# I'm getting older and I can tell.



## djmarcelca (Aug 2, 2012)

I'm only 40, but I really can tell a generational gap with my customers. 

Simple honesty for one is pretty much gone. I forgot a screwdriver in a customers car, it was a 12 inch straight blade snap on screwdriver, so about 50.00 to replace. 

Called the guy, he never bothered to return it. 
Asshat. 

It also really makes me look at girls sideways too working in a shop. 
When women, of any age come and ask for help I can count down3,2,1......."I'm JUST A DUMB girl" comes out in every conversation I have with female customers about their cars. 

I've taken to flat out asking them, "Are you really dumb, or just acting like it?" 

Many other things as well, especially interior damage claims. 

We take pictures befor and after we work on customers cars, partially for assembly reference, but mostly to counter claims that we damaged the vehicle. 


Its its a sad way to work, but nessesary and the money is fantastic - in Alberta, if I moved home to Ontario, I would have my wage cut in half. It's that large a gap.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Alberta is a great place to work (and live) IMO.

I am getting older too...the way that I can tell is the presence of pain, the fact that I am very patient but I have little patience for stupidity and also that sometimes I eat something and it makes me feel sick. When I was young I had no pain and I am sure that I could have eaten driveway gravel and it wouldn't have made me feel sick.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

So you leave the screwdriver in the car and the customer is the "asshat"?

Hmm...


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## Disbeat (Jul 30, 2011)

Must be an amazing thing to coast through life never making a mistake...


dradlin said:


> So you leave the screwdriver in the car and the customer is the "asshat"?
> 
> Hmm...


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## djmarcelca (Aug 2, 2012)

dradlin said:


> So you leave the screwdriver in the car and the customer is the "asshat"?
> 
> Hmm...


After I call him and ask for it back? And it doesn't get returned? 
Yes asshat - at the very least. Theif at worst. 

Let me me know how much of your tools you'd be willing to have go missing.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

djmarcelca said:


> After I call him and ask for it back? And it doesn't get returned?
> Yes asshat - at the very least. Theif at worst.
> 
> Let me me know how much of your tools you'd be willing to have go missing.


He has no obligation to you to return it. It would be a favor at best.

Why not ask if you could go and pick it up from him at a time and place convenient for him?


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Disbeat said:


> Must be an amazing thing to coast through life never making a mistake...


Oh I make my fair share of mistakes, I just don't blame others when I make them and hold others accountable.


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## Disbeat (Jul 30, 2011)

He never blamed him, just expressing his frustration of how the customer never even bothered to return his message regarding the missing tool. Seems like a fair topic for the open mic.

Read. Process. Reply.
Follow those steps in that order.



dradlin said:


> Oh I make my fair share of mistakes, I just don't blame others when I make them and hold others accountable.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Disbeat said:


> He never blamed him, just expressing his frustration of how the customer never even bothered to return his message regarding the missing tool. Seems like a fair topic for the open mic.
> 
> Read. Process. Reply.
> Follow those steps in that order.


Calling the customer an "asshat" and a thief? The customer has no obligation to loose time or expense in returning the tool. The customer would be a nice guy if he accommodated the OP in driving to pickup the tool at the OP's own time and expense.

Read. Process.


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## Disbeat (Jul 30, 2011)

Your right, the op has no right to express his frustration in the open mic in a forum he frequents. My mistake, please don't judge me too harshly.
Read. Process. PLEASE DO NOT REPLY.


dradlin said:


> Calling the customer an "asshat" and a thief? The customer has no obligation to loose time or exhpense in returning the tool. The customer would be a nice guy if he accommodated the OP in driving to pickup the tool at the OP's own time and expense.
> 
> Read. Process.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Disbeat said:


> Your right, the op has no right to express his frustration in the open mic in a forum he frequents. My mistake, please don't judge me too harshly.
> Read. Process. PLEASE DO NOT REPLY.


Without being challenged, the OP has the right to post something along the lines of "I'm such an asshat because I spent $50 on a screwdriver...", or "I'm such an asshat for leaving my $50 screwdriver in a customers car...".

Otherwise, the OP (or you) can expect to be called to the mat if blaming the customer in any way for the lose or expecting them to incur time or expense to cover the OP's mistake.

I had a mechanic leave a screwdriver in the chassis of my truck once. I leave the garage and get a few hundred meters down a busy road and the screwdriver falls out and onto the road. I had a tie rod ends replaced and front end alignment, I was thinking "wtf part just fell off my truck?". So I pull over on the busy road searching for what fell off... after a few minutes I found the screwdriver. I drove back to the garage and handed the screwdriver back to the asshat mechanic that left it there... he was fortunate there was no loss or injury incurred. True story.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

I have returned stuff that people left so many times I can't count. It doesn't make me 'citizen of the year' , it makes me a human being with common courtesy. True story.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

This is not worth arguing about.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

smorgdonkey said:


> I have returned stuff that people left so many times I can't count. It doesn't make me 'citizen of the year' , it makes me a human being with common courtesy. True story.


...causes me to ponder what else was forgotten on all those repairs if tools were so routinely left behind. Maybe time for a new serviceman?

Common courtesy is to not inconvenience your customers with your own forgetfulness, let alone it being expected.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

dradlin said:


> ...causes me to ponder what else was forgotten on all those repairs if tools were so routinely left behind. Maybe time for a new serviceman?


It's never been the same person twice so, no.



dradlin said:


> Common courtesy is to not inconvenience your customers with your own forgetfulness, let alone it being expected.


The onus of the common courtesy would be on the person who has the item since, in many cases, a place of business is known and an individual's address is not.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

smorgdonkey said:


> It's never been the same person twice so, no.
> 
> The onus of the common courtesy would be on the person who has the item since, in many cases, a place of business is known and an individual's address is not.


I beg to differ... the onus is on the originator of the error, in this case the OP. Common courtesy is to not inconvenience the customer, especially when no fault of theirs!


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

So, I guess I am citizen of the year every time I returned something. Cool!

When I was given a box with 2 Rockstands in it but I had only bought one, I returned the other one. It was inconvenient and it was still common courtesy.

You and I disagree - that, we can agree on.


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## Woof (Jan 13, 2010)

If I was the customer and I noticed later, I would at least inform and allow pickup... if I didn't notice but was asked, I would certainly look and still allow pickup.

I *might* consider the workmanship a little sloppy but it's still not my screwdriver... if it happened again I might reconsider where I go for work.

Still not my screwdriver!


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Woof said:


> If I was the customer and I noticed later, I would at least inform and allow pickup... if I didn't notice but was asked, I would certainly look and still allow pickup.
> 
> I *might* consider the workmanship a little sloppy but it's still not my screwdriver... if it happened again I might reconsider where I go for work.
> 
> Still not my screwdriver!


Who gave you the right to make sense?


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## djmarcelca (Aug 2, 2012)

Ok so the focus is on the screwdriver. 
So let me recap, 
the screwdriver was forgotten in the car, noticed and the customer was called, spoken to, and asked to return the item. He just didn't. 

So he knows he's in possession of an item he did not pay for, not on loan, there is no legal or moral reason for him to keep my tool other than he wants to. 

And yes, an honest person would return it. Usually without to much argument. 

I'm really surprised there's any debate about this.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

in my experience, people who use tools for a living would sooner return the screwdriver. those who don't work with tools for a living think of you as a low class, knuckle-dragging neanderthal who deserves no respect. many of those people wouldn't cross the street to piss on you if you were on fire, but will circulate a snarky email through the company, complaining about the screwdriver.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

cheezyridr said:


> in my experience, people who use tools for a living would sooner return the screwdriver. those who don't work with tools for a living think of you as a low class, knuckle-dragging neanderthal who deserves no respect. many of those people wouldn't cross the street to piss on you if you were on fire, but will circulate a snarky email through the company, complaining about the screwdriver.


Okay, but you and I both know that if you work/ed in a tool shop, or similar, you are locking your toolbox shut for a reason. There's more than enough neanderthals willing to walk away with your shit who work with you. At Bombardier Aerospace, we had a big issue with outside trades walking away with our stuff.

I think it comes down to luck of the draw - did you leave your shit in a douchbag's cars, or someone who was raised right.


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## JeremyP (Jan 10, 2012)

What a stupid thing to argue about on a guitar forum.
The OP was complaining about his day to a forum of his "friends and peers" . Blowing off steam if you will. 

See this same shit all the time. Why bust the guys balls about some offhand comment about a screwdriver? We are musicians for **** sakes, this is a lawyers argument . Say "amen brother , life blows , at least you got the guitars and online like minded people!" And MOVE ON.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

This thread has some good points and a few stupid statements _(you know who you are)_ but what I was wondering about is, what does this have to do with _"I'm getting older and I can tell"_. We can't group all of our young people as bad on the actions of a few and I have never in my life ever heard a woman of any age say "I'm just a dumb girl".


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

I thought this thread would be about things like, "I know I getting old because I'd rather sit down to take a whiz than standing."


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Blowing off steam is one thing... labeling the screwdriver guy an asshat and thief, his general contempt for "dumb" girls and the whole of generations below the OP is ridiculous.

I too am blowing off steam, because that makes everything one says justified.

I use tools everyday, and his tool would be in an envelope waiting on my front porch or front desk at work (his choice) for pickup. If I received a call demanding I return it, I'd hang up and wait for an appropriate call. If it was my screwdriver, I would have politely arranged to pick it up, apologized for the inconvenience. I guess I wasn't raised proper... sigh.

All are welcome to disagree. Enough said.


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

Robert1950 said:


> I thought this thread would be about things like, "I know I getting old because I'd rather sit down to take a whiz than standing."


here, here. I kinda thought that's what it was going to be about too. In retrospect, this thread is a lot less depressing, so I' think we're better off.


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

dradlin... you really need to get a life other than the one where you troll this place.

edit; it's a thread with dradlin's contribution, better add dead horse...


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

dradlin said:


> Blowing off steam is one thing... labeling the screwdriver guy an asshat and thief, his general contempt for "dumb" girls and the whole of generations below the OP is ridiculous.
> 
> I too am blowing off steam, because that makes everything one says justified.
> 
> ...


Yeah, but it's kinda like someone has been shitting in your cheerios every morning. You're causing friction where it doesn't need to be (forum-wide). There's a VERY simple way to get your point across without being so abrasive. 

I'm not looking to change anything (I am always one for spice), but maybe you should floss after breakfast (just a little) - it may make you look less assholey.

- - - Updated - - -



Jimmy_D said:


> dradlin... you really need to get a life other than the one where you troll this place.
> 
> edit; it's a thread with dradlin's contribution, better add dead horse...
> 
> View attachment 10373


Jesus Jimmy_D - I wanted to be the first person to say something. I guess I'm just a passenger on the bandwagon.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Sorry guys, but I'm not about to jump on the bandwagon going around here blaming the world for mistakes I made... as examples: a failure to read terms and conditions on an online sale; a failure to specify USPS instead of UPS; a failure removing all my tools from a customers car; or any other.

You want to bitch about culture, how about the growing lack of individual accountability? It's epic!

I'll be the last one to come here bitching about someone else's response to one of my screw-ups, and the first one challenging anyone that does... so if you don't want to be challenged keep your bitching and bashing to yourself, or take it to some other bitching and bashing forum unrelated to guitars.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

My mechanic forgot a ratchet in my car.
i returned it to him.
i have a long standing relationship with that mechanic/garage that I want to maintain, and they've always been great with me.
Anybody who owns tools knows how valuable they are to their owners.

that said, if it was some random stealership, I dont know what I'd do.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Diablo said:


> .....that said, if it was some random *stealership,* I don't know what I'd do.


Is this an intended pun? 


Cheers

Dave


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

dradlin said:


> So you leave the screwdriver in the car and the customer is the "asshat"?
> 
> Hmm...


So, losing something makes it fair game ie finders keepers?
wonder if you have a closet full of found wallets somewhere....apparently that wouldn't make you an asshat.
:sSig_Idontgetit:


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

dradlin said:


> Sorry guys, but I'm not about to jump on the bandwagon going around here blaming the world for mistakes I made... as examples: a failure to read terms and conditions on an online sale; a failure to specify USPS instead of UPS; a failure removing all my tools from a customers car; or any other.
> 
> You want to bitch about culture, how about the growing lack of individual accountability? It's epic!
> 
> I'll be the last one to come here bitching about someone else's response to one of my screw-ups, and the first one challenging anyone that does... so if you don't want to be challenged keep your bitching and bashing to yourself, or take it to some other bitching and bashing forum unrelated to guitars.












yes.. remove tool indeed /thread


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

greco said:


> Is this an intended pun?
> 
> 
> Cheers
> ...


 
lol
-----


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Bottom line is that I always return stuff that is left in my possession by mistake - it's called HUMAN ERROR. I like to reciprocate to human error by being a human being. I would normally return the item(s) before being called and most definitely after being called. Why? Because I am not an asshat.




dradlin said:


> I'll be the last one to come here bitching about someone else's response to one of my screw-ups, and the first one challenging anyone that does... so if you don't want to be challenged keep your bitching and bashing to yourself, or take it to some other bitching and bashing forum unrelated to guitars.


So, priority #1 for you is to bitch at someone bitching about something that you think they should have handled differently.

Face it...you're OTR. Permanently.

You could just skip the thread - unless you LOVE to bitch(?).


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> Bottom line is that I always return stuff that is left in my possession by mistake - it's called HUMAN ERROR. I like to reciprocate to human error by being a human being. I would normally return the item(s) before being called and most definitely after being called. Why? Because I am not an asshat.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 "OTR"? Which definition are you referring to?
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=OTR


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> "OTR"? Which definition are you referring to?
> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=OTR


#1

I had no idea that there were more definitions.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> #1
> 
> I had no idea that there were more definitions.


Lol....all I could think of was Off the record....which didn't make sense.
kids these days and they're slang.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Diablo said:


> So, losing something makes it fair game ie finders keepers?
> wonder if you have a closet full of found wallets somewhere....apparently that wouldn't make you an asshat.
> :sSig_Idontgetit:


Read post #26 and it should be apparent that is a total mis-characterization of my position. Though I suspect your intent (and others) is to slander rather than intelligently discuss the issue.


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

Diablo said:


> Lol....
> kids these days and they're slang.


Hell, I'm getting old. Acronyms do my head in. IMO.



Hee-Hee!


Old. & crusty. " and his skin is cold" doo-bee-doo. Love me some Doors.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk -& All Round Nice Guy.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

dradlin said:


> Though I suspect your intent (and others) is to slander rather than intelligently discuss the issue.


Now you are suggesting that you are intelligently discussing the issue?

If to 'tell everyone that everything is their own fault in a pissy manner' just about any time anyone raises a topic is to 'intelligently discuss the issue' then you are on it.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

dradlin said:


> Read post #26 and it should be apparent that is a total mis-characterization of my position. Though I suspect your intent (and others) is to slander rather than intelligently discuss the issue.


Haha. Right. We're the trolls here

so in Post 26 you say: "All are welcome to disagree. Enough said."

yet, when someone does disagree, you accuse them of slander?

do you even know what slander means, or is your intent to turn GC threads into your personal moronic moot court?
if so, fine. I'm charging you with disturbing the peace within a thread. The internet police will be at your door shortly, lol.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> Lol....all I could think of was Off the record....which didn't make sense.


I thought of 'Off The Record' immediately after I wrote it too. HA!


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

smorgdonkey said:


> Now you are suggesting that you are intelligently discussing the issue?
> 
> If to 'tell everyone that everything is their own fault in a pissy manner' just about any time anyone raises a topic is to 'intelligently discuss the issue' then you are on it.


Read the OP and then call me "pissy"? Whatever.


To the OP... suck it up buttercup. Call the customer and apologize for the inconvenience imposed on him and ask if there is a convenient time and place you could come pick up your screwdriver, and bring along a $10 Tim's card for his troubles.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Diablo said:


> Haha. Right. We're the trolls here
> 
> so in Post 26 you say: "All are welcome to disagree. Enough said."
> 
> ...


Disagreement is welcome, personal attacks are not... but I have come to understand that it always comes to that from a saintly few.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

dradlin said:


> Disagreement is welcome, personal attacks are not... but I have come to understand that it always comes to that from a saintly few.


Where are all these personal attacks? For someone as snide as yourself, you have an awfully thin skin. Yet most of your posts have a cheap little dig in the end, meant to provoke or demean.

in fairness, tone aside, I actually think this part of your post was reasonable and I agree with it.



> I use tools everyday, and his tool would be in an envelope waiting on my front porch or front desk at work (his choice) for pickup. If I received a call demanding I return it, I'd hang up and wait for an appropriate call. If it was my screwdriver, I would have politely arranged to pick it up, apologized for the inconvenience. I guess I wasn't raised proper... sigh.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

dradlin said:


> Read the OP and then call me "pissy"? Whatever.
> 
> 
> To the OP... suck it up buttercup. Call the customer and apologize for the inconvenience imposed on him and ask if there is a convenient time and place you could come pick up your screwdriver, and bring along a $10 Tim's card for his troubles.


Lol a $10. GC? Why not provide him some oral service while he's at it also? Maybe give him a kidney?
why do ppl think any act of simply doing the right thing to a fellow human needs to be financially compensated?


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## deadear (Nov 24, 2011)

Djmarcelca I found a large ratchet on the road near a truck repair outfit. Picked it up and took it home. Could have used it but very seldom. I knew it either came out of the quarry or a mechanic had left it on a truck and it feel off on a test ride. Phoned the repair outfit and left a message with the parts man if anyone lost a tool to call me and I left my number. Got a call in a couple days and the guy described the tool he lost. I dropped it off and the owner of the shop took out his wallet and handed me $20. It was a 1/2 drive with a swivel and long like a power bar. Probably $100 plus to replace


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Diablo said:


> Lol a $10. GC? Why not provide him some oral service while he's at it also? Maybe give him a kidney?
> why do ppl think any act of simply doing the right thing to a fellow human needs to be financially compensated?


Right, and I'm the guy that doesn't understand common courtesy?


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

Still beating that pony huh... want some discussion... In the real world we were taught to deal with it like this, if the guy forgets his tools and let's you know he made that mistake, and you do nothing to return them, then you're a thief.

It's isn't incumbent upon people not to make mistakes but it is incumbent on you once you've been notified of that mistake to do something as the tool in your possession is not yours, it may be an inconvenience for you but you're still wrong if you keep it... so suck it up buttercup and do the right thing.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Jimmy_D said:


> Still beating that pony huh... want some discussion... In the real world we were taught to deal with it like this, if the guy forgets his tools and let's you know he made that mistake, and you do nothing to return them, then you're a thief.
> 
> It's isn't incumbent upon people not to make mistakes but it is incumbent on you once you've been notified of that mistake to do something as the tool in your possession is not yours, it may be an inconvenience for you but you're still wrong if you keep it... so suck it up buttercup and do the right thing.


Post #26 - I'm not keeping it, it's in an envelope at the front desk of the place I work... come get it.


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

The op says "Called the guy, he never bothered to return it, asshat"... a true statement... the direction this one has derailed on, is that you take offense to calling him an asshat/thief... remember? (see post #9 by you).

It didn't come back... he didn't make it available by leaving it at his front reception, so he is just what he's been branded.


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

Wish I were a mod. There'd be some major editing and a warning or 2.


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

keto said:


> Wish I were a mod. There'd be some major editing and a warning or 2.


Or you could just go ahead and edit the posts the way you like, in a post, and then we'd know where you stand...


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Just checking in now.

Boy, this thread isn't AT ALL about what the header/title suggests, is it?


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

mhammer said:


> Just checking in now.
> 
> Boy, this thread isn't AT ALL about what the header/title suggests, is it?


You could get old while taking the time to read this thread in its entirety.

Cheers

Dave


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

Hey, I left my screwdriver in your car, mind if I come and pick it up?

/thread


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)




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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Jimmy_D said:


> The op says "Called the guy, he never bothered to return it, asshat"... a true statement... the direction this one has derailed on, is that you take offense to calling him an asshat/thief... remember? (see post #9 by you).
> 
> It didn't come back... he didn't make it available by leaving it at his front reception, so he is just what he's been branded.


I'm out enjoying a beautiful day today, get back and check in and you are still at it... yet I'm the one beating a dead horse? LOL

In post #20 the OP stated "...the customer was called, spoken to, and asked to return the item. He just didn't." So get your story straight. And you call me the asshat?

If the OP called and simply asked the customer for the opportunity to come pick up the screwdriver, I'm sure the ending to this saga would have been a whole lot different.

I don't see the issue with post #9.


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

dradlin said:


> I'm out enjoying a beautiful day today, get back and check in and you are still at it... yet I'm the one beating a dead horse? LOL
> 
> In post #20 the OP stated "...the customer was called, spoken to, and asked to return the item. He just didn't." So get your story straight. And you call me the asshat?
> 
> ...


Ahh just to clarify... no I didn't call you anything but dradlin... if you check you'll see that asshat is within the quotation marks in my comments and therefore was part of the op's initial statement, not my words and not in reference to you.:confusion:


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

Geez, what a bunch of grumpy old men.:sSic_vomitbuddy:


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## Intrepid (Oct 9, 2008)

I just read this whole thread this morning and by the time I got to the end I forgot what all the fuss was about. Dang nabbit.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

keto said:


> Wish I were a mod.



thanks for the laugh, that was a good one


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

cheezyridr said:


> thanks for the laugh, that was a good one


Especially when we know he's a rocker, not a mod.


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

smorgdonkey said:


> Especially when we know he's a rocker, not a mod.





keto said:


> Wish I were a mod. There'd be some major editing and a warning or 2.


http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodgies_and_Widgies
When my dad was younger, he was a Bodgie.
Me? Gear addict & delay junkie. (Attending A.G.A.S.A weekly meetings)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk -& All Round Nice Guy.


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

What the hell is an "Asshat"?!


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

..........


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

sulphur said:


> View attachment 10397
> ..........


Ahh! Perfect thanks Jock.

There's plenty of "Asshats" over 40 so I don't think it's related to someone's age.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

A.K.A - burrowcap, donkeytoque, or mulelid.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

sulphur said:


> A.K.A - borrowcap, donkeytoque, or mulelid.


A.K.A. - Keg Cover, Jug Topper, Rock Chapeau.

- - - Updated - - -


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

hardasmum said:


> What the hell is an "Asshat"?!


I've never heard of it either but I think it has something to due with *UPS*. It seems it can also be used if you don't like what someone writes in their post.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Guitar101 said:


> I've never heard of it either but I think it has something to due with *UPS*. It seems it can also be used if you don't like what someone writes in their post.


2.
asshat
A person, of either gender, whose behavior displays such ignorance/obnoxiousness that you would like to make them wear their own ass as a hat.
Usage: "Can you believe that my boss is making me stay until 9 pm on a Friday!?" "What an asshat."


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

djmarcelca said:


> Ok so the focus is on the screwdriver.
> So let me recap,
> the screwdriver was forgotten in the car, noticed and the customer was called, spoken to, and asked to return the item. He just didn't.
> 
> ...


Not much of a debate....about this. If you're lucky the customer will return the tool to you and not your boss. I suppose he has the tool which means that it was probably left inside the vehicle and not the engine compartment. Hopefully there's no damage caused by the screw driver after the "after" picture was taken. 
As far as your dumb girl comments, "Are you really dumb, or just acting like it?" Most of the ladies I know would 1) give you a good swift kick, 2) go talk to your boss and 3) find another place to work on their vehicles....


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## CocoTone (Jan 22, 2006)

dradlin said:


> Calling the customer an "asshat" and a thief? The customer has no obligation to loose time or expense in returning the tool. The customer would be a nice guy if he accommodated the OP in driving to pickup the tool at the OP's own time and expense.
> 
> Read. Process.


This is exactly what's wrong with the world today. This attitude is pure bullshit. I am glad I am from a generation where co-operation, honesty, and integrity was taught.
Asshat indeed.

CT.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Electraglide said:


> Not much of a debate....about this. If you're lucky the customer will return the tool to you and not your boss. I suppose he has the tool which means that it was probably left inside the vehicle and not the engine compartment. Hopefully there's no damage caused by the screw driver after the "after" picture was taken


So, you are in that group of people who thinks the cab driver should keep the million dollars left in their cab too. Finders keepers, mistakes and errors are all punished instead of 'no harm-no foul' and by the way here's your tool back.



Electraglide said:


> As far as your dumb girl comments, "Are you really dumb, or just acting like it?" Most of the ladies I know would 1) give you a good swift kick, 2) go talk to your boss and 3) find another place to work on their vehicles....


So, did you actually read his comment? The one where he says that "I'm just a dumb girl" comes out of their own mouths?

If a girl says that, she is fortunate if the conversation even continues.


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

Robert1950 said:


> I thought this thread would be about things like, "I know I getting old because I'd rather sit down to take a whiz than standing."


I know I'm getting older because I feel the need to argue about everything.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I knew I was getting older the last time I taught a university class, and realized that not only were my students too young to have seen the Beatles on Ed Sullivan or gone to Woodstock, but that their parents were also likely too young to have done that.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

smorgdonkey said:


> So, you are in that group of people who thinks the cab driver should keep the million dollars left in their cab too. Finders keepers, mistakes and errors are all punished instead of 'no harm-no foul' and by the way here's your tool back.


You crack me up, in your fallacy ridden attempt to twist this into something it's not just to support your argument... first in shifting focus from a screwdriver to million dollars, and second your implying that "finders keepers" is the customers sentiment.

I once again direct you to post #26... come get the screwdriver that YOU left in my car.

Nobody anywhere in the thread has even remotely suggested that the customer should keep the screwdriver.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

CocoTone said:


> This is exactly what's wrong with the world today. This attitude is pure bullshit. I am glad I am from a generation where co-operation, honesty, and integrity was taught.
> Asshat indeed.
> 
> CT.


What's wrong with the world?... that people won't submit themselves to your whims, demands, and selfishly skewed perspective?

Honesty is the customer saying "yes, your screwdriver was in the car", and cooperation is the customer saying "yes, you can come and pick it up at this address", and integrity is not blaming the customer for ones own failure.

Nobody anywhere in the thread has even remotely suggested that the customer should keep the screwdriver.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

mhammer said:


> I knew I was getting older the last time I taught a university class, and realized that not only were my students too young to have seen the Beatles on Ed Sullivan or gone to Woodstock, but that their parents were also likely too young to have done that.


I got another reminder this weekend that Im getting older. Was at Niagara falls at the falls, and saw 2 gals about 20yrs old, taking cellphone pics of each other, but they weren't the usual tourist sightseeing pics....they were taking turns posing with their asses pointed out towards at the camera...basically the Kim Kardashian type pics we've all seen, but wondered "who the hell actually does that in public??". And they weren't even joking or giggling. They actually had fairly determined expressions on their faces. Im sure they had it posted on facebook for "likes" in short order. Im not that old, but I cant think of many gals that would've done that in my day. 
Kinda like this, except with a lovely view of Niagara Falls in the back ground:


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

If you forget your wallet at a store checkout, and later realizing that you call the store and they acknowledge it is being held at the customer service desk, do you instead demand that a store representative deliver it to you otherwise they are asshats and thieves?... no, you drive yourself back to the store to pick it up. Exact same scenario just with the role reversed.


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

CocoTone said:


> dradlin said:
> 
> 
> > Calling the customer an "asshat" and a thief? The customer has no obligation to loose time or expense in returning the tool. The customer would be a nice guy if he accommodated the OP in driving to pickup the tool at the OP's own time and expense.
> ...


I watched a documentary about civility recently and a major point of it was that while people are generally less polite than they were fifty years ago and many young people feel a sense of entitlement, overall the world (in the west anyway) is in a better place today.


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## Option1 (May 26, 2012)

I'm sorry, is this the five minute argument or the full half hour?

[video=youtube_share;kQFKtI6gn9Y]http://youtu.be/kQFKtI6gn9Y[/video]

Neil


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

hardasmum said:


> I watched a documentary about civility recently and a major point of it was that while people are generally less polite than they were fifty years ago and many young people feel a sense of entitlement, overall the world (in the west anyway) is in a better place today.


I believe it.
I think its due to a few factors:
1) parenting style instilling sense of entitlement
2)internet. Sense of anonymity seems to bring out the worst in people...some of that spills over into real world behavior/attitude.
3) changes in social "self-policing"...50yrs ago, if you mouthed off to the wrong guy, you could end up with a black eye and swollen lip. And most ppl would say you got what you had coming to you, and youd (usually) learn from it. Today, fighting isn't socially acceptable, so really not much deterrent to jerks from being jerks.

I suppose it depends on how you mean "a better place". it seems like a more selfish place, to me anyways.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

dradlin said:


> If you forget your wallet at a store checkout, and later realizing that you call the store and they acknowledge it is being held at the customer service desk, do you instead demand that a store representative deliver it to you otherwise they are asshats and thieves?... no, you drive yourself back to the store to pick it up. Exact same scenario just with the role reversed.


Not true. If the misplacer has asked to have the item returned then the person in possession can say right then that they are not willing to do so and the location where the misplacer can pick the item up. The person in possession has, in most cases, the privacy of their home and/or whereabouts being unknown. Therefor, if the person in possession has not told the misplacer where they can pick it up and has not returned the item, then it is on the person in possession.

I seriously feel like I am trying to answer the 4 year old who keeps saying "why?" no matter how many times you explain things.

- - - Updated - - -



dradlin said:


> I once again direct you to post #26... come get the screwdriver that YOU left in my car.


If the guy would have told him that, I am sure he would have his screwdriver.

Ever notice that he hasn't said that they guy told him to come and get it? That leads one to believe that he doesn't care if the guy gets his screwdriver back.

- - - Updated - - -

Now you respond that dj should go get it.

I will tell you that he doesn't know where the guy is.

You can say dj has to go get it.

...and we can keep on going...*unless he can get another screwdriver from LA Music and then we can go on for 10 more pages.*


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

smorgdonkey said:


> Not true. If the misplacer has asked to have the item returned then the person in possession can say right then that they are not willing to do so and the location where the misplacer can pick the item up. The person in possession has, in most cases, the privacy of their home and/or whereabouts being unknown. Therefor, if the person in possession has not told the misplacer where they can pick it up and has not returned the item, then it is on the person in possession.
> 
> I seriously feel like I am trying to answer the 4 year old who keeps saying "why?" no matter how many times you explain things.
> 
> ...



Now you are just making stuff up... LOL!


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

dradlin said:


> Now you are just making stuff up... LOL!


Show me which part is made up.

or are you just always REALLY high when you are on the forum?


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

smorgdonkey said:


> Show me which part is made up.
> 
> or are you just always REALLY high when you are on the forum?


I'm the one dragging this out? LOL

Seems you are as guilty as any dragging this out...

You don't know what the OP asked or demanded from the customer, the level of respect (or lack thereof) that the OP approached the customer with, the exact response and commitment made by the customer, the degree of inconvenience the customer must endure to extend this FAVOUR to the OP, whether the OP knows the customer's home address (as most service shops do) yet you assume he doesn't, and on and on... you are making things up including non-existent social protocols.

So you want to run this for ten more pages, just keep up with the misquotes and character attacks. But you sir are the one beating the dead horse as both of our positions have been stated over and over again.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Diablo said:


> Kinda like this, except with a lovely view of Niagara Falls in the back ground:


As opposed to a view of Mt. Edith Cavell in the _foreground._


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Jimmy_D said:


> dradlin... you really need to get a life other than the one where you troll this place.


I am guilty. I have been trolled. NOBODY could be as stupid as dradlin is acting. I am ashamed that I have been trolled so thoroughly. 

Shame on me.

dradlin, you are one of the best trolls I have ever seen. You got me hook line and sinker. Victory is yours.


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> hardasmum said:
> 
> 
> > I watched a documentary about civility recently and a major point of it was that while people are generally less polite than they were fifty years ago and many young people feel a sense of entitlement, overall the world (in the west anyway) is in a better place today.
> ...


Yeah I realize now I didn't finish my thought! The doc was suggesting that for gender, sexual orientation and racial equality things were better now and that was worth the sacrifice of civility.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

smorgdonkey said:


> I am guilty. I have been trolled. NOBODY could be as stupid as dradlin is acting. I am ashamed that I have been trolled so thoroughly.
> 
> Shame on me.
> 
> dradlin, you are one of the best trolls I have ever seen. You got me hook line and sinker. Victory is yours.


Argumentum ad hominem... can't attack the argument, so you attack the person.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

hardasmum said:


> Yeah I realize now I didn't finish my thought! The doc was suggesting that for gender, sexual orientation and racial equality things were better now and that was worth the sacrifice of civility.


+1 and many other reasons as well...not sure why we cant be enlightened in those ways and still be courteous to each other though.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Diablo said:


> +1 and many other reasons as well...not sure why we cant be enlightened in those ways and still be courteous to each other though.


It's interesting that courtesy is a topic of this thread, many claim to be models of courtesy, yet so little courtesy has been demonstrated to fellow forum goers.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

dradlin said:


> It's interesting that courtesy is a topic of this thread, many claim to be models of courtesy, yet so little courtesy has been demonstrated to fellow forum goers.


true. and we're ALL guilty of it.
for example, you could have just let the Op have his rant to blow off some steam without calling him out on what you disagree with. over, and over and over.

theres active (stuff we do) and passive (stuff we just let go by) courtesy.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Diablo said:


> ...theres active (stuff we do) and passive (stuff we just let go by) courtesy.


And you are exempt?

I will not respond passively to a misrepresentation of my position or defamation of my character.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

All I can say about this thread is Wow!


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

dradlin said:


> And you are exempt?
> 
> I will not respond passively to a misrepresentation of my position or defamation of my character.


Wow.
drama queen!

"oh noes another ad hominem besmirching my character! Tito, get me a tissue!".

lol


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> Wow.
> drama queen!
> 
> "oh noes another ad hominem besmirching my character! Tito, get me a tissue!".
> ...


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Diablo said:


> Wow.
> drama queen!
> 
> "oh noes another ad hominem besmirching my character! Tito, get me a tissue!".
> ...


Case in point...


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

excellent thread... keep it going lads we're heading into epic territory. 

(insert pot-stirring emoticon here)

(I should throw in the obligitory dead horse here but really... what's the point, that poor horse has been beat to shit and still won't go down)

But But... according to scientific america it may not be his fault so better go easy on him boys.


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

Jimmy_D said:


> But But... according to scientific america it may not be his fault so better go easy on him boys.


Still some licks to get in on the horse Jimmy?... Diablo, Smorgdonkey you guys done now?


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

Ok dradlin you're busted as a full on troll... a response within a minute of my post... that is so 7uckin excellent... troll on buddy, personally I love seeing you in action.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

dradlin said:


> Still some licks to get in on the horse Jimmy?... Diablo, Smorgdonkey you guys done now?


Sure buddy, go ahead...have the last word if that's what you need to feel ok about yourself.
Obviously this thread means more to you than anyone else here.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

dradlin said:


> Still some licks to get in on the horse Jimmy?... Diablo, Smorgdonkey you guys done now?


Wow Super troll,









You accuse everyone else of doing exactly what you do with this high and mighty 'tone' that you are above it. 

Unreal.

...but as an added bonus, your 'mental equal' Steadfastly came in to comment too. BONUS!

Only 9 pages to go, carrot spanker.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

Jimmy_D said:


> excellent thread... keep it going lads we're heading into epic territory.
> 
> (insert pot-stirring emoticon here)



ok, see, i can't let this one slide. i complain all the time because the smileys here suck, and there are tons we don't have, but should. 

_BUT WE ACTUALLY HAVE THAT ONE!!! _

:stirpot::stirpot::stirpot:

instead of typing out (insert pot-stirring emoticon here) you coulda just actually inserted the smiley with only 2 mouse clicks. i'm lobbying for a better set, don't waste the ones we got! now, in this space.... i would put a laughing or possibly even a rofling smiley, but we don't actually have either one, although most other forums do. we have a lol smiley, but if you look at it, it just feels insincere, a little confused. as if putting it at the end of my statement implies it's s joke and yet not a joke. we may someday communicate using images as well as speech or text. smileys could be the precursor of that. smileys are scarce here, and there's been no official word as to if we'll ever have a better set. let's not misuse or waste the ones we have. they may be all we get.


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## Guest (Sep 29, 2014)

cheezyridr said:


> .. i'm lobbying for a better set, don't waste the ones we got! ... smileys are scarce here ..


google's yer friend.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

A rimshot emoticon? Oh man, I cannot _begin _to count the number of times I wanted one of those.


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## Guest (Sep 29, 2014)




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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

laristotle said:


>


Nominated for best post in 2014!

I swear all of the drummers are in time with each other!!!. 
Maybe it was the wine I had for supper...LOL

Cheers

Dave


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## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

mhammer said:


> A rimshot emoticon? Oh man, I cannot _begin _to count the number of times I wanted one of those.


I pray we don't get one. I would be on the receiving end of it way too much for my sensitive ego. 

I _do_ suggest we create a Dradlin emoticon, however. I picture it being a douche that spills onto a bunch of common cents.

rimshot?


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## dradlin (Feb 27, 2010)

adcandour said:


> I pray we don't get one. I would be on the receiving end of it way too much for my sensitive ego.
> 
> I _do_ suggest we create a Dradlin emoticon, however. I picture it being a douche that spills onto a bunch of common cents.
> 
> rimshot?


A is for "asshat"... and that's good enough for me! 

Rimshot!


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

greco said:


> Nominated for best post in 2014!
> 
> I swear all of the drummers are in time with each other!!!.
> Maybe it was the wine I had for supper...LOL
> ...


More cowbell please!


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## Guest (Sep 30, 2014)




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## gtrguy (Jul 6, 2006)

Wow... this no longer has anything to do with the OP and is nothing more than a bunch of guys/girls with personal issues with each other goading each other on.

I can't believe I actually took the time to read this. Enjoy your circle jerk fellas.


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

Snap On makes a great screwdriver.


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## djmarcelca (Aug 2, 2012)

allthumbs56 said:


> Snap On makes a great screwdriver.


Perfect amout of vodka:juice ratio


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

allthumbs56 said:


> Snap On makes a great screwdriver.


I agree.
There is no other screwdriver worth even holding in your hand. My favorite is the Snap On ratcheting screwdriver.........so good :acigar:


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

Jezzz some guys are getting upset... circle jerk... wtf is that? 

Perhaps actually having a snap-on tool is the issue here...


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## neldom (Apr 29, 2009)

Lincoln said:


> I agree.
> There is no other screwdriver worth even holding in your hand. My favorite is the Snap On ratcheting screwdriver.........so good :acigar:


While I agree that the Snap On ratcheting driver is nice, I also have a Mac clutch operated screwdriver that I grab every time before the Snap On.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

neldom said:


> While I agree that the Snap On ratcheting driver is nice, I also have a Mac clutch operated screwdriver that I grab every time before the Snap On.


The Mac guy quit coming out to Fort Sask in the early 80's. I'm obviously missing out........I need to track down a Mac truck asap.:sFun_dancing:


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

pshew! i thought gear snobs were bad! now we gotta keep up with tool snobs? holy smokes, what is the world comin to? now what about "vintage" tools, and relic'd ones? are they more valuable? i have some seriously relic'd screwdrivers, some of them vintage stuff you don't see every day. old stanleys that were clear amber and orange back in the 80's, now they have a nice honey patina. the shaft is still straight, and the tips is slightly rounded off in the corners. lots of surface scratches on the shaft, but the handle is fairly good. i have a chinese one with a wooden handle that i stained with walnut stain after i sanded off the fake logo. it looks good, but it's just for show. those darn chinese sweatshops and their counterfeit tools! i also have some handmade, custom tools. marking guages, jigs, dies, and little do-dads for specialized situations. when i first got landed, and i went to work, it was interesting everytime i got a new assignment. guys crowded around my box, hey what's this for? where didja get this? how much was it? does it really work? oh man, i haven't sen one of those in 20 yrs! etc. i like tools as much as guitars. which, to me, are tools in a way


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

cheezyridr said:


> pshew! i thought gear snobs were bad! now we gotta keep up with tool snobs? holy smokes, what is the world comin to? now what about "vintage" tools, and relic'd ones? are they more valuable? i have some seriously relic'd screwdrivers, some of them vintage stuff you don't see every day. old stanleys that were clear amber and orange back in the 80's, now they have a nice honey patina. the shaft is still straight, and the tips is slightly rounded off in the corners. lots of surface scratches on the shaft, but the handle is fairly good. i have a chinese one with a wooden handle that i stained with walnut stain after i sanded off the fake logo. it looks good, but it's just for show. those darn chinese sweatshops and their counterfeit tools! i also have some handmade, custom tools. marking guages, jigs, dies, and little do-dads for specialized situations. when i first got landed, and i went to work, it was interesting everytime i got a new assignment. guys crowded around my box, hey what's this for? where didja get this? how much was it? does it really work? oh man, i haven't sen one of those in 20 yrs! etc. i like tools as much as guitars. which, to me, are tools in a way


They do make counterfeit Snap On screw drivers! They look real nice but the first good twist you give them the tip shatters like glass. And don't even think about using them as a pry bar like you do with a real Snap On. They just break off and make you sad.


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## Jimmy_D (Jul 4, 2009)

Relic tools huh... worth cash hmm... well in the late '70s I picked up an apple basket full of tools for $2 from a roadside garage sale in Rockwood ontario, one of the items was an old Victor hand plane which I thought looked cool and it spent more than 20 years on a shelf in my shop and then went into storage for years, in 2006 I came across it while moving and decided to google it... long story short, 3 weeks later I cleaned it up and sold it on ebay for over $3000.

So yes cheezy there are tool snobs and they do pay large...


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Needs some work and some TLC, obviously, but a lovely device.

Once in a while, Lee Valley Tools will have some antique woodworking tools on the covers of their seasonal mini-catalogs.


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

I found a Snap-on screwdriver under the hood of my car a few days after I had it in the shop. I thought, "I better take this back to Tony (the mechanic)" but then I noticed it had the name Danny engraved in the handle. I still have it 30 years later.


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Danny always said Tony was an asshat.


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

Anybody lose a 12 inch straight blade snap on screwdriver. Somebody left it on my front porch with a note that said "sorry I missed you but here's the screwdriver that you left in my car".


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Jimmy_D said:


> Relic tools huh... worth cash hmm... well in the late '70s I picked up an apple basket full of tools for $2 from a roadside garage sale in Rockwood ontario, one of the items was an old Victor hand plane which I thought looked cool and it spent more than 20 years on a shelf in my shop and then went into storage for years, in 2006 I came across it while moving and decided to google it... long story short, 3 weeks later I cleaned it up and sold it on ebay for over $3000.
> 
> So yes cheezy there are tool snobs and they do pay large...
> 
> ...


I've got to check my old tool box. I may have one of those in there.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

that's a fine looking tool! good for you on the sell! 

can we talk about tape measures for a sec though? has anyone noticed it's dam impossible to buy a good one anymore? used to be, i could buy a 25'x1" stanley or even craftsman tape and it had a metal chassis. the tape itself had conversion charts on the backside. you could run it out a good 15'+ and hook something, like a beam if you wanted. you could lay it on the bench and mark out long sections by yourself, or use it like a marking guage, because it stayed locked. not no more! now they're dam expensive, you can't run 'em out no more than about 12' before they roll over and collapse. the locks don't hold for shit, and there's no conversion tables or nail charts on the back like there used to be. and the plastic chassis sucks too


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