# Deafness



## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

Searching through this website, I found only a few notes about deafness... I guess I have no hearing impairment, but I regret that my father cannot taste my music because while I became a better guitar player, his hearing loss progressed deeper and deeper and his aids do not allow him to appreciate the modulations much (I am not the cause of his deafness since we were not living in the same house).

Here are some loose info about this subject of utmost importance (apparently unrecognized and neglected) to musicians though a friend of mine told me he knows many guys playing in bars who "became deaf".

Deafness maybe congenital or acquired. Becoming deaf maybe acute (blast, noise trauma) or progressive. Some medication and toxic substances as well as certain diseases (Meniere on the long run) may cause it.

Grandpa progressive deafness maybe an aging process, with or without genetic basis, or it may have been triggered by chronic exposure to noise, namely industrial noise, but music have been quite neglected.

Many causes (generics, noise, toxics) may aggravate hearing loss.

The noise level is evaluated in decibels. This scale is not linear but logarithmique : the higher the value, the steeper the curve.

Roughly, some 1% of the population is at risk for deafness if exposed to 85 decibels for a period of 8 consecutive hours. For 90 decibels, the number would rise to some 3 %. If you have to almost yell to talk to a friend seated nearby, the sound around you is probably over 90 decibels. Nobody should even be submitted to 130 decibels or higher. Most organisms use the 85 db / 8 hrs guide.

Since no musical event would usually last 8 hours, you will be glad to know that the noise level can be ajusted depending on time : 85 db / 8hrs becomes 88 dbs / 4 hrs and 91 dbs / 2 hrs... but 82 db / 16 hrs

To understand the importance of deafness to musicians, one should get a look at "note frequency charts" : a seven octave piano goes from some 27 to 4k decibels. Normal human hearing covers more than that, but current hearing test covers from 250 to 8k db which covers daily sounds exposure (conversation, significant sounds like animals and alarms to name a few).

Take note that hearing testing requires a previous period of 48 hours out of noise since normal hearing gets tired under noise exposure during the day and correct itself away from noise : Think about this radio in the car that appears too loud in the morning. If you test at the gate while leaving the shop or concert you could test deaf ! Normal !

Permanent hearing loss from heavy noise exposure takes some ten years to occur. This type of deafness first happens around 4k db on the hearing test and will extend over time toward 2k and 8k db amd so on to near total deafness. The progression would stop if exposure to heavy noise stops.

I hope it may help understand this burden to musicians.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

We are all advocates of proper earplugs. 

Also, like my father did to me , your father may be ignoring you.


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Co-incidentally, I have an appointment tomorrow at a hearing clinic. The tinnitus is getting worse, and there may be another issue as well.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Mooh said:


> Co-incidentally, I have an appointment tomorrow at a hearing clinic. The tinnitus is getting worse, and there may be another issue as well.


I saw your post the other day, but didn't comment. Are you saying that the ringing I've be hearing for as long as I can remember isn't normal? I thought everybody had that. I only hear it when I listen for it, otherwise I don't notice it. I can't imagine what I'd do if it started to overwhelm my hearing.


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

I guess we've always heard a little current going through. We are a power generator after all. For me sometimes it's there, sometimes not. Get it more if I'm congested, then I guess the sound doesn't have anywhere to evaporate.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

adcandour said:


> We are all advocates of proper earplugs.


Well, I guess pro do.


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## jb welder (Sep 14, 2010)

mawmow said:


> To understand the importance of deafness to musicians, one should get a look at "note frequency charts" : a seven octave piano goes from some 27 to 4k decibels. Normal human hearing covers more than that, but current hearing test covers from 250 to 8k db which covers daily sounds exposure (conversation, significant sounds like animals and alarms to name a few).
> ...
> Permanent hearing loss from heavy noise exposure takes some ten years to occur. This type of deafness first happens around 4k db on the hearing test and will extend over time toward 2k and 8k db amd so on to near total deafness.


You are talking about frequency here, so the unit of measurement is Hz, not db.

One thing to note is that tinnitus is not limited to high frequencies. I hear a constant hum at 103hz, which is low frequency tinnitus.
Don't think you have to have a 'ringing' in your ears to have hearing problems.


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## Hammerhands (Dec 19, 2016)

You can get a ringing in your ear from high blood pressure, too.

And a whooshing sound.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

jb welder said:


> You are talking about frequency here, so the unit of measurement is Hz, not db.


Yep ! I should have been clearer about that : Sound volume in db and frequency in Hz.
Over sound volume of 85 db comes the risk of hearing loss and then the disease begins to alter hearing by the 4kHz "hearing sensors", enlarging its spectrum and magnitude as it worsens. So you first lose high pitch sounds.

A central, as you may have noticed, is 440 Hz

A tip : don't yell "high pitch" at grandpa, try articulating a "bass" voice. ;-)


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

Played in bands for many years. One day while playing on a small stage in Port Hope, I look to my left and notice the drummers crash cymbol is about 6" from my left ear. That was the 1st time I ever even thought about hearing loss. It just wasn't on the radar back in those days. (80's) The next monday, I set up a hearing test at work and discover my hearing was still good so I'm sorry to say, I just ignored it and kept right on doing what I was doing. Played in bands for many more years after that. Don't know why but my hearing is still good to this day and I'm in my late 60's.

My wife is the one with hearing loss in our family. She's not too bad but when I come into the room when she's watching television, it's up pretty loud. Not sure what hertz a small bit of flatulence come at but she can hear that upstairs or in the next room. Go figure

Mawmow, sorry to hear about your dad but it seems that everyone is different and unfortunately, we don't know what will hurt us until it's too late.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

Thanks a lot guitar101. My father used to work in noise many many years ago but I suspect diseases and medication inhis old age were most important factors in his case.

Without test, as you witnessed, it is the spouse who usually suspect deafness because of TV sound. In addition, people loose the abillity to sustain a conversation within group and so tend to avoid meetings and public places (restaurants).


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Guitar101 said:


> Not sure what hertz a small bit of flatulence come at but she can hear that upstairs or in the next room. Go figure


Thanks for my laugh for the day!


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

adcandour said:


> I saw your post the other day, but didn't comment. Are you saying that the ringing I've be hearing for as long as I can remember isn't normal? I thought everybody had that. I only hear it when I listen for it, otherwise I don't notice it. I can't imagine what I'd do if it started to overwhelm my hearing.


Tinnitus - Symptoms and causes - Mayo Clinic


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

Guitar101 said:


> My wife is the one with hearing loss in our family.


That reminds me of a joke.

Guy goes to the doctor, to ask what is to be done about his wife's deafness getting worse.
Doc tells him to try a little test to see how bad it's gone.

Coming from the back, ask her something from across the room. If no answer, walk a few steps and try again. Repeat to where she finally hears you.

Coming home, guy gets in the house and sees his wife preparing dinner, with her back turned to him. Perfect.
He ask in a normal voice, _Darling, what are we having for dinner ? _No answer.
Goes half way across the room and asks again, _Darling, what are we having for dinner ? _No answer still.
Comes real close to her, at arm's length from her ear and again asks, _Darling, what are we having for dinner ? 
_
She turns around, looks him in the eye and tells him,_ I told you twice, we are having pasta, you old deaf._


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## Guest (Nov 27, 2017)




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## Guest (Nov 27, 2017)




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## Guest (Nov 27, 2017)

My personal favorite:


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## amagras (Apr 22, 2015)

Player99 said:


> My personal favorite:


Roflmao


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## colchar (May 22, 2010)

I've got noise induced hearing loss and my hearing often sounds akin to a blown speaker. Playing guitar too loudly can affect it. Even playing my acoustic can affect it if I do so too loudly. Listening to loud music affects it, as can the television if it is too loud. Hell, sometimes talking on the telephone triggers it! The weirdest feeling is when it happens when I am talking so that I hear my own voice all broken up.

I am only a hobby player and have only been playing for a few years so it wasn't playing guitar that caused my hearing problems. I believe it was caused primarily by working in bars for so many years and being immersed in extremely loud music most of that time. Working as a bouncer, I was often right up next to the stage getting blasted by the band's amps, drums, etc. A few very loud concerts when I was younger probably also contributed.

My hearing issues have me seriously reconsidering my amps at times. I currently have a 50 watt Marshall combo which is kind of overkill since I cannot open it up. It is a great amp, and is widely considered to be one of the best that Marshall has produced in years, but if I can only ever play it below 3ish on the volume does it really make sense to keep it? I also have a vintage Traynor. I can't open it up either, especially as most vintage Traynors are insanely loud, but it can serve as a great pedal platform as pedals allow me to get dirt at lower volume levels. If I am going to stick with tube amps maybe I should be looking into lower wattage amps. Even though they are still loud, I would at least be ale to open them up a bit more. And if the wattage was changeable then that lower wattage amp would be even more practical for my purposes (ie. like an Orange OR15 which can be switched from 15 watts down to 7 watts).

Another option is to go to a digital modelling unit. If I were to stumble across an Eleven Rack at a stupidly cheap price I'd jump on it. A Helix at the right price would also be an option. Either one of those would allow me to get cranked amp tones at normal TV volume levels.

Whether I decide to stick with the Traynor and pedals, to grab a lower wattage amp, or to go to digital modelling I won't be turning anything up very loud. I like being able to hear and would like to preserve my hearing for as long as I possible can.


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## Guest (Nov 27, 2017)

colchar said:


> I've got noise induced hearing loss and my hearing often sounds akin to a blown speaker. Playing guitar too loudly can affect it. Even playing my acoustic can affect it if I do so too loudly. Listening to loud music affects it, as can the television if it is too loud. Hell, sometimes talking on the telephone triggers it! The weirdest feeling is when it happens when I am talking so that I hear my own voice all broken up.
> 
> I am only a hobby player and have only been playing for a few years so it wasn't playing guitar that caused my hearing problems. I believe it was caused primarily by working in bars for so many years and being immersed in extremely loud music most of that time. Working as a bouncer, I was often right up next to the stage getting blasted by the band's amps, drums, etc. A few very loud concerts when I was younger probably also contributed.
> 
> ...


I use my computer with S-Gear and listen using nearfield studio monitors. Way better than guitar amps for lower volume. Amps creep up, plus they don't sound good at low volumes. My ears are happier.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

Sudden hearing loss

This actually happened to a friend of mine so it's worth watching. He was sick one weekend and couldn't go with us to a function I attended. Ended up at the doctor who misdiagnosed it and he ended up losing his hearing in that ear. He's actually in the middle of having 4 injections into his eardrum to see if it will help but after 2, he's had no improvement. This happened 2 years ago so he thinks it probably too late. Watch for it if you have hearing loss after a cold or flu episode.


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