# A better bank for smartphone use?



## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Getting pissed off with the Royal Bank. Their iPhone app regularly disables touch-ID and forces me to go back and answer those stupid questions like "who is your favourite...". This is painfully slow when you're at a stranger's house trying to transfer money to buy something. I'm fed up and looking to move funds to another bank that has a more friendly app. Why RBC thinks their dumb security questions are more secure than my fingerprint is beyond me.

Any suggestions?


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## fretzel (Aug 8, 2014)

This doesn't help your situation but my wife and I both use the app without issue. iPhone 8 and Samsung S70. 

One in every 25 it will ask me to manually log in but no questions.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

I would suggest Scotia but I've been with them for close to 30 years now so I don't know if they have a better service than the other banks. I know it's not helpful. LOL


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

Phones are easily hackable. I’ve been online banking since it was available but never on my phone. Lose your phone, lose your money. The security questions are an attempt to see if your phone has been hacked. You should never disable them and you should change them on a regular basis. Yes, it is a pain but losing your money is a bigger pain.


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## DaddyDog (Apr 21, 2017)

I bank at RBC and BMO. My visa is at CIBC. They're all a little different, and they all have issues, or quirky user interfaces. Take your phone into a branch and ask. Perhaps it's an easy fix. Perhaps you just need to delete the app, and reinstall it. Wouldn't be the first (or the last) time this is needed to fix an app issue.


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## KapnKrunch (Jul 13, 2016)

I asked my financial guy when I needed to open an account in Ontario a few years ago. 

"Not RBC. I use the CIBC on [local] Street."


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

I don't use banking on my phone but I can think of a lot better reasons to ditch a bank than you don't like their app. I've been dealing with the Royal since the mid '60s. Had a BMO account also for a short while in the 90's when I was flagging but I got rid of that and went back to using cash. Nothing worse than being in a store in the middle of no where and your card doesn't work because of their limits. As far as fingerprints go, they're not that secure.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

fretzel said:


> This doesn't help your situation but my wife and I both use the app without issue. iPhone 8 and Samsung S70.
> 
> One in every 25 it will ask me to manually log in but no questions.


This is my experience also. I almost never get the security question, but once in a few months if I do it's a quick exchange.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Chito said:


> I would suggest Scotia but I've been with them for close to 30 years now so I don't know if they have a better service than the other banks. I know it's not helpful. LOL


Do you have experience with their app?


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Kerry Brown said:


> Phones are easily hackable. I’ve been online banking since it was available but never on my phone. Lose your phone, lose your money. The security questions are an attempt to see if your phone has been hacked. You should never disable them and you should change them on a regular basis. Yes, it is a pain but losing your money is a bigger pain.


I’m not going to lose my money if I lose my phone. First, they’d have to hack into the phone and then, they’d have to hack into the app. Pretty slim chance unless they’re a large organization with lots of resources. Then, they’d be disappointed in what they’d get from me.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Electraglide said:


> I don't use banking on my phone but I can think of a lot better reasons to ditch a bank than you don't like their app. I've been dealing with the Royal since the mid '60s. Had a BMO account also for a short while in the 90's when I was flagging but I got rid of that and went back to using cash. Nothing worse than being in a store in the middle of no where and your card doesn't work because of their limits. As far as fingerprints go, they're not that secure.


Not ditching the bank. Just the app. Want to move a few dollars over to a bank with a better app experience.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

1SweetRide said:


> Do you have experience with their app?


I use it all the time. Been using it since it came out. There was once I had an issue when I was trying to do an EMT and it won't let me. So I had to go to a bank machine to take out money. But that hasn't happened to me since. Sometimes I do all my banking on my phone. LOL


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

1SweetRide said:


> I’m not going to lose my money if I lose my phone. First, they’d have to hack into the phone and then, they’d have to hack into the app. Pretty slim chance unless they’re a large organization with lots of resources. Then, they’d be disappointed in what they’d get from me.


iPhone - is it up to date with the latest OS if it's not it can be hacked in minutes.
Android - even easier

Once it is hacked they have your email address. If you've ever used that address to logon to a web site that has been compromised they probably have list of passwords you may have used. If nothing else they can hack your email and watch for eTransfers or look for other information. They easily have enough info to open bank accounts and credit cards in your name. People worry about their computer being hacked but it way easier to hack most phones.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I have Scotiabank. They can be annoying setting safety limits on withdrawls.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Kerry Brown said:


> iPhone - is it up to date with the latest OS if it's not it can be hacked in minutes.
> Android - even easier
> 
> Once it is hacked they have your email address. If you've ever used that address to logon to a web site that has been compromised they probably have list of passwords you may have used. If nothing else they can hack your email and watch for eTransfers or look for other information. They easily have enough info to open bank accounts and credit cards in your name. People worry about their computer being hacked but it way easier to hack most phones.


Because it's an app for an iphone wouldn't it be the same for almost all the banks? The info you enter would be different per bank but the basic app would be the same.


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## fretzel (Aug 8, 2014)

Is It Safer to Bank on Your Phone or Your Computer? - NerdWallet


Online and mobile banking are picking up steam. We ask three security experts whether online banking is safer using your smartphone or computer.




www.nerdwallet.com


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## TheYanChamp (Mar 6, 2009)

If you need another basic chequing account I suggest Tangerine.

Its free. That alone is reason to use them. Their app works well, has never not worked. I don't use fingerprint ID so its a short question with one word answer and a 6 digit pin. They have fingerprint ID if you choose.

I really don't know why many on here are proud of being with the same bank for 30-60 years. Its a rip off! With Tangerine, they do not charge on any transactions except for those exploitative ATM's, but who uses cash which is the whole reason for the OP's post. You can use scotiabank machines if you need to deposit or withdraw for free. The only time they suck is if you lose a card, need a money order for a large purchase or physical documents they have to send via registered mail if you don't have a branch, which there aren't many.

I've saved a couple thousand on bank fee's according to their calculator in 6 yrs with the 17-30 bucks/mo I was paying. They link very easily to every other bank out there and its convenient.

Great hub for moving money around.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Kerry Brown said:


> iPhone - is it up to date with the latest OS if it's not it can be hacked in minutes.
> Android - even easier
> 
> Once it is hacked they have your email address. If you've ever used that address to logon to a web site that has been compromised they probably have list of passwords you may have used. If nothing else they can hack your email and watch for eTransfers or look for other information. They easily have enough info to open bank accounts and credit cards in your name. People worry about their computer being hacked but it way easier to hack most phones.


My iPhone is always up-to-date. I’ve worked with agencies responsible for breaking into phones and I’m not worried about Joe Smuck getting my phone. I also don’t ever reuse passwords. Anyway, I’m looking for a good banking up to perform EFTs when doing purchases. I don’t like carrying cash for some reason.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

TheYanChamp said:


> If you need another basic chequing account I suggest Tangerine.
> 
> Its free. That alone is reason to use them. Their app works well, has never not worked. I don't use fingerprint ID so its a short question with one word answer and a 6 digit pin. They have fingerprint ID if you choose.
> 
> ...


Thanks for this tip.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

fretzel said:


> This doesn't help your situation but my wife and I both use the app without issue. iPhone 8 and Samsung S70.
> 
> One in every 25 it will ask me to manually log in but no questions.


Same here. The times it asks are mainly just when I've accessed my account through multiple devices. Eg been back and forth between my laptop and phone. And that's really exactly when it should be asking. It will also ask if I haven't had the app open in a couple weeks or so (which rarely happens) . Which is also good security. I definitely wouldn't say it's frequent though.


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## TheYanChamp (Mar 6, 2009)

1SweetRide said:


> Thanks for this tip.



Looking back, I haven't used my debit card in a few years. I don't normally keep it on me.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Kerry Brown said:


> iPhone - is it up to date with the latest OS if it's not it can be hacked in minutes.
> Android - even easier
> 
> Once it is hacked they have your email address. If you've ever used that address to logon to a web site that has been compromised they probably have list of passwords you may have used. If nothing else they can hack your email and watch for eTransfers or look for other information. They easily have enough info to open bank accounts and credit cards in your name. People worry about their computer being hacked but it way easier to hack most phones.


If they have your phone in hand.

If you're concerned with being hacked electronically, the telecom protocol cellphones use is a lot more secure and robust than your wifi connection at home (newer and learned from the past). And lots of people bank at home on their laptop through their wifi (use a wired LAN connection if you really want to do that). Cellphones are more secure than that. This, from a security expert who came in and cleaned up our weak network security a few years ago.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

High/Deaf said:


> If they have your phone in hand.


Yes, if they have your phone in hand. Same with laptops if you carry it with you. I used to travel to a lot of weird places to ICANN and IETF meetings. Those are the people, mostly engineers, that run the Internet. They all have travel laptops with nothing on them and are very careful with their phones. They never leave their sight in some countries.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

High/Deaf said:


> If they have your phone in hand.
> 
> If you're concerned with being hacked electronically, the telecom protocol cellphones use is a lot more secure and robust than your wifi connection at home (newer and learned from the past). And lots of people bank at home on their laptop through their wifi (use a wired LAN connection if you really want to do that). Cellphones are more secure than that. This, from a security expert who came in and cleaned up our weak network security a few years ago.


The crazy part is there are still people who will access their online banking at places like coffee shops with public WiFi.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

torndownunit said:


> The crazy part is there are still people who will access their online banking at places like coffee shops with public WiFi.


LOL 

No problem. They're probably regularly customers, in for their third $8 cafe machiato that day, so they have nothing in their accounts anyways.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

High/Deaf said:


> LOL
> 
> No problem. They're probably regularly customers, in for their third $8 cafe machiato that day, so they have nothing in their accounts anyways.


Well it is their 'office' after all.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Had a friend who worked lost and found at a large store. First thing they would do if a phone was turned in was to turn it on to see if they could ID the owner. People would be surprised on how many phones are not locked. 


torndownunit said:


> The crazy part is there are still people who will access their online banking at places like coffee shops with public WiFi.


Or while shopping in a store with public wifi. I do it all the time, no need to pay for data.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Electraglide said:


> Had a friend who worked lost and found at a large store. First thing they would do if a phone was turned in was to turn it on to see if they could ID the owner. People would be surprised on how many phones are not locked.
> 
> Or while shopping in a store with public wifi. I do it all the time, no need to pay for data.


I use public WiFi all the time, I just don't log into anything secure at a coffee shop using my laptop though for example. That's just not a great idea security wise.

As for the phones, I can't even imagine that. I have both biometric and PIN security setup on my phones.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

1SweetRide said:


> Do you have experience with their app?


Yes, I use the ios RBC app, but I don't use touch id. That may be why I don't get the third degree every time I try to move money around.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

torndownunit said:


> I use public WiFi all the time, I just don't log into anything secure at a coffee shop using my laptop though for example. That's just not a great idea security wise.
> 
> As for the phones, I can't even imagine that. I have both biometric and PIN security setup on my phones.


I have my phone set up to only respond to a penis print.

The people in the Timmy's lineup were not amused.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

High/Deaf said:


> If they have your phone in hand.
> 
> If you're concerned with being hacked electronically, the telecom protocol cellphones use is a lot more secure and robust than your wifi connection at home (newer and learned from the past). And lots of people bank at home on their laptop through their wifi (use a wired LAN connection if you really want to do that). Cellphones are more secure than that. This, from a security expert who came in and cleaned up our weak network security a few years ago.


I also have a VPN app that I can load up before accessing sensitive data on a public or questionable network.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Kerry Brown said:


> Yes, if they have your phone in hand. Same with laptops if you carry it with you. I used to travel to a lot of weird places to ICANN and IETF meetings. Those are the people, mostly engineers, that run the Internet. They all have travel laptops with nothing on them and are very careful with their phones. They never leave their sight in some countries.


Our organization have burner phones when travel takes us to non-allied countries. Basic smartphone that's sanitized. When we come back, the phones are put through a shredder.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

High/Deaf said:


> I have my phone set up to only respond to a penis print.
> 
> The people in the Timmy's lineup were not amused.


High Deaf trying to pay for coffee in February....."hang on a sec, just have to warm it up a bit, the damn thing's doing the frightened turtle thing again"


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

High/Deaf said:


> I have my phone set up to only respond to a penis print.
> 
> The people in the Timmy's lineup were not amused.


For some reason my penis print requires aggressively rubbing it in the phone. It must be malfunctioning.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

All the B&m banks in this country are more or less the same. the good thing is, they'll never go bankrupt. the bad thing is, its because they arent competitive and couldnt lose money if they tried.
most positive/negative experiences depend on which teller was working at your local branch or who picked up the phone at the call center.
Im mostly with RBC...dont use the mobile app much, but i log in daily from my PC for my stock trading. Its the main reason I stay with them...probably not worth it to me to have to sell and re-purchase my investments if I changed. i have a dormant account with Cibc and my wife uses TD. its all pretty much the same.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

1SweetRide said:


> Our organization have burner phones when travel takes us to non-allied countries. Basic smartphone that's sanitized. When we come back, the phones are put through a shredder.


You must work for the gov't.


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## TheYanChamp (Mar 6, 2009)

1SweetRide said:


> Our organization have burner phones when travel takes us to non-allied countries. Basic smartphone that's sanitized. When we come back, the phones are put through a shredder.



Can you hint to what industry you're in?

Remember guys, at US border customs they can search your devices, force you to unlock them, look up your financial and medical histories without your consent.


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Government but it's pretty much the same modus operandi for any organization going to certain countries. There are hundreds of attacks on these phones during say a one week visit. They are constantly pinged for weaknesses. That's the problem with having to book a hotel room in advance. These nations flood the surrounding rooms and meeting spaces with government hackers.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

1SweetRide said:


> Government but it's pretty much the same modus operandi for any organization going to certain countries. There are hundreds of attacks on these phones during say a one week visit. They are constantly pinged for weaknesses. That's the problem with having to book a hotel room in advance. These nations flood the surrounding rooms and meeting spaces with government hackers.


I guess that you have to go to the states no matter what which is where the burner comes in. I also guess that this is policy for all parties and has been so for a long time, no matter who's in power. I'm wondering why they just can't sanitize the phone when it comes back and re-use it instead of shredding it. Which reminds me I just got a text on my burner saying the acct. will be deactivated on the 24th.....been a while since I put minutes on it. Time to factory it,get a new sim from the Dollar Store and set it up again. 


TheYanChamp said:


> Can you hint to what industry you're in?
> 
> Remember guys, at US border customs they can search your devices, force you to unlock them, look up your financial and medical histories without your consent.


A good reason to get a burner. That way any texts, calls, emails etc. you have are safe. Not too sure why you'd have your medical history on your phone. I recall the last time I went to the states....it's been a while....I didn't have a phone with me. Got one about 100 miles south of the border.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Kerry Brown said:


> Yes, if they have your phone in hand. Same with laptops if you carry it with you. I used to travel to a lot of weird places to ICANN and IETF meetings. Those are the people, mostly engineers, that run the Internet. They all have travel laptops with nothing on them and are very careful with their phones. They never leave their sight in some countries.


Do they need your phone in hand or just have to be near it. From what I understand there are readers for cell phones the same as there are skimmers and shimmers and other readers for your debit and credit cards.....just have to get them near a person. Same with laptops, tablets etc..


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## 1SweetRide (Oct 25, 2016)

Electraglide said:


> I guess that you have to go to the states no matter what which is where the burner comes in. I also guess that this is policy for all parties and has been so for a long time, no matter who's in power. I'm wondering why they just can't sanitize the phone when it comes back and re-use it instead of shredding it. Which reminds me I just got a text on my burner saying the acct. will be deactivated on the 24th.....been a while since I put minutes on it. Time to factory it,get a new sim from the Dollar Store and set it up again.
> 
> A good reason to get a burner. That way any texts, calls, emails etc. you have are safe. Not too sure why you'd have your medical history on your phone. I recall the last time I went to the states....it's been a while....I didn't have a phone with me. Got one about 100 miles south of the border.


It's not as much of a waste as you might think. It's a very small number of phones. The hacks are very sophisticated and government sponsored malware is designed to survive a wipe, re-boot, reset, etc. Keeping Canada's information secure is the priority.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

1SweetRide said:


> It's not as much of a waste as you might think. It's a very small number of phones. The hacks are very sophisticated and government sponsored malware is designed to survive a wipe, re-boot, reset, etc. Keeping Canada's information secure is the priority.


Not too sure how secure that is but since CSIS has problems with this number used in scams, 613-993-9620, same with CRA and RCMP numbers used I figure hackers etc. have better ways of getting that info. Especially with a few other countries in the mix.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

If the police have these tools so do the bad guys.









Police in 50 states have tools to crack locked smartphones: Report


Once they break into someone's phones, police can extract their photos, text messages, contacts, and web browsing history.



www.businessinsider.com


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Kerry Brown said:


> If the police have these tools so do the bad guys.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yup.


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