# Just how good is PLEK?



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

Everywhere I look I see mixed comments/feelings about PLEK. Some say it's the best thing ever and some say it's not as good as doing it by hand. What's the consensus here on the forum?

Also, are there any operators in western Canada?
Preferably in Alberta?


----------



## bobartlarry (Dec 3, 2016)

I know there's one in Vancouver:








Bruce Guitars Vancouver


Anybody have any experience with Bruce Guitars in Vancouver. Specifically his set-ups and Plek abilities?




www.guitarscanada.com


----------



## DaddyDog (Apr 21, 2017)

Does an air powered nail gun make you a great carpenter? No. Same with a Plek. It’s a tool. In the right hands, it’s apparently fantastic. The accuracy is crazy good.


----------



## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

I'd prefer to have a guitar Plek'd than not.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

BMW-KTM said:


> Everywhere I look I see mixed comments/feelings about PLEK. Some say it's the best thing ever and some say it's not as good as doing it by hand. What's the consensus here on the forum?
> 
> Also, are there any operators in western Canada?
> Preferably in Alberta?


It’s exactly 100,000 times more precise than a human. That being said, it needs to be operated by a competent technician. Which.. why would they get good at using a machine that deletes their job?


----------



## StratCat (Dec 30, 2013)

Were Jimi’s guitars pleked?


----------



## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

StratCat said:


> Were Jimi’s guitars pleked?


Yes.


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

Always12AM said:


> why would they get good at using a machine that deletes their job?


For the repeat business if they do it awesomely?
That would be my guess.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

BMW-KTM said:


> For the repeat business if they do it awesomely?
> That would be my guess.


That’s assuming that they have the volume of demand that offsets the money they are losing on their hourly fee.

Also, automating their skill set is not wise. I know a lot of people who could know nothing about guitars that can operate a CNC machine better than a luthier and will do so for less money etc.

I think would prefer someone PLEK my guitar and then look at it with their own eyes, but I’ve found that most places try to talk you out of a PLEK.


----------



## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

For problem necks a PLEK is helpful. The machine reads the neck under tension which then allows it to level the frets according to an optimal performance curve. It allows you to get your action as low as it will go without buzz. That's the idea anyway. Still, someone has to do the final setup.

I have never had a problem levelling frets without a plek machine though. The vast majority of players don't need- or even like- razer thin action. Standard fret levelling methods produce excellent results if the tech is competent.


----------



## Midnight Rider (Apr 2, 2015)

*How Does A PLEK Machine Work? || Righteous Guitars PLEK Demo: *




*Plek Station Tour & Demonstration at Yorkville Sound(Long & McQuade): *




*I PLEK'd My New 2019 Les Paul Standard: *


----------



## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I don’t like the action super low.

I have four Gibsons all of which were factory plek’d - none of them have any dud frets and bends are clean.

My telecaster was not plek’d and it has a couple of duds up around the 15th on a few strings.

I don’t think that my production run 70th Broadcaster was plek’d and of all the electric guitars that I have this one is the best over any of them. I’ve never played a custom shop Fender but I’m wondering how much better a custom shop could be over the broadcast that I have. If a custom shop is a lot better then that would really be something to have.

I think that for factory production guitars that you’re not gonna do much more other than relief ,slots, action and internation then probably plek’d from the factory is a good thing for overall consistency.


----------



## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

David Rutchinski at Westwood Music, showed me a Les Paul he got in and the problems it had, then put it in the Plek machine, dialed her up, then did a set up afterwards. Night and day....a great tool if used properly. It also helps to be a good player, and Dave is a really good player.


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

For anyone interested in the history of the plek machine, It was invented in 1956. Here is the first generation plek machine pleking a guitar.


----------



## lightman (Sep 4, 2013)

I got a Gretsch 5220 at Cosmo on sale when I was down in that area visiting about a year and half ago , any way there were a lot of unlevel frets on it.
My wife had meeting in Toronto 3 months later ( live 5 hours away) so I called up Cosmo and they said they could plek the guitar so I setup a time to take it in and they did it the same day for me.
The guitar now plays excellent , it's a different instrument. When you buy a guitar from Cosmo they will do a Plek and complete setup for 99.00 bucks. I think it is well worth it


----------



## GuitarT (Nov 23, 2010)

Always12AM said:


> why would they get good at using a machine that deletes their job?


Because getting your guitar PLEK'd costs a lot more than a hand fret leveling. It's a good gig, half the work, twice the price.


----------



## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

I couldnt tell the difference. Maybe if the guitar was wonky.


----------



## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Plek is as good as the technician running the machine. The machine doesn't know what to do. It has to be "told" by a tech.


----------



## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

Always12AM said:


> It’s exactly 100,000 times more precise than a human. That being said, it needs to be operated by a competent technician. Which.. why would they get good at using a machine that deletes their job?


Being a Plek operator deletes your job as a Plek operator?


----------



## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

StratCat said:


> Were Jimi’s guitars pleked?


Who here is Jimi? As for me I can use all the help I can get. I'm not Jimi.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

guitarman2 said:


> Being a Plek operator deletes your job as a Plek operator?


Music stores don’t hire a PLEK operator.
They cross train a “guitar tech”.


----------



## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

Always12AM said:


> Music stores don’t hire a PLEK operator.
> They cross train a “guitar tech”.



Whatever the case there's a job in there somewhere.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

guitarman2 said:


> Whatever the case there's a job in there somewhere.


Yes, there is also a person who stands there and assists 12 self checkouts at Walmart. For now.


----------



## GuitarT (Nov 23, 2010)

knight_yyz said:


> Plek is as good as the technician running the machine. The machine doesn't know what to do. It has to be "told" by a tech.


The machine knows exactly what to do. After the diagnostic scan the machine will tell the operator in great detail everything that is wrong with the neck and make recommendations to make it right. It's just needs the operator to okay it or make minor changes if he see fit.


----------



## GuitarT (Nov 23, 2010)

Always12AM said:


> I think would prefer someone PLEK my guitar and then look at it with their own eyes, but I’ve found that most places try to talk you out of a PLEK.


I would hope they at talk you into a diagnostic scan first.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

GuitarT said:


> I would hope they at talk you into a diagnostic scan first.


I don’t think that a lot of in house guitar techs are going to get really good at using a machine that makes 11 of their coworkers obsolete lol.

I know I wouldn’t.


----------



## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

Always12AM said:


> I don’t think that a lot of in house guitar techs are going to get really good at using a machine that makes 11 of their coworkers obsolete lol.
> 
> I know I wouldn’t.


Well if everyone starts going to where the Plek is then its really moot. I'm getting awful tired of dropping my guitar off at a tech and having it ready a month or so later. If I can get it plek'd much quicker thats where I'm going. 
They said computers would make jobs obsolete but here I am busier than ever in the IT dept because of computers. Never been out of work for 30 years. I don't think a plek machine is going to make anyones job obsolete or prevent them from getting a job. As for some employee refusing to learn how to operate it in some kind of an attempt to preserve jobs, well thats just silly. Unless of course they're union. Then I can see a problem.


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

GuitarT said:


> I would hope they at talk you into a diagnostic scan first.


As I understand the process a diagnostic scan is always done first and more importantly, the machining cannot be performed without a scan being done first. One must assume a trustworthy would tell you it won't make much of an improvement and offer the chance to leave with just a small fee for the scan. I suspect the scan would bring peace of mind to the guitar owner either way.


----------



## GuitarT (Nov 23, 2010)

Always12AM said:


> I don’t think that a lot of in house guitar techs are going to get really good at using a machine that makes 11 of their coworkers obsolete lol.
> 
> I know I wouldn’t.


If they've invested in a machine they better find a way for it to generate revenue and at least pay for itself or they'll all be out of work.


----------



## GuitarT (Nov 23, 2010)

BMW-KTM said:


> As I understand the process a diagnostic scan is always done first and more importantly, the machining cannot be performed without a scan being done first. One must assume a trustworthy would tell you it won't make much of an improvement and offer the chance to leave with just a small fee for the scan. I suspect the scan would bring peace of mind to the guitar owner either way.


That would be a good business model.


----------



## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

I would compare a PLEK machine to a skate sharpening machine; the neck of a guitar is suited to the player.
Most pro hockey players are quite particular about how their skates are sharpened...the hollow and rocker to their preference. Some players wish a manual grind over a computer assisted grind...the operator is best to know the customer's ergonomics.


----------



## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

umder most circumstances, i would be quick to recommend cnc. i use cnc alot for my job, and it's great. however, when i bought my LP it was supposed to be factory plekd. the nut was...less than good. the frets themselves were ok, but not impressive.
otoh, every time i take a new (to me) guitar to my local luthier here, the guitar that comes back is AMAZING. it's as if the guy has a magic wand that can turn a good guitar into a great one. he's busy a/f, so i usually have to wait a bit for it, but i never complain. it's worth the wait. every time


----------



## bw66 (Dec 17, 2009)

Paul Running said:


> I would compare a PLEK machine to a skate sharpening machine; the neck of a guitar is suited to the player.
> Most pro hockey players are quite particular about how their skates are sharpened...the hollow and rocker to their preference. Some players wish a manual grind over a computer assisted grind...the operator is best to know the customer's ergonomics.


The main problem with skate sharpening machines is not the machine itself, but the failure of the machine owner/operator to inspect and maintain the machine. I suspect that the same applies to PLEK machines.


----------



## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

bw66 said:


> The main problem with skate sharpening machines is not the machine itself, but the failure of the machine owner/operator to inspect and maintain the machine. I suspect that the same applies to PLEK machines.


Would a PLEK be calibrated by man or machine?


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

Paul Running said:


> Would a PLEK be calibrated by man or machine?


To my way of thinking the installation of a flat piece of steel in the place of a guitar neck and certified to be deadly straight would be a good way to calibrate the machine. You'd scan the plate and use it as a baseline for comparison. Does anybody know if they do this sort of thing? Or maybe something else. Calibration does seem to be like it could be an important thing. I ran a CNC plasma cutting table for a few years and calibration was done each time the steel to be cut was a different grade or thickness.


----------



## StratCat (Dec 30, 2013)

guitarman2 said:


> Who here is Jimi? As for me I can use all the help I can get. I'm not Jimi.


Point taken. For me, the only thing that will make me better is to play more.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

GuitarT said:


> If they've invested in a machine they better find a way for it to generate revenue and at least pay for itself or they'll all be out of work.


One would imagine that to be the case.
I welcome anyone to call Cosmo and inquire about PLEK services. Maybe they’ll have better luck than me in the 5 times I tried and was persuaded to not use it.


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

Always12AM said:


> Maybe they’ll have better luck than me in the 5 times I tried and was persuaded to not use it.


Persuaded by whom? The folks at Cosmo? Did they explain why?


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

guitarman2 said:


> Well if everyone starts going to where the Plek is then its really moot. I'm getting awful tired of dropping my guitar off at a tech and having it ready a month or so later. If I can get it plek'd much quicker thats where I'm going.
> They said computers would make jobs obsolete but here I am busier than ever in the IT dept because of computers. Never been out of work for 30 years. I don't think a plek machine is going to make anyones job obsolete or prevent them from getting a job. As for some employee refusing to learn how to operate it in some kind of an attempt to preserve jobs, well thats just silly. Unless of course they're union. Then I can see a problem.


Every 12 year old child in Canada right now can install windows and reboot their wireless modem. When they are 20 in 8 years and their technologically illiterate grandparents no longer populate the network fuelled workforce in North America, you can get your ass that there will be downsizing in IT departments lol.

The same thing has happened with every technician that existed prior to YouTube offering instructions on how to fix everything. YouTube exists now, so I don’t need to pay L&M $78 an hour to moisturize my fretboard. I don’t require the services of any technician, I require the assistance of experts (luthiers) once every 57 years to fix a flattop.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

BMW-KTM said:


> Persuaded by whom? The folks at Cosmo? Did they explain why?


They don’t need to explain why lol.
It’s because 1 guy in the building can use the PLEK machine and it’s not the guy who picked up the phone and who’s job is predicated on bench fees.


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I heard Gibson factory plek is only a partial plek, so the guitars are not perfect when finished.

A guitar tech / luthier spends all his time working to develop carpel tunnel and other hand problems from constantly filing and sanding. The plek machine can greatly reduce the amount of work he has to do manually.

The scan can reduce the amount of fret material removed potentially saving a refret down the road.

Finally if a plek operator is smoking weed he is referred to as being a real pleker head.


----------



## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Always12AM said:


> Music stores don’t hire a PLEK operator.
> They cross train a “guitar tech”.


Last time I checked L&M sends the guitars to a 3rd party. 


(this is old so I'm sure the prices have doubled by now)
Once you have decided that you want to improve your instrument, you can take it to your local Long & McQuade and have it shipped to Yorkville Sound in Pickering, Ontario for a diagnostic scan.

40 dollars for initial scan
140 Fret level and Crown
140 New nut from blank

Prices do not include a setup.... which is about another 100


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

Always12AM said:


> They don’t need to explain why lol.
> It’s because 1 guy in the building can use the PLEK machine and it’s not the guy who picked up the phone and who’s job is predicated on bench fees.


So call again and insist you speak to the guy who actually runs the machine as his job will very likely be dependant on fees as well.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

knight_yyz said:


> Last time I checked L&M sends the guitars to a 3rd party.
> 
> 
> (this is old so I'm sure the prices have doubled by now)
> ...


I remember this being the procedure at one point with L&M. Those prices seemed reasonable. Shipping something to Pickering always made me reluctant.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

BMW-KTM said:


> So call again and insist you speak to the guy who actually runs the machine as his job will very likely be dependant on fees as well.


I no longer own a Gibson, so I no longer require any guitar repairs lol.

I’d imagine the one guy cross trained on the PLEK is just as happy to keep his bench fees and skills on the forefront rather than taking a smaller percentage and getting less money to use a machine.


----------



## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

A few years ago I took a guitar to Cosmo with the intention of having it plek’d. They messed around with a guitar for a bit and handed back to me and said it didn’t need to be plek’d. So they just did a set up which was actually a lot better once I got it back and was all it needed.


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Wardo said:


> A few years ago I took a guitar to Cosmo with the intention of having it plek’d. They messed around with a guitar for a bit and handed back to me and said it didn’t need to be plek’d. So they just did a set up which was actually a lot better once I got it back and was all it needed.


Lazy plekers.


----------



## Grab n Go (May 1, 2013)

What's the word for a non-PLEKed guitar? FEKed?

"They wouldn't PLEK my guitar. So it's just FEKed."

Aye.


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Grab n Go said:


> What's the word for a non-PLEKed guitar? FEKed?
> 
> "They wouldn't PLEK my guitar. So it's just FEKed."
> 
> Aye.


You would be a plekless bastard.


----------



## Grab n Go (May 1, 2013)

player99 said:


> You would be a plekless bastard.


Better than a "fekless" bastard. 😁


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Grab n Go said:


> Better than a "fekless" bastard. 😁


You would be both. 

lacking initiative or strength of character; irresponsible.
"a feckless mama's boy" "with a shitty guitar setup."


----------



## Grab n Go (May 1, 2013)

player99 said:


> You would be both.
> 
> lacking initiative or strength of character; irresponsible.
> "a feckless mama's boy" "with a shitty guitar setup."


Yup, that's me to a T.


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Grab n Go said:


> Yup, that's me to a T.


I didn't mean you...


----------



## Grab n Go (May 1, 2013)

player99 said:


> I didn't mean you...


Cool. Still, I'd have to say all my guitars are FEKed...


----------



## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

Always12AM said:


> *Every 12 year old child in Canada right now can install windows and reboot their wireless modem.* When they are 20 in 8 years and their technologically illiterate grandparents no longer populate the network fuelled workforce in North America, you can get your ass that there will be downsizing in IT departments lol.
> 
> The same thing has happened with every technician that existed prior to YouTube offering instructions on how to fix everything. YouTube exists now, so I don’t need to pay L&M $78 an hour to moisturize my fretboard. I don’t require the services of any technician, I require the assistance of experts (luthiers) once every 57 years to fix a flattop.


Yeah 12 year olds can be pretty smart. Then they go to college where they learn to be stupid, put more emphasis on being called by the correct pro nouns then what they're majoring in and take up all kinds of leftist causes. Then they try to get a job and expect top pay for knowing nothing. 
Here at my company they hired young girl fresh out of college in HR. 2 weeks later they hired a senior HR and the young girl left in a huff because she felt she should have been in charge. 
If you think that companies will be downsizing IT departments you really have no clue. There will always be jobs for those talented individuals that want to work. 
Just because there are countless videos telling us how to do everything doesn't mean all of us are qualified to actually do it. How come the good techs are still back logged a month or more with work? Plek machines have been around for a very long time and I don't think they've effected work for good techs. Its simply a tool.


----------



## Fred Gifford (Sep 2, 2019)

Always12AM said:


> I remember this being the procedure at one point with L&M. Those prices seemed reasonable. Shipping something to Pickering always made me reluctant.


 shipping to Pickering? from Ajax? no to that, I have a car, I can deliver .. hard pass


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

Fred Gifford said:


> shipping to Pickering? from Ajax? no to that, I have a car, I can deliver .. hard pass


That was my exact response.
At the time it would have taken me 17 minutes to drive to Pickering, but they make it a big top secret operation where it has to be shipped through long and Mcquade and take weeks.


----------



## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

knight_yyz said:


> Last time I checked L&M sends the guitars to a 3rd party.
> 
> 
> (this is old so I'm sure the prices have doubled by now)
> ...


here's Cosmo's pricing, pretty similar since the setup is included with the levelling.
Cosmo Music - The Plek Station - Cosmo Music Repair Shop
*Pricing*

ScanA graphic display of what your fretboard looks like at a microscopic level; helps determine possible improvements.$37.50Fret LevellingLevel your frets according to your playing style. Scan is included. Set up (fret edges, truss rod adjust as needed, intonation, checking electronics) fee depends on guitar and requirements.$250 including set upRe-fretIncludes scan, fret levelling, and set up.$500Fingerboard PlaningIf needed, in addition to re-fret.$99Custom NutSplay strings at appropriate angle.$75Guitar Purchase Add-onPlek add-on for Cosmo Music purchased guitars; includes scan and fret levelling. Cosmo guitars have already been set up through the QA process.$99

$99 if you buy a guitar there is an interesting option. Id rather do that than an extended warranty lol...or maybe, as my wife says I say a lot, "...thats how they get ya...".

This thread may have got them some business...I have a Tele with some fret wear and string buzz that Im now considering getting this done on.


----------



## Fred Gifford (Sep 2, 2019)

Always12AM said:


> That was my exact response.
> At the time it would have taken me 17 minutes to drive to Pickering, but they make it a big top secret operation where it has to be shipped through long and Mcquade and take weeks.


I don't know why you could not book an appointment, arrive on time with your guitar, have the service performed, pay and then leave a happy customer rather than shipping because once in transit you are at their mercy .. could take days, weeks, months ?? who knows ...


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

Fred Gifford said:


> I don't know why you could not book an appointment, arrive on time with your guitar, have the service performed, pay and then leave a happy customer rather than shipping because once in transit you are at their mercy .. could take days, weeks, months ?? who knows ...


Thats exactly what has deterred me from the L&M PLEK on top of the fact that they try to talk everyone out of it lol.


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

The plek is a great tool, but the tech still has to do a lot of work. It's more labour intensive than one would imagine when the plek is integrated into the fret job. Its not as simple as strapping the guitar into the plek, pressing enter and then your done.


----------



## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

BMW-KTM said:


> To my way of thinking the installation of a flat piece of steel in the place of a guitar neck and certified to be deadly straight would be a good way to calibrate the machine. You'd scan the plate and use it as a baseline for comparison. Does anybody know if they do this sort of thing? Or maybe something else. Calibration does seem to be like it could be an important thing. I ran a CNC plasma cutting table for a few years and calibration was done each time the steel to be cut was a different grade or thickness.


what you're talking about is similar to what is known as a "mic God". a piece of metal of known exact size to check the accuracy of a micrometer. i don't think that's ALL that would be required for a plek machine, and your example of a plasma table is a great example of what i mean.

when a plasma table is calibrated, there are sensors attached to the mechanism that moves the head that detect magnets in strategic locations on the track so that the head knows exactly where "home" is. after that, the machine only travels the x/y and measures the distance between the limits. pierce points and lines, etc, are all calculated from that point by the computer. it makes allowances for kerf, burn thickness, etc. however, these measurements and known points can move not just from slop in the track or magets somehow moving. (that's pretty rare)
one of the giggest factors is the condition of the slats in the table where the sheet lays. calibrating a table has to be done with brand new slats. those slats have to be a specific width so that the sheet lays proper flat. as the slats wear, travel and kerf changes due to hills and valleys in the table as the slats get notched from burning. very minimal at first depending on the head speed and other factors, but over time can be very noticeable.

i would _suspect _a plek machine is similar in that the clamping devices and other parts of the machine might (i don't actually know, i'm just guessing) develop tiny amounts of slop that can affect a machine that has tolerances of 10,000th of an inch. with a guitar in a plek machine, it would seem to be far more critical than a sheet of 24ga galvanized steel on a plasma table.


----------



## GUInessTARS (Dec 28, 2007)

I wonder how many of Jeff Beck, Jimmy Page, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Rory Gallagher, et al, guitars were Plek’d?


----------



## bw66 (Dec 17, 2009)

GUInessTARS said:


> I wonder how many of Jeff Beck, Jimmy Page, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Rory Gallagher, et al, guitars were Plek’d?


The better question is, how many of them would have if it was available?


----------



## GUInessTARS (Dec 28, 2007)

Do you think having their guitars Plek’d would have made their music different? Maybe better?


----------



## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

GUInessTARS said:


> Do you think having their guitars Plek’d would have made their music different? Maybe better?


More robotic playing styles.


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

cheezyridr said:


> ... as the slats wear, travel and kerf changes due to hills and valleys in the table as the slats get notched from burning. very minimal at first depending on the head speed and other factors, but over time can be very noticeable.


It was extremely rare that we ever burned anything under 1/2" thick. I probably loaded 3 or 4 small crops of 3/8" onto the table, total, in the several years I worked on it. I think I burned 1/4" only once. Never, ever burned gauge plate. We had the power to burn 2" (1,000 amp supply) but we always switched to flame over 1-1/4" because the quality of the cut degraded sharply past that point. Hills and valleys due to slag on the slats were minimal and would be spread over 8 or 10 feet with 1/2" and probably the whole 40 feet on 1" or thicker. The table was 48' x 14' so there was plenty of room to move the gantry to the far end and load up a full 10' x 40' sheet. Slag lumps did not impact the precision of our cuts. Material type, grade and thickness were the big variables and those could change 3 or 4 times a shift.


----------



## GUInessTARS (Dec 28, 2007)

I was just wondering also how many of the legendary 58-60 Les Paul’s were Plek’d?


----------



## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I think it's more about production guitars leaving the factory and being close to about as good as they can get as opposed to the usual gibson crap shoot and having to play 20 to find one good one as Townshend said.


----------



## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

BMW-KTM said:


> It was extremely rare that we ever burned anything under 1/2" thick. I probably loaded 3 or 4 small crops of 3/8" onto the table, total, in the several years I worked on it. I think I burned 1/4" only once. Never, ever burned gauge plate. We had the power to burn 2" (1,000 amp supply) but we always switched to flame over 1-1/4" because the quality of the cut degraded sharply past that point. Hills and valleys due to slag on the slats were minimal and would be spread over 8 or 10 feet with 1/2" and probably the whole 40 feet on 1" or thicker. The table was 48' x 14' so there was plenty of room to move the gantry to the far end and load up a full 10' x 40' sheet. Slag lumps did not impact the precision of our cuts. Material type, grade and thickness were the big variables and those could change 3 or 4 times a shift.


a far bigger machine than what i use.


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

cheezyridr said:


> a far bigger machine than what i use.


Heaviest plasma cut I ever made on that machine (ESAB) was 3" 304L stainless. A pair of lifting lugs about 6 feet long and maybe 2-1/2 feet wide. Apparently that job set a record for the heaviest solid stainless vessel ever built. No clad was used. All stainless. I don't know if that record still stands. Came in at 240 ton when complete. Heaviest carbon cut was 4-1/2" on flame. Same thing; lugs. Normally ran oxygen for carbon, (flame over 1-1/4" as mentioned) nitrogen for stainless under 1-1/2" but for the heavy stainless we ran a mixture of argon and hydrogen. The hydrogen boosted the plasma temperature making the heavy cuts possible. It was pretty hard on the consumables though. You'd get maybe about 150 lineal feet before needing to stop to replace cups, nozzles, etc. You could tell when it was time by watching the brightness. The standoff would start to shrink. If you waited too long the cut would suffer and the head would crash. The dimensions were good on heavy stainless but the cut required some grinding to clean it up. Lots of schmeng on the bottom edge. You couldn't just chip it off. Curiously, the hydrogen mix had almost no hydrogen popping in the water under the plate. Maybe one pop every six feet or so. Don't ask me why because it never made any sense to me. You still had plasma burning water so hydrogen should have been forming. With that kind of weight there were no head crashes when pops did occur. The table would vibrate while it burped but the plate never jumped.


----------

