# Bread baking...my new hobby



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

l have always been someone who enjoys cooking, but with more time at home I have started making my own bread. I started last summer with my mom´s recipe for homemade white, but l have branched out a lot. I do white and rye, sourdough and most recently baguettes. The sourdough is the most fun, I made my own starter from god knows what is floating in the air and now its like my baby:










it rises like crazy, here’s a typical finished sourdough:


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

I tried to like this more than once


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Sourdough is above my pay-grade, I'm afraid. But I've been doing lots of baking as well. Made a nice fruit&nut loaf the other day with basic white flour dough, but loaded up with raisin, currants, cranberries, walnuts, and sunflower, pumpkin, and flax seeds. I like a bread with seeds. Came out nice. My wife, who normally eschews my baking, has been wolfing the loaf down. Given her work as a food toxicologist, though, I can't honestly see her eating anything I made using a culture developed from what was floating in the air.

BTW, VERY photogenic loaf. Nice relic-ing.


----------



## KapnKrunch (Jul 13, 2016)

Made my first loaf yesterday as a matter of fact! 

A Swedish coffee bread flavoured with cardamon. My mom used to make it whenever we "kids" visited. Best toast possible. I skipped the braiding and used a bread-making machine. Cheap cardamon is a waste of money. Get the good stuff.





__





This Week for Dinner: Vetebröd | Swedish Cardamom Bread


Recipe for vetebröd, a Swedish sweet yeast bread cooked in a braided loaf and flavored with cardamom, perfect for the holidays or any time of year, really!




thisweekfordinner.com


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

KapnKrunch said:


> Made my first loaf yesterday as a matter of fact!
> 
> A Swedish coffee bread flavoured with cardamon. My mom used to make it whenever we "kids" visited. Best toast possible. I skipped the braiding and used a bread-making machine. Cheap cardamon is a waste of money. Get the good stuff.
> 
> ...


I think I’ll try that one, it looks great!


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

mhammer said:


> Sourdough is above my pay-grade, I'm afraid. But I've been doing lots of baking as well. Made a nice fruit&nut loaf the other day with basic white flour dough, but loaded up with raisin, currants, cranberries, walnuts, and sunflower, pumpkin, and flax seeds. I like a bread with seeds. Came out nice. My wife, who normally eschews my baking, has been wolfing the loaf down. Given her work as a food toxicologist, though, I can't honestly see her eating anything I made using a culture developed from what was floating in the air.
> 
> BTW, VERY photogenic loaf. Nice relic-ing.


Apparently its a bit of crapshoot what ends up in a starter, mostly wild yeasts and lactobacillus, mine is evolving over time. It was bland and didn’t rise well for the first couple of weeks, I added a teaspoon of plain yogurt and that got it going. Since then it’s been smooth sailing, and it has been rising better every week. It doubles in volume in about 4 hours, even in our coolish kitchen (18 or 19 degrees)

If you´re feeling brave I will share some with you...

If you want a really easy and guaranteed to work starter my mom swears by this stuff that she got from San Francisco a few years back, its name is Larry:









S0URD0UGH STARTER Yeast VERIFIED 150yrs California Gold Rush - Etsy Canada


This Craft Supplies & Tools item by ZourdoughSourdough has 188 favorites from Etsy shoppers. Ships from United States. Listed on 02 Dec, 2022




www.etsy.com


----------



## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

Sourdough is simple- if your starter is good. 
We've kept our starter going since April. It even made the trip across Canada and back in the summer. It's hard to kill, in fact.


----------



## blueshores_guy (Apr 8, 2007)

For the last few months there have been posters around our neighbourhood advertising homemade sourdough bread delivered right to your door, with a picture of a sample loaf and the phone# of the lady baker. Last week I decided to give it a try.
Wow! Excellent bread. It arrived, yes, right to my door, on time and still warm from the oven. This is what I got...................







I've spent some time in San Francisco and never turned down the opportunity to have sourdough, and this lady's work is exemplary. Who knew?


----------



## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

Add potato bread to your list.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

The Rideau Bakery closed in Ottawa in late 2019, after serving the community for 90 years as a 3-generation bakery. They made a light rye, with caraway seeds. that was simply the best I've ever tasted. I would joke, half in seriousness, that if Kardash hands hadn't touched it, it wasn't bread. Back when the Saturday newspapers in Canada used to carry The Weekend Magazine, it won a citation for best rye bread in Canada. The crust was wonderfully carmelized and shiny, making the end pieces (mostly crust) the best. A few years back, when I was working downtown, a German deli across the street used Rideau rye for their sandwiches. Because he couldn't use the ends for anything, the owner would bag up all the ends after he was finished making sandwiches for the week on Monday mornings, and sell them for 35 cents a bag. I would have had to spend at least $100 to have that many rye bread ends from actual loaves. After the last owner closed the business to tend to his own health, he sold off the recipes and property to regional chain Farm Boy, who still make the rye. Haven't tried it yet. Probably because no Kardash hands have touched it.


----------



## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

Right on man!
I love bread and that bread looks amazing.


----------



## DavidP (Mar 7, 2006)

Mmmmm, I can smell it from here!! 
Nothing like the aroma of fresh baked bread!


----------



## MarkM (May 23, 2019)

My Bride has made bread since the 90's, sour dough, rye, old school white bread, multi grain and you name it. We eat curried dishes often and we have tried to make naan and it has not turned out like your grandma would make it.

Would really like to find an old Indian Grandmothers recipe and technique.

My First Nation DIL makes great bannock, showed her how to eat it with corn syrup, legendary!


----------



## dgreen (Sep 3, 2016)

Some nice looking bread photo's!

Bought my wife a Bosch universal plus mixing unit. She never bonded with it so I decided I would become the bread maker. Been two years now, and my default loaf is a whole wheat with flax, bran and sunflower seeds. I make three loaves a week


----------



## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

mhammer said:


> The Rideau Bakery closed in Ottawa in late 2019, after serving the community for 90 years as a 3-generation bakery. They made a light rye, with caraway seeds. that was simply the best I've ever tasted. I would joke, half in seriousness, that if Kardash hands hadn't touched it, it wasn't bread. Back when the Saturday newspapers in Canada used to carry The Weekend Magazine, it won a citation for best rye bread in Canada. The crust was wonderfully carmelized and shiny, making the end pieces (mostly crust) the best. A few years back, when I was working downtown, a German deli across the street used Rideau rye for their sandwiches. Because he couldn't use the ends for anything, the owner would bag up all the ends after he was finished making sandwiches for the week on Monday mornings, and sell them for 35 cents a bag. I would have had to spend at least $100 to have that many rye bread ends from actual loaves. After the last owner closed the business to tend to his own health, he sold off the recipes and property to regional chain Farm Boy, who still make the rye. Haven't tried it yet. Probably because no Kardash hands have touched it.


There's a little spot in Sittsville called Ivan's deli that does lunch hour sandwiches in edition to their full butcher's counter. Rideau Bakery closing has turned into an absolute nightmare for them. Really good fresh buns are hard to come by.


----------



## oldjoat (Apr 4, 2019)

the Richmond bakery was also known for exceptional breads (esp raisin)


----------



## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

I do a lot of cooking, but last year at Christmas, I baked for the very first time in my life. 

Only bread I've ever made was using a bread maker (and that's cheating)


----------



## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

I finally figured out some good bread recipes last year. I also splurged and bought a countertop flour mill so I can mill my own grains. Homemade bread still warm from the oven is one of my favourite foods.

Here is the mill I bought:










Some bread I made:


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I don't know how you folks get your out-of-pan breads so nicely shaped, with such a terrific crust.

Do tell.


----------



## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

mhammer said:


> I don't know how you folks get your out-of-pan breads so nicely shaped, with such a terrific crust.
> 
> Do tell.


I do mine in a Le Crueset Dutch oven. Heat the Dutch oven first while the oven is preheating. Place dough inside and cover to keep the steam trapped inside while cooking. Remove the cover for the last 15 minutes to make it crusty.


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Its all about the shaping and tension, it takes a few tries:


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Sneaky said:


> I do mine in a Le Crueset Dutch oven. Heat the Dutch oven first while the oven is preheating. Place dough inside and cover to keep the steam trapped inside while cooking. Remove the cover for the last 15 minutes to make it crusty.


Yes, this is REALLY helpful too. I use a lodge cast iron pot that can be inverted, but it makes a huge difference in the bread.


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Sneaky said:


> I finally figured out some good bread recipes last year. I also splurged and bought a countertop flour mill so I can mill my own grains. Homemade bread still warm from the oven is one of my favourite foods.
> 
> Here is the mill I bought:
> 
> ...


That is next level, very cool.


----------



## Swervin55 (Oct 30, 2009)

I'll play...since May I've probably done 4 doz loaves. It's really a great way to chew up those covid days in retirement. Problem is, I end up gifting most of them. My latest: halapeno/cheddar


----------



## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

My friend @starjag has a friend that bakes sourdough bread and adds thyme and garlic to it.


----------



## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

Mmm...love the aroma of fresh dough a rising and fresh bread baking.


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Here's my bread from this morning, regular yeast bread with some rye flour:


----------



## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

zdogma said:


> Here's my bread from this morning, regular yeast bread with some rye flour:
> 
> View attachment 354863


May I ask the ratio of rye to regular that you use?


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

_"I do mine in a Le Crueset Dutch oven. Heat the Dutch oven first while the oven is preheating. Place dough inside and cover to keep the steam trapped inside while cooking. Remove the cover for the last 15 minutes to make it crusty. "_

Ah. Makes sense. I put a tray of water in the oven to generate steam, but the bread is always uncovered. I had used a spring-form cake pan in past, with pleasing results, but no crust of similar quality to yours.

What temperature, and what flour?


----------



## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

mhammer said:


> _"I do mine in a Le Crueset Dutch oven. Heat the Dutch oven first while the oven is preheating. Place dough inside and cover to keep the steam trapped inside while cooking. Remove the cover for the last 15 minutes to make it crusty. "_
> 
> Ah. Makes sense. I put a tray of water in the oven to generate steam, but the bread is always uncovered. I had used a spring-form cake pan in past, with pleasing results, but no crust of similar quality to yours.
> 
> What temperature, and what flour?


I use about 50/50 mix of bread flour to whole wheat flour. For loaves like I pictured I would do them at 450 for about 45 minutes total, 30 covered and 15 uncovered. Sometimes I add a small amount seeds or Bob’s Red Mill 7 grain cereal mix to the dough to give it a bit more texture.


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Paul Running said:


> May I ask the ratio of rye to regular that you use?


I use about 1/4 rye flour, 3/4 bread flour. I get my rye flour from this place:





__





1847 Stone Milling | Local Flour | Organic Flour | Ontario


[bt_button text="Shop




1847.ca


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Do any of you add gluten when using non-wheat flours in significant proportions?


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

mhammer said:


> Do any of you add gluten when using non-wheat flours in significant proportions?


I don't, and it seems to work well. The protein/gluten content in the bread flour I use is quite high (13.5%) which seems to compensate for the lower gluten in the rye. I don't use whole wheat flour much, so I'm not as familiar with it.


----------



## Stephenlouis (Jun 24, 2019)

mhammer said:


> Do any of you add gluten when using non-wheat flours in significant proportions?


I do, and lemon juice with rye. Gluten does amazing things to bread if your body can handle it. Mine can


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

There may be people looking at this thread and thinking, "yeah, looks great but who's got the time to make that?!"

Bread can be made in so many ways, including some of the more-recent "wet dough" recipes that take very little time or work because they all but eliminate kneading. It's possible to make two big 10" round loaves of pretty-fantastic country-style bread in about ten minutes of easy hands-on work.

One of the pioneers of wet dough bread-making is a guy named Jim Lahey. This web site offers his recipe:









Jim Lahey's Easy No-Knead Artisan Bread - The Clever Carrot


An easy, simple recipe for no knead artisan bread. Made with instant yeast and baked in a Dutch oven. Includes step-by-step photos and details instructions.




www.theclevercarrot.com





He's got a recipe book but I haven't seen it:









My Bread: The Revolutionary No-work No-knead Method: Lahey, Jim, Flaste, Rick: 8601405996275: Books - Amazon.ca


My Bread: The Revolutionary No-work No-knead Method: Lahey, Jim, Flaste, Rick: 8601405996275: Books - Amazon.ca



www.amazon.ca





Ken Forkish is a leading proponent of this style of bread-making. He offers both yeast-based and sourdough-based recipes in his great recipe book. I have this one; it's my favorite for its simple clear recipes with great results:









Flour Water Salt Yeast: The Fundamentals of Artisan Bread and Pizza [A Cookbook]: Forkish, Ken: 9781607742739: Books - Amazon.ca


Flour Water Salt Yeast: The Fundamentals of Artisan Bread and Pizza [A Cookbook]: Forkish, Ken: 9781607742739: Books - Amazon.ca



www.amazon.ca





At the leading edge of wet-dough sourdough baking is a guy named Chad Robertson. I have his book too - a bit more time and complexity in his recipes, but worthy results.









Tartine Bread (Artisan Bread Cookbook, Best Bread Recipes, Sourdough Book): Robertson, Chad: 0890573814285: Books - Amazon.ca


Tartine Bread (Artisan Bread Cookbook, Best Bread Recipes, Sourdough Book): Robertson, Chad: 0890573814285: Books - Amazon.ca



www.amazon.ca





Anybody can make bread easily, and doing it once will put the foamed-up high-gluten crap sold in grocery stores in its place.


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Yes, I've read Ken Forkish's book, its really quite good.


----------



## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

My lovely and my son are very serious about their bread. His rye is about the best i've had. Mixing is critical I've been told.


----------



## Stephenlouis (Jun 24, 2019)

To put bread importance into context historically: “to be the _bread_-winner” (well it was an English taunt, but quickly became exactly as it reads by the early 1800's)

I remember reading a French book on bread making and he, the writer, was adamant you use water salt yeast, and flour,that's it, for your first 2 or three years until you have the basics down!


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

WCGill said:


> My lovely and my son are very serious about their bread. His rye is about the best i've had. Mixing is critical I've been told.
> View attachment 354881


Oh yeah, that's serious equipment for sure.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Sneaky said:


> I finally figured out some good bread recipes last year. I also splurged and bought a countertop flour mill so I can mill my own grains. Homemade bread still warm from the oven is one of my favourite foods.
> 
> Here is the mill I bought:
> 
> ...


I've found that a blender works nicely if you're making whole grain bread. Toss in what ever grains you want and just bust them up and mix them with what ever flour you are using. I now soften the wheat for a bit.....a little easier on the teeth and gums. 


Sneaky said:


> I do mine in a Le Crueset Dutch oven. Heat the Dutch oven first while the oven is preheating. Place dough inside and cover to keep the steam trapped inside while cooking. Remove the cover for the last 15 minutes to make it crusty.
> 
> View attachment 354862


While it's still hot cut a chunk off the edge and load it up with butter. Messy but good.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

zdogma said:


> Its all about the shaping and tension, it takes a few tries:


That's basically how both grandmothers did it and how we were taught years ago. I still do it that way.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

zdogma said:


> Yes, this is REALLY helpful too. I use a lodge cast iron pot that can be inverted, but it makes a huge difference in the bread.


This one? I have a couple of them - perfect for the task.






Lodge L8DD3 Logic 5-Quart Double Dutch Oven and Casserole with Skillet Cover (Cast iron) : Amazon.ca: Home


Lodge L8DD3 Logic 5-Quart Double Dutch Oven and Casserole with Skillet Cover (Cast iron) : Amazon.ca: Home



www.amazon.ca





However I paid almost half of the price being asked by some third-party sellers / crooks on Amazon today - pretty sure I paid $85. If I was buying more I'd hold off and check Amazon regularly until it has them back in stock at a reasonable price.

However many Dutch oven type pots would be OK for the technique of starting the loaf for about half an hour in a very-hot closed pot, which makes a big difference in the loaf.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

greco said:


> My friend @starjag has a friend that bakes sourdough bread and adds thyme and garlic to it.


I have a basic "white" bread recipie that I add things to. The next loaves I make will be a mixture of unbleached, rye, whole wheat and oat flour with some rice and potato flour mixed in. At times I'll use the water from boiling vegetables and throw in some garlic and green onion. This works best if you're not using active dry yeast that needs to be proofed.


----------



## Vincent Boissinot (Jun 3, 2017)

I'm also making bread  Not an expert by any means, but getting better after each batch I make


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Swervin55 said:


> I'll play...since May I've probably done 4 doz loaves. It's really a great way to chew up those covid days in retirement. Problem is, I end up gifting most of them. My latest: halapeno/cheddar
> View attachment 354864


oh my..., I had no idea. those look great

I drove over to the Bon Ton Bakery this morning for some sourdough and olive flutes after seeing the thread contents


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

WCGill said:


> My lovely and my son are very serious about their bread. His rye is about the best i've had. Mixing is critical I've been told.
> View attachment 354881


I have a top-end Kitchenaid stand mixer, and despite the company's claims it is NOT a great machine for breadmaking except in small batches - basically a single loaf at a time. However this Globe beauty weighs 55 pounds... I'd be getting large batches of grief from my wife if I brought it home. Can I come to your place?!


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

mhammer said:


> Do any of you add gluten when using non-wheat flours in significant proportions?


No. Doesn't seem to be needed for rye or oat bread.


WCGill said:


> My lovely and my son are very serious about their bread. His rye is about the best i've had. Mixing is critical I've been told.
> View attachment 354881


Looks nice but I still do the hands on approach tho I don't 'window pane' the dough. It doesn't seem to be that much slower than the mixer tho it is a bit messier.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Electraglide said:


> I have a basic "white" bread recipie that I add things to. The next loaves I make will be a mixture of unbleached, rye, whole wheat and oat flour with some rice and potato flour mixed in. At times I'll use the water from boiling vegetables and throw in some garlic and green onion. This works best if you're not using active dry yeast that needs to be proofed.


I've done that, and find it's a little more crumbly than I want. I like the heartiness, and the flavour is fine, but there's a lot more wiping the counter off than I'd like. IT may be a matter of the kneading, though.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Vincent Boissinot said:


> I'm also making bread  Not an expert by any means, but getting better after each batch I make
> 
> View attachment 354897


Um, I think you're supposed to slice it first, BEFORE you put it in the toaster.


----------



## Vincent Boissinot (Jun 3, 2017)

mhammer said:


> Um, I think you're supposed to slice it first, BEFORE you put it in the toaster.


You must not be afraid to let it sit a little longer in the oven. I really prefer bread a little darker (it does look a bit burned in the photos, but I swear it isn't!)

Also, to anyone baking with sourdough should check this blog : The Perfect Loaf | Bake Sourdough Bread


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

boyscout said:


> This one? I have a couple of them - perfect for the task.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, same. I think it was about $85 when I got it as well


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I don't have a dutch oven, but I do have a couple of nice bread pans I like. So I thought I'd try something. The dough rose in one of the pans, and I'm using the second one like a lid. Just popped it in the oven a minute ago, so we'll see how this turns out


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

mhammer said:


> I've done that, and find it's a little more crumbly than I want. I like the heartiness, and the flavour is fine, but there's a lot more wiping the counter off than I'd like. IT may be a matter of the kneading, though.


Some times it crumbles a bit and sometimes it doesn't. When it does the crumbs usually go into a container for when I'm cooking chicken. It might be the kneading but most of my cooking is old school, done until it feels right. One of the things my grandmothers would smack me for is I don't pre-heat ovens, I just cook things a bit longer. My grandmothers didn't get along but they both believed that boys and men should know how to cook, mend and for some reason knit.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Vincent Boissinot said:


> I'm also making bread  Not an expert by any means, but getting better after each batch I make
> 
> View attachment 354897


How close to the top of your oven is your bread? Maybe lower it down a notch. Do you use parchment paper to bake your bread?


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

boyscout said:


> This one? I have a couple of them - perfect for the task.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I keep searching the second hand stores and thrift stores around here for a dutch oven but lately all there seems to be is the enamelled stuff and not much of that. I might have to resort to going here for this if something doesn't show up. Not too sure what's on Kijiji.








Cabela’s® Five-Piece Cast-Iron Set | Cabela's Canada


• Handy 5-piece set of pre-seasoned cast-iron cookware • Ready-to-use, seasoned cast-iron construction: smooth heat distribution, superior heat retention • Works great over a campfire, on the stove, or in the oven • 10" skillet • Flat bottom Dutch oven with lid • 12" deep skillet with...




www.cabelas.ca


----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Wow this is a cool thread. I'll take more time to read through it later.

We were given a bread making machine a few months ago and we're having fun with it.

It still takes several hours to make a loaf and it's completely scratch.

Smells up the kitchen nicely.

So far we're just doing white.


----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Electraglide said:


> I keep searching the second hand stores and thrift stores around here for a dutch oven but lately all there seems to be is the enamelled stuff and not much of that. I might have to resort to going here for this if something doesn't show up. Not too sure what's on Kijiji.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dutch Oven?

I got yer Dutch Oven right here.

Sorry.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Okay, so here is the result of using the "2 bread-pan" method. The crust came out nice. You can see where I had to sort of pinch things down. Next time I think I'll put the "lid" on earlier in the rise to avoid that. I baked it at 400 for about 20min with the lid and then another 20 without. A nice height. Looks like it'll make good toast. Thanks for the tips, folks.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

Electraglide said:


> I keep searching the second hand stores and thrift stores around here for a dutch oven but lately all there seems to be is the enamelled stuff and not much of that. I might have to resort to going here for this if something doesn't show up. Not too sure what's on Kijiji.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Enameled cast iron pots can do the job; some people use them. The pot has to be able to withstand heat in the 450-500 degree range - sometimes just the handle on the lid can't do that and has to be replaced but they're otherwise capable of it. The other drawback of using most enameled pots is that they can't be inverted, so the bread is baked inside the deep pot and can be a challenge to extract it after baking. The loaf also doesn't get the exposure to heat that it should get after the lid is removed.

In the link you provided Cabela's doesn't specify the sizes of the pots in the set it's offering. At that low price they might be too small and/or maybe not very heavy. The pot gets pre-heated in this baking method, and should be heavy enough to retain blazing heat as the baking process is started and be large enough for large round loaves (9-10 inches).

One of pots in that set - if large and heavy enough - would be great; it's a pot with a lid like a frying pan. Perfect for inverting - the loaf bakes in the lid with the pot on top of it, then after about half an hour the pot is removed and most of the loaf is directly exposed to the heat for another 10-20 minutes.

The Lodge pot I linked above is perfect... might be worth waiting for it to come back in stock at a more-reasonable price than is currently available on Amazon. Or, find that pot somewhere else where Lodge pots are sold.


----------



## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Sure is some good looking bread in this thread!!


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

boyscout said:


> Enameled cast iron pots can do the job; some people use them. The pot has to be able to withstand heat in the 450-500 degree range - sometimes just the handle on the lid can't do that and has to be replaced but they're otherwise capable of it. The other drawback of using most enameled pots is that they can't be inverted, so the bread is baked inside the deep pot and can be a challenge to extract it after baking. The loaf also doesn't get the exposure to heat that it should get after the lid is removed.
> 
> In the link you provided Cabela's doesn't specify the sizes of the pots in the set it's offering. At that low price they might be too small and/or maybe not very heavy. The pot gets pre-heated in this baking method, and should be heavy enough to retain blazing heat as the baking process is started and be large enough for large round loaves (9-10 inches).
> 
> ...


Actually it does and I just noticed that it includes gloves.

"The kit includes a 10" skillet, 5-qt. camp oven with a lid that fits the 10" skillet as well, 12" deep skillet with a lid that reverses to a round griddle; Dutch oven lifting tool and heavy-duty leather cooking gloves. " If they are like the other ones I've seen from Cabela's they are heavy enough and one nice thing about them is that I can have the whole set here in about 1 1/2 hrs by transit.
Enamel is fine, until it starts cracking, then they rust. I've found that they aren't that good for camping and you can't season them.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Milkman said:


> Dutch Oven?
> 
> I got yer Dutch Oven right here.
> 
> Sorry.


Save that for your wife or does she have you beat?


----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Electraglide said:


> Save that for your wife or does she have you beat?


I'm afraid so.

S.B.D.

As in, knock a buzzard off a shit wagon deadly.

Now, back to our discussion about bread.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Milkman said:


> Wow this is a cool thread. I'll take more time to read through it later.
> 
> We were given a bread making machine a few months ago and we're having fun with it.
> 
> ...


Nice things about bread machines with timers is that you can set them up to be just finishing as you walk in the door.


----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Electraglide said:


> Nice things about bread machines with timers is that you can set them up to be just finishing as you walk in the door.


Yes, but you do still have to plan for it. If you remember at 3:00 PM that you have no bread, unless you eat later than we do, you won't have bread for dinner.

That's not a complaint. You just have to start thinking about it around 1:00 PM or earlier.

But, it's simple enough that I can do it and come up with a nice loaf every time.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

An experiment. I ground up some left over pork shank and round roast while waiting for a loaf's worth of dough to rise. Mixture of flours with some garlic and onion. I cut back on the sugar 'cause I'm supposed to. Took a 9x9 pan and put 1/2 the dough in a layer in the bottom, layer of shredded cheese, layer of ground meat, another layer of cheese and the rest of the dough on top. Let it sit for about 1/2 an hr and now it's in a 350'f oven for about 40 minutes. We'll see what happens.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Milkman said:


> Yes, but you do still have to plan for it. If you remember at 3:00 PM that you have no bread, unless you eat later than we do, you won't have bread for dinner.
> 
> That's not a complaint. You just have to start thinking about it around 1:00 PM or earlier.
> 
> But, it's simple enough that I can do it and come up with a nice loaf every time.


Put all your ingredients in the bread maker and let it mix them together when you get home. Doesn't take long. Once they are mixed take the dough out and let it rise as you're getting the rest of the meal together, maybe having a beer or something like that. That should take about a hr. Depending on what you're having for dinner put the loaf in a loaf pan and put it in the oven, possibly along with the rest of dinner taking it out when it's done. Tapping the top helps with that. You can also use the dough to make buns or dumplings or perhaps pizza shells, it just depends on what you're having for dinner. If you have a hit or two in there too everything should be on the table at the same time.
I had a bread maker for a while where you could set your start and stop times....I'd set things before I left for work at 6ish in the morning and it would be ready when I got home at just after 6 at night.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

Electraglide said:


> Actually it does and I just noticed that it includes gloves.
> 
> "The kit includes a 10" skillet, 5-qt. camp oven with a lid that fits the 10" skillet as well, 12" deep skillet with a lid that reverses to a round griddle; Dutch oven lifting tool and heavy-duty leather cooking gloves. " If they are like the other ones I've seen from Cabela's they are heavy enough and one nice thing about them is that I can have the whole set here in about 1 1/2 hrs by transit.
> Enamel is fine, until it starts cracking, then they rust. I've found that they aren't that good for camping and you can't season them.


Sounds like you're golden. Loaf pictures posted here by tomorrow?


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Electraglide said:


> An experiment. I ground up some left over pork shank and round roast while waiting for a loaf's worth of dough to rise. Mixture of flours with some garlic and onion. I cut back on the sugar 'cause I'm supposed to. Took a 9x9 pan and put 1/2 the dough in a layer in the bottom, layer of shredded cheese, layer of ground meat, another layer of cheese and the rest of the dough on top. Let it sit for about 1/2 an hr and now it's in a 350'f oven for about 40 minutes. We'll see what happens.


That sounds like a big win to me...


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

boyscout said:


> Sounds like you're golden. Loaf pictures posted here by tomorrow?


Not too sure if I'll buy them yet and then I have to figure out a way to post pictures here that works, doesn't cost me money and doesn't involve facebook or photobucket. Preferably something that is XP or win 7 or OS High Sierra based.


zdogma said:


> That sounds like a big win to me...


It's ok but not as good as I expected. Next time I'll make buns.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Electraglide said:


> Put all your ingredients in the bread maker and let it mix them together when you get home. Doesn't take long. Once they are mixed take the dough out and let it rise as you're getting the rest of the meal together, maybe having a beer or something like that. That should take about a hr. Depending on what you're having for dinner put the loaf in a loaf pan and put it in the oven, possibly along with the rest of dinner taking it out when it's done. Tapping the top helps with that. You can also use the dough to make buns or dumplings or perhaps pizza shells, it just depends on what you're having for dinner. If you have a hit or two in there too everything should be on the table at the same time.
> I had a bread maker for a while where you could set your start and stop times....I'd set things before I left for work at 6ish in the morning and it would be ready when I got home at just after 6 at night.


I actually mixed up all the dry ingredients the day before, and kept them in a container in the cupboard. In the morning, I poured in the water and oil, mixed it up, and let it rest for a bit before kneading and proving. Pretty efficient.

I imagine a person who needed to churn out bread on a regular basis could get some of those larger size resealable bags, measured out the dry ingredients, and bag 'em up for when you needed to bake. Useful for both bread machines and regular "manual" baking.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

mhammer said:


> I actually mixed up all the dry ingredients the day before, and kept them in a container in the cupboard. In the morning, I poured in the water and oil, mixed it up, and let it rest for a bit before kneading and proving. Pretty efficient.
> 
> I imagine a person who needed to churn out bread on a regular basis could get some of those larger size resealable bags, measured out the dry ingredients, and bag 'em up for when you needed to bake. Useful for both bread machines and regular "manual" baking.


 If you use active yeast it should prove by itself in the water at around 110'f with a bit of sugar. That's usually all the time I need to mix up the other stuff. Another way you can do it is to freeze the dough. Take a day and make up a bunch of loaves and go from there.








How to Freeze Bread Dough | Baking Mad


To save yourself time why not batch bake some bread dough and store it in the freezer? Read our top tips on how to do that!




www.bakingmad.com




When things went wild last spring yeast was kinda hard to get for a while so I tried using brewers yeast for a while. Didn't work for me. It takes a long time to get the dough to rise properly.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

@mhammer......do you put the regular amount of sugar and salt in your bread? The batch I made today I cut back both the sugar and salt to 1/4 of what was asked. I thought of using Palm Sugar again but the first time I tried that it wasn't a success.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I use the amount of sugar and salt called for in the recipe. We have a gas fireplace in the kitchen, and leave the pilot light on year-round. The heat from the pilot coming up through the vent at the top is perfect for proving; just enough warmth.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

mhammer said:


> I use the amount of sugar and salt called for in the recipe. We have a gas fireplace in the kitchen, and leave the pilot light on year-round. The heat from the pilot coming up through the vent at the top is perfect for proving; just enough warmth.


I'm going back to using the right amount of sugar and salt. This time of year I have to use the oven for first and second rise.....350' f for about a minute is warm enough.


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)




----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Not bread, but tonight we made scratch pasta with a Five Mushroom sauce.

Turned out really nice.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

Milkman said:


> Not bread, but tonight we made scratch pasta with a Five Mushroom sauce.
> 
> View attachment 355130


C'mon... that's a HELL of a lot more than five mushrooms! 

Haven't tried making pasta... does the Kitchenaid attachment work well? Any tips or recipe links?


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

We used to make pasta at home a lot, before the kids. I was pretty good at it, but it takes a bit of practice to get it right:









Fresh Pasta, Made Simply (Published 2015)


All you need to know about making fresh pasta, with tips from the chefs Anna Klinger, Marc Vetri and Jenn Louis. (Article plus video.)




www.nytimes.com


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

zdogma said:


> We used to make pasta at home a lot, before the kids. I was pretty good at it, but it takes a bit of practice to get it right:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks, but paywalled. I can find other info online, just wondered if pasta-makers here had favorite secrets.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

No secrets but I really need to figure out a way to dry it without it getting all tangled.
I would imagine that getting the "right" semolina flour is also important.


----------



## tdotrob (Feb 24, 2019)

For some reason when scrolling I keep reading this as Breaking Bad My new hobby .... and think meth recipes? Then remember and come in to look at all the killer bread........


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

mhammer said:


> No secrets but I really need to figure out a way to dry it without it getting all tangled.
> I would imagine that getting the "right" semolina flour is also important.


Watch the last 2 or so minutes. 



I'm not sure if there is a 'right' Semolina flour. If you asked Lulu she'd probably hit you with that rolling pin. They say you can use corn flour but the next time I'm at bulk barn I'll get some Semolina.


----------



## DrumBob (Aug 17, 2014)

During WWII, when my father shipped out for Italy in the Fifth Army, he quickly discovered that the guys down in the ship's bakery ate better than the GI passengers, so he volunteered for bread baking duties and ate good all the way over. It figures he'd do something like that. He wound up a First Sergeant in Quartermaster, finagling and trading for stuff all the time. He never went hungry or thirsty, although he said he could never eat Spam again.


----------



## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

I'm sure with pasta tools you can get every bit as nuts as with guitars stuff (well, maybe not _that _nuts.

We found a neat attachment for the Kitchenaide "engine" that extrudes a some of the more popular types of noodle, but for that device you don't even use a pasta roller (like the one we already bought). You roll the pasta dough up into littler balls and feed them into the extruder.

It's not cheap either but looks like it would work nicely.









KitchenAid KSMPEXTA Gourmet Pasta Press Attachment with 6 Interchangeable Pasta Plates, White : Amazon.ca: Home


KitchenAid KSMPEXTA Gourmet Pasta Press Attachment with 6 Interchangeable Pasta Plates, White : Amazon.ca: Home



www.amazon.ca


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Electraglide said:


> Watch the last 2 or so minutes.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not sure if there is a 'right' Semolina flour. If you asked Lulu she'd probably hit you with that rolling pin. They say you can use corn flour but the next time I'm at bulk barn I'll get some Semolina.


My grandmother would make noodles for soup. I'd watch her chop away at the dough, making them. I'm amazed that she never cut herself, given how fast that big knife was coming down. Bear in mind she had been pretty much completely blind from glaucoma for some 30 years at that point.

Thanks for the video. Nona knows.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

Milkman said:


> I'm sure with pasta tools you can get every bit as nuts as with guitars stuff (well, maybe not _that _nuts.
> 
> We found a neat attachment for the Kitchenaide "engine" that extrudes a some of the more popular types of noodle, but for that device you don't even use a pasta roller (like the one we already bought). You roll the pasta dough up into littler balls and feed them into the extruder.
> 
> ...


As often as it happens this still gets under my skin. Here's the same device on Amazon.com, for US$140 vs. CDN$217 from Amazon.ca.









Amazon.com: KitchenAid KSMPEXTA Gourmet Pasta Press Attachment with 6 Interchangeable Pasta Plates, White: Home & Kitchen


Shop KitchenAid at the Amazon Small Appliance Parts & Accessories store. Free Shipping on eligible items. Everyday low prices, save up to 50%.



www.amazon.com





Once Amazon.com layers on US$51 for shipping it's not cheaper to buy from Amazon.com (sometimes that works out better) because the Canadian site is shipping for "free" (i.e absorbing the small cost that they pay to ship the product). But it's that initial markup, and the ways that they rig things to ensure that Canadians will pay much more than Americans no matter how they choose to buy it, that rankles.

Now back to our regularly-scheduled programming. Looks good Milkman!


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

boyscout said:


> As often as it happens this still gets under my skin. Here's the same device on Amazon.com, for US$140 vs. CDN$217 from Amazon.ca.
> 
> http://[URL]https://www.amazon.com/...49Y2xpY2tSZWRpcmVjdCZkb05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU=[/URL]
> 
> ...


Yesterday I saw a pasta making attachment similar to milkman's at a Value Village for $29.99.....not too sure what machine it goes to. They had one of these








Imperia Pasta Maker Machine - Steel Construction w Easy Lock Dial and Wood Grip Handle-Made in Italy : Amazon.ca: Home


Imperia Pasta Maker Machine - Steel Construction w Easy Lock Dial and Wood Grip Handle-Made in Italy : Amazon.ca: Home



www.amazon.ca




for $19.99. Sometimes it's worth it to look around.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Electraglide said:


> Yesterday I saw a pasta making attachment similar to milkman's at a Value Village for $29.99.....not too sure what machine it goes to. They had one of these
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I bought one of those new from Stokes a few years ago. Solid build, and works well, though only a few styles of pasta possible. I think I must have paid somewhere in the neighbourhood of $40


----------



## Adcandour (Apr 21, 2013)

The New York Times put out some recipe on how to make bread with 4 ingredients or something. Nice as hell, but I'd rather go to a bakery. Now, churning my own butter is worth it.

Made it about 4 times and then said no more.


----------



## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

When the pandemic hit i thought id try making sourdough bread for something fun to try.
I have a whole new respect for bread making and how cheap bread is.

6mos later I still cant get that damn starter to rise and am about to give up and just make pancakes out of it (i did use some once for pancakes, they were amazingly fluffy and cooked throughout) and just buy my bread like everyone else.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

Adcandour said:


> Made it about 4 times and then said no more.





Diablo said:


> 6mos later I still cant get that damn starter to rise and am about to give up and just make pancakes out of it (i did use some once for pancakes, they were amazingly fluffy and cooked throughout) and just buy my bread like everyone else.


You can make bread. Anyone can. Diablo this is yeast bread - sourdough can be a chore - but it's seriously tasty.

100 grams whole wheat flour
900 grams white bread flour

(or just do 1000 grams of white flour, but it won't taste quite as good)

720 grams of 95-degree water

Mix flour and water together until completely combined, maybe one minute. Let it sit in a large covered container for half an hour.

6 grams instant yeast
(Pro bakers' Instaferm Red yeast is easily found on shelves these days or use another INSTANT yeast - no proofing req'd)

25 grams salt

Spread both evenly over top of the dough. Wet your hands several times as necessary to keep them from collecting too much dough as you do the following. Grab one edge of the dough, pull it up and fold it down across the remaining dough to the other side. Rotate 90 degrees, do it again. Repeat until salt and yeast are fully enclosed. Then mix dough thoroughly, squishing through fingers, punching down and pushing around, rotate, repeat, maybe 90 seconds working the dough to fully incorporate salt and yeast. Leave the dough in a ball in a large covered container in the warmest part of the kitchen.

After about 30 minutes the dough will have relaxed and spread out a bit. Grab one edge of the dough in the container and pull it up high - stretching it 12"-14" until most of the dough lifts off - and then fold it down across the dough mass. Rotate 90 degrees, do it again, total of 4-6 times, you'll feel the dough stiffen up, takes about 30 seconds. Replace the cover on the container.

After another 30-40 minutes the dough will have relaxed and spread out again. Fold again as in the previous step, another 30 seconds, and again the dough will stiffen up. Replace the cover on the container.

Leave dough in warmest part of the kitchen in the covered container and let it fully double in size, maybe 5 hours of waiting.

Tip the container and gently pull the dough out onto a well-floured surface. Cut it into two equal portions. Work each of the portions into a ball, pushing the edges underneath, pulling towards you, turning, pushing under and pulling towards you again several times to get a smooth well-sealed ball. Put each ball into (ideally) a proper well-floured proofing basket or if you don't have those put well-floured balls into 9" or 10" round deep pots. Takes 2-3 minutes.

Leave the dough to proof for about an hour. Place (ideally) two Dutch ovens that can be inverted so they rest on their lids with pots on top, and preheat oven and pot(s) to 475 degrees. Takes about 30 seconds.

Tip each of the balls of dough into (ideally) the TOP of a blazing-hot Dutch oven, lightly spritz the surface with water, place the pot over the lid, and put the Dutch oven back into the oven asap. Repeat for the second loaf if you have two Dutch ovens, otherwise put the second loaf of dough into the fridge while the first is baking and bake it after, or the next day. Takes about a minute. If you don't have an invertible Dutch oven, or any Dutch oven, you can try baking inside any well-floured large pot with a lid that can withstand the 475-degree heat.

After 30 minutes of baking remove the pot from above the bread, and leave the loaf in the inverted top of the pot to bake for another 12-18 minutes until it gets past golden, gets edges of really dark brown. Takes about a minute.

Remove the loaf / loaves and cool for at least 30 minutes before tasting.

*You've just made bread. Total hands-on working time less than ten minutes, total production time about eight hours.*


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I've actually had decent results using those inexpensive spring-form cake pans I got from Dollarama, Only trouble is the bread comes out an awkward shape for making toast.


----------



## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

This is a basic recipe and makes good bread. You can change or mix flours and add things like cheese, chopped garlic and onions etc. . Depending on how much bread you want to make the quantities can be modified. If you can't work in imperial then convert things to metric. 





EASY HOMEMADE BREAD RECIPE - Butter with a Side of Bread







butterwithasideofbread.com




I coat my hands with butter while kneading. That works. I have a couple of bread pans I got at Dollar Tree for $1.25 each but also use other pans and even large muffin trays. Still haven't found a Dutch Oven in a thrift store but I keep looking. 
I've made Sourdough bread before but usually I forget the starter on the counter or in the fridge and forget to feed it so if I want Sourdough bread I buy it.


----------



## Jim Wellington (Sep 3, 2017)

I always wanted a bread maker, but when the neighbors got one they both put on 15lbs. 

Their house made my mouth water when I would visit as they got into the temporary habit of always baking bread before guests arrived.


----------



## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

Diablo said:


> When the pandemic hit i thought id try making sourdough bread for something fun to try.
> I have a whole new respect for bread making and how cheap bread is.
> 
> 6mos later I still cant get that damn starter to rise and am about to give up and just make pancakes out of it (i did use some once for pancakes, they were amazingly fluffy and cooked throughout) and just buy my bread like everyone else.


I experienced some difficulty too...I'm having better luck with the cakes, vanilla from scratch is easy.


----------



## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Jim Wellington said:


> I always wanted a bread maker, but when the neighbors got one they both put on 15lbs.
> 
> Their house made my mouth water when I would visit as they got into the temporary habit of always baking bread before guests arrived.


my in-laws had one, used it a lot. they live in the middle of nowhere so dont go to stores as much.
their bread was always great, but one thing you notice is the short shelf life on home made bread. 
the Dempsters, wonderbread etc stuff from the grocery store will sit on my counter for weeks without turning. Home made bread sans preservatives would last about 3 days tops.


----------



## Jim Wellington (Sep 3, 2017)

Diablo said:


> my in-laws had one, used it a lot. they live in the middle of nowhere so dont go to stores as much.
> their bread was always great, but one thing you notice is the short shelf life on home made bread.
> the Dempsters, wonderbread etc stuff from the grocery store will sit on my counter for weeks without turning. Home made bread sans preservatives would last about 3 days tops.


So true... the good stuff with live bacteria and enzymes...vs. the dead stuff. If they put Wonderbread on one of the deep space probes I`m sure it would return intact and edible...lol.

Don`t get me wrong, any food is better than no, and Wonderbread is a godsend for people on a budget, but food value wise I`m not so sure. I guess some might say I`m a bit of a food snob, but i find that foods with alot of preservatives cause problems for me at least. I`m slowly reducing my intake of heavily processed foods or foods with considerable amounts of preservatives. It`s a little more costly, expensive and more work, but I do believe that my limbic and respiratory system both benefit.


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

Diablo said:


> my in-laws had one, used it a lot. they live in the middle of nowhere so dont go to stores as much.
> their bread was always great, but one thing you notice is the short shelf life on home made bread.
> the Dempsters, wonderbread etc stuff from the grocery store will sit on my counter for weeks without turning. Home made bread sans preservatives would last about 3 days tops.


Bread doesn't suffer horribly from being frozen. I bake those two 9" round loaves I described earlier in this thread. My wife is mostly gluten-free so they're usually all mine. I cut the loaves in half, freeze three halves in heavy zip-loc freezer bags as soon as they've cooled completely and start working on one half, also stored in a heavy zip-loc in the fridge**. It takes 4-5 days to eat half a loaf and it's still a whole bunch better on the last day than most of the bread in stores. The next and subsequent half-loaves that come out of the freezer are still delicious.

** Some people say that bread suffers from being stored in the fridge. I don't notice that; in fact with many good bread loaves it seems to me to lose its magic more quickly stored for days outside of the fridge.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Tried a 15% rye/85% wheat "bloomer" today. Let it prove 3 times and punched it down, before shaping it and sticking it in the oven. Did the slits on top and sprinkled some flour on like some of you here. Baked it on a big ceramic round pizza stone at 400F, with some corn meal on the bottom to prevent sticking. Rose a lot more in the oven than I had anticipated. Not perfect, but much better than I was expecting


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

I actually did a sourdough with all rye once...I had “raised” the sourdough on rye flour so it rose a fair bit, but cracked all over the surface, looked a bit like a meteorite. It tasted very sour like those German rye breads you get at the European stores, no one was very interested in eating it.


----------



## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

It'll never be Rideau Bakery light rye, but this weekend I'm going to take a crack at using more rye flour and caraway seeds. I think I'll soak the caraway seeds a bit first, before adding them to the flour, and let it prove and reprove for a while. I'm wondering how Rideau achieved the glossy carmelized crust. I assume they lightly sprayed the surface of the loaves, in a way that left them stiff-ish, but chewy. Will a lightly sugared water spray do that?


----------



## boyscout (Feb 14, 2009)

mhammer said:


> It'll never be Rideau Bakery light rye, but this weekend I'm going to take a crack at using more rye flour and caraway seeds. I think I'll soak the caraway seeds a bit first, before adding them to the flour, and let it prove and reprove for a while. I'm wondering how Rideau achieved the glossy carmelized crust. I assume they lightly sprayed the surface of the loaves, in a way that left them stiff-ish, but chewy. Will a lightly sugared water spray do that?


Egg wash.

In return for the advice, please send a loaf to...

(Good caraway rye is near the top of my list of favorites, but I haven't tried making it. Hmmm.)


----------



## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

I think it was an egg wash they used, sugar burns I think


----------

