# Shiraki, anyone?



## Lester B. Flat

I'm looking for owners of Shiraki guitars. It seems there were very few of them made in the early 80's. They were made in Japan but so far my search has only turned up a few owners in Canada and The Netherlands. None of these guitars have serial numbers and they have a "mystery history". Three or four different models have turned up but the one thing they have in common is the uniquely carved(?) sound holes. They are all beautifully finished and constructed and mine sounds like no other guitar ever produced. Small, lightweight, arched top and back, with a pickup under the bridge and those unique "f-holes". 

I know of perhaps two or three others like mine and they were all sold in either Ontario or the Maritimes. Anyone in the west ever see something like this or any other Shiraki guitar?


Besides the mystery of who made them there is also a question of how the grille work was done. A luthier told me he though it was laser carved. The width of the slits seems to vary in width according to to the grain in the wood. Maybe some of you luthiers can tell me how that may have been done.


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## shad

Hi Lester,
I to own a Shirak (i) guitar and I am from the west (B.C.). I don't know much about it but I have heard twice that Paul McCartney plays one. One just sold on ebay for 510 pounds (in England I think). Mine is a flat top with similar laser carvings for the sond hole. The neck is very nice and the sound is excellent but lacks a little on the bass end. I have met one other owner out here and his is similar to mine but with some differences in the carvings. There is no serial number and I would love to find out more about this guitar. Have you had any other replies to your post?


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## Lester B. Flat

Hi Shad,

Well, you're the first responder to this post but I have been in e-mail contact with some leads I got from Harmony Central. I'd like to see a photo of your guitar. It sounds similar to one owned by a guy in The Netherlands. Does it have an under-the-bridge pickup?

I don't know of any these guitars in the U.S., just Canada, France and The Netherlands so far. Nobody knows any more than I do about who actually made them. No serial numbers on any of them unless you have to crack them open to find it. Maybe it's time to start a Shiraki website.

Do you know Paul McCartney's e-mail address?


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## hardcorelogo

Hi Lester,

I remember these guitars...I've never owned one, but always liked them. They are extremely hard to come by. The Shirakis were produced in the late 70s and early 80s under the supervision of the Matsumoko factory, although it it's not certain that they were actually produced on that site. I hope you're not offended that the guitar was produced by Matsumoko and in a factory setting, Matsumoko has an awesome reputation in that era for building the best Japanese guitars of the time. (Aria, Vantage, Electra etc.) They were known for really high quality neck-thru electrics, usally characterized by different exotic wood used for the necks than for the wings of the body, resuling in a stripe down the center kind of a look.

those guitars are of very high quality and workmanship, even for Matsumoko, and all the carvings and decoration is indeed hand done. The technology for laser carving of that nature and intricacy (especially on thin spruce or cedar) undoubtedly didn't exist in 1979. I seem to remember (as you have said) the spacing and consistency of the carved sections is slightly different throughout the guitar.

I remember my local guitar store in belleville ontario having one back in the early 80's. I wanted it bad, but was ridiculously poor 

I think they are beautiful, and definitely rare. you're lucky to have one, thanks for the pics!


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## Lester B. Flat

Wow! After 24 years of searching I finally have an answer. I knew there had to be a factory behind the production and distribution and I'm certainly not offended. It's a gorgeous guitar. The "master Japanese luthier" theory sounded too much like an urban myth, although if those soundholes are indeed hand-carved, they were definitely done by a master wood carver. It still boggles my mind since there is no stain or poly on the sides of the slats, like it was done after the finish was applied. I even wondered if it had been sandblasted through a template removing only the softer wood, as the darker denser part of the grain aligns with the slats.

Anyway, thanks for the answers to most of my questions on this.:thanks5qx:


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## sneakypete

why wouldn`t the Japanese have master wood workers?...we were at a shrine today that been standing, well they aren`t sure but the first record of it is 820 A.D. and most of it is wood. Seems natural to me that they would have taken to guitar building quite naturally. Most of the best guitars the Japanese make today are unknown outside the country and many acoustic builder are pushing the envelope in terms of design. Thats a lovely guitar in the pics cherish it, and I`d wager there would be plenty of Japanese collectors who`d pay a lot of money for it should it ever come up for sale.


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## Lester B. Flat

You're right, the Japanese are known for their carvers of all sorts of material. I wasn't questioning their ability. It's just that "Shiraki was a master luthier from Japan" sounded like a convenient explanation from someone who didn't really know. I've simply never found any evidence to back it up or refute it. Even knowing they were connected with the Matsumoko factory doesn't rule out or confirm whether the Shiraki name refers to a specific person or not.

What I'd like to know now is how many were made. What I have seen or heard about accounts for less than 20. Most are full size flat tops with varying decoration, one electric 335 style, and 3 or 4 like mine. I guess my next step is to contact the Matsumoko factory if they're still around. Japanese collectors would need a lot of yen to pry this out of my fingers. 

Shad: The one sold on e-bay was one of the guitars from the Netherlands.


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## shad

Hi Lester,
I look forward to hearing about your research on the Matsumoko factory, it would be nice to know how many Shiraki's were made. My Shiraki is very much like the one from the Netherlands that sold on ebay. I will post pics soon. On another subject, I recently picked up a guitar at an auction, it appears to be a Samick (Greg Bennett model) but the label inside reads Samich, with an "h". Is this a knockoff of the real thing or what?


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## Lester B. Flat

shad said:


> Hi Lester,
> I look forward to hearing about your research on the Matsumoko factory, it would be nice to know how many Shiraki's were made. My Shiraki is very much like the one from the Netherlands that sold on ebay. I will post pics soon. On another subject, I recently picked up a guitar at an auction, it appears to be a Samick (Greg Bennett model) but the label inside reads Samich, with an "h". Is this a knockoff of the real thing or what?


Well, I've hit somewhat of a dead end. In my reasearch of the Matsumoko factory I discovered they went out of business in the mid 80's. In one account, the factory was destroyed by fire in 1985, another has it being burned in 1988, after which many of the brands being produced (Aria, Univox, Westbury, Westone) were moved to the Samick factory in Korea. Chances are any records of production may have been lost.
In another account, the Matsumoko factory, which also produced sewing machines, was bought by Singer in 1987 after which all guitar production was stopped. Either way, the trail has been dusted over for the last 20 years.

It's funny you asked about Samick considering what I discovered. I don't know if Samich is a knockoff of Samick, which are likely knockoffs of something else. I don't know if any Samick is the "real thing".


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## shad

Hi Lester,
I have been trying unsuccessfully to post the pics of my Shiraki, I am now told that it can't be done with attachments anymore. The site people told me of another way to do it, but as I am a wee bit computer challenged it was all Greek to me. I do know how to send a jpg by email so if you are interested, send me a private message with your email address and I'll send them to you. I have been sending out some inquiries to some so-called guitar experts that I found on the internet, and guess what? they've never heard of a Shiraki! I'm thinking these guitars are very rare. Have you had any other responses?
Shad.


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## zao_89

Wow, thats a really good looking guitar you have there.


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## Lester B. Flat

shad said:


> Hi Lester,
> I have been trying unsuccessfully to post the pics of my Shiraki, I am now told that it can't be done with attachments anymore. The site people told me of another way to do it, but as I am a wee bit computer challenged it was all Greek to me. I do know how to send a jpg by email so if you are interested, send me a private message with your email address and I'll send them to you. I have been sending out some inquiries to some so-called guitar experts that I found on the internet, and guess what? they've never heard of a Shiraki! I'm thinking these guitars are very rare. Have you had any other responses?
> Shad.


The owners seem to know the most and that ain't much! Sent you a message. I'll post your pics.


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## Lester B. Flat

shad said:


> Hi Lester,
> I have been trying unsuccessfully to post the pics of my Shiraki, I am now told that it can't be done with attachments anymore. The site people told me of another way to do it, but as I am a wee bit computer challenged it was all Greek to me. I do know how to send a jpg by email so if you are interested, send me a private message with your email address and I'll send them to you. I have been sending out some inquiries to some so-called guitar experts that I found on the internet, and guess what? they've never heard of a Shiraki! I'm thinking these guitars are very rare. Have you had any other responses?
> Shad.


Here ya go , Shad. Nice looking guitar! The Dutch dude's guitar is similar to this. I'll see if I can find the pics and get his permission to post them or at least send them to you.


Shad's Shiraki


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## stefan

this is mine :


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## Lester B. Flat

Hi Stefan,

That's the most intricate carving I've seen yet! Tell me more. Where are you located? How long have you had it? More pics would be nice. :smilie_flagge17:


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## stefan

i have this guitar since 1994, i think. (i live in belgium).
bought it second hand; the bridge was repaired by a luthier before i bought it.
i will post some other pics tonight.
nice guitar to look at, but i don't like the sound, 
'sounds like playing in the toilet', a guitarist told me once.


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## stefan

these are my other pics :


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## shad

Hi Stefan,
Nice looking guitar, is it acoustic only or electric as well? I can't tell from the pics. I like the sound of my Shiraki, but I wish it had a little more bass. Have you seen other Shiraki's in Belgium?
Shad


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## stefan

hello,

no, it is strictly acoustic, and i have never seen these guitars before.
the guitars on this site are the first i've seen. 
i tried to sell it once, on ebay, but the auction did'nt go higher than 80 euros so i just kept it.

grtz


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## delshardware

*Shiraki or Shirak Mandolin*

I'm glad to see that Shiraki or Shirak instruments are so rare because I just inherited a Shiraki Mandolin from my father.He has had this Mandolin since the mid 80's and it is the same exotic wood and intricate details as the guitars you have posted.I've been looking on the net for any info about these Mandolins and I wouldn't be surprised if I've got one of one ! I live in Nova scotia. If anyone has seen one of these please let me know! I'll send a pic if I can figure out how to post a pic on this site .


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## Lester B. Flat

A mandolin? Cool! I'd love to see a pic. Send me a PM and I'll help you post it.

Welcome to the forum!:smilie_flagge17:


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## Chi_Masta_G

*another canuck shiraki*

I bought mine used in Kingston Ontario for $800 CAD in 1988. Mine looks like one that's for sale on ebay from the uk (the netherlands?--i can't find it anymore). The roses and dove motif. I was told it was laser cut after the finish by a factory in Japan. Unfortunately the action starting going and the bridge was coming up, warping the top. I had to have a lutier cut a soundhole so that it would be fixable. It still sounds great but I miss the unique aspect of having no soundhole.


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## bRian

I think my wife must be right.....my mind does seem to be in the gutter much of the time. I first looked at this thread and was expecting to see pics of Shakira. Nice looking guitars.


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## shad

Is there any info visible through the new sound hole, like a serial number or the manufacturers name?
shad


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## Lester B. Flat

Chi_Masta_G said:


> I bought mine used in Kingston Ontario for $800 CAD in 1988. Mine looks like one that's for sale on ebay from the uk (the netherlands?--i can't find it anymore). The roses and dove motif. I was told it was laser cut after the finish by a factory in Japan. Unfortunately the action starting going and the bridge was coming up, warping the top. I had to have a lutier cut a soundhole so that it would be fixable. It still sounds great but I miss the unique aspect of having no soundhole.


Thanks for checking in Chi Masta. Love to see a photo of your modded Shiraki.


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## Pacem

My Shiraki is the exact same as Stefans. Which reminds me to ask, is there any engraving on the back of the head, like numbers for example Stefan? It's in horrible shape, its been around the block. I'm from the Vancouver area. I've spent alot of time looking it up and thought I'd try again today, low and behold this thread was new.... Great stuff. I'm trying to sell it. And its hella hard to sell something when you don't anything about it, lol.

They few i've found online have seemed to come from Canada. I phoned a guy in Florida who had one for sale on his website. He explained to me he bought it in Calgary in the early 80's. It was a small shop that had 3 of them, all different.

I'm glad to find out the myth of the famous "Japanese Luthier" has been dissmissed.

Take it easy, i'll keep checking this place out, I run across some cool stuff alot.


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## Stephen W.

*Same same BUT, not really.*

I have just tracked down the truth about another make. It's funny how these two stories sounded so similar. I thought there had to be a connection.
While at the Guitar World stores a couple of weeks ago I was offered and played two acoustics labelled:
Landscape, Designed by Soundport Technologies in the U.S.A.
The story I was told was that they were hand built in Japan by a little known but highly skilled luthier in very small quantities. The interesting thing is that on the base side of both the upper and lower bouts there are intricately carved patterns. I'm sure these where laser cut into the blanks prior to bending them for the sides.
I've been phoning, emailing and surfing off and on ever since. Tonight, I struck paydirt. Woody Mann plays Landscapes. From the LINKS page on his site I found HOOK UP Inc. in Japan.
Now load up your favourite translation site, (I used AltaVista's Babel Fish. Translation) Then paste in this URL and go from Japanese to English. 
http://www.hookup.co.jp/guitar/landscape/spt.html
(Translations are a hoot.)


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## Lester B. Flat

Thanks Pacem, for adding to what now is perhaps the largest database of Shiraki guitars (and one mandolin!) anywhere on the web, as modest as it is.

There's more of these out there than I originally thought, but that's still only about twenty known to me. I expect a few more will turn up.

A reminder to all: If you've got photos, post 'em! Thanks to everyone who has responded to this thread and keep them coming.


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## mdegraef

*another Shiraki guitar*

Hi Lester, 

I'm originally from Antwerp, Belgium, and now I live in Pittsburgh. In
1978 I bought a Shiraki classical guitar in a small store in Antwerp. Instead
of a sound hole it has a carved profile, similar to the ones that were shown
in various pictures; the difference is that the carving is located where the sound hole normally is, under the strings. 
It is my absolute favorite guitar ever. The sound is 
very warm, with good base tones and a relatively long sustain (for a 
classical guitar). It also has an under-the-bridge pick-up, but unfortunately 
that doesn't work anymore; maybe a loose wire somehere...the lack of a
sound hole makes it pretty tough to get inside the guitar. I've had the
frets reseated recently, since several of them came loose; I've played 
it nearly every day for the past nearly 30 years.

In 1986 I spent some time in Tokyo, and there was a store there that 
had several of the Shiraki models, including the one you showed in your 
pictures. I've never seen them anywhere else. I can't remember the name
or location of the store (Tokyo is a pretty big city and my knowledge of 
Japanese is non-existent....).

Anyway, I'm glad to find out that there are a few of these guitars around!

I'll try to post a picture soon.

Regards,
Marc.


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## Lester B. Flat

Good to hear from you Marc. A classical, eh? I'm beginning to think they tried a little bit of everything. You're also the first guy I know of who has seen one in Japan. Photos would be great!:food-smiley-015:


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## delshardware

*Shiraki Mandolin Pictures*



Lester B. Flat said:


> A mandolin? Cool! I'd love to see a pic. Send me a PM and I'll help you post it.
> 
> Welcome to the forum!:smilie_flagge17:


Hello Lester ! I hope that the pics insertion works! 
I would love to know if anyone out there has one of these or if anyone has even seen one!http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k96/delshardware/shiraki2.jpg


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## mdegraef

*Shiraki*

Lester,

I found two links on French chat forums (or is it fora?):

http://www.delcamp.net/forum/fr/viewtopic.php?t=561&highlight=shiraki

and

http://www.delcamp.net/forum/fr/viewtopic.php?t=4301&highlight=shiraki

I don't know how good your French is, but my classical guitar is very similar
to the first picture in the second link. You can see the name "shiraki" at
the top op the "sound hole". I'll try to get a better picture later this week.

From what I could understand from some of the entries, it appears that the 
cutaway patterns were made with a high pressure water jet; the pressure
on such jets can be finely controlled so that it would be possible to remove
the softer wood, but leave the harder veins (or whatever they are called).

More later,
Marc.


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## bert

*yet another shirak(i)*

hello lester,

my name is bert and i am from the netherlands.
i also own a shirak, and ofcourse i would like to know more about its
orrigin. so i'm very pleased that i discovered this side today.
my shirak is a classic guitar (nylon stringed) with no electrics.
the soundhole is in the normal place and the carving shows flowers and leaves, and in the top of the soundhole the name shirak is carved.
i bought this guitar myself, brand new, in 1979 or 1980 here in holland.
used woods are dificult to say, judging by looks and sound the top must be ceder. sides and back i think are mahogeny, but i'm not sure.
the sound is great, very warm with good expression.
will send foto's as soon as possible.

greatings,
bert


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## Lester B. Flat

Hi Bert,

Thanks for checking in with us. Another classical, eh? No serial number I expect? I'm starting to lose mental track of all these instruments and it's time to start compiling a list of some sort. Love to see some photos!

:food-smiley-004:


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## Lester B. Flat

mdegraef said:


> Lester,
> 
> I found two links on French chat forums (or is it fora?):
> 
> http://www.delcamp.net/forum/fr/viewtopic.php?t=561&highlight=shiraki
> 
> and
> 
> http://www.delcamp.net/forum/fr/viewtopic.php?t=4301&highlight=shiraki
> 
> I don't know how good your French is, but my classical guitar is very similar
> to the first picture in the second link. You can see the name "shiraki" at
> the top op the "sound hole". I'll try to get a better picture later this week.
> 
> From what I could understand from some of the entries, it appears that the
> cutaway patterns were made with a high pressure water jet; the pressure
> on such jets can be finely controlled so that it would be possible to remove
> the softer wood, but leave the harder veins (or whatever they are called).
> 
> More later,
> Marc.



Thanks for the links, Marc. At least I understand the pictures! The watersaw idea is best explanation yet.


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## bert

hi lester,
here are the pics. i think if you compare my shiraki with the one on the french site it looks very similar! maybe marc can compare his guitar with the pictures of my guitar, and if they are similer we have 3 identical.
on the turkish tv i saw a guitarplayer with exact the same shiraki as mine,
that would make 4. so maybe some serial production afterall!
at least for the classical type.
best thing to do lester, is to find a tv station that will sponsor your trip to japan to find shiraki's historie.It could be a great documentary!
anyway, good luck with your search.
bert
images of my guitar:


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## Lester B. Flat

bert said:


> best thing to do lester, is to find a tv station that will sponsor your trip to japan to find shiraki's historie.It could be a great documentary!


Hmm. I don't know if I'm ready for primetime!

Cool soundhole!


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## Gplayer

*shiraki*

Hi Lester, it's great to see this info on the shiraki guitar as I've tried for a long time to find something. I also have the Les Paul style body Shiraki as in your picture ( cutaway electric acoustic ). All I know is that I purchased it in a small music shop in Parksville BC called Len's Music back in 1979 and it was only a year old at that time supposedly. I've had many good years of playing it for many styles of music. The store mentioned actually had a number of them for sale at that time but they were all the flat top style acoustics with percussion hole in the normal position, all but mine anyway. The fellow informed me then that they were made in Japan by a very reputable guitar company and that the carvings were done by laser. I've had many shops and Luthiers offer to purchase it but of course would never even think of it as I'm very happy with it. I've also had it appraised by an expert in Vancouver for insurance purposes back in 1995 and they suggested no less than $1500 US as it would be near impossible to replace if not impossible. I receive huge compliments on it every time I take it to a jam or gig. Again this is sure great. Gplayer:food-smiley-004:


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## Lester B. Flat

Welcome aboard, Gplayer! So you've got one like mine eh? Throw a photo up when you get a chance, I'd love to see it. I had mine appraised around the same time for the same amount. I also consider mine irreplaceable. Have you made any mods or is it still original? No serial number I assume?


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## Gplayer

*Shiraki cutaway*

:food-smiley-004: :food-smiley-004: Hi Lester,
I'll get some pics loaded as soon as I can. As far as I can tell from your pics it's identical model. I've never done any mods at all and as everyone knows that owns one there's no serial # that can be found. I'm thinking of taking off the control knob plate and having a look around inside to see if there might be a label anywhere. I'll have to think about it though as I've never had to go inside and am a little hesitant, some food for thought though. I just took my baby over to a local music shop where the owner and I do some jamming, he's an older fella, probably late 60's and has an extensive history of playing and studio recording with some very well known players over the years and also a Luthier, and boy was he impressed with it. He had'nt ever seen one and loved the action, look and sound and this fella's an amazing guitar picker who's opinion I respect. I'm also going to see if I can track down the fella that I originally bought it from as he may still remember some things or have literature kicking around. Hopefully more info coming soon.
Gplayer


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## shad

Hi Gplayer, nice to have another Shiraki owner on the site. I think you are the ninth one since Lester started this thread. If possible I'd like to get the name of the expert in Vancouver who did your appraisal, I'd like to get mine done too. I look forward to seeing your pics.
Shad.:food-smiley-004:


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## Gplayer

*Shiraki cutaway*

Hey Shad,
It's been a few years but I'll try and dig up the paperwork on the appraisal.
I do remember this much, it was a Vintage guitar dealer / appraiser in the downtown core of Vancouver located on Granville St. just over the bridge on the right side, sorry but I can't remeber the name of the bridge or shop. Hope this helps for now. I have made some calls to some people that hopefully will be able to track down the dealer that I purchased it from and maybe something will come of it.
Great to be on board,
Gplayer:food-smiley-004:


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## Lester B. Flat

Gplayer said:


> Hey Shad,
> It's been a few years but I'll try and dig up the paperwork on the appraisal.
> I do remember this much, it was a Vintage guitar dealer / appraiser in the downtown core of Vancouver located on Granville St. just over the bridge on the right side, sorry but I can't remeber the name of the bridge or shop. Hope this helps for now. I have made some calls to some people that hopefully will be able to track down the dealer that I purchased it from and maybe something will come of it.
> Great to be on board,
> Gplayer:food-smiley-004:


Hey Gplayer, if you do happen to track down the dealer, ask him if he remembers who the distributor/importer was. It just occured to me that the Canadian distributor may have been on the west coast since there are quite a few guitars coming to light from there. It only makes sense since they came from Japan.


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## Gplayer

*Shiraki Distributor*

Hi Lester / Shad,
I've managed to locate the fellow I purchased the guitar from and he gave me some names that he thought were the distributors at the time.

I'm attempting to locate these people and get more info if possible. Hopefully I will be posting answers to all of our questions very soon !!!

What's really amazing though is the fellow that sold me the guitar whom I have'nt seen in 28 years remembers the specific guitar I purchased and this store sold alot of guitars over the years. Tells us something about the uniqueness would'nt you say ?

Gplayer:food-smiley-004:


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## Lester B. Flat

Good luck sleuthing and keep us posted!:food-smiley-004:


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## Gplayer

*Lester B. Flat*

Hello Lester,
The company Kief Music remembers the guitars but unfortunatley were'nt the distributors. They tell me they think it was a company from Mississauga 
( Toronto ) called B & J. This company if still in existance may have some info. Perhaps they can be found or owners tracked down if no longer operating. I'll keep trying !
Gplayer:food-smiley-004:


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## Cyar

*Shiraki Owner and loving it*

Hey lester. I too have a Shiraki guitar and have never seen one like mine. I live in Port Colborne Ontario.
I don't have a pickup in mine and would love to put one in but am so afraid that it might damage the guitar, that I don't want to try it. I love the sound and the action and everything about it. I bought it new about 25 years ago at Central Music in Welland for approx. $500 Canadian. I have played it in all kinds of weather - heat of the summer to the cold of winter on a bus - even walked from the building to the bus, playing it. I love it and was hoping to find somewhere to buy another when I came upon your message.
I have some pics I took today and I'll post them as soon as I can.
It is great to find other Shiraki owners.


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## Lester B. Flat

Hi Cyar, welcome to the forum. Let's see those photos!


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## Cyar

*Photos*

Here are the photos.

































Pics are a bit big sorry!


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## shad

Hi Cyar,
Welcome to the forum from a fellow Shiraki owner. That is a beauty for sure, I don't think I'd try putting in a pickup though. What gauge strings are you using there? :food-smiley-004:


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## Cyar

Hey Shad

Thanks. You have a great looking guitar as well. I really like the etched out design around the outside edge of yours. Looks great. How is the lower tones on yours. Mine is pretty good. I actually get a pretty full sound.
I use .011 gauge. I like Elixir custom lights.
I don't know if this is part of the urban legend, but I thought that someone told me (a friend of a friend who had a cousin who was married to a girl who's husband knew a guy that...:smile that they calculate the diameter of a regular hole and use that space in the design. So the lasered out or etched out part equals what you woud get in a regular hole. (I guess the theory isn't the same for the electric accoustics). Like I said, probably another myth.
I really wish I would have bought an electric as well back then. Hind sight, don't you know.
The water jet technology seems plausible. I was told, when I bought it, that it was lasered out.
As you can see on the right side of the design, the finish has been chipped away from using a pick but it still sounds, looks and plays great.


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## shad

Hey Cyar,

Thanks for the comments, the carvings on mine more simple and less artistic looking than yours and Lester's and others I've seen, maybe it was one of the earlier models.

When I'm playing it as an acoustic the low tones are not as full as I would like, but when it's plugged in the low tones seem fuller, I'm not sure why.

The theory about the area of the carvings equalling that of a sound hole seem's logical to me, I have an engineering background and that is probably how I would approach it, but having said that I have no clue if there is a formula for the sizing of a sound hole, or if it is all that critical, maybe a luthier will clue us in on that.

I'd love to know the actual history of these unique guitars but my attempts to track it down on the internet have been fruitless, hopefully someday someone who knows will see this site and enlighten us!

String gauge? I just put on some 10's and was disappointed, kind of weak and tinny acoustically but quite good amplified, anyway I'm going back to the 11's because I play it unamplified most of the time.

Interesting that you paid $500 new 25 years ago, I wonder what that translates into in todays dollars?


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## GregM

*Hi from "Down Under"*

I am delighted to have found this thread. I bought my Shiraki, second-hand, in 1987 and I was beginning to think I was the only Shiraki owner in the world. :wave:

I live in Brisbane, Australia and play guitar and oud. The Shiraki is an (almost) solid body classical, with an under-bridge pickup. The tone is exceptional. Amongst my other treasures, I have a Godin Multiac SA guitar and it has a better neck and, of course, synth access. But the tone of the Shiraki is superior with a very true acoustic sound when amplified. I use it with a Roland jazz Chorus 55 amp of a similar vintage.

Photos of the Shiraki at http://www.worldmusiccafe.info/files/Shiraki/

Regards,

Greg


----------



## shad

Hi GregM,

Nice guitar Greg, quite similar looking sound hole to one other that was posted here, but I think it was a full size hollow body. I believe your's is the only solid body I've heard of.

I assume your's doesn't have any manufacturers information on it either? You may not be the "only Shiraki owner in the world", but you're one of only a dozen or so that have posted to this site so far, and I think that all of us would like to know more about these unique guitars.

Anyway, welcome to the site. :food-smiley-004:


----------



## GregM

Hi Shad,

You're right, there is no manufacturer's information on the guitar, other than the word Shiraki worked into the sound-hole design. Considerng the build quality, it is strange that they didn't even put a serial number on them.

Regards,

Greg


----------



## coolp50

*shiraki booklet*

Hi guys,

My names Clay. I scanned a booklet my guitar teacher gave me about a year ago, the booklet is about shiraki guitars but doesn't give a whole lot of info on them... just mostly what their made of, they don't mention anything about how the soundholes are carved or etched out of the tops of them or even where they where made, but apparently these designs where the shiraki "Filigrana" models. My grandpa also has the XW71 model which I'll get a picture of next time I'm at his house.It seems weird that they made this catalogue without any way of telling us how to contact them for ordering guitars. I especially like the look of the mandolins on page 9.

anyways here are the pictures links:

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/frontcoversmaller.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page1small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page2small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page3small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page4small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page5small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page6small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page7small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page8small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page9small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page10small.jpg
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/backcoversmall.jpg

sry some of the pics got some corners cropped and that the front cover is messed up, I spilled pop on it and it got put away with other papers and it got ripped

If some of the images don't work email me at [email protected] or [email protected] and I'll fix it whenever I get your email


----------



## shad

coolp50 said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> My names Clay. I scanned a booklet my guitar teacher gave me about a year ago, the booklet is about shiraki guitars but doesn't give a whole lot of info on them... just mostly what their made of, they don't mention anything about how the soundholes are carved or etched out of the tops of them or even where they where made, but apparently these designs where the shiraki "Filigrana" models. My grandpa also has the XW71 model which I'll get a picture of next time I'm at his house.It seems weird that they made this catalogue without any way of telling us how to contact them for ordering guitars. I especially like the look of the mandolins on page 9.
> 
> anyways here are the pictures links:
> 
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/frontcoversmaller.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page1small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page2small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page3small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page4small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page5small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page6small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page7small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page8small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page9small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page10small.jpg
> http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/backcoversmall.jpg
> 
> sry some of the pics got some corners cropped and that the front cover is messed up, I spilled pop on it and it got put away with other papers and it got ripped
> 
> If some of the images don't work email me at [email protected] or [email protected] and I'll fix it whenever I get your email


Thanks Clay, for this amazing information, you have made my day for sure!! My Shiraki is identical to the XW70, except it is an electric/acoustic. Is there any chance that your teacher might be able to provide more information on these unusual guitars?

Cheers :food-smiley-004:


----------



## Lester B. Flat

Greg, thanks for posting your pics on this thread! You've got a model I've not seen before. It also doesn't seem to be in that brochure that Clay posted.

Clay, you are the man! I've been looking for catalogue on these guitars for years. I'm amazed to know the model number of my guitar, finally. (XEI20)


----------



## coolp50

sry Shad, I moved a couple months ago and haven't talked tohim and forgot his #... When I did ask him about the guitars tho he said all he knew about them was what he'd read in the catologue


----------



## shad

coolp50 said:


> sry Shad, I moved a couple months ago and haven't talked tohim and forgot his #... When I did ask him about the guitars tho he said all he knew about them was what he'd read in the catologue


Okay thanks anyway Clay, and thanks again for posting that info.


----------



## Cyar

*You da man Clay*

Clay, You are the man!!!!!

This is a great piece of info. I have the XW60 model. This is probably the most relevant info I've found yet.

Thanks again


----------



## sneakypete

it`s actually not that unusual for a Japanese maker to not have serials or very precise records of their work in the 50s, 60s and maybe even the early 70s...theres a very long list of brands from those days...even Yamaha has very little data available on their Dynamic acoustics, the Japanese guys who write books on old MIJs have a very hard time finding good info...all the folks who were involved in building them are dead or long since retired. I guess when they were building these gems they had no idea how collectable they`d become or that players would still be playing them decades later.
I did see this thread linked on a Shiraki that was for sale on the Japanese web, so even the natives have very little info on them.


----------



## shad

sneakypete said:


> it`s actually not that unusual for a Japanese maker to not have serials or very precise records of their work in the 50s, 60s and maybe even the early 70s...theres a very long list of brands from those days...even Yamaha has very little data available on their Dynamic acoustics, the Japanese guys who write books on old MIJs have a very hard time finding good info...all the folks who were involved in building them are dead or long since retired. I guess when they were building these gems they had no idea how collectable they`d become or that players would still be playing them decades later.
> I did see this thread linked on a Shiraki that was for sale on the Japanese web, so even the natives have very little info on them.


Hey Sneakypete, interesting comments. Regarding "the Japanese guys who write about MIJs" that you referred to, would it be worth our while to contact any of them for information? If so, any names, contact info, etc. that you could pass on to us would be muchly appreciated.

Cheers, :food-smiley-004:


----------



## sneakypete

I have the 8 volume series of books called Japan Vintage by Shinko.
You can try to contact them but don`t be surprised if they don`t answer...happens to me a lot...and I`m in the country. You might have better luck if you can find someone to write a mail in Japanese, not sure but I`d say over 80% of mails I send don`t get answered.
I`ll do a search on the name Shiraki and see what happens.

www.shinko-music.co.jp


----------



## shad

sneakypete said:


> I have the 8 volume series of books called Japan Vintage by Shinko.
> You can try to contact them but don`t be surprised if they don`t answer...happens to me a lot...and I`m in the country. You might have better luck if you can find someone to write a mail in Japanese, not sure but I`d say over 80% of mails I send don`t get answered.
> I`ll do a search on the name Shiraki and see what happens.
> 
> www.shinko-music.co.jp


Thanks for the Shinko link, I'll send them an email and see what happens.


----------



## Guest

*Mine was a classical Shiraki, too...*

Hi folks,

It looks like this discussion hasn't been added to in a while, but it is still floating out in cyberspace.

I had (I sold it like a dummy...) a Shiraki classical guitar just like what this fellow is describing. Inside the sound hole was a very intricate carving, which left the wood grain in the piece for shading. The one I had had flowers and leaves in the carving, and the carving encompassed the entire sound hole.

I got the guitar from a fellow who was from Victoria, BC. The story he told me is a bit different from what I am hearing here, so I'll repeat it, and go from there. This fellow studied classical guitar at a conservatory of music in Victoria. He told me he had special ordered the guitar from Japan, and (now he may have stretched this, I have never doubted him until today...) he said he (well his parents) paid around $5,000 for this particular guitar.

Because of the very intricate sound hole carvings I never doubted his price, but he traded it to me for about $500 worth of stuff when I moved out of an apartment we shared in Huntington Beach, California in 1989.

I do remember the tuning pegs were of a redish tint, and he claimed they were some kind of special stuff. Not sure if they were pearl, or red pearl, or who knows what. The guitar was absolutely gorgeous.

And as far as carving versus laser etching... the guitar I had was hand carved. There would be absolutely no way for a laser to digitize the exact grain of the wood, and then burn a pattern like that... for one thing, the laser BURNS the wood, and this wood was not burnt on the inside of the carving. To offer more on this, I was formerly employed in the trade of steel rule die making for 13 years. We used lasers to burn maple plywood that created our die boards. I have quite a bit of experience pertaining to the burning of wood with lasers, and in this professional opinion, these guitars are NOT laser etched...

So, when will we see Gibson or Fender attempt this, I wonder...? Never, probably... I have never seen another guitar at all with this type of carvings. Finding this thread tonight is the second time I have ever seen one of these guitars in my life. I had the classical guitar, then I saw one at a Guitar Center store one time in Phoenix, Arizona. I sold mine outright to a music store in Greensboro, North Carolina. The one in Phoenix was not as intricate as the one I had owned. In my sound hole there were leaves, and flower pedals, and stems of the plant, and the grain of the wood was used as shading.

The story the guy gave me was another one of the "master guitar maker" stories, even though some folks who have posted above have cl;aimed there is a factory involved. This guy seemed to think this guitar was extremely rare, and he claimed his folks dropped $5,000 on it brand new. He had the financial backing to afford it, and it could be true. Maybe they did a "custom shop" thing????

He said the man's name "Shiraki"... or on my guitar, it was actually spelled "S-H-I-R-A-K-S" ... there was no "i" at the end... and there was indeed an "s" at the end... the guy I bought my guitar from claimed that was the name of the luthier who actually did the hand carving. I don't recall there ever being a serial number on the guitar... He also inferred that it was a special luthier that had made the guitar, and that it was ordered from him direct. He did not mention the factory, nor did he seem to ever say anything other than it was made by one individual and that the individual's name was also carved into the sound hole with the decorative carvings.

The tone of this particular classical guitar was to die for. I should be shot at a firing squad for ever selling it... but back then as is the case now, I am and have always been an electric guitar type of guy, and I rarely ever played the very beautiful Shiraks classical.

Since there is a second name...

"Shiraki"

versus

"Shiraks" (on my guitar)

... then could there be a factory, AND a cutom shop type thing?

Meaning... are the "Shiraki" guitars the factory versions... and would that mean the "Shiraks" version (with an "s" at the end) would be a higher-dollar guitar, possibly a custom made or custom shop ordered guitar?

The sound hole of the one I had was much more intricately carved than any of the guitars pictured here... I wish I had taken at least one picture of it when I owned it... that was before digital cameras were all the rage... I have a huge box of photos... it may very well be that I do have a picture somewhere... I can't believe I would own it and not take a few pics, come to think of it...

If I do come up with some photos, I will scan them, and post them here...

This seems to be one of the only places on the web where I have even seen these guitars mentioned...



Jam


----------



## Guest

GregM said:


> I am delighted to have found this thread. I bought my Shiraki, second-hand, in 1987 and I was beginning to think I was the only Shiraki owner in the world. :wave:
> 
> I live in Brisbane, Australia and play guitar and oud. The Shiraki is an (almost) solid body classical, with an under-bridge pickup. The tone is exceptional. Amongst my other treasures, I have a Godin Multiac SA guitar and it has a better neck and, of course, synth access. But the tone of the Shiraki is superior with a very true acoustic sound when amplified. I use it with a Roland jazz Chorus 55 amp of a similar vintage.
> 
> Photos of the Shiraki at http://www.worldmusiccafe.info/files/Shiraki/
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Greg


Greg, this is EXACTLY the same guitar I had...

Same soundhole, and I always thought the signature in the sound hole was "Shiraks" with an "s"....



JH


----------



## Guest

Oops... a couple small details (in my zealous ambition to post, I missed...)... Mine was not a cutaway... it also did not have any electronics... other than that, it was identical to your pictures...

Thanks you, Greg, for posting these pistures... If you only knew how many times I have told people about this guitar... because I sold it... and it has always been a memory...

So... has anyone seen one of these for sale anywhere?




JH


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## sneakypete

-ki is a common name ending in Japan...there is no plural for in our sense and for a possessive they use -no...Shiraki-no.
Is it possible the Japanese guy who built the guitar made a mistake with English letters? yes...and I see it here everyday. He may have had trouble with the English possessive...I correct that mistake frequently in class here. I`d wager there is no name of Shiraks, but I`ll ask my wife tonight. Not unusual for builders of the day to make customs and /or one offs for customers...still happens and on one of my Sadao Yairis, he crossed off a kanji he wrote and corrected it so my guess is...just a writing error. One of the old MIJ classicals I have has a name on the label that, so far, nobody can read...none of the Japanese I`ve shown it to anyways.


----------



## Guest

sneakypete said:


> -ki is a common name ending in Japan...there is no plural for in our sense and for a possessive they use -no...Shiraki-no.
> Is it possible the Japanese guy who built the guitar made a mistake with English letters? yes...and I see it here everyday. He may have had trouble with the English possessive...I correct that mistake frequently in class here. I`d wager there is no name of Shiraks, but I`ll ask my wife tonight. Not unusual for builders of the day to make customs and /or one offs for customers...still happens and on one of my Sadao Yairis, he crossed off a kanji he wrote and corrected it so my guess is...just a writing error. One of the old MIJ classicals I have has a name on the label that, so far, nobody can read...none of the Japanese I`ve shown it to anyways.




Check out the "003" picture that Greg posted:
http://www.worldmusiccafe.info/files/Shiraki/Shiraki 003_sm.jpg

The last letter "looks" like an " s "... but maybe it could be an " i "...

That is the exact sound hole my classical guitar had, too... which is amazing, because it shows they can duplicate this killer carving stuff... 

If you follow the spruce grain through the design, it continues all the way through the carving... because the grain varies ever so lightly, there would be no way fro a laser to digitize this exact grain, and blast out only the material in between the grains... the material was taken out by hand... totally amazing...


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## Guest

There are some reviews of Shiraki guitars on Harmony Central:
http://reviews.harmony-central.com/reviews/Guitar/product/Shirak/Unknown/10/1


JH


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## Guest

Here is another Shiraki classical on another forum, this one is like the one I had... no cut-away... no electronics... same cool sound hole again...

http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=69120&p=2&tmode=1&smode=1



JH
.


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## sneakypete

I thought we were talking about a hand written label for some reason. So I`m gonna say it`s an "i".
there was a Shiraki for sale on the Japanese web last year and the seller had this thread linked to his sale so it looks like not everybody knows about em here either. There may be some info in books in Japan but not in any I own and I don`t own all the books on MIJs...plus there was a time when there were literally dozens of brands of both electic and acoustic Japanese guitars many of which are shrouded in mystery...nobody knows where they were made, when, for how long or how many were made and honestly it`d be impossible to know. Maybe Shiraki is one of those.


----------



## PaPa Dave

I've owned my Shiraki since 1984. I purchased it in Budengin West Germany while stationed there in the army. Of all of my guitars the Shiraki out plays them no problem.


----------



## rollingdam

here is a link to a Mandolin for sale

http://www.coolguitars.ca/kgs_inv_detail.asp?InvID=2973


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## PaPa Dave

can you tell me what model this instrument is? The one I have is practically a corbon copy. I purchased mine while overseas in 1984


----------



## Lester B. Flat

PaPa Dave said:


> can you tell me what model this instrument is? The one I have is practically a corbon copy. I purchased mine while overseas in 1984


Looks like this one. The XM25. Do you have both a guitar and a mandolin?

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page9small.jpg


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## PaPa Dave

Clay Thanks for posting that booklet. I was able to find out that I have an XW70 model. 
Do you know of anyone that would know the values of these Shiraki s? I really need to get mine insured.


----------



## C. Brayland

*How Cool is This*

hey guys, i am so excited to have found this forum.

i too have a shiraki. your thread has allowed me to figure out that its an xw70

hey, and my name is also clay!

i love the sound of this guitar, and of course the look, and i'm thinking of having a serious custom guitar specialist put electronics in it.

there are unfortunately, two large cracks running from the bridge to the butt of the guitar. whoever had sold it to me had not stored it properly. the unfortunate thing is that with no sound hole there's no easy way to go about repairing it...

i also own a high end taylor, 914ce, but i often brush it aside to play my shiraki. it's bright, phenomenally loud, and bell like. it doesn't have much of a bass end, but it lets the mids come through much stronger, and i like that.

i wonder if the guys at talyor would be up to the task of repairing an old shiraki...


----------



## Lester B. Flat

Welcome aboard, Clay!

Post a pic when you get a chance. Is the top cracked or is it just the finish?


----------



## C. Brayland

the top is definately cracked, twice. i'll take some pics soon.
it sounds great in an open tuning by the way


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## eriko

*Hello Proud Shiraki Owners*

Hello everyone,

I am truly glad I found this site. I own a Shiraki XW51. (Thanks to Clay for posting those pictures.) Mine needs some work. The bridge is gone, and apparently someone tried to reglue the bridge without much success as evidenced by the layers and clumps of glue on the bridge area. Other than that, it appears to be in sound condition. I just bought this unique guitar last month.

I plan to do the repairs myself. I know that it would be a formidable task to glue a bridge, because there is no soundhole to position a bridge clamp. But, I found a new innovative tool that was made for installing bridge, without using C clamps. The tool is called vacuum clamp. It costs about $100.00, just for the clamp. Then of course the vacuum pump will be another cost.

I guess when tools are too pricey, one will tend to make the tools themselves. So I designed my own vacuum clamp! It is still in the works, but my cost will be only about $15.00 at the most.

Anyway, these Shiraki guitars are really special. One can only wonder how much time each craftman took to finish carving those intricate "soundholes." let alone the design themselves.

Let us keep in touch, and I know that each one of us, proud Shiraki owners, have a unique story to tell about our pride posession.

By the way, I am from San Diego, California.

Thanks,
Eriko


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## Lester B. Flat

Welcome Eriko!

Glad you found us and glad you found a wayward Shiraki. It would be interesting to see some pics of your bridge repair process.


----------



## greco

Gplayer said:


> Hello Lester,
> The company Kief Music remembers the guitars but unfortunatley were'nt the distributors. They tell me they think it was a company from Mississauga
> ( Toronto ) called B & J. This company if still in existance may have some info. Perhaps they can be found or owners tracked down if no longer operating. I'll keep trying !
> Gplayer:food-smiley-004:


Hello to all..fantastic thread. Wonderful guitars.

Nice that you can compare your instruments (and storeis behind them) and learn more about them.


I bought an MIJ 335 copy by SEGA (IIRC) and it was brought into Canada by *B & J in Toronto*. The case that came with the guitar had some of the original info in it. I tried to track down B & J but got nowhere..other than finding out *that they did import a variety of brands * of guitars from Japan. The guitar was unfortunately taken from my house during a B&E in 2004 

Dave


----------



## Sneaky

Here's another mando on Calgary CL.... :smile:

http://calgary.en.craigslist.ca/msg/660053592.html


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## Jampy

For all those that felt cheated..LOL











I heard her hips don't lie


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## Cybergy

I own a Shiraki that I bought new in Toronto back in the early 80's. I am planning on selling it in the next little while because I'm out of work and I need the money. I have never seen another one - frankly, I'm surprised to find this thread! I didn't realize there was much interest in the brand. It truly is a beautiful guitar.

Looking at Clay's links - it appears I have the XW70 Dreadnought!

http://s94.photobucket.com/albums/l84/Cybergy/?action=view&current=IMG_0755.jpg


----------



## shad

Cybergy said:


> I own a Shiraki that I bought new in Toronto back in the early 80's. I am planning on selling it in the next little while because I'm out of work and I need the money. I have never seen another one - frankly, I'm surprised to find this thread! I didn't realize there was much interest in the brand. It truly is a beautiful guitar.
> 
> Looking at Clay's links - it appears I have the XW70 Dreadnought!
> 
> http://s94.photobucket.com/albums/l84/Cybergy/?action=view&current=IMG_0755.jpg


Hey Cybergy, I have an XW70 too, is yours electric/acoustic? Hope you get a good price for it!!
Cheers,


----------



## Cybergy

Hi Shad,

No it's a straight-up acoustic - yours is too, right? The pics you posted appear to be identical to my guitar.


----------



## shad

Cybergy said:


> Hi Shad,
> 
> No it's a straight-up acoustic - yours is too, right? The pics you posted appear to be identical to my guitar.


No, mine is acoustic/electric, I think you can just barely see the tuners in one of the pictures, on the top left side near the base of the neck.


----------



## GregM

*Sorry!*

Hey guys,

I am sorry, I just noticed that sometime in the past I must have removed the Shiraki pictures from my site.
They are back up at http://www.worldmusiccafe.info/files/Shiraki/
(same link as before)

Regards,

Greg


----------



## The Ainsworths

*Shiraki giutar*

Hi Lester, 

My husband and I 8 years ago near a trash dumpster found this beautiful giutar. Until this morning, we never noticed the name Shiraki in the intricate detail around the sound hole. So I googled Shiraki and came across this site. Neither my husband or myself play the guitar but it's just such a beautiful giutar we have kept it around. Any idea on where we can get more info. on the value? It's definitly one of a kind. I guess we will no longer allow our 18 month old practice on it... 

Oh by the way, we found the guitar in WA state, USA and currently live in San Diego CA. 

thanks


----------



## violagran

*Shirak acoustic/electric*

This might not be the best place for doing this but I would hate to go through EBay. A friend in dire need of cash just left me with her Shirak guitar a couple of hours ago.She said she did´nt know where to sell it or what it was worth. She bought it in the late 80s in France for 2000francs. It is a classic body shape with the same amazing carving in the sound hole that everyone was talking about in this thread. Would anyone know what it´s value might be (ballpark) if I were to send pictures. I live in Granada,Spain and the shops here don´t know the make and would´nt give much money for it even if they were interested even though they liked the work.I´m a violist so the guitar world is a little foreign to me but I´d like to get this into some caring hands and make sure that my friend dons´nt get too little money.


----------



## Cybergy

I thought mine was just in need of a good cleaning but it appears that the finish was damaged, likely by sweat. Does anybody know what the finish is made of? 

Standard guitar polish does not appear to do anything at all - I suspect it's the actual lacquer that's been damaged. It's pretty minor, but I'd like to fix it before selling if possible.

Any ideas?


----------



## Lester B. Flat

The Ainsworths said:


> Hi Lester,
> 
> My husband and I 8 years ago near a trash dumpster found this beautiful giutar. Until this morning, we never noticed the name Shiraki in the intricate detail around the sound hole. So I googled Shiraki and came across this site. Neither my husband or myself play the guitar but it's just such a beautiful giutar we have kept it around. Any idea on where we can get more info. on the value? It's definitly one of a kind. I guess we will no longer allow our 18 month old practice on it...
> 
> Oh by the way, we found the guitar in WA state, USA and currently live in San Diego CA.
> 
> thanks


Sorry for taking so long to respond, but I've been absent from the board for a while. It's hard to put a value on these guitars because they come up for sale so rarely. It seems that most people that have them don't ever sell them. I think most of them sold new in the $500 range. I'd use that as a starting point. They may be rare but since they are obscure there is no demand to drive up the price. Like anything else, it's worth what someone will pay for it.

Since you aren't a player (and you found it in a dumpster!) you're looking good at any price. In the case of my guitar, someone might only offer $500 and that may be its value, but I wouldn't sell for 5 times that amount.


----------



## Cybergy

As with any good guitar, it's the value to you that's most important.


----------



## Cybergy

Has anybody sold their Shiraki recently?


----------



## iod14

*got one*

Hi everyone.
It was nice to find so much info and... emotion speaking about the mysterious Shiraki.
I got a fantastic one today (word!) from my uncle who can't play anymore because of some accident he had... 
He looked sad to give it away and so i got it for 500 €. I now consider i'm very lucky. I'm astonished by the soft sound and the moderate bass coming out. But it's very interesting and different. As i sing, i think this is a new approach of mixing voice with guitar.
My uncle told me that he bought it new for 48000 Belgian Francs, during the 80's, which means 1200 €.
My model is an XW71, so it's the same as Stefan's, who also found it in Belgium.
Then again, he bought it in the old galleries of Cora supermarket in La Louvière probably in the eighties, and of course these galleries have been destroyed and/or renewed. So the shop doesn't exist anymore. XW71 is the one with dark green hiding under black, and some mythologic Japanese lions/dragons carvings. 
You can find some pictures of mine here (webcam quality).
It's in perfect state though i should use some wood care liquid to erase the fingers spots on it. Any advice ?


----------



## rbbambino

My advice is... Don't play it when you are wearing that ZIPPERED vest :smilie_flagge17:
There have been suggestions about various guitar polishes mentioned on the "acoustic guitar forum". I suggest that you search the forums.
Congratulations on the new guitar. It looks great. Enjoy.


----------



## Cyar

Hey iod14
Wow! congrats on the gift... You don't think I could get adopted, do you?

It's a beautiful guitar! I have had years of pleasure from mine.
As per the threads above. I wouldn't sell my guitar, unless I absolutely had to.
I would love to find one that has a pickup in it, but for now I don't think I could afford it anyway. I checked with the place I bought mine back in the early 80's (still owned by the same owners) but they didn't even remember the brand.
I think they were carved out with water jets as suggested on a prior thread.


----------



## GregM

*I am going to sell my Shiraki*

Hey Guys,

I have decided to sell my Shiraki, because it rarely gets played and I have way too many instruments. I just sold my Vintage 1970s pre-lawsuit Ibanez Howard Roberts' Guitar, for the same reason.

It is sad to see these old beauties go, but I'm a working musician and my main investment has to be in gear that I use for gigging.

I have no idea of its worth, but if there is any interest here, I am open to offers.

I can be contacted direct at g.marsh [a.t) abtec.com.au

Here is the link to the pictures again:

http://www.worldmusiccafe.info/files/Shiraki/

Regards,

Greg


----------



## Elfiero

Hello folks,

For a long time I've been drooling over my fathers guitar, a Shiraki, and finally he handed it to me with no begging at all...:bow:
He bought this guitar (Thx to Clay I now know it's a XW51) back in the late 80's paying ca €350 on SALE!! kqoct

Now, I am now aware of that we all got rare instruments here, though it's a shame not useing them. I have a daughter at the age of 11 with a wonderful voice (yeah, I know I'm not the one to tell but as a music teacher, I believe I know the difference) and Is very talented in playing the guitar. We have 4 accustic guitars, but this is the one she really enjoy playing due to the special good tone it makes.. Soft hearted as I am, I do let her, and knowing this is a sort of one-of-a-kind guitar...

BTW, this guitar is located in Norway

BR
Elfiero aka Trond


----------



## martin

*shirak*

Hello everone,

I'm Martin from the Netherlands and it seems that I own a rare guitar, namely a Shirak XW51. I bought it 25 years ago in a guitarshop named Dirk Witte in Amsterdam. I wasn't aware, until I found this site, that it was a special one. I've always been proud on it because its looks beautiful. I think I paid about € 600,00 for it (new). I've never been a great guitar player but now an then I give it a try. Two years ago I took guitar lesson and each time the theacher give me compliments for my guitar and the beautiful sound it has.

You understand that now I know something of the background I threat him with more respect.

Thanks to everone who wrote one this forum and I wish you all great pleasure with the shirak.

Greeting 

Martin, Volendam, Netherlands


----------



## Neenagh

*Shiraki "Telecaster"*

Hi everyone! 
My name is Marina and I live in Stockholm, Sweden. I have a semi-acoustic Shiraki guitar. I bought it from a music store at a Vintage Guitar Fair in Stockholm in 1997. 
I am not an expert guitar player in any way, but I happened to set eyes upon this guitar and just HAD to have it! I paid 2500 Swedish Cronor for it, which is about €250 and I got a hard case along with it as well.
The guitar fair was packed with musicians, music store owners etc, but no one had a clue about where the guitar came from, how old it could be or who had made it.
Since then I have been intrigued by it's origins and have been searching the net and asking around, but haven't been able to find anything out until I came upon this forum. Thanks for sharing all the information and pictures! Even though none of the guitars posted here looks like mine, it is great to find out a little more about the Shiraki guitars in general.

My guitar has somewhat of a Telecaster shape. The body is thin, only appx 2 inches (which I tried to illustrate in one of the pictures by placing a lighter on the side of the guitar). 
The carving has flowers underneath the strings and a hummingbird in the "top right corner" of the body. 
Unfortunately, whoever owned it before me did not treat it with the great care it deserves. As you can see in the pictures, there are some bits broken off from the carving beneath the strings -probably the result of the careless use of a pick. 
There is a nice sound to the guitar when played acoustic, although somewhat lacking bass. Plugged in it sounds amazing! It is very easy to play, with a thin neck and a fairly low action which suits me well.
It is a beautiful piece of craftsmanship and I just wish I could play it more, and better. Anyway, it looks great when hanging on the wall as well.:smile:

Links to pictures:

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC03599.jpg

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC_0042.jpg

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC_0039.jpg

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC_0037.jpg

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC_0035.jpg

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC_0024.jpg

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC_0015.jpg

http://s1000.photobucket.com/albums/af126/neenagh/Shiraki Guitar/?action=view&current=DSC_0003.jpg


Cheers//Marina


----------



## GuitarsCanada

Nice looking guitar, its not in too bad of shape.


----------



## scirocco

Hi all,

I live in Turkey and I have one of those http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/coolp50/page8small.jpg. Definetely a piece of art work, I cannot name it only a guitar. It was bought from the Netherlands, by a famous Turkish singer back in 1986, for about 500US$. I will post the pictures soon. My wife is a making fun of me, because every time I wash my hands, always wear a long sleeved shirt, remove my watch, belt, ring before playing it.
For sure no serial numbers, manufacturing date etc.
Thanks for the info, pictures, and pride shared in this forum.


----------



## sneakypete

oh I know what you mean. I have some guitars that I just stare at for a while, they are just so beautiful...I am a painter and to me some guitars are works of art...I love the lines of a nice strat. And I also take care when I play, but some of my old ones had been banged up pretty good before I got em, but all my guitars are babied...all get wiped down after I play em.


----------



## Lester B. Flat

martin said:


> Hello everone,
> 
> I'm Martin from the Netherlands and it seems that I own a rare guitar, namely a Shirak XW51. I bought it 25 years ago in a guitarshop named Dirk Witte in Amsterdam. I wasn't aware, until I found this site, that it was a special one. I've always been proud on it because its looks beautiful. I think I paid about € 600,00 for it (new). I've never been a great guitar player but now an then I give it a try. Two years ago I took guitar lesson and each time the theacher give me compliments for my guitar and the beautiful sound it has.
> 
> You understand that now I know something of the background I threat him with more respect.
> 
> Thanks to everone who wrote one this forum and I wish you all great pleasure with the shirak.
> 
> Greeting
> 
> Martin, Volendam, Netherlands


I guess I missed this when it was first posted. That looks like the rarest model so far because it didn't even appear in the catalogue that was posted. That's closer in concept to the model I have than any of the others. Great to see more of these guitars getting unearthed. It's very strange how a company could make such a wide range of beautiful instruments and yet, fly completely under the radar.

Thanks, Martin!


----------



## harm

Hello,

I am Herman from the Netherlands and i have three Shiraki's. I have the XW70 the XW71 and the XW45. I am always searching for more news or details about these beautiful guitars and if the price is right i want to buy them to.
If you have pictures or any information of Shiraki would you please send them to me?

Thanks!

Herman


----------



## Ivan

Hi Marina. Did you ever consider selling your Shiraki? I have an acc Shiraki but would love to have a semi acc.  I Live in Tromsø, Norway. 
Rgds / Ivan


----------



## GuitarsCanada

Shiraki for sale in Toronto area

RARE Shiraki Acoustic Guitar - City of Toronto Musical Instruments For Sale - Kijiji City of Toronto Canada.


----------



## Ship of fools

Wow she only wants $3500.00 for hers, I have to ask what would be the difference between one of these and a Blueberry Guitar. Oh and to the one who thought that they might have cut it with Water,come on think about that if they were done in Japan I could see them being done by hand carving.ship


----------



## harm

I have 5 Shiraki's and i love those guitars but for 2000 euro's each i will sell them too.


----------



## Ship of fools

Wow even that is just to much Harm, there has to be certain criteria's for them to reach that kind of price, rarity, demand, playability and such and to be honest I just don't see folks clammering over each other to go out and buy one. They are very interesting guitars but from a money point of view they are not in the high demand area yet, but hey you never know till you try right.ship


----------



## harm

Hello Ship of fools,
There are more people who think this is a good price
See this Japanese music store!
Shiraki XW70?J????????Shiraki?


----------



## Ship of fools

Well I see it is still for sale since March 2010 so I can only think maybe its not at the right price yet, but for those who love this type of guitar then I can only asume they would be willing to pay that much, not that I am saying you are asking to much ( I don't really know ) but you own more then one so I can assume you would know more then I Herman about the market for them.ship


----------



## harm

Hello Ship 
I love my guitars and I had no plans to sell them but saw the guitar for $3500 for sale and for such prices I wil sell my Shiraki's too . I don't know exactly the real value but those guitars are really great and they are very rare. We will see.


----------



## sneakypete

heres how software translates the sales pitch...these are tough times in Japan, some folks are still spending big money on some guitars but not as much as before plus the disaster in this area has made an even deeper impact on the economy.



Inquiring about Shiraki Guitar and this brand name, almost without being, there probably is one which you know. Japan not to be, with the catalog, some type only it is seen in the sight of the foreign country, is. Natural shape, each manufacturer of Japan directing to the super maniac of the foreign country, is thought as the thing which is produced to 70~80 age beginning as an export exclusive use. As for first feature, there is no usual sound hole, two patterns of the top surface have become openwork, that has borne the function of the sound hole. “The openwork of the traditional technical art empty of the plain wood” you took also the brand name of Shiraki, it probably is mind of the plain wood. The catalog which is seen in the sight of the foreign country the cover has become “west position weaving”, as for that of the binding like the album, as for that they are extravagant ones. The specifications which are seen is in that catalog as follows. Whether top/[shida] veneer, side & back/deer moa, veneer or plywood obscurity, finger board & bridge/rose wood. The deer moa (the alias great maple), in the domestic product of that time, with the valuable kind of material which was used in the Stradivarius violin not to be seen rarely, in the foreign country those which are transacted with high price. Smell for the maniac of the foreign country [punpun] does even in this. By the way, the knitting machine the most significant type of grade which is 4 types. We have become [watsushiyuban], first it doubted [yamaki] make with that line why peg, but is, the original has become gold die-cast, those which perhaps are exchanged. 100% so you cannot say, but. That the Beatles used in the Misaki concert of queen majesty, there is also description in the sight of the foreign country, but because age is not agreeable, perhaps it probably is creation.


----------



## Ship of fools

Hay Sneakypete are they trying to say that it was made by Yamaki, and if so I do not remember any of their instruments being carved before.ship.............interesting translation thats for sure


----------



## sneakypete

just added the translation, don`t own a Shiraki, never seen a Shiraki in person, have no ideas or opinions on Shiraki...couldn`t tell you a thing about the brand. the seller in the translation seems to be mentioning foreign countries a lot...and I`ve seen this thread linked on Yahoo Japan auctions of Shirakis...so if the Japanese are linking this thread, I figure there isn`t much info on them in Japan.


----------



## Pahlwest

Hello Lester, I never researched my Guitar and it was good to find your Thread. I've posted some pics of my Shirak at:

Shirak Guitar pictures by pahlwest - Photobucket

Also, thanks to the other of you for the info! - Michael


----------



## GuitarsCanada

Another nice example there. Nice guitar


----------



## Pahlwest

Thanks! When I bought my XW60 (which I just found out today was the model number - thanks!!!), there was another model that had "Peacocks" on each side with their "Tails" running along the left and right edge and curving into the center of the lower face under the bridge. It was nicer looking than mine but didn't play or sound as good. In retrospect, I should have bought both of them, but hindsight is usually full of regret, and in this case it's true. I bought mine from "Zolla's Guitar" store in downtown San Diego. I didn't play it much and for the most part it hides in it's case waiting to be admired. I thought that these guitars were the most beautiful guitars I'd ever seen and I still think they are still a work of art. I had always thought that "sandblasting" was used to create the designs, not lasers. Thanks again, Michael


----------



## harm

Hello Michael,
I've never heard before of a Shiraki guitar with peacocks. There is a catalogue online from Shiraki but without this specific guitar. I'm very interested in Shiraki guitars and i hope you have more information about it?
Thank you!
Harm


----------



## harm

Hello,
I am a collector of Shiraki guitars and i'm trying to know all about them.
I ask everybody if you can help me with information. Everything is very very welcome. Do you know something about those guitars, whatever it is, please let me know!!!
Here some pic's from my Shiraki collection.
Thanks!
Harm








.


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## sneakypete

Everything members here know is probably already written in this thread, I don`t think the guys are holding out. Evidently it is difficult finding reliable info...and as the owner of many old MIJ acoustics I can say that doesn`t apply only to this brand, I have a lot of questions about many of mine but there is nowhere to ask...even here in Japan. Something I have learned to live with.


----------



## Cyar

*WOW what a collection*



harm said:


> Hello,
> I am a collector of Shiraki guitars and i'm trying to know all about them.
> I ask everybody if you can help me with information. Everything is very very welcome. Do you know something about those guitars, whatever it is, please let me know!!!
> Here some pic's from my Shiraki collection.
> Thanks!
> Harm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


That is a beautiful collection!! I haven't seen another for sale anywhere yet (except for hearing about them online).
What a great collection! How long have you been collecting them and how did you happen upon them.


----------



## harm

I'm collecting this guitars for 10 years and i'm really proud of this guitars. There are still very much different Shiraki's to collect. There are other brands who sold Shiraki guitars with their own brand.
I really want to have them to. By example, there is an Hopf guitar made by Shiraki. I will post a picture soon.
Harm


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## harm

Click on this link and you can see the Shiraki XG20 picture and a Hopf guitar with the same "Soundhole". 







.
Harm


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## ParaFrog

Hello all.
I have bought my Shiraki XW-60 some 20 years ago from a friend of mine.
Did cost me about $100, ( 130 Guilders ath that time here in Holland).
It hase some damages and user marks. Didn't know anything about this guitar untill some moths ago.
Have played it a couple of times during practise and gigs. Playing nice, but for acoustics I do prefer my Ovation guitar.
Will post some pics of my Shiraki later.
Might even sell it, I haven't played on it for a long time, but kept it under maintenance.


----------



## harm

Hello Parafrog, I've send you a personal message. You can reach me on [email protected]


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## Erwin

Hey everyone,

Nice forum. I got a XW51. I bought it when I was about 16years old in the Netherlands.
I still think its a great guitar, but I wasnt aware that they were rare 
Its great to read this forum !


----------



## Cootjo

After all these years I finally found other owners of Shiraki guitars. I have to honest here, my Shiraki XE120 is in a pretty bad shape at the moment, needs lots of restauration. But now I know how unique these guitars seem to be, I'm certainly gonna try to make it look the way it supposed to look. https://plus.google.com/photos/1108...s/5850716254124973489?authkey=CPLQoLbd_8TbpgE
Hope it works with the photo link


----------



## Jonnyboy

Hey guys! I just joined this forum. I inherited a shiraki xw60 with the dove and flower pattern from a nice lady that my family helped move to her cottage. It is in insanely good condition as she bought it back in 83' for $564, played it 4 or 5 times and then left it in its case for 30 years . The guitar is currently having the bridge re-glued by a professional luthier as it was lifting and will be back in my hands next week! I am so excited to play it. It is an acoustic/electric and I have already purchased an amp for it. Any recommendations on a cheap cord that will service me well? I bought a brand new 10' cord from my local pawn shop for $10 and it sounds amazing (I'm aware that higher quality usually significantly increases cord durability and insulation as you can here my cord but only when I give it a good smack with something lol! thanks guys! I'm only 17 by the way lol!


----------



## -ST-

Hi Jonnyboy,

Congratulations on having a really interesting guitar. 

Save your money - You can spend as much or as little as you want on a cord. But for now, I'd say - just enjoy the guitar. There's plenty of time and ways to blow your dough.

It looks like Noise Supply (forum member) has some good deals on custom made cords and these look to be in line with off-the-shelf quality cables.

Here's the link http://noisesupply.ca/custom-cables/cables-to-guitar-and-or-amp.html


----------



## Jonnyboy

Thanks! I actually love the sound of the guitar when it isn't plugged in as well. It just seems to be the perfect volume for me  and I already have $10 cord that seems to work perfectly fine so I think I'll stick with that for now. I am actually doing my High school talent show next year with my friends and we are playing rocket queen and I'm doing vocals lol!


----------



## chimasta

Hi I just stumbled on to this forum because I was looking for pictures to describe my Shiraki. I found someone in this forum with my same guitar but can't find it now. It is the Shiraki with the rose and doves pattern instead of a sound hole. I wonder where people are getting there model-numbers. I would love to know the history of this guitar. I bought it in Kingston On in the eighties. I had a luthier cut a sound hole into it (sad i know) but it still looks and sounds great. The sound hole was so we could do some repairs. I would love to know what model it is etc.


----------



## chimasta

Hi Cyar!! Wow I never thought I would see another guitar like mine. I bought this exact model used in Ontario in 1987 for ~$800. It eventually needed work and I had a luthier cut a sound hole in to it. It was sad but it extended the life of the guitar. I still play it everyday and it still sounds amazing. I really wonder how many were made and what they originally went for. I also wonder if it is Shirak or Shiraki. Having lived in Japan I tend to believe Shiraki as the Japanese language rarely ends in a consonant. 
Anyway I would love to hear more about your guitar. Feel free to send me a message if you have a moment.


oops I'm new to this forum thing and was trying to reply directly to Cyar's pictures of his Shiraki. I'll get the hang of it.


----------



## shirakiowner

Hi there I'm also a owner of a beautiful Shiraki, that I'm thinking about selling because I do not play. I would like to 
Find someone who will love this guitar as much as my did.


----------



## Steadfastly

shirakiowner said:


> Hi there I'm also a owner of a beautiful Shiraki, that I'm thinking about selling because I do not play. I would like to
> Find someone who will love this guitar as much as my did.


Put it on Kijiji. If you are not sure of pricing, we could help you out if you give us some pics and a good description.


----------



## shirakplayer

Hello, I search the net every now and then to find info on these guitars since I bought one new a long time ago in the Netherlands, I have the XW70 model, the left one on the picture see link http://www.jedistar.com/pdf/Shiraki manual/page4small.jpg It has a few bruces, and is damaged in one spot (1 cm) in the grain where the ornamentation is but play's very well.

I am still not sure if the name is Shiraki, I've looked very often to the headstock but cannot see an ( i ) after shirak, to me it lookes like an ornamentation, but maybe I'm wrong. 

Like the poster shirakiowner I am thinking of selling it and trying to find out what the prices for these guitars are, maybe members here on the forum can give me some advise ?


----------



## David Renwick

Hello everyone. I have a Shiraki GX20 and live in Riwaka, Tasman, New Zealand. I bought it from my sister about ten years ago, and am a novice player. Lovely craftsmanship with cedar and rosewood and mahogany I believe, and it has the lasercut soundhole, complete with the cedar winter growth rings (harder than the rest of the sapwood) untouched . I believe its about 30 years old and in good nick. It's a beautiful instrument and I cherish it.


----------



## allthumbs56

Lester B. Flat said:


> Thanks for the links, Marc. At least I understand the pictures! The watersaw idea is best explanation yet.


I can't speak for guitars but I have a client who owns a waterjet cutting company. He says the jet must penetrate entirely through the material (ie make a hole through both sides) - at least that's how his machine works - the water is a propellant and the actually cutting is done by garnet grit being blasted by the water. He says laser cutting is very similar but generates heat in the process where waterjet cutting is self-cooling and is favoured for the most precise work. He makes parts for military helicopters.

I wonder if those patterns are possibly embossed into the wood - I know they do this with "affordable" furniture to give it "carved-look" patterns. I think they use a big stamp with heat, moisture, and pressure.


----------



## knight_yyz

Beautiful guitar, loving the f sound holes!!


----------



## Richard Hoadley

Hi everyone. I've just signed up because I have a Shiraki guitar.
I believe it to be an XW45 Dreadnought although mine differs in two respects from the catalogue photos / info which I found online. Firstly, the 'filigrana' is not type C-2. Secondly, there is no truss rod as advertised in the catologue.
I was lucky enough to pick up this 'little beauty' in my local music shop for 120 euro in (maybe) 2009! I should explain that I'm English but moved to France in 2004. I'm certainly no guitarist but, I just love 'special' guitars and like having them around to pick up and strum once in a while.
The music shop in question had taken the Shiraki in part exchange for a new guitar. It was, apparently, left 'out the back' for a while and the bridge came partially unstuck. They obviously had no idea of the rarity of the guitar and, given the state it was in, were happy to make some money on it. I was able to repair it myself with some good quality epoxy resin and a few books! The repair is almost invisible and has held up for 7 years!
Moving on to the 'sound hole'; it is of the 'filigrana' type but, with a 'sound hole'! I believe this to be original as the hole blends in perfectly with the filigrana design.
I will post some piccies ASAP! I took some tonight but they are not wonderful. I'll see what happens after the aperitif (LOL).
Considering I bought blind, as it were, the results are fantastic! Lovely tone and easy to play!
I'll sign off for now, hoping that you guys are still watching this post!
All the best to you my fellow Shiraki owners,
Rich.

EDIT I do not have a Photobucket (or the like) account and I'm not sure that I want to pay for an account here just to post a couple of photos! If however there is some interest then I will happily do so!


----------



## Scotty

Jampy said:


> For all those that felt cheated..LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I heard her hips don't lie


Her hips are something alright. Art in motion


----------



## Scotty

Lester B. Flat said:


> I'm looking for owners of Shiraki guitars. It seems there were very few of them made in the early 80's. They were made in Japan but so far my search has only turned up a few owners in Canada and The Netherlands. None of these guitars have serial numbers and they have a "mystery history". Three or four different models have turned up but the one thing they have in common is the uniquely carved(?) sound holes. They are all beautifully finished and constructed and mine sounds like no other guitar ever produced. Small, lightweight, arched top and back, with a pickup under the bridge and those unique "f-holes".
> 
> I know of perhaps two or three others like mine and they were all sold in either Ontario or the Maritimes. Anyone in the west ever see something like this or any other Shiraki guitar?
> 
> 
> Besides the mystery of who made them there is also a question of how the grille work was done. A luthier told me he though it was laser carved. The width of the slits seems to vary in width according to to the grain in the wood. Maybe some of you luthiers can tell me how that may have been done.


That is some beautiful carving. The worlds best carving comes from the east, and this is by far a much better medium than ivory. 

Save an elephant...play guitar


----------



## Jimmy_D

Gentlemen, I happen to know where there are not one but two of these for sale, one is $575 and the other $675 if anyone is interested.

BTW that design is sand blasted... they mask off the face and cut out the design, then sand blast with a medium that eats soft but not the hard bits, Cedar is perfect for this, the technique is an old one and pretty cool


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## thehack

I was given a shiraki guitar. see attached pictures. I think that mine is an earlier model then the ones on this site. It has a sound hole. The carvings are more primitive. The carvings are not very deep and then painted. The head stock is more basic and flat compared with the ones on this site. It does have a serial number inside the sound hole on the neck joint. It is a very beautiful guitar with little wear. The sound is brilliant and awesome. I hope you enjoy the pictures.


----------



## Michael Patrick

Anyone still following this older thread? Just recently discovered some history on this guitar I picked up years ago and it appears to be shiraki.


----------



## Semih

Hi All

The son of my brother in law owns a Shiraki. It was bought from Holland by a friend of mine (who happens to be a famous musician in Turkey: Fuat Guner of MFO). It is a beautiful classical guitar with a wonderful sound. As far as I remember, it was the second best soundwise to a Spanish built handmade classical and best workmanship overall. It looks very much like a normal classical guitar except the sound hole. There is no round hole. In its place is an intricately carved out pattern of round outer shape. The curious thing is that only the soft parts of the soundboard are removed. The year rings (the herder lines) are continuous. When it came, it was called "Shiraki Laser". I doubt the carvings were made because I found no burns as I inspected the guitar some 30+ years ago. I will ask the boy (who is almost 50 now) to make some photos ans send me. If he does, I will try to post them.

Cheers
Semih Oksay, Istanbul-Turkey


----------



## Semih

My previous post is the sam guitar Scirocco mentioned. He is the son of my brother-in-law.

Cheers
Semih Oksay


----------



## thehack

Michael Patrick said:


> Anyone still following this older thread? Just recently discovered some history on this guitar I picked up years ago and it appears to be shiraki.


Michael what kind of information do you have on your Shiraki? I can not find out anything about mine. I know that it made from a solid top and the back and sides are also solid word which makes it sound a lot better. You can contact me through this forum on at [email protected]


----------



## Martin L.

Hi. 

As I see this is a very old posting, but I see this for the first time. I bought a Shiraki GX10 in 1982 from a dealer (in Quebec city) that disappeared since. This guitar has a very incredible sound (and it is not for sale, I keep it preciously). Since, I bought also a Jose Ramirez R4 guitar but the Shiraki is still my preferred. It has a sound richness that no other guitars have, excepted for very expensive concert guitars.

About the 'rosette', I have always thought that the carved out pattern was done with a mask and acid (or an organic solvent). The wood is composed of several growth rings with alternate soft light wood and hard dark interface. The acid may dissolve the soft wood and leave the growth ring interfaces. What is sure, this is not done with a laser.


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## sulphur

I picked this one up a few years ago...


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## MacroMusic

Hey everyone, who joined this thread! I’m a new proud owner of a Sharki Mandolin Model XM45! I found it on Vancouver island BC in perfect condition I was told it was purchased in 1979 in Victoria BC placed in it’s hard case and never played. It’s so beautiful and even with its original strings in the three months I’ve owned it it’s held it’s tune. The sound holes are like nothing I’ve ever seen on an instrument before. The catalog photo I’ve found of my model looks identical to mine and I wouldn’t be surprised if it was the exact one from the photo! If you ever come across the twin to this mandalion I want to know! I didn’t pay very much for this, as the person selling had no idea how to value it! But it’s priceless if ever see one again I’m buying another! [email protected]


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## MacroMusic

[QUOTE="Martin L.What is sure, this is not done with a laser.
[/QUOTE]

I second this! This for sure was not the work of a laser! I’ve been perplexed trying to figure it out!


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## sulphur

MacroMusic said:


> [QUOTE="Martin L.What is sure, this is not done with a laser.


I second this! This for sure was not the work of a laser! I’ve been perplexed trying to figure it out!
[/QUOTE]

They were apparently masked off and sandblasted, as mentioned in post #148 above.


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## Martin L.

sulphur said:


> I second this! This for sure was not the work of a laser! I’ve been perplexed trying to figure it out!


They were apparently masked off and sandblasted, as mentioned in post #148 above.
[/QUOTE]
No, This wasn't done by sand blasting. Yes a mask was used to create the figure. If you look carefully the wood texture, the remaining lamella correspond exactly to the dark line in the wood. The sand blast would not precise and selective enough to produce such a result. I rather believed that a chemical reaction corroded or dissolved the soft wood (the pale growth rings) and the reaction is stopded before the darker and harder wood rings (which are more resistant to the reaction) are dissolved too.


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## Eric Reesor

Shiraki branded guitar were only one of the many Japanese companies to experiment in how best to crack into the huge factory guitar market. The great Japanese financial collapse of the 1980's most likely sealed their fate as makers of musical instruments for sale in North America and Europe as it did for quite a few other small guitar makers in Japan and elsewhere.

As to their use of cedar: there could be very good reasons why they chose it for the majority of their engraved instruments. Spruce burns way too fast, is one good reason and quite likely caused their process engineers night terrors as the guitar tops expanded and contracted causing micro cracks from the rapid heating and cooling of lasers. I would imagine for every spruce top that they succeeded in etching that many would have become scrap or worse burned through on the spot. Cedar burns on the surface quickly but if the engraving process was done before final thickness sanding then the cedar would be less likely to self immolate, burn through, crack or otherwise wind up being useless as a guitar or mandolin top.

Old growth red cedar, yellow cedar (which in truth is not a true cedar but a member of the cypress family of trees) as well as some species of spruce can all be incredibly wonderful tone woods and perfect looking old growth wood from these species is becoming increasing rare and hard to obtain. So many builders are making instruments that take advantage of wood that is routinely rejected for building high end production line or custom super expensive guitars by the top factory manufactures like Larivee, Taylor, Gibson, Martin...etc etc ad infinitum.

This situation for up and coming and established small shop guitar builders has been going on a very long time and not just in Japan. Smaller builders can have a very hard time getting tone wood and usually wind up paying much more for the best looking woods if they can get them at all. The great Japanese builders from the 1950's all the way to the present with the exception of corporations like Yamaha that can source raw log cants, are stuck with the leftover pickin's. So they have to be creative in other ways and produce good quality instruments that can sound much better and look different somehow than low end off the shelf production line Yamaha's, Taylor's, Martin's etc etc etc.... 🎸 🎸 🎸 🎸 🎸 🎸 🎸 

The history of the use of spruce and cedar and how it can be used in musical instruments and indeed in other ways is a very fascinating topic and this thread begs answers to what can be done with wood, as well as how and why certain woods are used. 

The West Coast Indigenous ceremonial masks from 3 hundred years ago before iron tools arrived, were made from cedar that was shaped with hot rocks, scrapers made of volcanic glass or other hard natural materials, then sanded with horse tails and shark skin and dyed with red ochre and other natural dyes. The ones done with heat to accentuate the carving are absolutely incredible. The descriptions of the masks from historic accounts tell of incredible artwork and wonderful colours used to great effect. And yes some have the same effect of depressions between the hard growth layer where the wood was heated until it started to smoulder and burn down. Many smaller masks were made with yellow cedar but many of the really large ones were made with red cedar which is by and large much lighter and can easily be shaped by the removal of wood by burning. Some West Coast canoes which could be absolutely huge were hollowed out first with carefully applied fire and then chip finished with stone adze

But back to why the fancy engraving and chocolate finish on Shiraki guitars

The spruce topped guitar models of Shiraki with engravings that I have seen all seem to have darkened or stain highlighted carvings. Whereas the cedar ones seem to all have dark finish with some of the natural colour of the cedar in the engravings. If you burn red cedar slowly the hard less burned growth rings can be made to protrude by rubbing off the chard layers in between very carefully. The softer wood in between will maintain the natural colours of red cedar which can be surprisingly light in colour in vertical bands. Notice that the majority of Shiraki cedar top products also have a chocolate sunburst finish. This would mask natural age staining and uneven shading in otherwise high grade red cedar tone wood that would be rejected as too low grade for a Yamaha factory classical guitar top. Their cedar and some of their spruce tone wood was most likely first processed into raw cedar and spruce guitar tops by Godin/La Patrie from small box car loads of selected cedar shake blocks bought unprocessed raw in BC. Or from one of Larivee's associated bulk tone wood buyers/processors on the west coast. The unique planetary sources of the inexpensive spruce and cedar guitar tops. Or maybe the mysterious German buyers or all three. Alaskan woods are by and large more expensive than the cheap tone wood from BC. But who knows some of their tone woods may have come from Alaska over their short history as guitar and mandolin builders.

Woods that are perfect across the entire top of an instrument are usually graded high quality and used for a clear or light stain finish on an instrument. They can look great but mostly very plain and any slight imperfection present after thicknessing will stand out like a sore thumb. And is part of the reason custom made instruments can be ultra expensive, a builder can go through quite a few tops before one turns out to be suitable for a custom build for a high end client, who usually will have kittens if nature puts in a little curve ball in their guitar top. MEOW

My bet is that the guitars and mandolins being discussed on this thread are decorated with a laser engraving technique that is very carefully temperature controlled so as to not actually make holes but leave the character that fire can create if controlled with great skill by automated engraving machines with very precise heat control and duration. Most of their guitars then require an opaque finish to hide the fact that the tops were not high grade at all but the cheapest tone wood from BC to keep costs down and still be able to produce instruments that sound better than most! I have played a few of these guitars over the years and some can sound better than an off the shelf D18 or Larivee Classical if a nylon string, hands down. Same as the guitars that came from Tama and other really great Japanese builders who have vanished or been driven out of the history of guitar manufacture.


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## Skidplate

Lester B. Flat said:


> I'm looking for owners of Shiraki guitars. It seems there were very few of them made in the early 80's. They were made in Japan but so far my search has only turned up a few owners in Canada and The Netherlands. None of these guitars have serial numbers and they have a "mystery history". Three or four different models have turned up but the one thing they have in common is the uniquely carved(?) sound holes. They are all beautifully finished and constructed and mine sounds like no other guitar ever produced. Small, lightweight, arched top and back, with a pickup under the bridge and those unique "f-holes".
> 
> I know of perhaps two or three others like mine and they were all sold in either Ontario or the Maritimes. Anyone in the west ever see something like this or any other Shiraki guitar?
> 
> 
> Besides the mystery of who made them there is also a question of how the grille work was done. A luthier told me he though it was laser carved. The width of the slits seems to vary in width according to to the grain in the wood. Maybe some of you luthiers can tell me how that may have been done.


I just bought one today. Beautiful guitar. I am in Ontario. The girl told me her dad bought it many years ago in Japan.


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## shehasawakened

My dad owns one of these. It is sitting beside me right now. He bought it while he was stationed overseas in Germany during the mid-80’s. I grew up playing it. It is incredibly beautiful and unique. My husband recently pointed out that it appears to be made for acoustic lead. I believe he is correct. It cuts right through any sound and kind of rises above it as if it has a few thoughts on the matter and everyone is going to hear them now. We live in Southwest Louisiana. Lots of love to you all!


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## [email protected]

Lester B. Flat said:


> I'm looking for owners of Shiraki guitars. It seems there were very few of them made in the early 80's. They were made in Japan but so far my search has only turned up a few owners in Canada and The Netherlands. None of these guitars have serial numbers and they have a "mystery history". Three or four different models have turned up but the one thing they have in common is the uniquely carved(?) sound holes. They are all beautifully finished and constructed and mine sounds like no other guitar ever produced. Small, lightweight, arched top and back, with a pickup under the bridge and those unique "f-holes".
> 
> I know of perhaps two or three others like mine and they were all sold in either Ontario or the Maritimes. Anyone in the west ever see something like this or any other Shiraki guitar?
> 
> 
> Besides the mystery of who made them there is also a question of how the grille work was done. A luthier told me he though it was laser carved. The width of the slits seems to vary in width according to to the grain in the wood. Maybe some of you luthiers can tell me how that may have been done.


I have one. I bought is in 1983 in Leiden Holland. Looking for a reasonable price to sell it I landed on this site. I’m looking with different eyes at it now. Indeed it has been beautifully and robustly made. A piece of art that plays as a guitar, or the other way round?


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