# Gibson still quality?



## Old Dave (Dec 8, 2020)

I'm a long time player and teacher , however with accoustic and classical. With pandemic boredom setting in , I have been thinking of getting an electric for fun. I used to tour with a Les Paul years ago . It was an early 70's and had serious quality control issue , mainly the pickup pole pieces didn't line up with the strings , as well as cosmetic slopiness. I was thinking of a new 335 , but am wary of Gibson from what I've heard from various players. Does one need to go full Custom Shop to get the kind of quality that there reputation was built on , or are the regular new 335's well done?


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I have a 2015 Firebird, a 2015 LP Jr. and a 2018 LP Jr. All of of them are good guitars. Fit and finish, is good, intonation is good and no dud frets. The 2018 LP Jr. is very nicely done.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

I guess the question is how badly do you need it to say Gibson?


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## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

I have four Gibson Les Pauls currently (2007, 2016, two 2018's), as well as a couple of Epiphones (335 and a Wilshire). The quality of the hardware is noticeably better on the Gibsons, and I've had no issues with any of them quality-wise. Epiphones are a little more hit-and-miss, but are an alternative. There are lots of quality non-Gibson guitars out there as well - depends on what floats your boat. I would purchase any of these guitars again.


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## StevieMac (Mar 4, 2006)

If you're set on getting a recent Gibson 335, my experience with the Memphis built guitars (I've probably have a had a dozen or so in my hands) was this: Not a single dud among them and fit & finish were top notch. Gibson has really stepped up their game with that line of guitars in particular IMO.


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## Old Dave (Dec 8, 2020)

StevieMac said:


> If you're set on getting a recent Gibson 335, my experience with the Memphis built guitars (I've probably have a had a dozen or so in my hands) was this: Not a single dud among them and fit & finish were top notch. Gibson has really stepped up their game with that line of guitars in particular IMO.


When you say Memphis built , are you refering to the regular lineup or Custom Shop?


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

IMO, they are as good or better than ever.


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## StevieMac (Mar 4, 2006)

Old Dave said:


> When you say Memphis built , are you refering to the regular lineup or Custom Shop?


Just the regular line up, but particularly those made within the last 5 years or so, up until 2019.


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## Alex (Feb 11, 2006)

Old Dave said:


> I'm a long time player and teacher , however with accoustic and classical. With pandemic boredom setting in , I have been thinking of getting an electric for fun. I used to tour with a Les Paul years ago . It was an early 70's and had serious quality control issue , mainly the pickup pole pieces didn't line up with the strings , as well as cosmetic slopiness. I was thinking of a new 335 , but am wary of Gibson from what I've heard from various players. Does one need to go full Custom Shop to get the kind of quality that there reputation was built on , or are the regular new 335's well done?


If cosmetics/sloppiness is a concern, I would go with a CS guitar. I agree with the comments about Gibson being currently on top of their game (Fender and PRS as well in my experience). If you don’t mind not having the Gibson logo, check out Eastman’s version of the 335. A lot of guitar for the money.


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## GouldyGuitar (Jun 6, 2020)

Big fan of my 2017 Les Paul traditional. My main guitar and will be for years to come. I do however thing you need to play A LOT of them to find an amazing one. They're all relatively good nowadays, but some are incredible, and that's true with every brand. I don't care how much people say PRS guitars are all consistently great, it's not true. Good? Yes. Very playable? Yes. But not all incredible.

I decided to do an experiment and went to my favorite shops (The Arts Music and Cosmo Music) to play every guitar from a brand I'd never played really (prs, I'm a traditional guy). They were all comfortable, good sounding for the most part, but only 1 blew me away, and it wasn't the most expensive one! It was a particular S2 McCarty that was all mahogany. SUPER light, amazing sounding, so I ran out with it!

The same can be said for gibson, although in my experience, less consistent (however I haven't played tons of brand new ones as of late). All of them are GOOD guitars for the most part, but some are INCREDIBLE and the only way to get an incredible one, is to play lots of them, not to mention it's totally subjective. However IMO the way a guitar resonates and just fundamentally how well that guitar was put together is not subjective. Some are duds, some are good, and some are fantastic. Just gotta play lots until you find the one for you!

Happy hunting!


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## loudtubeamps (Feb 2, 2012)

or 'The Heritage' 530/535's


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

GouldyGuitar said:


> so I ran out with it! ....


Did they run after you .. lol


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

All this talk of Gibson quality the last few years probably has a lot to do with “the squeaky wheel gets the grease”. Of course everyone remembers the threads pointing out all the “flaws” with their new guitar but for every one of those owners, there are thousands who have zero issues and love their guitars. They just don’t post threads about them.

...and I’m not saying that someone who gets a new guitar with issues doesn’t have the right to post about it. Just saying that the number you hear about is a tiny percentage compared to the great ones.


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

I have been very fortunate thus far. My LP, SG, and J185 are as close to perfect as I need.

A good friend rejected 3 different 355's last year at L&M because, in his words, they had twisted necks. The one I did try was fretting out at the 15th fret but I thought it may have recovered with a decent adjustment. My friend knows his stuff though and for 6 grand he's got a right to expect (his definition of) perfection.


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## troyhead (May 23, 2014)

StevieMac said:


> If you're set on getting a recent Gibson 335, my experience with the Memphis built guitars (I've probably have a had a dozen or so in my hands) was this: Not a single dud among them and fit & finish were top notch. Gibson has really stepped up their game with that line of guitars in particular IMO.


I'd agree, for the ones I've tried.

If you want something part Les Paul, part 335, you could check out the ES Les Paul. They are Memphis built, play and sound fantastic, and are the lightest guitars ever! The MHS pickups sound amazing.


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## blueshores_guy (Apr 8, 2007)

loudtubeamps said:


> or 'The Heritage' 530/535's


This.
And if you want more bling, try to find a Heritage H555


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Remember 335's have one less upper fret and the cutaway makes it tough to reach the upper register.


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## DaddyDog (Apr 21, 2017)

Gretsch.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

Old Dave said:


> mainly the pickup pole pieces didn't line up with the strings ,


I'm not really sure that's an issue beyond appearance.
The pole pieces don't create 6 little magnetic fields, but there's one big one.
As long as the strings fall in that field you should be fine.
(I did once try a sound hole pickup on my 12 string, and the field was narrower than my strings--but there were no pole pieces.)
It's never bothered me.

maybe others notice something, maybe not.

just an observation, not a criticism.


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## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

Gibson still quality?
That is entirely subjective and fraught with stubborn bullheaded opinions on both sides of the issue.
Some people insist every Gibson is perfect.
Some people insist there hasn't been a good Gibson for 35+ years.

My advise?
You've been out of the game a long time.
Save some money and get your toes wet slowly.
Get an Epiphone.


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## TheGoodTheGain11 (Nov 25, 2020)

TO BEGIN WITH PEOPLE COMPLAIN TO MUCH , i have to touch my tuners and tune by ear in a jiffy :,( !!! What if im a little sharp for this bar gig . That being said there guitar are nice !!!

I dont mess with those robot tuners or pull push knob .

Give me a gibson 60 neck style , and some top of the line pick ups , thin or fat , it plays and just sounds better , fuller 

Ive own the american standard strat , tone is king baby solid body neck through and the resale over all really good .

ALLL THIS BEING SAID BUY AN EPIPHONE FOR 800$-999$ and there just about up there lol 

proof in the pics
Epiphone 100th anniversary 
Les paul lite 2019 gibby


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## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

I get plenty of 335s in my shop for setup etc. Very few are bad, some are quite good, some excellent. However, I will say that the 335 is the most inconsistent of all the standard Gibson electrics. I have had a couple of the CME 335s in that both had bad neck angles and a rise at the tung that could not be adequately corrected without removing frets. 

Try before you buy.


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## colchar (May 22, 2010)

My Gibsons are all of excellent quality. I also have a 335 for sale in the classifieds here if you're interested.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

BMW-KTM said:


> Gibson still quality?
> That is entirely subjective and fraught with stubborn bullheaded opinions on both sides of the issue.
> Some people insist every Gibson is perfect.
> Some people insist there hasn't been a good Gibson for 35+ years.
> ...


My MIK Sheraton is a beauty.


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## KapnKrunch (Jul 13, 2016)

Make sure you try the Godin Premiere.


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

I own two very nice Gibsons and my take on it is that the difference between Gibson and the Japanese is that if you shop around long enough you can still find a flawless Gibson but you will have to shop even longer to find its Japanese equivalent that actually has a flaw. My advice is to go Yamaha or Ibanez Japan.

SA 2200


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## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

BEACHBUM said:


> I own two very nice Gibsons and my take on it is that the difference between Gibson and the Japanese is that if you shop around long enough you can still find a flawless Gibson but you will have to shop even longer to find its Japanese equivalent that actually has a flaw. My advice is to go Yamaha or Ibanez Japan.
> 
> SA 2200
> View attachment 340254
> ...


Great guitars for sure and way better QC. I've owned a few Ibanez as-200s and a couple Yamaha sa2200. There's a pretty big difference in feel though. The Ibanez uses a 9.5 radius and the Yamaha has a 14 radius. Some people wouldn't notice but I find with the Yamaha, it feels very flat. Older 335s had a 9.5 radius as well. Modern Gibson is 12.


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

zztomato said:


> Great guitars for sure and way better QC. I've owned a few Ibanez as-200s and a couple Yamaha sa2200. There's a pretty big difference in feel though. The Ibanez uses a 9.5 radius and the Yamaha has a 14 radius. Some people wouldn't notice but I find with the Yamaha, it feels very flat. Older 335s had a 9.5 radius as well. Modern Gibson is 12.


And some tonal differences as well. I do love Gibson pickups in general although I have to say that the Ibanez Super 58's that are in the AS 200 and that I have in my 83 AM 205 are my all time favorites. It can also be said that the early versions of the SA 2200 were a bit bright for some folks taste but Yamaha has now corrected that with a change of pot values on recent models. I did the same on my early version and they're now sweet as syrup. Having said that at the end of the day it's all just a matter of personal preference.


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## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

BEACHBUM said:


> although I have to say that the Ibanez Super 58's that are in the AS 200 and that I have in my 83 AM 205 are my all time favorites


Incredible pickups. I have an old 80's set that I put in an SG. Took that guitar to a whole new level.


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## Old Dave (Dec 8, 2020)

BEACHBUM said:


> And some tonal differences as well. I do love Gibson pickups in general although I have to say that the Ibanez Super 58's that are in the AS 200 and that I have in my 83 AM 205 are my all time favorites. It can also be said that the early versions of the SA 2200 were a bit bright for some folks taste but Yamaha has now corrected that with a change of pot values on recent models. I did the same on my early version and they're now sweet as syrup. Having said that at the end of the day it's all just a matter of personal preference.


I hear you on the Yamaha. I have seen a few over the years that were very fine. Nowhere in Ottawa to see one though. I have been also eyeballing a Gretsch 6228FM Players EditionJBT at Lauzon's. Build quality is spot on and sounds real nice. It's the Japanese one that seems to get a lot of praise. They just got a new 335 in . I just want to go in there informed , so I don't have to waste there time , and have them clean a bunch of guitars .


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## brokentoes (Jun 29, 2014)

I love MIJ quality myself but if you don't mind high specs and quality Eastman is worth a look for 335 styles. Easier to come by as well usually.


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## alphasports (Jul 14, 2008)

Despite playing for 45 years or so I always had a bug up my arse about Gibbys, for no particular reason, that was encouraged by all the internet chatter about bad quality etc. Despite that I finally bought a used 2004 (Memphis) ES137 last year, and its fit 'n finish didn't do a lot to dispel the hearsay...sloppy trim, finish issues, but nothing major or structural. HOWEVER....it plays great, I mean I really enjoy playing it, just something about it. FWIW I also have a Collings City Limits Deluxe and a couple of PRS cores, so the Gibby gets clobbered by them as far as general quality and finish goes...but the ES stands shoulder to to shoulder with them as far as playability goes. And that's a big deal.


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

Old Dave said:


> I have been also eyeballing a Gretsch 6228FM Players EditionJBT at Lauzon's. Build quality is spot on and sounds real nice. It's the Japanese one that seems to get a lot of praise.


I checked it out. That's a sweet looking guitar. As it happens I've got a Gretsch as well. Made by Terada Japan. Being mostly a 335ish/Tele guy I honestly never thought that I'd own a Gretsch but once I picked it up I just couldn't walk away from it.

6119 Tennessee Rose
View attachment 340311


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

alphasports said:


> Despite playing for 45 years or so I always had a bug up my arse about Gibbys, for no particular reason, that was encouraged by all the internet chatter about bad quality etc. Despite that I finally bought a used 2004 (Memphis) ES137 last year, and its fit 'n finish didn't do a lot to dispel the hearsay...sloppy trim, finish issues, but nothing major or structural. HOWEVER....it plays great, I mean I really enjoy playing it, just something about it. FWIW I also have a Collings City Limits Deluxe and a couple of PRS cores, so the Gibby gets clobbered by them as far as general quality and finish goes...but the ES stands shoulder to to shoulder with them as far as playability goes. And that's a big deal.


It's uncanny. That is exactly the experience I've had with mine. Gibson is actually making excellent guitars but I think that the mistake they are making is that their fixation on mass producing lacquer finishes is extending their production time to the point that they start to take short cuts. And you're right they aren't serious flaws but when you're laying out premium bucks it can be disappointing. Sometimes I think that they'd be better off just to go to poly finishes like just about everyone else and have done with it. The thing I love most about this one is that if you've got one of these you don't need a 335 or a Les Paul. It does both exceedingly well.


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

misposted


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## alphasports (Jul 14, 2008)

BEACHBUM said:


> It's uncanny. That is exactly the experience I've had with mine. Gibson is actually making excellent guitars but I think that the mistake they are making is that their fixation on mass producing lacquer finishes is extending their production time to the point that they start to take short cuts. And you're right they aren't serious flaws but when you're laying out premium bucks it an be disappointing. Sometimes I think that they'd be better off just to go to poly finishes like just about everyone else and have done with it. The thing I love most about this one is that if you've got one of these you don't need a 335 or a Les Paul. It does both exceedingly well.


Hey, exactly! I have no empirical evidence beyond more internet chatter but it sounds like quality is up since they threw Henry out (big surprise!), but yes my 137 (Classic) can do LP or 335 as well as either. Nice Custom BTW! Had a line on one a couple of months ago, should have grabbed it if for no other reason than to play with the Varitone. Regardless of model they're a great looking guitar!

Cheers


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

alphasports said:


> Hey, exactly! I have no empirical evidence beyond more internet chatter but it sounds like quality is up since they threw Henry out (big surprise!), but yes my 137 (Classic) can do LP or 335 as well as either. Nice Custom BTW! Had a line on one a couple of months ago, should have grabbed it if for no other reason than to play with the Varitone. Regardless of model they're a great looking guitar!
> 
> Cheers


The Varitone is a nice option to have with the only exception being that it causes a volume drop and it's a PIA having to adjust on the fly. One of these days I need to pick up a volume pedal.


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## DrumBob (Aug 17, 2014)

The complaints about rampant Gibson QC issues is exaggerated. I have a 2019 Les Special I got a couple of months ago, and the quality is stellar. Likewise, my 2010 LP Standard and Billie Joe Junior are great guitars. I'd recommend you go play Gibsons until you find the right one.


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## Hammertone (Feb 3, 2006)

Old Dave said:


> I'm a long time player and teacher , however with accoustic and classical. With pandemic boredom setting in , I have been thinking of getting an electric for fun. I used to tour with a Les Paul years ago . It was an early 70's and had serious quality control issue , mainly the pickup pole pieces didn't line up with the strings , as well as cosmetic slopiness. I was thinking of a new 335 , but am wary of Gibson from what I've heard from various players. Does one need to go full Custom Shop to get the kind of quality that there reputation was built on , or are the regular new 335's well done?


If only there was some way to find out.


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## AnthonyZ (Dec 9, 2020)

*Personally, I would look to purchase a used ES-335 in great condition or a new one (reasons below) primarily as they really hold their value and very likely to appreciate. *

My favorite electric guitar of all times is the Gibson ES-335. I have a ’78 Walnut bought new at L&M for $888.88 in 1979 and a ’69 Cherry I bought via a boutique shop in Ohio about 4-years ago for USD$5,000 (and it is mint for its age and the finish is in better shape than the 1978).

The 1978 was set-up when purchased with the truss rod tweaked and it hasn’t been touched since and was my main gigging guitar used to pay for University. It is still in mint condition for its age, no finish flaws when new and only the slightest bit of lacquer checking now and hardly noticeable dings.

I did a blind listening test with both guitars with my daughter (who plays piano) through my vintage ’69 Princeton. The 1969 hands down sounds so much better. The cut of ‘60s ES-335s necks varied over that decade but are all really nice and far nicer feeling than anything Gibson made during the mid to later Norlin years.

I have played friends, early 1970’s Norlin era ES-335s that have a really nice shaped mahogany neck and the fit and finish was excellent and they sounded really good. At some point in the ‘70s Norlin switched to thinner shaped maple necks likely for production cost reasons. Despite all the Norlin trashing you hear about, still a very well-made guitar. The maple neck just doesn’t do it for me. Mahogany necked ES-335’s are more body weighted and feel really comfy in a sitting position or when standing with a good strap. Maple necked 335’s are more headstock heavy but still ok to play comfort wise. Also I think mahogany in general is a sonically superior wood over maple to use for semi-hollow and acoustic guitars (and a lot of luthiers will agree).

I haven’t played any 335’s made in the ‘80’s to early 2000’s. But I have played a number of new ones at Cosmos and other music stores in the past 5-years. At some point Gibson reverted to using mahogany for their necks which was a huge improvement. All the ones I have played were fit and finish perfect and played very nicely. I echo what others said above, Gibson has stepped up their game!

I toyed between buying a new 335 vs. something vintage from the late ‘60’s (early to mid-60’s ES 335’s are really pricey – check www.reverb.com). Glad I went for the ’69 I purchased, but I know I would have been happy with a new one.

You can buy a new:

Cherry ES-335 Dot for $3,999 at L&M (or elsewhere);
All the way up to $4,799 for a figured maple ($4,399 sale price at L&M for a figured 2018 model)

New purchase alternatives I would seriously look at are:

Eastman - $1,610 (a friend of mine has one and it is a very good guitar); or
Ibanez - $490 to $2,000 but few are in a finish colour that appeals to me other than the Violin Sunburst that runs about $1,000 (I haven’t played many, ones played were nice)
Epiphone - ~$650 to $1,000 (some of those would quickly get some hardware change outs if I purchased)
Heritage H555 (seen a few, never played one, but look well made and I believe they are made in Gibson’s old Kalamazoo plant. Ghosts of Gibson’s past lurk and likely impart awesome mojo).

Have a look on Reverb, typically lots available and it will give you a good sense for the cost of various vintage ES-335’s. Guaranteed most people selling equipment on Kijiji use Reverb for price discovery and the price point they offer to sell at.

Another suggestion if you are looking for a semi-acoustic Gibson is the ES-330 or possibly ES-175 (single cutaway jazz guitar), they don’t command the same price in the vintage market or used market as ES-335s do, but both are really nice guitars. 

Good luck with your deliberations and let us know what you decide.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

You want a 335 style guitar and you want quality. Look at the Eastman's. The quality is as good or better than Gibson and you can keep a wad of money in your pocket.









Eastman Guitars


Explore handcrafted guitars and mandolins by Eastman.




www.eastmanguitars.com


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> The quality is as good or better than Gibson and you can keep a wad of money in your pocket.


Welcome back @Steadfastly !


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

greco said:


> Welcome back @Steadfastly !


how appropriate is the thread that brought him back, hey? dude can’t resist


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

greco said:


> Welcome back @Steadfastly !





vadsy said:


> how appropriate is the thread that brought him back, hey? dude can’t resist


I couldn't resist the temptation of this opportunity!


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

greco said:


> I couldn't resist the temptation of this opportunity!


Well, I don't know if you could really say I'm back. I do check out some of the acoustic posts here perhaps every month or so. If there was more action on the acoustic forum, I would come back here more often. I scan the electric forum sometimes when I am here but there is not much there that is personally interesting to me. Thanks for the post. Take care and stay safe.


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

Steadfastly said:


> You want a 335 style guitar and you want quality. Look at the Eastman's. The quality is as good or better than Gibson and you can keep a wad of money in your pocket.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That be true.


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## Fuzzy dagger (Jun 3, 2016)

I have Gibson USA 2011 ES-335. Great guitar, Memphis made, absolutely no qualms about quality. I’m not the most particular guy, so there’s that. I kind of feel that if you want a Gibson 335, nothing else will do. If you want a 335 shaped guitar then there’s a lot out there. Good luck with the search.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

There's personal experience and then there's the big picture. 

I've bought three Godins in my life, all three ended up being flawed, two to the point of being unplayed (and one, according to L&M wasn't worth as much as the repair would cost). And yet, some people love them, rave about them, etc. I don't waste my breath telling this story in every Godin thread out there, because everyone's experience is different. Then there's the Gibson threads, with the same half dozen known-quantity posters pounding their same old tired drums. LOL

It really is a YMMV world, but the internet is so good at promoting all sorts of provocative myths (and usually ones that fly in the face of commonly held notions) that are fun to spread, like flat earths, exploding headstocks and other conspiracies.


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## AnthonyZ (Dec 9, 2020)

High/Deaf said:


> There's personal experience and then there's the big picture.
> 
> I've bought three Godins in my life, all three ended up being flawed, two to the point of being unplayed (and one, according to L&M wasn't worth as much as the repair would cost). And yet, some people love them, rave about them, etc. I don't waste my breath telling this story in every Godin thread out there, because everyone's experience is different. Then there's the Gibson threads, with the same half dozen known-quantity posters pounding their same old tired drums. LOL
> 
> It really is a YMMV world, but the internet is so good at promoting all sorts of provocative myths (and usually ones that fly in the face of commonly held notions) that are fun to spread, like flat earths, exploding headstocks and other conspiracies.


Ahem, I just joined the other day....lol


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

@vadsy See post #45...Now I'm feeling guilty.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

greco said:


> @vadsy See post #45...Now I'm feeling guilty.


why?

serious question, not looking to instigate


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

vadsy said:


> why?
> 
> serious question, not looking to instigate


See below...


greco said:


> Welcome back Steadfastly!





Steadfastly said:


> Thanks for the post. Take care and stay safe.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

greco said:


> See below...


ah, I think I'm getting it. allow me to put on my analyst/therapist hat.
he's playing you off as no big deal and that kind of makes you feel sad but trust me, the guy is lonely and looking for someone to reciprocate, especially in a positive way. you did and it made his day, trust me and good for you. he wants to keep playing the outsider so he says he's off although he probably checks in daily. the dude makes himself a pariah everywhere he goes in some misguided quest and at this point he's been banned or run off so many times he takes what he can. he's just playing to save face


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

we'll be fine


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

vadsy said:


> ... the dude makes himself a pariah everywhere he goes in some misguided quest and at this point he's been banned or run off so many times he takes what he can. he's just playing to save face





vadsy said:


> we'll be fine


So you and Steadly are the same dude ?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Wardo said:


> So you and Steadly are the same dude ?


I wish. dudes has made getting under peoples skin a science.

if it comes to bans. hardly, hasn't happened. guess I'm easy o the eyes and don't need to use the same James Taylor story over and over for likes. if its about being a pariah, hardly. I’m just out of the clique and I don't visit the same glory hole in the political forum hoping to read and wank to the same hateful shit all my imaginary internet friends do


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

vadsy said:


> I don't visit the same glory hole in the political forum...


Not that it matters but it is remarkable that you are one of the main contributors in that forum, and to put it mildly, much of what you say there would qualify as hateful. But that is not a conversation for this thread nor is it of any consequence at least not to me.

On a brighter note, Gibson do make decent enough guitars.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Wardo said:


> Not that it matters but it is remarkable that you are one of the main contributors in that forum, and to put it mildly, much of what you say there would qualify as hateful. But that is not a conversation for this thread nor is it of any consequence at least not to me.
> 
> On a brighter note, Gibson do make decent enough guitars.


main? I don't think I am, certainly not by the official counts running tally on the right side of my screen.. but if you've elevated me to status, I won't let you down.

hateful? hardly. how fragile are you? the shit you say when folks aren't around is basically Parler in Canada. and stop starting conversations with little jabs and running off. I wanted to chat with greco without any animosity and you show up after a few drinks and get lippy but puss out quicker than Steady made his exit

ps- Gibson QC threads are doomed to fail,., this literally is the best possible outcome


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

Old Dave said:


> I hear you on the Yamaha. I have seen a few over the years that were very fine. Nowhere in Ottawa to see one though. I have been also eyeballing a Gretsch 6228FM Players EditionJBT at Lauzon's. Build quality is spot on and sounds real nice. It's the Japanese one that seems to get a lot of praise. They just got a new 335 in . I just want to go in there informed , so I don't have to waste there time , and have them clean a bunch of guitars .


The Japanese Gretsch (Terada factory) guitars are right up there with the best of the Japanese offerings. Hope you find what you're looking for.

6119 Tennessee Rose


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## Old Dave (Dec 8, 2020)

BEACHBUM said:


> The Japanese Gretsch (Terada factory) guitars are right up there with the best of the Japanese offerings. Hope you find what you're looking for.
> 
> 6119 Tennessee Rose
> View attachment 340668


Leaning towards the Gretsch with a Deluxe hand wired . Should be the bomb


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

AnthonyZ said:


> Ahem, I just joined the other day....lol


...........and that's _exactly _why you don't know who the half-dozen people I was referring to are, right?


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## AnthonyZ (Dec 9, 2020)

High/Deaf said:


> ...........and that's _exactly _why you don't know who the half-dozen people I was referring to are, right?


You are absolutely correct, and in retrospect, my post was most likely wasn't appropriate. Gibson makes good guitars, as do so many other manufacturers. Such a personal thing as to what is best for anyone is not an entirely appropriate thing to impose upon others.


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## BEACHBUM (Sep 21, 2010)

AnthonyZ said:


> You are absolutely correct, and in retrospect, my post was most likely wasn't appropriate. Gibson makes good guitars, as do so many other manufacturers. Such a personal thing as to what is best for anyone is not an entirely appropriate thing to impose upon others.


I wouldn't worry about it. As we all know there are things that are important and worth stressing over and there things that are not. The vast majority of what you will read around here is opinion backed by hearsay recycled endlessly with no resolution in sight. I think you handled that quite well. Folks on these forums often get contentious. Ain't no big deal.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

AnthonyZ said:


> You are absolutely correct, and in retrospect, my post was most likely wasn't appropriate. Gibson makes good guitars, as do so many other manufacturers. Such a personal thing as to what is best for anyone is not an entirely appropriate thing to impose upon others.


It's fine to have an opinion. Variety of opinion makes places like this tick. 

I can't even remember specifically what you posted (so my comment was never aimed at you anyways, sorry you felt impugned by it), but it's good to know the regular posters and their constant gripes about the same old thing, ad infinitum, in places like this. I guess they had a lot of skipping records growing up.


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## AnthonyZ (Dec 9, 2020)

High/Deaf said:


> It's fine to have an opinion. Variety of opinion makes places like this tick.
> 
> I can't even remember specifically what you posted (so my comment was never aimed at you anyways, sorry you felt impugned by it), but it's good to know the regular posters and their constant gripes about the same old thing, ad infinitum, in places like this. I guess they had a lot of skipping records growing up.


Okay that was funny . I didn't feel the least bit impugned.


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## AJ6stringsting (Mar 12, 2006)

Gibson is overated and over priced.
I have an 2007 Epiphone LPC that sounds and plays as well as my 1974 Gibson Flying V.

Gibson is over pricing them selves to extinction.
I guarantee that Epiphone is more than the key to Gibson's survival.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

AnthonyZ said:


> Okay that was funny . I didn't feel the least bit impugned.


See what I mean. The same /\ /\ /\ six guys /\ /\ /\ over and over again. LIke they know more about guitars than everyone else (not to mention our own preferences and budgets). Their arrogance knows no bounds.


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## AnthonyZ (Dec 9, 2020)

High/Deaf said:


> See what I mean. The same /\ /\ /\ six guys /\ /\ /\ over and over again. LIke they know more about guitars than everyone else (not to mention our own preferences and budgets). Their arrogance knows no bounds.


Ya just gotta let that stuff go. Arrogance in my mind comes from ignorance or not being open or receptive to others opinions. It's not unique to this forum. Forums regardless of the hobby I have been involved with tend to be amazing sources of information. Bright people willing to freely share information, making you think about things a different way, opening your eyes to things you didn't know about or rethinking things....etc. I have been on photography forums, spent a ton of time learning the craft of building guitars on a few lutherie forums (learned a ton about building guitars), name the forum....stuff can get weird and hostile when people hide behind a keyboard. Ya just gotta let stuff go that you don't agree with as by and large, people who's posts get under your skin, don't mean to do so, and even if they do.....who cares because what you like to play that matters most.

Think of the history of Gibson guitars, they in my mind set the standard for all that followed and I am therefore very biased towards that brand. I used to turn my nose up at Fender Strats and Teles cause they are typically a fancy plank of cheap ash (or whatever) wood with the cheapest of stable hardwoods (maple) bolted on. Sonically, maple is about the worst wood ever used to build guitars. Guess what, I have one of each and love playing them both, especially how certain single coil pick-ups make the right amp absolutely chime (but I won't be seen in public playing such a hideous lack of craftmanship in a guitar...lol).

You like what you like! No body else's opinion matters, but respect it.


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## AJ6stringsting (Mar 12, 2006)

Gibson's hasn't solved many of it's issues :
1. The famous snapping neck ....they solved it for a while with the Value at the headstock, that my 1974 Gibson LPC and 1971 Gibson Medallion Series Flying V has ...then they stopped putting valutes on the headstock that helps prevents neck damage.

2. They don't put Compensated Nuts on their Guitars. Due to the tilt of the headstocks, the stress that D and G strings exerts on the Tuning Keys ....thus pulling the D and G out of tune easier.


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## Powdered Toast Man (Apr 6, 2006)

I bought a 2012 LP Jr double cut brand new in 2013. I had to get the nut completely replaced and recut just to make it playable. Before the nut change the guitar wouldn't stay in tune for more than one song. There were also finish flaws on it. It was a purchase from across the border from an online retailer. Had I bought it locally I would have returned it. 

I recently got a hankering for an ES-339. Found one at my local L&M. A 2016 model that was still new and heavily discounted. I went and tried it out. 5 minutes in my hands and I could tell why this $3300 guitar had been on their wall for 4 years. Total dog. 

Based on my own experience with Gibsons I would never ever buy another one of them sight unseen (online).


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## Roots-Picker (Dec 29, 2017)

Yeah...I too have experienced the hit-and-miss quality of newer Gibson electrics. In my case a LP Traditional and an ES-335 that had the same nut/tuning issues as described by others. I guess my point is, why should you *have* to perform extra setup work or mods to make a $2,000+ guitar play properly?! (My Gretsch, Fender, Grosh, Suhr and other guitars simply don’t have these problems.) Having said that, I just picked up a 1999 LP Deluxe that has admittedly been modded and well played-in, but the nut and overall setup are great; mojo for days!

And...there will always be those out there who present _their_ opinions as indisputable facts, and who dismiss and/or demean the opinions or experiences of others. While annoying, over time I’ve learned that it’s not worth getting all torqued up unless the individual is personally disparaging you or other forum members. One man‘s opinion only, but I normally choose to let it go. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to All! 🎄


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Funny, Gibson could have fixed those 'design flaws'. But they get vilified if they change the color of a fricken capacitor, let alone something that actually matters. God knows they tried in the Norlin era, and look how that worked out. LOL

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


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## Powdered Toast Man (Apr 6, 2006)

High/Deaf said:


> Funny, Gibson could have fixed those 'design flaws'. But they get vilified if they change the color of a fricken capacitor, let alone something that actually matters. God knows they tried in the Norlin era, and look how that worked out. LOL
> 
> Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


I think Fender has the right mix. You can get the vintage style specs (American Original, Vintera) and then you have your modern spec stuff that's updated every so many years (American Pro, Elite). 

Gibson's problem is that rather than offering an updated Les Paul with fixes to actual weaknesses to their original designs, they go way off into the weeds and release stuff like automatic tuning machines and the Firebird-X. Fix the fundamental flaws like the headstock design that snaps off if you look at it the wrong way or learn how to cut a nut slot. 

There's a video on Rhet Shull's channel where he took the LP that Gibson literally gave him off their factory floor to a dealer and put it on a PLEK machine. The nut had flaws and they had to file the slots to fix it.


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