# i'm simple...explain this pricing



## ezcomes (Jul 28, 2008)

Used to go here when i visited Ottawa...havent been to the new place yet, but this stumps me...i don't get how a fake Gibson is worth more than an Epi


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## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

Consignment item? I've found their pricing to be either really good, or off the wall.


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## fogdart (Mar 22, 2017)

But that is an Epiphone???


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

Now, I’m not saying this is the case here, but I can imagine there are copies made, in the past, by well respected Japanese companies that are recognized as better guitars than the Epiphone (copies) and are actually priced accordingly.


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## Permanent Waves (Jun 2, 2020)

BlueRocker said:


> Consignment item? I've found their pricing to be either really good, or off the wall.


Both have green tags, so both are store-owned (Consignments are red tags). I also agree the pricing is usually really good on store-owned stuff (which I guess does not say much for how much they pay for their used instruments!) and the off-the-chart pricing stuff usually is consignment. I usually put stuff on consignment but they do tend to provide some guidance on pricing as they know what will move and at what price, and they are not interested in seeing stuff hang around for year.


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## dwagar (Mar 6, 2006)

I can't believe they are knowingly selling a counterfeit Gibson.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

dwagar said:


> I can't believe they are knowingly selling a counterfeit Gibson.


As long as they're up front about it being a counterfeit, the problem isn't immediately apparent to me.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

dwagar said:


> I can't believe they are knowingly selling a counterfeit Gibson.


Something something replicas.


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## Parabola (Oct 22, 2021)

Some of those older Japanese copies are fairly good quality and collectable. My first electric was a used copy of a Gibson Marauder….of all the things to copy lol.


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## BobChuck (Jan 16, 2012)

I am confused here...
OP mentions a fake Gibson, shows an Epiphone, everybody post without acknowledging this fact, except Fogdart.
What am I missing ?


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## dwagar (Mar 6, 2006)

BobChuck said:


> I am confused here...
> OP mentions a fake Gibson, shows an Epiphone, everybody post without acknowledging this fact, except Fogdart.
> What am I missing ?


Click on the small attachment on the bottom of his post.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Maybe it’s just a really good fake or a recognition that people will pay more if it says Gibson on the headstock regardless if its fake .. lol


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## dwagar (Mar 6, 2006)

Okay Player said:


> As long as they're up front about it being a counterfeit, the problem isn't immediately apparent to me.


Until some guy buys it, and a month later it shows up on Kijiji for $3000 with an ad that says "I inherited this guitar from my uncle, I don't know anything about guitars (code for don't blame me when you find out it's fake)".

As far as I'm concerned it should go to the wood chipper. I think it's illegal to sell a fake in the US, I guess it isn't in Canada.


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## Robhotdad (Oct 27, 2016)

The dollar is really losing its value. Those are both $300 starter guitars for kids. Wages are stagnant, interest rates are going up. Some young folks are really in for a shock.


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

dwagar said:


> Until some guy buys it, and a month later it shows up on Kijiji for $3000 with an ad that says "I inherited this guitar from my uncle, I don't know anything about guitars (code for don't blame me when you find out it's fake)".
> 
> As far as I'm concerned it should go to the wood chipper. I think it's illegal to sell a fake in the US, I guess it isn't in Canada.


This ^^^^^
It’s bad enough seeing counterfeits on kijiji. I _really_ don’t like seeing them in shops.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

2manyGuitars said:


> This ^^^^^
> It’s bad enough seeing counterfeits on kijiji. I _really_ don’t like seeing them in shops.


I'm being completely honest when I say this, but I'm not terribly concerned about that guitar fooling anyone who's actually going to be looking for Custom. I know very little about Gibson's and I already see things I'd be skeptical about.

I'm mostly curious about how Gibson would feel about them selling fake Gibson's given them being a Gibson dealer and all.


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## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

Permanent Waves said:


> Both have green tags, so both are store-owned (Consignments are red tags). I also agree the pricing is usually really good on store-owned stuff (which I guess does not say much for how much they pay for their used instruments!) and the off-the-chart pricing stuff usually is consignment. I usually put stuff on consignment but they do tend to provide some guidance on pricing as they know what will move and at what price, and they are not interested in seeing stuff hang around for year.


Says consignment in the listing.


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

Okay Player said:


> I'm being completely honest when I say this, but I'm not terribly concerned about that guitar fooling anyone who's actually going to be looking for Custom. I know very little about Gibson's and I already see things I'd be skeptical about.
> 
> I'm mostly curious about how Gibson would feel about them selling fake Gibson's given them being a Gibson dealer and all.


Spaceman is not listed as a Gibson dealer on the Gibson website.


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

Are you sure it's legal to openly sell counterfeit items in a store in Canada ?
Combating Counterfeit Products Act

Nobody is going to report that to the police ?


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

I reported it to gibson....


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## Robhotdad (Oct 27, 2016)

I think Slash was playing a fake Gibson some years back. If he puts it up for sale, will you report it to Gibson too? Someone call the police, Slash has a replica!!!


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

Robhotdad said:


> I think Slash was playing a fake Gibson some years back. If he puts it up for sale, will you report it to Gibson too? Someone call the police, Slash has a replica!!!


Probably. Can't really see the difference.


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

Mark Brown said:


> I reported it to gibson....


If they're not a registered dealer, they won't blink an eye on this.

I tried the RCMP, but their email for such is down.



Robhotdad said:


> I think Slash was playing a fake Gibson some years back. If he puts it up for sale, will you report it to Gibson too? Someone call the police, Slash has a replica!!!


Owning one and selling one are two different matters.


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

For anyone saying “what’s the big deal?”, try opening a shop and selling fake Rolex watches, counterfeit Coach handbags, etc. See how long _that_ lasts.


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## Permanent Waves (Jun 2, 2020)

BlueRocker said:


> Says consignment in the listing.


Ah, I see the green tag actually belongs to the Ampeg cabinet in the background. That explains a lot. I've seen a few Chibsons at Spaceman and they are typically well marked as fakes and priced around $400-$500.


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## Jim Soloway (Sep 27, 2013)

Okay Player said:


> As long as they're up front about it being a counterfeit, the problem isn't immediately apparent to me.


Are you really ok with counterfeits if the seller is open about it? Isn't that kind of like being ok with it being stolen as long as the seller is open about it? And if you think not then please tell me what the difference is.


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## bw66 (Dec 17, 2009)

Robhotdad said:


> I think Slash was playing a fake Gibson some years back. If he puts it up for sale, will you report it to Gibson too? Someone call the police, Slash has a replica!!!


It seems to me that Gibson actually sold a signature guitar based on the fake. But I may have gotten that from the internet.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

Jim Soloway said:


> Are you really ok with counterfeits if the seller is open about it?


I'm unlikely to buy one, but if you want to buy one from someone else, yes, I'm okay with it.



Jim Soloway said:


> Isn't that kind of like being ok with it being stolen as long as the seller is open about it?


No, because in the case of physical theft you're physically taking something from someone. In this case, with a willing seller, willing buyer, there's no victim. No one knowingly trafficking in fakes is ever going to he giving Gibson $5k for a new Custom, so it's not like they can be honestly painted as a victim. If you're making an argument from an intellectual property perspective, again Gibson is as guilty as anyone. The Slash signature that's a copy of a copy comes to mind.

I also don't think people selling or building partscasters are thieves.


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## elburnando (11 mo ago)

dwagar said:


> I can't believe they are knowingly selling a counterfeit Gibson.


There's a guy with a shop called MusicM in Mississauga who sells counterfeits of all brands, even boutique builders, and pianos too. Except he doesn't tag them as replicas, rather "consignment" or "refurbished". When i was there I saw a woman gushing about what a great "steal of a deal" she got on her Yamaha piano, when it was obviously a fake. I've report him several times, as I don't like people getting slammed like that. I also don't like fakes out in the market.


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## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

Jim Soloway said:


> Are you really ok with counterfeits if the seller is open about it? Isn't that kind of like being ok with it being stolen as long as the seller is open about it? And if you think not then please tell me what the difference is.


I think it depends on your tax bracket - these things seem to get a pass all the time
Tom Bartlett Aged 1959 Les Paul Replica Burst Brazilian rosewood board | Reverb













Okay Player said:


> If you're making an argument from an intellectual property perspective, again Gibson is as guilty as anyone. The Slash signature that's a copy of a copy comes to mind.


First of all the Slash is a copy of a copy of a Gibson product. Hard to establish the guy who made Slash's "replica" was harmed by violating IP he didn't own. The "eye for an eye" argument against Gibson IP is weak. The same rules apply to everyone - so you don't get to rob a bank because they overcharged you on your monthly service fee.


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

Okay Player said:


> In this case, with a willing seller, willing buyer, there's no victim.


But one day, this guitar WILL be offered up as a legitimate Gibson.

The more of these that are out there, the higher the likelihood that someone will be the victim of fraud one day. The harder it is to sell these, the fewer there would be out there. By offering a legitimate way to mass market their counterfeit, Spaceman is only going to make it worse.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

2manyGuitars said:


> But one day, this guitar WILL be offered up as a legitimate Gibson.
> 
> The more of these that are out there, the higher the likelihood that someone will be the victim of fraud one day. The harder it is to sell these, the fewer there would be out there. By offering a legitimate way to mass market their counterfeit, Spaceman is only going to make it worse.


Maybe it will, maybe it won't. He asked a question and I answered. As I said earlier in the thread you aren't going to fool many people with a copy. The ones you do aren't doing their homework, and to be honest are likely flippers who think they're pulling a fast one on somebody.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

BlueRocker said:


> I think it depends on your tax bracket - these things seem to get a pass all the time
> Tom Bartlett Aged 1959 Les Paul Replica Burst Brazilian rosewood board | Reverb
> 
> 
> ...


The guy who made Slashes built one of the most iconic guitars in music history. Gibson is now taking the credit for it. It's also hardly the only example of Gibson taking inspiration from elsewhere.

No one said you can rob a bank because you think the fees are too high. You could however use another bank or open your own. Now, one could make the argument that "You couldn't use another banks logo on your new bank" and that would be true, but on this case we're talking about Gibson who has proven time and time again that they don't seem to think that anyone else should be allowed to participate in their industry at all, and that absolutely factors into how seriously I take claims about them being victimized.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

Gibson must now face antitrust litigation in Heritage case, US judge rules


Gibson must face antitrust litigation as part of its legal battle with Heritage Guitars, a Michigan judge has ruled.




guitar.com


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