes that agents talk about products and services to ensure that customers have what is "right for them" and are "aware of new services or performance upgrades."



He did not address whether or not there is pressure for customer service agents to make a sale on every call.


Read Bell's email to CBC Go Public's Erica Johnson
*Coaches listen in*


Rizzo describes how coaches randomly listen in on customer calls without her knowledge, and rush to her desk if she's not sealing a deal.



"They'll sit next to you and say, 'Don't tell them that. No, put the call on hold,' or 'No, tell them you have no other options, this is the best choice they're making,'" says Rizzo. "Some of them will take over the call and actually talk for us."

'There has to be a sale on every single call.'- Andrea Rizzo, Bell client representative


She says she's also coached to talk quickly, not to let the customer speak, and to bury the price of products and services.





"We're supposed to mention the price really quickly and then jump to, 'We can get a technician out for this day and this time.'"





As for the basic so-called 'skinny package' — a starter cable package that new CRTC rules require all TV service providers to offer for no more than $25 — Rizzo says she and her colleagues are coached not to talk about it.



That allegation is a violation of CRTC broadcasting rules, which say "TV service providers should not downplay the small basic service," and "should clearly communicate all relevant information."


*Read full response from the CRTC on alleged sales practices by Bell employees*


*Top sellers are 'unethical' *


Rizzo has struggled to meet her sales targets. In August, Bell told her she was "unable to meet performance expectations," and put her on a plan Rizzo believes is designed to eventually enable the company to terminate her employment.









Andrea Rizzo says when frustrated customers call Bell's Scarborough call centre, agents have to try to make a sale every time. (CBC)



Meantime, she says, many of the top performers on her team are hitting goals by being unethical — not telling customers about a two-year contract, or that a promotional price is going to go up after a few months.



Those allegations, too, would be a violation of CRTC rules, known as The Wireless Code, which say telecoms have to clearly provide contract and price information, including when a promotional offer is going to expire.



"But nobody listens to their calls," says Rizzo. "Managers don't want to know what their star performers are saying to customers."


*Other bell employees speak out *


Rizzo's concerns are echoed by other Bell customer service agents with whom Go Public has spoken.

Michael Lacaprara quit Bell's Scarborough call centre in 2015, after a dozen years on the job, due to the pressure to hit sales targets by upselling customers, who were often angry.


"They would say, 'I hate Bell,'" says Lacaprara. "And I would have to try to sell them more things on top of what they had."

He says he was prompted to quit after he was suspended for three days without pay for not selling on a call.


In the most recent annual report produced by the CCTS, the number 1 complaint consumers filed last year — and the year before that — was that telecom providers gave misleading information or didn't disclose all the facts about products or services.

The report says of more than 8,000 customer complaints the CCTS investigated overall, Bell was the subject of almost 3,000.














"I would like to see them change their employee practices effective immediately," Wanda Morris says.



"And to never upsell seniors for products or services that they don't need, don't want, and won't be able to use."



Andrea Rizzo would like that to happen, too.









Rizzo gets emotional when she describes the stress of having to continually hit sales targets at a Bell call centre. (Tina Mackenzie/CBC)



"I was having panic attacks," she says. "I was stressed out and crying, thinking 'I don't have enough time to get my numbers up.'

"I'm not only speaking on behalf of myself, but everyone else," says Rizzo. "It's not just me."


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

not surprised. sleazy business.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Thank you to Steadly and the CBC for bringing old news to light on a guitar forum. 

This also just in,.. "Kittens are still cute" and our fact checkers are working on a story about the sky being white but we still don't have confirmation so we are hesitant to publish anything just yet.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Jeez, what a surprise. A company that sells products and services is trying really hard to sell you products and services. Like always, the consumer needs to be informed. This is a slow news day or something?


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

It's interesting that you've boiled it down to simply selling products and services. As far as I see it there are several issues with what's going on at Bell according to this story. It's not only about the shady business practice of pressuring customers to buy services that they won't use or don't need but there are serious issues regarding the treatment of employees in a manner that is causing them stress to the point that it's becoming a mental health issue.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

You mean putting her on extra training because she's not meeting her performance targets?


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

Was it also because she had to make all those calls on a rotary phone?


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

1SweetRide said:


> You mean putting her on extra training because she's not meeting her performance targets?


If that's all the information that you gleaned out of the entire article then further discussion about it is pointless.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

JBFairthorne said:


> If that's all the information that you gleaned out of the entire article then further discussion about it is pointless.


OK, because everything a disgruntled, about-to-be-fired employee says is true of course.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

The problem is deeper than the article suggests. Bell is lobbying to get NAFTA changes that will give them control of what you can and can't watch. Bell is also a large content provider. Under their proposed changes they could shut down VPNs and other methods to access foreign broadcasts that compete with their content. Bell wants total control of the Internet in Canada.

Bell Calls for CRTC-Backed Website Blocking System and Complete Criminalization of Copyright in NAFTA - Michael Geist


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

Bell showed up at the door a few weeks ago after cancelling the landline a few months ago. 

The girl at the door was being quite pushy and I had to tell her three times before she got the message.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Do you remember the telecom company that didn't push it's products or market aggressively? Ya, me neither. Because they didn't last a week. 

Personally, I don't know why this is a problem because about 85% of the people here believe marketing doesn't work on them. My, that's a beautiful baby! LOL


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Kerry Brown said:


> The problem is deeper than the article suggests. Bell is lobbying to get NAFTA changes that will give them control of what you can and can't watch. Bell is also a large content provider. Under their proposed changes they could shut down VPNs and other methods to access foreign broadcasts that compete with their content. Bell wants total control of the Internet in Canada.
> 
> Bell Calls for CRTC-Backed Website Blocking System and Complete Criminalization of Copyright in NAFTA - Michael Geist


Wouldn't bother me Kerry, I hardly watch anything anymore except for NetFlix and I doubt Bell is going to have much influence over that. Even if they did, I'd just stop watching TV completely. Not a big loss for me anyway.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

1SweetRide said:


> Wouldn't bother me Kerry, I hardly watch anything anymore except for NetFlix and I doubt Bell is going to have much influence over that. Even if they did, I'd just stop watching TV completely. Not a big loss for me anyway.


It is not just watching TV. They want to control everything you surf to.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Sales is a tough gig and not for everyone. These companies do often go beyond whats ethical or professional...but is she suggestiung they have a formal policy to treat old people for example differently? eg in the sales playbook "...don't try selling internet to old people....theyre like, old....and kind of dumb..."...why stop there? immigrants, those with disabilities etc.
I have a bigger problem with how they handle cancellations and the various hoops you have to jump through, as well as the rigmarole and call-center theater you can go through and get a rate re-negotiated. everyone should pay the same rate for phone internet etc. from the same company, esp one that's practically a public utility like Bell. What if your gas, hydro etc was handled the same way?


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Kerry Brown said:


> It is not just watching TV. They want to control everything you surf to.


Oh, like China? Oh joy.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

I think the employee who is publicly speaking out has a lot of courage. She thinks they may push her into an area where she can be dismissed. I would be dropping the word sue like a large hunk of lead. The last thing Bell wants is more bad publicity. 

They have a large chunk of the TV/Internet sown up here on the east coast with few options.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

Eastlink of out of NS, I believe.
I've been with them for over ten years now and just recieved yet another letter from Bell, ffs.
What a waste of paper, they should be fined for that too.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

sulphur said:


> Eastlink of out of NS, I believe.
> I've been with them for over ten years now and just recieved yet another letter from Bell, ffs.
> What a waste of paper, they should be fined for that too.


Yes, I wish I could use them where I am but we only have Bell, Rogers and Xplornet. I would use Xplornet but their tower is too far away from me.

Regarding fining Bell, I threatened to call CRTC on them if I received one more call from them. They had just been fined a few months earlier for $700,000.00+. I never received another call. Imagine that.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

Steadfastly said:


> Yes, I wish I could use them where I am but we only have Bell, Rogers and Xplornet. I would use Xplornet but their tower is too far away from me.
> 
> Regarding fining Bell, I threatened to call CRTC on them if I received one more call from them. They had just been fined a few months earlier for $700,000.00+. I never received another call. Imagine that.


They were fined over a million I beleive, for calling people on the Do Not Call list.
Get on that list, it's easy to do and will at least stop shysters within Canada, like Bell.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

sulphur said:


> They were fined over a million I beleive, for calling people on the Do Not Call list.
> Get on that list, it's easy to do and will at least stop shysters within Canada, like Bell.


We were on the list and they kept on calling, thus my threat. And they have to be one of the worst shysters in Canada. Those of us who know their game don't get caught but a lot of senior citizens, (like the article says) get caught in their net.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

The attitude of Bell's has a long history. If you old enough to remember when Bell held the telephone monopolies in a number of provinces and was know as 'MA BELL', it is not surprising.


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## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

I'm ditching my landline. They can pound salt. Sound's like they have become the quick lube of the communication world


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

I was with Bell and will NEVER use them again for anything. 

In case anyone would like to know, I was with another company for cell (who might piggy back on Bell's network) who were giving me the complete runaround on cancelling service when my contract was up. They started threatening me so I just filed a complaint with the CRTC, which only took about five minutes. 

The whole thing was over two days.


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## colchar (May 22, 2010)

1SweetRide said:


> Jeez, what a surprise. A company that sells products and services is trying really hard to sell you products and services. Like always, the consumer needs to be informed. This is a slow news day or something?


Their actions are in violation of CRTC rules.


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## colchar (May 22, 2010)

Kerry Brown said:


> The problem is deeper than the article suggests. Bell is lobbying to get NAFTA changes that will give them control of what you can and can't watch. Bell is also a large content provider. Under their proposed changes they could shut down VPNs and other methods to access foreign broadcasts that compete with their content. Bell wants total control of the Internet in Canada.
> 
> Bell Calls for CRTC-Backed Website Blocking System and Complete Criminalization of Copyright in NAFTA - Michael Geist



They are also the fuckwits who administer the 'Do Not Call List' and who the CRTC fined as being the biggest abusers of that list.


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

The reason we cancelled the landline was because the telemarketer calls had gotten completely out of hand, even though we were on the do not call list.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Diablo said:


> everyone should pay the same rate for phone internet etc. from the same company, esp one that's practically a public utility like Bell. What if your gas, hydro etc was handled the same way?


Utilities are still 'monopoly' status - usually with a govt watchdog so they don't run too amok and are answerable to someone. It would be very expensive, not to mention the political problems, to build parallel power grids or gas pipeline infrastructure. I think the non-backbone, tail-end stuff, like electric load/distribution (i.e. the customer connection) or gas reselling has been privatized and competition allowed in some areas - we have multiple gas marketers out here, but only one electricity supplier.

Telco's monopolies were removed in the early 90's in Canada. And we were all happy to see prices relax a bit. Initially, we saw an increase in local loop charges (your basic connection fee) with quite large decreases in long distance charges, as third party carriers got involved. Long distance always subsidized local loop fees during monopoly times (meaning it was cheaper for everyone to have a phone connection - as long as they didn't dial long distance). 

And, in recent times, local loop charges have dropped as well. I see lots of 'packages' with <$20/month charges, which is cheaper than it was in the early 90's, before de-reg. The long distance fees we see would be unheard of 20 years ago, let alone now (factoring in inflation). I remember paying 25c a minute for inside BC long distance calls, more as you called farther away. Now I can call anywhere in NA for about 4c a minute. Some markets are still expensive to call, but it's usually the telco at the far end that's causing that.


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## hammerstein (Oct 17, 2017)

There was a period of time a few years back I probably would have punched anyone who told me they worked in a Bell call centre lol..

I cancelled all services with them in September a few years back, and wasn’t done fighting with them about it til April the next year. They told me they would be sending me packaging to return my equipment, then immediately charged me for all of it, sent my bill to collections.. even though I paid the bogus bill when I got it, because I knew they would do that.. 

After all my headaches with them, I still get mail from them almost weekly telling me about the latest “deals”..


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

butterknucket said:


> The reason we cancelled the landline was because the telemarketer calls had gotten completely out of hand, even though we were on the do not call list.


Same


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

butterknucket said:


> Bell showed up at the door a few weeks ago after cancelling the landline a few months ago.
> 
> The girl at the door was being quite pushy and I had to tell her three times before she got the message.


We just cancelled our landine after 40 years of being a customer. They wanted a ridiculous price for the most basic service (more than Maggs and I pay for TWO cell phones) and wouldn't budge more than 5 bucks a month for a year.


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

allthumbs56 said:


> We just cancelled our landine after 40 years of being a customer. They wanted a ridiculous price for the most basic service (more than Maggs and I pay for TWO cell phones) and wouldn't budge more than 5 bucks a month for a year.


Maybe you can expect a visitor at your door as well!


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## LanceT (Mar 7, 2014)

Does Bell even have a presence in Western Canada?


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Steadfastly said:


> I think the employee who is publicly speaking out has a lot of courage. She thinks they may push her into an area where she can be dismissed. I would be dropping the word sue like a large hunk of lead. The last thing Bell wants is more bad publicity.
> 
> They have a large chunk of the TV/Internet sown up here on the east coast with few options.


bullshit. she has no courage, or scruples, for that matter. the woman you're talking about worked for them 20 years, and never said anything until it started affecting HER. she's a dirty piece of shit who deserves worse than she has gotten afaict.

at the end of the day, it's your government who is responsible. they are supposed to protect it's citizens from this kind of crap. however, bell is one of many examples of how the government does not protect you, but actively supports the corporations instead.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

cheezyridr said:


> at the end of the day, it's your government who is responsible. they are supposed to protect it's citizens from this kind of crap. however, bell is one of many examples of how the government does not protect you, but actively supports the corporations instead.


Cheezy: You are being unusually hard on her and you are not usually like that. 

Should she have spoken up sooner? Yes. But in the end she has done so and she deserves credit for that. There must be a lot of internal and external pressure on her to keep quiet. 

As for the government being responsible. They are responsible for many problems in our society in showing lack of concern for people and I agree that this is one of them.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Steadfastly said:


> Cheezy: You are being unusually hard on her and you are not usually like that.
> 
> Should she have spoken up sooner? Yes. But in the end she has done so and she deserves credit for that. There must be a lot of internal and external pressure on her to keep quiet.
> 
> As for the government being responsible. They are responsible for many problems in our society in showing lack of concern for people and I agree that this is one of them.


it's because like most women, she does not want to be held accountable for her actions. it's the evil patriarchy making her do these bad things. she didn't want to make good money ripping off old people, she was forced to do it. it's time people stood up and started calling bullshit on this. you're really going to argue that in 2 decades she could not get another job? or that it took her 2 decades to figure out what she was doing was wrong? or maybe it took her those 20 years to figure out how wrong it was? just what is your defense for her, specifically? if you did the same thing people would call you an evil man. because she is a woman, she rightly expects to get a free pass, because that's what society does. well, if you can't admit there is a problem it will never get solved. if half of your society can do whatever they want with near impunity, you're never going to fix problems like the one at bell, because many of the people causing that problem are not held accountable for what they do. if it was a man in that video, saying what she was saying, i would have called him on it just as straight-up as i did her. the difference is, had that been the case, you would not have come to his defense.


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## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

cheezyridr said:


> it's because like most women, she does not want to be held accountable for her actions. it's the evil patriarchy making her do these bad things. she didn't want to make good money ripping off old people, she was forced to do it. it's time people stood up and started calling bullshit on this. you're really going to argue that in 2 decades she could not get another job? or that it took her 2 decades to figure out what she was doing was wrong? or maybe it took her those 20 years to figure out how wrong it was? just what is your defense for her, specifically? if you did the same thing people would call you an evil man. because she is a woman, she rightly expects to get a free pass, because that's what society does. well, if you can't admit there is a problem it will never get solved. if half of your society can do whatever they want with near impunity, you're never going to fix problems like the one at bell, because many of the people causing that problem are not held accountable for what they do. if it was a man in that video, saying what she was saying, i would have called him on it just as straight-up as i did her. the difference is, had that been the case, you would not have come to his defense.


wow. Woman hating issues???


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Scotty said:


> wow. Woman hating issues???


so you are saying i am wrong? i notice you didn't point out what i said that was wrong. feel free to do that, once you figure out what it was. 
if your best argument is vacuous, vapid shaming tactics you're better off picking someone else to converse with. i won't bother presenting logic and reason against smug, virtue signaling dreck. it's an exercise in futility.


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## Guest (Nov 22, 2017)

cheezyridr said:


> it's because like most women, she does not want to be held accountable for her actions. it's the evil patriarchy making her do these bad things. she didn't want to make good money ripping off old people, she was forced to do it. it's time people stood up and started calling bullshit on this. you're really going to argue that in 2 decades she could not get another job? or that it took her 2 decades to figure out what she was doing was wrong? or maybe it took her those 20 years to figure out how wrong it was? just what is your defense for her, specifically? if you did the same thing people would call you an evil man. because she is a woman, she rightly expects to get a free pass, because that's what society does. well, if you can't admit there is a problem it will never get solved. if half of your society can do whatever they want with near impunity, you're never going to fix problems like the one at bell, because many of the people causing that problem are not held accountable for what they do. if it was a man in that video, saying what she was saying, i would have called him on it just as straight-up as i did her. the difference is, had that been the case, you would not have come to his defense.


There is something here. I agree in principle.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

cheezyridr said:


> it's because like most women, she does not want to be held accountable for her actions. it's the evil patriarchy making her do these bad things. she didn't want to make good money ripping off old people, she was forced to do it. it's time people stood up and started calling bullshit on this. you're really going to argue that in 2 decades she could not get another job? or that it took her 2 decades to figure out what she was doing was wrong? or maybe it took her those 20 years to figure out how wrong it was? just what is your defense for her, specifically? if you did the same thing people would call you an evil man. because she is a woman, she rightly expects to get a free pass, because that's what society does. well, if you can't admit there is a problem it will never get solved. if half of your society can do whatever they want with near impunity, you're never going to fix problems like the one at bell, because many of the people causing that problem are not held accountable for what they do. if it was a man in that video, saying what she was saying, i would have called him on it just as straight-up as i did her. the difference is, had that been the case, you would not have come to his defense.


Until we walk in someone else's shoes, so to speak, we may not fully understand what they are going through. While you make some valid points, as you did in your other posts, you're being a bit harsh, aren't you?


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Here is an update on the story. It seems the gal opened the floodgates. Under the heading "Bell Responds", Bell says they are a _trusted_ company. I would say that is 100% correct. They can be_ trusted to rip you off if you give them a chanc_e.

'Enough is enough': Flood of complaints from Bell customers, employees about high-pressure sales tactics

*Bell customers, employees flood CBC with complaints about high-pressure sales*
*Consumer advocacy group calls for CRTC inquiry*

*Bell Canada customers and employees from coast to coast are speaking out in the wake of a Go Public investigation into customer upselling at Canada's biggest telecom.

"Enough is enough," said Shaelene McInnis of Oshawa, Ont., who discovered that Bell was charging her aging in-laws for internet service, unbeknownst to them.

"They've never even turned on a computer!" McInnis said. "They have absolutely no need for internet services."

When she called to find out why the Bell bill was so high, she learned that a customer service representative had signed them up for Fibe TV, which is delivered through a network enhanced by fibre optic and automatically includes a fee for internet service.




Been wronged? Contact Erica and the Go Public team


She threatened to cancel all Bell services if the customer service rep wouldn't lower the bill.



"When he was trying to avoid taking it off the bill, I said to him, 'How many other senior citizens are you doing this to? How many people are you charging when they don't need internet service at all?'"

Customers complain 
McInnis is one of dozens of unhappy Bell customers who emailed Go Public after reading a story earlier this week about Andrea Rizzo, a Bell call centre employee in Scarborough, Ont., who said she is under intense pressure to make a sale on every call.



One Bell customer wrote to say she felt misled.

"After fulfilling a two-year [cellphone] contract, I was told by a rep on the phone that because I was a valued customer, my phone would be upgraded for free," writes one Bell customer. It wasn't, she said, and her bill skyrocketed. "I fell hook, line and sinker."

'I fell hook, line and sinker.'- Bell Canada customer
Another Bell customer said a rep offered him a TV/internet deal of $78 a month, but "after three months of constant calling and confusing answers with confusing bills, I was told that no such deal existed and was basically told I made this up."



Others wrote that they were billed for upgrades that were not requested, charged for months for internet service that had yet to be installed, have spent hours on the phone trying to cancel products and services and were often disconnected during those calls.

"I experienced three frustrating weeks attempting to cancel my landline," one customer wrote. "I had to emphatically insist I did not want their service."

Bell responds
In an email to Go Public, Bell did not address customer complaints CBC has received.



"Bell succeeds in a highly competitive marketplace by ensuring we serve our customers well and that's always our focus," spokesperson Nathan Gibson wrote.

"Bell is a trusted Canadian institution that has built a reputation for service and technology leadership with our more than 23 million customers nationwide."

'Bell was hell'


A flood of Bell employees, past and present, are speaking out, too. 



"I went on stress leave and returned to find things even worse when I came back," wrote a former manager who said "high-pressure sales tactics" and "employee mistreatment" were common.









Public Interest Advocacy Centre executive director John Lawford is calling on the CRTC to take a 'holistic' look at sales practices at Canada's telecoms, with an emphasis on upselling or misleading sales. (CBC)



A customer service rep said he and his colleagues "are actually penalized if we let a 'downgrade' go through without convincing the customer to keep the package or add more."



Many wrote about the extreme stress of trying to meet sales targets and the fear of losing their jobs.



"If you meet the stats, they raise them," wrote one customer service rep. "I've sat at my desk in tears many a day."



"Bell was hell," wrote a longtime employee who quit just a few years short of retirement because the culture was "toxic."
*


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## Jim DaddyO (Mar 20, 2009)

Steadfastly said:


> Until we walk in someone else's shoes, so to speak, we may not fully understand what they are going through. While you make some valid points, as you did in your other posts, you're being a bit harsh, aren't you?



A case of "don't shoot the messenger"? Even if it took a while?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Jim DaddyO said:


> A case of "don't shoot the messenger"? Even if it took a while?


hah, I think cheezy had this one right. She sure took her sweet time to put on a cape and become the hero we all needed. Have you guys thought about a crowdfunding campaign going so we can erect a state in honour of this person?


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

vadsy said:


> hah, I think cheezy had this one right. She sure took her sweet time to put on a cape and become the hero we all needed. Have you guys thought about a crowdfunding campaign going so we can erect a state in honour of this person?


Do you and Cheezy think it would be better if nothing was said and Bell were able to go on using unethical practices without being called on it. I'm guessing that there are not many people that have not been cheated by this company. I know I have.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Guitar101 said:


> Do you and Cheezy think it would be better if nothing was said and Bell were able to go on using unethical practices without being called on it. I'm guessing that there are not many people that have not been cheated by this company. I know I have.


Plenty of companies are doing this now and we all know, we all seem to be living just fine. Coming forward after all this time makes me question her motives. If she started 2 weeks ago and was told to be unethical, came forward and accused Bell I'd give her more credit than I do now.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> Cheezy: You are being unusually hard on her and you are not usually like that.
> 
> Should she have spoken up sooner? Yes. But in the end she has done so and she deserves credit for that. There must be a lot of internal and external pressure on her to keep quiet.
> 
> As for the government being responsible. They are responsible for many problems in our society in showing lack of concern for people and I agree that this is one of them.


My hunch is, she's looking to get a package and has no real intention to return, hence the whistle-blowing at this point. I don't think she "deserves credit" for that.

call-centers have incredible turnover. her having been there as long as she has tells me a lot about where her personal convictions lie in her priorities. I'm sure she was exemplary in the fulfillment of her duties. Throughout history, lots of ppl claimed they didn't like it, but were just "following orders"...we tend not to celebrate them.
its a sleazy industry, she got burned out or encountered some personal or career difficulties, wants out and shes blowing the whistle now. thanks for the inside info....but that doesn't make her a hero.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

cheezyridr said:


> bullshit. she has no courage, or scruples, for that matter. the woman you're talking about worked for them 20 years, and never said anything until it started affecting HER.
> 
> at the end of the day, it's your government who is responsible. they are supposed to protect it's citizens from this kind of crap. however, bell is one of many examples of how the government does not protect you, but actively supports the corporations instead.


When the vitriol is removed (I don't know how to do that cute crossed-out-with-red-lines thing, so I just cut it out), hes pretty much on the money.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Diablo said:


> When the vitriol is removed (I don't know how to do that cute crossed-out-with-red-lines thing, so I just cut it out), hes pretty much on the money.


ive tried and tried to figure that out, but so far, no luck. i tried using bbcode, but it doesn't work for me. i wonder if it might be a forum thing?


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Zero surprise.


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## Guest (Nov 22, 2017)

Diablo said:


> that cute crossed-out-with-red-lines thing


Try this generator, ̶o̶r̶ ̶n̶o̶t̶.̶
Strikethrough text generator ( ̶S̶t̶r̶i̶k̶e̶-̶t̶h̶r̶o̶u̶g̶h̶)


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Guitar101 said:


> Do you and Cheezy think it would be better if nothing was said and Bell were able to go on using unethical practices without being called on it. I'm guessing that there are not many people that have not been cheated by this company. I know I have.


I know they have tried to cheat me many times. I usually got my money back but when I was younger, I just said okay and took it.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Guitar101 said:


> Do you and Cheezy think it would be better if nothing was said and Bell were able to go on using unethical practices without being called on it. I'm guessing that there are not many people that have not been cheated by this company. I know I have.



no, i don't think it would have been better. however, i think calling her a hero or even a victim is a huge stretch. i've had my own issues with them, although it was minor in comparison to what others have experienced. it just bugged the hell out of me when gynocentrism labels her as though she has made some big sacrifice in order to do the public a huge solid. it's hard being one of the few who sees the emperor has no clothes. knowing i am not a genius or a prophet, i have a difficult time understanding why some things seem so obvious to me, and yet it sails right past everyone else.
i know that eventually the rest of you will figure it out. i have seen numerous examples of this since coming here in 2009. but in the now, i can only think "why do they not get it?"


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

What is the unethical part? That they are in a competitive business, trying to make a buck, and don't necessarily tell the truth as you understand it?

I have people come to my door on a regular basis that do that. They may be selling telecom, or natural gas, or eternity. And I know some people here are part of some of those 'sales organizations', although from their perspective, they are selling 'the truth'. Their truth, maybe, but not 'the truth'. Unethical? Perhaps. I'm of the 'buyer beware' belief.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

cheezyridr said:


> no, i don't think it would have been better. however, i think calling her a hero or even a victim is a huge stretch. i've had my own issues with them, although it was minor in comparison to what others have experienced. it just bugged the hell out of me when gynocentrism labels her as though she has made some big sacrifice in order to do the public a huge solid. it's hard being one of the few who sees the emperor has no clothes. knowing i am not a genius or a prophet, i have a difficult time understanding why some things seem so obvious to me, and yet it sails right past everyone else.
> i know that eventually the rest of you will figure it out. i have seen numerous examples of this since coming here in 2009. but in the now, i can only think "why do they not get it?"


I was just glad someone got the ball rolling on their unethical sales practices. I won't get my $300 back but maybe some senior that doesn't even have a computer won't be tricked into paying for internet in the future as has been reported.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

Guitar101 said:


> I was just glad someone got the ball rolling on their unethical sales practices. I won't get my $300 back but maybe some senior that doesn't even have a computer won't be tricked into paying for internet in the future as has been reported.


Thank's for the "like" Cheezy. I knew that under that tough exterior of yours, you were really a big softee.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Now it's Rogers who have got caught doing the same thing.

*Rogers employees say managers turn a blind eye so call centre workers can lie and cheat customers*
*'We do not believe the concerns raised represent our values or sales practices,' Rogers says*









Erica Johnson · CBC News · January 15
















Rogers employees at this call centre say they're under extreme pressure to upsell customers, often at the expense of ethics. (Guillaume Lafrenière/CBC)
1604 comments
Call centre employees working for Rogers Communications say the telecom company is pressuring them to try to make a sale on every call — even to elderly people who don't understand or need certain products or services.

In emails and interviews with Go Public, dozens of Rogers workers say they're under "extreme pressure" to hit sales targets or risk termination.

Their claims come on the heels of Bell Canada workers revealing similar pressures to upsell customers, often at the expense of ethics.


*Bell insider reveals high-pressure sales tactics required on every single call*
*Bell customers, employees flood CBC with complaints about high-pressure sales*
*Bell's 'Let's Talk' campaign rings hollow for employees suffering panic attacks, vomiting and anxiety*
"You're supposed to look at a customer's account and sell them cable, home phone, home security, a credit card — whatever is missing," says an employee who currently works at Rogers' major call centre in Ottawa and has asked CBC to conceal his identity to avoid retribution in his workplace.

He says even when people are off sick, their sales targets aren't adjusted unless they go on short-term disability, "so you're at home, trying to get better, but stressing about how you're going to keep your job."

He admits when he is "desperate" to earn sales points, he signs up seniors for internet service, and then tells them a technician is going to come to their house "to install a modem for their TV" — modems are required for internet, not TV.

"We're giving internet service to customers who actually do not have a computer," he says.



This Rogers call centre worker says he is pressured to lie to customers and sign them up for unnecessary products to keep his job. (Christian Patry/CBC)
He also admits to not telling [mostly older] customers about installation fees for TV and internet ($49.99 for both), internet activation fees ($14.95) or cellphone activation charges ($25) and to sneaking extra products or services onto a bill.

"Even customers who have home phone service, I say, 'How about I add a second line for your home phone and I'll give you a discount for your other product?' Which makes no sense.

"It feels really bad," he says. "But you have all this pressure on you. All your managers are around you, telling you to sell, sell, sell."


*Been wronged? Contact Erica and the Go Public team*
Jessica Robinson recently quit working at the Ottawa call centre after seven years.

She, too, says employees are expected to try to sell on every call, even when customers want to cancel services, complain about malfunctioning products, or are grieving the loss of a partner.

"When I had my interview ... they actually asked me 'If an elderly lady calls in to cancel her sports package on her TV because her husband just died, are you going to convince her to keep it and add more?'" says Robinson.

Robinson says she dealt with a lot of calls from customers who were angry about confusing or increasing bills, a concern echoed by other past and present Rogers workers.

"They teach us how to be empathetic. To say things like 'I understand how frustrating that must be,'" says Robinson. "I'm like, why? We're the ones screwing them over."


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