# Rice Crispies shortage



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I thought it was just me, but apparently it has been, and remains, a real thing. I started noticing there was a big empty spot on the store shelves where the Rice Crispies should have been. Checked about a half-dozen stores in multiple chains. Same thing. Now I learn there's a reason.



https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/rice-krispies-shortage-1.6279856#vf-7570400021210


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I noticed there were no Kelloggs Corn Flakes for a while.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

On strike.


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

We stock up on Shreddies, several boxes at a time. Life without Shreddies might be like life without Shreddies. Unimaginable.

Mrs. Mooh has a couple of good granola recipes...it makes the Shreddies go further.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

A neighbour was telling me about this. Apparentl, though the grocery store in her in laws town Owen sound has them, again.

Rice Krispies are ok, but cinnamon toast crunch is the real deal.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

My wife used holiday Captn Crunch to make a bunch of squares because of this. We were shopping and I thought it must be a mistake, where will everyone get there zero nutrition diabetes crunch for the holiday season now?

Luckily enough she found some holiday colored boxes of Rice Krispies a few days later as she bakes non stop till the new year from 1st week of December and we now hoard that shit like covid toilet paper.

Check classified soon for my $30 boxes of diabetes feed.


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

My boss is hoarding Corn Flakes in his office.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Mooh said:


> We stock up on Shreddies, several boxes at a time. Life without Shreddies might be like life without Shreddies. Unimaginable.
> 
> Mrs. Mooh has a couple of good granola recipes...it makes the Shreddies go further.


I wonder if Yngwie Malmsteen eats Shreddies before shredding?



butterknucket said:


> My boss is hoarding Corn Flakes in his office.


My boss is just plain flakey.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Ahh cornflake hoarding is a serious illness.

Bowls of soggy cornflakes everywhere


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## FatStrat2 (Apr 7, 2021)

You guys joke (and yup, its funny), but wait until the next year or two when things get really bad. They'll be bad for a few years too, lots of shortages and other stupid stuff is going to happen. Looks like it was a good year to start OMAD.

Trade papers have already been stating that manufacturers will be consolidating their products (not just food) shedding the not-so-popular and keeping the popular products only. So you'll see less of tomato or cheese flour tortillas and more plain and whole wheat. This is across the board (more black, white & red guitars and less Charcoal Silver Metallic). That's life post-COVID for a while.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

FatStrat2 said:


> You guys joke (and yup, its funny), but wait until the next year or two when things get really bad. They'll be bad for a few years too, lots of shortages and other stupid stuff is going to happen. Looks like it was a good year to start OMAD.
> 
> Trade papers have already been stating that manufacturers will be consolidating their products (not just food) shedding the not-so-popular and keeping the popular products only. So you'll see less of tomato or cheese flour tortillas and more plain and whole wheat. This is across the board (more black, white & red guitars and less Charcoal Silver Metallic). That's life post-COVID for a while.


No FatStrat2, just plain old vanilla FatStrat. Then no more FatStrat, just plain old Fat.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Oh no my consumerism will be curbed and I’ll be forced to just be happy with what I have. Whatever will I do now? I better start fear mongering now and get all anxious and Shit


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Frankly, our (Mrs. Mooh and me) survival instincts have started to kick in big time. It's fundamentally why we enlarged the garden, planted new fruit trees, started pre-preparing food like we did early in our marriage when we were poor. We have simply given up many things, too. It's not really a hardship either, more like a challenge, a game even, to find workarounds for daily obstacles.

Shreddies though, not sure if I could give them up.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Mooh said:


> Frankly, our (Mrs. Mooh and me) survival instincts have started to kick in big time. It's fundamentally why we enlarged the garden, planted new fruit trees, started pre-preparing food like we did early in our marriage when we were poor. We have simply given up many things, too. It's not really a hardship either, more like a challenge, a game even, to find workarounds for daily obstacles.
> 
> Shreddies though, not sure if I could give them up.


same here, at the beginning of the pandemic I switched to farm beef and pork and chicken, direct from a local farmer to the butcher to my freezer.
Now that I’m a regular he has guaranteed me my regular purchases every few months and I found some local eggs as well. I’m saving a tonne of money and getting better meat than any grocery store feedlot garbage.

Other than that I don’t give a fuck. I’m resigned to the fact that I’ll get fucked over on utilities and gasoline no matter what so I did all I can with new windows, new boiler, high efficiency furnace and on demand water tank to try and lube It up a bit


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

About a week ago, the Wife asked me to grab a small box of corn flakes for a batch of cookies she wanted to build. I was amazed to find no corn flakes on the shelves of every store I was in. Came home with a bag of no-name corn flakes. This weekend in the stores, there was nothing for flakes. Not eve no-name. Lots of Frosted flakes, no corn flakes. 

WTF?


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Lincoln said:


> About a week ago, the Wife asked me to grab a small box of corn flakes for a batch of cookies she wanted to build. I was amazed to find no corn flakes on the shelves of every store I was in. Came home with a bag of no-name corn flakes. This weekend in the stores, there was nothing for flakes. Not eve no-name. Lots of Frosted flakes, no corn flakes.
> 
> WTF?


Rinse the frosting off, carefully place each flake individually on a baking sheet and heat in oven until dry.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

player99 said:


> Rinse the frosting off, carefully place each flake individually on a baking sheet and heat in oven until dry.


You can’t even breath on a cornflake or frosted flake without it going instantly soggy.


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## FatStrat2 (Apr 7, 2021)

^ Yeah, ever notice that they never run out of sugary crap? Candy isles are full.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Rice Krispies and Corn flakes are sugary crap with zero nutritional value though.

Once it hits your blood stream its the same as a bag of m and m’s.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I don't think I've eaten rice crispies since grade school; so not gonna miss them.

This was a really good year for my business and that had nothing to do with covid. 

Friend of mine imports shit; last I talked to him his shipping costs were 5 times what they were pre covid. So not good.

What they need to do here is at least triple the carbon taxes on everything by next year, and make gas so expensive that no one can afford it except the ruling classes in ottawa. Forget electric cars that's just a scam; ordinary people can never afford them and with the reset they won't need to be going anywhere anyway. Once we get back to living like it was in the 1600s then it'll all be cool and the virus will go away.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)




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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Wardo said:


> This was a really good year for my business.


Without all the crowds it must be easier to catch ambulances?


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Man, I hadn't realized that mentioning I wasn't able to find a common simple cereal, would unleash such a tidal wave of optimism and sunny Pollyanna sentiment here.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Wardo having a good year.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Ahh makes sense. Wardo=


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

mhammer said:


> Man, I hadn't realized that mentioning I wasn't able to find a common simple cereal, would unleash such a tidal wave of optimism and sunny Pollyanna sentiment here.


I believe you are smart enough to know exactly what type of responses your post would get.

we demand a regular supply of delicious breakfast cereals.Kelloggs shortages is the first sign of apocalypse, it’s in the bible right before Mary gives god a hummer.

Though shall not run short of post coital soggy grains and flakes


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I've started making my own out of old phone books.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Lincoln said:


> ....grab a small box of corn flakes for a batch of cookies she wanted to *build.*


Your wife "builds" cookies!?
You really need to "bake" some more tube amps...LOL! (j/k)


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

tdotrob said:


> Ahh makes sense. Wardo=


I'm nowhere near as congenial looking as the character in your picture .. lol


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

tdotrob said:


> Oh no my consumerism will be curbed and I’ll be forced to just be happy with what I have. Whatever will I do now? I better start fear mongering now and get all anxious and Shit


There's a difference between someone making the active decision that they don't need all this extra crap in their lives (good) and people being forced to live a substandard lifestyle because the system isn't working as it should (bad).

What we're currently seeing is largely the second version and not the first. There's also a difference between "I don't need 15 guitars." and "I can't buy diapers because they haven't gotten a shipment in 3 weeks."


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## tonewoody (Mar 29, 2017)

Rice Crispies have about the same nutritional value as toilet paper. They probably taste the same with sugar added.

Bowl to bowl, a pointless effort but one can't deny the snap, crackle, pop novelty..🙄

Tip: Buy some steel cut oats...


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Wardo said:


> I'm nowhere near as congenial looking as the character in your picture .. lol


Detroit legend Sam Bernstein.

Thing about lawyers is no matter how they look they all leave same trail of slime when they leave a room.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Okay Player said:


> There's a difference between someone making the active decision that they don't need all this extra crap in their lives (good) and people being forced to live a substandard lifestyle because the system isn't working as it should (bad).
> 
> What we're currently seeing is largely the second version and not the first. There's also a difference between "I don't need 15 guitars." and "I can't buy diapers because they haven't gotten a shipment in 3 weeks."


Maybe, but maybe not.

Maybe living life without Rice Crispies and buying anew car every couple years isn’t really a substandard way to live at all.


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## Powdered Toast Man (Apr 6, 2006)

The Kelloggs shortages have absolutely nothing to do with covid or the supply chain. Their workers in the USA have been on strike for weeks and it's bad. When the workers rejected the company's last contract offer (A WHOLE 3 CENT RAISE), Kelloggs decided to try and hire hundreds of permanent replacement workers (basically permanent scabs). However online labour activists flooded the Kelloggs recruitment website with phony applications (with one person actually writing code that would automatically spam their site with fake applications). Things have not been going well for Kelloggs in their efforts to use replacement labourers either. There's been reports of factory malfunctions and accidents due to poor training. There was even a train car that got derailed on one of their sites and they had to call in workers from Oklahoma to come help because no one in Michigan would cross a picket line.

And the worst part is, guess what these striking workers were making? Less than $8 an hour!

Kelloggs can eat a bag of dicks.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Powdered Toast Man said:


> The Kelloggs shortages have absolutely nothing to do with covid or the supply chain. Their workers in the USA have been on strike for weeks and it's bad. When the workers rejected the company's last contract offer (A WHOLE 3 CENT RAISE), Kelloggs decided to try and hire hundreds of permanent replacement workers (basically permanent scabs). However online labour activists flooded the Kelloggs recruitment website with phony applications (with one person actually writing code that would automatically spam their site with fake applications). Things have not been going well for Kelloggs in their efforts to use replacement labourers either. There's been reports of factory malfunctions and accidents due to poor training. There was even a train car that got derailed on one of their sites and they had to call in workers from Oklahoma to come help because no one in Michigan would cross a picket line.
> 
> And the worst part is, guess what these striking workers were making? Less than $8 an hour!
> 
> Kelloggs can eat a back of dicks.


This post is too well informed for GC Canada.

we want sensationalism and fear mongering damnit!!!


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

Zzzzz Zzzzz Zzzzz ..........


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## tomee2 (Feb 27, 2017)

Powdered Toast Man said:


> The Kelloggs shortages have absolutely nothing to do with covid or the supply chain. Their workers in the USA have been on strike for weeks and it's bad. When the workers rejected the company's last contract offer (A WHOLE 3 CENT RAISE), Kelloggs decided to try and hire hundreds of permanent replacement workers (basically permanent scabs). However online labour activists flooded the Kelloggs recruitment website with phony applications (with one person actually writing code that would automatically spam their site with fake applications). Things have not been going well for Kelloggs in their efforts to use replacement labourers either. There's been reports of factory malfunctions and accidents due to poor training. There was even a train car that got derailed on one of their sites and they had to call in workers from Oklahoma to come help because no one in Michigan would cross a picket line.
> 
> And the worst part is, guess what these striking workers were making? Less than $8 an hour!
> 
> Kelloggs can eat a back of dicks.


Is Kellogg's in Canada different? Some of their cereal brands are made here I think? 
Hope we pay better though.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

tdotrob said:


> Detroit legend Sam Bernstein.


If it gives you something to focus your hatred on then it's all good.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Wardo said:


> If it gives you something to focus your hatred on then it's all good.


No hate all in good fun. I’m a big fan of Sam and lawyers actually.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

greco said:


> Your wife "builds" cookies!?
> You really need to "bake" some more tube amps...LOL! (j/k)


well, if you want to split some hares......I believe corn flake cookies are no-bake cookies. Therefore, she's not really baking them. She's building them. 😋


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Powdered Toast Man said:


> Kelloggs can eat a bag of dicks.


Big Bag Of Dicks Crunch Cereal.

Now with new Fruity Balls.


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## vuonganvu (Dec 9, 2021)

I just ran to buy a few rice crispies boxes and cinnamon toast crunch also. Think that I have to find alternative choice


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

player99 said:


> Now with new Fruity Balls


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Well, I'll just switch over to Prostitooties.

They don't snap, crackle or pop.

They just lay there and bang.

(Sorry, I only have so many jokes and I re-use them liberally).


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

tdotrob said:


> Maybe, but maybe not.
> 
> Maybe living life without Rice Crispies and buying anew car every couple years isn’t really a substandard way to live at all.


The diaper example wasn't hypothetical.

The car is also arguable depending on where you live or what your circumstances are. There are people who have leases from 5 years ago ending, or vehicles no longer fit for the road and can't replace their vehicles. That of course is ignoring that shortages are also impacting the repair side of the industry.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Shreddies: 16% sugar, by weight
Generic "Crispy Rice": 6.7% sugar by weight
My wife's PC Blue Label nuts&grains granola is 22.5% sugar, by weight.
A glass of orange juice has the equivalent of about 4 tablespoons of sugar. I'm not allowed to drink it.
Oatmeal has a lot of complex carbohydrates that eventually get turned into sugar, but because that happens slowly, it has a low glycemic index. It also contains more fibre than processed cereal, which is good.

The film "The Road to Wellville" fictionalizes the early days of Dr. Kellogg's, um, initiative to improve the health of Americans. This scene, where early attempts at producing corn flakes are shown, likely expresses the sentiments of some here.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

mhammer said:


> Shreddies: 16% sugar, by weight
> Generic "Crispy Rice": 6.7% sugar by weight
> My wife's PC Blue Label nuts&grains granola is 22.5% sugar, by weight.
> A glass of orange juice has the equivalent of about 4 tablespoons of sugar. I'm not allowed to drink it.
> ...


The first time I actually checked out the ingredients in Shreddies I was shocked. I always had the misconception that Shreddies was a fairly pure product. Then I saw how high in the list of ingredients sugar was.

*WHOLE GRAIN WHEAT, SUGAR, SALT, BARLEY MALT EXTRACT*.

They must soak it in liquid sugar.

Thanks.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Grains do not adhere together easily. The sugar is necessary to get the grain to clump together into something that doesn't simply blow away from your spoon when you breathe on it. Of course, once that task is accomplished, all the sugar on top of that is gluttony and intended to tempt children. I'm generally appalled at the number of sugar-intense cereals I see in the aisle.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

mhammer said:


> intended to tempt children


When I was a kid shopping with mum, the dash down the cereal isle was for the coolest 'prize' in a box.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

mhammer said:


> Grains do not adhere together easily. The sugar is necessary to get the grain to clump together into something that doesn't simply blow away from your spoon when you breathe on it. Of course, once that task is accomplished, all the sugar on top of that is gluttony and intended to tempt children. I'm generally appalled at the number of sugar-intense cereals I see in the aisle.



I guess we always thought of Shreddies, Shredded Wheat, Cheerios and other cereals that are NOT visibly coated with sugar (ie frosted) as being pretty healthy.

The truth is they're ALL drenched in sugar.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

FatStrat2 said:


> You guys joke (and yup, its funny), but wait until the next year or two when things get really bad. They'll be bad for a few years too, lots of shortages and other stupid stuff is going to happen. Looks like it was a good year to start OMAD.



Since adopting the keto lifestyle I gave up any of those nutritionally bad cereals. Even the ones you think are healthy are full of empty carbs and hidden sugars. I do 2 meals a couple of times a week, skipping breakfast and 1 to 2 days of OMAD. As well as a 2 day fast every 6 to 8 weeks. The few times I eat breakfast its free range eggs from grain fed chickens. I've gone to buying all my eggs and meet from a local organic farm and buying my vegetables locally as much as possible. Supply chains don't seem to be hurting these sources too badly.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

I am always amazed that people (not citing anyone here) seem to think they should be able get their regular stuff even though there's a pandemic, and things aren't exactly normal. 

And I don't eat Rice Krispies. I want my breakfast to last until lunch, not until I start work at 8.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

My impetus for starting the thread was not any sort of insistence that "I get what I want" (and I am confident you weren't directing anything at me). Rather, when one sees the aisle dripping with products you think of as requiring a far more involved production process, and the one you perceive as simple to produce, not requiring anything exotic, and as "always having been there" as dozens of other trendy products come and go, it sticks out when it's not on the shelf.

For my part, a modest bowl of cereal later in the evening is my treat, and is nice and light. And, as much as I like the taste of regular Shreddies, the malt and whatever does a number on my stomach. Bad enough I'm having milk that late in the day. Can't remember the last time I had a bowl of cereal at breakfast. Oatmeal, yes, on a cold day, sweetened with sweetener, but cold cereal, no. For breakfast I'm generally a two-slices-of-toast-and-coffee man. I might split the Sunday-morning omelet with my wife occasionally but that's it.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Milkman said:


> I guess we always thought of Shreddies, Shredded Wheat, Cheerios and other cereals that are NOT visibly coated with sugar (ie frosted) as being pretty healthy.
> 
> The truth is they're ALL drenched in sugar.


As a diabetic, I tend to look at ingredient listings. One is generally kind of surprised to find out how much of the things you'd rather not consume much of is found in products you always thought of as "healthier". I as sorely disappointed to find out that the majority of fruit juices would be permanently stricken from my list of possible beverages.

If you really want to be shocked, look at sodium content. I was shopping for soy sauce the other day, and most have more sodium in a single 15ml tablespoon than you'll find in an entire tin of soup.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

Still lots of oatmeal and other unprocessed grain cereals on the shelves...that will be next when all the processed cereals run out. Winters here and we've started on the Cream of Wheat and Red River cereal...grew up with that and as my father used to say: "it sticks to your ribs".


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

I'll stick with coffee and cigarettes for breaky.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

Paul Running said:


> Still lots of oatmeal and other unprocessed grain cereals on the shelves...that will be next when all the processed cereals run out. Winters here and we've started on the Cream of Wheat and Red River cereal...grew up with that and as my father used to say: "it sticks to your ribs".



I used to think that healthy grain oat meals were good for you. They're very high in carbs which converts to sugar. The problem with most of us is we eat too much processed sugars and carbohydrates. You don't have to be keto but I think most of us could do well consuming less carbs. The biggest lesson I learned was too much carbs caused me to have more cravings eating more frequently and portions that were too big. Now that I've got my carbs lower and I'm burning fat I no longer have those cravings and my portion sizes are much easier to control.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

We eat the whole oatmeal, it has a low glycemic load and plenty of fiber typically, anything processed is high on the GI load scale; it seems that most things are best with moderation...not always easy.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

laristotle said:


> I'll stick with coffee and cigarettes for breaky.


That was my dads breakfast for years apparently. I don't actually remember it cause he quit smoking when my Nan (his Mum) died in 79.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

mhammer said:


> My impetus for starting the thread was not any sort of insistence that "I get what I want" (and I am confident you weren't directing anything at me). Rather, when one sees the aisle dripping with products you think of as requiring a far more involved production process, and the one you perceive as simple to produce, not requiring anything exotic, and as "always having been there" as dozens of other trendy products come and go, it sticks out when it's not on the shelf.
> 
> For my part, a modest bowl of cereal later in the evening is my treat, and is nice and light. And, as much as I like the taste of regular Shreddies, the malt and whatever does a number on my stomach. Bad enough I'm having milk that late in the day. Can't remember the last time I had a bowl of cereal at breakfast. Oatmeal, yes, on a cold day, sweetened with sweetener, but cold cereal, no. For breakfast I'm generally a two-slices-of-toast-and-coffee man. I might split the Sunday-morning omelet with my wife occasionally but that's it.


I have cereal and milk with some yogurt most days. I need the protein or I am a total grump. If I am becoming an angry old man, I make sure to have some protein and that calms the beast quickly. 

And it seems that milk protein does the job best and fastest -- nuts/peanut butter does next to nothing.

I aim to cut back on sugar significantly after the holidays, to try to cut back on my waistline.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

laristotle said:


> I'll stick with coffee and cigarettes for breaky.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)




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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I like Michael Pollan's 7 rules as a guide:

Don't eat anything your great grandmother wouldn't recognize as food. "When you pick up that box of portable yogurt tubes, or eat something with 15 ingredients you can't pronounce, ask yourself, "What are those things doing there?" Pollan says.
Don’t eat anything with more than five ingredients, or ingredients you can't pronounce.
Stay out of the middle of the supermarket; shop on the perimeter of the store. Real food tends to be on the outer edge of the store near the loading docks, where it can be replaced with fresh foods when it goes bad.
Don't eat anything that won't eventually rot. "There are exceptions -- honey -- but as a rule, things like Twinkies that never go bad aren't food," Pollan says.
It is not just what you eat but how you eat. "Always leave the table a little hungry," Pollan says. "Many cultures have rules that you stop eating before you are full. In Japan, they say eat until you are four-fifths full. Islamic culture has a similar rule, and in German culture they say, 'Tie off the sack before it's full.'"
Families traditionally ate together, around a table and not a TV, at regular meal times. It's a good tradition. Enjoy meals with the people you love. "Remember when eating between meals felt wrong?" Pollan asks.
Don't buy food where you buy your gasoline. In the U.S., 20% of food is eaten in the car.
At a less industry-focussed, and more general level, he suggests: "Eat as much real food as you can, and try not to eat too much of it, and try to eat mostly plants." I think that's wise, although I imagine keto-philes wouldn't necessarily agree with parts of it.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)




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## Jim Soloway (Sep 27, 2013)

This is Kelloggs 


FatStrat2 said:


> You guys joke (and yup, its funny), but wait until the next year or two when things get really bad. They'll be bad for a few years too, lots of shortages and other stupid stuff is going to happen. Looks like it was a good year to start OMAD.
> 
> Trade papers have already been stating that manufacturers will be consolidating their products (not just food) shedding the not-so-popular and keeping the popular products only. So you'll see less of tomato or cheese flour tortillas and more plain and whole wheat. This is across the board (more black, white & red guitars and less Charcoal Silver Metallic). That's life post-COVID for a while.


This is Kelloggs trying to break the union. F### 'em. No more corn flakes for our house.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

mhammer said:


> I like Michael Pollan's 7 rules as a guide:
> 
> Don't eat anything your great grandmother wouldn't recognize as food. "When you pick up that box of portable yogurt tubes, or eat something with 15 ingredients you can't pronounce, ask yourself, "What are those things doing there?" Pollan says.
> Don’t eat anything with more than five ingredients, or ingredients you can't pronounce.
> ...


Part of this is North-American biased. A university friend and his wife moved to Europe, and they started losing weight like crazy without trying. Food has WAY fewer chemicals over there. Anything that is in the food has to be proven to not be harmful before it is put in, unlike in the US, where if it's proven harmful, they'll take it out...if they have to...they guess...

Thinking again about Keto for myself. I want to run a 5K when I am 55 (just turned 50). Lots of weight (triple digits) has to come off before that is possible.


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## Powdered Toast Man (Apr 6, 2006)

Rollin Hand said:


> Part of this is North-American biased. A university friend and his wife moved to Europe, and they started losing weight like crazy without trying. Food has WAY fewer chemicals over there. Anything that is in the food has to be proven to not be harmful before it is put in, unlike in the US, where if it's proven harmful, they'll take it out...if they have to...they guess...
> 
> Thinking again about Keto for myself. I want to run a 5K when I am 55 (just turned 50). Lots of weight (triple digits) has to come off before that is possible.


It's because European cities are designed around people and not cars. Europeans walk/cycle WAAAY more than anyone in North America. In North America we've been designing cities entirely around vehicles since the 1940's.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Powdered Toast Man said:


> It's because European cities are designed around people and not cars. Europeans walk/cycle WAAAY more than anyone in North America. In North America we've been designing cities entirely around vehicles since the 1940's.


True dat.
Even when cities make allowances for cycling, it is limited, an afterthought, and often not designed to allow for continuous travel.

TVOntario had been showing the series "Life-Sized City" - an excellent show that is both critical and hopeful. The episode focussing on Hamilton has some nice segments having to do with cycling and walkability. The Life-Sized City - Hamilton Actually, most of the episodes address what is referred to as "active transport" (walking and cycling - movement reliant on physical effort), but the Hamilton one is likely going to feel more relevant to more folks here.


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## Stephenlouis (Jun 24, 2019)

Rich countries like us will never run out of food just choices, and that will be short term and rotating depending on what the "news" feeds us. Ive never horded in my life, and never will but I generally have 3-6 months min of dry foods/cans. I donate them every winter and start over. Over the last year Ive been trying to eat me way through my deep freeze to start that one fresh too, Ive got 3 year old turkeys and hams in there!


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## Doctor Cheese (Oct 16, 2021)

This is an interesting thread.



Rollin Hand said:


> A university friend and his wife moved to Europe, and they started losing weight like crazy without trying. Food has WAY fewer chemicals over there. Anything that is in the food has to be proven to not be harmful before it is put in, unlike in the US, where if it's proven harmful, they'll take it out...if they have to...they guess...


In the US, proving something harmful can be tough it seems to me. See also: Smoking, HFCS, asbestos, etc. Just about takes overwhelming evidence attached to lawsuits making it ultimately _unprofitable_ for a company to carry on.

Almighty $$$!

Much of the push towards eating healthier started us on making more of our own meals. I think it's been years since we've eaten fast food. Since March 2020 we've eaten restaurant takeaway maybe 3 times - because I can't cook lamb chops the way my local Greek place can. Slowly I started taking some of the items we'd normally buy prepared in stores, and started making them from scratch. I found that simplifying our meals made it easier - salad dressings, condiments, etc.

Last week we made burgers - and I make all our ketchup, mustard, & mayo. I love making ketchup, especially with fresh tomatoes we grow. 

But we still buy fruit loops.
Cuz they go great in treats made with cannabutter.


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## Doctor Cheese (Oct 16, 2021)

Powdered Toast Man said:


> It's because European cities are designed around people and not cars. Europeans walk/cycle WAAAY more than anyone in North America.


In my trips to France and England, it seemed more people used public transport also. That may also be my bias as I don't really like driving in my hometown let alone another country, but I found it easy to get around France and England by rail more than I've done in most places I've lived in North America.


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## Doug Gifford (Jun 8, 2019)

Powdered Toast Man said:


> It's because European cities are designed around people and not cars. Europeans walk/cycle WAAAY more than anyone in North America. In North America we've been designing cities entirely around vehicles since the 1940's.


I was at a council meeting some years ago and one of the councillors complained that Gananoque was designed for people and not cars. Sorry, thats a feature, not a bug.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

mhammer said:


> As a diabetic, I tend to look at ingredient listings. One is generally kind of surprised to find out how much of the things you'd rather not consume much of is found in products you always thought of as "healthier". I as sorely disappointed to find out that the majority of fruit juices would be permanently stricken from my list of possible beverages.
> 
> If you really want to be shocked, look at sodium content. I was shopping for soy sauce the other day, and most have more sodium in a single 15ml tablespoon than you'll find in an entire tin of soup.


I’m a diabetic as well and control my type 2 with diet only, no insulin, metformin etc.

Is sodium actually bad for you? My understanding is that if your fairly active sodium is essential for the uptake of many nutrients and your body can handle a lot more and the recommended amounts are for sedentary people.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

Doctor Cheese said:


> But we still buy fruit loops.
> Cuz they go great in treats made with cannabutter.


Curing the munchies, while simultaneously getting the munchies. Efficient.


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## Doctor Cheese (Oct 16, 2021)

Rollin Hand said:


> Curing the munchies, while simultaneously getting the munchies. Efficient.


Sometimes we make a non-cannabutter batch for the munchies because I still remember that time we were baked and a friend had a batch of brownies in front of us...that we thought were just normal 'dessert' brownies.

We were baked for a whole month that day.

I'm about to rant about my fave medical supplier getting bought out by one of those conglomerates and now I can't get my fave products. Gah!


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

tdotrob said:


> I’m a diabetic as well and control my type 2 with diet only, no insulin, metformin etc.
> 
> Is sodium actually bad for you? My understanding is that if your fairly active sodium is essential for the uptake of many nutrients and your body can handle a lot more and the recommended amounts are for sedentary people.


Sodium, per se, isn't "bad". Your very nerve cells depend on it to function. But too much salt (where we will get most of our sodium) is an express route to hypertension. Ingredients lists will not show salt, but will list sodium, from all sources in the product. Of course, as we can taste, those "sources" are mostly good old NaCl. Frozen vegetables are better than canned ones, largely because canned vegetables often rely on salt to prevent the vegetables from soaking up too much water and being mushy. Freezing vegetables requires no salt to prevent mushiness.

I'm not on insulin, but do take a few sugar-reducers/dumpers and have long since said goodbye to a number of foods. That's why I consider a small bowl of Rice Crispies ("Crispy Rice" these days) with some sweetener a treat. No donuts for me, and only one, maybe two, flavours of ice cream (Chapman's makes 6 flavours of no sugar added, but just try finding anything besides chocolate and vanilla in this city). I still have a thing for the sugar-free rhubarb-custard candies that Marks & Spencers sells, but you can't buy them in North America. I have to rely on people visiting the UK to bring me back some.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

mhammer said:


> Sodium, per se, isn't "bad". Your very nerve cells depend on it to function. But too much salt (where we will get most of our sodium) is an express route to hypertension. Ingredients lists will not show salt, but will list sodium, from all sources in the product. Of course, as we can taste, those "sources" are mostly good old NaCl. Frozen vegetables are better than canned ones, largely because canned vegetables often rely on salt to prevent the vegetables from soaking up too much water and being mushy. Freezing vegetables requires no salt to prevent mushiness.
> 
> I'm not on insulin, but do take a few sugar-reducers/dumpers and have long since said goodbye to a number of foods. That's why I consider a small bowl of Rice Crispies ("Crispy Rice" these days) with some sweetener a treat. No donuts for me, and only one, maybe two, flavours of ice cream (Chapman's makes 6 flavours of no sugar added, but just try finding anything besides chocolate and vanilla in this city). I still have a thing for the sugar-free rhubarb-custard candies that Marks & Spencers sells, but you can't buy them in North America. I have to rely on people visiting the UK to bring me back some.


It’s been nice the amount of keto stores and products available now that weren’t around 10 years ago when I was zero carb.

I have to be very careful controlling it strictly with diet, I find even small amounts of certain sugar alchohols present in most “sugar free” candy and products will cause my sugars to rise and I can physically feel it in the nerves of my toes and fingers. 

It’s been a lot of experimenting but I’m fine tuning in what I can have and how much.

For me, it’s A lot better than being on a pile drugs or taking insulin.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

tdotrob said:


> I’m a diabetic as well and control my type 2 with diet only, no insulin, metformin etc.
> 
> Is sodium actually bad for you? My understanding is that if your fairly active sodium is essential for the uptake of many nutrients and your body can handle a lot more and the recommended amounts are for sedentary people.


At one time I avoided putting salt on anything and tried to keep my sodium intake low. My blood pressure was on the high side, borderline bad. Since going on at keto based diet I don't hold water. So I drink a lot of electrolytes and put pink sea salt on a lot of food out of necessity. If you have high blood pressure you might want to watch your sodium intake. Working out a lot and sweating you'd have to replace it.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

guitarman2 said:


> At one time I avoided putting salt on anything and tried to keep my sodium intake low. My blood pressure was on the high side, borderline bad. Since going on at keto based diet I don't hold water. So I drink a lot of electrolytes and put pink sea salt on a lot of food out of necessity. If you have high blood pressure you might want to watch your sodium intake. Working out a lot and sweating you'd have to replace it.


My sodium intake is sky high through the roof. But I’m active and drink a tonne of water. Blood pressure improved and cholesterols came back into balance.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

tdotrob said:


> It’s been nice the amount of keto stores and products available now that weren’t around 10 years ago when I was zero carb.
> 
> I have to be very careful controlling it strictly with diet, I find even small amounts of certain sugar alchohols present in most “sugar free” candy and products will cause my sugars to rise and I can physically feel it in the nerves of my toes and fingers.
> 
> ...


I'm 24 years without needing insulin shots. I watch what I eat, and dutifully take my meds. I prefer to keep their numbers and dosages as low as feasible, and could probably go without if I exercised. But exercise is not for me, so it's meds and dietary restrictions....but in moderation. I'm not vegetarian - I simply_ like_ vegetables and grains - but the older I get, the less appeal meat has for me. I like meat, so not an aversion or any moral opposition, just not as much appeal (I think my last steak was in 2006). So no keto for me. With our son in town for a visit the past 2 weeks, and his equally vegetarian friend up from Pittsburgh for a visit, my wife and I went pretty much without more than 150-200g of meat for the last 2 weeks, in total. It was fine. I made some absolutely killer pot stickers with oyster mushrooms, bean curd, fried tofu, fresh ginger and garlic, and a bit of TVP and Napa cabbage finely chopped up in the processor, with a wee bit of vegetable broth and sesame oil to help everything stick together as filling. All my previous attempts at pot stickers used ground beef and cabbage, like I was taught by a friend from Beijing. These ones were* much *better.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

tdotrob said:


> My sodium intake is sky high through the roof. But I’m active and drink a tonne of water. Blood pressure improved and cholesterols came back into balance.


Watch any carbonated beverage intake. People tend to associate sodium intake with salt, to the neglect of *soda*, and they wonder why their blood pressure is still high despite lowering salt intake.. There ARE low sodium fizzy beverages, fortunately, but many folks don't make the effort.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

mhammer said:


> I'm 24 years without needing insulin shots. I watch what I eat, and dutifully take my meds. I prefer to keep their numbers and dosages as low as feasible, and could probably go without if I exercised. But exercise is not for me, so it's meds and dietary restrictions....but in moderation. I'm not vegetarian - I simply_ like_ vegetables and grains - but the older I get, the less appeal meat has for me. I like meat, so not an aversion or any moral opposition, just not as much appeal (I think my last steak was in 2006). So no keto for me. With our son in town for a visit the past 2 weeks, and his equally vegetarian friend up from Pittsburgh for a visit, my wife and I went pretty much without more than 150-200g of meat for the last 2 weeks, in total. It was fine. I made some absolutely killer pot stickers with oyster mushrooms, bean curd, fried tofu, fresh ginger and garlic, and a bit of TVP and Napa cabbage finely chopped up in the processor, with a wee bit of vegetable broth and sesame oil to help everything stick together as filling. All my previous attempts at pot stickers used ground beef and cabbage, like I was taught by a friend from Beijing. These ones were* much *better.


Nice! That’s awesome! 

Different strokes for different strokes and I love hearing how others are managing.

I decided I didn’t want to take any drugs, and also wasn’t comfortable with the thought of being on the insulin teeter-toter cycle of eating foods that raise blood sugar than taking drugs to lower it and on and on. So I just took blood sugars out the equation and chose to live on fat energy and ketones.

This is the second time in my life I have done this, last time was early to mid 2000’s when I was fighting professionally. 

Both times now same results- retain muscle, lose extra fat, blood pressure and cholesterol regulate, massive increase in energy physically, better sleep and much better focus and clarity mentally and my dick is hard as a rock 24/7 which isn’t too bad post 40.

It’s not for everyone but easy choice for me over insulin and metformin and my skeptic doctor is super impressed and starting to wonder why the hell they aren’t learning this in school.

Funny thing is, prior to insulin this is how they “treated” diabetes and it worked then too.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

mhammer said:


> Watch any carbonated beverage intake. People tend to associate sodium intake with salt, to the neglect of *soda*, and they wonder why their blood pressure is still high despite lowering salt intake.. There ARE low sodium fizzy beverages, fortunately, but many folks don't make the effort.


I have one diet pop a week. I apologize if I didn’t speak clearly but my sodium intake went waaaay up at the same time my blood pressure and cholesterols have gone consistently down. I’m not scared of sodium at all because I’m not sedentary and my blood work and physicals show it’s not harming me.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

rice krispies? bleh! if you're going to eat cereal or make those marshmallow treats, you're supposed to use cocoa pebbles, because they're bad-ass


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

But not nearly as badass as Count Chocula.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)




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## colchar (May 22, 2010)

mhammer said:


> Watch any carbonated beverage intake. People tend to associate sodium intake with salt, to the neglect of *soda*, and they wonder why their blood pressure is still high despite lowering salt intake.. There ARE low sodium fizzy beverages, fortunately, but many folks don't make the effort.



Not all pop has an amount of sodium worth watching.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

That was the point of my last sentence.


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