# Who's a pinky planter?



## Jeff Flowerday

Mine's always down, it's a reference point thing. I spent 2 days with it lifted but had no control over my right hand.


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## lolligagger

*I suffer from P2...*

Hi, my name is lolligagger and I'm a pinky planter...its a disease. Actually a buddy of mine who happens to be a guitar instructor came over the other night and poo-pooed the way I was holding my pick, and the use of my pinky as a reference point. Apparently, in his view its a crutch. 

I have spent the past four days practicing without the planting the proverbial pinky, and holding my pick "properly" and it has been frustrating. My timing is off, missing the strings, lack of control for volume...a real train wreck. Last night was a little better, so hopefully this is a sign of better things to come.


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## Xanadu

I'm not.

ps. why do our replies have to be 10 characters long?


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## washburned

So what's more important, style or technique? If people like what you play the way you play it, who cares?


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## Ripper

Just out of curiosity, what is the proper hold for a pick? I have to admit I'm a pinky planter.


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## Gilliangirl

I'm a pinky planter and I hate myself for it.


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## MaxWedge

I never paid much attention to this before. For somethings I plant the pinky and ring finger. chording and such my hand is free. I don't see why this is a problem. If it gives you more pick control, why not? Actually I'd like to hear any other methods of pick control used by others.


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## lolligagger

Gilliangirl said:


> I'm a pinky planter and I hate myself for it.


Hah! Er...I mean, I feel your pain and your shame. Let it out sister...



washburned said:


> So what's more important, style or technique? If people like what you play the way you play it, who cares?


I agree with you 100 percent. So many great players do their own thing very well, often times with spectacular results. I am going down this route of learning to hold my pick "properly" and removing the pinky plant in the interest of self improvement. 



Ripper said:


> Just out of curiosity, what is the proper hold for a pick? I have to admit I'm a pinky planter.


Here is a close representation of what I am attempting to switch to in terms of holding a pick. The funny thing is that this is Lesson 1, apparently.

http://guitar.about.com/library/weekly/aa071200g.htm

It may be a little too soon to tell, but speed seems to come more easily...I'm just not very controlled yet. I practice with a metronome, so I should figure out whether or not this is working for me soon enough.


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## Jeff Flowerday

Watch this video he's definately not pinking planting. :bow: 

http://guitarscanada.com/Board/showthread.php?t=3574


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## JSD's Guitar Shack

Guilty as charged for planting the pinky.


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## Mr. David Severson

can't say I'm much of one..although I can see it have its merits now and then.


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## MaxWedge

Read the lesson and watched the EVH thread. I can see where pinky planting is incorrect. More bad habits on bad habits.


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## MaxWedge

I just give the unplanted pinky a try and it's clunky alright but there is a feel to it that is correct. As I said I wasn't even aware I was doing it, or knew this was incorrect.
Thanks for bringing this up. Now about my hanging thumb. That's never going away.


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## lolligagger

MaxWedge said:


> Thanks for bringing this up. Now about my hanging thumb. That's never going away.


I didn't even want to go there just yet...its the other part of the equation in my guitar playing that equals a train wreck. Apparently, I'm supposed to believe that left hand activity doesn't require an incredible amount of strength, and that my speed and dexterity would improve if only I would release the death grip from around the neck of my guitar. :wink:


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## SCREEM

no PP here, I started out as a teen playing mostly metallica and slayer stuff wich require lots of palm muting with fast alternate picking, so the bridge was my anchor.
The funny thing is that metallica was doing the PP thing and I tried but couldn't get the hang of it...slowed me down too much


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## Jeff Flowerday

SCREEM said:


> no PP here, I started out as a teen playing mostly metallica and slayer stuff wich require lots of palm muting with fast alternate picking, so the bridge was my anchor.
> The funny thing is that metallica was doing the PP thing and I tried but couldn't get the hang of it...slowed me down too much


Kirt pinky plants? Hmm, funny Satch allowed that.


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## Milkman

It depends on what I'm playing.

When I'm playing rhythm I generally don't plant my pinky, but often do when playing lead.

I also use a hybrid technique (pick + three fingers) a lot so I suppose my pinky can't really be anchored for that.

I really don't see the drawback, at least for what I play.


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## Emohawk

lolligagger said:


> Here is a close representation of what I am attempting to switch to in terms of holding a pick. The funny thing is that this is Lesson 1, apparently.
> 
> http://guitar.about.com/library/weekly/aa071200g.htm


Hmmm... Someone should have told my old guitar teacher that. 

Oddly enough, I do hold my pick "correctly" based on this, however I don't form a fist - my other three fingers tend to be open. And yes - I DO pinky plant. It depends on what I'm playing though. Someone else mentioned they don't when chording, and neither to I. But when I'm riffing or soloing I usually do. I have tried not doing it but it just feels awkward and I spend too much effort concentrating on it. I'm a horrible player to start with - I can't afford to have this kind of thing distract me too much!

By the way, I'm a hook-thumb player too most of the time. I guess I'm just pure evil from a technical standpoint! :rockon2:


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## david henman

...mine seems to become "erect" when i have a drink in my hand.

should i seek professional help?

-dh


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## Guest

I only "post" with my pinky when I'm finger-picking.... when I'm strumming, it'd just get in the way and slow me down... 

Then again, my lead-guitar player mentioned the other night, that if I play any faster, he's gonna start slipping roofies into my coffee so that he can keep up.

LOL


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## mick7

Im never tired that. And seeing what people are saying im not gunna start.:banana:


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## Lester B. Flat

*I am - I am not*

I never have the pinky planted when strumming or using a pick but always have it planted along with my third finger when fingerpicking. I don't consider it a "bad" thing at all. You just have to be aware of when it helps and when it hurts, and that can vary from person to person. You don't tell Mark Knopfler he's been doing it all wrong for 40 years any more than you tell Jeff Healey he's holding the guitar wrong. Pinky Planters, cast off your guilt and feel free to be yourselves!


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## Jeff Flowerday

What set me off is I'm not playing the low E string as clean as I want. I feel the pinky is the problem even if I'm sliding it up to rest on the high E to make the low E accessible.

I'm slowly getting the hang of no pinky plant but now everything isn't clean.  :tongue: Only time will tell how it turns out.


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## Ripper

okay, so now how does one break themselves from the death grip left hand? I've got pretty decent speed with my left hand, but I know I've seen alot of players who seem to grip the guitar alot lighter than I do on the neck.


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## Emohawk

Lester B. Flat said:


> I never have the pinky planted when strumming or using a pick but always have it planted along with my third finger when fingerpicking. I don't consider it a "bad" thing at all. You just have to be aware of when it helps and when it hurts, and that can vary from person to person. You don't tell Mark Knopfler he's been doing it all wrong for 40 years any more than you tell Jeff Healey he's holding the guitar wrong. Pinky Planters, cast off your guilt and feel free to be yourselves!


I don't feel guilty about it. I'll hold the guitar backwards if it feel comfortable to me. It's all about enjoying the thing. 

Oddly enough, I was playing a bit last night and after reading this thread yesterday I was paying more attention to what I was doing. It turns out I don't pinky-plant all that much. Funny - I always thought I did. I do hook the left thumb though - even when soloing sometimes. But so did Jimi so I figure I'm in good company (if not in the same league!). Having long fingers helps...


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## Metal#J#

Lester B. Flat said:


> I never have the pinky planted when strumming or using a pick but always have it planted along with my third finger when fingerpicking. I don't consider it a "bad" thing at all. You just have to be aware of when it helps and when it hurts, and that can vary from person to person. You don't tell Mark Knopfler he's been doing it all wrong for 40 years any more than you tell Jeff Healey he's holding the guitar wrong. Pinky Planters, cast off your guilt and feel free to be yourselves!


No guilt here! I agree that it has it's advantages and disadvantages. 
When playing metal, I actually use the side of my palm to mute the strings I'm playing and my pinky is some what planted (on and off) to keep the resonance from travelling to the other strings. It's keeps the noise down and sounds tighter. 

Naturally my right hand does what it wants without thinking, but I've never seen this as a problem. What are you supposed to do with it? Tuck it in?


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## lolligagger

Just winding down from a practice session by doing a little bluegrass surfing. Found this link here and couldn't help but notice Orin's pinky firmly planted...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4L9fBPUswjU&mode=related&search=

I was just patting myself on the back for making some progress towards getting rid of this habit. I'm still going to try. 

As a further point of interest...a couple of weeks ago I found a book of Orin's called "Hotlicks for Bluegrass Guitar". I am on page 13 of 173 pages, and that is only because the first 10 pages include the preface, introduction, explanations and overview. This book is going to provide me with entertainment for years to come.
http://www.amazon.ca/exec/obidos/ASIN/0825602912/searchbox-20


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## Jeff Flowerday

lolligagger said:


> Just winding down from a practice session by doing a little bluegrass surfing. Found this link here and couldn't help but notice Orin's pinky firmly planted...
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4L9fBPUswjU&mode=related&search=
> 
> I was just patting myself on the back for making some progress towards getting rid of this habit. I'm still going to try.
> 
> As a further point of interest...a couple of weeks ago I found a book of Orin's called "Hotlicks for Bluegrass Guitar". I am on page 13 of 173 pages, and that is only because the first 10 pages include the preface, introduction, explanations and overview. This book is going to provide me with entertainment for years to come.
> http://www.amazon.ca/exec/obidos/ASIN/0825602912/searchbox-20


I've been seeing some progress as well. My right hand is pretty much back up to speed. It feels much more fluid now, but will take some more metronome work for sure.


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## Robert1950

Not me. None But I'm just a flat picker.


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## ShadowRiffer

What exactly is pinky planting?

Is it where you put your pinky on the pick guard area for strumming support?



Emohawk said:


> I do hook the left thumb though


I do the same, but I do it to mute the low E when playing chords, and to hit the low E for other things.


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## rippinglickfest

*Pinky Plant*

There is no one correct hand position or mechanic for the picking hand.........everyone will have variations on the the way they hold their pick, mute and so on because of hand size and physical dexterity and type of guitar. The pinky plant is a part of several hand positions I use in my picking repertoire.
If it feels comfortable to you..........its the right way regardless of who says it isnt.

Ray


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## Jeff Flowerday

ShadowRiffer said:


> What exactly is pinky planting?
> 
> Is it where you put your pinky on the pick guard area for strumming support?


Not so much for strumming more for lead work, but yes, putting your pinky on the pickguard or guitar body.


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## mandocaster

*fisticuffs*

Well, I don't pinky plant. I used to. As a mandolinist, I find that in order to get speed you can't be twiddling the top with number 4. If you watch any of the bottled lightning players like Big Mon or Ricky Skaggs, they make a loose fist and hold the pick lightly....and play eighth notes effortlessly at 160BPM.

After recently revisiting the Mount Everest of mandolin tunes, Bill Monroe's 'Rawhide', and concentrating on careful note placement, once I got it up to 160 it was surprisingly effortless. I then returned to my by-now-sulking Les Paul and was astounded at the precision I had inherited.


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## Baconator

I don't, but Chet did: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApnOnFoq6bk&mode=related&search=


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## mandocaster

Methinks that Chester Atkins was not a user of the single plectrum, eschewing it for a precise finger-style, for which anchoring the minor distal digit can be an asset......

None


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## droptop88

Just reading this, and i realized that Buckethead is a pinky planter.... on the FINGERBOARD whilst he taps at a zillion mph!


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## I_cant_play

I'm not and for some reason I've never even been tempted by it. I change my picking hand from the open to closed position depending on the song or part though. I also can't seem to not rest my wrist on the low E close to the bridge when I'm playing lead. I can't play lead with my hand "floating". I don't know if this is a bad thing..


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## jimmy peters

*Pinky Planter*

I never used to be when I first started playing.
But as time moved on and my guitar playing improved along with it, I found that the wrist can move much faster than the arm.
In order to keep my wrist doing the work I planted my pinky on the bottem of the bridge. I've made a decent living playing, and teaching, so I say,
"PLANT YOUR PINKYS"
and to hell with evert one else.


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## Coustfan'01

I tried it , after seeing petrucci do it , and it just doesn't work for me . Then I heard it's considered a technique flaw or something... I guess you just do what's comfortabel for you .


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## lolligagger

I am still working at trying to hold the pick correctly...I focus on this during every practice session. The strangest thing happens when I play in public though, in that I regress automatically to the old pinky plant. To my ear, my playing is more fluid, expressive, controlled and the tone is better when I plant. I even receive compliments from others at the jam...this makes it difficult not to abandon my attempts to stop pinky planting. I was just curious how everybody else is doing with their pickin'...how about you Jeff?


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## GuitaristZ

I used to pinkie plant a bit, but I found it hindered me so I stopped and just practiced more.


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## BloodBrotherXxX

I really didnt know it was problem untill I read this thread, so I tried not pinky planting. I find that I can pick alot faster, less control at first, but thats nothing a little practise wont take care of. My hand kinda cramps after a while tho. Thx for the tip:rockon:


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## Warren

lolligagger said:


> Hi, my name is lolligagger and I'm a pinky planter...its a disease. Actually a buddy of mine who happens to be a guitar instructor came over the other night and poo-pooed the way I was holding my pick, and the use of my pinky as a reference point. Apparently, in his view its a crutch.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk_GMvIea6s

Ya, I know it moves but he still puts it down, he talks about it in an old instructional tape set, he uses it as a reference point.

So, when he meets Steve Morse? "uh, Steve, nice job but really manwhy use your pinky as a crutch"


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## violation

I do... I like to keep my right hand / arm in contact with the body as much as possible, gives me more overall control of the guitar. If Petrucci among MANY others *cough* MAB *cough* can do it, I fail to see how it can hinder you or your playing. Dudes can shred at 200+ bpm.


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## dhutchings

I was trying to train myself to NOT do it, and when I brought it up to my instructor he said that not only is it not a crutch, he highly recommends it. For me it helps as a reference point for the position of the pick over the strings.


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## Jeff Flowerday

I was working on quitting, then I saw a video of Petrucci going at Mach 10 with his pinky planted. Now I'm back at it.


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## david henman

...oh, geez, i saw this thread title and now i've become all self conscious and insecure about my pinky.

thanks a bunch, you guys!

 

-dh


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## AJ6stringsting

JSD's Guitar Shack said:


> Guilty as charged for planting the pinky.


 I don't pinky plant...........but if you do ...who cares as long as you sound great !!!!!:rockon2:


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## drak10687

My hands are actually really, REALLY small (in fact they are so small that I shouldn't probably even be palying guitar, but whatever, I do it for fun) so its almost impossible for me to piky plant or hook the left thumb in most hand positions...


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## Starbuck

*Unfortunately*

I'm not a pinky planter, but much to my dismay I've gotten into the very bad habit of NEVER using a pick. I hold my pointer and my thumb like I"m using a pick. I do alot of fingerpicking (that seems to be what happens when you play alone) and when I try to use a pick I'm like a person who has never held a guitar (and I'm pretty good otherwise) HELP!


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## ENDITOL

I have an ugly floating hand picking technique, but it works for me (usually). :smile:


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## simescan

Starbuck50 said:


> I'm not a pinky planter, but much to my dismay I've gotten into the very bad habit of NEVER using a pick. I hold my pointer and my thumb like I"m using a pick. I do alot of fingerpicking (that seems to be what happens when you play alone) and when I try to use a pick I'm like a person who has never held a guitar (and I'm pretty good otherwise) HELP!


I fell into the same pickless habit, and yes, I play alone...


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## Starbuck

*Let me ammend that*

Now that you mention it, turns out that when I finger pick, the pinky is firmy planted.. With strumming that is not the case. Funny thing, before I came across this thread I never even noticed. It must not be that important.


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## Robert1950

I was watching a Zappa vid on YouTube - ABB's Whipping Post. Frank was a PINKY PLANTER.


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## simescan

...Oh and, yeah,...I'm a pinky planter too!


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## Oldgold54

You can have all the style you want, but without any technique, who'll know that you have style?


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## calluses

omg...i thought i was the only one who does that 

i find it much easier to control while picking a solo


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## Geek

When I play bass, I only need two fingers on each hand, so.....


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## zontar

Sometimes, sometimes not.

It depends on what I'm playing--I haven't thought of it much.

Even if I'm not pinky planting my hand is usually not in a fist.

As for this-"Do not rest your picking hand on the strings or body of the guitar." (from the lesson link earlier)--well sometimes I use my fingers to mute the strings, although I mostly use the heel of my hand.

It's probably not a bad idea to try the other way--it may work better for you. A guitarist shouldn't be afraid to try different techniques--I've resisted things in the past, and then I turned out to love them. You never know what you'll truly prefer.


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## dodgechargerfan

I hadn't thought about it much. I tend to plant it when I'm trying to pick at "mandolin speeds." Otherwise, I'm pretty much all over the place. :^/


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