# How to become a sound engineer?



## Cort Strummer (Feb 16, 2009)

I am looking for a career change because I am tired of being a grunt. Because I like music I was thinking of going to school to be a sound engineer, I was wondering if anyone had any insight on the best school/course and/or the best way to get into the profession?

I have been talking to someone at Metal Works because they have their own school now but the price is a little ludicrous. At most a sound engineer makes what $15-20 with experience and to get started you normally need to do an internship? For the 1 yr program Metal Works wants $17,820 and the 2 yr program is $33,210 and gives you up to 3 years to pay it off with interest so that seems to me that for a FUN but low paying job you are digger your self a pretty deep hole. Now for that kind of money I can go to BC and take a Guitar Luthier program which in turn would pay a lot more than a sound engineer I would think.

So does anyone have any input on how to become a sound engineer without having to claim bankruptcy? Other other good College courses anyone knows about? I know there is media arts at Sheridan but that covers everything related to media.


----------



## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

Finances - Admissions | OIART college of audio arts


----------



## six-string (Oct 7, 2009)

Recording Workshop - Welcome


----------



## Powdered Toast Man (Apr 6, 2006)

Cort Strummer said:


> For the 1 yr program Metal Works wants $17,820 and the 2 yr program is $33,210 and gives you up to 3 years to pay it off with interest so that seems to me that for a FUN but low paying job you are digger your self a pretty deep hole. Now for that kind of money I can go to BC and take a Guitar Luthier program which in turn would pay a lot more than a sound engineer I would think.
> 
> So does anyone have any input on how to become a sound engineer without having to claim bankruptcy? Other other good College courses anyone knows about? I know there is media arts at Sheridan but that covers everything related to media.


Son, for that kind of money, you can get yourself a full on Bachelor degree in Manitoba. 

Frankly, as a former TV industry person, I wouldn't recommend any of the smaller "career college" type places for anything related to media. They're generally considered a joke by broadcast industry pros and you will find it difficult to find meaningful employment in the field. Actually, I would avoid broadcasting altogether as the job market there is highly competitive due to a shrinking pool of jobs. Many (and I mean about 70%) of the people I formerly worked with in TV are no longer in the industry at all because jobs were cut and there were no other jobs to go to - period. Broadcasting is one of the fields where automation and computer networking has severely cut the number of people required to make TV happen.

I assume you're looking to get into recording engineering or something similar. You'll need some formal training, and then just a lot of experience (probably as an understudy with an established industry pro) to build up a reputation and contacts. I think anyone who makes any real money doing that pretty much works freelance. But, in order to go freelance in any industry, you need an established reputation and contact network to keep work flowing.

Best of luck.


----------



## snacker (Jun 26, 2008)

to be honest, going to school to be a recording engineer these days is a bad move - the reason metalworks is a school now is because the market is DRY and they needed to diversify in order to stay afloat - if you're really set on becoming an engineer, take your $17,000....take a few online berklee courses, buy a bunch of gear, set up your basement and find some clients - a good luthier program, tube amp repair, music business or video and post-production program is going to be a better bet - with any of those, be prepared to make your own work though - it's an entrepreneurial field - hope that helps


----------



## Cort Strummer (Feb 16, 2009)

Thanks for the info guys.

Once I talked to the guy on the phone I had to resist laughing and hanging up on the guy. There is no way I would spend that much money on a course for this. I was just curious to see if it was a feasible idea, but the responses that I got it doesn't seem like it. I will just go with my first plan and go to Sheridan for Design and Drafting which seems to be the smarter idea right now.


----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

The reality is that with the relentless improvements in computer recording software and peripheral gear, it's going to get increasingly difficult to find what most of us would consider gainful employment in the recording arts. More and more artists are making investments in hopped up computers and doing it themselves.

Live sound is still a viable business. It's hard work, but there are lots of opportunities.


----------



## Destropiate (Jan 17, 2007)

I had a friend who went to Trebas, basically said he could have learned as much by reading up on mic placement & spending 20 minutes with a mixing console manual. Apparently its a complete joke, 30 people in his class new classes starting every 6 months. Do the math...theres not that many Sound engineer jobs in Ontario and when your pushing 60 people through the school in a year.........
Apparently the only good advice he got at the school was where to hang out to meet industry people, unfortunatly as soon as you mention your a Trebas student they ignore you.


----------



## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

What everybody else is saying.. $33k buys a lot of gear and soundproofing. There are luthier programs in ontario but I would suggest a cabinetmakers course if you are thinking that way. Guitar building is still woodworking and it would give you a foot in the door to places where there is work. As well as open the door to carpentry, boatbuilding etc etc.


----------



## Cort Strummer (Feb 16, 2009)

I was interested in doing both Recording and Live... when there is an event going on working there and when there is nothing going on work in the studio. I have take a carpentry course already and have done carpentry work but after a lay off I worked for a overhead door company and shattered my left elbow. So I am actually looking for a good not so labour intensive job that is fun. 

Thanks for the input guys, there is no way I would invest $33K for a job that is so disposable.


----------



## kw_guitarguy (Apr 29, 2008)

Join IATSE and get your name on the list...start by pulling cables and work your way up the ladder.

~Andrew


----------



## ronmac (Sep 22, 2006)

Cort Strummer said:


> I was interested in doing both Recording and Live... when there is an event going on working there and when there is nothing going on work in the studio. I have take a carpentry course already and have done carpentry work but after a lay off I worked for a overhead door company and shattered my left elbow. So I am actually looking for a good not so labour intensive job that is fun.
> 
> Thanks for the input guys, there is no way I would invest $33K for a job that is so disposable.


Your shattered elbow may be something to consider, especially for live sound work. As Milkman said, live work is rewarding but hard work. Not everybody gets to sit in the easy chair behind the board.


----------



## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

Sort of a no-brainer thing to consider, but it's probably the most important. Make sure you have good ears. Not just in terms of freq response, but also ability to hear in a mix, and just have a good sense of balance, etc. is really important. Sure, you can learn guidelines and stuff, but every solid sound guy has a good set of ears to begin with.

I try mixing my own stuff and after a while, I can get it sounding ok, but it's never as good as when a pro gets behind the sliders.


----------



## keeperofthegood (Apr 30, 2008)

>_>

Am I the only one that read this thread title and thought

Go to a sound school!

ok ok sue me  I've been sick that's my story and I'm sticking to it


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

keeperofthegood said:


> >_>
> 
> Am I the only one that read this thread title and thought
> 
> ...


Keeps...Go back to bed...Your fever is giving you weird thought processing...LOL

Cheers

Dave


----------



## Jimmypaz (Sep 15, 2009)

As far as I know Fanshawe College in London Ontario still has the MIA (musical industry arts) program running. One of the best around, if you can get in, they have fairly high standards. Or the traditional way to learn is start as a teenager lugging amps for bands and learn by doing, that's basically how I learned. As has been said, though, all the training in the world won't help if you don't have good "ears". Much like anything else in the music game, I guess,,,,
Peace;
Jim


----------



## Andy (Sep 23, 2007)

This sounds eerily similar to my situation last year -- I was choosing between OIART and the Architectural Technology program at Conestoga. I'm not going to tell you which path is better for you, only that I'll be attending Conestoga in the fall. 

Good luck.


----------



## Cort Strummer (Feb 16, 2009)

ya I already did the private college thing for carpentry, for what you pay it isnt worth it because at least in my situation we zoomed/skipped through so much stuff. So to sum it up private colleges are a cash grab. I think I will just dream about about being a sound engineer to the stars and continue playing and maybe I will get to play with them instead. After all the input the Design and Drafting course definitely sounds like a more solid plan, I am glad that I decided to ask here before I just jumped into something that really wouldn't pay off... I am 26 and can't afford to screw around anymore.

Thanks everyone for the great insight.


----------



## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

Cort Strummer said:


> ya I already did the private college thing for carpentry, for what you pay it isnt worth it because at least in my situation we zoomed/skipped through so much stuff. So to sum it up private colleges are a cash grab. I think I will just dream about about being a sound engineer to the stars and continue playing and maybe I will get to play with them instead. After all the input the Design and Drafting course definitely sounds like a more solid plan, I am glad that I decided to ask here before I just jumped into something that really wouldn't pay off... I am 26 and can't afford to screw around anymore.
> 
> Thanks everyone for the great insight.


Even legitame colleges, like Conestoga (my Alma Matter), have several "seat filler" courses that lead nowhere. They all inflate or fudge their employment numbers too. that 93% employment rate doesn't mean 93% work in the field they paid for training in. Courses like law and security, woodworking and other programs for jobs that used to onl;y require a high school diploma fall into that catagory. Honestly, if you want to go to college and you want to get a good paying job at th end of it all, apprentiship is the only way to go. If you're concerned about heavey lifting I'd suggest either electrician or plumber. I used to install cabinets on big job sites, and the electricians were always doing the least hard work for the most money, followed closely by the plumbers.


----------



## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Want to make money?

Get into something involving computers, involving health care or both. With an aging population and the advances in technology, that's where the money is.


----------



## Cort Strummer (Feb 16, 2009)

well the course I am looking at is a 3 year course, 2 years in school and the the 3rd year is a paid co-op placement. A lot of my friends that have done a co-op course at Sheridan told me a lot of the students were offer jobs where they did their co-op. And after this course you can go to U of T for a Masters in engineering.


----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

hollowbody said:


> Sort of a no-brainer thing to consider, but it's probably the most important. Make sure you have good ears. Not just in terms of freq response, but also ability to hear in a mix, and just have a good sense of balance, etc. is really important. Sure, you can learn guidelines and stuff, but every solid sound guy has a good set of ears to begin with.
> 
> I try mixing my own stuff and after a while, I can get it sounding ok, but it's never as good as when a pro gets behind the sliders.


If you are unable to lift intricate parts (accurately learn a cover tune note for note) you may not be a good sound man. The key to mixing in my opinion, is the ability to listen to a crowded room full of people talking, mentally strip away the din and hear that one conversation you're interested in.


----------



## Guest (Apr 21, 2010)

Cort Strummer said:


> well the course I am looking at is a 3 year course, 2 years in school and the the 3rd year is a paid co-op placement. A lot of my friends that have done a co-op course at Sheridan told me a lot of the students were offer jobs where they did their co-op. And after this course you can go to U of T for a Masters in engineering.


I'm a big believer in co-op. It was an option that served me well all thoughout my youth. On the job and in the classroom are very different things.

As for the Masters degree at U of T - that seems highly unlikely. I think someone is feeding you some mis-information there. You should call U of T's engineering department and verify that for yourself.


----------



## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

Milkman said:


> If you are unable to lift intricate parts (accurately learn a cover tune note for note) you may not be a good sound man. The key to mixing in my opinion, is the ability to listen to a crowded room full of people talking, mentally strip away the din and hear that one conversation you're interested in.


Absolutely! Depending on the mix, I sometimes have an incredibly hard time picking out parts. I try to follow along on a tab that I know is accurate and I'll be playing things that sound right, but I can't necessarily hear them happening in the song, or at least not right away.

Bottom line - you don't want me doing your sound!


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

How to become a sound engineer?

Is that a sound engineer or a sound, engineer?


----------

