# 6th Intervals for the Blues



## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

So as I continue to delve more into the Blues style of play, to accompany my already set heavy rock/metal style with extra trinkets strewn about from my jazz education and Classical methods.....aka...Jack of all trades, master of none......I thought I'd dig a bit deeper into the wonder of the 6th interval. It's always been a sound I've loved greatly, but never really applied to my play style. As a disclaimer, I'll note that I've been extremely melody/scale/modal oriented with my lead playing.....pretty much avoiding the triads, chords, arpeggios, etc. more than I should have. But it is what it is, time to move forward yet again. 

At this point, reference material /ideas are what I need. I know the proper approach (for myself) to practicing, but would like other ideas on other guitar player's approaches to this type of material. The most obvious one to me is the diatonic approach to both the intervals and triads while applying techniques like double stops, bends etc, so I'd like to hear how others have done it. Here's a good video (IMO) on specifically approaching the 6's that may suggest more of what I'm looking at here.






I've also watched another couple of video's on applying triads to improv, this one by Andy Aledort.






Disclaimer...I do realize this isn't beginner material, far from it actually. But any new players out there should get a ton of info to think about and apply from this as well. Probably some more experienced players as well, much like myself.


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## fretzel (Aug 8, 2014)

I can think of a couple songs that may prove useful to pick this up. 

GnR Patience. This song has them all over the place. Major scale

Led Zep Since I've Been Loving You. 
ThIs song is interesting how it uses them. Sometimes it's on the 5th and the 3rd others on the 3rd and root. 

Not sure if you like Extreme or not but the Pornografitti album is loaded with them.


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## Analogman (Oct 3, 2012)

The Stumble (Freddie King) is another good example of 6ths. Check out the John Mayall w/ Peter Green version.


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## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

Thanks guys. I'll check that out. I'm familiar with all of it except the stumble. I'm getting more into it though. Not really into Extreme as a band but I love Bettencourt's style.

EDIT: I noticed our own Robert Renman hs a nice little lesson on adding the 6th to the Blues scale as well. just checked that out with the John Mayall/Pete Green etc... apparently a number of guitar legends and bands do The Stumble, like Beck, Moore, Stones etc. Seems as though I should learn that one.


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## dolphinstreet (Sep 11, 2006)

One way to accomplish this sound is to use the minor pentatonic and just add the major 6th to it. It implies the Dorian mode, but it's often better to think "minor pentatonic with 6th thrown in", rather than the "Mode Thinking". I feel that when a player decides to switch to thinking in Modes during a solo, it sounds like some exercise and not so natural. I have found my students sound much better using the method I described here.


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## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

dolphinstreet said:


> One way to accomplish this sound is to use the minor pentatonic and just add the major 6th to it. It implies the Dorian mode, but it's often better to think "minor pentatonic with 6th thrown in", rather than the "Mode Thinking". I feel that when a player decides to switch to thinking in Modes during a solo, it sounds like some exercise and not so natural. I have found my students sound much better using the method I described here.





dolphinstreet said:


> One way to accomplish this sound is to use the minor pentatonic and just add the major 6th to it. It implies the Dorian mode, but it's often better to think "minor pentatonic with 6th thrown in", rather than the "Mode Thinking". I feel that when a player decides to switch to thinking in Modes during a solo, it sounds like some exercise and not so natural. I have found my students sound much better using the method I described here.


I teach as well Robert, and I've always used the Modal way of thinking in my own playing. But I like your approach much better, and have been changing my own way of thinking it over the last couple of years. Even as a guitar teacher, I'm always asking other teachers and players questions about their thoughts on a subject and how they apply it. Same as technique, song structure, everything music related. It's this constant learning and adjustment curve that keeps things fresh, new, and often much simpler. And the way you describe it makes it an easy transition into the flow of what is happening at the time. I'll admit it now man, I'm ripping off your ideas left, right, and center to incorporate into my already set standard of play and some of my lessons. I really keep that KISS principle alive and in check at times, or it gets bogged down. I also haven't forgot about hooking up with you for a lesson or 2 somewhere down the line.


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## wayne_h (Oct 28, 2009)

dolphinstreet said:


> One way to accomplish this sound is to use the minor pentatonic and just add the major 6th to it. It implies the Dorian mode, but it's often better to think "minor pentatonic with 6th thrown in", rather than the "Mode Thinking". I feel that when a player decides to switch to thinking in Modes during a solo, it sounds like some exercise and not so natural. I have found my students sound much better using the method I described here.


So in Am the major 6 you're referring to would be F#?
(I always wondered why that works)


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## dolphinstreet (Sep 11, 2006)

wayne_h said:


> So in Am the major 6 you're referring to would be F#?
> (I always wondered why that works)


Yes, that is because that is the note that makes it Dorian, which works great over minor chords.


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## purpleplexi (Nov 5, 2014)

What ever you do don't try and emulate the guy in the first video with the glasses. He has zero feel. Zero.


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## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

purpleplexi said:


> What ever you do don't try and emulate the guy in the first video with the glasses. He has zero feel. Zero.


Oh no doubt. That wouldn't even have entered my mind to be honest. I posted that particular video just because of the theory value and idea. The wierd thing about me is although I do know a ton of theory, I've always played purely by feel of the moment anyways. I think it's worth getting the basic constructs and devices used in Blues down as I'm learning a style that I'm slightly familiar with on a listening level but not on a playing level (as far as the nuts and bolts). Once I have those down. I get a better feel when I know it like the back of my hand, so I typically use that type of video for a good basic idea to lay my own ground work on.


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## purpleplexi (Nov 5, 2014)

dolphinstreet said:


> One way to accomplish this sound is to use the minor pentatonic and just add the major 6th to it. It implies the Dorian mode, but it's often better to think "minor pentatonic with 6th thrown in", rather than the "Mode Thinking". I feel that when a player decides to switch to thinking in Modes during a solo, it sounds like some exercise and not so natural. I have found my students sound much better using the method I described here.


The point you made here led me to think that maybe it would be helpful to guitar players to think of emphasizing certain notes rather than being tortured by "modes". In other words, there are only a couple notes that change from mode to mode and really all you need to do is focus on those couple notes to totally change the feel of any particular phrase or lick. 

For example, last night, after reading this thread, I screwed around with consciously adding the 6th but really concentrating on where to place it in phrases where the WEIGHT of the note had the most impact. Does it work better as a passing note? Does it work better to really sit on that note and make it the centre of a phrase where it's repeated several times?

Fun stuff : )


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## dolphinstreet (Sep 11, 2006)

Yeah I have a whole course on what I call a Hybrid Scale, where the 6th is highlighted. I always focus on the intervals when teaching and playing and not so much modes. They are 2 sides of the same coin, but it's more helpful and powerful to focus on intervals. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## purpleplexi (Nov 5, 2014)

As a side note there is probably no more famous use of the 6th thing than the into to the Bon Jovi song "Dead Or Alive". You usually hear the 6th thing in blues solos but rarely in a composed way like the Jovi tune.


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## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

purpleplexi said:


> As a side note there is probably no more famous use of the 6th thing than the into to the Bon Jovi song "Dead Or Alive". You usually hear the 6th thing in blues solos but rarely in a composed way like the Jovi tune.


Funny that me and my buddy do that tune but I never bothered to break it down for various (time related) reasons. I'm currently working out diatonic Major and minor 6ths all over the neck, from 1 - 6 and 6 - 1. I already have all the positions of the 3rds down so once the 6ths are in place, it should open up more of the fretboard for me. This is basically me trying to break the bad habit (again) of improvising and staying too linear at times. Takes abit to relearn something you had in the past. Now at least I'm at the point of getting pissed off with myself if I don't pick up the guitar for at least 30 minutes a day. The very minimum. I feel empty if I don't...haha.


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## purpleplexi (Nov 5, 2014)

Dorian2 said:


> Funny that me and my buddy do that tune but I never bothered to break it down for various (time related) reasons. I'm currently working out diatonic Major and minor 6ths all over the neck, from 1 - 6 and 6 - 1. I already have all the positions of the 3rds down so once the 6ths are in place, it should open up more of the fretboard for me. This is basically me trying to break the bad habit (again) of improvising and staying too linear at times. Takes abit to relearn something you had in the past. Now at least I'm at the point of getting pissed off with myself if I don't pick up the guitar for at least 30 minutes a day. The very minimum. I feel empty if I don't...haha.


You should feel empty and maybe some shame. Being awesome ain't easy or everyone would be awesome.


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