# Do I Really Need An Effects Loop?



## david henman

...i guess what i'm really asking is: how do you guys cope _without_ an effects loop?


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## mhammer

Are you referring to a loop selector before the amp, or an effects loop built into the amp? They each have different uses and advantages.


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## Brennan

My Peters does have an effects loop, but I have yet to use it ... I get along just fine with everything out front (but I don't use very much in the way of effects).


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## hollowbody

I've had amps with and without, but honestly, I don't use enough effects that need to go in the FX loop to really to miss not having one. The only thing I use that could go in the loop would be my DMM, but I honestly don't think it sounds bad up front, so there she stays.


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## Chito

All my gigging amps have effects loops but I've never used it. I always go pedal board to amp. I just have my OD/Dist pedals before the modulation/delay pedals all the time. I don't think it really matters much if you get your dist/od from a pedal as all you have to make sure is have the od/dist before everything else. Now if you are getting your dirt sound from the preamp section of the amp, then having the modulation/delay pedals in the effects loop makes sense. OTOH if you are getting your od through the power tubes then having the pedals in the effects loop won't matter whether you put it in the effects loop or not.

This is my understanding of how it works. Now if someone thinks I might be talking through my a** in here and think I really don't know what I'm talking about, please let me know. hahaha


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## sivs

My AC15 without has served me well. I've never felt the need to run things through a loop - but I suppose if you were running somthing with more than one channel or at high gain, the FX loop would be useful for delays and such. I had one on my AC30 that I never used, and now that I don't have it I don't miss it.


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## GuitarsCanada

Interesting topic and responses here. Surprised at how many people do not use the loop. I don't myself but thought I might be in the minority on that one. Maybe not. Added poll to the thread.


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## mhammer

Personally I find that feeding a delayed or reverbed signal to an amp that I intend to overdrive is unwise. In such instances, I think one gets a more desirable spacious sound by splitting the signal before the amp, feeding the amp a nonreverbed/delayed signal and patching the delayed signal to the effects return so that the delay is cleaner, and mixed in with the overdriven tone. That gets you closer to a post-production application of delay/reverb.


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## Guest

david henman said:


> ...i guess what i'm really asking is: how do you guys cope _without_ an effects loop?


Better yet: how do I cope without a guitar amp? 

I picked no. You can do without it. Might not be exactly how you want to role, but not the end of the world. Worst case you run the amp clean and build everything with pedals where you can control order to the Nth degree.


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## washburned

I always figured effects loops were for things like reverb and echo back in the day they were as big as a head and not board mountable.....I think these days it's just a carry over, because in the studio all effects should go post amp and in a live situation the difference in sound quality is, as Wild Bill says, mice nuts. Maybe if you have one of those huge rack mount units with a pedal board controller it would be handy, but come on, how many of us are using that type of rig?


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## zurn

I used to have an ac30 with an effects loop, now the one I have doesn't have one and I must say that I can hear a difference. My DMM is a lot noisier in front (more hiss), my modulation pedals don't sound as good in front either. The way I see it, if you pedals insert noise in the signal and your running them in front, you amplifying the noise twice (once in the pre-amp stage, and another time in the power amp stage).


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## david henman

...this pretty well sums it up for me, as well, chito.

i was considering the traynor dark horse amp head but, with no fx loop, it just doesn't make sense.

the egnator tweaker is the one i should look at.

should have put this thread in the amps forum.




Chito said:


> All my gigging amps have effects loops but I've never used it. I always go pedal board to amp. I just have my OD/Dist pedals before the modulation/delay pedals all the time. I don't think it really matters much if you get your dist/od from a pedal as all you have to make sure is have the od/dist before everything else. Now if you are getting your dirt sound from the preamp section of the amp, then having the modulation/delay pedals in the effects loop makes sense. OTOH if you are getting your od through the power tubes then having the pedals in the effects loop won't matter whether you put it in the effects loop or not.
> 
> This is my understanding of how it works. Now if someone thinks I might be talking through my a** in here and think I really don't know what I'm talking about, please let me know. hahaha


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## 4345567

__________


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## Budda

I've had an fx loop on just about every amp I've owned, and I never put any fx in there. I did however dime the send and return on the JSX, because it increased volume and thickened the amp up, made it sound better to my ears. I have a footswitchable loop right now (never hurts), I may use it some day.


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## GuyB

I don't use any effects up to now but maybe will (bit of modulation and delay). But I don't know wich of the two ways there is on my Traynor YCS 50 to plug my old rack mount Yamaha SP50 into it. The YCS has a parallel effects loop with a send control and return controls for each channel. And there is also the amp in and pre-amp out jacks that can be used as a loop-thru (serial ?) for effects. What are the advantages and disadvantages of both ways ? I will have to experiment but some prior advices would be welcome, like what's the difference between parallel and serial ?


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## lbrown1

I stuff evereything into the front - wah / od / dis first - trem / delay / flanger - straight to teh front of the amp

to be honest - I can't tell the diff in tone when I tried them in teh loop - so didn't see the point in all that extra wiring and tweaking

the YCS 50 has volume or level controls for the FX loop - which I suppose somebody might find useful.....just not me


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## mrmatt1972

I've only used fx loops with time based effects. Currently I have none, so the loop on my Trace Elliot is functioning as a boost (which it does well). The difference between series and parallel loops is another facet of the discussion. As I understand it, using a series loop is functionally no different from running effects into the input of the amp. From my manual:

Effects Loop
This has sockets for SEND and RETURN and levels for each as well as a switch for
SERIES or PARALLEL configurations.

Send, Level
The SEND socket is for connection to the input of effects units. By correctly adjusting the
LEVEL control, this can drive floor type battery powered effects pedals or 19” rack type
studio effects units.
The actual setting of the LEVEL control will depend on several things:- the output of the
guitar, the preamp settings and the level needed to drive the particular effects unit.
The general idea is to set the level as high as possible, (which improves signal/noise ratio)
without creating distortion.
As a guide, if floor type pedals are used the LEVEL will probably need to be set
somewhere between 8 o’clock and 12 o’clock, whereas if studio rack type devices are
used it can be set higher up so that the level indicators on the effects unit reach their
maximum point during peaks in the playing.
Series/Parallel
The SERIES/PARALLEL switch alters the configuration of the effects loop.
In SERIES mode the whole signal comes out of the amp, into the effects unit and then
back into the amp, whereas in PARALLEL mode the effected signal is mixed in with the
original dry signal, thus ensuring tonal purity of the dry signal.
The choice of which mode to use will depend on what kind of effects unit is used and
what overall effect is desired. But generally if time delay effects are used, such as delay
(echo), reverb, chorus, flanging, phasing etc., then the PARALLEL setting is usually
preferred. If volume or EQ related effects are used, such as overdrive/distortion,
compression, graphic equalisation, wah-wah or volume pedals, or if multi-effects unit is
used with a combination of time delay and volume related effects, then it is usually best
to set the switch ro SERIES. There are no rules, it is best to experiment and see what you
prefer.
If PARALLEL configuration is used then if possible it is recommended that the dry/direct
signal from the effects unit is turned to minimum or off.
Return, Level
The RETURN socket is for connection to the output of effects units. The function of the
LEVEL control will depend on whether the loop is set to SERIES or PARALLEL
configuration.
In PARALLEL operation the LEVEL control will set the amount of effect signal mixed in
with the straight, uneffected ‘dry’ signal when the effects loop is switched in, it has no
effect on the dry signal.
In SERIES operation the LEVEL control will the overall level of the total signal (sent from
the effects unit) when the effects loop is switched in.
Unless otherwise desired, it is best to set this so that when switching the effects loop on
or off there are no great leaps in volume difference.
12
Ultimately there are no rules as to how to use effects, it is all down to the players
personal preference and will also depend on what actual effects units are being used.
Indeed, although the effects loop is generally accepted as the best place to add effects,
both technically and sonically, a lot of guitarists still prefer to put at least some of their
effects before the amp, particularly, wah-wah or volume pedals, auto wahs/envelope
filters or compressors.
Therefore, the only right way of doing things is to experiment with all your equipment
and find what suits you best.
If two Speed Twins are used in a stereo set up where the SEND from one amplifier is sent
into the effects processor and the left and right outputs are fed back into the RETURN on
each amp, a jack plug of some kind will need to be inserted into the INPUT to un-mute
the amplifier. The ‘slave’ amp should also preferably be set to ‘SERIES’ with all the
controls on CHANNEL 1 and CHANNEL 2 turned down.
For more advice on this please contact TRACE ELLIOT UK Service Dept. or distributor in
your territory.


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## GuyB

Many thanks for those infos mrmatt1972.


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## w.luchka_17

I have one on my Traynor YVC20 and I can't really tell the difference between effects in or out of the loop, I would not miss it if I got a different amp.


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## zontar

Like so much else about playing guitar--check it out with & without and see what works.
I've tried the effects loop, but didn't like it.

I don't know too many guitarists who use it.

But since I don't gig, who knows if my opinion matters.


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## GuitarsCanada

Never expected to see the kind of results we are getting on the poll. Not many people using the effects loops. So the question is, why were they created in the first place and why are we not using them?


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## zontar

GuitarsCanada said:


> Never expected to see the kind of results we are getting on the poll. Not many people using the effects loops. So the question is, why were they created in the first place and why are we not using them?


Just another idea that never really panned out.
Guitar history is full of them.


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## mhammer

One of the purposes of an effects loop is for sending a preamp signal out to another amp.

I hasten to remind people that there are plenty of features on amps that a lot of folks don't use. Remember all those amps with 4 input jacks? Some people used them, but most did not. And those extension speaker cab jacks, and impedance changer features, etc. Just because people don't use them doesn't mean they are useless. Hell, lots of folks have probably never used a service outlet on their amp.


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## Robdssa

The only thing I find that really was beneficial going through an effects loop was a volume pedal. Unlike running it ahead of the preamp section, going through the effects loop does not rob your "tone". It's like a volume knob on the guitar, normally you lose tone when reducing the signal going to the preamp section, however, if you run the volume pedal through an effects loop, it kind of works like an attenuator allowing you to drive the amp without muddying up the frequency response.


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## Greg Ellis

It depends quite a lot on what you're trying to do, and in what setting.

If you're just jamming with friends, or working a venue where you need to run all the sound equipment on your own, then you're going to need to manage all of your volume changes (solo boost and whatnot) and time-based effects on your own.

If you're running a clean amp, this can be done relatively easily out front, with your guitar volume, or a volume pedal, or a clean boost, various pedals, or whatever. Likewise, as many have mentioned, your time-based effects will probably sound ok in front of a relatively clean amp. And the signal path is simpler, shorter, etc.

However, if you're running a dirty amp, then pushing more signal into the front of it for a solo boost is not likely to result in more volume, just more raunch. A clean boost in the effects loop (or a volume pedal, as Robdssa mentioned) is a good solution. Likewise, your delay and chorus and reverb are likely to sound better in the loop.

Of course, if you're playing bigger venues, with a soundman who knows your set and pays attention, he's going to be in a much better position to tweak your sound than you are. Volume kick to get up over the mix while soloing, time-based effects where they're needed, etc. Effectively, your entire rig becomes a pre-amp and personal monitor. The real sound processing is moved to the sound booth - mixer, effects, and mains.


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## Alien8

I definitely use my FX loop. They don't make amps voiced just the way I want one to be, so I use an FX loop and EQ combination to get "that sound" sent to the power amp. This gives me control over the frequencies that his the power amp tubes, giving a break-up that works for me.

My delay pedals also run in my FX loop.

You don't need one, but they are IMO the best tone shaping tools you can use.


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## gtrguy

I get by just fine without using an effects loop. In fact with my current selection of amps, I don't have a choice- none of them have an effects loop. All are old school, non channel switching Fenders and Marshalls. I've owned amps with effects loops and used them in the past but at this point in my tone journey, they just aren't necessary. I run my pedals in front of the various amps and generally set the amps clean or at the edge of breakup or if I'm using more than 1 amp, a combination of clean and slightly dirty. I'm totally happy with the sounds I have available and don't miss having an effects loop in the least.

For channel switching amps where you're going between a clean sound and a dirty sound on the amp itself rather than adding dirt via a pedal, having effects like delay and modulation in front of the amp becomes a lot more problematic. Delay/modulation settings that sounded great on the clean channel become completely wrong for dirt sounds. The way I see it, if you're using an amps channel switching capabilities you may need an effects loop if you're just using the amp as a tone platform and varying tones via pedals and not by changing channels an effects loop is probably unnecessary. 

My 2 cents


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## ne1roc

I'm surprised how few people use the loop. I can live without one but I prefer the reverb and delay trails thru the loop. The differences I hear going in front or in the loop are quite noticeable to me.


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## prodigal_son

I have tried using my effects loop but it does not react fairly to most effects, especially digital. It only makes sense to put everything before the amp. I have trued using my time based stuff in the effects loop and it never sounds the way I need it to. I have yet to find a pedal that actually instructs you to use it specifically in the effects loop.

On the other hand, I do use a GCX looper. Absolutely essential tool.


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## jimsz

nkjanssen said:


> If I had 10' running from guitar to board, 25' running board to amp, 25' running back to a delay pedal, 25' running back to the amp, that's 85' of unbalanced cable between my guitar and the amp's power amp section. That seems like a lot. Maybe it's not a big deal. I've never tried it. But it seems like a lot.





mrmatt1972 said:


> Ultimately there are no rules as to how to use effects, it is all down to the players
> personal preference and will also depend on what actual effects units are being used.
> 
> Therefore, the only right way of doing things is to experiment with all your equipment
> and find what suits you best.


I have an Effects Loop on my Delta Blues Amp but not on my SuperReverb clone. I haven't tried experimenting yet but it would seem logical that adding all that extra unbalanced cable into the mix would add signal loss and some extra noise compared with running it in front.

Here's what Don Mackrill from Mack amps says: 

"Why have an effects loop in an amp? Why not plug effects into the input like most guitarists? There are a couple of reasons.

First, it is often advantageous to have some effects like reverb, delay, chorus, flanging and phasing, work their magic on your guitar tone after it has gone through distortion pedals and the like (that reside between your guitar and your amp’s input) AND your amp’s preamp. This is particularly true if your amp creates preamp distortion. At that point in your amp’s signal chain your gear has worked much of its mojo on your tone and it is often the best time to slam it with a time-based effect like those mentioned above. This is, of course, a subjective decision. Some guitarists prefer putting time-based effects in the same chain as their other pedals between their guitar and amp.

Second, the FX loop’s signal is better suited for rack mount type equipment that likes to see “line level” signals instead of the “instrument level” signals that exist between guitar and amp. We won’t dive into the technical definition of line and instrument level signals other than to point out that they are different and some ‘fancier’ gear likes it better when it’s driven by a line level output. This does NOT mean that you cannot put good old stomp box pedals in an FX loop. If your loop has a line/instrument switch or a Send Level control, you should be just fine. Even if it doesn’t and you want to use a stomp box in a loop – go for it! It may be that the signal levels in the loop won’t be matched perfectly, but you won’t hurt anything – depending on what’s in the loop you may hear more ‘noise’ (hiss), but that again is a subjective decision: is it good enough or not? Remember, this is a guitar amp we’re talking about, not a hi-fi amp!"


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## prodigal_son

Line level vs. Instrument level. Exactly!! Here is a good article:

Effects Loop Truths, by Kevin O'Connor


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## Cort Strummer

I was bored and havent even touch my guitar\amp in over a week, so I decided to hook up my effects loop. I noticed a fairly big difference in tone, and better OD from just the tubes. All the pedals work just fine in the loop, the OD and Distortion pedals you need to adjust the levels to balance the volumes, but that is not a big deal.

I would recommend trying it out, you might be surprised.


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## Stevo

I think it comes down to if you are using your amp's OD or not. (at least it does for me)

If I am overdriving the preamp on my amp, I definitely use my FX loop. For me, running a delay into a dirty amp and hearing dirty repeats is hard to enjoy.
If I am running my OD with a pedal and keeping the amp clean, I prefer to not use an FX loop and keep the delay out front after the OD's as it takes out the unnecessary circuitry of the loop.


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## Cort Strummer

I have revised my setup. I have my DD3, Phase 100, and Wylde Wah going into the effects loop. Then I have my OCD and ML-2 going into the front of the amp, I have everything passing through my NS-2 in the X setup. Everything works and sounds great.


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## ezcomes

i don't use anything that requires it...i have a flanger and a chorus...but that both runs in front of the amp...i have no use for other things at this time...my head has a loop...my combo doesn't...i'm not worried


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## Zman

I basically always had Fender amps like the Super reverb, Deluxe Reverb, Blues Junior, and Vibrolux reverb. In the last couple of years I picked up 3 Marshall amps. The DSL401, DSL100 and Lead 100 Mosfet. I had never used an effects loop. I found that the delay pedals sounded rather hollow and weak through the front end. I put my DD20 through the effects loop and it works much better. I have yet to try any others but I think it is a usefull tool and highly under used. I think a lot of it comes from people just not understanding the best ways to use it.


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## david henman

...this pretty much sums it up, for me.



Stevo said:


> I think it comes down to if you are using your amp's OD or not. (at least it does for me)
> 
> If I am overdriving the preamp on my amp, I definitely use my FX loop. For me, running a delay into a dirty amp and hearing dirty repeats is hard to enjoy.
> If I am running my OD with a pedal and keeping the amp clean, I prefer to not use an FX loop and keep the delay out front after the OD's as it takes out the unnecessary circuitry of the loop.


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## KoskineN

I got 2 different amps, and I use the fx loop on my Mesa, but not on my Maz 18. The Maz has a FX Loop but I don't use it since I run the amp quite clean.
My Mesa has the option to turn on and off the loop on each channel, so it's very usefull.


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## Greenbacker

I typically prefer straight up, single channel amps which typically don't have effects loops and I run them through an attenuator. I love a bit of delay at times (and a LOT of delay at others) but I'm beginning to think that an effects loop would be a good idea. Y'see, as my delayed notes trail off through my overdriven amp, they progressively get cleaner and cleaner since they aren't hitting the preamp as hard, when I really want the (analog) delay to be doing the opposite. I love when the repeats fade off into a swirly, murky mess and it's harder to achieve this just through the front end.


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## Milkman

I sure hope you don't NEED one because the amp I just bought doesn't have one.

Having said that, if I have one, I do use it. Effects like chorus, delay, phase, flange and reverb work well in a loop.


You can live without one of course.


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## Morkolo

I said no, but after you have an amp with that option you realize how valuable it is. Not that it would be a deal breaker though.


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## torndownunit

Morkolo said:


> I said no, but after you have an amp with that option you realize how valuable it is. Not that it would be a deal breaker though.


Ya that sums it up for me too. I would pass up on an amp I really like the sound of due to a lack of an effects loop. They are nice to have though.


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## Rahlstin

I always use my FX loop on my DSL100. I split my pedal board with some effects into the amp FX loop and some into the front via a small patch bay I made for the pedal board.

If I use an amp with no loop like my little Darkhorse (spare amp for just in case) I can put a jumper in my patch bay and then everything is now in line and I can run it all into the front end of the amp. So depending on the situation I can config my board either way with one 3" jumper.

Front End: Guitar > Crybaby > EB Vol > DigiT Bad Monkey > Amp Input. (Bad monkey I use for 70's tone as I run the clean channel of the amp farily clean, for all other more modern rock tones I use the dirty channel with no help from a pedal for the rythem tone, preamp only).

In the FX Loop: FX send fr amp > MXR micro amp Boost #1 > MXR micro amp boost #2 > Boss CE5 chorus > Boss DD3 Delay > Boss RV5 Reverb > FX return amp. 

I use MXR micro amps for clean boost of the power section only, it takes the tone I already have from the preamp and dosnt add anything (more or lessish) to it unlike pushing the front end and often running out of preamp headroom, I dont need more gain, just more loud. I use two as I have a high and not so high boost requirement depending on clean runs, rock runs, or the BadMonkey going in the front end which dosnt need as high a clean boost. 

For main stage amp I would never buy one that didnt have an effects loop. 

For my spare amp which I use for other projects where an fx loop isnt an issue its no big deal. But, if Traynor had an option for a darkhorse with an FX loop and one without, I would have spent the extra to get a loop over the plain jane version.


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## GuitarsCanada

So is the definitive answer yes, if I have one and no if I don't? How effective are they?


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## Rahlstin

The difinitive answer is it depends entirely on you, what you want to do, how you want to do it. You can ask 100 players and youll get 120 opinions. If you get an amp with one, then you can at least try it out, if you dont, well, youll never know.


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## david henman

...for me, the definitive question is this: how do guys who use delay straight into an overdriven tube amp manage _without_ an fx loop?

certainly, if you are using only the clean channel of your amp, and placing your delay pedal after your o/d pedals, an fx loop is not neccessary.

but if you are getting your overdrive/distortion from the amp itself, and running a delay pedal in front, it seems to me that an fx loop is absolutely essential, no?


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## Guest

david henman said:


> ...for me, the definitive question is this: how do guys who use delay straight into an overdriven tube amp manage _without_ an fx loop?
> 
> certainly, if you are using only the clean channel of your amp, and placing your delay pedal after your o/d pedals, an fx loop is not neccessary.
> 
> but if you are getting your overdrive/distortion from the amp itself, and running a delay pedal in front, it seems to me that an fx loop is absolutely essential, no?


I guess it depends. Some people are a-okay with the fact that the decaying repeats on the delayed signal will just be less overdriven than the original signal. It can actually sound pretty nice.


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## david henman

iaresee said:


> I guess it depends. Some people are a-okay with the fact that the decaying repeats on the delayed signal will just be less overdriven than the original signal. It can actually sound pretty nice.


...this is probably not much of an issue if you don't use anything more than mild overdrive. 

but i have heard a clean/clear delay signal get distorted after the fact, and it sounds pretty ugly to me.

and for folks like me who occasionally use a fair amount of gain, the ugliness would increase exponentially.

delaying a distorted signal makes perfect sense.

distorting a delayed signal? not so much.


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## stevonf

*Effects loops yes or no?*

Hey guys, 
I am new to this site and forum. Cheers. 

I have recently purchased a Traynor Custom Special 100H head and matching cabinet. I have been doing much research into the effects loop lately. As my new amp has it i was curious. I got curious because my pedal board (8 pedals) was always running straight into my amps with no loop usage. Once i started weeding out my OD and Tubescreamer pedals and using the actual amp distortion (the traynor has 3 channels) i noticed i was getting a brutal humming sound from my delay pedals even when they were not engaged. This was only happening on my 2 OD channels and couldnt be heard on the clean. 

So after much research ( i am no expert), and personal experience and experimentation, here is what i am finding. 

1) The effects loop is essential for time based pedals ( i run all my delays, chorus, tremolo, etc... through the loop and the "humming" disappeared totally.... also the "cleanliness" of the delays seemed to be crisper even on overdrive channels)
to me this is a must! Even if you are using pedals for your distortion/OD.

2) If you are using amp distortion rather than pedals then you should pretty much use your effects loop in parallel. I am noticing a big difference in sound now. 

3) If you just use a distortion pedal straight into a "clean" amp... such as when i was using my tubescreamer in my clean fender blues jr... you can get away without a loop. 

Summary: Effects loops are almost essential if you use delays or time based pedals... they get added onto a clean signal not a distorted signal (i think).
If you are using amp distortion... effects loop is a must for cleaner sound and pedal sounds. If you use a delay pedal you will hear the humming at whatever speed your pedal is set at if you dont use the loop.
If you are using a "clean amp" and using pedals to make distortion you can get away without one. (although your time based pedals wont sound quite as good but still ok)

Again ... no expert but this is what my research/experience tells me. I beg to be corrected because i am trying to learn it as well.


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## keefsdad

nkjanssen said:


> In 25 years of playing, I've never used an effects loop. Not even once. I generally run a couple of overdrives and a little bit of delay in front of the amp. I drive the amp for just a little bit of grit (which I consider my "clean" tone). Then I use the overdrive pedals to get a harder rhythm tone and a lead tone. I've never felt that my tone has suffered fron running the delay in front of the amp rather than in an effects loop. Playing live, I generally need a 25' cable from pedalboard to amp. If I had 10' running from guitar to board, 25' running board to amp, 25' running back to a delay pedal, 25' running back to the amp, that's 85' of unbalanced cable between my guitar and the amp's power amp section. That seems like a lot. Maybe it's not a big deal. I've never tried it. But it seems like a lot.


Exactly. My amp has one, I confess I've never even tried it. Even if it sounded slightly better I don't think I would want to deal with two more cables on stage, and all the potential failures that that could entail. I like things pretty simple on stage. For the first 15 years it was cord into amp. Now I usually use 4-5 effects.


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## hardasmum

stevonf said:


> i noticed i was getting a brutal humming sound from my delay pedals even when they were not engaged.


1. How are you powering your pedals? Are they sharing a wall wart?

2. Are your delay pedals true bypass?

From my experience humming/effect bleed can be caused by these two issues.


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## Spikezone

Funny this thread should come up. I JUST started using the FX loop on my YCV50. I was having some issues with some disturbing ambient sounds, and breaking up the pedals seemed to be the solution. I have noticed an improvement in the sound of my delay/chorus/flanger pedals through the loop, and I also think that the amp overdrive and my Daddy-O sound better straight into the front end without the other effects in line. I had to get a few more cords and make a sort-of-a snake, but I think it was worth the expense and effort.
-Mikey


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## ACCABUTS

If you are using your amps dirt then an effects loop is a must IMO. Running a delay before the amp and using the amp dirt just sounds like soup!! When I finally updated to an amp with a loop and a great drive section I was blown away how good my delays were sounding!!


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## mrfiftyfour

I always experience tone loss whenever I use the loop in any amp I've ever owned that had one.
I'm going through it right now with my Traynor CS90 212. I just brought home a tc electronics Nova Modulator, with the idea of running it in the loop. Whether I'm getting dirt from the preamp or pedals, I lose all mids as soon as the pedal (or any pedal) is plugged in. When switched on, the effects sound very digital.
When plugged into the front of the amp, tone is much better and the effects are warmer. The Nova sounds as good as I hoped in front.
This baffles me because the Nova should sound great in the loop.
Does this mean the amp has a crappy loop, or does the Nova suck? Or maybe it's operator error...


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## bluzfish

Pedals are designed to run in front of the amp and that is where they perform at their optimum. They are EQed for a guitar signal that will be input into an amp's preamp. The FX loop is meant for rack mount studio/FOH type effects which are designed to be transparent to the input in the signal path. Long cables in the loop to and from pedals will also weaken and otherwise affect the overall signal into the power section of the amp.


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## corailz

hardasmum said:


> 1. How are you powering your pedals? Are they sharing a wall wart?
> 
> 2. Are your delay pedals true bypass?
> 
> From my experience humming/effect bleed can be caused by these two issues.


3. It can be a bad ground on a patch cable too?


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