# NGD Vintage Canadian Content... Norman Classical Guitar C-20



## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

Saw this come up on Kijiji last night and snapped her up today. I thought I was getting some sort of early version of the La Patrie Étude, but was very surprised when I went to pick it up and saw what was in the case. I have never seen a Norman like this before and I'm guessing it's around 40 years old. The owner had inherited it from her father and put it in her closet for 30 years. The cardboard alligator case is (laughably) in the finest condition that I've ever seen one in. As for the guitar, it has a crack in the top that I'll need to address but is otherwise in reasonable order. 

There was another person there before me who passed on it. I think he may have been confused by the bolt on neck, but I've seen that before. That's the way old Norman's were built. 

On to the pics. (And just in time for Canada Day!)
























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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

It's a model C-20. I didn't come across anything on the internets about it.


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

The rosette looks like it's been done by hand. 











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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

These must be caps hiding the neck bolts. Not sure. 











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## Blind Dog (Mar 4, 2016)

Perfect way to celebrate -- Happy Canada Day!

Congrat's on the cool old Canadian guitar, and case. Dig it!


..................._"  I use smelly, old, chicken McNuggets to catch them real old cases! "............_


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## rollingdam (May 11, 2006)

I guess you beat me to it-the caps hide 2 screws-even if you remove them, the neck will stay on, as those guitars also had wood dowels holding the neck to the body.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Send an email to [email protected] they can tell you a lot more about it. It is a very odd model number being it starts with a "C" and not a "B". It does say handmade and when I look at the details I have to agree looks like everything is done by hand. Nice score


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

knight_yyz said:


> Send an email to [email protected] they can tell you a lot more about it. It is a very odd model number being it starts with a "C" and not a "B". It does say handmade and when I look at the details I have to agree looks like everything is done by hand. Nice score


First thing I did was shoot them an email! I am really curious to date it. It is a C model, presumably because it is a nylon folk/classical style guitar. It is very playable and the neck angle is just about prefect in my estimation. The saddle might get a shave as it's clearly not been touched since it was built. The strings are disgusting, there is a new/old set in the case but they can stay in their package. I need to head out to L&M and pick out some nylon strings and set it up. Not sure if I'll set it up as a classical or squeak the action a bit lower. Most importantly, I need to decide how I will repair the crack in the top. It's stable and old, but I'm fussy. I'll post a pic or start a separate thread on that when I have a chance.


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## rollingdam (May 11, 2006)

I would recommend you order these strings as the Norman is probably braced heavy enough

Thomastik Infeld KR116 Classic S Series Flatwound Guitar Strings


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

rollingdam said:


> I would recommend you order these strings as the Norman is probably braced heavy enough


Wow, they aren't cheap. I hadn't considered anything like that though. Will look into it & thx for the tip!


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

IMHO, that is a very nice find, L-H. If it is 40 years old, it would be just after or just before Robert Godin purchased the Norman guitar factory. Here is a little bit of information on what happened. (No deer but a guitar factory). You will get this when you read the article. lol

Builder Profile: Godin Guitars


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

So, I head back from Godin... !!!



> Your Norman C20 was built in 1974. It has a solid spruce top, a solid rosewood back, a mahogany neck and a rosewood fingerboard and bridge.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Sweet


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I read somewhere that when Norman was starting up his business he rented a D18 or 28 maybe and took it apart to see how they were built. Eventually he re- assembled the Martin guitar and took it back to the rental place which was kind of a mom and pop joint with a fairly strict business model. Pop took one look at the Martin guitar, wasn't having none of it, and busted Norman's nose. 

Norman made good guitars though. I have a B20(6) bought in 2000 and it has held up pretty good.


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

Wardo said:


> I read somewhere that when Norman was starting up his business he rented a D18 or 28 maybe and took it apart to see how they were built. Eventually he re- assembled the Martin guitar and took it back to the rental place which was kind of a mom and pop joint with a fairly strict business model. Pop took one look at the Martin guitar, wasn't having none of it, and busted Norman's nose.


Haha! That might be a true story, there are some small town areas in Quebec that are fairly rough and tumble.


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hi all, new here, I can answer a bit about your guitar.
C goes for Classical
The white label was used between 1973-1975
Serial 1007 means it is the 7th C-20
The rosette and back strip were hand made by Normand Boucher
The story about taking apart a Martin never happened...
Normand had a Martin 00-40H of his own given by is father in the '30s 
Normand made quite a few classical guitars from 1967 to 1971 before they where using labels
Those are scrarce and hard to find
Rosewood may be Braz, at the time they were using whatever was found
Dan


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hi again
Checked out my archives
C-20 serial 1007 went out the shop on july 8 1974
Total of 12 were made in 1974

Could you confirm it is an X braced, not fan braced
Thanks

Dan


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Daniel Laroche said:


> The story about taking apart a Martin never happened...


I am sure that you are correct but it's a good story all the same ... lol


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hey true, good story
Maybe I'm wrong just never heard of it
I know Normand spent hours and hours with a flashlight and a mirror exploring and measuring is own OO Martin.
It is most probably true that he borrowed a Martin D for measurement and most probably a Gibson 24.75 short scale
A guy came to the shop one day to get is Martin D-35 fixed. Normand lend him Norman a B-50. The guy never came back.
Apperently the D-35 was not that great sounding and ended up in the back room. It was later falsely knowned to be the origin of Norman guitars.
It is now owned by Claude, Normand's son
Dan


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

Daniel Laroche said:


> Hi again
> Checked out my archives
> C-20 serial 1007 went out the shop on july 8 1974
> Total of 12 were made in 1974
> ...


Very interesting information! Thank you for sharing. Here are a few pictures of the bracing, I assume this is X bracing or some variation thereof. 


















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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hey Lord Humong, Thanks
We don't see the center X but definately X braced
So kind of a classical with folk bracing is what I thoughted
What I've never done is measure the angle of the X and compare it to a Martin or Gibson
'Cause we don't really know Normand's original bracing inspiration......never ending quest 
Dan


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Daniel Laroche said:


> Hey true, good story
> Maybe I'm wrong just never heard of it


Yeah, I was going to ask you if you'd ever heard it. I read it somewhere and the story was that he rented a Martin took it apart and then the rental place wouldn't take it back. I think it's almost certainly something that someone just made up but I thought that the idea was amusing; dude rents a guitar, takes apart and then starts his own business etc. The bit about the mom and pop joint I just added that in.

But at the end of the day he made some really good guitars. I ended up with a B20 in 2000 when I went to get strings - tried the guitar with no intention of buying it and it occurred to me that for that kind of money I'm not leaving this thing behind. I was walking around the store with it in my hand so no one could take it while I was looking at other stuff. ... lol


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Ah Ah !!
Well Mrs Boucher, Normand's widow (still alive at age 92)
Once said to me : "Those damned B-20 were sounding too good..."


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## rollingdam (May 11, 2006)

Daniel Laroche said:


> Ah Ah !!
> Well Mrs Boucher, Normand's widow (still alive at age 92)
> Once said to me : "Those damned B-20 were sounding too good..."


Daniel are you the one who had a website with the original Normans?-it was once on the Boucher guitars site but disappeared.


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hey Rollingdam hi, yes I am
Closed down the site when the host server was shot down
Also got fed up anserwing questions like : How much is my "rare" B-20's worth... is it worth 1000$ ?...
All of my questions regarding the origin of local guitar factories being answered, I went elsewhere learning banjo and mandolin, than back to guitars
But...I just cannot not answer questions regarding the era where as a teen I got pushed in that Norman-Quebec-post woodstock-music-storm of the early 70's
Happy to post but no more web site for me 
Dan


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## billythekid (Jun 2, 2018)

Dan,

I always wondered why that site disappeared. I used to look through it a lot. From a user point of view, it was very informative. More helpful than anything else I ever found when it came to Normans. At the time, I had just found a B50 with a bolt on neck. Maple back and sides. Bright but what an exceptional tone it had to my ears. Only thing I didn’t like about it was the neck weight. Felt like there was a 5 Ib bag of sugar on the headstock.

billythekid


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## JethroTech (Dec 8, 2015)

I'm looking for a decent classical guitar and was recently offered a "vintage" Norman C-80, although it could be C-30 as the ink on the white label has faded a bit. The seller sent me some pics but I was thrown off by the bolt-on neck and I politely declined. Did I miss out on something good? It might not be too late  Thank you.


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

JethroTech said:


> I'm looking for a decent classical guitar and was recently offered a "vintage" Norman C-80, although it could be C-30 as the ink on the white label has faded a bit. The seller sent me some pics but I was thrown off by the bolt-on neck and I politely declined. Did I miss out on something good? It might not be too late  Thank you.


Oh dang, I'd be very interested in finding out more about that one. Insofar as it as a classical guitar, I can't really comment on it as I don't play that style nor have I ever owned or played a proper classical guitar to compare it to. What I can say though is that I've set mine up with a light action and play it as I would a nylon folk style guitar. The bolt on neck is actually a good feature in my opinion because you don't need to worry about a bum neck joint or getting the neck reset. I actually unbolted the neck on mine and took it off when I went over the guitar and set it up. It's a really innovative design. 

My best advice would be to snag it if the price is reasonable. I'm pretty sure you would be able to sell it in this community (ie: on the forum) if you don't love it.... ! I'd love to see the pics that you have of it, there's very little on the internet about these guitars.


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hey Yo!
Billy, The site went down mainly because the server hosting it was shut down and because I was fed up with anserwing : "do you think my vintage B-20 is woth 800$ so I can sell it on Kijiji?"
But we might be in the process of preparing something with members of the Boucher family......
As for C-20 C-80 and such, old classical Normans are most of the time good workhorse, more like a folk guitar.
Dan


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

I think all Godin products have bolt on necks, don't they?


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## Tyyy (Sep 3, 2018)

Hello!
new member here and i am looking for help with new to me B20-12 with bolt on neck like the classical in this thread








Thanks


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## Tyyy (Sep 3, 2018)

....the image would have shown red label ser#2423


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hi
B-20-12 #2423 = april 5th 1977
637 were made that year, yours in the 66th
Laminated wild cherry back sides and top, maple neck, rosewood fingerboard and bridge
Probably a single action truss rod
6 on a plate tuners (?) or black plastic single tuners (?) or else (!)
Dan


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## Gengzhi Wang (Jun 25, 2019)

Hi, Dan.
I’m a new member. Do you have any information about a Norman C-100? The owner told me he bought it new 35 years ago and payed 700$ Back then, is that true?


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## zguitz (Aug 18, 2017)

Hey!
Sorry, can't tell you if it's true or not...
C-100 from the '70s, '80s ? serial number, label type and photos would help 
Dan


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## Blind Dog (Mar 4, 2016)

withdrawn


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## Gengzhi Wang (Jun 25, 2019)

Forgot to check this post. The serial number is B18248. Really can’t find too much info.


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