# Attenuators?



## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

I've had a few over the years but nothing right now. Does anyone have any experience with this? Seems too good to be true. I'm thinking if my Budda doesn't sell this might be the answer. It's the loudest 18 watts I've ever heard 

[video=youtube;vVfyTbdMyi8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=108&amp;v=vVfyTbdMyi8[/video]


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

The demo certainly suggests it does what you want it to do. But the fact that it is in a small enclosure with no ventilation provokes a bit of concern on my part.
Is that a rotary switch or a pot? If a pot, then I am not aware of many wire-wound pots up to handling that sort of wattage, especially without air flowing through. Keep in mind that simple passive attenuators essentially "dump" amp output as heat. And if there is nowhere for the heat to go... 

Admittedly, this unit is intended for more modest-powered amps (30W or less). Still, I need an explanation of why I should have high expectations for its longevity. If it was intended to make single-6V6 or single EL-84 amps quieter, I'd be more accepting.


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

My concerns exactly. Most of the ones I've owned were fairly large and in some cases vented. Even the Weber Mini Mass is a decent size, although not vented.











mhammer said:


> The demo certainly suggests it does what you want it to do. But the fact that it is in a small enclosure with no ventilation provokes a bit of concern on my part.
> Is that a rotary switch or a pot? If a pot, then I am not aware of many wire-wound pots up to handling that sort of wattage, especially without air flowing through. Keep in mind that simple passive attenuators essentially "dump" amp output as heat. And if there is nowhere for the heat to go...
> 
> Admittedly, this unit is intended for more modest-powered amps (30W or less). Still, I need an explanation of why I should have high expectations for its longevity. If it was intended to make single-6V6 or single EL-84 amps quieter, I'd be more accepting.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

mhammer said:


> T
> 
> 
> > The demo certainly suggests it does what you want it to do. But the fact that it is in a small enclosure with no ventilation provokes a bit of concern on my part.
> ...


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

It is apparently vented and contains something called an L Pad? Oops Greco beat me to the ventilation bit 

https://reverb.com/item/228349-tubular-mods-juice-box-16-tube-amp-attenuator

http://www.parts-express.com/parts-...attenuator-100w-mono-3-8-shaft-8-ohm--260-262


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

So, I stand corrected on both counts: you can get wirewound L-pads that can handle higher power. and the seemingly sealed enclosure actually IS vented. All of which means that I was worrying, and causing concern, unnecessarily.

Carry on!


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

Does that mean you think this might actually be viable technology? I'm surprised we haven't seen more like this if that is the case. Very cool if it works as advertised though. I've seen them on Ebay for about $50.



mhammer said:


> So, I stand corrected on both counts: you can get wirewound L-pads that can handle higher power. and the seemingly sealed enclosure actually IS vented. All of which means that I was worrying, and causing concern, unnecessarily.
> 
> Carry on!


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

I've had an L-Pad Attenuator which worked great until it stopped working. The L-Pad was rated for 15 watts and I was using it with a modded 5 watt Epiphone Valve Jr. I don't know why it failed but I smelled something burning while I was playing (and it wasn't the fretboard - I'm not that fast). Within seconds, it stopped working. I was mailed a replacement from the guy that sold the kit but I still haven't fixed it.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

mhammer said:


> So, I stand corrected on both counts: you can get wirewound L-pads that can handle higher power. and the seemingly sealed enclosure actually IS vented. All of which means that I was worrying, and causing concern, unnecessarily.
> 
> Carry on!


Don't view it as worrying and causing unnecessary concern. 

View it as consumer protection/education, quality control, group enlightenment, etc 

Someday I hope we can discuss topics like this.... in depth, and over a a beverage, in Ottawa.

Cheers

Dave


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

Ah ha! Some interesting discussion towards the end of this thread with the builder.

Would buying a higher rated L Pad alleviate some of the issues I wonder? Say a 100 watt when running a 15 - 30 watt amp.

http://forum.gibson.com/index.php?/topic/114371-juice-box/page__st__20


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

davetcan said:


> Ah ha! Some interesting discussion towards the end of this thread with the builder.
> 
> Would buying a higher rated L Pad alleviate some of the issues I wonder? Say a 100 watt when running a 15 - 30 watt amp.
> 
> http://forum.gibson.com/index.php?/topic/114371-juice-box/page__st__20


I suspect that the higher rated L-Pad would just heat up at a slightly slower rate at any given/or constant volume.

I built a dummy load (for an amp head) one time for 8 ohms @ 75 watts....those can get VERY HOT, VERY FAST. I was surprised.

Cheers

Dave


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## Swervin55 (Oct 30, 2009)

Dave: I have a Swart Night Lite that appears to perform in the same way as the video. I don't have a clue if it is L pad technology, but I can tell you I'm thrilled with the results. It has 4 levels of attenuation vs variable as the Juice Box. I bought it to tame a very loud 5E3 and it's made the difference between keeping the amp or getting rid of it. The Night Lite is also good up to 30W supposedly. So far so good.


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## Chitmo (Sep 2, 2013)

I have had more than a few attenuators and finally landed on a Rivera Rock Crusher. They're pricey units but it will do anything up to 120 watts and I can bring volumes down to the point where I can play in the room next to my sleeping 18 month old and not wake her up. The best part is that it doesn't color the tone. I know where you can find a used one right now as well if it's something that you'd be into.

Cheers,
F


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

Depends on the Budda selling or not, and then the price of course. Us retired guys don't have money to throw around like I used to. The Budda is absolutely killer on the clean channel and takes pedals really well so it's not a big deal, but I feel like I'm missing out on all that great Budda OD on the drive channel. I just can't turn it up loud enough to get the breakup, without going deaf that is.

I really don't need one for any of my other amps so I'm hoping the Budda sells, but if not .......



Chitmo said:


> I have had more than a few attenuators and finally landed on a Rivera Rock Crusher. They're pricey units but it will do anything up to 120 watts and I can bring volumes down to the point where I can play in the room next to my sleeping 18 month old and not wake her up. The best part is that it doesn't color the tone. I know where you can find a used one right now as well if it's something that you'd be into.
> 
> Cheers,
> F


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

I have a Zbrake in one of my Zbest cabs that came with my Carmen Ghia.

I've yet to hook it up, we don't need no stinking attenuation!
That, is a loud as heck 18 watter too!

There are two types the regular and a "lite" model for lower powered amps.
I think that I have the lite model.

I could pull it from the cab and let you try it out Dave, it's not getting any use right now.


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

Well i REALLY appreciate the offer but no need to get drastic yet, LOL. The Juice Box thingy caught my eye because $70 is something I can afford 



sulphur said:


> I have a Zbrake in one of my Zbest cabs that came with my Carmen Ghia.
> 
> I've yet to hook it up, we don't need no stinking attenuation!
> That, is a loud as heck 18 watter too!
> ...


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## Chitmo (Sep 2, 2013)

sulphur said:


> I have a Zbrake in one of my Zbest cabs that came with my Carmen Ghia.
> 
> I've yet to hook it up, we don't need no stinking attenuation!
> That, is a loud as heck 18 watter too!
> ...


I have owned an Air brake and the brake lite, I always found they were built more to tame an amp in a small venue gig than at home. I love me Dr Z. Amps but the Rivera is where its at for attenuators.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

I'm still a huge fan of the Ho's Attenuator. I have two and they are both awesome. I can turn it down so low that my stringers are louder than the cranked amp sound coming out of my amp.


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## jb welder (Sep 14, 2010)

davetcan said:


> Would buying a higher rated L Pad alleviate some of the issues I wonder? Say a 100 watt when running a 15 - 30 watt amp.


Yes.
Once you get into heavy clipping, the power can really go up. So a 18W amp putting out a square wave can approach 36W.
If you only want to push the amp to where it _starts_ to break up, the 50W (30W) unit is probably sufficient for you.
But once you have the luxury of not destroying your ears, it's easy to get carried away and want to dime everything. If that's the case then you better get the 100W (60W) version.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

jb welder said:


> Yes.
> Once you get into heavy clipping, the power can really go up. So a 18W amp putting out a square wave can approach 36W.
> If you only want to push the amp to where it _starts_ to break up, the 50W (30W) unit is probably sufficient for you.
> But once you have the luxury of not destroying your ears, it's easy to get carried away and want to dime everything. If that's the case then you better get the 100W (60W) version.


Interesting. I wonder if that's why I fried my 15w L Pad. I had my 5w amp dimed most of the time.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

I built a 40W 8 ohm load into a box about the size of that Juice Box (4 10W 32 ohm resistors in parallel). It gets pretty hot running my YBA1 hard into it. And it's only taking half the power, the speaker cab is taking the other half, so I would guess it is dissipating 20 to 25 watts at most. More heat than I would want to put through an L-pad with a moving wiper.

Personally, if I'm fully terminating an amp with a load box, I would want inductive controls on the box, to shape the load more like a speaker. The more I look at the Fryette Power Station, I'm pretty sure there will be one in my future, when demand settles down (and maybe the Canadian dollar goes up). That will make all of my small amps more useful. It would help tame my big amps as well, but I only have a couple of 50 watters so that's not as much of a need for me. If I had a 100W Marshall, I would be all over one for that reason as well.


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