# Boss Waza Tube Amp Expander Whistling - ideas?



## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

So I got a Boss Tube Amp Expander, and I have it set up with a DeLisle 7x7 amp/cab switcher. I have 6 amps and 3 cabs hooked up currently.

Amps

Mesa TransAtlantic 15
Princeton clone
Dr. Z EMS
Rivera R-55
Mesa Roadster
Mesa F-100
Cabs

Custom 1x12 with Eminence Reignmaker
Blackstar 4x8
Mesa Lonestar 1x12
The Boss TAE goes in an attenuator loop on the DeLisle switcher, so any of the amps can be wired in. It is a really cool setup. It also gives me an effects loop that can be shared.

The issue I am getting, which I read about in the manual, is I am getting a high pitched squealing/whistling when I use the F-100 head. The Roadster head is fine. I have to get really close for it to happen. The F-100 head squeals very easily. It is not traditional feedback as the volume is down. Gain is around 10 O’Clock too, and not boosted. I have the reactance settings on what the recommend for hi gain amps which is Lo and Lo. So overall, I am using it with way less gain than the Roadster.

Ideas? I am thinking maybe one of the preamp tubes is microphonic?


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

Beuler.... Beuler... Beuler...


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

Start simple. Hook up the F-100 directly to the Boss. Does the problem go away? 

I suspect some type of ground loop.

TG


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

Hadn’t thought about a ground loop as it is a whistling based on my proximity to the amp, not a steady buzz which has been my experience of ground loops in the past, but it’s worth a shot. Thanks.

Most of the amps cranked up, especially with higher gain, seem to do the whistling thing when the guitar is close, so I suspect it is a tube, unless there are other ideas. Just gotta get some time to get methodical.


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

madhermit said:


> Hadn’t thought about a ground loop as it is a whistling based on my proximity to the amp, not a steady buzz which has been my experience of ground loops in the past, but it’s worth a shot. Thanks.
> 
> Most of the amps cranked up, especially with higher gain, seem to do the whistling thing when the guitar is close, so I suspect it is a tube, unless there are other ideas. Just gotta get some time to get methodical.


It's just a quick way to get to the root of the problem. If amp directly to TAE doesn't cause problems you know to look elsewhere. 

TG


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## jb welder (Sep 14, 2010)

Can you recreate the problem using the F-100 head all on it's own?
Then you can try holding the preamp tubes one at a time with an oven mitt or rag or something so you don't get burnt. If you find one that affects the level of squeal, try replacing it.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

madhermit said:


> Hadn’t thought about a ground loop as it is a whistling based on my proximity to the amp, not a steady buzz which has been my experience of ground loops in the past, but it’s worth a shot. Thanks.
> 
> Most of the amps cranked up, *especially with higher gain, seem to do the whistling thing when the guitar is close,* so I suspect it is a tube, unless there are other ideas. Just gotta get some time to get methodical.


That strikes me as possibly microphonic or unpotted pickups, which can squeal at certain amount of gain. Do all of your guitars do this?


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

High/Deaf said:


> That strikes me as possibly microphonic or unpotted pickups, which can squeal at certain amount of gain. Do all of your guitars do this?


Good one! I don’t know if I used the same guitar each time. I ‘think’ it was a potted alnico II single coil that was whistling.

Gathering ideas so when I tackle the issue, I have some things I can try. 

Biggest symptom seems to me that the F100 even on much lower gain squeals like crazy, when the Roadster has to be up pretty high to d9 the same thing.


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

jb welder said:


> Can you recreate the problem using the F-100 head all on it's own?
> Then you can try holding the preamp tubes one at a time with an oven mitt or rag or something so you don't get burnt. If you find one that affects the level of squeal, try replacing it.


Just got me some grippy gloves for tube fiddling. 
Never had the issue before with the F100. The Boss manual seems to indicate that it can lead to feedback squeal more easily that if it wasn’t being used.


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## Christi (Mar 29, 2020)

madhermit said:


> Hadn’t thought about a ground loop as it is a whistling based on my proximity to the amp, not a steady buzz which has been my experience of ground loops in the past, but it’s worth a shot. Thanks.
> 
> Most of the amps cranked up, especially with higher gain, seem to do the whistling thing when the guitar is close, so I suspect it is a tube, unless there are other ideas. Just gotta get some time to get methodical.


Did you figure this out? I have the same problem without the amp switcher. Do you have the waza TAE sitting on top of the f100? I'm not sure if that has something to do with it, but I just noticed earlier today that when the guitar is a couple feet or so away from the Tube Amp Expander itself, things go microphonic. I tried going close to just the cab and it was less.. Closer to the head.. And it was more.. Closer to the TAE and it was way more.

I think the Waza TAE must have some insane magnetic field going on. I'm not sure if they could have fixed it with shielding, but it's extremely unfortunate. If you walk up to it to adjust it with anything above medium gain, you automatically get a squeal. At least that's what happens to me.what you're updated take?

Man.. I wish it could be shielded way more.


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

Christi said:


> Did you figure this out? I have the same problem without the amp switcher. Do you have the waza TAE sitting on top of the f100? I'm not sure if that has something to do with it, but I just noticed earlier today that when the guitar is a couple feet or so away from the Tube Amp Expander itself, things go microphonic. I tried going close to just the cab and it was less.. Closer to the head.. And it was more.. Closer to the TAE and it was way more.
> 
> I think the Waza TAE must have some insane magnetic field going on. I'm not sure if they could have fixed it with shielding, but it's extremely unfortunate. If you walk up to it to adjust it with anything above medium gain, you automatically get a squeal. At least that's what happens to me.what you're updated take?
> 
> Man.. I wish it could be shielded way more.


The manual mentions high gain amps can lead to the squealing (I think, but I read about it somewhere). I have noticed the Mesa amps I have are more sensitive to it. I have a TA-15, a Mark V:25, and a Roadster head. They will get a microphonic squeal if I get too close, but if I am back a few feet, no problem. The F100 though. I spent A LOT of time messing with it, and I think it is the nature of that beast. It just won't play nicely with the TAE. It just has something going on that the TAE doesn't like. Maybe it's really high frequency filtering that is needed inside the amp or something, but I couldn't get it to work at all, so I took it out of my switching system. Even at low gain, once I turned up the volume on the gain channel, SQUEEEEL! Especially with the contour kicked in. I am talking gain around 9-10 Oclock and overall volume not even loud enough for a drummer.

I find the squeal was worse when I was nearer the amp than the TAE.


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## Christi (Mar 29, 2020)

madhermit said:


> The manual mentions high gain amps can lead to the squealing (I think, but I read about it somewhere). I have noticed the Mesa amps I have are more sensitive to it. I have a TA-15, a Mark V:25, and a Roadster head. They will get a microphonic squeal if I get too close, but if I am back a few feet, no problem. The F100 though. I spent A LOT of time messing with it, and I think it is the nature of that beast. It just won't play nicely with the TAE. It just has something going on that the TAE doesn't like. Maybe it's really high frequency filtering that is needed inside the amp or something, but I couldn't get it to work at all, so I took it out of my switching system. Even at low gain, once I turned up the volume on the gain channel, SQUEEEEL! Especially with the contour kicked in. I am talking gain around 9-10 Oclock and overall volume not even loud enough for a drummer.
> 
> I find the squeal was worse when I was nearer the amp than the TAE.


Did you try separating the Tae from the amps? I put mine on a table to the side and the squeal happens when I get to the TAE. Wonder if the magnetic field of the TAE might be interfering with the F100 maybe more... 
This is kind of a bummer. I was thinking of racking the TAE with my 5150, but if it squeals every time I go to adjust something on the TAE or the Amp, it becomes a problem. Having to keep everything separated at a distance is a pain... Live and in the studio too..
. The manual says to lower the gain, but then the Amp doesn't have enough gain and doesn't do what it was meant to do.. Like. You know. High gain on 6.


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

The TAE was always 4-5 feet away from the F100 head. I don’t think it’s a magnetic thing. I think it’s the way the gain is created in the amp. My Mesa Roadster head is 2 feet closer and doesn’t have this issue and it has more gain.


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## PBGas (Jan 14, 2017)

I run my TAE with a JP-2C and a Mark V 25. The 25 with the Extreme mode on is not friendly towards the Waza....all other modes are great though. I don’t have issues with squealing on either amp. You will get some noise if your pickups are close to the unit while the amp is on but I’m talking a foot from it. Other than that, my setup is uber quiet and sounds amazing.

This sounds like a combination of pickups, a bad cable or some type of ground loop issue as mentioned. You are going to have to eliminate all areas. 

Did you update the unit to the latest version?


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

PBGas said:


> I run my TAE with a JP-2C and a Mark V 25. The 25 with the Extreme mode on is not friendly towards the Waza....all other modes are great though. I don’t have issues with squealing on either amp. You will get some noise if your pickups are close to the unit while the amp is on but I’m talking a foot from it. Other than that, my setup is uber quiet and sounds amazing.
> 
> This sounds like a combination of pickups, a bad cable or some type of ground loop issue as mentioned. You are going to have to eliminate all areas.
> 
> Did you update the unit to the latest version?


If you are talking to me, it is a non-issue for me now. All my other amps work fine, the F100 is the only one that acts weird. 
It is completely fine by itself. Only acts up when it is in the TAE. I spent hours tube swapping. No difference at all. Played with the ground. All software is updated. It's the way the F100 makes gain. 

The other amps I use with the TAE are;
1. Mesa TA-15
2. Princeton clone
3. Rivera R55
4. Dr. Z EMS
5. Mesa Roadster
6. 59 Bassman clone
7. Mesa Mark V 25 combo

All of these are fine.


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## Christi (Mar 29, 2020)

PBGas said:


> I run my TAE with a JP-2C and a Mark V 25. The 25 with the Extreme mode on is not friendly towards the Waza....all other modes are great though. I don’t have issues with squealing on either amp. You will get some noise if your pickups are close to the unit while the amp is on but I’m talking a foot from it. Other than that, my setup is uber quiet and sounds amazing.
> 
> This sounds like a combination of pickups, a bad cable or some type of ground loop issue as mentioned. You are going to have to eliminate all areas.
> 
> Did you update the unit to the latest version?


I didn't update the unit.
I have 35+ guitars. Not the pickups.
I have tons of cables. Not the cables. 
The speaker cables are pretty much as heavy gauge as it gets, are brand new, and don't cause issues in any other situation. 
If the gain is lowered to mid gain, the sqeual goes away. 
The sqeal only happens in proximity to the WAZA TAE, when adjusting the volume. 
The amp is a 5150.

It happens even at whisper quiet volumes. 
The squal is also much more dramatic than from the speaker cabinet itself. It's like instant and supersonic. More like a a mic ugged into a Metal Zone on 10, right in front of a blasting PA (except quiet, because I have the volume turned down).


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## madhermit (Dec 31, 2017)

Christi said:


> I didn't update the unit.
> I have 35+ guitars. Not the pickups.
> I have tons of cables. Not the cables.
> The speaker cables are pretty much as heavy gauge as it gets, are brand new, and don't cause issues in any other situation.
> ...


I think it’s normal for some amps with the TAE. My F-100 Mesa goes nuts with the gain at 10 o’clock and the contour boost on. My Mesa Roadster on Recto mode doesn’t have the same issue. It will still do it when I am close, but it is easy to control by stepping away a few feet from the TAE.

From the Boss FAQ here...
Q: Feedback noise occurs when I connect a guitar to the tube amp connected to the WAZA Tube Amp Expander.
A: Depending on the connected tube amp and guitar, if the gain is too high, oscillation may be produced by an acoustic or electromagnetic loop.
If such noise occurs, try adjusting the gain setting on the tube amp to an appropriate level or moving the WAZA Tube Amp Expander and guitar farther apart.


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## Christi (Mar 29, 2020)

madhermit said:


> I think it’s normal for some amps with the TAE. My F-100 Mesa goes nuts with the gain at 10 o’clock and the contour boost on. My Mesa Roadster on Recto mode doesn’t have the same issue. It will still do it when I am close, but it is easy to control by stepping away a few feet from the TAE.
> 
> From the Boss FAQ here...
> Q: Feedback noise occurs when I connect a guitar to the tube amp connected to the WAZA Tube Amp Expander.
> ...


Yeah.. I had read that. The problem is.. I need it to work with this amp and can't have this happen every time I go to adjust the volume or any of the controls... Doing Yoga to avoid it is also a pita. 

The 5150 is the most popular metal amp of all time. It would be very unfortunate if there is no solution to mitigate it. 

I'm pretty sure it's cause my an electromagnetic loop, and there has to be a reason why it happens with certain amps and not others.

A reason I'm trying to figure out if anyone has a problem like this with the 5150 specifically, is because then I might be able to tell if I have a defective unit. Also, who knows.. Perhaps knowing the reason, I could fix it with additional shielding or something. Maybe the shielding on the TAE isn't sufficient as is.. 
Anyhow, knowing the reason might help find the cure.. If it is possible. 

Who knows.. It could be something as simple as grounding in the amp or having isolated power or something that could be fixable.
. I'm still waiting on a reply from Boss/Roland.


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## PBGas (Jan 14, 2017)

Congrats on having so many guitars. I was not at all implying that you did not know what you are doing. Apologies if it came across that way. No one knows what others knowledge of these things are behind a keyboard.

I gather this is with the old block letter 5150? I tried a 5150 III Stealth 100W head and it sounds monstrous with it! No squealing on channel 2 or 3. No issues. I know it is a different amp in some ways but I’m not having the same issue. Perhaps there is something wrong with the unit itself...then again maybe not as you indicated other amps are fine with it. Very strange.


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## Edax (May 5, 2020)

Hello,

I have been searching some how about this kind of topics (they are quite rare to be honest). And i had similars issue.



PBGas said:


> I gather this is with the old block letter 5150? I tried a 5150 III Stealth 100W head and it sounds monstrous with it! No squealing on channel 2 or 3. No issues. I know it is a different amp in some ways but I’m not having the same issue. Perhaps there is something wrong with the unit itself...then again maybe not as you indicated other amps are fine with it. Very strange.


I am playing on EVH 5150III 100S stealth and had this probleme. I was just drooling when this unit came out and couldn't leave the idea of getting one sooner or later. So I bought a TAE during lockdown and I had all this issues and my use was most for this amp than the other i own that is a SS amp. I sent it back afterwards because i couldn't use it like that with those feed backs ... my settings on EVH were those :

blue channel :
gain:13' o clock

low:14' o clock

midds:12' o clock

high :15' o clock

presence (maxed)
resonance (15' o clock)


red channel:
gain:10' o clock

low:14' o clock

midds:9' o clock

high :15' o clock

presence (15' o clock)
resonance (15' o clock)

I had these feedbacks hight frequencies whisltling effects without any front boost and even more while pushing up highs and presence just on the amp by his own (and this even with Lo presence /resonance settings on TAE) . I contacted RockinChippy, a well known youtuber and he told me that on those amps the waza had to be disposed away from EVH 5150III 100S. the fact is I don't have enought space at my house to be able to put away so i sent it back. To my opinion this unit is very well built and give a very nice tone when you don't have those issues. My clean channel never had been so great but the issue is more about not being able to stack it on this kind of high gain amps and this just because of transistors electromagnetic field... Also i could reach some tones without whistles but then amp tone was totally dull. i tryed many thing staying away from it fairely like 3 meters distance with guitare and the probleme is not comming up from guitar pick ups more than the amp is to close of the TAE making a lot of interferences.

@PBGas seeing you telling that you had not this kind of probleme with yours make me think that this unit must be veery sensitive to something else than amp transistors and that these feedbacks could also be caused by electrical installation, i have to say that mine is very crappy and the TAE user guide says properly that it have to be powered on a separeted socket (my intallation seems to be all in paralell in my fucking shit appartment). Well all of this just to say that this unit is great in a way but too sensitive to any electric/magnetic field. And feedback causes are barely impossible to anderstand where they come from . I guess mistery is still present on this weird side effect. Or maybe some units have problems just hard to tell ...


I wanted to share my expenrience of the TAE with you guys


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## PBGas (Jan 14, 2017)

Yet it his video (Rock'n'chippy) he has it right on top of the amp in his vid. LOL. Are you sure you want to believe him still?

I'll have a go on Friday with my new amp. I picked up the new EVH 50W Stealth version. I was extremely thankful and very fortunate to get one of the only 2 in North America at this time. I'll report back if I have any issues with it and my Waza. If it squeals and makes a ton of noise then I will agree with the issues here and report it as so.


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## Edax (May 5, 2020)

PBGas said:


> Yet it his video (Rock'n'chippy) he has it right on top of the amp in his vid. LOL. Are you sure you want to believe him still?
> 
> I'll have a go on Friday with my new amp. I picked up the new EVH 50W Stealth version. I was extremely thankful and very fortunate to get one of the only 2 in North America at this time. I'll report back if I have any issues with it and my Waza. If it squeals and makes a ton of noise then I will agree with the issues here and report it as so.


He have it on the top of the EL34 not the stealth, not sure that makes any difference but I experienced those issues tho'. Congratz for the EVH 5150III 50S seems a really good piece of gear. I wonder how it differs from the 100S.


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## PBGas (Jan 14, 2017)

So I got my new amp! It's nothing short of amazing sounding! I got extremely lucky getting one of these as only 2 were sent up here and no where else in N.A. 

















I immediately hooked it up to the Waza unit to test a few reports. It sounds fabulous. I tried it sitting on top of the waza unit which is directly beside this setup with the JP-2C on top of it now. I ran channel 1 with gain at 3/4 and then channel 2 with gain at 1 and 2 o'clock. There is no squealing happening whatsoever. What I have found is that setting the resonance control both to low is essential for most higher gain amps and it sounds much better this way, especially when playing loud or recording. Obviously won't get to put this through it's paces live or at rehearsals yet until some of the restrictions are eased up. That being said, if you are running a boost in front of this amp, it is going to squeal regardless of it being connected to the Waza or not....LOL. That should be obvious. My boost in this case is my JP95 wah. On my JP-2C when I engage the shred mode, it will also squeal. Adding that much gain to anything that is already high gain will. 

So, for me, this works great and the Waza unit continues to be a well-built and great solution for everything I need when playing live, rehearsing, practicing or recording.


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## Edax (May 5, 2020)

PBGas said:


> So I got my new amp! It's nothing short of amazing sounding! I got extremely lucky getting one of these as only 2 were sent up here and no where else in N.A.
> 
> I immediately hooked it up to the Waza unit to test a few reports. It sounds fabulous. I tried it sitting on top of the waza unit which is directly beside this setup with the JP-2C on top of it now. I ran channel 1 with gain at 3/4 and then channel 2 with gain at 1 and 2 o'clock. There is no squealing happening whatsoever. What I have found is that setting the resonance control both to low is essential for most higher gain amps and it sounds much better this way, especially when playing loud or recording. Obviously won't get to put this through it's paces live or at rehearsals yet until some of the restrictions are eased up. That being said, if you are running a boost in front of this amp, it is going to squeal regardless of it being connected to the Waza or not....LOL. That should be obvious. My boost in this case is my JP95 wah. On my JP-2C when I engage the shred mode, it will also squeal. Adding that much gain to anything that is already high gain will.
> 
> So, for me, this works great and the Waza unit continues to be a well-built and great solution for everything I need when playing live, rehearsing, practicing or recording.


@PBGas Well cool for your new gear ! but you should not be kind a insulting, sarcastic or arrogant with your "LOL" ... I know that actually any boost give some hiss/feedback and I said whisles not squeals or hiss (quite different tho'), this is different I am not a gear beginer and i play guitar for a while now ... and I will detail a little more, it was like hearing several high oscilating frequencies crossing each others and this occured without any boost only with amp having some high and presence just look back mys settings on my previous posts

it's defenitly not a problem of boost like you could hear on this video @5'13"




And it was way different and that was coming from the unit not the amp I can tell it. I know my gear and how it reacts.

It was more like it was getting real interferencies from something else and obviously boosting highs (only with amp settings) let that thing out wheras my amp never reacted likely before even with boost and high volume. Second thing i never said either that this unit was bad or anything like that, so please don't pretend i said something i never said


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## PBGas (Jan 14, 2017)

Edax said:


> @PBGas Well cool for your new gear ! but you should not be kind a insulting, sarcastic or arrogant with your "LOL" ... I know that actually any boost give some hiss/feedback and I said whisles not squeals or hiss (quite different tho'), this is different I am not a gear beginer and i play guitar for a while now ... and I will detail a little more, it was like hearing several high oscilating frequencies crossing each others and this occured without any boost only with amp having some high and presence just look back mys settings on my previous posts
> 
> it's defenitly not a problem of boost like you could hear on this video @5'13"
> 
> ...


Apologies if you felt I was being insulting. You asked me to let you know if I had any squealing on my unit. There is none. Sorry as I was of no help to you in this situation.


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## amesburymc (May 14, 2006)

I’m not using the same set up as OP but at least I get the same high pitch whistling feedback. I thought it was just because the amp is almost dimed. I’m using Marshall Silver Jubilee RI into TAE and its master and lead master is always past 7-8. However I only get the noise when I boost the amp with OD pedal or playing a Strat. Even those, I can reduce/eliminate the problem by getting away from the amp or using a noise gate. I’m just afraid if I’m not taking the issue seriously enough.


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## Pebbles (May 25, 2020)

I received my TAE last week and I'm getting that whistling and squeeling sound. I am using it with a Marshall SV20H and 212 cab. I moved the entire setup into the other room to get it away from the TV, lights and stuff and I got a very loud squeel. However, it is weird, though, because it was the reverse! I could play and all is fine but if I pulled the volume back with the volume pedal I'd get a really loud squeel. When I turned off my Naga Viper pedal, instant squeel. For me in the other room, the setup seemed to like a lot of gain but squeeled when dialing it back. I did notice before when placing my amp onto standby I'd get a quick chirp. I didn't mess around with settings and stuff as I was exasperated and packed it in. I'm not sure this thing was ready for market.


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## Analogman (Oct 3, 2012)

Mine seems to be from my guitar pickups? I have my TAE sitting on my amp that sits on an OS 1x12, I only get squealing when I walk over to adjust the amp or TAE, guitar is around the same height as the TAE. I used it at rehearsal the last couple times with no issue, there it’s sitting on top of my amp that was on a 4x12 so the unit was quite a bit higher.


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## GavoGarmo (Oct 16, 2020)

Hi,
Did anyone find a solution to this problem? I found this forum whilst searching for people with similar issues. I too have tried multiple amps, multiple guitars and found that the TAE is kicking out some sort of RF interference. The squeal even comes out of my tubes, when all the volumes are turned down. If I move the TAE away from the amp (it's usually sat on top) then the squeal goes away. Equally my guitar(s) pick up a similar squeal when the pickups are within a few meters of the unit and facing toward it. When I turn my back or duck down below the unit, the squeal goes away. (it's like a beam of radiation coming out of the unit) I've been faffing with it for months, thinking the problem was with something else, and now it's a month out of warranty I realise where the problem is. I'm particularly annoyed now as the squealing has actually blown one of my tubes and now my amp is out of action. Has anyone managed to speak to Boss about this issue?

Thanks 

Gav


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