# Line 6 Power Cabs



## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

For all of you modeler guys. 

These sound interesting.

Powercab

*So are these the Helix FRFR speakers we’ve been requesting for, like, years?*
Nope—Powercab is waaay beyond your bog standard FRFR speaker. When paired with any modeler, it’s an active speaker system that can deliver a much more authentic “amp-in-the-room” playing experience. However, when set to Flat mode (and whether you load IRs into Powercab or your modeler), Powercab amplifies the sound of your presets as they are, similar to a traditional FRFR speaker system—but with a response and feel closer to that of an actual guitar amp.

Powercab works as both a backline amp and a wedge speaker, thanks to its integrated kickstands.

Oh, and it looks like a guitar amp instead of a PA speaker. So that’s cool.

*What’s going on under the hood?*
Powercab doesn’t utilize cab modeling; it has true _speaker_ modeling. Speaker Modeling is Line 6’s proprietary method of duplicating the frequency and behavior of speaker drivers _by themselves_, independently of the cabinets in which they happen to be loaded. Imagine having an empty 1x12 speaker cabinet where you can swap out the Greenback for a Creamback or a Swamp Thang or an Alnico Blue—instantly—and you’re close.

*I don’t own Helix. Will Powercab work with my Kemper, Atomic, or Fractal box?*
Absolutely! And any other modeler as well, including POD HD500X. In fact, if your modeler has a 48kHz AES/EBU out (or S/PDIF out with RCA-to-XLR M adapter), with Powercab 112 Plus you can run everything digitally, with no additional D/A/D conversion or latency. And if your modeler sends MIDI messages, you can even sync Powercab 112 Plus’s presets and user IRs with your modeler or profiler’s presets.

*Which six speakers are the models based on?*

Celestion® Vintage 30
Celestion® Greenback 25
Celestion® G12M-65
Jensen® P12Q
Eminence® Swamp Thang Patriot Series
Celestion® “Blue Bell” Alnico
*What’s the difference between Powercab 112 and Powercab 112 Plus? *
Powercab 112 Plus adds the following:

2-inch, 128 x 32-pixel LCD display
128 user preset locations
128 user IR locations
MIDI In and Out for recalling presets, IRs, and most parameters (can also be recalled via USB)
AES/EBU | L6 LINKTM digital In and Out
Additional input for use as an FOH monitor (post-DSP)
_Powercab Edit_ connectivity
USB audio interface for jamming along with or monitoring backing tracks from your Mac/PC/iOS* device
User-selectable mic modeling and distance on the XLR output (Powercab 112’s output uses an SM58 model only)
Powercab 112 Plus is about 2 lb (1 kg) heavier
_*iOS interfacing requires the Apple Camera Connection Kit_

*How loud do they get?*
250 watts total. That's 200 watts to the woofer and 50 watts to the compression driver.

*Wait. 250 watts doesn’t sound like much. Aren’t there other speakers that are thousands of watts?*
250 _real_ watts, not marketing watts. The operative spec here is SPL (Sound Pressure Level). Powercab reaches 125dB SPL handily. You should have no problems playing next to the drummer.

*What’s the reference speaker used?*
Powercab features a custom designed 8Ω, 12" coaxial speaker that uses a guitar-style cone as opposed to a PA-style cone with a 2” high-temperature voice coil loosely based on the Eminence Beta 12CX format. The 1” compression driver is a Celestion CDX 1-1010, which is used only for Flat mode, monitor feeds, and user IR modes; it’s not utilized at all for speaker models.

*How do I load IRs into Powercab 112 Plus?*
From the free _Powercab Edit_ software (Mac/PC) via USB.

*So I can edit presets via Mac or PC?*
Yes. _Powercab Edit_ (Mac/PC, available this May from Line 6) is used to manage, reorder, backup, import, and export your Powercab 112 Plus presets and IR files (2048-point, 48 kHz .WAV). This allows you to easily create an unlimited collection of presets and IRs stored on your computer, and transfer them as needed to Powercab 112 Plus.

*Can I get a cover for Powercab?*
Yes, Powercab covers will be available from select retailers and the Line 6 Store; expected US street price is $69.99.

*Dimensions/weight? Am I gonna break my back?*
Powercab 112—22.3”w x 18.2”h x 12”d (33.25 lbs)
Powercab 112 Plus—22.3”w x 18.2”h x 12”d (35.5 lbs)

*What’s the price? *
Powercab 112—$599.99 US street
Powercab 112 Plus—$799.99 US street

*When are they shipping?*
May 2018.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

These look very cool. I sold my modelling stuff (except for the Amplifire that I use to play with headphones), but if I were to put together another Helix rig (which I've contemplated), these would be on my list of cabs to try out.

If they deliver on their potential, they could be pretty cool.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

sometimes I wish Line 6 would just build a simple piece of equipment and not incorporate digital tech of any sort. I checked out these earlier this week and was immediately turned off when they showed the extra bells and whistles, like the modelling. It'll do the job for some but if I'm looking for a straight ahead and simple FRFR speaker I'm going to pass on these. It also makes me wonder if something like this, probably like all Line6 stuff, is heading for the junk pile in a few years when it is outdated


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

vadsy said:


> sometimes I wish Line 6 would just build a simple piece of equipment and not incorporate digital tech of any sort. I checked out these earlier this week and was immediately turned off when they showed the extra bells and whistles, like the modelling. It'll do the job for some but if I'm looking for a straight ahead and simple FRFR speaker I'm going to pass on these. It also makes me wonder if something like this, probably like all Line6 stuff, is heading for the junk pile in a few years when it is outdated


I don't think something like a Helix will go to the junk pile in a few years. If it's working and set up well, I don't see any reason not to use it for a long time. These cabs can do the FRFR thing if you turn the speaker emulation off. It seems like a good design with some flexibility that addresses one of the big complaints from some about modellers (ie. miked sound vs. amp in the room sound).


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

vadsy said:


> sometimes I wish Line 6 would just build a simple piece of equipment and not incorporate digital tech of any sort. I checked out these earlier this week and was immediately turned off when they showed the extra bells and whistles, like the modelling. It'll do the job for some but if I'm looking for a straight ahead and simple FRFR speaker I'm going to pass on these. It also makes me wonder if something like this, probably like all Line6 stuff, is heading for the junk pile in a few years when it is outdated


Didn't they do some Bogner designed amps that were tube?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

butterknucket said:


> Didn't they do some Bogner designed amps that were tube?


oh yea, those were actually pretty cool and could have been cooler if all the modelling could be yanked out and you'd still have a working amp.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

jdto said:


> I don't think something like a Helix will go to the junk pile in a few years. If it's working and set up well, I don't see any reason not to use it for a long time. These cabs can do the FRFR thing if you turn the speaker emulation off. It seems like a good design with some flexibility that addresses one of the big complaints from some about modellers (ie. miked sound vs. amp in the room sound).


I'm still not sold on these cabs but that may change when I'm ready to buy. I'm really digging the Friedman stuff and I just found out they do a simple regular looking 1x12 with horn FRFR cab over the wedge they used to show. As for the Helix, it seems like it will outlast the pods for the time being but you can't argue that many of those units are outdated and heading for the back shelf/junk pile.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

vadsy said:


> I'm still not sold on these cabs but that may change when I'm ready to buy. I'm really digging the Friedman stuff and I just found out they do a simple regular looking 1x12 with horn FRFR cab over the wedge they used to show. As for the Helix, it seems like it will outlast the pods for the time being but you can't argue that many of those units are outdated and heading for the back shelf/junk pile.


Yeah, the earlier stuff is probably getting bypassed, it’s true. The sounds from the current modellers are good enough that you could play them for 20 years, provided they don’t fry or something. A Helix is a pretty damn good piece of gear. That with a pair of these cabs (or with some good FRFR like a Friedman or XiTone) would be a kickass setup for anyone. 

If it weren’t for GAS, I’d still have a Helix/XiTone setup and I’d probably not need anything else. Not that I buy gear because of need, anyway


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

vadsy said:


> I'm still not sold on these cabs but that may change when I'm ready to buy. I'm really digging the Friedman stuff and I just found out they do a simple regular looking 1x12 with horn FRFR cab over the wedge they used to show. As for the Helix, it seems like it will outlast the pods for the time being but you can't argue that many of those units are outdated and heading for the back shelf/junk pile.


I thought those things were just straight tube amps? Oh well. 

I've never owned any modelling gear for the same reason.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

vadsy said:


> I'm still not sold on these cabs but that may change when I'm ready to buy. I'm really digging the Friedman stuff and I just found out they do a simple regular looking 1x12 with horn FRFR cab over the wedge they used to show. As for the Helix, it seems like it will outlast the pods for the time being but you can't argue that many of those units are outdated and heading for the back shelf/junk pile.


You’re thinking is asenine really. Are you still listening to music on an 8-track? How about watching a tube TV? Technology keeps advancing and with that the old tech becomes obsolete and heads for the “junk pile”. L6 is killing right now with their new tech, can’t wait to try that PC+!!!


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## chuck_zc (Dec 6, 2009)

vadsy said:


> oh yea, those were actually pretty cool and could have been cooler if all the modelling could be yanked out and you'd still have a working amp.


That's exactly what I did with my Line 6 Spider Valve. Pulled all the digital crap and built my own preamp. The tube section is very easy to work with.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

They are up front that this isnt meant to be just an frfr cab.

Which is their way of saying "if you jut want an frfr wedge, other peope make that. If you want something better, look here".


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## Cups (Jan 5, 2010)

I’m not sure why people who aren’t into modelling are posting:
To me with a modeller you are going direct so for me a powered cab of decent quality will do fine as far as FRFR. 
This is probably next level detail for the weirdos who use modeling to get as close to tubes as possible- I don’t quite understand that myself. Why can’t modeling sound like itself? Every once in a while I play a tube amp and I left disappointed. So one dimensional. My opinion of course


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

I just picked up a Powercab Plus last week along with a Helix LT. The PC+ sounds really good, so far. I haven’t been able to really play it too much as we had to close the cottage this weekend, but what little I’ve played sounds good. The greenback model certainly gives a greenback vibe based on the amps I’ve had with that speaker. 

@Cups it’s nice to have different sound options. My Helix is full of “miked amp” presets and they sound great, but turning off the cab block in Helix and using the greenback model in the PC+ sounds really good, too. 

As to weirdos using modelling to get as close to tubes as possible, a big selling point of the top-line modellers is “you can’t hear or feel a difference”. 

I agree that modellers sound good, but they are models of tube amps, so I guess that’s why people want them to sound like the amps they simulate.


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## Cups (Jan 5, 2010)

Weirdo is the wrong word (and not very gracious of me). It just seems people want modeling to be what’s its not and then end up bad mouthing it because it is what it is (make sense?) 
Of course there’s no pleasing some people. I guess these individuals like sound more than actually playing music.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Cups said:


> Weirdo is the wrong word (and not very gracious of me). It just seems people want modeling to be what’s its not and then end up bad mouthing it because it is what it is (make sense?)
> Of course there’s no pleasing some people. I guess these individuals like sound more than actually playing music.


I get what you're saying. There will always be biases for or against any technology. I had a full Helix modelling rig and I sold it and bought a couple of tube amps. Now I've come back to the Helix. I like the ease of switching amps/rigs for different tones and sounds. I will eventually hook it up to my computer and set up a few presets for the kind of songs and music I like to play, but there are plenty of usable tones in it already.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Weird multi-post


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Cups said:


> Weirdo is the wrong word (and not very gracious of me). It just seems people want modeling to be what’s its not and then end up bad mouthing it because it is what it is (make sense?)
> Of course there’s no pleasing some people. I guess these individuals like sound more than actually playing music.


I would say a lot of us want modeling to the best of both worlds. The tone of a good amp (tube or otherwise, although in my world it is only the former) but with the flexibility of switching platforms, built in effects, lots of presets - and not weighing 100lbs. This last comment was because I owned a very versatile 4 channel tube amp that was crazy heavy and crazy loud, although it sounded great and met many of my 'flexibility' criteria. I just hated moving it.

I also don't think liking good sound and playing music are mutually exclusive. In fact, I think the former feeds the latter, at least in my and my contemporaries' case. Just because you like good tone doesn't mean you can't play, or don't play out. Ask guys like Pete Thorn or Ian Thornley. YMMV.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

pat6969 said:


> You’re thinking is asenine really. Are you still listening to music on an 8-track? How about watching a tube TV? Technology keeps advancing and with that the old tech becomes obsolete and heads for the “junk pile”. L6 is killing right now with their new tech, can’t wait to try that PC+!!!


It's probably asinine but it isn't that far fetched. We may not be listening to 8-tracks but vinyl has certainly made a comeback. We may not be watching tube TV's but we are certainly playing tube amps and praising the vintage circuits of the golden tone era. With how quick technology is advancing the 'new' becomes obsolete quicker than the old, it often doesn't even have a chance to make a presence. A Fender Blues Jr hasn't changed all that much over the years but we've gone through literally ten L6 POD's in that time. I'm not trying to trash modelling in my post I'm saying I wish that L6, if given the opportunity, make something that has a better chance of sticking around. I think with all the modelling options they offer these days in pedal, floorboard and rack form, why not offer something simple that can stay relevant across the board for longer? A simplified speaker cab may be that opportunity.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

vadsy said:


> It's probably asinine but it isn't that far fetched. We may not be listening to 8-tracks but vinyl has certainly made a comeback. We may not be watching tube TV's but we are certainly playing tube amps and praising the vintage circuits of the golden tone era. With how quick technology is advancing the 'new' becomes obsolete quicker than the old, it often doesn't even have a chance to make a presence. A Fender Blues Jr hasn't changed all that much over the years but we've gone through literally ten L6 POD's in that time. I'm not trying to trash modelling in my post I'm saying I wish that L6, if given the opportunity, make something that has a better chance of sticking around. I think with all the modelling options they offer these days in pedal, floorboard and rack form, why not offer something simple that can stay relevant across the board for longer? A simplified speaker cab may be that opportunity.


Probably because literally everything line 6 does is about pushing forward and being the latest and greatest.

Yeah fender didnt change the blues junior, but you're omitting the mustang series


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

@vadsy I get what you're saying, but as long as the stuff doesn't break, fry or otherwise stop working, what's to stop someone from using it for a decade or more? Sure, there will be newer gear and newer technology, but the Helix sounds great right now, so why wouldn't it sound great in 10 years?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Budda said:


> Probably because literally everything line 6 does is about pushing forward and being the latest and greatest.
> 
> Yeah fender didnt change the blues junior, but you're omitting the mustang series


That's exactly my point. Throw the latest and greatest tech into the mix and its out the door in 6 months. It doesn't matter who is doing the building. I'm not trying to pit Fender and L6, I'm saying I want L6 to make me something I can hold on to for a couple of years.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

vadsy said:


> It's probably asinine but it isn't that far fetched. We may not be listening to 8-tracks but vinyl has certainly made a comeback. We may not be watching tube TV's but we are certainly playing tube amps and praising the vintage circuits of the golden tone era. With how quick technology is advancing the 'new' becomes obsolete quicker than the old, it often doesn't even have a chance to make a presence. A Fender Blues Jr hasn't changed all that much over the years but we've gone through literally ten L6 POD's in that time. I'm not trying to trash modelling in my post I'm saying I wish that L6, if given the opportunity, make something that has a better chance of sticking around. I think with all the modelling options they offer these days in pedal, floorboard and rack form, why not offer something simple that can stay relevant across the board for longer? A simplified speaker cab may be that opportunity.


I think that was their idea with Helix, to make a unit that can be expanded and have a long shelf life. As with all things, especially electronics, sometimes the technology moves way faster than the hardware can keep up. I think Helix has a lot of untapped horsepower so hopefully it lasts another 5-8 years. We’ll see. As for the Powercab, it’s precisely what people have wanted for years, an FRFR type speaker as well as something that can produce that “amp in room” feel. Genius if you ask me, can’t wait to get mine.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

jdto said:


> @vadsy I get what you're saying, but as long as the stuff doesn't break, fry or otherwise stop working, what's to stop someone from using it for a decade or more? Sure, there will be newer gear and newer technology, but the Helix sounds great right now, so why wouldn't it sound great in 10 years?


Lets be realistic, very few people are gonna want a ten year old Helix. How many people play a POD X3 these days? They'll have something better out six times over and we will all follow it. L6 themselves will make the Helix obsolete.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

vadsy said:


> Lets be realistic, very few people are gonna want a ten year old Helix. How many people play a POD X3 these days? They'll have something better out six times over and we will all follow it. L6 themselves will make the Helix obsolete.


They will come out with new tech, of course, but if my Helix is still working, why would I get rid of it? The sound of the Helix isn't going to change, is it?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

pat6969 said:


> I think that was their idea with Helix, to make a unit that can be expanded and have a long shelf life. As with all things, especially electronics, sometimes the technology moves way faster than the hardware can keep up. I think Helix has a lot of untapped horsepower so hopefully it lasts another 5-8 years. We’ll see. As for the Powercab, it’s precisely what people have wanted for years, an FRFR type speaker as well as something that can produce that “amp in room” feel. Genius if you ask me, can’t wait to get mine.


I'd love to try it too, maybe I'll buy yours.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

vadsy said:


> Lets be realistic, very few people are gonna want a ten year old Helix. How many people play a POD X3 these days? They'll have something better out six times over and we will all follow it. L6 themselves will make the Helix obsolete.


Of course they will! That’s technology moving forward. I’d be very concerned if they weren’t moving forward.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

jdto said:


> They will come out with new tech, of course, but if my Helix is still working, why would I get rid of it? The sound of the Helix isn't going to change, is it?


You don't have to get rid of it but chances are you'll be tempted and I'm sure they'll find ways to make improvements, or at least thats what they should be doing.


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

vadsy said:


> I'm saying I wish that L6, if given the opportunity, make something that has a better chance of sticking around.


I hear you. I loved my M-9, L6 loved it so much they grandparented its fx into the Helix .
I just got rid of my M-9 to try the HX Stomp......we will see how that goes.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

jdto said:


> @vadsy I get what you're saying, but as long as the stuff doesn't break, fry or otherwise stop working, what's to stop someone from using it for a decade or more? Sure, there will be newer gear and newer technology, but the Helix sounds great right now, so why wouldn't it sound great in 10 years?


I agree. It's the 'foot-itis' thing we gear guys suffer from. Always looking for the next big thing while there's nothing really wrong with what we've got.

Personally, I've got an L6 M9 that works brilliantly for what I do with it (mod effects only). I've got the perfect sized pedalboard for it and a few analog drive/comps. Got that big, proprietary power supply mounted underneath. No need to change. While I look longingly at the newer Helix multi-fx, in a live environment I don't know if it will be that much of an improvement. And it/they won't fit as well as the M9 does without changing the board, power supply, etc. 

I hope to get 10 years out of that M9 (5 years in already) while I couldn't out of their earlier modeling tech (on of those kidney bean things).


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

vadsy said:


> You don't have to get rid of it but chances are you'll be tempted and I'm sure they'll find ways to make improvements, or at least thats what they should be doing.


I might be, but it would be out of GAS, rather than the need to "upgrade". People buy and sell gear all the time. I agree that the current modelling tech will likely have very little resale value in a decade, which is not something you see with guitars or tube amps.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

pat6969 said:


> Of course they will! That’s technology moving forward. I’d be very concerned if they weren’t moving forward.


Holy shit. Yes, it will move forward, absolutely. I was originally trying to say that if they make just one thing that isn't latest and greatest tech based it could last longer than building something around a plugin modelling circuit board wedged unnecessarily into one of their products. If they already have a bunch of boards/pedals to offer players that meets their needs, why not make a speaker cab that just amplifies the Helix or POD or whatever they put out? It could possibly last a few generations of Helix or HXFX units.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

bzrkrage said:


> I hear you. I loved my M-9, L6 loved it so much they grandparented its fx into the Helix .
> I just got rid of my M-9 to try the HX Stomp......we will see how that goes.


Keep us posted. 

No, wait ..... DON'T. What am I saying? "I love my M9. I love my M9. I love my M9. I love my M9. I love my M9. I love my M9." I am so weak.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

vadsy said:


> Holy shit. Yes, it will move forward, absolutely. I was originally trying to say that if they make just one thing that isn't latest and greatest tech based it could last longer than building something around a plugin modelling circuit board wedged unnecessarily into one of their products. If they already have a bunch of boards/pedals to offer players that meets their needs, why not make a speaker cab that just amplifies the Helix or POD or whatever they put out? It could possibly last a few generations of Helix or HXFX units.


That’s what the Powercab is so I guess they’ve already answered your question.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

pat6969 said:


> That’s what the Powercab is so I guess they’ve already answered your question.


I think its the speaker modelling that turns me off.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

vadsy said:


> I think its the speaker modelling that turns me off.


Does it not sound realistic? Which one did you try? Regular or plus?


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

vadsy said:


> sometimes I wish Line 6 would just build a simple piece of equipment and not incorporate digital tech of any sort. I checked out these earlier this week and was immediately turned off when they showed the extra bells and whistles, like the modelling. It'll do the job for some but if I'm looking for a straight ahead and simple FRFR speaker I'm going to pass on these. It also makes me wonder if something like this, probably like all Line6 stuff, is heading for the junk pile in a few years when it is outdated


All modelling stuff tends to end up in the junk pile once it's outdated, that's why I don't bother with it.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

butterknucket said:


> All modelling stuff tends to end up in the junk pile once it's outdated, that's why I don't bother with it.


Until it’s indistinguishable from a mic’d up tube amp’ then it’s pretty much as far as it will go. Apparently a lot of bands seem to feel it’s at that point.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

pat6969 said:


> Does it not sound realistic? Which one did you try? Regular or plus?


Just the regular 112, it was ok, nothing wrong with it if that’s what your after. Very light, that was noticeable. I could see someone having a great little gigging rig with a guitar, Helix LT and a 112 Powercab.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Dont eventide H3000's still fetch good money on the used market? Etc.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

vadsy said:


> a guitar, Helix LT and a 112 Powercab


It's working well for me


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

pat6969 said:


> Until it’s indistinguishable from a mic’d up tube amp’ then it’s pretty much as far as it will go. Apparently a lot of bands seem to feel it’s at that point.


It's a fine idea and it seems to be working for both smaller bands and big guys but do you ever feel like its wholehearted tone satisfaction or a financial decision to maximize tour profits?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

jdto said:


> It's working well for me


That is awesome and I hope it continues to. Are you using just the LT in terms of a board?


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Budda said:


> Dont eventide H3000's still fetch good money on the used market? Etc.


Certainly looks that way, that thing looks vintage at this point. 

Do you find that Eventide and Strymon vs Line 6 seem to hold resale value better? Why is that?


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

vadsy said:


> That is awesome and I hope it continues to. Are you using just the LT in terms of a board?


Yup, all LT. I do have a little board with four cool pedals and a tuner on it that I use with my Vox AC4, but I haven't used it with the Helix, yet. I sold off my big board when I sold my Tone King Royalist and traded in a few pedals on the Powercab at L&M (they gave me used return on a few pedals).


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

vadsy said:


> Certainly looks that way, that thing looks vintage at this point.
> 
> Do you find that Eventide and Strymon vs Line 6 seem to hold resale value better? Why is that?


Resale is probably best on strymon, but their prices changed and im not sure used prices caught up. I dont look up eventide or line 6 gear so im not sure if their resale is any worse than the typical 20-30% less sticker.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

vadsy said:


> It's a fine idea and it seems to be working for both smaller bands and big guys but do you ever feel like its wholehearted tone satisfaction or a financial decision to maximize tour profits?


If those bigger bands were using a Helix or AX8 I might be inclined to say it’s for maximizing profit but look at their modelling rigs, they’re huge. Each Metallica member has a huge rack with Fractals, power amps and other stuff, as well as cabs, I can’t imagine it’s that much easier to transport. Smaller bands it’s quite possible, gigging a Helix and Powercab definitely saves them money from lugging around amps and cabs.


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

I'm pretty interested in the Power Cab. I've been using an OOOOOLLLLLLDDDDD Yorkville 100K Mixer Amp as my on-stage monitor for my Helix for a couple years now, mostly because I already own the thing. I don't even haul it to all our shows, sometimes I'll just go direct into FoH and put some guitar in the monitors is space is a constraint. However, I prefer my guitar sounds at my back and just vocals/keys in the monitors to keep things less cluttered.

Power Cab seems really neat. I've been looking at the Friedman, Mission and other offerings and the Line 6 is a good balance of gadgets and price. I'm a little more interested in the vanilla PC over the Plus, _but_ it might be interesting to load a few IRs into the PC+ and let it handle that side via MIDI or L6 link, and let Helix do everything else. That should open up some DSP for more processing on the amp/effects side. Although, in terms of placement, doing that speaker processing at the end of the chain may not be ideal. Who knows?

Anyway, the Helix is hella killer. I've had mine for 2 years now and haven't had a single problem with my unit. Line 6 is great at pumping out firmware for it, constantly improving existing sounds and adding-in new toys. I've literally lost all interest in amps. There are some effects that come out that are interesting, and with Helix's 4 loops, I can always make use of them, but I largely ignore most pedals out there, too. I find I spend a LOT more time just playing and making adjustments to my tones and less time researching new pedals 

Will it get outdated? Sure. But so is that tube amp sitting in your studio. Personally, I will keep using the Helix until it dies on me. I can get it to sound as good as any other rig I've heard, so the next latest-greatest product isn't really the point. Helix 2 will eventually come out, and I'm sure I'll want one, but it will largely come down to ergonomics. If it's smaller, lighter, more portable and STILL does everything that the current Helix does, I'll definitely be interested. Other than that, I'll keep rocking my Helix Floor until the capacitors dry-up.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

hollowbody said:


> I'm pretty interested in the Power Cab. I've been using an OOOOOLLLLLLDDDDD Yorkville 100K Mixer Amp as my on-stage monitor for my Helix for a couple years now, mostly because I already own the thing. I don't even haul it to all our shows, sometimes I'll just go direct into FoH and put some guitar in the monitors is space is a constraint. However, I prefer my guitar sounds at my back and just vocals/keys in the monitors to keep things less cluttered.
> 
> Power Cab seems really neat. I've been looking at the Friedman, Mission and other offerings and the Line 6 is a good balance of gadgets and price. I'm a little more interested in the vanilla PC over the Plus, _but_ it might be interesting to load a few IRs into the PC+ and let it handle that side via MIDI or L6 link, and let Helix do everything else. That should open up some DSP for more processing on the amp/effects side. Although, in terms of placement, doing that speaker processing at the end of the chain may not be ideal. Who knows?
> 
> ...


I’m with you on getting the regular Powercab, only thing steering me to the plus is it will have FW updates and possibly new speaker sims which I like.


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

pat6969 said:


> I’m with you on getting the regular Powercab, only thing steering me to the plus is it will have FW updates and possibly new speaker sims which I like.


I really like the idea of it, but I wish it had all the stock Helix cabs loaded on it as well, although IR functionality is nice. Without having heard any of the on-board speaker models, I guess it could all be moot - maybe they sound killer? Anyway, the one thing that makes me leery of the Plus is relying on Helix to send midi commands to the cab for it to switch over per preset. I'm sure it's fine, but I hate the idea of introducing _another_ thing that might go wrong at a gig 

It _is_ Yorkville Month at L&M, so I'm tempted to pick one up on 0% financing


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

In 24 hours @hollowbody will post his NGD.


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

It’s here! With bonus warranty (thx L&M)


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

I got my Powercab Plus about two weeks ago and I’m thoroughly impressed. The speakers models sound great and it sounds killer in FRFR mode. I haven’t cranked it yet but on half volume it’s plenty loud in my basement. Just snagged JVT69 to complete the trifecta! I’ll have it tomorrow.


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

pat6969 said:


> I got my Powercab Plus about two weeks ago and I’m thoroughly impressed. The speakers models sound great and it sounds killer in FRFR mode. I haven’t cranked it yet but on half volume it’s plenty loud in my basement. Just snagged JVT69 to complete the trifecta! I’ll have it tomorrow.


Congrats! I'm still sitting on the fence about getting PowerCab. I'm in the "I'd like one" camp more than "I need one."


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

hollowbody said:


> Congrats! I'm still sitting on the fence about getting PowerCab. I'm in the "I'd like one" camp more than "I need one."


Christmas.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

I stopped in at L&M yesterday to see that they had the Stomp in and I was going to try it with a PowerCab but they were both sold. It would have been interesting. In the meantime I am starting to gain interest in the Kemper.


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## neldom (Apr 29, 2009)

@vadsy, the problem is you're thinking like a consumer, L6 wants you to buy a new model every two years.
They are more than happy to see guitar player's shelves full of dusty obsolete gear as long there's new stuff on their floor.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

neldom said:


> @vadsy, the problem is you're thinking like a consumer, L6 wants you to buy a new model every two years.
> They are more than happy to see guitar player's shelves full of dusty obsolete gear as long there's new stuff on their floor.


That's pretty much anything electronic, not just Line 6. Tech is always outracing hardware, just the way it is.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

That said, the Kemper has been around for 7 years and is still going strong and sounding fantastic, by all accounts. The Helix sounds good to me through my PowerCab+ and I'm pleased with the setup. As long as the Helix/PC+ combo keeps functioning, I don't see any reason to replace them with new models just because they come out with something new. Good sound is good sound. Sure, eventually they might burn out or stop being supported by subsequent software updates or operating systems, but until that day, I'll be good. 

@pat6969 let us know how the JT Variax is. I'm tempted to grab on of the 59 or 69 models to run with my Helix. It would be fun to swap all sounds (and even tunings) at once. Variax is getting long in the tooth, too, as far as modelling tech goes, but I've read some good reviews (and some not-so-good) about Variax/Helix. I think I'd like it, but haven't had one come up for sale used at a time when I had enough in the GAS fund.


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

neldom said:


> @vadsy, the problem is you're thinking like a consumer, L6 wants you to buy a new model every two years.
> They are more than happy to see guitar player's shelves full of dusty obsolete gear as long there's new stuff on their floor.


I feel so used all of a sudden, terrible of them to do this to me


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## Ricktoberfest (Jun 22, 2014)

vadsy said:


> I feel so used all of a sudden, terrible of them to do this to me


Please please buy a Kemper or Helix. That way I can play with it and live vicariously through you! No way I’m getting anything like that any time soon! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Ricktoberfest said:


> Please please buy a Kemper or Helix. That way I can play with it and live vicariously through you! No way I’m getting anything like that any time soon!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I’m working on it. Let’s see what the budget is like once the streaming and in-ear jazz is done and hopefully Debi and Dave buy me one.


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## Guest (Nov 29, 2018)

The bitter taste of cheap failing crap will remain long after the sweet sound of L6 gear is gone. L6 has suckered me a bunch of times but after the last purchase I swore I would never buy anything L6 again.


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

Player99 said:


> L6 has suckered me a bunch of times but after the last purchase


 What kit failed you last time around? Just asking, cause my M-9( just traded up) lasted me a good....7 years. My G-30 is still working (touch wood!)


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## Guest (Nov 29, 2018)

bzrkrage said:


> What kit failed you last time around? Just asking, cause my M-9( just traded up) lasted me a good....7 years. My G-30 is still working (touch wood!)


J Tyler Variax.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

Player99 said:


> The bitter taste of cheap failing crap will remain long after the sweet sound of L6 gear is gone. L6 has suckered me a bunch of times but after the last purchase I swore I would never buy anything L6 again.


Man! I’m sure they hate to lose a sucker.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2018)

pat6969 said:


> Man! I’m sure they hate to lose a sucker.


Na, they got you.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

Player99 said:


> Na, they got you.


That’s unfortunate you had a bad experience in the past. The new L6 line is killer.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2018)

I have amps and pedals from the '60's that work as they should. I have bought a number of Line6 products that stopped working prematurely. DL4, Pod floor unit, 3 Variaxes to name some.


pat6969 said:


> That’s unfortunate you had a bad experience in the past. The new L6 line is killer.


Thanks I know... I just won't ever again buy because out of the tons of gear I own, only L6 has let me down so consistently. Perhaps Yamaha will bring better quality control, but with all the gear there is out there, I will live without L6.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

Player99 said:


> I have amps and pedals from the '60's that work as they should. I have bought a number of Line6 products that stopped working prematurely. DL4, Pod floor unit, 3 Variaxes to name some.
> 
> Thanks I know... I just won't ever again buy because out of the tons of gear I own, only L6 has let me down so consistently. Perhaps Yamaha will bring better quality control, but with all the gear there is out there, I will live without L6.


Unfortunately everyone has a story like this. Mine is Gibson. Too many guitars I’ve bought with bad QC. I’ll never buy another Gibson though others buy them by the truckload. To each their own I say.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2018)

pat6969 said:


> Unfortunately everyone has a story like this. Mine is Gibson. Too many guitars I’ve bought with bad QC. I’ll never buy another Gibson though others buy them by the truckload. To each their own I say.


I have 5 Gibsons and they are all working. All the L6 crap is in the dump. Funny how a pedal from the 1960's still functions as new, and a DL4 is DOA.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Player99 said:


> I have 5 Gibsons and they are all working. All the L6 crap is in the dump. Funny how a pedal from the 1960's still functions as new, and a DL4 is DOA.


But simple research would show you that that's a symptom of DL4's that see a lot of use. Our singer is on his 7th or 8th. It could have been avoided


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2018)

Budda said:


> But simple research would show you that that's a symptom of DL4's that see a lot of use. Our singer is on his 7th or 8th. It could have been avoided


That was many many years ago.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Player99 said:


> That was many many years ago.


There was still the internet.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

Player99 said:


> I have 5 Gibsons and they are all working. All the L6 crap is in the dump. Funny how a pedal from the 1960's still functions as new, and a DL4 is DOA.


Same with my Gibson junk! To be fair, they were good for kindling in the fire pit.


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2018)

Budda said:


> There was still the internet.


Yes but it was new so all I looked at was porn.


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

jdto said:


> That said, the Kemper has been around for 7 years and is still going strong and sounding fantastic, by all accounts. The Helix sounds good to me through my PowerCab+ and I'm pleased with the setup. As long as the Helix/PC+ combo keeps functioning, I don't see any reason to replace them with new models just because they come out with something new. Good sound is good sound. Sure, eventually they might burn out or stop being supported by subsequent software updates or operating systems, but until that day, I'll be good.
> 
> @pat6969 let us know how the JT Variax is. I'm tempted to grab on of the 59 or 69 models to run with my Helix. It would be fun to swap all sounds (and even tunings) at once. Variax is getting long in the tooth, too, as far as modelling tech goes, but I've read some good reviews (and some not-so-good) about Variax/Helix. I think I'd like it, but haven't had one come up for sale used at a time when I had enough in the GAS fund.


Same here. I've been using my Helix for regular gigs for over 2 years now and I've never had a single problem with it. It's usually on at home, too, so it's definitely been putting-in the hours. The only reason I could see me buying a different unit or a newer version of the Helix would be if it made more sense ergonomically/logitically for me. Something smaller, easier to transport, etc. Or if it had functionality that made my life easier. Having said that, Helix has made my gigging and band life easier already, so that's a huge plus, and it sounds absolutely killer. Sound guys love the thing and hearing it pumping out of a big PA rig is really awesome.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Never had a problem with Gibson or L6 (or TC Electronics, another favorite whipping boy). But I will never ever ever buy another Godin. Ever. The ones I had were junk and soon gone. Never ever again.

I guess we all having our stories to tell.


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

jdto said:


> That said, the Kemper has been around for 7 years and is still going strong and sounding fantastic, by all accounts. The Helix sounds good to me through my PowerCab+ and I'm pleased with the setup. As long as the Helix/PC+ combo keeps functioning, I don't see any reason to replace them with new models just because they come out with something new. Good sound is good sound. Sure, eventually they might burn out or stop being supported by subsequent software updates or operating systems, but until that day, I'll be good.
> 
> @pat6969 let us know how the JT Variax is. I'm tempted to grab on of the 59 or 69 models to run with my Helix. It would be fun to swap all sounds (and even tunings) at once. Variax is getting long in the tooth, too, as far as modelling tech goes, but I've read some good reviews (and some not-so-good) about Variax/Helix. I think I'd like it, but haven't had one come up for sale used at a time when I had enough in the GAS fund.


I’ve had a few days to put it through its paces and I can’t really put it down. The actual guitar is rather incredible. Frets are perfect, stays in tune perfect whether I bend or use the trem. Fit and finish is excellent, but then again these are built at WMF so I expected that. The modelling, combined with the Helix is excellent. If I had to say a bad thing it would be the palm muting isn’t very good when I use the drop tuning. I can get through “Stillborn”, for instance, but I use the pitch whammy in the Helix dropped half step as it sounds a bit better. Acoustic models are great and single note and chords sound Good on all the models, just muting suffers. All in all I really like it.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

pat6969 said:


> I’ve had a few days to put it through its paces and I can’t really put it down. The actual guitar is rather incredible. Frets are perfect, stays in tune perfect whether I bend or use the trem. Fit and finish is excellent, but then again these are built at WMF so I expected that. The modelling, combined with the Helix is excellent. If I had to say a bad thing it would be the palm muting isn’t very good when I use the drop tuning. I can get through “Stillborn”, for instance, but I use the pitch whammy in the Helix dropped half step as it sounds a bit better. Acoustic models are great and single note and chords sound Good on all the models, just muting suffers. All in all I really like it.


Thanks for the review. That does sound really interesting and I'm going to keep an eye out for one, I think.


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## hollowbody (Jan 15, 2008)

pat6969 said:


> I’ve had a few days to put it through its paces and I can’t really put it down. The actual guitar is rather incredible. Frets are perfect, stays in tune perfect whether I bend or use the trem. Fit and finish is excellent, but then again these are built at WMF so I expected that. The modelling, combined with the Helix is excellent. If I had to say a bad thing it would be the palm muting isn’t very good when I use the drop tuning. I can get through “Stillborn”, for instance, but I use the pitch whammy in the Helix dropped half step as it sounds a bit better. Acoustic models are great and single note and chords sound Good on all the models, just muting suffers. All in all I really like it.


I've been convincing myself that I don't need one (or do I?) for a while now. But I think I'm more interested right now in potentially trading my Helix Floor for a Rack and Control system. Gear, eh?


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## pat6969 (Feb 4, 2013)

hollowbody said:


> I've been convincing myself that I don't need one (or do I?) for a while now. But I think I'm more interested right now in potentially trading my Helix Floor for a Rack and Control system. Gear, eh?


The acoustic models sound pretty good to me.


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## Lemmy Hangslong (May 11, 2006)

I got a Line 6 Helix LT back in March and soon afterwards got the Powercab Plus... sounds excellent to me and I like the ease of use. My last gig before covid was with a Katana Artist which is a pretty cool amp but this Line 6 pairing sounds way better. Until now I've been tubes and pedals, still got all my tube gear but like wont gig it very often.


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