# HSS Wiring Help



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

I have an old Session by Riverhead Sound Research that I am planning on fixing up for my son. Currently it has three on/off switches for each pickup, but I have seen a lot of alternative wiring to this. However, all the diagrams I have seen have not been 100% accurate to my set up. I have drawn up a diagram for a Humbucker with series/off/parallel wiring and the middle and neck still with on/off switches. These diagrams are wired for Seymour Duncan pickups with 4 wires.

Is this diagram correct? I am confused on the on/off positions, if I am understanding correctly in my diagram the pickup is wired to the "lower" lug on the switch so that when in the on position it connects with that wire? In the off position the "top" lug isn't connected to anything therefore not a complete circuit? Also, with that logic, would the bridge toggle positions be correct according to this wiring?


----------



## Latole (Aug 11, 2020)

" I am confused on the on/off positions,"
-WA


Hello , don't you have a multimeter ? It is a must. 

Toggle switch or rocker switch are built lake that; 
You see how arm position make or break contacts
Is that help you ?


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

Latole said:


> " I am confused on the on/off positions,"
> -WA
> 
> 
> ...


Like I said, I've seen diagrams that show both ways and labelled both ways, they seem to contradict themselves. I do not plan on wiring this myself so I do not have a multimeter, and I would like to know if it is correct before I put the money and work into it.

Is my diagram on in the up position?

Is the bridge toggle drawn correctly?

If I give this draft to a Luthier will it be installed the way I think it will?

I could simply take my draft to one of many shops where I live and get a yes or no answer. I just figured a growing community specifically for this type of question would be a little more help.


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Welcome to the forum and congrats on creating such an impressive diagram. Very professional looking!

I'll be following your thread with interest. I enjoy these threads because I typically learn from them and I like to do hands-on aspects of guitar wiring. Switches and their associated logic drive me crazy...LOL
Hence, I do not have the confidence to comment on your questions directly.

Along with @Latole , @knight_yyz and @mhammer often enjoy responding to threads about the challenges presented by using multiple switches to control a circuit.
Maybe they will also "drop by".

Good Luck!


----------



## loudtubeamps (Feb 2, 2012)

The diagram posted will certainly work with the neck and mid pups having the on/ off switches.... In this case....toggle up towards strings being the on position.
Other diagrams that you mention probably work as well if they have been commercially designed and drawn....just a different way to achieve similar results.
A posting of the conflicting diagrams would be helpful in giving an informed response and would certainly clear things up.
Question.....If you have the ability to draft up the diagram above as I understand by your op, I have a difficult time understanding how you would not know the workings of the switches and the relationship between toggle position and contacts being made?
Did you cut and paste some of Seymour’s diagrams to suit your particular needs?


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

What is it you want to achieve with the wiring? I tend to take a curmudgeonly view of guitar wiring that starts to look like a combination lock and doesn't let you go from this sound to that audibly different sound easily. I have a SSH Telecaster style I bought off a guy pre-pandemic, with three toggles instead of a Strat-type switch and it's a royal pain having to turn this one off before turning that one on.

That said, you already have the three spots for toggles and no routing for a 5-way, so we're stuck with what is.


----------



## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

This one is a bit out of my league. We have 3 humbuckers with 4 wires, but the middle and bridge are not setup for coil split. The bridge looks like it can coil split, but I am not sure why the neck pickup is connected to the push pull at the bridge . 


I agree with mhammer, we need to know what is supposed to happen with this circuit. What is the end goal?


----------



## Latole (Aug 11, 2020)

There are many caps ont volume and tone I don't understand why.
Volume pot with treble bleed ; ok . Why other cap ? 
Tone pot ; tone cap Ok , What's the use of other one ?


----------



## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

those look like treble bleeds


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Latole said:


> There are many caps ont volume and tone I don't understand why.
> Volume pot with treble bleed ; ok . Why other cap ?
> Tone pot ; tone cap Ok , What's the use of other one ?


Good catch! I was too focused on the switches to notice this.
I'm also interested in knowing the reasoning for the additional cap and resistor on the tone pot.


----------



## Latole (Aug 11, 2020)

Volume pot ; one cap picture is a solder .......
Yes lots of treble bleed, why so many ?


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

In addition/as a reminder to the OP, if the pickguard is not shielded, the pots need to be grounded to each other and to the output ground.
A bridge ground is also needed.
Apologies if the above is viewed as a post from "Captain Obvious" ...LOL


----------



## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

This is how you wire a Humbucker for series/parallel. The OP diagram is slightly different. Notice the white north wire. 










For the diagram below here is the copy and pasted info I could find...It basically changes the sweep of the pot

"Let's assume, that I have a 250K tone pot in my guitar. If I will turn the knob down to 50%, I will get the 125k ohm resistance before the cap. If I will make the mod from the diagram, with the 20k resistor, I will get 145k (125+20) on the same knob position. It means, that my tone control will be working a little bit less drastically, so I will need a greater turn of the knob, to get a very warm tone.

If I will turn the pot knob of my modded circuit to „0”, the resistance before the cap will be 20k – because of the resistor value. It means, that with this mod, I will never get the tone, that I can have with the classic tone control circuit, with the full turn down."


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

knight_yyz said:


> For the diagram below here is the copy and pasted info I could find...It basically changes the sweep of the pot
> 
> "Let's assume, that I have a 250K tone pot in my guitar. If I will turn the knob down to 50%, I will get the 125k ohm resistance before the cap. If I will make the mod from the diagram, with the 20k resistor, I will get 145k (125+20) on the same knob position. It means, that my tone control will be working a little bit less drastically, so I will need a greater turn of the knob, to get a very warm tone.
> 
> ...


COOL!

So why is there also a 0.1 uF cap on the tone pot in the OP's diagram? 
Is it part of the "Beck mod" that you mentioned before?


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> Welcome to the forum and congrats on creating such an impressive diagram. Very professional looking!
> 
> I'll be following your thread with interest. I enjoy these threads because I typically learn from them and I like to do hands-on aspects of guitar wiring. Switches and their associated logic drive me crazy...LOL
> Hence, I do not have the confidence to comment on your questions directly.
> ...





greco said:


> Welcome to the forum and congrats on creating such an impressive diagram. Very professional looking!
> 
> I'll be following your thread with interest. I enjoy these threads because I typically learn from them and I like to do hands-on aspects of guitar wiring. Switches and their associated logic drive me crazy...LOL
> Hence, I do not have the confidence to comment on your questions directly.
> ...











This is what I want the toggle switches to do. I am confident in the On-Off for the neck and middle, but for the bridge I've seen this drawn up this way, backwards, upside down...I've never seen a diagram of it "in its place" to confirm.



















For instance, these two diagram are different. One is upside down and backwards from the other. Which diagram would I use for:
Up = Series
Middle = Off
Down = Parallel


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> In addition/as a reminder to the OP, if the pickguard is not shielded, the pots need to be grounded to each other and to the output ground.
> A bridge ground is also needed.
> Apologies if the above is viewed as a post from "Captain Obvious" ...LOL


There is no pickguard. I've done a lot of research on this and my last question is that I just want to know if I have them in the correct up/down position.

















Which diagram would I use for the specifications I described?
Up = Series
Middle = Off
Down = Parallel


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

loudtubeamps said:


> The diagram posted will certainly work with the neck and mid pups having the on/ off switches.... In this case....toggle up towards strings being the on position.
> Other diagrams that you mention probably work as well if they have been commercially designed and drawn....just a different way to achieve similar results.
> A posting of the conflicting diagrams would be helpful in giving an informed response and would certainly clear things up.
> Question.....If you have the ability to draft up the diagram above as I understand by your op, I have a difficult time understanding how you would not know the workings of the switches and the relationship between toggle position and contacts being made?
> Did you cut and paste some of Seymour’s diagrams to suit your particular needs?


Yeah, I grabbed as many diagrams for HSS Strat with three toggle switches and incorporated the Seymour Duncan wires into it according to Seymour Duncan diagrams and forums. I am pretty confident I have drawn this right, just wanted a confirmation that I drew them in the correct up/down position. However, I have never wired anything myself, I am new to this.


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

knight_yyz said:


> This is how you wire a Humbucker for series/parallel. The OP diagram is slightly different. Notice the white north wire.
> View attachment 358639
> 
> 
> ...











You mean the white(grey in diagram) next to the red that is clearly connected to the same lug shown in the diagram you posted?


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> COOL!
> 
> So why is there also a 0.1 uF cap on the tone pot in the OP's diagram?
> Is it part of the "Beck mod" that you mentioned before?


I wasn't asking about the pots or capacitors, that is still up to debate in the planning stage (one is treble bleed, the other is greasebucket, I haven't decided which would be optimal as of yet)
I just want to know if toggle switches were drawn according to this:


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

WolfeAlpen said:


> I wasn't asking about the pots or capacitors, that is still up to debate in the planning stage (one is treble bleed, the other is greasebucket,


Sorry... I (and possibly "we") have a tendency to get carried away at times.


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

For our education...(sorry for the slight derail)

*Mod Garage: The Fender Greasebucket Tone Circuit*
Dirk Wacker
February 15, 2011
*Many pro players swear by this tone circuit, and it indeed produces a different effect than the standard tone circuit we all know.*

This month we're taking a look at the Fender Greasebucket tone circuit introduced in 2005 on several guitars in the Highway One series, as well as in various Custom Shop Stratocaster models. The Greasebucket name (which is a registered Fender trademark, by the way) is my favorite when it comes to Fender's habit of choosing cheesy marketing names for new products. But don't let the Greasebucket name fool you—your tone will get cleaner with this modification, not greasy and dirty. I tried to find out who came up with this name, but it seems that this info is not documented, which is another Fender habit that began in the early '50s.

Here is what Fender says about the Greasebucket: “The Greasebucket tone circuit adds a new dimension to your tone, the effect is that when rolled down, the tone pot reduces the high frequencies, but does not add bass."

Okay, it sounds like this is worth trying out. In fact, many pro players swear by this tone circuit, and it indeed produces a different effect than the standard tone circuit we all know. But don't take the Fender description literally—a Strat's standard Tone control does _not_ add bass frequencies. With passive electronics, you can't add anything that isn't already there—you can only reshape the tone by attenuating certain frequencies, which makes others sound more prominent. Removing highs makes lows more apparent (and vice versa), and that's exactly what we have here: The standard tone control rolls off some high frequencies (depending on the capacitance of the tone cap), making the bass frequencies more prominent.

In addition, the use of inductors (which is what a pickup behaves like in a guitar circuit) and capacitors can create resonant peaks and valleys, further coloring the overall tone. Some people like this interaction, others don't—it's purely subjective and a matter of personal taste.

Anyhow, the Greasebucket tone control is a cool way to roll off the highs and lows in your guitar while preventing your tone from getting muddy. This is especially helpful for creating sparkling clean tones, but it's also useful for overdriven sounds.

To convert your Strat's normal tone control to Greasebucket specs, you don't need much: 0.1 μF and 0.022 μF capacitors (Fender uses ceramic-disc versions), and a 1/4-watt 4.7 kΩ resistor (Fender uses the metal-film type). If you want to convert both your Strat's tone controls to Greasebucket specs, obviously you'll have to double these parts.

The mod itself is relatively easy. Simply unsolder your tone pot and then connect the new parts as shown in the diagram. (Note that the resistor is soldered in series with the 0.022 μF cap.) The rest of the Strat wiring, including the volume pot, stays standard.










*Fender's Greasebucket circuit in all its glory. This wiring diagram comes courtesy of Seymour Duncan Pickups and is used with permission. Seymour Duncan and the stylized S are registered trademarks of Seymour Duncan Pickups.*

This type of band-pass filter
only allows certain frequencies
to pass through, while others
are blocked. The standard tone
circuit in the Strat is called a
variable low-pass filter (aka a
“treble-cut filter"), which allows
only the low frequencies to pass
through while the high frequencies
get sent to ground via the
tone cap.


The Greasebucket's bandpass
filter is a combination
of a high-pass _and_ a low-pass
filter. This circuit is designed
to cut high frequencies without
“adding" bass. Mostly it has
to do with that 4.7 kΩ resistor
wired in series with the
pot, which prevents the value
from reaching zero. You can
get a similar effect by simply
not turning the Strat's standard
tone control all the way
down. The additional cap on
the wiper of the Greasebucket
circuit complicates things a bit,
because together with the pickups,
it forms an RLC circuit
(a resonant circuit comprising
a resistor, an inductor, and a
capacitor), but that's outside
the scope of this column. But
the Greasebucket has its own
special sound, and I can only
encourage everyone to try it.
You'll be surprised at its flexibility
and tone.


If you're adventurous, you
can personalize the Greasebucket
circuit with additional mods. For
example, you can try different
tone-cap values and materials.
The 0.022 μF cap connected to
the tone control is the standard
configuration we all know from
our Strat's tone control. But,
as we've discussed several times
in previous columns, there are
tons of alternatives. You can try
other values from 2200 pF up to
0.1 μF, and also different types
of new, used, or new-old-stock
(NOS) caps—such as metal
film, film, paper in oil, waxed
paper, and silver mica. Your
choices are virtually unlimited.


We'll discuss more Strat
mods—such as the Fender S-1
switching system—in the coming
months, so stay tuned.













*Dirk Wacker* lives in
Germany and is fascinated
by anything related to old
Fender guitars and amps.
He plays country, rockabilly,
and surf music in two
bands, works regularly as a
session musician for a local studio, and writes
for several guitar mags. He's also a hardcore
guitar and amp DIY-er who runs an extensive
website—singlecoil.com—on the subject.
MOD GARAGE


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> Welcome to the forum and congrats on creating such an impressive diagram. Very professional looking!
> 
> I'll be following your thread with interest. I enjoy these threads because I typically learn from them and I like to do hands-on aspects of guitar wiring. Switches and their associated logic drive me crazy...LOL
> Hence, I do not have the confidence to comment on your questions directly.
> ...





greco said:


> Sorry... I (and possibly "we") have a tendency to get carried away at times.


No worries! I've only slightly looked into the whole pot mods so I am still learning all of that. Will more than likely be posting a specific question about that in the near future as that is new to me!


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> For our education...(sorry for the slight derail)
> 
> *Mod Garage: The Fender Greasebucket Tone Circuit*
> Dirk Wacker
> ...


Thank you for that! I've only been recently looking into this whole pot mod thing as this is completely new to me! I play a lot of punk/metal with treble up and bass down, I figured a greasebucket mod with a treble bleed would give me the best chance of recreating that sound? Unless I am completely backwards on how these work that is!


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> Welcome to the forum and congrats on creating such an impressive diagram. Very professional looking!
> 
> I'll be following your thread with interest. I enjoy these threads because I typically learn from them and I like to do hands-on aspects of guitar wiring. Switches and their associated logic drive me crazy...LOL
> Hence, I do not have the confidence to comment on your questions directly.
> ...


Thank you! I've been using the most archaic programs to draw these up! I've seen hundreds of wiring diagrams but they all seem to be "floating" (ie, not in their place on the guitar). I understand this is for clarity, I just see things better "in their place."


----------



## Latole (Aug 11, 2020)

Circuit need one more ground wire as Greco wrote.


----------



## Latole (Aug 11, 2020)

WolfeAlpen said:


> However, I have never wired anything myself, I am new to this.


You do a very good job !


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> In addition/as a reminder to the OP, if the pickguard is not shielded, the pots need to be grounded to each other and to the output ground.
> A bridge ground is also needed.
> Apologies if the above is viewed as a post from "Captain Obvious" ...LOL


"Pots need to be grounded to each other" So a simple wire soldered to the top of volume going to the top of tone pot?

"Bridge ground is also needed" I assumed from the Seymour Duncan diagrams that the green and bare wire from the pickup would go to the top right lug, while the grey wire going from the top right lug would ground it? As in, green/bare to grey, grey to volume pot to ground?


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

Latole said:


> Circuit need one more ground wire as Greco wrote.
> 
> View attachment 358697


Thank you for the clarification!


----------



## Latole (Aug 11, 2020)

WolfeAlpen said:


> 1- "Pots need to be grounded to each other" So a simple wire soldered to the top of volume going to the top of tone pot?
> 
> 2- "Bridge ground is also needed"
> 
> 3- I assumed from the Seymour Duncan diagrams that the green and bare wire from the pickup would go to the top right lug, while the grey wire going from the top right lug would ground it? As in, green/bare to grey, grey to volume pot to ground?


1- Yes
2- Yes
3-


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

Latole said:


> 1- Yes
> 2- Yes
> 3-


How would I ground the bridge for this setup? I would assume the green/bare wires would go to pot to ground just like the middle/neck, however those wires are going to the toggle switch. Add a wire from the same lug as the green/bare then to the pot?


----------



## Latole (Aug 11, 2020)

One end of a stranded wire between the bridge and the guitar body, other end anywhere is a ground. Most of the time we solder to a pot body for a not tremolo guitar .

With tremolo; solder one end of the wire to the springs clamp, the other to the pot body


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

Spring claw for tremolo bridges, like I have here?


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

WolfeAlpen said:


> Spring claw for tremolo bridges, like I have here?
> View attachment 358777


OOOPS...I missed seeing that. Sorry
That is also commonly referred to as a "bridge ground".


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

greco said:


> OOOPS...I missed seeing that. Sorry
> That is also commonly referred to as a "bridge ground".


Awesome, thanks for clarification!


----------



## WolfeAlpen (Apr 2, 2021)

Someone had asked for an example of the conflicting diagrams I was talking about.
















These two diagrams say they do the same thing (minus off position in second diagram as this appears to be an on/on not an on/off/on) but they are drawn backwards and upside down from each other.

Which diagram would be correct for this positioning?
Up - Series
Middle - Off
Down - Parallel


----------

