# Is It Safe?



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

As society is acting like Covid is not a problem I am still keeping to my own and wearing n95 masks and gloves when I am out shopping.

This week 2 close friends came down with very bad cases of covid, both performed gigs a few days before. One of them is on his 4th time.

Statistics on long haul is the more times you get it the greater chance of getting long haul symptoms. 

The girl at the pet food store thought I was unusual for wearing protection but after talking she says she's had Covid 3 times. She says she's fine except now she has shortness of breath. My Internet installer guy said he's had it 2 times.

Now on the news they are warning about rising cases.

Keep safe and be careful.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)




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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Yeah, it's not being reported as much as it used to be but obviously it's still going and likely to increase in the fall/winter as these things usually do. I still wear a mask going into stores and such. Did some rehearsal space jams over the summer and got away with it but probably finished with that for this year. Lottsa open mics but I don't feel like being in a bar for a few hours anymore so probably done with that as well.


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## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

I'm still wearing my mask while driving so I don't give myself covid.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

You actually need distance, procedural mask and hand washing.
We used to say flu was transmitted by door knobs.

You cannot make a general rule from two or three anecdotal cases…

The problem is very few data analysis are published… and most is about nightmares and vaccine.
We do do not see much about after effects of vaccine or COVID.

The Brit published in The Lancet that the vaccine protects for four months and the Jews published that a dose of vaccine and COVID disease, whichever comes first, protects for as long as eight months.

So, with six months intervals, people were protected for four months and lived unprotected for two months !
Quebec just shortened vaccinal interval to five months… but continue to say one should be vaccinated three months after COVID.

A nephew is suffering from long COVID from first wave. My elderly mother had Omicron a month after her fourth vaccine dose and just got her fifth dose recently. It appears Omicron variant found our address last month…
I could go back to play golf after a week… We have been quite sick, but no shortness of breath and fully recovered by now.

They are now warning us about a new variant and an eighth wave : We would not have any good vaccine and the general protective measures remain mandatory, crossing fingers again !

The facts show the virus is now endemic and variants will appear here and there anyway.


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## Doug Gifford (Jun 8, 2019)

My wife is a teacher and the Ontario government policy on teachers seems to be "suck it up, we don't like you anyway."

On Saturday September 24, she tested positive. Next day our daughter had it. Next day me and finally the day after my son and mother-in-law. It's certainly contagious. Also, fairly unpleasant even if you don't get one of the special long cases etc. My sense of smell is still recovering.


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

Without sounding flippant about the whole thing, it never is going anywhere. The available options are vaccination and do nothing. You will get covid, much like one encounters the flu or common cold. I assume at one time the common cold was less common and more deadly than now but eventually the population is exposed and builds tolerance. 

There really isn't a flying fig of a thing a person can do in the long run to avoid these things. Sure one can marginally protect themselves, and is probably wise to do so, however in the end we all suffer the same fate.

Be blissfully ignorant of that which you cannot change and which you have no power over, thats my motto and so far its working out just fine. The best part is if it isnt, I dont know any better


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## RBlakeney (Mar 12, 2017)

My wife has had it since Friday, and pretty much hasn’t left bed. I don’t seem to have it yet, but that will probably change.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

I'm just getting over it now. Wife & I went to the states for a week in mid September, and we came home with it. We've had three vaccinations too, and managed to elude it this long.
She didn't have it bad, mine was a lot worse. I missed work for 2 weeks and lost 10lbs. I'm fairly healthy too, I'm not a slog.
The beast lives.

Good thing is, I finished a couple amps that had been laying around partially done all summer.


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

I'm hearing of people with the 4th jab getting Covid and are quite sick. Shits!


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

If I go into an L&M with 4 or 5 other dudes in the whole place, I don’t bother. If I go to Costco, I wear my N95. If someone thinks I’m weird for wearing it, who cares? It’s not like you can recognize me anyway.

And even _before_ covid, y’all were some disgusting MF’ers. Now, at least I can wear a mask and not get made fun of too much. 😆


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## Fred Gifford (Sep 2, 2019)

I'm honestly confused here, I thought the situation was under control but I watched a legitimate Medical Specialist (not the talking head on CP24) saying that due to continued, repeated, undetected infections we are doing pretty bad damage to our lungs, brains and something else, which in my advanced years I have forgotten. It sounded legit, so my concern was, A) other than daily testing how would you know if you have contracted the virus if you have no symptoms and B) if you do get the virus don't they just tell you to tough it out? I mean honestly it just seems as if there is no real solution .. vaccinations ? I've had two and have so far avoided the continual booster shots but do know someone in the Medical Profession with 4 shots so far who has contracted a bad case of the virus at present .. I see it as only two choices, I can say woe is me, there is no hope and jump into the river and drown, or live my life to the fullest each and every day, which is what I have chosen to do .. maybe not practical but I think If I'm going down I want to have FUN with the time I have left


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

Lincoln said:


> Like Mark Brown said above, we're all going to get it at some point. Good thing is, one you've had it, the chances are very good you won't get it again.


I am quadruple vaxxed and have had it twice since April. It is entirely possible to get it again.

My wife and I both had it a couple of weeks ago, and we are both still recovering. The fatigue has been the worst part.


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## leftysg (Mar 29, 2008)

Lincoln said:


> Like Mark Brown said above, we're all going to get it at some point. Good thing is, one you've had it, the chances are very good you won't get it again.
> 
> Unless of course you're the Prime Minister and you need to hide from the public whenever a crisis happens.


 The political spin is uncalled for.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I said it here before many times, I will continue to mask until such time as there are as many Covid cases reported as we'd be comfortable with if it was polio, measles, malaria, TB, pertusis, or anything else we get vaccinated for. The thing about communicable diseases is that, unless it is carried by mosquitoes or houseflies, one catches such diseases from others. And if hardly anyone has it, then one's odds of contracting it are slim unless you make a point of having close contact with those few persons. So far, though considerable reduction HAS happened, thanks to public health protocols, and immunization programs, we have NOT reached that no-one-to-catch-it-from point. We're getting closer, certainly, but we're not there yet.

Don't be a patient, and don't be a carrier.


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## tomee2 (Feb 27, 2017)

There are post infection treatments but they seem to be used only on serious cases in Canada. In the US if you have it and test positive and symptoms are bad you get the pills.


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## tomee2 (Feb 27, 2017)

Mark Brown said:


> Without sounding flippant about the whole thing, it never is going anywhere. The available options are vaccination and do nothing. You will get covid, much like one encounters the flu or common cold. I assume at one time the common cold was less common and more deadly than now but eventually the population is exposed and builds tolerance.
> 
> There really isn't a flying fig of a thing a person can do in the long run to avoid these things. Sure one can marginally protect themselves, and is probably wise to do so, however in the end we all suffer the same fate.
> 
> Be blissfully ignorant of that which you cannot change and which you have no power over, thats my motto and so far its working out just fine. The best part is if it isnt, I dont know any better


True, but also as a new disease kills the most vulnerable off the survivors are those with immune systems that are a better match for the new disease. Over time the virus appears less deadly, because all the people most susceptible to it died. 
At the same time it might mutate into a less harmful variant, but that is not guaranteed although I've read it seems to be what happens. If it does, then the best strategy is to try to not get it for as long as possible, which for me means masks and handwashing.


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## DavidP (Mar 7, 2006)

"Is it safe" -- NO!!! I've dodged the bullet so far but that has meant no gigs...


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## Doug Gifford (Jun 8, 2019)

tomee2 said:


> There are post infection treatments but they seem to be used only on serious cases in Canada. In the US if you have it and test positive and symptoms are bad you get the pills.


Our doctor prescribed these for my mother-in-law. Free with a prescription.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

50 years ago everyone who died in a car crash was NOT wearing a seat belt. Today, just about everybody who dies in a car crash IS wearing a seat belt. We don't dismiss seatbelts as not saving lives; we know they do. Seat belts, however, do not save ALL lives.

Masking is equally imperfect. I am the only one still diligent about masking at my work. I use a triple layer cloth mask that I find comfortable enough to use long term. Is it as good as an N95? Of course not! But I am the only one at my work without a covid infection. I am AZ x1, Moderna x3, and looking forward to the Pfizer bivalent next month. Will this be perfect? Of course not.

Right now my Father-in-law is in long-term care. His son refuses to be vaxxed or tested, so he is ineligible to visit. My wife, (fully vaxxed and boosted), visits twice a day, for lunch and supper, and is tested at the LTC home 3x/week. This is reduced from daily as of a few weeks ago. If my wife tests positive.... then no visitors for Father-in-law. So I continue to stay current with vaccines, I continue to mask indoors in public, and I continue to limit my exposure to others. I had three Turkey Day meal offers yesterday.... declined them all. 

I know what my Father-in-law had to do to bring his family to safety in Canada from Czechoslovakia in 1968. Equally, I know what I have to do to limit the likelihood that I bring C19 to my wife. What I can do won't be perfect, but it's the least I can do. My Father-in-law and wife deserve no less.

YMMV.

Peace, 

Paul


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## FatStrat2 (Apr 7, 2021)

I had it once when they barely knew what to call it, sometime in Dec 2019/Jan 2020 whee my co-worker came back from Beijing with a pleasant surprise. It was the heavy one too, simply walking around my place felt like I was doing heavy squats in the gym.

Haven't worn a mask since first quarter of this year and take no precautions other than my normal habits (don't lick your keyboard,, don't kiss your co-workers, etc.). My colleagues at work get it once or twice a year now, my co-worker sitting 5 feet from me has had it 4 times. Odds appear that I'll probably not catch it again. If I do, it will be mild.

No, it's not luck - immune system is working just fine as it should. Haven;t been ill since (with anything).


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## Vally (Aug 18, 2016)

RBlakeney said:


> My wife has had it since Friday, and pretty much hasn’t left bed. I don’t seem to have it yet, but that will probably change.


My wife had it a few weeks ago and hadn’t left the bed in three days. She said she rather give birth


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## tomee2 (Feb 27, 2017)

That's the stuff I was thinking of! It's supposed to reduce risk of death considerably.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

leftysg said:


> The political spin is uncalled for.


For sure, although it was entertaining.


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

I find it funny, the media were roundly criticized for their reporting and emphasis on Covid, now you can hardly find numbers at all. As with lots of things, I think a lot of us wish it were somewhere in between.


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

keto said:


> I find it funny, the media were roundly criticized for their reporting and emphasis on Covid, now you can hardly find numbers at all. As with lots of things, I think a lot of us wish it were somewhere in between.


Buddy, in todays world, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. There is no one happy any longer.

I have found robust data still available from the health ministry or Provincial CDC or whatever we are calling it. You gotta put a little leg work into it, but it is there


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## Robhotdad (Oct 27, 2016)

No the world is not safe. It never has been. It's been trying to kill us since birth. Funny thing is, after we ban this and mandate that and take precautions against this, something else eventually pops up and gets us. Do you know of any doctor who has managed to cure death? We're all going to die. Some of us will enjoy a few more things while we're alive, others will shake in their boots till the final moment.


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## Robhotdad (Oct 27, 2016)

Mark Brown said:


> Buddy, in todays world, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. There is no one happy any longer.
> 
> I have found robust data still available from the health ministry or Provincial CDC or whatever we are calling it. You gotta put a little leg work into it, but it is there


I'm happy, almost every day. what gives?


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

Robhotdad said:


> I'm happy, almost every day. what gives?


Me thinks you have intentionally missed the point.


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

I wear my mask around my bum. Every time I defecate it captures all of the covid. Doctor said it's good for me. Haven't gotten Covid yet (knock on wood!).


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

I only wore the face diaper when I had to. I had covid once. I felt off for a couple days and that was it. Life is too short to live in fear. I have not been careful whatsoever. I've done lots of gigs. Covid is only one thing in 9 million things that could kill me.
Like anything else I take certain precautions. For my Covid prevention I simply decided to get as healthy as I can. Lost all excess weight, work out, eat healthy, etc. And guess what? It helps with a lot of other diseases that are far more dangerous than Covid. If not for Covid I'd likely have continued being unhealthy and would have likely had a heart attack or diabetes. Diabetes runs in my family and I was definitely pre-diabetes.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

I’ve been wearing one of these around. It keeps falling off though so I’ll have to find a way to secure it. Makes me feel pretty pretty pretty safe


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

tdotrob said:


> I’ve been wearing one of these around. It keeps falling off though so I’ll have to find a way to secure it. Makes me feel pretty pretty pretty safe
> View attachment 441363












Here, try one of these.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Pat James said:


> Here, try one of these.


Wouldn’t want to take your last couple and leave you and your homie “unprotected” since you probably gotta special order em, ya know. Appreciate the offer!


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

tdotrob said:


> Wouldn’t want to take your last couple and leave you and your homie “unprotected” since you probably gotta special order em, ya know. Appreciate the offer!


I just care about you and don't want you to catch covid bro


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

Young 40 year old female close friend. Before she caught the plague, she ran 10km to work every day and did some mountain trail competitions. She was into kiting ang mountain biking. Since she got it in April, she can barely walk for 15 minutes before wanting to fall in the ditch and sleep there. She runs a business with 15 employees, some weeks she forgets to write the paychecks. Can only work morning, sleeps all afternoon.

THAT is how I don't want to end up.

We caught it at the same time she did and I have symptoms, but less extreme that what she has. No energy, joint and muscle aches. I sleep 2 hours every afternoon. Before a 10 minute nap did it.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

Pat James said:


> I just care about you and don't want you to catch covid bro


We just looking out for each other. It’s a caring community for sure


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## polyslax (May 15, 2020)

Pat James said:


> I wear my mask around my bum. Every time I defecate it captures all of the covid. Doctor said it's good for me. Haven't gotten Covid yet (knock on wood!).


No wonder dogs are all over you!


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

polyslax said:


> No wonder dogs are all over you!


Not really sure about that because I change the mask after 💩


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

All this fear of Covid becomes super clear after watching my wifes cousin die a fairly slow death. He was diagnosed with ALS and I watched him deteriorate over the course of a year where he could not move. Barely able to breathe as everything shut down. Then made the decision for assisted suicide. Nothing he could have done to avoid that one. I'm not going to live a minute of my life fearing Covid.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

player99 said:


> As society is acting like Covid is not a problem I am still keeping to my own and wearing n95 masks and gloves when I am out shopping.
> 
> This week 2 close friends came down with very bad cases of covid, both performed gigs a few days before. One of them is on his 4th time.
> 
> ...


Covid is endemic and never going away.

As an essential worker who's had hard time getting PPE, please, for the love of God, stop wearing gloves.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

guitarman2 said:


> I only wore the face diaper when I had to. <snip>


Why can't you just call it a mask? Why do you have to be insulting to those of us who have different comfort levels with the perceived risk?

You are usually better than this.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

Paul M said:


> Why can't you just call it a mask? Why do you have to be insulting to those of us who have different comfort levels with the perceived risk?
> 
> You are usually better than this.


Although I disagree with his description, most of the people I know who do use the term started doing so in reaction to the derogatory names they were being called.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

Paul M said:


> Why can't you just call it a mask? Why do you have to be insulting to those of us who have different comfort levels with the perceived risk?
> 
> You are usually better than this.


Sorry. Never meant to be insulting. Never called it that till my sister made fun of me a million times for wearing it and I've heard her call it that so many times I guess I thought thats what it was called. She's anti-mask, anti-vax and believes covid is a hoax. Usually I can't talk to her to about it. But I don't take it personal.


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## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

I prefer face condom or bad breath test kit.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Not disputing the veracity of anyone's claims here, but all of the claims that one has some sort of super immune system are NEVER corroborated by actual evidence. Rather, the assumption seems to be "I haven't gotten sick *yet*, therefore my immune system is a brick wall". Seems to me that assumption is confounding _chance_ with _capacity_. People automatically assume that they have knowingly had confirmed sufficient exposure to become ill and they have fought it off due to their robust immune response. None of that is ever measured. We do know that folks who have caught it previously and/or have had a vaccine shot or two or three tend to get over it quickly, without requiring hospitalization. That's a reflection of how immune systems and immunity are aided by such exposures, and not necessarily a reflection of how robust one's immune system is in the _absence_ of such assists.

I have also not been sick a single day since the virus was first identified and announced. My own immune system is probably not exceptional, though my wife gets sick more often than I do. I certainly have been MUCH healthier since I retired and stopped riding a crowded commuter bus five days a week. Many people don't make it a point to keep their snot to themselves. And while I used to think of my runny nose as a nuisance, these days I think it likely plays a role in keeping me healthy, since anything I inhale nasally tends to get snorted out 10 minutes later, before it has a chance to replicate and establish itself.

Currently, I have had 4 vaccine shots. Though I'm not wearing the sort of mask that the more enthusiastic types would deem optimal (I.e., no N95s), I cloth-mask when in group situations, and in some one-on-one situations. It's like seatbelts. I don't know that I'm going to be in an accident, but I also can't vouch for all other drivers, road conditions, or any other precipitating factor, so I belt up as a good habit. When people came to the early voting station I worked at on Friday, some looked at my masked face and asked if they had to wear a mask. I replied that it wasn't required, but was simply a good habit to keep up.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

guitarman2 said:


> Sorry. Never meant to be insulting. Never called it that till my sister made fun of me a million times for wearing it and I've heard her call it that so many times I guess I thought thats what it was called. She's anti-mask, anti-vax and believes covid is a hoax. Usually I can't talk to her to about it. But I don't take it personal.


Seems to me you're the more mature one of the two siblings.


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

Paul M said:


> Why can't you just call it a mask? Why do you have to be insulting to those of us who have different comfort levels with the perceived risk?
> 
> You are usually better than this.


It is a sobering reminder to read the comments from those who have experienced this pandemic first hand or have experienced the unimaginable loss of loved ones/friends.

I can't speak for others, but I will say that for me, when it comes to constant, unpredictable, and fluctuating changes with public health guidelines*, *joking is one way of dealing with all of this...stuff.... and it's not coming from any place that is insulting or insensitive, nor is it being directed to anyone else other than myself..

Coming back to this forum and having others to talk to about guitars has given each of us an outlet to ask questions and get opinions about guitar stuff, which I seek out of respect and kindness, as I am sure everyone else here does too.

As for global pandemic health crises, I deal with it by trying to keep a sense of humour.

I blame the Irish in me.


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## markxander (Oct 24, 2009)

mawmow said:


> the Jews published that a dose of vaccine and COVID disease, whichever comes first, protects for as long as eight months.


....typo I hope?


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

What a lot of people seem to miss is that wearing a mask other than N95 only means you're not exhaling your dirty, filthy droplets on others. It's basically being courteous to those around you, and helping them to not get sick -- you know, being _nice_. 

I am always in awe of those who don't seem to give a damn about anyone but themselves and their short-term wants.


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## markxander (Oct 24, 2009)

Rollin Hand said:


> What a lot of people seem to miss is that wearing a mask other than N95 only means you're not exhaling your dirty, filthy droplets on others. It's basically being courteous to those around you, and helping them to not get sick -- you know, being _nice_.
> 
> I am always in awe of those who don't seem to give a damn about anyone but themselves and their short-term wants.


them and the 17% of the province that voted for doug ford


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

Rollin Hand said:


> What a lot of people seem to miss is that wearing a mask other than N95 only means you're not exhaling your dirty, filthy droplets on others. It's basically being courteous to those around you, and helping them to not get sick -- you know, being _nice_.
> 
> I am always in awe of those who don't seem to give a damn about anyone but themselves and their short-term wants.


Health Canada acknowledged that the droplet theory was incorrect and that's it's airborne in September of 2020. That's also when they started recommending N95 masks


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## Grab n Go (May 1, 2013)

I caught it when I went to see an indoor gig at a club. Luckily, the rest of my family was spared. First show in years and I was masked up too. I'll admit, it's made me think twice about attending live shows for the next little while.

In general, I mask up indoors in public spaces. I might be in the minority right now, but I'm okay with that.

The prospect of long covid is enough to give me pause. The things that I enjoy most: I want them to continue uninterrupted. If I have to take a few precautions, so be it. Of course there are never any guarantees, but that's life.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I use the N95s because if I'm gonna put up with wearing one might as well be the best I can get; the cloth masks are just whistling past the grave yard not likely to do anything.

I think I'm stating the obvious but it seems that the 19 hits some people much harder than others and it doesn't come down to being young and fit as a protection although I can understand why that might be an appealing concept for some. My business partner, her husband got it and he's mid 40s, has a business where he renos homes so he's fit but the 19 floored him. An 80 year old I know got it and he was OK in a few days. Woman who rents an office from us she got long covid and still ain't better after a year. Pretty sure I had it in Jan 2020 knocked me on my ass for 2 weeks but no long term issues. 

I'm pissed at the whole fuckin thing and god damn the gain of function bastards that let this loose on the world but it's not about living in fear just that I'm gonna do what I can to minimize risk. I have a business to run and I got no health benefits so if get sick I'm fucked.


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## oldjoat (Apr 4, 2019)

Wardo said:


> I have a business to run and I got no health benefits so if get sick I'm fucked.


twas the same till I retired . 
no work , no pay. 
seem to have dodged the 19 bullet so far , but that luck can only go so far , just a matter of time. 

the shots , mask when in stores, and do the usual precautions as needed....

in the mean time , I'll continue on doing most of the things I like.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

oldjoat said:


> .. no work , no pay.


The rains would come and the roof would leak.
And the gas man shut off the heat.
When it rains you don't work means there ain't no pay.
Which always means not much to eat.
There's just too many ways to get beat.
At Brown and Root. Brown an Root....

From an old Rodney Crowell song ... lol


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

Wardo said:


> The rains would come and the roof would leak.
> And the gas man shut off the heat.
> When it rains you don't work means there ain't no pay.
> Which always means not much to eat.
> ...


Reminds me of this.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)




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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

Wardo said:


>


Interesting lyrics/melody for a song from 1980. Really seems 10 years before it's time. I think the first line would have been better delivered: "Peepaw pissed his pant's again." for some added alliteration.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

It's one thing for daddy to be doin sister sally but back there you'd never refer to your granpa as peepaw... lol


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

Wardo said:


> It's one thing for daddy to be doin sister sally but back there you'd never refer to your granpa as peepaw... lol


I checked Wiktionary and peepaw is US Southern dialect for grandpa, which we can assume that is where they are from given the chorus's emphasis on "Sweet Home Alabama". It would actually line up fairly well given the incestuous narrative too. Then you have double entendre of the word "pee" in peepaw adding to the whole pissing of the pants line.


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## HeavyMetalDan (Oct 5, 2016)

I don't wear mask and I never would have if I had a choice. Some people think wearing a mask weakens your immune system and I believe the same. 
For the people that want to wear a mask, all the power to them. But what is this now going to become a life long habit? I believe you can't hide from colds, viruses or covid.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Pat James said:


> It's more of a deep south thing, which would actually line up fairly well given the incestuous narrative don't ya think? Plus, you have the double entendre of the word "pee" in peepaw lining in nicely with the whole pissing of the pants situation.


No, I'm from there and we respect our elders and don't give a rats about double intenders who are just trying to rip you off on the crop share .. lol


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

Wardo said:


> No, I'm from there and we respect our elders and don't give a rats about double intenders who are just trying to rip you off on the crop share .. lol


I am just trying to punch up a lyric in a decades old song...but if you like the way it sounds...hats off to ya  Although I honestly think that if daddy is doing the sister...you would be calling your grandpa some variation of "paw".


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Pat James said:


> I am just trying to punch up a lyric in a decades old song...but if you like the way it sounds...hats off to ya


To address your point more seriously my feeling is that the song won't benefit from a "clever" double entendre on a word. The song is a blunt and crude description of a set of circumstances and it is the antitheses of sophistry.


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## Pat James (5 mo ago)

Wardo said:


> To address your point more seriously my feeling is that the song won't benefit from a "clever" double entendre on a word. The song is a blunt and crude description of a set of circumstances and it is the antitheses of sophistry.


I am going to agree to disagree, but I can see that if you don't like the word "peepaw" as a word choice then you wouldn't want to hear it in a song lyric regardless of what it means, and I can also see your point about how it is supposed to sound crude and not poetic. "Peepaw" is not a fancy or poetic word by any means, and I would argue that it fits the crude narrative better by being a slang term for the more proper English term "Grandpa". I also can't think of any type of poem or song that didn't benefit from having figurative language...and that word in my opinion fits that line perfectly. I have no way of being able to change that regardless, so there is nothing I can do to make that change, so you can have some solace in the fact that "The Song Remains the Same" no matter what I think.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Pat James said:


> I am going to agree to disagree...


It's just a word in a song doesn't much matter and it ain't gonna be re-written. To my mind, the better part of this is that a thread about contagion has been to some extent derailed into a discussion about music. If you want to see figurative and poetic language check out some Townes Van Zandt stuff.


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## RBlakeney (Mar 12, 2017)

RBlakeney said:


> My wife has had it since Friday, and pretty much hasn’t left bed. I don’t seem to have it yet, but that will probably change.


It changed. Now I have a cough and alternating chills and fever. Lets see how round one goes.


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## amp boy (Apr 23, 2009)

fuck.....this thread just went Zevon.


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## Pierrafeux (Jul 12, 2012)




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## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

markxander said:


> ....typo I hope?


Mawmow is going Defcon 3 with Kanye


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## MetalTele79 (Jul 20, 2020)

I'm sure I've mentioned it before but I lead an contact tracing team for some hospitals in Toronto. Cases are definitely starting to go up again and the organization seems concerned about this fall. This year there will be staff absences from COVID and the Flu which hasn't been bad for the the past few years because of masking/distancing that isn't currently in place. At the moment Germany and the UK are getting hit hard and I think Germany just reinstated mask mandates.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

tdotrob said:


> I’ve been wearing one of these around.





Pat James said:


> Here, try one of these.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

MetalTele79 said:


> I'm sure I've mentioned it before but I lead an contact tracing team for some hospitals in Toronto. Cases are definitely starting to go up again and the organization seems concerned about this fall. This year there will be staff absences from COVID and the Flu which hasn't been bad for the the past few years because of masking/distancing that isn't currently in place. At the moment Germany and the UK are getting hit hard and I think Germany just reinstated mask mandates.


Anything I have to say is anecdotal. My sister in law is a respiratory therapist here and they have 6 Covid patients admitted the hospital right now (which is enough to push their resources).

It's been running wildfire through any of my friends households I know who have kids since school went back. I am not exaggerating at all saying every household I know in this scenario has had it and several currently have it. But on top of that, they've been nailed with strep and a bunch of other stuff was was reduced during the time everyone was wearing masks/being more cautious. My brother's household seems like they have been sick pretty much since school went back.

The only other note, most of them are sick enough to be fully incapacitated for at least a few days. Not like being out of a commission with flu/cold. Their key issue is they are so weak they say their legs literally give out. That along with the brain fog. They said they can't do anything when they've had it never mind try to work.

I love alone, and I don't do a ton of stuff where theres crowds. My main activities are golf and hiking so I am always outdoors. My Dad is 81 and has had heart issue though, so I avoided anything around Thanksgiving to just hang out with him. I rapid test before seeing him. As I mentioned, my brother's household have all been sick which means I'm the only one who can visit much. So I'm going to keep being cautious.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

torndownunit said:


> Anything I have to say is anecdotal. My sister in law is a respiratory therapist here and they have 6 Covid patients admitted the hospital right now (which is enough to push their resources).
> 
> It's been running wildfire through any of my friends households I know who have kids since school went back. I am not exaggerating at all saying every household I know in this scenario has had it and several currently have it. But on top of that, they've been nailed with strep and a bunch of other stuff was was reduced during the time everyone was wearing masks/being more cautious. My brother's household seems like they have been sick pretty much since school went back.
> 
> ...


Um, I think you meant to type "I live alone...". "I love alone" has a very different meaning, my friend. Dang virtual keyboards! 😄


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

mhammer said:


> Um, I think you meant to type "I live alone...". "I love alone" has a very different meaning, my friend. Dang virtual keyboards! 😄


Unfortunately for the last 2 years, love alone actually applies too lol. 

I'm not great at dating in the first place, never mind Covid thrown in the mix the last 2 years. On top of a lot of people just taking a dating break, nothing social was going on for so long. Even the hiking groups in my area stopped all group hikes.


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## Parabola (Oct 22, 2021)

RBlakeney said:


> It changed. Now I have a cough and alternating chills and fever. Lets see how round one goes.


Hydrate and pound the D3, good luck!


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

mhammer said:


> "I live alone...". "I love alone"


He must 'drink alone' as well?


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Haven't followed the "peepaw" debate here. I'll simply note that toddlers' earliest terms for significant others are almost universally repetitions of the same or similar simple syllable, be it yaya, nona, meemah, baba, etc. There tends to be a preference for leading consonants that are easier to mouth with one's lips, rather than more difficult consonants requiring tongue/palate coordination. That preference is not set by the culture so much as by how infants learn how to use words. They/we babble a lot during the first year and a bit, generally repeating phonemes to learn how to make them fluidly (bababababa...), not unlike how we practice scales to be able to riff smoothly. Typically, repeating the same syllable (termed "reduplicative babbling") progresses on to more complex combinations of different syllables (termed "nonreduplicative babbling"). But proto-words can emerge early on, before infants can get their mouths to do more complex things. Ultimately, they notice how people around them respond to certain utterances, and those become their first "words" that they can now deploy to prompt interaction and social response from those significant others. The difficulty of making, and repeating, some phonemes is why 'mama' can often precede 'dada'. Not that dad is unappreciated, but 'm' is a sound one can make a little more easily than 'd', when you're 11 months old. And I suppose such phoneme-articulation difficulties are also the basis for mispronunciation of siblings' names, that turn into nicknames for them at later ages. So 'Brian' might turn into Byby or similar.

Peepaw is part of that grand tradition, as is Meemah.


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## troyhead (May 23, 2014)

Fred Gifford said:


> due to continued, repeated, undetected infections we are doing pretty bad damage to our lungs, brains and something else, which in my advanced years I have forgotten.


There is no third thing, that's just the pretty bad damage to your brain talking. 😜



mhammer said:


> I said it here before many times, I will continue to mask until such time as there are as many Covid cases reported as we'd be comfortable with if it was polio, measles, malaria, TB, pertusis, or anything else we get vaccinated for.


We have been getting vaccinated for influenza for years with many reported cases and no masks. So, I guess you are free to take yours off now? 🤷‍♂️ Just kidding... I feel people should (and will) feel comfortable to wear masks as much as they want. I hope it becomes normalized where people who feel sick and insist on going out will wear a mask to stop spreading their germs.


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## Stephenlouis (Jun 24, 2019)

I have covid right now. I work in healthcare, I had a sore throat so I decided to do a test at work and it showed positive. I was told to leave the hospital immediately. I remember driving home thinking yeehaw 5 days of guitar playing and relaxation. Within 4 hours of being home I could barely move. I felt like iron bands around my chest and someone was pushing a pencil through my ear into the back of my eyeball. I would semi sleep 4 hrs and then be awake for 1, this lasted for 48 hrs.. I had a mild fever of 38.4 and I was sweating profusely. At least I could breathe well. I'm in day four of it and last night was absolutely terrible. Yet at 5:00 a.m. today I feel 75% better. This is a strange disease and you do not want it. Obviously doing what I do I've had two shots I was due for my booster ironically in the next week and I take as many precautions as I have to legally work. I have a healthy respect for precautions now. I think we are in for a shit storm this winter. Half my crew now has it and 1 wing is locked down.

On the covid fun Factor scale I give this disease a zero out of 10. It has no redeeming qualities and I cannot recommend it😜🙄


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

The second time that I acquired it, felt like a three day hangover. The worst of it was my ears were plugged for four weeks. Everything sounded bass-y and muffled.


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## Mikev7305 (Jan 6, 2020)

The first time I had it in January 2022 I had the sweats and felt dizzy around 7pm, had a sweaty sleep with the chills coming and going, I almost went to work the next day because I felt 90% the next morning, but tested myself, positive, stay home. 

Second time was just over a month ago, my wife felt the chills for a day, I was tired for a day, over it completely in 24 hours. Neither of us are dosed. 

I finally saw an article on a main stream news source saying that gargling mouthwash kills a lot of the virus and drastically reduces symptoms if you start using it early in the infection period. Funny, I heard that from Dr Peter McCullough a year ago and everyone said that guy was a quack. 

So is it safe? No. But certainly not dangerous enough to justify locking society down again.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Stephenlouis said:


> I have covid right now. I work in healthcare, I had a sore throat so I decided to do a test at work and it showed positive. I was told to leave the hospital immediately. I remember driving home thinking yeehaw 5 days of guitar playing and relaxation. Within 4 hours of being home I could barely move. I felt like iron bands around my chest and someone was pushing a pencil through my ear into the back of my eyeball. I would semi sleep 4 hrs and then be awake for 1, this lasted for 48 hrs.. I had a mild fever of 38.4 and I was sweating profusely. At least I could breathe well. I'm in day four of it and last night was absolutely terrible. Yet at 5:00 a.m. today I feel 75% better. This is a strange disease and you do not want it. Obviously doing what I do I've had two shots I was due for my booster ironically in the next week and I take as many precautions as I have to legally work. I have a healthy respect for precautions now. I think we are in for a shit storm this winter. Half my crew now has it and 1 wing is locked down.
> 
> On the covid fun Factor scale I give this disease a zero out of 10. It has no redeeming qualities and I cannot recommend it😜🙄


This echos what my friends have told me. In each case they tested because of a minor symptom, then just got slammed. Others I know got off with very few issues, but the majority of my friends got it bad lately. The group ranges from late 30's to early 40's, and we are all generally in good shape.

The person's word I trust about the amount of cases going around is my sister in law. She's a respiratory therapist so she's been at the literal frontline through all of this. She said cases are through the roof at emerg, but that with case numbers not being released anymore no one really knows other than what they see in their social circle.


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## Stephenlouis (Jun 24, 2019)

torndownunit said:


> This echos what my friends have told me. In each case they tested because of a minor symptom, then just got slammed. Others I know got off with very few issues, but the majority of my friends got it bad lately. The group ranges from late 30's to early 40's, and we are all generally in good shape.
> 
> The person's word I trust about the amount of cases going around is my sister in law. She's a respiratory therapist so she's been at the literal frontline through all of this. She said cases are through the roof at emerg, but that with case numbers not being released anymore no one really knows other than what they see in their social circle.


The slam caught me off guard, I thought I would be like laristotle at worst. Mild hangover/cold, and chilling with my guitars I am grateful I am vaccinated, as I would not want to think how much worse this could be if I was not. It really does hit everyone differently, but if there is a layer of protection available, why not use it( conspiracies aside)

We all know it too, funny though we just sort of don't talk about it, we just shake our heads and say "we are fucked" I am serious, as there is nothing we can do, but our best when people start pouring in, FASTER than they already are... I do not support a lock down again, though I loved driving to work in it. I do support personal precautions.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

markxander said:


> ....typo I hope?


Sorry, I do not understand what you mean…

This morning, I read in « La Presse » (a respected daily newspaper in Quebec) a quote from a research guy in Sherbrooke saying that COVID vaccines were effective from 15 to 50 % !
The article also reported 5% occurrence of long COVID even with Omicron variant. Many will recover within a year, but those lasting more thant two years will probably not.

So, protect yourself guys and be aware the vaccines may help, but there is no warranty !


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

Maggs and I had it for the first time about 2 months ago. Did not hit either one of us that bad. Maggs still has a nagging cough. I'll get my 4th booster but will probably wait until January or so. I'd like to think I've got pretty good protection at the moment and have enjoyed the freedom of going about without a mask again. However, if cases go up the mask goes on.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Ain't it interesting, and a bit discouraging, that when something requires a collaborative/cooperative effort to manage or defeat, these days people seem to be more likely to say "Hey, not MY problem", and then drum up rationales for why cooperation was stupid and pointless in the first place?

Spoke with a cousin of mine yesterday, who just went for his 5th shot. He happens to be an MD, but is working from home and on a list for a heart transplant after a rather catastrophic 2020. He don't take NO chances, after spending about 4 months in the big Montreal/McGill hospital. His daughter is expecting in 5 weeks - something he thought he'd never live to see - and he ain't missing it for love or money.


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## fogdart (Mar 22, 2017)

We dodged COVID until the last week of September when our three year old brought it home from daycare. The daycare that he attends is super loosey goosey and there are constantly snotty kids running around. When I called to ask when he could return after being sick they said 24 hours after fever is gone so long as there’s no vomiting or diarrhea. If we’d sent him back according to their parameters it would have been day 3 of COVID. We kept him home for 12 days out of respect to the other parents.

Anyway.... I’m an emergency services worker in Toronto and have been in constant proximity to the virus since the beginning. I’ve done CPR on patients with COVID a handful of times, routinely go into houses where everyone is sick, deal with crowds of people. All of my coworkers have been sick at least once and I’ve worked with them while they were beginning to be symptomatic. We work in close proximity and essentially live together for long shifts. But none of us have caught COVID at work. It’s always been from our kids. My take is that for most people, you need a pretty significant exposure to become infected. I don’t wear a mask any where unless I’m doing it to be respectful of someone else. I don’t live in fear of the virus, my family doesn’t, my 70+ year old parents don’t, and the vast majority of my social circle doesn’t. Almost everyone that I know has had COVID at this point and the only person who has long term symptoms is a very unhealthy person. My wife, son, and myself were symptom free (aside from some lingering congestion) in 4 or 5 days. My wife had it the worst with a fever of 102 for twelve hours. Otherwise we were active doing yard work, riding bikes around our property, and playing ball hockey the entire time. It was like a cold for me and my son, and a mild flu for my wife.

In my line of work I see people die on a regular basis. But it’s almost always from chronic illness (heart disease, cancer, addiction) or traumatic accident. I’ve not personally been to any COVID deaths since the first wave when it was killing very old, very sick, people who were on death’s door anyway. I’ve seen mental health and addiction related deaths skyrocket and kill many more people than COVID.

I will not miss experiences because I’m afraid of getting sick. A healthy person is probably significantly more likely to die on the way to the vaccine clinic (I’m 3x vax’d) than we are from the virus. I’ll wear a mask at a concert if I plan on going to a family event soon after. I certainly won’t go out if I’m sick, I respect the health of others and also their comfort levels. But I will not miss any more events, dinners, gatherings. I could get hit by a bus tomorrow, diagnosed with terminal cancer next week. Imagine if I’d hide inside for what ended up being the last three years of my life?


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## markxander (Oct 24, 2009)

mawmow said:


> Sorry, I do not understand what you mean…
> 
> This morning, I read in « La Presse » (a respected daily newspaper in Quebec) a quote from a research guy in Sherbrooke saying that COVID vaccines were effective from 15 to 50 % !
> The article also reported 5% occurrence of long COVID even with Omicron variant. Many will recover within a year, but those lasting more thant two years will probably not.
> ...


I was referring to the source being "the Jews" instead of probably "the news"


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

markxander said:


> I was referring to the source being "the Jews" instead of probably "the news"


I suspect that was not a typo, but rather an attribution to an ethnic/religious group, rather than to an "Israeli" report. I hasten to note that Israel, and more particularly its academia and health researchers, consists of a much greater diversity than those who are Jewish. A bit like describing an Italian report as "the Catholics". But no worries. We make misattributions all the time. Not out of malice, but simply by typing faster than we think.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

The sad thing about this is we only have anecdotal evidence to go on because the authorities are no longer giving us statistics. They tell us to make our own decisions. How can we make proper decisions without data.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

Kerry Brown said:


> *They tell us to make our own decisions.*


As a free democratic government should


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## 2N1305 (Nov 2, 2009)

2manyGuitars said:


> And even _before_ covid, y’all were some disgusting MF’ers.



LOL so true! it's just the way you said it, you're as blunt as an editorialist in the _*Journal de Montreal!*_

I have to admit I no longer wear my mask, but am thinking about returning to wearing it... Problem is, it protects others more than it does me.


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

mhammer said:


> Ain't it interesting, and a bit discouraging, that when something requires a collaborative/cooperative effort to manage or defeat, these days people seem to be more likely to say "Hey, not MY problem", and then drum up rationales for why cooperation was stupid and pointless in the first place?
> 
> Spoke with a cousin of mine yesterday, who just went for his 5th shot. He happens to be an MD, but is working from home and on a list for a heart transplant after a rather catastrophic 2020. He don't take NO chances, after spending about 4 months in the big Montreal/McGill hospital. His daughter is expecting in 5 weeks - something he thought he'd never live to see - and he ain't missing it for love or money.


I think in Canada we had about an 85% buy-in on the whole vaccines and masks requirement. To my way of thinking that's massive. I'm not sure which people you are referring to.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

allthumbs56 said:


> I think in Canada we had about an 85% buy-in on the whole vaccines and masks requirement. To my way of thinking that's massive. I'm not sure which people you are referring to.


I think the 85% figure is for first shots, with subsequent vaccinations declining in frequency. Not dramatically so (i.e., from 85% to 50%), but somewhat steadily. It's graphed quite nicely (if somewhat alarmingly) here: COVID-19 vaccine doses administered in Canada – Canada.ca

As for "getting slammed", the thing to remember about more recent variants is that they seem to replicate _faster_; going from a little bit of virus to a lot of virus more quickly than the 2020 variant. The problem this has created is that people can _*think*_ they are somehow protected because they got vaccinated last week, but the acceleration on the virus is greater than the acceleration on your immune system. Even if one has been fully-vaxed, and is not immune compromised, the "memory cells" in your immune system take a couple of days to "remember" and kick into action, and by that point the virus is in full swing already. So while your immune system is panting and muttering "Hold up a sec, guys, let me catch up", the virus has done a roadrunner "meep-meep" and zipped way down the road in a cloud of dust. Fundamentally, the issue with recent variants has been one of relative speed of viral replication, versus speed of immune response, prophylaxis and treatment. It didn't help that much of the preceding anecdotal information and socially "received wisdom" was based on a slower-moving variant.

Again, things are certainly NOT as bad as they were for the 2nd, 3rd and 4th waves, but if people keep basing their personal health behaviours on what happened back then, this thing is not going to abate anytime soon.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

2N1305 said:


> LOL so true! it's just the way you said it, you're as blunt as an editorialist in the _*Journal de Montreal!*_
> 
> I have to admit I no longer wear my mask, but am thinking about returning to wearing it... Problem is, it protects others more than it does me.


Not if you wear an N95 mask.


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## tomee2 (Feb 27, 2017)

mawmow said:


> Sorry, I do not understand what you mean…
> 
> This morning, I read in « La Presse » (a respected daily newspaper in Quebec) a quote from a research guy in Sherbrooke saying that COVID vaccines were effective from 15 to 50 % !
> The article also reported 5% occurrence of long COVID even with Omicron variant. Many will recover within a year, but those lasting more thant two years will probably not.
> ...


I think you meant to say Israel in an earlier post, not Jews.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Many people, and I include myself, who are ostensibly "healthy", can be carriers. So, while higher grade masks may be optimal for prevention of *inhaling* airborne viral droplets, lower-grade masks can prevent one from *exhaling* such droplets. I realize mask-wearing is perceived by many to be a self-protective measure - and it's only natural that people seek to protect themselves, and might eschew such measures if they feel personally safe - the other equally-important aspect of mask wearing is the protection of others.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I think people wearing N95 masks with the exhale exhaust port are not being fair, unless they have a breathing issue and still want to be protected.


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## Parabola (Oct 22, 2021)

player99 said:


> I think people wearing N95 masks with the exhale exhaust port are not being fair, unless they have a breathing issue and still want to be protected.


I had one from the UK early in the pandemic that the UK Ministry of Defence were using, it had a integrated filter port, but it was filter like a mini gas mask filter. They weren’t replaceable and had a 60 day lifespan before you needed a new mask Entirety.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

Mikev7305 said:


> The first time I had it in January 2022 I had the sweats and felt dizzy around 7pm, had a sweaty sleep with the chills coming and going, I almost went to work the next day because I felt 90% the next morning, but tested myself, positive, stay home.
> 
> Second time was just over a month ago, my wife felt the chills for a day, I was tired for a day, over it completely in 24 hours. Neither of us are dosed.
> 
> ...


Both times I had CV it was very mild. Thankfully it was the same for family/friends. Outside of work I'm not the least bit concerned with Covid. In our hospital cases are climbing but again, the definition of a "Case" leaves a lot to be desired. The vast majority are incidental findings....people in the hospital WITH covid vs FOR covid. And everyone that has actual covid is on their 3rd or 4th booster. "Safe" is really defined by the individual and at this point everyone has the necessary tools and knowledge to keep themselves safe.


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

I spent almost every day of the last 2 weeks visiting someone in the hospital. Obviously masked (not an option although I’d wear it there anyway) and just got dose 4 earlier tonight.


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## Parabola (Oct 22, 2021)

2manyGuitars said:


> I spent almost every day of the last 2 weeks visiting someone in the hospital. Obviously masked (not an option although I’d wear it there anyway) and just got dose 4 earlier tonight.


Sorry to hear that, best wishes to you and your loved one.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

player99 said:


> I think people wearing N95 masks with the exhale exhaust port are not being fair, unless they have a breathing issue and still want to be protected.


I'm unfamiliar with those masks, but I gather they are for working with or in fine dust. We may gather dust, but humans are not known to exhale dust, so the protection of such masks may be deliberately uni-directional. I.E., stops incoming but not outgoing.


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## Parabola (Oct 22, 2021)

mhammer said:


> I'm unfamiliar with those masks, but I gather they are for working with or in fine dust. We may gather dust, but humans are not known to exhale dust, so the protection of such masks may be deliberately uni-directional. I.E., stops incoming but not outgoing.


Some of them have vent ports that allow air to escape unfiltered. I first saw them years ago for people who run in the winter, the idea being you’re not breathing cold air into the lungs and venting exhaust air. They became popular with some people in Covid as it feels like You’re not breathing “mask air”, but obviously that exhaust air is unfiltered and doesn’t stop pathogens.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

RJP110 said:


> Both times I had CV it was very mild. Thankfully it was the same for family/friends. Outside of work I'm not the least bit concerned with Covid. In our hospital cases are climbing but again, the definition of a "Case" leaves a lot to be desired. The vast majority are incidental findings....people in the hospital WITH covid vs FOR covid. And everyone that has actual covid is on their 3rd or 4th booster. "Safe" is really defined by the individual and at this point everyone has the necessary tools and knowledge to keep themselves safe.


Whether 'with' or 'for', they are still potentially contagious, and requiring additional protections in a hospital environment. No different than being admitted for a gunshot wound but ALSO having measles.

More recent variants ARE less lethal, yes, but if one needs life-saving or life-altering surgery, and that surgery has to be put on hold because too many surgical staff are down with a "mild" case, the impact of mildness will be the same as what we saw with more intense variants in 2020.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

mhammer said:


> Whether 'with' or 'for', they are still potentially contagious, and requiring additional protections in a hospital environment. No different than being admitted for a gunshot wound but ALSO having measles.
> 
> More recent variants ARE less lethal, yes, but if one needs life-saving or life-altering surgery, and that surgery has to be put on hold because too many surgical staff are down with a "mild" case, the impact of mildness will be the same as what we saw with more intense variants in 2020.


Very different than being admitted with a gunshot wound and measles. For one, measles is pretty much eradicated as the vaccine prevents acquisition and transmission of the virus. “If” you have measles you have symptoms which is not the case with CV. We are catching the vast majority of CV cases with asymptomatic testing. And again, there’s no long term solution where that remains feasible. Influenza has an asymptomatic rate of around 50% and is also highly contagious. We never have asymptomatically tested for influenza. And if we did, there would also be some alarming “case” counts. And the current BA5 variant has an IFR quite a bit less than influenza for all ages.

More importantly, it’s misleading as to the impact of the current variant on the healthcare system. It’s apples to oranges. This all started to flatten the curve so healthcare can effectively treat sick patients. Counting asymptomatic cases means nothing. All it does is scare the general public unnecessarily. Those individuals would be in the hospital regardless of Covid. It’s like counting hospitalizations due to cancer. Would you include those people admitted for a heart attack and during the diagnostics they discovered a tumour? Or someone in a car accident that during labs found undiagnosed leukaemia? Never.

Also, the vast majority of nurses/MDs were boosted 6 months ago (and by boosted I mean got omicron.). So staffing is safe for a while at least (until the next variant that escapes natural immunity anyways). The staffing shortages we are seeing now are from post pandemic fatigue, other illness and general burnout from patient volume and acuity (and not acuity due to having Covid)


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

RJP110 said:


> Very different than


Thanks to you and the other people from the medical profession who contributed to this thread as well as a few previous threads about covid. Much appreciated.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

Wardo said:


> Thanks to you and the other people from the medical profession who contributed to this thread as well as a few previous threads about covid. Much appreciated.


Thank you for that. Much appreciated. I know my stance seems paradoxical to that of the mainstream media. The majority of front line healthcare workers realize that Covid is done because it’s never done. It’s here to stay regardless of vaccination (current vaccination at least), masking or other NPI’s. we are now seeing firsthand the effects of 2 years of lockdowns and it isn’t pretty. Suicides, overdoses, and a terrifying amount of cancer. Covid will now ebb and flow like every other respiratory virus. It will increase during winter and decrease during summer. Universal mandates will not stop it (as it didn’t with the alpha variant which was much less infectious), they will just cause increased poverty, fear and declining public health. Covid needs to be an individual safety assessment. Those that feel they are higher risk need to take interventions. Those that aren’t should be free to live their life as they see fit.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

So, um, you're on Danielle Smith's side?


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

RJP110 said:


> Thank you for that. Much appreciated. I know my stance seems paradoxical to that of the mainstream media. The majority of front line healthcare workers realize that Covid is done because it’s never done. It’s here to stay regardless of vaccination (current vaccination at least), masking or other NPI’s. we are now seeing firsthand the effects of 2 years of lockdowns and it isn’t pretty. Suicides, overdoses, and a terrifying amount of cancer. Covid will now ebb and flow like every other respiratory virus. It will increase during winter and decrease during summer. Universal mandates will not stop it (as it didn’t with the alpha variant which was much less infectious), they will just cause increased poverty, fear and declining public health. Covid needs to be an individual safety assessment. Those that feel they are higher risk need to take interventions. Those that aren’t should be free to live their life as they see fit.


What's responsible for the terrifying amounts of cancer?


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

jab jab jab.....viral reactivation, immune escape, bell's palsy, parkinsons, brain fog, myocarditis/pericarditis, immune exhaustion, shingles, wildfire cancers (my words, I wanted to use wildfire and not just with that cute song), the ever popular blood clots, any number of immune suppressed conditions.....and the list goes on and on and on.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

HighNoon said:


> jab jab jab.....viral reactivation, immune escape, bell's palsy, parkinsons, brain fog, myocarditis/pericarditis, immune exhaustion, shingles, wildfire cancers (my words, I wanted to use wildfire and not just with that cute song), the ever popular blood clots, any number of immune suppressed conditions.....and the list goes on and on and on.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I saw Fouchi on TV last week. He said there are 400 Covid deaths a day in the US now.


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## GuitarT (Nov 23, 2010)

player99 said:


> What's responsible for the terrifying amounts of cancer?


Lack of early detection and reduced access to treatment over the last two and a half years. We're living it in my family.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

player99 said:


> What's responsible for the terrifying amounts of cancer?


It's always difficult to know what constitutes a conspicuous incidence of cancer. Keep in mind that everyone has to die of _something_, and different somethings strike at different ages. The result is that if you don't die of X, you live long enough to die of Y or Z. So, things like sharp increases in childhood leukemia *are* conspicuous. But more people dying of prostate, cervical, stomach, and bowel cancer in their 50s and 60s may simply mean they haven't already died from many of the respiratory things that killed off their ancestors in the 1800s before they reached their 40s.

In statistics, there is the concept of sampling-with-replacement, and sampling-without-replacement. If I ask you to pick a card from a deck, and you pick a heart, without putting it back, the odds of you getting a heart the _next_ time you pull out a card will have decreased. If you put that first card back in the deck, the odds remain one-out-of-four. Sources of mortality are a bit like sampling-without-replacement in that the probability of any particular source changes with age. Not for the deceased, of course, but with respect to _population_ incidence. Indeed, _lifespan_ hasn't increased much, although life _expectancy_ has. More and more folks are living to the maximum lifespan humans can/do, because they're not dying from diseases of childhood that filled up many a cemetery with young ones in bygone days. Life-expectancy is how far we estimate you're likely to make it (based on population data), given that you've made it _this_ far. Things like war, famine, and disasters obviously impact on region-to-region differences in life expectancy. But if you've made it through the major hurdles of earlier life, chances are pretty good you'll go the distance...and die of either heart disease, pneumonia, or cancer (in that order of likelihood).

Cancer itself is very much what one might suggest is the natural state of the organism. We are constantly growing cells, and most, if not all, of us have little bits of unnecessary cell growth here and there, be they skin tags moles, warts, or whatnot. Where it becomes problematic is when we grow too many of the wrong kind. Happily, cell growth is kept in check, for the most part, by a variety of cellular mechanisms. But those "brake pads" can wear out with age over repeated cell-divisions. What we call "cancer" is really a premature dysfunction of those brakes in some manner.

Many decades ago, I watched a CBC panel of experts discussing cancer, and the host or maybe a guest asked one of the panel members if cancer could be cured. His reply stayed with me: If you made it into your 70s and you died being hit by a bus or truck, yes, you could be said to have been cured.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

not nowadays


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> What's responsible for the terrifying amounts of cancer?


Great question. I’m not sure. Lockdowns and Covid NPI’s wouldn’t cause cancer. I think the amount of cancer is probably similar than pre Covid but due to no cancer screening, no in person MD visits and people just generally afraid to go out (including going to the hospital) that it’s all presenting at once vs over a few years. I do think the lockdowns and zero screening are responsible though for people presenting with much later stage cancers and therefore a much poorer prognosis.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

RJP110 said:


> Great question. I’m not sure. Lockdowns and Covid NPI’s wouldn’t cause cancer. I think the amount of cancer is probably similar than pre Covid but due to no cancer screening, no in person MD visits and people just generally afraid to go out (including going to the hospital) that it’s all presenting at once vs over a few years. I do think the lockdowns and zero screening are responsible though for people _presenting with much later stage cancers_ and therefore a much poorer prognosis.


Good point, one shouldn't confuse how far various cancers _progressed_, once started, during lockdown, with their incidence. In similar fashion, it may also be true that many folks experiencing angina or other telltale signs of heart disease also convinced themselves "it's nothing" and didn't seek diagnosis, perhaps too late, because of lockdown and staffing shortages.

We have mountains of data indicating that health is associated with income levels, but fundamentally health is a question of access, and whatever provides or deprives that access. Money _can_ buy you access, but has a harder time when there isn't much *to* access.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

@markxander @mhammer
You are deadly right guys and I must apologize for the incorrect shortcut I took. 

I was referring to the contract between Israel and the vaccine co. to give access to all their data as they paid lower than the general market for the huge vaccine doses they bought.
So authors from Israel published some of those data.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

GuitarT said:


> Lack of early detection and reduced access to treatment over the last two and a half years..


I think that reduced access here is gonna be a big problem. They've known about the aging demographic for decades and nothing much has been done. It's already too late because whatever solutions, if any, are brought forward will take effect in maybe 10 years or so. The priorities are obvious insofar as 100 billion has been pledged for climate change initiatives in underdeveloped countries most of which funding, apart from a few photo-op windmills, will line the pockets of the local warlords. I suspect that healthcare will eventually be rationed and I wouldn't care to speculate on what principles the bureaucracy will use to determine who gets treatment.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

mhammer said:


> So, um, you're on Danielle Smith's side?


I'm not sure if this was directed at me. I had to google her name as I had no idea who she is.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

It was, but I'll happily retract....which is what she did the day after.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Wardo said:


> I think that reduced access here is gonna be a big problem. They've known about the aging demographic for decades and nothing much has been done. It's already too late because whatever solutions, if any, are brought forward will take effect in maybe 10 years or so. The priorities are obvious insofar as 100 billion has been pledged for climate change initiatives in underdeveloped countries most of which funding, apart from a few photo-op windmills, will line the pockets of the local warlords. _I suspect that healthcare will eventually be rationed and I wouldn't care to speculate on what principles the bureaucracy will use to determine who gets treatment._


Whatever principles they are, or will be, you can bet your bottom dollar they will be questioned, if only because health is a provincial responsibility and provinces have different budgets and demographics to contend with, so they won't all use the same principles.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

mhammer said:


> Whatever principles they are, or will be, you can bet your bottom dollar they will be questioned, if only because health is a provincial responsibility and provinces have different budgets and demographics to contend with, so they won't all use the same principles.


Obtuse as usual.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Things are smelling political again. And not just this thread.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

mhammer said:


> It was, but I'll happily retract....which is what she did the day after.


Yeah I saw her statement. Pretty tone deaf but there was/is a heavy amount of needless discrimination towards CV unvaccinated individuals. At one point my 14 year old boy was unable to go to a movie with his friends as he only had one shot and had already omicron. Anyone that thinks that was justified blows my mind.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

That was pretty much the crux of the matter, and the principle reason why this bloody virus stuck around so long and will remain around for a while. Too many looked at this from the perspective of "But what about what _I_ want?", and too few asked "What can I do to help get rid of this blight?". We paid the price for a society that insisted on being individualist, rather than collectivist.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

mhammer said:


> That was pretty much the crux of the matter, and the principle reason why this bloody virus stuck around so long and will remain around for a while. Too many looked at this from the perspective of "But what about what _I_ want?", and too few asked "What can I do to help get rid of this blight?". We paid the price for a society that insisted on being individualist, rather than collectivist.


I’m not disagreeing in general but I do not see how the Covid vaccine was ever a collective intervention, only individual. Despite what the media stated it was known early on it didn’t prevent transmission or acquisition. It was used to prevent severe disease. But really, the IFR even with the alpha strain was very lopsided as far as age. If you were over 60, Covid was MUCH worse than the flu. If you were under 20, the flu was about 10 times worse. And in between was more grey but largely dependent on overall health. So being that there is next to zero community benefit, mandates were and are ridiculous. And even as far as individual benefit you can’t impose general mandates when the risk of the vaccine is worse than the risk of the virus to many (namely young males 12-30). There should have been open dialog regarding each individuals risk profile. But as soon as anyone questioned whether they needed this vaccine they were automatically labeled as “anti-vax” despite the majority having all their standard vaccinations. And this BS is the reason why there's so much mistrust regarding vaccines in general and many are now NOT vaccinating their children for MMR etc. 

And as far as "remain around for a while", you mean forever. There was never a chance this virus would be eradicated. Far too transmissible, has a long incubation period, a non sterilizing vaccine and multiple animal reservoirs. And that was the alpha variant. The 'Covid Zero" population are delusional.

California had a mask compliance of 98% and very high vax uptake. And we are talking even outdoor masking. They fared no better (and in some cases worse) than other areas with minimal interventions.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

mhammer said:


> That was pretty much the crux of the matter, and the principle reason why this bloody virus stuck around so long and will remain around for a while. Too many looked at this from the perspective of "But what about what _I_ want?", and too few asked "What can I do to help get rid of this blight?". We paid the price for a society that insisted on being individualist, rather than collectivist.


It's sticking around because of the jab leading to immune escape and the virus learning to adapt. You never vaccinate during a pandemic, especially with this leaky 'chit. In fact it's not even a vaccine....it's a therapeutic, but unlike certain other therapeutic treatment protocols which work, this is leading to negative efficacy. To get the LNP's not to be rejected by the body it shuts down the normal immune response. The key here is uridine and the TLR's it turns off....look it up. Supposedly it was only to last a day or two, but two months on it's still happening, and 15 months later there are reports of the spike protein still active. It travels to every organ and part of the body and even passes the blood brain barrier....no vaccine has ever done that. That's why you see all the increase in adverse reports I put up there earlier on.

This is the price we've paid....not having an active debate with all the facts on the table. And the real price is we won't be reaching herd immunity anytime soon.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

RJP110 said:


> California had a mask compliance of 98% and very high vax uptake. And we are talking even outdoor masking. They fared no better (and in some cases worse) than other areas with minimal interventions.


I watch YouTube videos of people doing stuff in California and they were nor 98% compliant. The whole Trump thing, you're not a man if you wear a mask was very prevalent.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> I watch YouTube videos of people doing stuff in California and they were nor 98% compliant. The whole Trump thing, you're not a man if you wear a mask was very prevalent.


Yes, I mis spoke sorry. I was thinking of regionally in California such as the Bay Area abd LA. There was and still is very high mask use. My point is though that despite radically different vaccination rates and NPI’s, Covid outcomes are very similar.


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## Percy (Feb 18, 2013)

I think I am a carrier !
Or maybe the 500 or so toilets I have changed in my life has given me a superior immune system !








Dear unvaxxxed idiots!







www.youtube.com


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

Percy said:


> I think I am a carrier !
> Or maybe the 500 or so toilets I have changed in my life has given me a superior immune system !
> 
> 
> ...


All the crazy stuff that has followed....all based on a lie. And they're still pushing this garbage in Canada with nice shiny ads on TV. And people still support the lie. Time to go clean my toilet.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

HighNoon said:


> All the crazy stuff that has followed....all based on a lie. And they're still pushing this garbage in Canada with nice shiny ads on TV. And people still support the lie. Time to go clean my toilet.


What's the lie?


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

player99 said:


> What's the lie?


Oh fak! Here we go.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

player99 said:


> What's the lie?


Safe and effective.....do it to protect grandma....federal mandates resulting in job loss.....provincial and municipal decisions resulting in job loss....vaccine passports.....etc etc etc. All this resulting in business and personal foreclosures, increase in suicide, unable to fly or travel by train, couldn't attend sports events, or go to restaurants ....you figure out the rest.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

HighNoon said:


> Safe and effective.....do it to protect grandma....federal mandates resulting in job loss.....provincial and municipal decisions resulting in job loss....vaccine passports.....etc etc etc. All this resulting in business and personal foreclosures, increase in suicide, unable to fly or travel by train, couldn't attend sports events, or go to restaurants ....you figure out the rest.


But what's not true?


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

player99 said:


> But what's not true?


And the biggest of all, informed consent, which is the basis for our trust in the medical system.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

HighNoon said:


> And the biggest of all, informed consent, which is the basis for our trust in the medical system.


If there was no vaccine so much more would have happened. If the powers that be wouldn't have taken action, where would we be today?


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

player99 said:


> If there was no vaccine so much more would have happened. If the powers that be wouldn't have taken action, where would we be today?


It's not a vaccine....it doesn't offer immunity to a specific disease (the definition of a vaccine). It's a therapeutic and not a very good one at that. There are others that work much more effectively. Where would we be today? We'd be over the pandemic, because it would have burned through the population and we would have achieved herd immunity. With safe therapeutics you can project fewer people would have died. And people would trust 'the powers that be' because they handled it in a calm and effective manner, by actually following the pandemic plan that was in place. No mandates....no shut downs....no medical coercion. Heck, there wouldn't have been a Trucker's Convoy and the good citizens of Ottawa would have had more restful and quiet nights. And we'd have another $500 billion bucks in the kitty to deal with other stuff in our country. Other than that it's been perfectly delightful.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> What's the lie?


The lie was that the vaccine prevented infection and transmission. Pfizer recently lost a legal battle and had to release its vaccine information (that they wanted to hold till 2040!). The initial trial that the EUA was granted on never even tested for transmission (And they never did). Yet the Pfizer CEO stated it stops all symptoms and transmission. Fauci and all the other charlatans followed suit. They coerced millions based on the “if you won’t do it for yourself, do it to save grandma” rhetoric. Also, that lie of community benefit was the driver of ridiculous vaccine mandates. Pfizer recently confirmed this under testimony that transmission was never even looked at. They of course stated there was no time. When you are releasing a completely new technology and planning to vaccinate a billion people including pregnant women and children these steps need to happen (and ALWAYS have previously). Now all these politicians are scrambling stating they never said it stopped transmission, only severe disease. Unfortunately for them there’s this thing called the internet. Oh , and and they are continuing the absurdity with the bivalent booster which was literally tested on 8 mice! That’s it, 8 mice. And then they push to boost children and teens for a virus that’s the same risk as common cold to them.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1581028434498576385

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1579759795225198593


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> If there was no vaccine so much more would have happened. If the powers that be wouldn't have taken action, where would we be today?


Your statement has nothing to do with informed consent. The vaccine could have been rolled out with the REAL information and it would have had the same outcome. Give accurate risk/benefit info and I’m absolutely certain that the majority of people that were at risk would have taken it. And I actually think MORE people would have as their flip flopping caused so much mistrust. Lying and taking away someone’s right to choose is never the way. Because of these idiots Polio is making a resurgence


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

RJP110 said:


> their flip flopping caused so much mistrust


I certainly don't trust pharma.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

laristotle said:


> I certainly don't trust pharma.


I think pharma has its place but it’s dangerous to think they have our best interests in mind over massive profits. Let’s just keep in mind that Purdue pharma recently lost a lawsuit costing them 6 billion dollars for basically causing the opioid epidemic. And statins….a trillion dollar drug prescribed on the lie that high LDL causes heart disease.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I always knew the vaccine didn't cure, or prevent, it helped to reduce the severity of symptoms and death. It also reduced the viral load expelled into the air when one was infected, as well as reduced the number of days someone could transmit the disease.

I never heard anyone say it was a cure, or said anything other than what I stated. I listen to CBC radio. The experts they had on only stated what I wrote above.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> I always knew the vaccine didn't cure, or prevent, it helped to reduce the severity of symptoms and death. It also reduced the viral load expelled into the air when one was infected, as well as reduced the number of days someone could transmit the disease.
> 
> I never heard anyone say it was a cure, or said anything other than what I stated. I listen to CBC radio. The experts they had on only stated what I wrote above.


Viral loads are the same and so is days to transmit. Minimal difference with the alpha variant in 2020 but Zero difference after the alpha variant. The vaccine literally is just individual benefit. And clearly, CBC was the exception because the overwhelming majority of mainstream media (and public health experts) did in fact say it was a cure and stopped transmission….including our bumbling Federal leaders. 

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1444191965759873024


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Delta changed the rules a bit.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Plus when the got better information they updated their statements to reflect what they knew at the time.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

or to cover their ass.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> Plus when the got better information they updated their statements to reflect what they knew at the time.


Sorry, I have to disagree with this. Especially considering that there was never data to support their misinformation in the first place. I’m not certain it was nefarious or just rampant sensationalism and an information snowball rolling down hill. I can’t speak for CBC but that wasn’t the case until the proverbial “cat was out of the bag”. With omicron, global posted a story regarding how you shouldn’t allow unvaccinated family members to your house for Christmas. Sooo……. Also, this was WELL known before the trucker convoy which really was driven (pun intended😂) by the fact the mandates persisted despite longstanding evidence the vaccine had zero community benefit


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

laristotle said:


> or to cover their ass.


Exactly. I’ve kept close tabs on this since it started. The main players spouted BS and then pulled the “misinformation “ and “I listen to THE science” until they were outed and had no choice but to change their opinion. There are exceptions but they are far and few.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

What's the point? Should we have listened to Trump and injected bleach?

Do you think there was no reason to try to protect society using what knowledge was available?

We should have let everyone die? Fuck masks, isolating and Covid protocols?

As far as I understand there is no herd immunity with Covid.

Recent studies has shown the more times you get Covid the more likely you will experience long haul symptoms.


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

player99 said:


> Should we have listened to Trump and injected bleach?


To be fair, it might solve a lot of other problems


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

player99 said:


> Recent studies has shown the more times you get Covid the more likely you will experience long haul symptoms.


And also a more rapid hair loss.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> What's the point? Should we have listened to Trump and injected bleach?
> 
> Do you think there was no reason to try to protect society using what knowledge was available?
> 
> ...


I think there was a reason to initiate "Two weeks to flatten the curve" not "2 years and maybe 3 to flatten the curve". Lockdowns were not the answer and never will be. The only argument would be potentially in areas like NZ or Australia where they are a closed system to try and delay until there are therapeutics and vaccines. Yet ALL these areas had the same outcome, just months apart. That's including the terrible Sweden, who actually did much better than the USA. The lockdowns killed more people globally than it saved from covid. Plain and simple. Cloth masks and surgical masks have never worked and never will. An N95 is a different story. But it better be fit tested, under your glasses and immovable. And an N95 is not healthy to be wearing hours on end either. 

For one, that is NOT what I'm saying. I'm saying that important information for the "Knowledge that was available", was just plain false. And as things snowballed out of control and that became more common knowledge they had the chance to do the right thing. Admit it, accept responsibility and give the facts they absolutely know at present. Then take a balanced approach (Like EVERY medical crisis in the past). But they didn't. They lied, or stated facts that they didn't know and made it sound like it was absolute science. .... until it all came out. Imagine if the government and media took this same stance in the 80's with the Aids crisis? Telling families to segregate their gay relatives because they may give them Aids. Or telling them that they don't deserve health care due to their choice. 

Again, there was a reason but it went on FAR too long. And as far as long covid, All ILI's have had lingering symptoms and CV is no different. Your best defence (Unless your plan is to wear an N95 forever....which is absolutely your choice) is to decrease your co-morbidities and be healthy when you meet the virus (and we all will, many times over).

It's not 2020. Different virus, different socio-economic picture and also many therapeutics. There is absolutely herd immunity with CV, not against transmission or acquisition but your Memory B/T cells are ready to fight against all future infections. If an individual doesn't feel safe, that's fine. Take measures. But at this point if that person also expects men, women and children who DO feel safe to mask for their benefit then that's just plain selfish.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

All I can say is I have never caught a dose. Of Covid. I have been very good to wear N95 + a regular mask and disposable gloves. That's just when I masturbate though.

Seriously I still gear up, I don't go out much except to shop, I am really careful still. Many people I know recently have been hit hard with Covid. But not me, or my 89 year old father who I look after. Argue about precautions being stupid or a scam, but I feel they have kept me safe from Covid and it's short and long term health effects.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

player99 said:


> All I can say is I have never caught a dose. Of Covid. I have been very good to wear N95 + a regular mask and disposable gloves. That's just when I masturbate though.
> 
> Seriously I still gear up, I don't go out much except to shop, I am really careful still. Many people I know recently have been hit hard with Covid. But not me, or my 89 year old father who I look after. Argue about precautions being stupid or a scam, but I feel they have kept me safe from Covid and it's short and long term health effects.


I don't wear a mask (just based on comparing micron sizes). If it was Ebola or something nasty like that I'd be wearing a proper fitted respirator with N100's cartridges. Preparation wise I keep an early treatment protocol bag of goodies, that would serve me well for any respiratory condition. Grab a nebulizer and a blood pack size of food grade hydrogen peroxide and saline solution. 5,000 I.U.'s of Vit D each day, especially for Dad. For public places I try to avoid people on their knees heaving, or people hacking up chunks of phlegm, sweating profusely and talking about the Devil. The solution has always been industrial air control.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

RJP110 said:


> Your statement has nothing to do with informed consent. The vaccine could have been rolled out with the REAL information and it would have had the same outcome. Give accurate risk/benefit info and I’m absolutely certain that the majority of people that were at risk would have taken it. And I actually think MORE people would have as their flip flopping caused so much mistrust. Lying and taking away someone’s right to choose is never the way. Because of these idiots Polio is making a resurgence


Some of the polio re-emergence is related to the oral vaccine drops (I think that's the Sabin one). Not quite the bang for the buck as the injection (cheaper though and easier to administer). I know that vaccine induced polio was the case in Pakistan....probably a few African countries as well. And there appears to be a big uptick in herpes zoster, referring to viral reactivation after the jab.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

player99 said:


> All I can say is I have never caught a dose. Of Covid. I have been very good to wear N95 + a regular mask and disposable gloves. That's just when I masturbate though.
> 
> Seriously I still gear up, I don't go out much except to shop, I am really careful still. Many people I know recently have been hit hard with Covid. But not me, or my 89 year old father who I look after. Argue about precautions being stupid or a scam, but I feel they have kept me safe from Covid and it's short and long term health effects.


That’s awesome and I sure hope your father and yourself do not acquire it. The overwhelming majority of people have gotten Covid whether no mask, surgical mask or N95. like I said previously, if the mask and precautions are working for you go for it. At this point though, it’s an individual choice.


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## RJP110 (Sep 15, 2020)

HighNoon said:


> Some of the polio re-emergence is related to the oral vaccine drops (I think that's the Sabin one). Not quite the bang for the buck as the injection (cheaper though and easier to administer). I know that vaccine induced polio was the case in Pakistan....probably a few African countries as well. And there appears to be a big uptick in herpes zoster, referring to viral reactivation after the jab.


Agreed. The oral polio vaccine was responsible for vaccine induced polio vs the injectable. It is an alarming trend though that (in my opinion) essential childhood vaccination rates have suffered dramatically over the bullshit from the past 2 years.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

A couple of the people who work at my office had never heard of polio just didn’t know what it was. They never heard of an iron lung either and thought vaccines are orange man bad.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Paul Running said:


> View attachment 441319


We must be in the same age bracket. It's the first thing I thought of when I saw the thread title.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Steadfastly said:


> We must be in the same age bracket. It's the first thing I thought of when I saw the thread title.


That's what I had in mind two.


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