# NDIYPD



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Here's a combo delay-reverb pedal I built in one of the predrilled chassis that Aimish from Diamond Pedals provided me with.

There's five PT2399 digital delay chips in this beast, 3 for the delay, and two for the ersatz reverb. The delay is the Tonepad Rebote 3, and the reverb is Merlin's Equinox circuit. I etched and drilled both boards.

The delay seems to get about 1200-1400msec and has modulation. I added a treble rolloff for the repeats, and a bass cut for the overall delay path, that rolls off below around 280hz. I like it. I also adjusted the Mix control so that I can make delay louder than dry. The repeats are not runaway, but I can fix that.

The reverb is so-so. More cheap amp than Lexicon church hall. It also has a bass cut toggle.

The input jack is to the right of the Thin toggle. The rear skirt has (L to R) reverb out, delay out, feedback in. Delay out just taps the transfer point between reverb and delay. The Feedback in breaks the input to the Feedback pot such that I could insert something between either of the outputs and the Feedback in to modify each repeat.

It won't replace my other delay pedals or rack units, but I just wanted to see if I could do it. I like the modulated delays. Adding a bit of reverb to each repeat is kinda neat too.









Aimish gave me two boxes like this one. Some years back, Jeorge "Mr. Huge" Tripps gave me one of those uber-rare MN3011 multi-tap bucket-brigade chips, like the ones used for the old A/DA STD-1 (below). Once I retire next year, I think I'd like to build a derivative of that unit into the 2nd box. It'd make a helluva stereo chorus.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Delay into reverb is just such a nice sound.

Nice work.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

mhammer said:


> Once I retire next year, I think I'd like to build....


I have heard you mention this phrase quite a few times now. It seems to me that you had also several projects at various stages of completion when we met in the summer. 

I'm thinking that you will not be coming out of your workshop for some fresh air (i.e., no solder fumes) for quite some time. In addition, you can't let your wonderful garden become neglected and you will need to visit Lee Valley often. Things are going to be VERY BUSY!!!


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

Budda said:


> Delay into reverb is just such a nice sound.
> 
> Nice work.


I find unless I'm hitting a crispy clean amp, I find it gets washed out


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

5 PT chips? Holy cow.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

greco said:


> I have heard you mention this phrase quite a few times now. It seems to me that you had also several projects at various stages of completion when we met in the summer.
> 
> I'm thinking that you will not be coming out of your workshop for some fresh air (i.e., no solder fumes) for quite some time. In addition, you can't let your wonderful garden become neglected and you will need to visit Lee Valley often. Things are going to be VERY BUSY!!!


LOL A couple of year of 'retirement' and he might have to get a govt job to get some much-needed rest.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

cboutilier said:


> I find unless I'm hitting a crispy clean amp, I find it gets washed out


Gotta get it dialled in. Some wash is expected when theres moderate dirt involved.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

Budda said:


> Gotta get it dialled in. Some wash is expected when theres moderate dirt involved.


It's much better when I use my amps reverb and the delay out front, than my delay and holy grail out front.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Granny Gremlin said:


> 5 PT chips? Holy cow.


You can really only get about 400 decent msec of delay out of one of them. Cascading 3 gets you over a second.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

High/Deaf said:


> LOL A couple of year of 'retirement' and he might have to get a govt job to get some much-needed rest.


Don't laugh. I'm trying to lay the groundwork for post-retirement contracts even now. Not because I'm eager to double-dip, but because there's stuff that nobody else in the country knows more about than I do, and I'll be damned if I'll let departments throw big bucks at idiot consultants.

It'll probably be better for my back if I get up from my desk and stop soldering once in a while anyways.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

greco said:


> I have heard you mention this phrase quite a few times now. It seems to me that you had also several projects at various stages of completion when we met in the summer.
> 
> I'm thinking that you will not be coming out of your workshop for some fresh air (i.e., no solder fumes) for quite some time. In addition, you can't let your wonderful garden become neglected and you will need to visit Lee Valley often. Things are going to be VERY BUSY!!!


When I did my doctorate out in Victoria, and we were trying to book retirees to come into the lab for testing, it was often the case that they'd pull out their little appointment book, and rifle through a bunch of pages before they could find an available time slot to fit us in. It can be a much busier lifestyle than working.

That's why the afterlife is reserved for sorting all those old family photos.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

The A/DA STD-1 Stereo Tapped Delay was an amazing and sorely underappreciated effect. You can find the owner's manual here: Synth Manual: A-DA: STD 1 owner's manual : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive Worth a read to get you thinking about things you can accomplish that you never ever considered previously. Tim "Retrosonic" Larwill and I had discussed producing a scaled-back STD-1 for a little while, because he had stumbled onto a reasonably-priced stash of the magic chips, but I was too slow in coming up with the design and the opportunity just evaporated away. I know that several of the older bucket brigade chips have been reissued, but I don't know if there would be enough momentum to bring the MN3011 back. It was used in just a couple of pedals, and some Gallien-Kruger amps, in addition to the STD-1, but that simply wasn't enough volume to justify continued manufacture. In the meantime, I can work on something just for me.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

cboutilier said:


> It's much better when I use my amps reverb and the delay out front, than my delay and holy grail out front.


Is your amp's verb after the preamp?

Ive been running everything out front for two and a half fun-filled years haha.


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

mhammer said:


> You can really only get about 400 decent msec of delay out of one of them. Cascading 3 gets you over a second.


Oh I know (I've had a dual chip pedal and built a single chip one). Still (1 PT is more delay time than any single BBD - e.g. Boss DM-2 or Memory man).

It's awesome and those chips aren't expensive so rock on. That is skirting phrase sampling territory.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

Budda said:


> Is your amp's verb after the preamp?
> 
> Ive been running everything out front for two and a half fun-filled years haha.


Yep. Silverface/Blackface Fender reverb


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

mhammer said:


> When I did my doctorate out in Victoria, and we were trying to book retirees to come into the lab for testing, it was often the case that they'd pull out their little appointment book, and rifle through a bunch of pages before they could find an available time slot to fit us in. It can be a much busier lifestyle than working.
> 
> That's why the afterlife is reserved for sorting all those old family photos.


What is your background in? I got the impression that you were indeed very learned, but I didn't realize you had a PhD.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Granny Gremlin said:


> Oh I know (I've had a dual chip pedal and built a single chip one). Still (1 PT is more delay time than any single BBD - e.g. Boss DM-2 or Memory man).
> 
> It's awesome and those chips aren't expensive so rock on. That is skirting phrase sampling territory.


At 45 cents apiece, you bet your bippy they're cheap. For ambience, rather than whole phrase repeat, I generally prefer some additional progressive treble cut on the repeats, so that they don't perceptually intrude when there are lots of them in a short period of time. For true phrase sampling, where you want the repeat to sound exactly like the original, and not fade into the background, a person would want much higher fidelity than those 45 cent chips provide. They're ridiculously cost-effective for some tasks, but just not enough for others.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

cboutilier said:


> What is your background in? I got the impression that you were indeed very learned, but I didn't realize you had a PhD.


Nuthin' magical about a doctorate. You just have to like ramen _a lot _to be able to put in the time.  Humility and patience is more essential to advanced degrees than intelligence.

I'm a psychologist. I did animal work for a decade (our lab was working with one of the labs that took the Nobel for medicine last year), before moving into aging and development across the lifespan, and eventually into workplace stuff. I actually learned much of what I know about signal processing in the mid-1970's, learning how to do electrophysiological recordings. There is much in common between sensing a guitar string to making a speaker break up, and detecting a biological signal of several microvolts and getting it to the point where it can drive a pen on a chart recorder. They both require multiple cascaded gain stages, proper filtering and level-management.


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## amagras (Apr 22, 2015)

greco said:


> I have heard you mention this phrase quite a few times now. It seems to me that you had also several projects at various stages of completion when we met in the summer.
> 
> I'm thinking that you will not be coming out of your workshop for some fresh air (i.e., no solder fumes) for quite some time. In addition, you can't let your wonderful garden become neglected and you will need to visit Lee Valley often. Things are going to be VERY BUSY!!!


Although this ^^^ might sound like a poetical gibberish or coded language I understand it all...I was there!!!


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## amagras (Apr 22, 2015)

mhammer said:


> a bass cut for the overall delay path, that rolls off below around 280hz.


Does that mean that it will affect every signal coming out of the delay or it doesn't affect the dry signal? 



mhammer said:


> I also adjusted the Mix control so that I can make delay louder than dry.


Is it possible to make it wet only? 



mhammer said:


> The reverb is so-so. More cheap amp than Lexicon church hall.


Sounds to me like the interesting type of reverb!


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

amagras said:


> Does that mean that it will affect every signal coming out of the delay or it doesn't affect the dry signal?


Dry signal is full bandwidth. The control just cuts bass from the delay only.



> Is it possible to make it wet only?


Not right now, but it could be arranged. Actually, now that I think of it, what I called the Feedback-in can also serve as wet-only out.



> Sounds to me like the interesting type of reverb!


Well I suppose everything is useful eventually, but trust me, it is not that interesting. I have a few sets of Alesis chips ( Wavefront Semiconductor | Products | AL3201B ) that will provide much better reverb, but have to install them on boards. Maybe in future, I'll replace the board I have in there now with a much better reverb.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

mhammer said:


> Nuthin' magical about a doctorate. You just have to like ramen _a lot _to be able to put in the time.  Humility and patience is more essential to advanced degrees than intelligence.
> 
> I'm a psychologist. I did animal work for a decade (our lab was working with one of the labs that took the Nobel for medicine last year), before moving into aging and development across the lifespan, and eventually into workplace stuff. I actually learned much of what I know about signal processing in the mid-1970's, learning how to do electrophysiological recordings. There is much in common between sensing a guitar string to making a speaker break up, and detecting a biological signal of several microvolts and getting it to the point where it can drive a pen on a chart recorder. They both require multiple cascaded gain stages, proper filtering and level-management.


I know all about the time haha. I'm halfway through my second undergrad.


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## bduguay (Jul 15, 2009)

Wicked cool build there Mark!
B.


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## dcole (Oct 8, 2008)

Nice build mhammer. Did you use rub-ons for the lettering on the case?





cboutilier said:


> I find unless I'm hitting a crispy clean amp, I find it gets washed out


That would make sense if you have delay and reverb in the front. You want effects like that in your effects loop or after any distortion in your chain. Sound way better that way .


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

dcole said:


> Nice build mhammer. Did you use rub-ons for the lettering on the case?


Yup. An art-supply store near work was clearing out all their rub-on stock a decade back, so I bought a whole stack of it. I'm more a fan of the MXR-style packaging anyway, so solid colours and simple legending suits my style. The trick with rub-on transfers is that one needs to keep it from drying out over time, and a light coat of laquer over the painted/powder-coated box gives the letters something to grab on to.


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## dcole (Oct 8, 2008)

mhammer said:


> Yup. An art-supply store near work was clearing out all their rub-on stock a decade back, so I bought a whole stack of it. I'm more a fan of the MXR-style packaging anyway, so solid colours and simple legending suits my style. The trick with rub-on transfers is that one needs to keep it from drying out over time, and a light coat of laquer over the painted/powder-coated box gives the letters something to grab on to.


So you laquer the box, then put the rub-ons on? Do you do a light coat of laquer after as well to seal them on?


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Yup. Just a light spray first for some "traction", and then whatever it takes afterward to make the letters resistant to rubbing off or chipping. I'm not a gigging musician, so what works for me personally in my basement may well look like hell in short order for someone who packs up a pedalboard nightly. But you asked, and that's what I do.

Guillaume Fairfield probably has the best idea for legending his pedals. He has a buddy who uses an alphanumeric punch set and bangs out each box individually. Looks "as good as new" 5 years down the line.


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## dcole (Oct 8, 2008)

mhammer said:


> Guillaume Fairfield probably has the best idea for legending his pedals. He has a buddy who uses an alphanumeric punch set and bangs out each box individually. Looks "as good as new" 5 years down the line.


I seen that Fairfield has his pedals stamped like that. Seemed like an easy way to label boxes, permanently.


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