# Basic Recording System



## ampaholic (Sep 19, 2006)

Hi folks. I am looking for some advice on where to start with a basic recording system. I know this is a question similar to "what kind of guitar should I buy" with hundreds of different answers and opinions however I'm hoping that if I provide some info I might get some practical advice.
To begin with my band has just constructed a rehearsal studio. We are a 6 piece band and the room is small but more than adequate, plus we can leave gear set up which is very helpful. Our purpose in recording is basic, and that is to use as a tool for writing and refining original material. The finished product would be used only for demo purposes or perhaps to give to a studio in preparation for doing a more pro recording. That said, I would like to do a respectable job. Here is some more info:

- We have access to decent mics, some requiring phantom power.
- we have Macs and PC's at home but nothing we can dedicate to the studio.
- we are prepared to spend some money but don't have a huge budget. +\- $1,000
- we will record live off the floor mainly however it is not out of the question that we lay down rhythm tracks and add guitar/vocals after on some tunes.
- ease of use is critical. Nobody desires to make this a hobby and a steep learning curve would probably kill it.
- I have a functional Teac 4 track reel to reel that I've always imagined fitting in but not sure how! (Mics to mixer to Teac to PC?)
-on the surface a stand alone unit might seem the best alternative however I think we are the sort that will have better success with knobs and faders versus multi-function buttons.
Anyway, I know this is a tough question to answer however any advice would be appreciated.
Thanks!


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## 4345567 (Jun 26, 2008)

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## ampaholic (Sep 19, 2006)

nkjanssen said:


> The main question to answer first is... what is the maximum number of tracks you want to record at any one time? If you're recording a 6-piece band live off the floor, do you think you can get away with 8 simultaneous tracks?


I think 8 tracks would be more than adequate. If we really record live off the floor then we'll certainly get a lot of bleed through all of the mics which might mean that 2 or 3 carefully positioned mics might be adequate rather than trying to mic individually. (By the way, one of the 6 pieces is vocals only). This of course means that overdubs are not possible, which I think will be ok for most of our recording.
Having 8 tracks available for the odd occasion where we want to "build" something should be more than adequate.
Does that make sense?


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## 4345567 (Jun 26, 2008)

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## ampaholic (Sep 19, 2006)

So if a person was to shop for an easy to use, basic recording software what is the best bang for the buck out there?
We can probably piece together a computer.


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## 4345567 (Jun 26, 2008)

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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

I have one of these http://tascam.com/product/us-1641/ it's really versatile ..you can us it as a straight mixing board with out a computer as well 

Works great at home and I also record at a bar I jam in. At the bar I run everything into the computer then basically feed the house P.A. with monitor signal that I want..ie no bass or drums in that mix. Works great .. the bass player forgets that he is recording. The trick is to have a template for the mic setup made ahead of time so that you can save the last song, click in a new template and record another song without mush waiting.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

> So if a person was to shop for an easy to use, basic recording software what is the best bang for the buck out there?


http://www.reaper.fm/

you can download it, and its the full version, not a crippled demo.
then if you like it, you can purchase the license very affordably- $60
its also pretty easy to use ive found, as well as having a lot of flexibility.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

I also have the Tascam US1641 Shoretyus mentioned which I believe is now replaced by the Tascam US1800. I record our rehearsals using Reaper as mentioned by Fraser. I use up the 8 mic inputs (with the preamps) with 4 used by the drums (2 OH, 1 for the snare and 1 for the kick), 1 for vocals, 1 for guitar, 1 DI for the bass and 1 DI for the keys. As mentioned by shoretyus, the trick is to have a template of the mics ahead of time. I use the same template every rehearsal. So I just open it up, and let it run through out the rehearsal which usually runs from 2-3 hours.

Here's a tip. Instead of plugging in the Tascam to a USB port in the computer you are using, get a PCI or PCIe card with a USB port and use that to plug in the Tascam. Usually, the USB ports that you have in your computer shares the same bandwidth (480mbps). Having a separate USB port in a PCI card alleviates that. This way you don't get issues with latency. With your $1000, you can get the Tascam for $300+tax, $60 for Reaper and still would have enough to get some extra mics, cables, stands, etc.


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## ampaholic (Sep 19, 2006)

Wow! This is all superb info. The Tascam setup seems perfect for my needs. 
Am I correct that software like Reaper seems to be preferred over what comes with the interface?


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

ampaholic said:


> Wow! This is all superb info. The Tascam setup seems perfect for my needs.
> Am I correct that software like Reaper seems to be preferred over what comes with the interface?


It comes with Cubase LE which I didn't even bother to install as I was already using reaper then with the 2-channel M-Audio Audiophile PCI (2496).


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## Kenmac (Jan 24, 2007)

ampaholic said:


> Wow! This is all superb info. The Tascam setup seems perfect for my needs.
> Am I correct that software like Reaper seems to be preferred over what comes with the interface?


Yes, Reaper is definitely better but I also wanted to mention another free software program you can use. From what I've read it looks like you won't be using anything MIDI related or VST related so another option for recording your band would be Audacity which allows you to record up to 16 tracks at once and it's cross platform:
http://audacity.sourceforge.net/


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

> Am I correct that software like Reaper seems to be preferred over what comes with the interface?


usually what you get when buying equipment is a demo version-
i bought a midi keyboard and it came with a demo pro tools-
was never able to make it work on my pc.
one big reason i brought up reaper was it seems to work for just about everybody.


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## ampaholic (Sep 19, 2006)

Chito said:


> Here's a tip. Instead of plugging in the Tascam to a USB port in the computer you are using, get a PCI or PCIe card with a USB port and use that to plug in the Tascam.


A question about this...and this is when I show my computer illiteracy!

Seems as if PCI cards are typically installed inside a PC. Can I get one for a laptop? What should i budget for $?


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

ampaholic said:


> A question about this...and this is when I show my computer illiteracy!
> 
> Seems as if PCI cards are typically installed inside a PC. Can I get one for a laptop? What should i budget for $?


Check first if your pc has a slot for a PCI or PCIe card before buying the card. Newer PCs/Laptops don't have them anymore. It shouldn't cost you more than $50.


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## ampaholic (Sep 19, 2006)

So if the budget allowed for the purchase of a laptop dedicated to recording can a person get away with the basic $300 - $400 type?


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## jtienhaara (Dec 4, 2013)

Personally if I wanted to keep things simple, and avoid turning recording into a time-sucking hobby, I would get a decent mixer and a 2 track standalone unit (I have not used the Zoom H4N, but would like to), and just record everything in stereo.

In fact to keep things really simple, I would just hang the 2 track recorder from the ceiling, and skip the mixer and nice mics.

Mic placement is a pain in the arse, and the more time you spend sorting out phasing issues with the kick drum and bass getting picked up all over the room, the less time you have to lay down a really awesome take. 6 instruments is a lot, and in a small room without gating and side-chain compressing, you'll have serious challenges making any meaningful changes at the mixing stage. Then when you have multiple tracks to tweak in the digital domain, if you don't practice and get good at using compression and EQ in small doses, and learning which plugins sound good to your ears with your music, you might just end up making the mix sound worse by futzing with it.

So if you want simple, my advice is: keep it simple and record to 2 tracks live off the floor.

Here's an interesting thread on another forum about a guy who records live off the floor to mixer to 2 track tape:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/high-end/739536-high-end-gets-direct-2track.html

If you change your mind and want to turn recording into a time- and money-sucking hobby, then you'll have an absolute blast with it. Recording 6 instruments live off the floor would be a lot of fun. But you'll spend at least as much time on your new hobby as you do making music, and your band will have to spend more time too, doing mic tests and "pre-production". That's not a bad thing, it will feed into your music-making and change the way you play and hear, and it is a lot of fun (in a sort of nerdy way). But in my humble opinion, the moment you choose to go the multi-track route, you've chosen to commit to recording as a new hobby.

Whichever direction you head in, keep us posted on how it's working out. Cheers & good luck ampaholic,

Johann


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## 4345567 (Jun 26, 2008)

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## ampaholic (Sep 19, 2006)

Johann, that is very practical advice. Based upon my criteria I suspect you are correct, and knowing myself and bandmates I doubt any of us are prepared to spend the time needed with a more elaborate system.
Thanks!


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## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

Reaper is a great DAW for very little $$$, that explains its popularity. I just record myself into a standard laptop using the AKAI EIE pro, it has 4 XLR inputs and 4 digital outputs (so each input has its own track in Reaper). i5 processor, Toshiba Satellite pro laptop (nothing special) - Never any issues with latency for me. I'll be recording a demo during March Break with 3 mics only - I'll post some songs when I'm done. FWIW, Reaper has really good support and documentation to get you going. An afternoon spent reading and trying things out will get you far enough to record well. One thing I really like about the AKAI is the VU meters. I did see a tascam US-2000 with LED meters built in, for me that is a big plus.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

If you want to keep it simple, the Tascam products are easy to use, of good quality and receive good reviews. Here are a couple to ponder.

The DP-03 should be everything you need at around $300.00.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/multitrack-recorders/tascam-dp-03-digital-portastudio-sd-cd

[video=youtube;aQtYfJ8nKSc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQtYfJ8nKSc[/video]

OR.......a little simpler Tascam DR-100 MKII hand held recorder at around $230.00

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/portable-field-recorders/tascam-dr-100-mkii-portable-digital-recorder

[video=youtube;7rXzJxwNQ3s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rXzJxwNQ3s[/video]


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

Well, that's the route that I started with a few years ago. Didn't want to go through the trouble of setting up and stuff, so I ended up using Sony MS907 Stereo Mic connected to an iRiver FP795. Which I was happy with for a bit. Then thought the mic wasn't picking up the low frequencies, so I got an Audio Technica AT822 Stereo Mic. Then the Edirols came out and ended up getting a Roland R-09HR to replace the iRiver. And then I didn't get satisfied with that after a while as I start wanting to at least turn the levels up or down for each of us after recording to have a more balanced mix. Being the admitted gear head I am, see where this is headed. LOL That's when I started using the Tascam. Bought more mics, cables, stands, etc... This happened through a 5-year period. 

So yeah you could start with that route. There's a few of those recorders around made by Zoom, Sony, Olympus, Edirol., Tascam.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

I started trying to record with a 4 track cassette. With the digital why limit yourself. I bought my tacam used for $300 ..had mics etc etc.


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