# Push Button Switches for Pickups



## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

Fender had a guitar back in '83 that I'd love to own but never will... Fender Elite. Had push buttons for switches, 3 pickups and 1 hidden pickup for noise cancelling, surface mount trem (probably a Kahler) and just loved how it looked. Never seen one in person sadly.

Anyways... I've also never used active pickups and a Squier SE popped up nearby cheap and was debating another fun build in the style of that guitar.

Plan is to use push button switches to turn each pickup on/off. 

I see Fender has the buttons for sale for a Jeff Beck model, after shipping and import looking at about $50 per switch so, no thanks. It says "DPDT Push-Push Button Switch"

Would something like these work? I could 3D print some caps and make some sorta mounting for them inside. 

LINK

I was also looking at these... SPST though but for on/off would they work? Black to ground, red wire into this and then run a wire to the pot? 

LINK

I can solder but, this stuff I'm still shakey on... but if I recall, a light switch is SPST and all I need is on/off for each pickup. And I know I don't want momentary unless I start playing Buckethead riffs.

I'm also kinda debating using something like the Jazzmaster dials for Vol/Tone/Tone controls. Look kinda cool, be a unique guitar build for certain. 

Anyone know much about switches? Got feedback? Will this work?

While asking, anyone ever try the GFS RedActives? If the guitar turns out great, I might upgrade to EMG's but, price wise, a set of SSS pickups from GFS, is what, the price of 1 EMG? Though if they utterly suck the point is rather moot.

Build wise, Rosewood neck version, Wilkinson 2-point bridge and Wilkinson gold/pear tuners, probably the GFS RedActives, and paint, that 2020 Ford Mustang Candy Apple Green is looking pretty good.


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## Hammerhands (Dec 19, 2016)

If they are a current Fender part, and you have the part number, you can likely order them through Long & McQuade.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

THRobinson said:


> Anyone know much about switches?


I recommend the Alcoswitch brand. Their PB and toggle switches are reliable and fairly priced.
I've used this one on many projects and never had any issues:


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## loudtubeamps (Feb 2, 2012)

Push on push off if you are not in a hurry....I would suggest mini toggles.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Personally, I would recommend against push-buttons. If you have all the time in the world to dial up one of the pickup combinations, more power to ya. But for changes mid-song, your "aim" better be perfect. There's also the matter of the requirement to disable *this* pickup when you want to switch to *that* one. I bought a 2nd hand 3-pickup (HSS) Tele clone a few years ago. The neck is decent and I installed a nice Wilkinson vibrato on it. But it uses 3 toggles for the pickups (no pickguard). Neck and middle are on-off, and the bridge pickup is coil-cancel/off/both-coils. Now, admittedly, push-buttons will interfere with fluidity of motion less than toggle-switches. But if I want to change from neck to bridge, or neck+middle to bridge, that's a bunch of actions I shouldn't have to do, mid-tune. I find a 5-way switch MUCH more fluid than individual switches - one flick and you're done. If a person wants all possible options for a 3-pickup guitar, there are plenty of ways to wire the 5-way switch and/or controls to permit more than the standard 5 settings.

I will also note that there are many exotic settings whose nuanced differences tend to disappear when the amp volume gets cranked or an overdrive pedal gets turned on. That doesn't automatically make maximum-dialability guitars dumb or moot. Rather, one has to consider your playing needs and tonal style to determine whether such arrangements support what you like/need to do, or interfere with it. Guitars shouldn't have to feel like remembering the combination for your high-school locker. Of course, if you have lots of guitars that serve your normal needs, and this is simply one more for interest's sake, then ignore my caveats.

P.S.: I have a longstanding interest in the Bond Electraglide, that was produced in Scotland during the early 1980s. It had a bunch of things warranting against it, that led to its hasty death, so I won't put all the blame on the pickup switching, but I gather people just didn't like it.


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

I appreciate the advice, but, not really looking for advice on push vs toggle... more on which type of push button switches will work. Personally I don't see much dif between tapping a button quickly versus hitting a tiny switch, other than the button is in/out from any angle, and a mini toggle if you hit from the wrong direction doesn't toggle.

Again, I'm looking to try something different and model it after that '83 Elite I'll never own... so needs to be push buttons. 

@Paul Running thanks for the advice, I'll look them up. Need to find one with different mounting since I want the screws hidden and no nut/washers on top if possible.

Anyone know though about SPST vs DPDT?

I know the Fender part was DPDT, but from a Jeff Beck model and not sure what it's function is... could be coil splitting so on/on. I think for on/off I need SPST?


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

Those ones you linked to will work - same mechanism type used in pro audio gear and consoles (though not as good quality probably). Caps are available (it's a standard switch actuator size) and you can mount them to the underside of the pickguard using standoffs as necessary so the actuators/caps aren't too high above the pickguard. You will have visibsle screws though (unless you get fancy with it).

The Alco @Paul Running posted is probably a better (more robust) part and a bit easier with the mounting and comes with a cap, but may sit a bit high or too deep depending on the body cavity depth.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

Granny Gremlin said:


> but may sit a bit high or too deep depending on the body cavity depth.


Yeah, I never used in with a guitar, just pedals and amps.


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

Well, I have a 3D printer and been learning Fusion360 for designing various parts and tools... between that, or making something with a metal bracket or adding wood back to the cavity, I'm sure I can figure out a way to make it without visible screws.

@Granny Gremlin which link? the DPDT or the SPST?


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

THRobinson said:


> Well, I have a 3D printer and been learning Fusion360 for designing various parts and tools... between that, or making something with a metal bracket or adding wood back to the cavity, I'm sure I can figure out a way to make it without visible screws.
> 
> @Granny Gremlin which link? the DPDT or the SPST?



For simple on off all you need is the SPST, but the DPDTs are cheaper and better access for cleaning and will allow you to use them for other things (series/para;lell - coils or pickups etc) - like you are getting 10 of them so you'll have spares to find purpose for. Even at the same price take an equivalent DPDT over SPST (barring physical constrasints) because you can always just not use one pole, but if all of a sudden you wanna do something else you're good.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

What we have not discussed is:
a) how such switches would be mounted, and
b) machining of holes in the pickguard.

I've used small DPDT pushbuttons on pedals, and they are a pain in the butt. IF you have all the precision machinery and expertise to make holes that are the precise diameter, more power to you. But if they are too big, the switch will wobble a bit and be subject to lateral stress from pressing. But isn't it a simple matter of knowing the outside diameter of the pushbutton and having a drill bit that size? Sure, but making a precise hole is moot if the switch isn't positioned precisely below the hole. If the button rubs against the side of the hole it doesn't spring back up when pushed. One can always enlarge the hole a bit with a reamer, to accommodate a button that doesn't sit perfectly in the hole., but then you're back to a too-big hole that lets the switch wobble a bit, decreasing its life expectancy.

I'm not saying it can't or shouldn't be done. I'm saying that if you don't have the right switch harness and can measure and machine things precisely, you may be biting off more than you can chew. There's a reason why people opt for toggles, as annoying as they can be. And the reason is that positioning and mounting them is considerably more simple than mounting push-buttons. If you can score a replacement pickguard from somewhere (and someone probably makes them, for people who'd simply like to change the colour on theirs), AND can score a compatible push-button harness, vaya con dios. As entirely DIY tasks go, personally I wouldn't attempt it.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Those little buttons as shown in the OP, we used used by Fender on the Deluxe Player Strats in the mid 2000's. I'm sure you can still buy them from Fender


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

mhammer said:


> What we have not discussed is:
> a) how such switches would be mounted, and
> b) machining of holes in the pickguard.


We kinda did... I mentioned designing in Fusion 360, or basic metal work. I have a few ideas but until I have the switches and guitar in hand I can't do too much. 

Idea is to probably 3D print, or if not strong enough print a proto to make a casting mold, both a holder and buttons. I'm certain the idea I have will work with PLA printing. 

Machinery wise, desktop CNC machine. Use the files from the bracket to also make the holes and buttons files. 

Honestly I have no worries about that stuff. Mostly need to know what switches will work, then find ones that are the right size, mount type, etc... If I know it can work, I'll make it work.


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

Lincoln said:


> Those little buttons as shown in the OP, we used used by Fender on the Deluxe Player Strats in the mid 2000's. I'm sure you can still buy them from Fender


Ha, typed fender deluxe switch, first hit is that switch... Gotta be a cheaper one out there, looks pretty basic though it has solder lugs not pcb pins like most. Searching digikey, mouser, ebay, etc... I'll find it.


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## loudtubeamps (Feb 2, 2012)

Interlock Push Button Switch Piano Type DPDT 6 Pin 4 Row | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Interlock Push Button Switch Piano Type DPDT 6 Pin 4 Row at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



www.ebay.ca


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

THRobinson said:


> We kinda did... I mentioned designing in Fusion 360, or basic metal work. I have a few ideas but until I have the switches and guitar in hand I can't do too much.
> 
> Idea is to probably 3D print, or if not strong enough print a proto to make a casting mold, both a holder and buttons. I'm certain the idea I have will work with PLA printing.
> 
> ...


Okay, that's more than the average member here will have access to. Fingers crossed for a successful outcome. It's not what I would do but you're the customer, and the customer is always right.


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## tomee2 (Feb 27, 2017)

I think there is a little metal bracket glued under the pickguard to hold that pushbutton switch. That's what I recall seeing for the Jeff Beck setup, but I'm not sure if the 3 button setup in the Elite used that as well.

(I believe Xhefri website on the Stat Plus explains the JB wiring. Edit.... No sorry, he explains the Strat Ultra wiring. The JB wiring might still be up on the Fender website, it used to be.)


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

loudtubeamps said:


> Interlock Push Button Switch Piano Type DPDT 6 Pin 4 Row | eBay
> 
> 
> Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Interlock Push Button Switch Piano Type DPDT 6 Pin 4 Row at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!
> ...


I have the 3 switch version bookmarked from when I was searching... Looked promising but wasn't sure the two sets of leads. I'm assuming what's on the back is the same as the front. Will have to grab the measurements off ebay and crack open a Squier SE that I have, see if fits.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I have a bunch of those, as individual switches. I've seen units with more than two sets of contacts per switch (have one that is 12PDT !), but never just a single set. Takes up the same room, anyway, and offers up a "backup" set of contacts. Spacing under the pickguard is critical. One needs the snap-on caps to be able to visually indicate switch status, via current height, but also not be so tall as to have the cap catch on the side of the hole. Again, all achievable, just something to pay attention to.

Of course, since the switch comes with a second set of contacts, one could use them to turn on status LEDs for each pickup to let you know which ones are on or off. A bit of "gilding the lily".


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

mhammer said:


> Okay, that's more than the average member here will have access to. Fingers crossed for a successful outcome. It's not what I would do but you're the customer, and the customer is always right.


I like to try different stuff... Otherwise I'd just buy a guitar and leave it as-is. I kinda miss imports from the 60/70's... Weird pickups, giant rocker switches, toggles, push buttons, built in pedal fx, etc...


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

mhammer said:


> I have a bunch of those, as individual switches. I've seen units with more than two sets of contacts per switch (have one that is 12PDT !), but never just a single set. Takes up the same room, anyway, and offers up a "backup" set of contacts. Spacing under the pickguard is critical. One needs the snap-on caps to be able to visually indicate switch status, via current height, but also not be so tall as to have the cap catch on the side of the hole. Again, all achievable, just something to pay attention to.
> 
> Of course, since the switch comes with a second set of contacts, one could use them to turn on status LEDs for each pickup to let you know which ones are on or off. A bit of "gilding the lily".


I looked at the LED switches and yup... Debated that... Never used active pickups before so not sure if with LEDs how long a 9v battery will last.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

THRobinson said:


> how long a 9v battery will last.


Run a phantom power setup; 9VDC power supply runs on the signal line and you isolate the DC with caps...the mic idea, except an unbalance config.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

1) Unlike a pedal, where the effects circuit is still being powered, whether in bypass OR effect mode, an LED will only need power when illuminated. If you're not using a pickup, its suggested status LED draws no power at all.

2) Contemporary LEDs have incredibly high efficiency. The ones you find on a 1980s Boss pedal are generally rated around 300 millicandles. The ones you can buy pretty much anywhere for a nickel a pop are often rated in excess of 10,000 millicandles. You can stick a 22k current-limiting resistor in series with them (many Boss pedals would use <3k3) and they're still plenty bright. I'll bet you could go up as high as 33k and still be bright, until the battery starts to crap out.. So even leaving all 3 pickups on for an evening will still give plenty of lifespan out of a 9V battery. And if the battery craps out, you still have switch height to tell you what you need to know. 

As an aside, I always try to complement choice of LED colour with the background, some colours being more visible against certain backgrounds. So, a yellow or white LED against a creme pickguard needs to be much brighter to be visible, just as an orange LED against a red/brown tortoise-shell pickguard would need to be brighter. Blue will generally be visible even at fairly low illumination against most backgrounds one might find on a guitar. Worst case scenario, one uses those little black bezels to mount an LED in and that provides excellent contrast for pretty much all colours. And, since the human eye is more sensitive to some colours than to others, the specific value of any current-limiting resistance might be tweaked to provide roughly equivalent perceived brightness for each LED. If I was implementing this on a guitar, I might use a yellow, blue, and red LED for the pickups (blue for neck, yellow for middle, red for bridge). Makes for a quick "status scan".


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## Zurdo-USA (Dec 1, 2010)

I am also looking for a push on-push off switch that will fit in the hole of a volume knob shaft. I don't want a mini toggle switch.
I ordered them from china but they are momentary. I think I need a "latching" switch ? 
If anybody knows where I can get a switch like that please post it here.
I need something very "flat" or very low that will not interfere with playing since the switch will go near the E String and bridge pickup, as in a Strat. Thanks.


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## THRobinson (Jun 29, 2014)

1 thing I know about switches is the momentary thing... basically (depending how you wire it) the pickup will always be on, unless holding the button down... or off until you hold it down. Just like the buttons on a video game joystick/gamepad.... only works when being pressed.

I was debating a momentary on a Les Paul I have here... it's a unique one, I should post it and see if anyone knows what it is... anyways... Buckethead uses a momentary switch for his guitar.

LINK

He's really good, but it's that kinda music where you listen to it because it's kinda neat, but not something you'd want playing on the radio in the car. Like Vai and Satriani. 

I went on eBay and typed "10mm push button switch -momentary" and a few potential options popped up. How big are the holes? I searched 6mm, 6.35mm, 1/4" and 7mm and all buttons that are very small or stick up a bunch. Might need to go 10mm and drill the hole out bigger.


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