# Line 6 Helix???



## pat6969

Anybody heard anything on when these will be in Canada? I'm using the AxeFX II XL with the MFC-101 but I sure like this all in one unit. I have cash sitting in my "guitar" account but might snag one of these.


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## Steadfastly

They are expected at Musician's Friend in a few days so they should be available in Canada within the month, I'm guessing.


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## pat6969

I see them on the L&M website but when I called they didn't know anything other than they have 40 ordered in to the warehouse with 25 already spoken for. They don't have any idea as to when they will hit the warehouse though.


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## Budda

pat6969 said:


> Anybody heard anything on when these will be in Canada? I'm using the AxeFX II XL with the MFC-101 but I sure like this all in one unit. I have cash sitting in my "guitar" account but might snag one of these.


Wait until you can try the Fractal AX8.

To sum it up, taken from a friend online:

"There's no way I'm paying Axe-Fx/Kemper money for something that says Line 6 on it. Line 6 is synonymous with fizz, plummeting resale value, and shitty tech support."


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## Milkman

Budda said:


> Wait until you can try the Fractal AX8.
> 
> To sum it up, taken from a friend online:
> 
> "There's no way I'm paying Axe-Fx/Kemper money for something that says Line 6 on it. Line 6 is synonymous with fizz, plummeting resale value, and shitty tech support."



Opinions vary.


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## Budda

Google "line 6 software updates" and see what their last models sell for used. For anyone looking to get serious use out of their products, it would be on my radar. Tone aside, if the unit doesn't get regular, free updates and barely gets support - who's going to help after the purchase has been made? It's the line 6 track record that makes it sketchy, not the unit itself.


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## Milkman

Budda said:


> Google "line 6 software updates" and see what their last models sell for used. For anyone looking to get serious use out of their products, it would be on my radar. Tone aside, if the unit doesn't get regular, free updates and barely gets support - who's going to help after the purchase has been made? It's the line 6 track record that makes it sketchy, not the unit itself.


Resale value is of no interest to me.

Opinions vary as to the tones.

In my opinion, if you can't get good tones from Line 6 modelers, the problem isn't gear related.

And, for what it's worth, I've never really needed tech support with my Pod. I just plug in and play.


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## jbealsmusic

Budda said:


> Wait until you can try the Fractal AX8.


We'll see what they sell it for... I was really excited for the AX-8 until I saw Helix. The UI is far superior, and it includes an expression pedal. Less stuff to carry is always good to me! Decent usable tones should be easily achievable on both units. The AX-8 may have that extra 5% that only I'm going to notice when jamming alone through nice studio monitors in a treated room. But coming from a loud stage at a club, no one will notice the difference but me.



> To sum it up, taken from a friend online:
> "There's no way I'm paying Axe-Fx/Kemper money for something that says Line 6 on it. Line 6 is synonymous with fizz, plummeting resale value, and shitty tech support."


I wish people would stop saying that. Helix sells for USD$1499 (even less with discount coupons). Axe II+MFC is more than twice that. KPA with a decent controller is getting up near the USD$2500 range. They are nowhere near the same price. For the price of an Axe-II+MFC or a KPA+Controller you can get a Helix with a decent powered FRFR or combo amp with money to spare.

Also, I'm not sure judging a company's products based on past releases at a completely different price point is totally fair. Just look at Apple (or any other mainstream tech company for that matter).

Honestly, I'm sure both units will be amazing tools to work with! Neither should be written off before giving it a shot.


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## Guest

From my experience with different L6 items since Pod 1, I'm done.


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## Budda

All a company has to go on at the end of the day is how it's been remembered with previous attempts. It was mentioned with guitars, cars, movie producers, etc. If your track record is bad, you're *really* going to have to wow people *for a while* to convince them the ship has been turned around.

No one said axe fx + MFC . If the Helix won't be getting updates to keep up with the Fractal/KPA gear, and keeps getting left in the lurch, why not spend the extra couple hundred (which is what a used Axe FX II sells for) and get a unit that is constantly being improved upon? An expression pedal can be had for $40, so line 6 including one (to me) isn't really a big deal. 

I'm jealous that Milkman doesn't have to worry about resale value, but a lot of guitar players factor that in - myself included.


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## Milkman

Budda said:


> No one said axe fx + MFC . If the Helix won't be getting updates to keep up with the Fractal/KPA gear, and keeps getting left in the lurch, why not spend the extra couple hundred (which is what a used Axe FX II sells for) and get a unit that is constantly being improved upon?
> 
> I'm jealous that Milkman doesn't have to worry about resale value, but a lot of guitar players factor that in - myself included.


Why do we need constant and continuous updates? Do you get those with a vintage tube amp? For me the value is in functionality and in the sounds I'm able to get, not in keeping up with the latest thing.

As for not having to worry about resale value, I'm no more well off than many here. I just don't buy gear hoping to recoup some of the cost later. I buy it because I like it and expect to use it.

I'm currently using POD HD500X. It cost much less than the Dr. Z Maz 38 I recently sold, and sounds every bit as good. 

The Helix IS a bit pricey but if the sounds are better than what I currently have I'd say there's value there.

The trick is NOT trying to keep up with technology and focussing more on playing IMO.

I just take exception to people saying that the tones from Line 6 are crap.

I've always felt the same about almost every Mesa amp I've heard, but I've come to realize that it's almost always the player that has the biggest impact on what I hear from the board.


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## Adcandour

I'm not sure how I feel about this unit. It _could_ be the player, but I'm leaning toward the gear. If you listen closely and focus on the hanging notes, you'll see that's there's zero expression coming from the players fingers. I'll have to surf around for some other vids. 

[video=youtube;-Fduahpgt8I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Fduahpgt8I[/video]


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## Milkman

adcandour said:


> I'm not sure how I feel about this unit. It _could_ be the player, but I'm leaning toward the gear. If you listen closely and focus on the hanging notes, you'll see that's there's zero expression coming from the players fingers. I'll have to surf around for some other vids.
> 
> [video=youtube;-Fduahpgt8I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Fduahpgt8I[/video]


Youtube clips are not how I would assess any gear in terms of tone. You can get a reasonable idea of functionality but to know how it sounds when YOU are playing it, well, you know.......


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## pattste

Milkman said:


> Why do we need constant and continuous updates? Do you get those with a vintage tube amp?


I think the reason is that people are hoping the software update will get the modeler to sound closer to said vintage tube amp it is emulating. Assuming the processor has enough power to keep up with the more sophisticated algorithms that the company develops over time, this is a reasonable expectation. I have not followed the world of modelers closely but it appears that the Kemper has been more futureproof than the Axe Fx or Line 6 devices. This is also how resale becomes a consideration, if you need to sell to get a new unit that does a better job of getting the classic amp sounds. I think it's pretty clear that strictly in terms of coping the sound of the best amps, the modelers are not quite there yet. The question is whether their numerous and significant advantages in other aspects make up for it.


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## Cups

You're never going to find the answer through YouTube. It's a sit down and test it thing. 
Digital emulators feel different then the real thing. So what? I've been playing the digital stuff so long I prefer it over tubes. I've come to that realization and I'm okay with it. 
There's also the volume factor which is huge for me. There's a threshold where after a certain volume I can't recognize the note anymore . There is way more control with digital. And the sound is consistent over many decibels. 
I still enjoy a nice tube amp but I'm more inspired by my Boss GP-10 then anything else.


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## pat6969

Budda said:


> Wait until you can try the Fractal AX8.
> 
> To sum it up, taken from a friend online:
> 
> "There's no way I'm paying Axe-Fx/Kemper money for something that says Line 6 on it. Line 6 is synonymous with fizz, plummeting resale value, and shitty tech support."


Not interested in waiting. I'm thinking of buying the Helix and then snagging the AX8 as well. Was just wondering if anyone has heard anything on when they're hitting the streets.


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## TimH

I'm one of the people with a deposit down on the unit...I'm hoping it shows up next week since a) the US is getting theirs and b) L&M are the CND distributors.


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## Milkman

I wouldn't rule one out for me at some point.

If the resale value is so low and they're as undesireable as some believe, there should be an abundance of them for sale used and at a very low price by the time I'm ready.


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## Milkman

pattste said:


> I think the reason is that people are hoping the software update will get the modeler to sound closer to said vintage tube amp it is emulating. Assuming the processor has enough power to keep up with the more sophisticated algorithms that the company develops over time, this is a reasonable expectation. I have not followed the world of modelers closely but it appears that the Kemper has been more futureproof than the Axe Fx or Line 6 devices. This is also how resale becomes a consideration, if you need to sell to get a new unit that does a better job of getting the classic amp sounds. I think it's pretty clear that strictly in terms of coping the sound of the best amps, the modelers are not quite there yet. The question is whether their numerous and significant advantages in other aspects make up for it.


Modelers will NEVER get it to 100%. Real is real and modelers are always going to be a simulation.

But, how different _is _the tone really?

I wonder in a double blind test how many of us would really be able to conclusively tell the difference.

I also know that in a live context, once that tube amp is mic'd and the signal travels down the snake, through the board, rack, back up the snake to the stage, through the power amps and then through the mains, the difference will be of little impact.

But that's just my opinion.


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## TimH

This whole conversation about resale value is silly...The newest POD sells for $679 new and usually $500 used. The HD500, with the release of Helix, is 2 generations old and sells for an average of $300. So the current generation resale value is about 74% resale on the used market. 

To compare, the last Kemper sold on this board was asking $1700 and sells new for $2250 - 75.5% assuming the seller got their full asking price.


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## vadsy

I've done the Line6 thing several times and I suppose it'll happen again. Don't know how long it would stick with me this time but at least the feedback seems positive in German.


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## Cups

That brings up another important point (thanks Milkman): you have much more control over the final sound in a live situation. Dudes spend thousands on gear and let sound guys plac any old mic any old way and are confident the sound on stage will be represented front of house. Better control over all the variables was a big draw to digital for me.


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## vadsy

For those of you using these systems, what do you find is the best way to monitor yourselves in a live situation? If in-ears are out and the house doesn't have anything what do you bring with you?


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## pat6969

vadsy said:


> For those of you using these systems, what do you find is the best way to monitor yourselves in a live situation? If in-ears are out and the house doesn't have anything what do you bring with you?


I use an EV ZLX-12P with my AxeFX. I considered the CLR but thought a decent monitor would give me a better representation of what will be coming out FOH.


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## Steadfastly

Milkman said:


> Modelers will NEVER get it to 100%. Real is real and modelers are always going to be a simulation.
> 
> But, how different _is _the tone really?
> 
> I wonder in a double blind test how many of us would really be able to conclusively tell the difference.
> 
> I also know that in a live context, once that tube amp is mic'd and the signal travels down the snake, through the board, rack, back up the snake to the stage, through the power amps and then through the mains, the difference will be of little impact.
> 
> But that's just my opinion.


Nope, that is fact. There have been blind tests done and many of the so-called experts had to admit they got it wrong. Many of the ones that got it right admitted it was just a guess.


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## Guest

It sounds compressed and sterile in the video to me. One thing I like to remember is the guys doing the demos are super ringers. They are very very good at playing, and getting great sounds out of anything. Check out YouTube vids on your favorite pedals. The ones from PGS or Prymaxe etc. sound great. Then check out videos that are made by a home user. They sound buzzy and nothing like the pro vids.


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## amagras

There will always be one that is better...


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## Milkman

vadsy said:


> For those of you using these systems, what do you find is the best way to monitor yourselves in a live situation? If in-ears are out and the house doesn't have anything what do you bring with you?


I've never been in a situation where I can't use IEMs or where there's no monitor mix available. If I had to drag a powered speaker or other means to hear a modeler out to a show, I might as well bring a normal rig.
I know there are full range powered cabs that are purpose built for such applications and I've heard the sound good, but somehow that seems to defeat the purpose for me.

I like the silent stage approach.


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## TimH

anyone getting a shipping update?


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## jbealsmusic

I guy on another forum contacted L&M for an update. They were told the units are at Yorkville (distributor). No word yet on when they'll actually get to stores or ship out to customers.

Maybe they haven't yet been flashed with the proper firmware.


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## exhausted

TimH said:


> anyone getting a shipping update?


Guitarworks in Calgary now says sometime mid/late October vs the original September.


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## TimH

FYI I had the London store manager call Yorkville...the Helices are still in transport to them (not in the warehouse as previously reported) and he would expect to see them in store late next week. I'm hoping Thursday before my band practice.


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## High/Deaf

Bonus points to TimH for the correct pluralization of Helix. Tres bon!


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## Guitar101

Milkman said:


> I like the silent stage approach.


Please explain the "Silent Stage" approach. I'm picturing the band on stage playing with no sound coming out to the audience.


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## Milkman

Guitar101 said:


> Please explain the "Silent Stage" approach. I'm picturing the band on stage playing with no sound coming out to the audience.


Guitars, bass, keyboards and drums (electronic) are direct to PA. The musicians hear themselves via IEMs. The audience hears the mains.

There are no amplifiers or monitor speakers on stage.

This results in a highly controllable mix without hot spots (sitting in front of the guitarists's amp in a normal situation and that's all you hear).

Typically monitors are very loud. Musicians seldon realize HOW loud, until you show them by turning off the mains. That inteferes wiith the house mix, causes feedback issues. Having conventional amps on stage has additional pitfalls such as escalating volumes.

A variation of the silent stage can be accomplished using conventional amps if the are kept off stage (isolated)and mic'd.


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## Guitar101

Thanks for the explanation. I personally would like this "silent stage" concept as I struggled through 30 years of playing trying to get band members to turn down their volume. I'm assuming that a soundman is necessary to control the final mix from the board as band members still have volume control knobs on their instruments and that everyone is using IEM's.


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## Milkman

Guitar101 said:


> Thanks for the explanation. I personally would like this "silent stage" concept as I struggled through 30 years of playing trying to get band members to turn down their volume. I'm assuming that a soundman is necessary to control the final mix from the board as band members still have volume control knobs on their instruments and that everyone is using IEM's.


You're quite welcome.


What I've found is that once each player has his mix dialed in, the volume escalations stop dead.

And, another bonus with IEMs is the fact that no matter where any player wanders on the stage, he or she continues to hear the mix he dialed in.

The soundman has a much easier time getting a balanced mix throughout the audience. It's such an improvement over the old way, it's surprising to me that more bands don't adopt it.


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## dradlin

IEM's... too each his own.

I'd rather not play than have to play with them. I feel to isolated and disconnected from my surroundings, and guitar tones just don't sound right through ear buds.

That's my experience so far anyways with mic'd amps off stage, or a few generations of PODs, and even with control of my own monitor mix via Aviom personal mixer.

However touring pros mostly use them, so that speaks volumes.

As far as the Helix goes, I'm looking forward to them hitting the streets so we start hearing some real user tones and experiences.


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## Robboman

Line 6 Helix - $1499 USD, shipping October. 
Fractal AX8 - $1399 USD, shipping October.

Will be a battle for the ages. 

IMO the short story is that the choice comes down to what you value more.. the best UI and feature set, or the best sound.

I'm curious to hear the Helix for myself, but I've heard the HD500x and IMO it didn't compare to Fractal. Not in the same ballpark. It was great for the money though, you could buy 5 or 6 of them for the price of an Axe-Fx.

Now with AX8 vs Helix, the price argument is all but gone. 

I know exactly how the AX8 will sound - same as my Axe-FX II. Same code and same quality hardware for A\D and signal path, the only compromise is you can't run as many instances of amps, cabs and FX all at the same time. For everything I do (virtual amp, cab and string of virtual pedals) it will sound equally incredible. 

Now along comes the Helix. SUPER fancy hardware.. big color screen, programmable LCD labels for each switch, multi-color rings around switches. VERY cool UI and feature set. It's supposed to sound better too. It's possible they could close the gap, or at least somewhat to the point that it won't matter much. 

I'd have to hear Helix, but at this point if I had to guess I'd bet the AX8 will still sound significantly better then the Helix. 

These are my thoughts, not yours. 

Peace


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## Guest

Robboman said:


> Line 6 Helix - $1499 USD, shipping October.
> Fractal AX8 - $1399 USD, shipping October.
> 
> Will be a battle for the ages.


It continues to be a very good time to be a guitar player.


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## Guitar101

I, like Robboman, haven't tried either one but I think the Helix has to sound better. It costs $100 more.


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## Robboman




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## Robboman

By the way, Fractal just opened their waitlist for AX8 for US and Canada. 

http://www.fractalaudio.com/ax8-amp-modeler-multi-effects.php


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## jbealsmusic

There is a thread for the AX8. Wouldn't posts about it be better suited there?
http://www.guitarscanada.com/showthread.php?69353-Fractal-Audio-Systems-AX8-(not-FX8)


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## pattste

The Helix looks sharp.


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## Guest

Colourblind people will have trouble with the Helix.


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## TimH

spoke to L&M and the Helices landed at Yorkville yesterday and should be in stores mid next week at the latest.


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## Milkman

TimH said:


> spoke to L&M and the Helices landed at Yorkville yesterday and should be in stores mid next week at the latest.


There seems to be some restrictions to which stores are getting this particular model. 

My local shop has told me they're having trouble getting them.


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## TimH

I picked mine up tonight


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## dradlin

TimH said:


> I picked mine up tonight


Well.......???


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## Guest

TimH said:


> I picked mine up tonight





dradlin said:


> Well.......???


What he said!


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## bzrkrage

dradlin said:


> Well.......???





iaresee said:


> What he said!


Well he's got his L6 500HDX & Zoom G3 up for sale so it can't be TOO shabby.


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## Steadfastly

dradlin said:


> Well.......???





TimH said:


> I picked mine up tonight





iaresee said:


> What he said!


What they both said!


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## amagras

https://sr0.cdn.speedyrails.net/ima...ystem-fp-f4cd0fb50ce13b738af6ff17cac0e8f7.jpg


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## Whip

Crazy! Just spoke to an Toronto L&M salesman and he said the date they have now is February! As far as he knows, L&M has only sold 1, so I guess you got the only one TimH. Poor business practice for line 6 IMHO


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## vadsy

The only L&M store in Edmonton that had or will have them is the south side location. I was told all the pre-orders are filled and more are coming in. I didn't ask how many were sold already or how many are coming in.


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## gtrguy

Player99 said:


> Colourblind people will have trouble with the Helix.


You mean the footswitch ring colors? You can set any/all of them to any color you like.


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## Whip

vadsy said:


> The only L&M store in Edmonton that had or will have them is the south side location. I was told all the pre-orders are filled and more are coming in. I didn't ask how many were sold already or how many are coming in.


I would appreciate it if you could find out next time you are in. Maybe the dude I spoke to is not playing nice.


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## Whip

Lucked out. Have one coming mid-December


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## vadsy

Whip said:


> I would appreciate it if you could find out next time you are in. Maybe the dude I spoke to is not playing nice.


So initially the Edmonton south store had 4 special orders right from the beginning, these have been delivered. They currently have 2 more on order, one is sold and the other is coming in for stock. As for delivery the sales person said 'a few weeks' but he also mentioned head office warehouse doesn't have any and it all depends on Line 6.


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## hollowbody

Steadfastly said:


> What they both said!


What they ALL said!


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## Adcandour

Just an observation...

Have you guys noticed that people are getting rid of these units like hot potatoes on the TGP forum? Every third post on the modelling emporium is one of these units.


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## jbealsmusic

adcandour said:


> Just an observation...
> 
> Have you guys noticed that people are getting rid of these units like hot potatoes on the TGP forum? Every third post on the modelling emporium is one of these units.


I haven't checked. It doesn't surprise me though. A lot of TGPers seem to buy everything fancy that comes out only to resell them right after.

I'm waiting for the negative reviews to be posted. Not the advertisements claiming to be reviews, but the reviews from actual users detailing what exactly they didn't like about it. Something tells me I won't bond with it either, but I'm certainly willing to give it a shot.


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## Adcandour

jbealsmusic said:


> I haven't checked. It doesn't surprise me though. A lot of TGPers seem to buy everything fancy that comes out only to resell them right after.
> 
> I'm waiting for the negative reviews to be posted. Not the advertisements claiming to be reviews, but the reviews from actual users detailing what exactly they didn't like about it. Something tells me I won't bond with it either, but I'm certainly willing to give it a shot.


I've been much more critical of youtube after my recent series of debacles, so I was able to listen for key things that hint at what the gear might be like in actuality. As mentioned in post 12, those pros can't even get any feeling into those notes.


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## Budda

skip youtube videos, go straight to proper soundcloud uploads of the audio. Anyone who can get a decent mic placement (or DI as the case may be) would have a far better representation. I think a lot of YT demos are actually just camera audio, which is next to useless IMO.


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## pat6969

Couldn't wait for the AX8, I'll still buy it when my name comes up but I had gas. Found a Helix in Edmonton!! Woooohoooo!! Should have it tomorrow. I will start a new thread with a review and some clips after I've tried it a few days. 30 day return policy makes trying it a no brainer!!


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## Milkman

adcandour said:


> Just an observation...
> 
> Have you guys noticed that people are getting rid of these units like hot potatoes on the TGP forum? Every third post on the modelling emporium is one of these units.



I just looked and I see five Fractal Axe FX for sale on the first page. There's one Helix and it's sold already.

As for "feeling" in the notes, that is either in the player's hands or it doesn't exist.

Just my opinion of course.


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## Dorian2

Milkman said:


> I just looked and I see five Fractal Axe FX for sale on the first page. There's one Helix and it's sold already.
> 
> As for "feeling" in the notes, that is either in the player's hands or it doesn't exist.
> 
> Just my opinion of course.


I went to the link that was provided in post 12 just to watch the guys hands. It sure LOOKED like he was trying to get some "feel" into it considering how much those finders were vibratoing, but it sure didn't sound like what I was expecting after seeing it.

Just my own observation though.


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## vadsy

Stang Guitars has a Helix hooked up and ready to demo in-store,.. if anyone in the Edmonton area is interested. 

I stopped by this afternoon and asked for a demo, didn't want to embarrass myself wanking away on something I have zero experience with. Sounded good, straight cray amount of tweaking options, possibly a selling feature for some and a deal breaker for others. They have it hooked up to a 2x10 Roland solid state stereo amp, I'd love to hear it with a large amp and compare some tones.


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## Adcandour

Milkman said:


> I just looked and I see five Fractal Axe FX for sale on the first page. There's one Helix and it's sold already.
> 
> As for "feeling" in the notes, that is either in the player's hands or it doesn't exist.
> 
> Just my opinion of course.


It looks like things have changed, since my post. There's always Axe FX, Kempers, or Eleven Racks filling the pages out. I just think it's telling that the Helix pretty new, and there was a bunch up there already. They couldn't have had them for too long.

I'm certain you can't coax any dynamics out of certain gear - no matter how good you are. Your "feeling" is lost. I can hear it in the Helix.

A good player can work within the limits of shit gear to make it work (andy at proguitarshop is a master of making mediocre pedals sound awesome). I recall that video where SRV grabs Buddy Guy's guitar and struggles to get his signature vibe.

Buddy guy does a quick noodle before handing it over to SRV- zero dynamics, but some definite style. SRV can't make a note squeal for the life of him, no message from the fingers at all, so he starts working the wah to save himself.


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## TimH

Hey Guys...really sorry for not checking back. I've been renovating my basement and time has been as a premium. Also...I'm not gear whoring at the moment. 

So...how is the Helix?

Great!

I've owned the Kemper with pro made profiles, the Axe Std, Ultra, and IImk1 and to me the Helix is every bit as good as those units sonically. Different...but in the same ballpark for sure. All the people I've played with agree with the assessment too...even the digital skeptics. 

The interface is brilliant. I HATE the idea of lugging a laptop to a gig for some edit program and without that the Axe and HD500 were terrible to use. The Helix is simple, intuative and beautiful. 

The only thing I've had to connect to a PC for was updating and initial loading of my IR's. Took me maybe 5 min total.

So that is the meat and potatoes. Everyone wants to know "does it sound as good as other offerings." To me...yes. Different but good. 

The gravy is this: I get a recording interface, MIDI controller that is better than both the Axe and Kemper offerings, and it costs $1000CND less than a full Kemper rig or half an AxeII+MFC rig. 

The cons? Less variety than either rig. If you absolutely need a Matchless sound or the vintage channel on a Dual Rec this won't be a rig for you....at the moment. 

Feel free to ask questions


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## Guest

TimH said:


> *Feel free to ask questions*


Should I break up with my girlfriend?


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## Budda

^ keep this guy around!


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## pat6969

I think the Helix can hold it's own with the big boys. I loaded it with some Ownhammer IR's and it simply rocks. The option for amps and effects is severely limited compared to the AFXII XL I had but the core tones of the amps that it comes with are excellent. The UI is slick and easy to use, the audio interface is great, and the scribble strips are excellent. Build quality is tankish. Not sure if I'll keep it as I find myself looking for that Friedman tone I was getting from my Axe. If I knew 100% that L6 was going to be adding amps and effects at a frantic pace I might decide to keep it.


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## TimH

pat6969 said:


> I think the Helix can hold it's own with the big boys. I loaded it with some Ownhammer IR's and it simply rocks. The option for amps and effects is severely limited compared to the AFXII XL I had but the core tones of the amps that it comes with are excellent. The UI is slick and easy to use, the audio interface is great, and the scribble strips are excellent. Build quality is tankish. Not sure if I'll keep it as I find myself looking for that Friedman tone I was getting from my Axe. If I knew 100% that L6 was going to be adding amps and effects at a frantic pace I might decide to keep it.


Yeah I guess this could be a legitimate concern...but I guess my experience using the units live is that the differences between a modeled AC30 and DC30 dissapear rather quickly. I'm always evaluating these units from a live perspective and so, even if there are no additions, I can't think of any sounds I won't be able to get from this unit. Worst case scenario is that I add an H9 Max in a loop. 

That being said, I won't complain if they do add stuff over time. I just am not in the camp of people who need dozens of amp options. I'll settle in on 3-4 eventually anyhow.


----------



## jbealsmusic

So far, L6 has been pumping out firmware updates and it isn't even in the hands of most of the people who have bought it due to backorders. In the last firmware update, they added a new stereo delay effect. I'd say these are all good signs that they plan continued support for the unit. Assuming they keep it up, I'm sure there will be more amps and effects to come in the future.

That said, in the TGP thread, there was talk that it was still up for debate at L6 HQ whether or not they will charge for added amp packs. We'll just have to wait and see what happens.


----------



## TimH

jbealsmusic said:


> So far, L6 has been pumping out firmware updates and it isn't even in the hands of most of the people who have bought it due to backorders. In the last firmware update, they added a new stereo delay effect. I'd say these are all good signs that they plan continued support for the unit. Assuming they keep it up, I'm sure there will be more amps and effects to come in the future.
> 
> That said, in the TGP thread, there was talk that it was still up for debate at L6 HQ whether or not they will charge for added amp packs. We'll just have to wait and see what happens.


To me charging for amp packs won't be a big deal...you pretty much HAVE to buy new amp for the Kemper...


----------



## jbealsmusic

TimH said:


> ...you pretty much HAVE to buy new amp for the Kemper...


Not sure I agree with that one. Thousands of free profiles out there. It's just a serious pain to download so many and sort through them all to find the gems.


----------



## pat6969

TimH said:


> Yeah I guess this could be a legitimate concern...but I guess my experience using the units live is that the differences between a modeled AC30 and DC30 dissapear rather quickly. I'm always evaluating these units from a live perspective and so, even if there are no additions, I can't think of any sounds I won't be able to get from this unit. Worst case scenario is that I add an H9 Max in a loop.
> 
> That being said, I won't complain if they do add stuff over time. I just am not in the camp of people who need dozens of amp options. I'll settle in on 3-4 eventually anyhow.


I'm the same but I like to be able to settle on 2-3 from a choice of 100!


----------



## TimH

pat6969 said:


> I'm the same but I like to be able to settle on 2-3 from a choice of 100!



and I guess what I'm saying is that since nearly every amps lineage is represented in the Helix (maybe Dumble is the glaring omission) and since the differences between cousins are, IMHO, all but lost when you play live, I think most people, if they stop going over the last 2% with headphones in their basement, can probably get there 2-3 for live use out of the Helix's available amps.


----------



## jbealsmusic

Bringing this thread back to mention the newest update. Great stuff, including SNAPSHOTS! My most desired feature. If Line 6 keeps up with these updates, they have a real winner!

*Helix Firmware 2.0* - Includes new models, features, fixes, stability improvements, and optimizations. It is highly recommended that all Helix users perform this update!

*New Amp Models*

*Cali IV Rhythm 1*, based on* the Rhythm I channel of the MESA/Boogie® Mk IV
*Cali IV Rhythm 2*, based on* the Rhythm II channel of the MESA/Boogie® Mk IV
*Cali IV Lead*, based on* the Lead channel of the MESA/Boogie® Mk IV
*Line 6 2204 Mod*, Line 6 Original based on* a hot-rodded Marshall® JCM 800
*Line 6 Fatality*, Line 6 Original based on* THALL
*New Effects Models*

Distortion > *Wringer Fuzz* (Mono, Stereo), based on* Garbage’s special BOSS® FZ-2
EQ > *Cali Q Graphic* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the MESA/Boogie® Mk IV’s 5-band EQ
Modulation > *Harmonic Tremolo* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
Delay > *Vintage Digital* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
*New Features*

_Snapshots_—Select one of eight snapshots to instantly recall all block on/off states, up to 64 parameters' values, certain Command Center values, and tempo. Any Delay, Reverb, or FX Loop block with its Trails parameter turned on will spill across snapshots seamlessly. To select a snapshot, *press BANK UP and BANK DOWN simultaneously and then one of the middle eight footswitches*. For Helix Rack owners who haven’t yet snagged Helix Control (and you should), *press PRESETS and turn Knob 5 (Select Snapshot)*. For more information, check out the new _Helix 2.0 Owner’s Manual_, available here
_Snapshot Parameter Assign_—To adjust a parameter AND set it to automatically update per snapshot, *press and turn the knob*. To adjust a parameter WITHOUT it automatically updating per snapshot, just turn the knob like you normally would. If you accidentally press and turn and didn’t mean to, *hold BYPASS and press the knob to instantly unassign snapshot control*
_Copy/Paste Snapshots_—*While touch-holding the footswitch for the snapshot you want to copy, briefly touch and release the footswitch for the snapshot you want to overwrite. *For Helix Rack owners who haven’t yet snagged Helix Control (and again, you SHOULD), *select the snapshot you want to copy, press PRESETS, and then ACTION. Press Knob 1 (Copy Snapshot). Select the snapshot you want to overwrite, press ACTION, and then Knob 2 (Paste Snapshot)*
_Swap Snapshots_—*Touch and hold two snapshot footswitches and a dialog appears, asking if you want to swap their location*
_Rename Snapshots_—*Press PRESETS and then Knob 6 (Rename Snapshot) to rename the snapshot to something meaningful, such as “VERSE 1”, “BIG SOLO” or “D. IGLOO.”* Snapshot names are limited to 10 characters
_Global Settings > Preferences > Snapshot Edits_—Determines whether or not any edits made to a snapshot are remembered when returning to that snapshot. "Recall" automatically recalls any edits made to the snapshot; "Discard" forgets any edits made and returns the snapshot to its state when the preset was last saved. You must save the preset to store changes to snapshots regardless. The home screen’s camera icon turns red when set to “Discard.” Shortcut: *Hold BYPASS and press SAVE to toggle this setting*
_Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > Tempo Select_—In addition to Global and Per Preset (still the default), Helix’s tempo can now be set per snapshot. Shortcut: *Touch TAP to briefly view and set this parameter*
_Global Settings > Footswitches > Preset Mode Switches_—You can now determine whether each row in Preset footswitch mode (upper or lower) selects Presets, Snapshots, or Stomps. The default setting remains the same, but is now called “8 Presets”
_Global Settings > Footswitches > Snapshot Mode Footswitches_—A new Global Settings > Footswitches parameter lets you set Snapshot mode footswitches as Auto Return (automatically returns to Preset or Stomp footswitch mode after selection) or Manual Return (stays in Snapshot footswitch mode until you press FS6 [CANCEL])
_Global Settings > Footswitches > Up/Down Switches_—FS1 and FS7 now have three options: Bank Up/Down, Preset Up/Down, and Snapshot Up/Down, available from the Global Settings > Footswitches menu. Shortcut: *Press and hold FS1 and FS7 for one second to cycle through Bank Up/Down, Preset Up/Down, and Snapshot Up/Down*
_Global Settings > Ins/Outs > USB In 1/2 Trim_—Added the ability to attenuate the level of incoming USB 1/2 signals, so Mac/PC/iOS applications with no (or difficult-to-access) app-level volume control can be more easily blended with Helix’s processing
_Global Settings > Ins/Outs > Digital Out Level_—Added the ability to adjust the digital (S/PDIF and AES/EBU) output level
_Global Settings > EXP Pedals > EXP 1/2/3 Polarity_—Added the ability to individually switch the polarity of EXP 1, 2, and 3, providing support for a wider variety of third-party expression pedals
_Global Settings > EXP Pedals > EXP 1/2/3 Pedal Position_—Global Settings > Footswitches > EXP Pedal Position has been split into separate parameters for each expression pedal. For example, EXP 1’s wah position can be recalled per preset, EXP 2’s volume position can act globally, and EXP 3’s reverb depth control can be recalled per snapshot
_Controllers to Variax Parameters_—Controllers (including Snapshots) can now control/recall Variax parameters, so you can do cool stuff like toggle between two guitar models with a footswitch, control Variax’s tone knob with an expression pedal, assign a momentary footswitch to drop D, recall completely different tunings with each snapshot, and more. There’s nothing special to do; *just assign a controller to Variax parameters like you would any other parameter*
_Per Preset Guitar In Impedance_—Global Settings > Ins/Outs > Guitar In Impedance has been moved to the Input > Multi and Input > Guitar In block and is now recalled per preset. It appears at Knob 4 as “Guitar In-Z.” Now that it’s on the Home page, you can assign a footswitch or snapshot to it and determine how your guitar’s pickups are loaded in real time. The default has been changed to “Auto.”
_Enhanced Tuner Display_—The tuner display now shows an additional –3-cent to +3-cent row of bars, providing more granularity when the note played is close to being in tune. Accuracy remains the same
_MIDI Recall Indicator_—*Press PRESETS to open the Setlist menu. *Dark text appears above Knob 2 and displays the necessary MIDI messages required to remotely recall the current setlist, preset, and snapshot so you don’t have to go digging through the manual


----------



## jbealsmusic

*Other Improvements*

Shortcut: *Hold BYPASS and press a parameter knob to quickly remove any controller assignment (including the Snapshots controller)*. The value appears without brackets, indicating no controller is assigned to it
Shortcut: In Pedal Edit mode, *press and hold FS10 (VALUE–) and FS11 (VALUE+) to quickly scroll through values*. Now Helix Rack/Control users can quickly adjust parameters with their feet when no expression pedal is connected
Shortcut: In Pedal Edit mode, *press and hold a Time (or Speed) parameter switch to toggle between ms (or Hz) and note values, just like pressing the knob*
Helix’s pitch detect algorithms have been optimized and now track slightly faster
Parameters in the Global Settings menu have been reorganized to better reflect their category. For example, Tap Tempo Pitch has been moved to a new Preferences submenu and the Info submenu has been removed, as the current FW version now appears at the top of the Global Settings screen
On the Save, Name, and Customize screens, Knob 3 (Clear) has been replaced with Insert, which inserts a space and shifts all following characters to the right. You can still clear a character by pressing the joystick, which now cycles through A, a, 0, and [SPACE]
The Footswitch Assign page has been renamed “Bypass Assign” to better describe current and potential future functionality
*Touch-hold any assigned stomp footswitch and the Customize button now also appears above Knob 5.* The Customize button is grayed out if the footswitch has nothing yet assigned to it
On the Customize screens, Knob 4 now always displays a Remove button, regardless of whether a custom label has been assigned (solid button) or not (grayed out button)
When touching two stomp mode switches to swap their locations, the inspector text now tells you which two footswitches will be swapped
Recall snapshots remotely via an incoming MIDI CC message. A CC69 message with value 0 recalls Snapshot 1, value 1 recalls Snapshot 2, value 2 recalls Snapshot 3, and so forth
Footswitches in Looper mode now transmit corresponding MIDI CCs
Additions to and improvements made to the existing factory preset bundle
Re-leveled presets
The _Helix Owner’s Manual_ has been updated to 2.0
*Bug Fixes*

Parameters could respond sluggishly when receiving lots of fast incoming MIDI CC data _- FIXED_
Some MIDI keyboards (including those by Roland and M-Audio) send active sensing messages every 300ms, which could sometimes affect Helix’s MIDI input to the computer, causing intermittent dropouts _- FIXED_
Certain cab model defaults with 121 Ribbon mic could display as 421 Dynamic - _FIXED_
Rapidly moving EXP 1/2/3 while importing/exporting presets could result in data lockout - _FIXED_
Command Center > Copy/Paste All Commands would not copy customized labels - _FIXED_
Learn Controller would not work with FS1 or FS7 while in 10 Switches Stomp mode - _FIXED_
Helix wouldn’t remember tuner output routing across power cycles_ - FIXED_
After a factory reset, Global Settings > Ins/Outs > XLR Out Level would be set to Mic level until toggled, regardless of its displayed value - _FIXED_
Certain delay models’ Time parameter could only go down to 20ms, even if the display reflected a lower value_ - FIXED_
The TAP footswitch’s LED would reflect Global tempo instead of Per Preset tempo_ - FIXED_
General stability improvements
Other minor bug fixes and optimizations
*Known Issues*

In rare cases, snapshot-enabled parameter values may appear out of range; this doesn’t affect audio, only visual feedback of the value. If this happens, *turn the knob slightly to reset the displayed value and resave*


----------



## tomsy49

jbealsmusic said:


> *Other Improvements*
> 
> Shortcut: *Hold BYPASS and press a parameter knob to quickly remove any controller assignment (including the Snapshots controller)*. The value appears without brackets, indicating no controller is assigned to it
> Shortcut: In Pedal Edit mode, *press and hold FS10 (VALUE–) and FS11 (VALUE+) to quickly scroll through values*. Now Helix Rack/Control users can quickly adjust parameters with their feet when no expression pedal is connected
> Shortcut: In Pedal Edit mode, *press and hold a Time (or Speed) parameter switch to toggle between ms (or Hz) and note values, just like pressing the knob*
> Helix’s pitch detect algorithms have been optimized and now track slightly faster
> Parameters in the Global Settings menu have been reorganized to better reflect their category. For example, Tap Tempo Pitch has been moved to a new Preferences submenu and the Info submenu has been removed, as the current FW version now appears at the top of the Global Settings screen
> On the Save, Name, and Customize screens, Knob 3 (Clear) has been replaced with Insert, which inserts a space and shifts all following characters to the right. You can still clear a character by pressing the joystick, which now cycles through A, a, 0, and [SPACE]
> The Footswitch Assign page has been renamed “Bypass Assign” to better describe current and potential future functionality
> *Touch-hold any assigned stomp footswitch and the Customize button now also appears above Knob 5.* The Customize button is grayed out if the footswitch has nothing yet assigned to it
> On the Customize screens, Knob 4 now always displays a Remove button, regardless of whether a custom label has been assigned (solid button) or not (grayed out button)
> When touching two stomp mode switches to swap their locations, the inspector text now tells you which two footswitches will be swapped
> Recall snapshots remotely via an incoming MIDI CC message. A CC69 message with value 0 recalls Snapshot 1, value 1 recalls Snapshot 2, value 2 recalls Snapshot 3, and so forth
> Footswitches in Looper mode now transmit corresponding MIDI CCs
> Additions to and improvements made to the existing factory preset bundle
> Re-leveled presets
> The _Helix Owner’s Manual_ has been updated to 2.0
> *Bug Fixes*
> 
> Parameters could respond sluggishly when receiving lots of fast incoming MIDI CC data _- FIXED_
> Some MIDI keyboards (including those by Roland and M-Audio) send active sensing messages every 300ms, which could sometimes affect Helix’s MIDI input to the computer, causing intermittent dropouts _- FIXED_
> Certain cab model defaults with 121 Ribbon mic could display as 421 Dynamic - _FIXED_
> Rapidly moving EXP 1/2/3 while importing/exporting presets could result in data lockout - _FIXED_
> Command Center > Copy/Paste All Commands would not copy customized labels - _FIXED_
> Learn Controller would not work with FS1 or FS7 while in 10 Switches Stomp mode - _FIXED_
> Helix wouldn’t remember tuner output routing across power cycles_ - FIXED_
> After a factory reset, Global Settings > Ins/Outs > XLR Out Level would be set to Mic level until toggled, regardless of its displayed value - _FIXED_
> Certain delay models’ Time parameter could only go down to 20ms, even if the display reflected a lower value_ - FIXED_
> The TAP footswitch’s LED would reflect Global tempo instead of Per Preset tempo_ - FIXED_
> General stability improvements
> Other minor bug fixes and optimizations
> *Known Issues*
> 
> In rare cases, snapshot-enabled parameter values may appear out of range; this doesn’t affect audio, only visual feedback of the value. If this happens, *turn the knob slightly to reset the displayed value and resave*


After flipping so many Amps and pedals I'm seriously considering a Helix. What are your opinions on the Amps and effects, as well as the ease of creating a great sounding tone?? What do you use it with to play out loud?


----------



## jbealsmusic

tomsy49 said:


> After flipping so many Amps and pedals I'm seriously considering a Helix. What are your opinions on the Amps and effects, as well as the ease of creating a great sounding tone?? What do you use it with to play out loud?


I flipped gear (especially pedals) ALL the time prior to going digital.

I've been using modelers direct for about a decade. You just can't beat the convenience IMO. The modeling in Helix seems to be on par (or close enough to it that it doesn't really matter) with the big boys (Kemper/Fractal). It is certainly better than any L6 product I've previously owned, and much better than my RP1000 (which I've used for several years).

Once you get the hang of the basics, it is really easy to create usable tones. It is easy to get the hang of too because the UI is probably the best in the business. When you get into the more advanced features and routing, it is unbeatable for its versatility and simplicity.

I go direct and use a powered PA for self-monitoring and jamming.

All that said, it is a different animal than a few pedals and an amp. It "feels" different than playing with an amp in the room. Even after using and preferring modelers for years, I can still "feel" a clear difference compared to when playing through a tube amp sitting next to me. If I had to guess, it is partly psychological and partly the difference between how a traditional cabinet interacts with the room compared to a FRFR system. Unfortunately for some guys, they never get over that feeling.

And no, I'm not a shill for Line 6. I am not endorsed by them and have never worked in a store that sold their gear. In fact, I've been pretty critical of them for a long time. A lot of their products have fallen short for me. Helix is the first piece of gear from them that I'm legitimately impressed with (considering the recent updates especially).


----------



## Man0warrioR

Noob alert! I am probably getting one but I love playing through my pedalboard and Blues Jr. The board got big and i have always struggled with weight and also, lack of space for modulation. In addition, my apt really wont allow me to mic my amp hence I cant record my pedalboard really. Please help me understand:

1. Any idea how it'd be to use a amp cab block and still use a tube amp? I keep my amp sound really clean
2. I have KRK Rokit 5s; would I get a good output or do i need to get something better ? Some buddies use tech 21 power engine etc.

Any advice is appreciated.


----------



## hollowbody

Man0warrioR said:


> Noob alert! I am probably getting one but I love playing through my pedalboard and Blues Jr. The board got big and i have always struggled with weight and also, lack of space for modulation. In addition, my apt really wont allow me to mic my amp hence I cant record my pedalboard really. Please help me understand:
> 
> 1. Any idea how it'd be to use a amp cab block and still use a tube amp? I keep my amp sound really clean
> 2. I have KRK Rokit 5s; would I get a good output or do i need to get something better ? Some buddies use tech 21 power engine etc.
> 
> Any advice is appreciated.


Your KRKs are fine. I use Fostex PM0.3s, with a tiny 3" driver and it sounds great. Loses some bass, but we're talking electric guitar here, so there's not much going on below 80 hz anyway.

You'd have to disable any cab modeling on the Helix if you're planning on running it into the BJ. You may also have to bypass amp modeling. At that point, you're basically just running effects, which may make it a bit expensive for that intended usage. However, in your situation, I would be much more likely to run the amps and cabs on the Helix and plug the Helix directly into the DAW. It will likely sound much better that way, too.

If you're micing up your BJ, everything is going to sound like it's being recorded through a 1x12 with the same mic. Why not let the Helix do its thing, choose the amp you want that best suits they sound you're going for, test out a few different mic models and go with what sounds best? Honestly, you'll find yourself using the Helix more and the BJ less. I haven't fired-up my DRRI in almost a month.


----------



## hollowbody

Also, there's ANOTHER new firmware out just last week.

*New Amp Models*

- *Archetype Clean*, based on* the clean channel of the Paul Reed Smith® Archon®

- *Archetype Lead*, based on* the lead channel of the Paul Reed Smith® Archon®

- *Line 6 Litigator*, new Line 6 Original inspired by boutique mid-gain amps



*New Effects Models*

- Distortion > *Stupor OD* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the BOSS® SD-1 Overdrive

- Delay > *Pitch Echo* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original

The Litigator is a Dumble model and sounds incredible. I immediately dropped it into where I was previously using things like the Bassman/Twin. Also, while I had no experience with the PRS Archon previous to the model included in this firmware, the Archetype amp sounds phenomenal. The Clean is very, very usable with a TON of headroom and the lead is hot-rod Marshall heaven! Wowy Zowie.


----------



## Man0warrioR

awesome! thanks so much! I have a Whammy DT which has a momentary switch I like to use a lot. Helix wont cover it, but I guess I'd have to take it out of my templeboard (which is a pain) and use it as an external pedal with the helix.


----------



## jbealsmusic

hollowbody said:


> Also, there's ANOTHER new firmware out just last week.
> 
> *New Amp Models*
> 
> - *Archetype Clean*, based on* the clean channel of the Paul Reed Smith® Archon®
> 
> - *Archetype Lead*, based on* the lead channel of the Paul Reed Smith® Archon®
> 
> - *Line 6 Litigator*, new Line 6 Original inspired by boutique mid-gain amps
> 
> 
> 
> *New Effects Models*
> 
> - Distortion > *Stupor OD* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the BOSS® SD-1 Overdrive
> 
> - Delay > *Pitch Echo* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
> 
> The Litigator is a Dumble model and sounds incredible. I immediately dropped it into where I was previously using things like the Bassman/Twin. Also, while I had no experience with the PRS Archon previous to the model included in this firmware, the Archetype amp sounds phenomenal. The Clean is very, very usable with a TON of headroom and the lead is hot-rod Marshall heaven! Wowy Zowie.


I have been rocking that Archon model with some mesa IRs. Sounds killer!


----------



## jbealsmusic

That Litigator model too. It is the dream classic rock tone for me. I really think L6 are outdoing themselves with Helix. I have never been happier with a single piece of gear.


----------



## hollowbody

jbealsmusic said:


> I have been rocking that Archon model with some mesa IRs. Sounds killer!


I've been using mine with the Friedman 4x12 IR from 3 Sigma. Loving the sounds I'm getting out of this. Spent some time last night tweaking some presets where I was previously using the Bogner Shiva/Uber for my lead sounds and replacing them with the Archon. Honestly, with a clean and lead Archon, you can go a loooong way. I'm thinking of creating a master-preset for my base tone that uses EXP1 to increase gain and decrease channel volume so I can use the clean Archon and switch to a dirty sound and adjust the level of dirt to taste based on the song.



jbealsmusic said:


> That Litigator model too. It is the dream classic rock tone for me. I really think L6 are outdoing themselves with Helix. I have never been happier with a single piece of gear.


I agree. I'm still well within the honeymoon phase of my Helix ownership, but in the last two months, I've received some compliments on my tone from sound techs who were also very happy to not deal with stage volume, I've enjoyed dealing with app-based effects/setlist editing (which is a dream come true for me) and I've seen L6 come out with a major update just a few months after their last major update. 

The one thing I was a little iffy on when it came to modelers was L6's ability/desire to continuously update their software. I figured Fractal had the edge here, but L6 has really shown a willingness to improve their product and I couldn't be happier!


----------



## hollowbody

double post


----------



## Man0warrioR

I got it this weekend and it has been hard to balance...life!

I love the editor so much that I'd probably not be able to edit in the unit itself 

Question below (plz pardon my ignorance):

1. Anyone reamping via cubase? I'd love to talk/pm about the routing. I am doing something wrong but dont know what.
2. Output advice needed. I am using helix as an audio interface with my KRKs. Basically the two quarter inch from helix to my monitors. I also have a scarlett 2i2 (not in use right now). Any advice on other routing options with these gears to get the best sound?

Thanks


----------



## Man0warrioR

btw, it cost me 2200 + CAD including tax at L&M! The one time I am disappointed for not being in the US.


----------



## Steadfastly

Man0warrioR said:


> btw, it cost me 2200 + CAD including tax at L&M! The one time I am disappointed for not being in the US.


You could have driven to Buffalo and got it for $1725.00 CDN + HST. Maybe I shouldn't be telling you that you could have saved $500.00 now that it is too late.


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## vadsy

Steadfastly said:


> You could have driven to Buffalo and got it for $1725.00 CDN + HST. Maybe I shouldn't be telling you that you could have saved $500.00 now that it is too late.


...but you just can't help yourself,... because you're such a 'nice' and 'helpful' guy 

pat yourself on the back, Steadly, you're awesome


----------



## hollowbody

Steadfastly said:


> You could have driven to Buffalo and got it for $1725.00 CDN + HST. Maybe I shouldn't be telling you that you could have saved $500.00 now that it is too late.





vadsy said:


> ...but you just can't help yourself,... because you're such a 'nice' and 'helpful' guy
> 
> pat yourself on the back, Steadly, you're awesome


lol. 











Man0warrioR said:


> I got it this weekend and it has been hard to balance...life!
> 
> I love the editor so much that I'd probably not be able to edit in the unit itself
> 
> Question below (plz pardon my ignorance):
> 
> 1. Anyone reamping via cubase? I'd love to talk/pm about the routing. I am doing something wrong but dont know what.
> 2. Output advice needed. I am using helix as an audio interface with my KRKs. Basically the two quarter inch from helix to my monitors. I also have a scarlett 2i2 (not in use right now). Any advice on other routing options with these gears to get the best sound?
> 
> Thanks


try both methods and see what you like best. I'm running XLRs into my Presonus Audiobox 22VSL because I like the preamps. Sounds pretty good to me.

Things I've found useful are to adjust the low and high filters on the cabs. The high is less important, but will reduce hiss, the low, though, is hugely important. Without EQing, the presets have WAY too much low end for me. This isn't as noticeable on headphones or small monitors, but into large PA cabs, you'll definitely realize that you have too much low end. I filter out anything below 120hz and anything above 6khz on the cabs.

Also, I disable the volume knob for the XLR outs. This allows me to run XLR to the board/interface at a steady signal that won't change and mess up the mix, but allows me to control the 1/4" outs in case I want to turn myself up in the monitor, if I'm running one. I also set the XLR outs to Mic, not Line. I feel like this sounds better.


----------



## Man0warrioR

Thanks a lot hollowbody. Will do.


----------



## hollowbody

Hey everyone, Helix 2.20 is out as of yesterday. Mostly new bass stuff this time around, but a few neat features that I'm interested in, too - namely the 4OSC, reduced DSP usage for reverbs and the autoswell feature.

*New Amps (6)*

*Line 6 Badonk*, all new Line 6 original inspired by the original high gain Big Bottom model
*Woody Blue*, based on* the Acoustic® 360 bass amp
*Del Sol 300*, based on* the Sunn® Coliseum 300 bass amp
*Busy One Ch1*, based on* channel 1 of the Pearce BC-1 bass preamp
*Busy One Ch2*, based on* channel 2 of the Pearce BC-1 bass preamp
*Busy One Jump*, based on* channel 1 and 2 (jumped) of the Pearce BC-1 bass preamp
*New Hybrid Cabs (7)*

*1x12 Cali IV*, based on* the MESA/Boogie® Mk IV 12” cab
*1x12 Cali EXT*, based on* the MESA/Boogie® 12” extension cab (EVM12L speaker)
*2x12 Match H30*, based on* the Matchless® DC-30 cab (12” G12H30 speaker)
*2x12 Match G25*, based on* the Matchless® DC-30 cab (12” Greenback 25 speaker)
*1x12 Del Sol*, based on* the Sunn® Coliseum 300 bass cab (12” speaker)
*1x18 Del Sol*, based on* the Sunn® Coliseum 300 bass cab (18” speaker)
*1x18 Woody Blue*, based on* the Acoustic® 360 18” bass cab
*New Effects (9)*

Distortion > *Obsidian 7000* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the Darkglass Electronics® Microtubes B7K Ultra bass preamp/overdrive/EQ
Distortion > *Clawthorn Drive* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the Wounded Paw Battering Ram bass overdrive
Dynamics > *3-Band Comp* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original multiband compressor
Dynamics > *Autoswell* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
Modulation > *PlastiChorus* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the modded Arion SCH-Z chorus
Delay > *Vintage Swell* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
Delay > *Adriatic Swell* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
Pitch/Synth > *3 Note Generator* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
Pitch/Synth > *4 OSC Generator* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
*NOTE: As 3 Note Generator and 4 OSC Generator make sound without any instrument connected, their blocks are turned off by default. Press BYPASS to turn them on.*

_* All product names are trademarks of their respective owners, which are in no way associated or affiliated with Line 6._

*New Features*

_Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > Receive MIDI Clock_—Helix can now synchronize its time-based effects (such as delay and modulation) to incoming MIDI clock from external DAW software, drum machines, keyboard workstations, or other modelers. *Select “Off” (Helix ignores MIDI clock), “MIDI” (Helix responds to clock received at its MIDI IN jack), “USB” (Helix responds to clock received via USB), or “Auto” (Helix uses its internal tempo generator until receiving clock from either MIDI or USB)*
_Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > Send MIDI Clock_—Helix can now transmit MIDI clock to synchronize the tempo of external pedals, rack gear, and software. *Select “Off” (Helix does not transmit clock), “MIDI” (Helix transmits clock from only the MIDI OUT jack), “USB” (Helix transmits clock only via USB), or “MIDI+USB” (Helix transmits clock from both MIDI and USB)*
_Variax Workbench HD Support_—Variax can now communicate directly with Variax Workbench HD software (Mac/PC) through Helix via USB. _*IMPORTANT! Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > MIDI over USB must be set to “On.”*_
_In addition, you MUST update Variax Workbench HD to version 2.13, available here: Mac: http://line6.com/sof...a.html?rid=7403 or Windows: http://line6.com/sof...a.html?rid=7402_
_Windows users MUST also download the Helix USB driver, version 1.85, available here: https://line6.com/so...a.html?rid=7381_
*IMPORTANT! Variax Workbench uses MIDI channel 16. When connecting to Variax Workbench via Helix’s USB port, do not assign Helix or any of Helix’s Command Center messages to MIDI channel 16 or Omni (which includes channel 16).*


Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > MIDI PC Send/Receive has been split into two separate parameters—MIDI PC Receive and MIDI PC Send—and moved to Page 2. In addition, you may choose whether Helix sends or receives MIDI PC (program change) messages to/from MIDI, USB, both, or neither
_Clear Bypass Assignment_—Individual blocks’ bypass assignments can now be cleared. *From the Bypass Assign screen, select the block whose bypass assignment(s) you wish to clear. Press ACTION and then Knob 1 (Clear Assignments).*
_Line 6 Allure Pack IRs_—Line 6 has created a pack of five user impulse responses for use with Helix or any other modeler or software that supports them. Download the free Allure Pack here: www.line6.com/allure
*Improvements/Changes*

Optimized GUI engine speeds up navigation and model selection
Receive MIDI Clock and Send MIDI Clock have also been added to the Tempo panel shortcut. *At any time, touch TAP to open the Tempo panel.*
When slaved to external MIDI clock, TAP’s scribble strip text grays out and its switch LED ring flashes blue
Reverb > Plate, Room, Chamber, Hall, Echo, Tile, Cave, Ducking, and Octo have all been optimized to be less DSP-intensive
Pitch > Pitch Wham, Twin Harmony, Simple Pitch, Dual Pitch, and 3 OSC Synth have all been optimized to be less DSP-intensive
Non-selected Pedal Edit parameter switches now reflect dim block color
Inactive Looper function switches now appear as dim white
Additions to and improvements made to the existing factory preset bundle
*Bug Fixes*

In very rare cases, corrupted presets containing a Volume/Pan > Volume Pedal block can cause volume to drop to 0% _- FIXED_
Certain Roland keyboards constantly spit out active sensing MIDI messages (with no way to disable them), which could affect Helix’s MIDI transmission - _FIXED_
The Channel Volume taper for the Archetype amp model was incorrect _- FIXED_
Many other minor bug fixes and optimizations
*Known Issues*

If a Variax guitar is connected to Helix, MIDI channel 16 should never be used, as channel 16 is how Variax Workbench communicates with the guitar. This is by design. On a related note, Variax Workbench should never be used while MIDI tracks are armed or playing back in your DAW
In rare cases, Helix may freeze when very rapidly changing presets while receiving MIDI clock
Helix’s blue TAP LED flashes but tempo is not actually synced unless an audio device is selected in Ableton Live
Subtle stepping may be heard when adjusting the main VOLUME knob while audio is present
If a user fails to read and follow the update instructions, Helix will engage Snapshot 2 in preset 8 Templates > 32D every day at 4:30 AM


----------



## jbealsmusic

hollowbody said:


> Hey everyone, Helix 2.20 is out as of yesterday. Mostly new bass stuff this time around, but a few neat features that I'm interested in, too - namely the 4OSC, reduced DSP usage for reverbs and the autoswell feature.
> 
> *New Amps (6)*
> 
> *Line 6 Badonk*, all new Line 6 original inspired by the original high gain Big Bottom model
> *Woody Blue*, based on* the Acoustic® 360 bass amp
> *Del Sol 300*, based on* the Sunn® Coliseum 300 bass amp
> *Busy One Ch1*, based on* channel 1 of the Pearce BC-1 bass preamp
> *Busy One Ch2*, based on* channel 2 of the Pearce BC-1 bass preamp
> *Busy One Jump*, based on* channel 1 and 2 (jumped) of the Pearce BC-1 bass preamp
> *New Hybrid Cabs (7)*
> 
> *1x12 Cali IV*, based on* the MESA/Boogie® Mk IV 12” cab
> *1x12 Cali EXT*, based on* the MESA/Boogie® 12” extension cab (EVM12L speaker)
> *2x12 Match H30*, based on* the Matchless® DC-30 cab (12” G12H30 speaker)
> *2x12 Match G25*, based on* the Matchless® DC-30 cab (12” Greenback 25 speaker)
> *1x12 Del Sol*, based on* the Sunn® Coliseum 300 bass cab (12” speaker)
> *1x18 Del Sol*, based on* the Sunn® Coliseum 300 bass cab (18” speaker)
> *1x18 Woody Blue*, based on* the Acoustic® 360 18” bass cab
> *New Effects (9)*
> 
> Distortion > *Obsidian 7000* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the Darkglass Electronics® Microtubes B7K Ultra bass preamp/overdrive/EQ
> Distortion > *Clawthorn Drive* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the Wounded Paw Battering Ram bass overdrive
> Dynamics > *3-Band Comp* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original multiband compressor
> Dynamics > *Autoswell* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
> Modulation > *PlastiChorus* (Mono, Stereo), based on* the modded Arion SCH-Z chorus
> Delay > *Vintage Swell* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
> Delay > *Adriatic Swell* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
> Pitch/Synth > *3 Note Generator* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
> Pitch/Synth > *4 OSC Generator* (Mono, Stereo), Line 6 Original
> *NOTE: As 3 Note Generator and 4 OSC Generator make sound without any instrument connected, their blocks are turned off by default. Press BYPASS to turn them on.*
> 
> _* All product names are trademarks of their respective owners, which are in no way associated or affiliated with Line 6._
> 
> *New Features*
> 
> _Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > Receive MIDI Clock_—Helix can now synchronize its time-based effects (such as delay and modulation) to incoming MIDI clock from external DAW software, drum machines, keyboard workstations, or other modelers. *Select “Off” (Helix ignores MIDI clock), “MIDI” (Helix responds to clock received at its MIDI IN jack), “USB” (Helix responds to clock received via USB), or “Auto” (Helix uses its internal tempo generator until receiving clock from either MIDI or USB)*
> _Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > Send MIDI Clock_—Helix can now transmit MIDI clock to synchronize the tempo of external pedals, rack gear, and software. *Select “Off” (Helix does not transmit clock), “MIDI” (Helix transmits clock from only the MIDI OUT jack), “USB” (Helix transmits clock only via USB), or “MIDI+USB” (Helix transmits clock from both MIDI and USB)*
> _Variax Workbench HD Support_—Variax can now communicate directly with Variax Workbench HD software (Mac/PC) through Helix via USB. _*IMPORTANT! Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > MIDI over USB must be set to “On.”*_
> _In addition, you MUST update Variax Workbench HD to version 2.13, available here: Mac: http://line6.com/sof...a.html?rid=7403 or Windows: http://line6.com/sof...a.html?rid=7402_
> _Windows users MUST also download the Helix USB driver, version 1.85, available here: https://line6.com/so...a.html?rid=7381_
> *IMPORTANT! Variax Workbench uses MIDI channel 16. When connecting to Variax Workbench via Helix’s USB port, do not assign Helix or any of Helix’s Command Center messages to MIDI channel 16 or Omni (which includes channel 16).*
> 
> 
> Global Settings > MIDI/Tempo > MIDI PC Send/Receive has been split into two separate parameters—MIDI PC Receive and MIDI PC Send—and moved to Page 2. In addition, you may choose whether Helix sends or receives MIDI PC (program change) messages to/from MIDI, USB, both, or neither
> _Clear Bypass Assignment_—Individual blocks’ bypass assignments can now be cleared. *From the Bypass Assign screen, select the block whose bypass assignment(s) you wish to clear. Press ACTION and then Knob 1 (Clear Assignments).*
> _Line 6 Allure Pack IRs_—Line 6 has created a pack of five user impulse responses for use with Helix or any other modeler or software that supports them. Download the free Allure Pack here: www.line6.com/allure
> *Improvements/Changes*
> 
> Optimized GUI engine speeds up navigation and model selection
> Receive MIDI Clock and Send MIDI Clock have also been added to the Tempo panel shortcut. *At any time, touch TAP to open the Tempo panel.*
> When slaved to external MIDI clock, TAP’s scribble strip text grays out and its switch LED ring flashes blue
> Reverb > Plate, Room, Chamber, Hall, Echo, Tile, Cave, Ducking, and Octo have all been optimized to be less DSP-intensive
> Pitch > Pitch Wham, Twin Harmony, Simple Pitch, Dual Pitch, and 3 OSC Synth have all been optimized to be less DSP-intensive
> Non-selected Pedal Edit parameter switches now reflect dim block color
> Inactive Looper function switches now appear as dim white
> Additions to and improvements made to the existing factory preset bundle
> *Bug Fixes*
> 
> In very rare cases, corrupted presets containing a Volume/Pan > Volume Pedal block can cause volume to drop to 0% _- FIXED_
> Certain Roland keyboards constantly spit out active sensing MIDI messages (with no way to disable them), which could affect Helix’s MIDI transmission - _FIXED_
> The Channel Volume taper for the Archetype amp model was incorrect _- FIXED_
> Many other minor bug fixes and optimizations
> *Known Issues*
> 
> If a Variax guitar is connected to Helix, MIDI channel 16 should never be used, as channel 16 is how Variax Workbench communicates with the guitar. This is by design. On a related note, Variax Workbench should never be used while MIDI tracks are armed or playing back in your DAW
> In rare cases, Helix may freeze when very rapidly changing presets while receiving MIDI clock
> Helix’s blue TAP LED flashes but tempo is not actually synced unless an audio device is selected in Ableton Live
> Subtle stepping may be heard when adjusting the main VOLUME knob while audio is present
> If a user fails to read and follow the update instructions, Helix will engage Snapshot 2 in preset 8 Templates > 32D every day at 4:30 AM


Awesome that they keep the free updates coming. I'll have to check out the new amp models and that IR pack when I get a chance to run the update.


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## jdto

I need to fix my computer. I think I'd get even more out of my Helix if I did. That said, I'm still enjoying it.


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## 1SweetRide

Was looking at Line 6 products and liked the specs of the Helix but was turned off when I saw the last app update for the still current Firehawk was over a year ago. Bought a GT-100 but will keep my eye on the Helix.


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## hollowbody

1SweetRide said:


> Was looking at Line 6 products and liked the specs of the Helix but was turned off when I saw the last app update for the still current Firehawk was over a year ago. Bought a GT-100 but will keep my eye on the Helix.


The Helix is where the majority of the R&D at Line 6 is going right now. They've been issuing updates for the Helix very regularly. I think there's been 4 updates in the last 8 or 9 months and 2 of them were major updates with a LOT of new stuff. I'm sure they'll eventually trickle-down stuff to the Firehawk, but that's just how it goes. The flagship model gets all the goodies and they eventually funnel parts of that tech to the products on the lower rungs. The Firehawk was meant to be the next step to the POD and HD series. It was never going to rival the Helix, so you can't expect to be receiving Helix-level goodies on that device.


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## tomsy49

What was initially thought of as an elaborate April Fool's joke turned into a real thing! For anyone that needs a little less physical flexibility Line 6 has released the Helix LT. Released on April 1st. Still not cheap but very reasonable!

Line 6 Helix LT Guitar Multi-effects Processor


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## hollowbody

tomsy49 said:


> What was initially thought of as an elaborate April Fool's joke turned into a real thing! For anyone that needs a little less physical flexibility Line 6 has released the Helix LT. Released on April 1st. Still not cheap but very reasonable!
> 
> Line 6 Helix LT Guitar Multi-effects Processor


Yeah, that seems super neat! Perfect if you're itching to try a Helix but are balking at the price. Pretty much sacrificing some I/O. DSP horsepower, sounds, available effects, etc are all identical.


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## metallica86

Wow didnt expect this


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## 1SweetRide

hollowbody said:


> The Helix is where the majority of the R&D at Line 6 is going right now. They've been issuing updates for the Helix very regularly. I think there's been 4 updates in the last 8 or 9 months and 2 of them were major updates with a LOT of new stuff. I'm sure they'll eventually trickle-down stuff to the Firehawk, but that's just how it goes. The flagship model gets all the goodies and they eventually funnel parts of that tech to the products on the lower rungs. The Firehawk was meant to be the next step to the POD and HD series. It was never going to rival the Helix, so you can't expect to be receiving Helix-level goodies on that device.


They shouldn't have abandoned the Firehawk. It's still a current product but the lack of app updates in inexcusable. It's a bit like Ford saying, sorry, we've now got a 2017 Focus, we won't support the 2015 anymore. It's not like they're a small company.


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## pat6969

Long and Mcquade should have them stocked by Christmas this year!! Glad I have the big unit!! Go L6!!


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## 1SweetRide

I may have to try this new LT


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## hollowbody

1SweetRide said:


> They shouldn't have abandoned the Firehawk. It's still a current product but the lack of app updates in inexcusable. It's a bit like Ford saying, sorry, we've now got a 2017 Focus, we won't support the 2015 anymore. It's not like they're a small company.


Your analogy doesn't really work. I get what you're saying, but you're implying you can take your 2015 Ford to the factory and have your car's software updated. That's simply not true. Ford will support your car insofar as they'll repair any malfunctions, but so will Line 6. If your product stops working, they'll fix it under warranty or for a charge after the warranty's expiration.

Anyway, the Firehawk is the next generation of the Pod and the HD series. Neither of those received regular updates in the past - some software to support other products, some new sound packs, etc, but for the most part, what you bought is what you'll still have years from now. That's part of the product. It's not a scam. It's not Line 6 ripping anyone off. The product that is directly competing with Fractal and Kemper is the one that's going to receive all the updates because _those _products also get updated all the time. Line 6 hasn't abandoned the Firehawk so much as the product was never intended to receive constant updates.


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## tomsy49

pat6969 said:


> Long and Mcquade should have them stocked by Christmas this year!! Glad I have the big unit!! Go L6!!


Amen to that! I'm not sure why such a big chain store takes so long to get in products from a company they have sold for many years! I feel like they miss out on a lot of sales opportunity because people don't want to wait 6 months for a new product so they buy it out of country online


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## 1SweetRide

hollowbody said:


> Your analogy doesn't really work. I get what you're saying, but you're implying you can take your 2015 Ford to the factory and have your car's software updated. That's simply not true. Ford will support your car insofar as they'll repair any malfunctions, but so will Line 6. If your product stops working, they'll fix it under warranty or for a charge after the warranty's expiration.
> 
> Anyway, the Firehawk is the next generation of the Pod and the HD series. Neither of those received regular updates in the past - some software to support other products, some new sound packs, etc, but for the most part, what you bought is what you'll still have years from now. That's part of the product. It's not a scam. It's not Line 6 ripping anyone off. The product that is directly competing with Fractal and Kemper is the one that's going to receive all the updates because _those _products also get updated all the time. Line 6 hasn't abandoned the Firehawk so much as the product was never intended to receive constant updates.


I know it wasn't the perfect analogy but you have to admit that a year without updates in the mobile app world for a device that is dependent on the mobile app is too long. RIght? My point was I stopped considering that product and questioned the commitment of Yamaha/Line 6 when I saw how long the app had been left stale. I am very impressed with the LT though and would love to try one.


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## metallica86

tomsy49 said:


> Amen to that! I'm not sure why such a big chain store takes so long to get in products from a company they have sold for many years! I feel like they miss out on a lot of sales opportunity because people don't want to wait 6 months for a new product so they buy it out of country online


I don't think so, talked to Frank from TGP and Line6 already shipped 1st batch to Canada, L&M and Cosmo, they will have it by the end of the week, I put down my little deposit already


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## 1SweetRide

Lauzon Music here in Ottawa is advertising them as being available now.


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## hollowbody

1SweetRide said:


> I know it wasn't the perfect analogy but you have to admit that a year without updates in the mobile app world for a device that is dependent on the mobile app is too long. RIght? My point was I stopped considering that product and questioned the commitment of Yamaha/Line 6 when I saw how long the app had been left stale. I am very impressed with the LT though and would love to try one.


I totally agree that it's a long time, but if the product works how necessary is it? I mean, it still does everything you want it to, so the only thing that's lacking is all the new. fancy, bells-and-whistles amps and effects the Helix gets.

fwiw, I updated my Mackie DL1608's Master Fader app for the 1st time since I bought the thing almost two years ago! I hadn't even bothered to check for an update because the app worked fine and I was happy with using it. Turns out the new version has some new reverbs and also real-time frequency analysis which should make dialing-in the PA way easier! Neat update, but had I not found it, I would've been happy using the product regardless because it worked fine.


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## 1SweetRide

hollowbody said:


> I totally agree that it's a long time, but if the product works how necessary is it? I mean, it still does everything you want it to, so the only thing that's lacking is all the new. fancy, bells-and-whistles amps and effects the Helix gets.
> 
> fwiw, I updated my Mackie DL1608's Master Fader app for the 1st time since I bought the thing almost two years ago! I hadn't even bothered to check for an update because the app worked fine and I was happy with using it. Turns out the new version has some new reverbs and also real-time frequency analysis which should make dialing-in the PA way easier! Neat update, but had I not found it, I would've been happy using the product regardless because it worked fine.


Good points for sure.


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## jbealsmusic

Cool. Nice to see a "lite" option for those who don't need all the I/O's and other stuff in Helix. Smaller is better too because Helix is a beast size wise.


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## pat6969

jbealsmusic said:


> Cool. Nice to see a "lite" option for those who don't need all the I/O's and other stuff in Helix. Smaller is better too because Helix is a beast size wise.


It's pretty much the same footprint. I think maybe 1" shorter across. I'd definitely miss the scribble strips though.


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## jbealsmusic

pat6969 said:


> It's pretty much the same footprint. I think maybe 1" shorter across. I'd definitely miss the scribble strips though.


Oh. Well, that's less cool. I figured it would be smaller than that and I love the scribble strips. Oh well.


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## metallica86

pat6969 said:


> Not interested in waiting. I'm thinking of buying the Helix and then snagging the AX8 as well. Was just wondering if anyone has heard anything on when they're hitting the streets.


I put my order at noon today at my local store, when the sale guy put mine in system, showing i'm the 2e one in whole canada put the deposit, 1st is some guy from quebec
The warehouse of LM is in pickering so not far from my local store, only couple blocks away


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## Guest

They should have made it identical but just withheld software features so LT owners could upgrade to full Helix if they like the unit.

PS- Line 6 sucks.


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## High/Deaf

I'm glad I quit listening to uninformed internet opinion years ago. Or else I wouldn't own the L6 stuff I own, which works just fine and does it's job exactly as intended.

I suspect this is a secret the pros learned as well. I see lots of L6 stuff on their boards. But you have to understand how to use it correctly. Something many internet gurus apparently struggle with and the pros don't. Go figure.


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## pattste

Player99 said:


> They should have made it identical but just withheld software features so LT owners could upgrade to full Helix if they like the unit.


Unfortunately manufacturing costs would be identical for the two units so they couldn't really charge less for the LT (at least that's what the company is saying).


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## Guest

pattste said:


> Unfortunately manufacturing costs would be identical for the two units so they couldn't really charge less for the LT (at least that's what the company is saying).


$3 VS $3.15


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## 1SweetRide

Not really. The scribble strips probably cost that each and then there's the volumes being produced, etc. Steel is less expensive than aluminum too.


----------



## Steadfastly

High/Deaf said:


> I'm glad I quit listening to uninformed internet opinion years ago. Or else I wouldn't own the L6 stuff I own, which works just fine and does it's job exactly as intended.
> 
> I suspect this is a secret the pros learned as well. I see lots of L6 stuff on their boards. *But you have to understand how to use it correctly*. Something many internet gurus apparently struggle with and the pros don't. Go figure.


Exactly!


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## 1SweetRide

Steadfastly said:


> Exactly!


For sure, take a look at the Glenn Delaune videos up on YouTube.


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## hollowbody

Player99 said:


> They should have made it identical but just withheld software features so LT owners could upgrade to full Helix if they like the unit.
> 
> PS- Line 6 sucks.





1SweetRide said:


> Not really. The scribble strips probably cost that each and then there's the volumes being produced, etc. Steel is less expensive than aluminum too.


Not only that, but also all the I/O that is missing in the LT. The Aux input, XLR in, SPDIF in/out, EXP, etc. If all that was also included, along with the same chassis, etc. then there would be no discount at all.

That's a ridiculous idea, c'mon. The LT isn't right for me, but I think they did a good job of positioning a product in-between the entry-level modelers the the Helix/AxeFX/Kemper stuff. The only people who might be upset about this are those who bought the whole-hog Helix and really didn't need all the bells-and-whistles.


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## 1SweetRide

3 in stock now at Lauzon in Ottawa.


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## bzrkrage

Finally, 8 spots on the HX stomp & a “Pog”





Helix 3.0 Release Notes


The Helix 3.01 update addresses potential severely corrupted audio output. Due to this, we recommend updating your Helix family device as soon as possible. This issue may also be experienced on Helix Native; an update for Native will be available in the very near future. IMPORTANT! Click here for...



line6.com


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## jbealsmusic

FINALLY!! Helix Native gets a tuner! For sure, there's a lot of other cool stuff, but that's what I'm most excited about by far! Lol!


----------



## AJ6stringsting

Milkman said:


> Resale value is of no interest to me.
> 
> Opinions vary as to the tones.
> 
> In my opinion, if you can't get good tones from Line 6 modelers, the problem isn't gear related.
> 
> And, for what it's worth, I've never really needed tech support with my Pod. I just plug in and play.


Lots of people blame the gear for their lack of good tone ....it should be blamed on a lack of patients.


----------

