# Has anyone ever dealt with...



## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

A guy with the email address barterchamp63 AT gmail DOT com. His name comes up Scott Smith...

Just wondering... he's in the Ontario area. I purchased a guitar last week and since the final payment he has been non-communicative. 

Thanks,

- Will.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Not I.

Did you get it off of CL or kijiji?


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## StevieMac (Mar 4, 2006)

I don't think I've ever encountered that email. We have a Scott Smith here on the forum (in Ottawa) and he's an absolute pleasure to deal with and a stand up guy so...not sure there's any relation. If it's him, I wouldn't be worried in the least.


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## fredyfreeloader (Dec 11, 2010)

You said you purchased it, did he not deliver?


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## kat_ (Jan 11, 2007)

King Loudness said:


> I purchased a guitar last week and since the final payment he has been non-communicative.


There are a lot of reasons why someone can be non-communicative over a weekend, especially if he's a private seller not an ebay store or a business. I wouldn't worry yet.


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

fredyfreeloader said:


> You said you purchased it, did he not deliver?


Not yet, and there's no tracking number quite yet. He told me he would ship after payment cleared, which it did on Thursday.



kat_ said:


> There are a lot of reasons why someone can be non-communicative over a weekend, especially if he's a private seller not an ebay store or a business. I wouldn't worry yet.


I'm trying to be reasonable but the lack of communication has me worried. I'm also an anxious person by nature. 

W.


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## kat_ (Jan 11, 2007)

King Loudness said:


> I'm trying to be reasonable but the lack of communication has me worried. I'm also an anxious person by nature.


I tend to be like that too. It seems like most other people are pretty laid back though. Hopefully the seller is a perfectly trustworthy guy who is just a little too relaxed with responding to email.


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## fredyfreeloader (Dec 11, 2010)

What kind of guitar and how much money are we talking about here. Weather conditions from Ontario east could be playing a part, the seller may be waiting until the parcel has been shipped so you can be notified of an approx. arrival date.


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

you never got his full info?....adresse, phone number and such?...Did you pay with Paypal?


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

al3d said:


> Finished EVH Frankenstein Replica. http://www.guitarscanada.com/showthr...245#post521245




that's a 404


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

Some answers to questions. The guitar in question is a 2011 Gibson Les Paul R9, it was offered to me through a want ad I posted in Kijiji Ontario. It is NOT owned by the Scott Smith on this forum, I have actually dealt with that member and bought my goldtop DGT from him. Payment was via EMT, not PayPal. I stupidly didn't get any contact info for him, but i have a phone number I found via Canada 411 that I will try.

Cheers.


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## StevieMac (Mar 4, 2006)

King Loudness said:


> Payment was via EMT, not PayPal. I stupidly didn't get any contact info for him, but i have a phone number I found via Canada 411 that I will try.


Not at all surprised it didn't involve _our_ Scott Smith. I sincerely hope this works out for you though. I'd take that payment route with just about anybody here but, on a sizeable out-of-province kijiji sale, I seriously doubt it. Best of luck however.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

Oh my. I hope this works out for you but I would advise you to never do that again. Kijiji is just too wonky for that kind of deal. Anything over $60 and I would need to meet up with the seller and take possession


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

Yeah.. I definitely screwed up. Oh well... worst case I'm out the money and have learned a very valuable lesson. Not the kind of thing I wanted to be dealing with at 19, but alas. For now I'm taking some routes to try and rectify the situation.

W.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

King Loudness said:


> Yeah.. I definitely screwed up. Oh well... worst case I'm out the money and have learned a very valuable lesson. Not the kind of thing I wanted to be dealing with at 19, but alas. For now I'm taking some routes to try and rectify the situation.
> 
> W.


Also, just for future reference and to anyone that is reading this. Talking to someone on a cell phone or even getting an address from them does not mean a thing in my opinion. Cell phones are essentially disposable as are the numbers and I can give you any address in the tri county area that will amount to a hill of beans. I drove all the way to Michigan one time to pick up an amp. 8 hour round trip. It's a shame that we have to take the "trust nobody" mind set but shit happens.

Having said that, your guitar may show up tomorrow. Keep us posted.

If you hang around here long enough you will find literally dozens of stand up sellers and traders.


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## Louis (Apr 26, 2008)

Musicians or most of us are sensitive people and sometimes trust too much ,
and do business more with are hearth than are brain !

Well that was my case more than once !

And never forget that a good crook is almost always a Gentleman !!...........he put's you in confidence !
I really hope this will settle !!


Lou


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

King Loudness said:


> Some answers to questions. The guitar in question is a 2011 Gibson Les Paul R9, it was offered to me through a want ad I posted in Kijiji Ontario. It is NOT owned by the Scott Smith on this forum, I have actually dealt with that member and bought my goldtop DGT from him. Payment was via EMT, not PayPal. I stupidly didn't get any contact info for him, but i have a phone number I found via Canada 411 that I will try.
> 
> Cheers.


If that is the correct number, you can do a reverse address and find out where he lives as long as the address is not ficticious.


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

I called the 411 number with my Dad and no dice, so a police report has been filed. Hopefully this may pan out. I'll always have my DGT if nothing comes of it at least! 

W.


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## Louis (Apr 26, 2008)

King Loudness said:


> I called the 411 number with my Dad and no dice, so a police report has been filed. Hopefully this may pan out. I'll always have my DGT if nothing comes of it at least!
> 
> W.


Would you know a computer wiz who could read your hard disk and find out
where the info's come from ?


Lou


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## Bluesburglar (Jan 22, 2014)

Good luck, I'll keep my fingers crossed that everything is fine and your guitar shows up soon. I'd be sick with worry in your position.


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## Intrepid (Oct 9, 2008)

Do you know where he lives? Some of us in Ontario may be able to help you. Please remember that we got battered the last few days with horrific weather so that may have delayed shipping. Give him a phone call and see what he says. If there is no response then connect with some of us via PM and we'll see what we can do to help. I wouldn't panic yet. Stay calm, there could be a perfectly reasonable explanation for the delay.


King Loudness said:


> A guy with the email address barterchamp63 AT gmail DOT com. His name comes up Scott Smith...
> 
> Just wondering... he's in the Ontario area. I purchased a guitar last week and since the final payment he has been non-communicative.
> 
> ...


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## Intrepid (Oct 9, 2008)

P.S. I never noticed the second page of comments when I posted. Sounds like this may be more complex then I thought. If you need some help please PM me your number and I will call you from work tomorrow. I may have some connections that may be of assistance. Good luck.
P.P.S. Go to your Bank right away tomorrow and ask them to get an electronic copy of your cheque which will show who cashed it, when it was cashed and what Bank it was cashed at.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

I'd certainly be pleased to help in any way possible/advised.

Dave



Intrepid said:


> Do you know where he lives? Some of us in Ontario may be able to help you. Please remember that we got battered the last few days with horrific weather so that may have delayed shipping. Give him a phone call and see what he says. If there is no response then connect with some of us via PM and we'll see what we can do to help. I wouldn't panic yet. Stay calm, there could be a perfectly reasonable explanation for the delay.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

King Loudness said:


> A guy with the email address barterchamp63 AT gmail DOT com. His name comes up Scott Smith...
> 
> Just wondering... he's in the Ontario area. I purchased a guitar last week and since the final payment he has been non-communicative.
> 
> ...


try looking up the email on facebook as well.


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## StevieMac (Mar 4, 2006)

Louis said:


> Would you know a computer wiz who could read your hard disk and find out
> where the info's come from ?



"Seller" could have been emailing from a public library or, as others pointed out, using a throwaway phone or account. That's a HARD lesson to learn but I'm _still_ hoping it works out. I wonder if it's too late to try a stop payment through your bank...


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

I'd post every bit of info you have on this guy right here in this thread to see if any of the guys around here can help you, there's just too much of this going on lately and if anyone here can help to shut it down, even on a microscopic level, I'm sure they would.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

StevieMac said:


> "Seller" could have been emailing from a public library or, as others pointed out, using a throwaway phone or account. That's a HARD lesson to learn but I'm _still_ hoping it works out. I wonder if it's too late to try a stop payment through your bank...


Easy enough to get an IP address off the email. Wont give you an exact address but will confirm area


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## Bubb (Jan 16, 2008)

greco said:


> I'd certainly be pleased to help in any way possible/advised.
> 
> Dave


me too,Ontario is big though,can you narrow the location down a little more ?


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

As mentioned above, don't you have to have a valid bank account to receive an EMT? Surely your bank can find out where the funds ended up.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Jimmy_D said:


> I'd post every bit of info you have on this guy right here in this thread to see if any of the guys around here can help you, there's just too much of this going on lately and if anyone here can help to shut it down, even on a microscopic level, I'm sure they would.


posting info would have the thread deleted. PM it to those who can help find the guy.


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

Good point, there does seem to be some leeway though as witnessed by the "smith falls" thread, no? Anyway you're right, pm is better...


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Budda said:


> posting info would have the thread deleted. PM it to those who can help find the guy.



i really dont understand that. ifd someone is on the level, no harm done. if they aren't, they SHOULD be exposed to all. why does this board continually pussy out when it comes to doing the right thing?


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

Hey guys,

Well, I filed and dropped off a police report. I am going to leave it in the hands of the law enforcement agencies now. The lady at the fraud unit that I spoke to says that they can contact the banks and hopefully catch the "trail" of money that was sent. 

Thanks so much for all the well wishes, I really appreciate it! I will update as I hear more, but for now back to reality!

- Will.


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## DrHook (Oct 28, 2013)

cheezyridr said:


> i really dont understand that. ifd someone is on the level, no harm done. if they aren't, they SHOULD be exposed to all. why does this board continually pussy out when it comes to doing the right thing?


With Smith Falls there was a bit of leeway because the guy is a known scumbucket, but the posts regarding where he worked, facebook, etc...weren't verified as being his, so it crossed into a grey area of liability and disclosure. At this point in this thread, it's not known yet if there was intentional foul play or just circumstances that caused the guitar not being shipped...the OP has done the right thing filing a police report...I hope he calls the bank too.


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## Louis (Apr 26, 2008)

King Loudness said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Well, I filed and dropped off a police report. I am going to leave it in the hands of the law enforcement agencies now. The lady at the fraud unit that I spoke to says that they can contact the banks and hopefully catch the "trail" of money that was sent.
> 
> ...


Well wishes and also pissed feelings !!
Hearing stories like this get's me mad !!!

Let us know and I'm sure a lot of us including me
will learn from your experience.

Lou


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

cheezyridr said:


> i really dont understand that. ifd someone is on the level, no harm done. if they aren't, they SHOULD be exposed to all. why does this board continually pussy out when it comes to doing the right thing?


Simply because there are often legal implications. I personally feel for anyone getting burned on any transaction but we are not a kijiji policing agency here. I have been contacted several times and threatened with legal action because someone posted personal information here. ie phone numbers, addresses and names. I am the one responsible regardless of who posts it. Therefore I do not allow personal information being posted about individuals based solely on one persons info. ie (this guy ripped me off, he lives here) we cannot do that type of thing. 

This OP has done the right thing. He has notified the police and filed a report. He should also file one with Kijiji. There is little we can do here other than to let people know to be very cautious when dealing on any board (including here) on high ticket items. We could easily get a crook here as well. Thats why posts and feedback is so very important.


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

I like this forum far too much to be banned... I will NOT be posting any personal information. That is in the hands of the police now. 

W.


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

This is brutal, sorry to hear it. As we're talking about an R9 and not some $100 - $200 guitar I assume he sent you lots of info on the guitar, including pics? If he did, and you kept it, it may help the police with their inquiries. Have you been able to narrow down where in Ontario?


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

King Loudness said:


> I like this forum far too much to be banned... I will NOT be posting any personal information. That is in the hands of the police now.
> 
> W.


We would never ban you for something like that. PM you maybe but not ban you. If in fact there is some kind of conviction then by all means, post whatever you can, it is public domain at that point.


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

GuitarsCanada said:


> Simply because there are often legal implications. I personally feel for anyone getting burned on any transaction but we are not a kijiji policing agency here.* I have been contacted several times and threatened with legal action because someone posted personal information here*. ie phone numbers, addresses and *names*. I am the one responsible regardless of who posts it. Therefore I do not allow personal information being posted about individuals based solely on one persons info. ie (this guy ripped me off, he lives here) we cannot do that type of thing.
> 
> This OP has done the right thing. He has notified the police and filed a report. He should also file one with Kijiji. There is little we can do here other than to let people know to be very cautious when dealing on any board (including here) on high ticket items. We could easily get a crook here as well. Thats why posts and feedback is so very important.


Well now, that certainly explains the disappearance of a number of posts from within a number of different threads, all with one common denominator, thanks for that.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

I suppose if anyone really cares to know the scammer's identity, PM's are perfectly acceptable, but that's at king loudness' discretion.

For what it's worth, I mourn the loss of our trust for our fellow man.

I'm such a frigging boy scout, but I remember a time when a handshake or a phone call was as good as a contract.

Those days are gone, and in a sense, that means the bad guys won.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Milkman said:


> I remember a time when a handshake or a phone call was as good as a contract.
> 
> Those days are gone, and in a sense, that means the bad guys won.



i think that's exactly what it means. and there are still some people who's word is their bond. but unfortunately it often seems as though there are only 2 types of people anymore. predators, and prey.

also, 


GC, thanx for the explain. i get it, now that you said it.


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## Mr Boggie (Dec 4, 2012)

sorry man, - hope it works out for you. positive vibes sending your way for a speedy resolution.


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## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Mr Boggie said:


> sorry man, - hope it works out for you. positive vibes sending your way for a speedy resolution.


Indeed. Many thanks to the OP for telling the story. I think we can all learn from this.


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## StevieMac (Mar 4, 2006)

zdogma said:


> Indeed. Many thanks to the OP for telling the story. I think we can all learn from this.


Agreed. The obvious take away from all of this being: Don't trust anyone named Scott Smith. *;^ )*


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## g.a. (Aug 28, 2014)

King Loudness said:


> A guy with the email address barterchamp63 AT gmail DOT com. His name comes up Scott Smith...
> 
> Just wondering... he's in the Ontario area. I purchased a guitar last week and since the final payment he has been non-communicative.
> 
> ...


Hi Will, I was scammed by the same person in Dec 2013, around Christmas time. He contacted me about my Want-ad on Kijiji for a used Traynor Amp TVM10. He used the same email address (barterchamp63 AT gmail DOT com), the name was also Scott Smith. He was supposed to send me the amp via post. I paid the price + shipping via Email Transfer, and never received the amp, nor heard from him since.

I also reported the fraud to the police here (downtown Toronto). I provided the email correspondence, and the two phone numbers that he used to call me, one with the area code (587), and the other one (226), which he texted from. The police made a detailed report, but at the time they said that since it seemed he wasn't a local (226 is area code of London, ON), there wasn't much they could do. If he were in Toronto, they would come and knock on his door. They did, however, keep a file of this person with all the info (phone numbers, email address, bank confirmation of Email Transfer) in case of future frauds. So if others who have been scammed by him also made reports, I believe he'll get himself caught eventually.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

I have said this many times before. NEVER get involved with a high priced item on kijiji unless you can pick it up in person. There is absolutely no way I would ever send more than $50 to someone from kijiji and hope that the item gets shipped.


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

i'm curious to what ever happen?....


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## sambonee (Dec 20, 2007)

al3d said:


> i'm curious to what ever happen?....


Me too. 
I do large deals frequently but I always exchange copies of drivers licenses after a few phone calls. Never been burned as this system always smokes out the crooks. I do however hide my birthdate and DL number.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Can we conclude that kingloudness was scammed, since 'g.a.' had the same thing happen to him around the same time, by a guy with the same email?

I hate scammers. I was scammed a few years back (actually 6 years - wife was prego) and found out while I was in England. It was a bad scene; I still think about it at times (in a happy gilmore "I hate that Bob Barker" sorta way) - and that was over about $600 - not an R9. 

@ g.a. - interesting first post, g.a. (no offence and welcome).


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Post #33 pretty much says it all. That scammer should be put in the iron maiden and beaten with Jay Turser guitar necks.


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

Since everyone is asking for an update, I may as well oblige. I had the police conduct a warrant through the bank to trace the trail of money. I'm currently dealing with the police in Chatham-Kent where the bank account holder is located. G.A, I sent you a PM, maybe between the two of us we can catch this evildoer.

W.


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## sambonee (Dec 20, 2007)

We should start a thread for jay turser neck donations. Or at least a few stiff bull rushes.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

thwe guy is still advertising on kijiji, and he's bold, too


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

cheezyridr said:


> thwe guy is still advertising on kijiji, and he's bold, too


Send me some links? I will take any and all "evidence" to present to the police right now. If he is an active scammer they will want to remedy the situation.

W.


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## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

GuitarsCanada said:


> I have said this many times before. NEVER get involved with a high priced item on kijiji unless you can pick it up in person. There is absolutely no way I would ever send more than $50 to someone from kijiji and hope that the item gets shipped.


Good advice to be MINDFUL of, but not necessarily follow every time without exception.

I've sold and shipped from kijiji and craigslist (and from here!) guitars worth over $5K but those buyers had wisely worn me over pretty well before they sent their money. We had phone numbers and real email addresses, and had spent time getting to know each other including sometimes sending additional pictures with the purchaser's name in them, and talking about things other than just the purchase.

Even a seller getting paid in advance should be very cautious, so good two-way communication is important.

I'd be ALMOST as cautious as Scott suggests. However with time and careful smarts, long-distance high-value purchases do work out well for many folks. Fortunately the good guys still outnumber the scammers, but take your time and use your head to ensure that you haven't landed on a scammer.


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## g.a. (Aug 28, 2014)

Thanks for the welcome, adcandour.

Will, I've just PM'd you.


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## JeremyP (Jan 10, 2012)

I hate reading stuff like this , it makes my stomach turn. Hopefully they catch this guy and the OP gets some restitution. 
Real sorry to hear.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

a few weeks ago i saw one of his ads. i emailed him and said 

"we know all about you here in the gta. you are a known scammer. we're waiting for you to screw up again, and we'll have the cops on you like before."

he responded "Go for it, the cops favored me last time"

i still have the email he sent, i could forward it to you if you like, just p/m me an email address.


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## sadowsky13 (Feb 26, 2007)

That sucks, crap like that pisses me off! Best of luck hope they catch the sob!


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## King Loudness (May 3, 2010)

Cheezy, PM'd ya.

If anyone has further info, send me a message. This son of a bitch needs to be put behind bars. I'd love to do it myself, but alas.

W.


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## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

Jeez, what a POS. I hope the cops find this guy...he has to pay


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## urko99 (Mar 30, 2009)

This guy needs a visit from a couple guys with Masks and Bats. I wish you luck in finding him. Any way I can help, I'm there.


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## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

Hey, if this POS is still operating on Kijiji, maybe a member could set him up...keep the police posted so he gets nailed this time...


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

I hate to here about scams like this... hope he gets what is coming to him....


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## Rick31797 (Apr 20, 2007)

I was just reading last night about a music gear web site in the US ripping people off. One thread was a guitar collector in the UK, he had bought guitars all over the world with no issues.. He sees a vintage strat on this web site.. emails the guy, they make a deal for 13,000.00... never got the guitar, that was 2 yrs ago.. and then many others came forward, some getting the shaft for over 30,000 in gear... So he is still up and running, and there will probably be more victims , before anything is done..


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