# Pinched nerve in neck



## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

So, apparently I am a physically active and aggressive sleeper. I woke up the other day with a pinched nerve that has now been diagnosed as a suspected left side C6 radiculopathy.

So, weakness, pain, numb/tingling fingers. I can't do much at work, can't play guitar, can't find a pain free position to sit, stand or lie down.

Who has experience, what do my next 2 weeks/months/years look like? Are there really folks in this much chronic pain? If a kidney stone is 10/10 level pain, this is cruising along at a level 5 or 6, with frequent jumps up to 8. 

Thanks in advance for any and all input.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I was recommended physio.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

player99 said:


> I was recommended physio.


Did it help? How long until pain free?


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Paul M said:


> Did it help? How long until pain free?


I never did it. I only got diagnosed a month ago. I don't have much pain, only some numbness. I waited almost a year for a nerve scan that showed the nerves weren't damaged or dying. This can potentially rule out ALS or MS type of issues. They don't recommend surgery as the risks are common end results.

I do need to try the physio... 

Are you a side sleeper? What is the hardness of your mattress? Hard mattresses aren't recommended for side sleepers.


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## jayoldschool (Sep 12, 2013)

I've dealt with this a few times. Along with three herniated discs in my lower back (and that is much less fun). For immediate relief, go to a local home health supply place. Like Shoppers etc. The kind of place that supplies walkers, canes, special toilet seats, etc. You want an inflatable cervical collar. It has velcro in the front, a valve, and a pump. It pushes down on your collar bones, and pushes your head up. Takes the pressure off your discs. And works immediately. You look stupid, and it's not super comfy, but it will alleviate your pain and discomfort from the pinch right away. Put it on, watch TV for awhile, then take the pressure off. Keep doing it, reducing time and frequency as your pain/kink subside. I've used everything from Tylenol to morphine for back issues, and buying this thing was money well spent.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

acupuncture and chiro massage


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Talk to your doctor. They might send you to a neuro and there might be a pain clinic in your future. Physio could make it worse; a lot of them are just tail twisters looking for a fast buck.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

Wardo said:


> Talk to your doctor. They might send you to a neuro and there might be a pain clinic in your future. Physio could make it worse; a lot of them are just tail twisters looking for a fast buck.


Damn tail twisters.....


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## Twisted Metal (Oct 12, 2011)

I did physio...twice. The second place had a traction machine and that was the ticket for me ....


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

HighNoon said:


> Damn tail twisters.....


That's what my mother used to call them; she was an RN / VON.. lol


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

It's not an impact injury (unless those were steel pillows), so you should be able to deal with it. I would find/hunt down a healer with real good hands....massage therapist/reflexologist type, who have a handle on TCM.....a real good physio person with experience in multiple techniques. Look for someone who deals with patients who've had trauma from injuries or are in a painful post surgical state.


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## 1979 930 (Oct 13, 2019)

Had this type of pain for years until i saw a chiro. Do your research however. They are not all good. Now, when lighter episodes come, i do hot-cold therapy with a magic bag and ice. Works for me. Hope you get well soon. 

Cheers


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

Wardo said:


> That's what my mother used to call them; she was an RN / VON.. lol


I was addicted to the back crackers....the lady who ran into the back of my '71 Dodge Polara, knocked the front seat right off it's rails. The results were fugly. Crack crack crack....grab that tail and give 'er a twist. Mom knew her 'chit.


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## Thunderboy1975 (Sep 12, 2013)

Sounds like wry neck. It goes away in a week.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

All the best for a full recovery as quickly as reasonably possible.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

greco said:


> I was a tail twister for 30 years.


 All Hail Greco....Tail Twister Supreme. Funny story. I had herniated L5 ...think carrying a Michigan Spartan 265lb. football player on your shoulders, and then him slipping sideways and crashing, taking me with him in a disorganized pile on the concrete....seemed like a fun idea at the time....I blame the demon drink. Laid around the pad in Detroit for a couple weeks. Started each day crawling to the bathroom in gloriously abysmal pain....pull yourself up, drain the vein, then crawl back to bed, and down your first percodan of the day (sometimes with a wine chaser). If I needed to go someone, the lads would come get me, carry me downstairs and put me in the back of the van. Go take care of business than back to the shack, crawl up the stairs to the landing, crawl left and you're back in the rack.
Figured I got to do something about it, so the guys carried me over to see a neurosurgeon in Royal Oak. Told me what he figured it was, but said to be sure exactly they would have to inject the ol' blue dye into the spine (CT myelogram) and see what shows up on the pretty pictures. Okay....And that would be how much....$1500. Alrighty than, thanks for your time and I'll see what I can do.
Alright boys, back to the van. It's good to have friends to carry you around and another perc. Next stop, a chiropractor in Harper Woods I had frequented before. They plopped me down on his table....he listened to the particulars, and started gently poking around...he took my hand and said feel this....really , what the....yup that's the area on fire.
So he worked on me for awhile, basically trying to get some range of motion in the area, that would relieve the pressure on the sucker. After a short time, he was, No, I can't adjust you, it's way too dangerous. You've got to get the inflammation down first and relax the whole quadrant (which of course was a tangled mess).
As the guys were carrying me out, he said maybe you could go over and see this Chinese doctor in Windsor. I've heard really good things about him. So, called and made an appointment to go see Dr. Cheung in a couple days. The day arrives and off in the van we go. The Ambassador bridge border was fun....heck, any border is fun, as there's always friendly folk to inquire where you are going, how long you expect to stay, and is there anything in the van in the back you wouldn't want to be found ....except for your injured buddy, groaning away. I love borders. So we get to the Doc's place.....not a fancy place...converted old store front....no desk.....no receptionist, clean enough though. Teenage male comes out from the back, glasses, black leather jacket, jeans, and says follow me. Go into the treatment room and layed down on your basic examining table. Old man comes in the room. I found out later that Dr. Cheung had been in a Chinese prison for over 15 years (he had been dabbling a little too much into the opium), and that's where he took up the study of medicine, specifically Traditional Chines medicine.
So he examines me, and says something in Chinese to the kid. What did he say, I asked. Grandfather says you're really fucked up. Alright, I knew I was at the right place. So he gets out the moxibustion and starts putting the heat therapy to the area....Man I love the smell of burning herbs....after that it was the suction balls with the moxi smoke in them before they get sucked down into the skin. When he pulls them off, the area is dark, really dark. Cheung spoke in English....Black Stasis....no good....bad Qi. And who would want Black Stasis ....not me. Then he started working on me with his hands. For an old guy, he was strong. He used all parts of his hands, and then of course my favorite, the elbow. Yeah baby, get that nasty shit out of there. Worked on me for over an hour, then gave me some herbs to take home and cook up. You know those nasty Chinese combos that make your house smell like.....well, like Chinese medicine. Luckily I love the smell of Chinese medicine. It's so .....Earthy!! Total bill $35 (thirty years ago now).
An important component of TCM is healing from the inside out. And that's what we did every couple days over the next two weeks. He kept reefing on me and I kept cooking up that nasty stuff and drinking it.....some really gnarly stuff came out of me; brownish urine and streaks of dark blood when I was able to squeeze out a bowel movement. But hey, Houston we have do have movement, be glad for that. And then that last day with the Doc, he was tweaking my leg a little bit and all of a sudden I could feel some warmth in my back, not fire, just some simple warmth. I laughed....Cheung looked at me and said, Qi flow again. Go see chiropractor now. By now I could walk a few steps on my own and started leaving. Looking back at the old healer guy (I could see all the prisoners he had a chance to work on to learn his trade....and you always need help in prison), and I thought, wow, the people you meet on the road of life and what a kick it all is.
Went directly over to my chiro ....Got in on the table, he drew the leg up and over, put one hand on the shoulder, the other on the hip, and bingo boom, click, that sucker went back in, with a beautiful persuasive thud. Now, that was cool. I walked out on my own steam to the ride, slowly, carefully, one slow crab like step at a time....but I'm walking again. Life is good.
You buy the ticket.....you take the ride.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Wow, I'm sorry but I have no experience or advice to offer. I've slept funny a few times and ended up with a sore neck for a day or two, but nothing that ever hung around or caused me to miss work.

Sure hope it passes quickly.

I'd say it's no fun getting old, but it sure beats the alternative.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

You need to adjust your truss rod.


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## marcos (Jan 13, 2009)

Physio is your first step. Finding a good one well thats another issue. Dont despair.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Thanks for the feedback, folks..... there is an obvious clear consensus, NOT!

For me......

Step one is to knock down inflammation, I'm starting with Low Intensity Laser Therapy. It has mixed reviews, the science is unclear, but it worked for my wife for plantar fasciitis. Benefits cover most of it, and what isn't covered is a tax deductible.

Step 2 is a physio to regain range of motion, and to provide exercises to maintain mechanical health. Between guitar and cycling I have two time committed hobbies that put me in less than ideal physical positions.

I've got appointments set up for both.

Mostly I just want to know...... is there an end to this? Two days ago I was looking up Medical Assistance In Dying

P.S. It took me embarrasingly too long to figure out TCM isn't Turner Classic Movies. How are Cary Grant movies going to help?


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

Not in my neck, but I pinched my femoral nerve July 28th 2018. I was bed ridden for 2 months. Like, I asked my wife to smother me with a pillow. And off work for a total of 4 months. I thank God she is a nurse, cause no one outside of a nurse or PSW should have had to do for me what the woman did. I will spare details beyond what I've already shared... 
I had nerve blocks, spinal nerve injections, traction, acupuncture, physio, facial manipulation (if you think that one sounds painful, it is). It is pinched _somewhere_, but no one can agree on where. The back guy says my hip, the hip guy says my back, so I will never, ever be "fixed". I've learned to live with it. Let's be clear, when I was bed ridden, I was at 2% functionality, I am at about 80% now. I will never golf again. Skating, riding a road bike, working out (weights) run/jog, or anything else that could twist or jar me. I will NEVER go through that again. 

There are a ton of possible treatments, and most should work to get you healthy again. I will say that you will need to champion yourself with the medical specialists.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

Physio. I have issues with my C6 and C7. A few years ago I can't even sit still for 5 minutes. I tried all sorts of things including accupuncture. My physiotherapist then started doing dry needling. And that fixed me up. That was for the right side now I'm starting to have issues with the left. I'm going to see her soon and do it all over again. Check out Dry Needling, it worked for me.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)




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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Milkman said:


>


You got me!


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)




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## Business (Jul 30, 2013)

Walk it off


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## jayoldschool (Sep 12, 2013)

SWLABR said:


> I had nerve blocks, spinal nerve injections, traction, acupuncture, physio, facial manipulation (if you think that one sounds painful, it is). It is pinched _somewhere_, but no one can agree on where. The back guy says my hip, the hip guy says my back, so I will never, ever be "fixed"


Did you have an MRI? You definitely should have. I would almost certainly say you have a herniated disc.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

jayoldschool said:


> Did you have an MRI? You definitely should have. I would almost certainly say you have a herniated disc.


I’ve had plenty of MRI’s. The one immediately after the accident showed bulging/herniated discs. But the one after the traction and physio showed “enough receding” to suggest it was not the culprit. Hence the back guy saying it was in my hip joint. No MRI could convince the hip guy it was his area of expertise. Both did agree the scarring wasn’t enough to go “digging around” and that they would “create more than they’d fix”.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

SWLABR said:


> I’ve had plenty of MRI’s. The one immediately after the accident showed bulging/herniated discs. But the one after the traction and physio showed “enough receding” to suggest it was not the culprit. Hence the back guy saying it was in my hip joint. No MRI could convince the hip guy it was his area of expertise. Both did agree the scarring wasn’t enough to go “digging around” and that they would “create more than they’d fix”.


Differential diagnosis can be very difficult and complicated. Orthopaedic and neurological symptoms/presentations can often be interrelated/coexisting.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Chronic pain I know all about. I still get 10/10 migraines at least 15 days a month. They’re incredibly painful. I also have gastritis. I got a migraine and stomach attack on Tuesday together and I wanted to jump off a bridge and just end this misery. I have had migraines for about 20 years and as I get older they get worse. I spoke to my doctor today and I am now on another medication. He thinks that possibly my stomach issues could be tied in with my migraines. Just 1 day of being pain free is like winning the lottery for me.


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## Midnight Rider (Apr 2, 2015)

I know it all too well. Had a workplace accident involving the cervical and lumbar spine. Damage to the C4-5 and C5-6 levels. Went for acupuncture, physio and every other possible therapy for near 8 months but nothing worked to completely manage the pain, headaches, numbness, etc.. It wasn't until I had an MRI shortly after the 8 months of therapy that the orthopaedic surgeon identified two badly herniated discs at the aforementioned cervical levels.

A few months later I was having surgery to remove the two discs with a chunk of bone taken from my right hip which was used used to slip between the two cervical vertebrae for fusion,... then a metal plated inserted to span the area held with six screws fastened to the vertebrae. I'll be getting the same procedure done at the lumbar level.

My advice would be not to wait too long before talking to your doctor about having an MRI done. Normal X-Rays will not identify what the actual issue may be,... as what had occurred in my situation. By no means am I suggesting you may need a surgical a procedure but it is extremely important you know what the discs and vertebrae alignment and condition look like in great detail. Even a small herniated discs can cause serious discomfort in some people. Degenerative Disc Disease can occur even without having had an accident injury.

For several years now I have been using and inversion table and hang upside down for 20-30 minutes 3 to 4 times per week to stretch the spine and allow rehydration of the discs.I have noticed a significant improvement in controlling the pain associated with spine injury.

I also had a bout with kidney stones to the point of surgery and I can tell you that in my case the pain was *many * levels higher than when I had neck pain and neck surgery,... that is not to say that what you currently are experiencing is not a pain in the neck.

Also, if you look into getting an MRI don't ask,... tell them you want one if they give you an excuse as to why it is not granted,... you paid up front for it years ago.

Here's some of my MRI and X-Ray imaging that will clearly show the significance of getting an MRI. The detail is night and day.


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## Midnight Rider (Apr 2, 2015)

Other stuff to know about the spine.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Midnight Rider said:


> Other stuff to know about the spine.
> View attachment 398926
> 
> View attachment 398923
> ...


I feel like I know you inside and out now.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

Screw-type fasteners in an x-ray sends shivers down my back.


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Midnight Rider said:


> Here's some of my MRI and X-Ray imaging that will clearly show the significance of getting an MRI. The detail is night and day.
> View attachment 398919
> View attachment 398920
> View attachment 398921
> ...


Wow, that's some heavy duty work! I hope you've improved. 



greco said:


> Differential diagnosis can be very difficult and complicated. Orthopaedic and neurological symptoms/presentations can often be interrelated/coexisting.


I couldn't agree more. My foot pain and foot drop disappeared after I had a VP shunt for hydrocephalus installed. No one made the connection, least of all me.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

If you have a situation where you need surgery, you get it, heal and then you can live again. With me I never know when I will get a migraine or gastric attack. That makes me constantly worry with great anxiety. Chronic pain is extremely difficult to live with. I hate it with a passion. I don’t even know what it’s like to feel “normal” anymore.

I have been on the BRAT diet since last Sunday and thought I would have an Oatmeal cookie for a change of pace. I had 2 and paid the price this morning. This just sucks.

I never get miserable with the pain I just cry. I don’t know how else to deal with it.

I can really appreciate what my husband has been going through with his feet and the pain he has been constantly experiencing.

The only good thing to come out of this is it has made us closer and more compassionate towards each other. We understand what each other is going through.


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## Midnight Rider (Apr 2, 2015)

HighNoon said:


> All Hail Greco....Tail Twister Supreme. Funny story. I had herniated L5 ...think carrying a Michigan Spartan 265lb. football player on your shoulders, and then him slipping sideways and crashing, taking me with him in a disorganized pile on the concrete....seemed like a fun idea at the time....I blame the demon drink. Laid around the pad in Detroit for a couple weeks. Started each day crawling to the bathroom in gloriously abysmal pain....pull yourself up, drain the vein, then crawl back to bed, and down your first percodan of the day (sometimes with a wine chaser). If I needed to go someone, the lads would come get me, carry me downstairs and put me in the back of the van. Go take care of business than back to the shack, crawl up the stairs to the landing, crawl left and you're back in the rack.
> Figured I got to do something about it, so the guys carried me over to see a neurosurgeon in Royal Oak. Told me what he figured it was, but said to be sure exactly they would have to inject the ol' blue dye into the spine (CT myelogram) and see what shows up on the pretty pictures. Okay....And that would be how much....$1500. Alrighty than, thanks for your time and I'll see what I can do.
> Alright boys, back to the van. It's good to have friends to carry you around and another perc. Next stop, a chiropractor in Harper Woods I had frequented before. They plopped me down on his table....he listened to the particulars, and started gently poking around...he took my hand and said feel this....really , what the....yup that's the area on fire.
> So he worked on me for awhile, basically trying to get some range of motion in the area, that would relieve the pressure on the sucker. After a short time, he was, No, I can't adjust you, it's way too dangerous. You've got to get the inflammation down first and relax the whole quadrant (which of course was a tangled mess).
> ...


Now that's interesting writing,...I could vividly picture every scene! Used to walk the streets of Windsor and Detroit during my mid-teens to early twenties. I hear you on the Ambassador bridge crossings,... the boys and I were pulled over on more than one occasion. Actually pissed over the railing of the Ambassador into the Detroit River one summer night while caught in a traffic jam when returning to Windsor from a concert at Pine Knob Music Theatre. Five of us were on our bikes and lined up shoulder to shoulder for a fountain show extraordinaire, lol.

Anyways, good to hear your trips to see Dr. Cheung paid off and was successful getting you on your feet again. No-one could ever imagine the debilitating effects of chronic back/neck pain unless they have lived it ,...period.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

Midnight Rider said:


> Now that's interesting writing,...I could vividly picture every scene! Used to walk the streets of Windsor and Detroit during my mid-teens to early twenties. I hear you on the Ambassador bridge crossings,... the boys and I were pulled over on more than one occasion. Actually pissed over the railing of the Ambassador into the Detroit River one summer night while caught in a traffic jam when returning to Windsor from a concert at Pine Knob Music Theatre. Five of us were on our bikes and lined up shoulder to shoulder for a fountain show extraordinaire, lol.
> 
> Anyways, good to hear your trips to see Dr. Cheung paid off and was successful getting you on your feet again. No-one could ever imagine the debilitating effects of chronic back/neck pain unless they have lived it ,...period.


The Knob was a great place for a show. And getting stuck on the bridge was a lot more entertaining, than getting locked down in the tunnel, especially when the oxygen was running thin.


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## Midnight Rider (Apr 2, 2015)

Lola said:


> If you have a situation where you need surgery, you get it, heal and then you can live again. With me I never know when I will get a migraine or gastric attack. That makes me constantly worry with great anxiety. Chronic pain is extremely difficult to live with. I hate it with a passion. I don’t even know what it’s like to feel “normal” anymore.


Have you looked into seeing a Naturopathic ND Doctor or ND/MD Doctor? I started seeing an ND about 15 years ago for an alternative approach for some health issues and found the results extremely positive. 

One herb I have taken for stomach discomfort in the past was Slippery Elm. It has also been used by people with gastritis with very good results and when combined with Marshmallow herb the results can be even better. An ND can give you the dose required. Slippery Elm also works great for a sore throat. In the past I would strip some of the inner bark of an Elm tree down to the mucilaginous to chew on which soothes the throat , stomach and intestines.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Midnight Rider said:


> Have you looked into seeing a Naturopathic ND Doctor or ND/MD Doctor? I started seeing an ND about 15 years ago for an alternative approach for some health issues and found the results extremely positive.
> 
> One herb I have taken for stomach discomfort in the past was Slippery Elm. It has also been used by people with gastritis with very good results and when combined with Marshmallow herb the results can be even better. An ND can give you the dose required. Slippery Elm also works great for a sore throat. In the past I would strip some of the inner bark of an Elm tree down to the mucilaginous to chew on which soothes the throat , stomach and intestines.


Actually someone suggested this to me. I will wait and see. I have a new medication to try. I really truly hope this works. I’am starting to feel like garbage on a daily basis. I really can’t deal with this effing pain anymore.


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## Business (Jul 30, 2013)

Best solution when you have a health issue: go ask for medical advice on as many internet forums as you can


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Business said:


> Best solution when you have a health issue: go ask for medical advice on as many internet forums as you can



LOL..... Point well taken. I was hoping to hear about other folks experiences. Is this with me for 2 weeks, 2 months, 2 years? 

I'm better today, in that I'm not crying myself to sleep.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Paul M said:


> LOL..... Point well taken. I was hoping to hear about other folks experiences. Is this with me for 2 weeks, 2 months, 2 years?
> 
> I'm better today, in that I'm not crying myself to sleep.


I have taken to doing reflexology points on my feet for my stomach issues and it seems to be working. Right below the big toe on both feet is to be massaged for 2 minutes and then switched to the other foot. I felt relief. I am going to keep doing this.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

HighNoon said:


> The Knob was a great place for a show. And getting stuck on the bridge was a lot more entertaining, than getting locked down in the tunnel, especially when the oxygen was running thin.


Wasn’t that place a strip joint too back in it’s hey day?


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

@SWLABR my heart goes out to you! I can empathize with your pain. If you need someone to talk to you know I am always here for you!! And....I mean it!!


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## Business (Jul 30, 2013)

Lola said:


> reflexology


Quackery


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Business said:


> Quackery


I was desperate I thought I would give it a try and atm it seemed to work. Obviously it was psychological. Thx for confirming my suspicions!


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## patski (Feb 7, 2018)

I had sudden severe nerve pain coming from my neck a few years ago. It was excruciating and went all down my arm to my fingers. Pinched nerve from two herniated discs took about 8 weeks of physio, 2-3x a week. Physio was PAINFUL and it can be tricky to find a good one that actually helps instead of hooking you up to a machine. My physio is at a sports clinic in Mississauga. 

It's awful pain and truly debilitating. I hope you find relief soon!


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

I'm at the end of 2 weeks of this..... it's improved, but not back to normal. I haven't had any imaging yet, but the most likely root cause is a herniated disc. 

I have been for 5 Bioflex Laser treatments so far. It seems a bit "woo", but a couple of people I trust swear by it. I have benefit coverage, so it's not costing me much, and I can't see any way it could make me worse. I've not agreed to spinal "adjustments". I know someone who last December left her chiro unconscious in an ambulance after an "adjustment."

I have had one physio appt., will be doing this once/week for the time being. The physio came to me at work. My boss clearly enjoyed watching the torture.

I signed up for the 100 km Paris to Ancaster bicycle race on April 24th, and my hope is to be gently cycling by the end of next week. It took me 55 years to create this mess of a spine, it'll take some time to fix it.

I learned that I can can tylenol and advil concurrently to double up on pain meds. I have started adding very low THC oils to my usual CBD oil during the day. I don't want to feel any stoned sensation, but my pain level is now at 2 or 3 out of 10, with spikes to 5 ir 6, instead of the 7 or 8, with spikes to kidney stone levels.

I still don't know the actual thing I did to trigger this. As a friend said: we're at the age where we wake up with things we didn't go to bed with. I'm more confident of recovery today, last week I was looking up Medical Assistance in Dying.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Paul M said:


> I'm at the end of 2 weeks of this..... it's improved, but not back to normal. I haven't had any imaging yet, but the most likely root cause is a herniated disc.
> 
> I have been for 5 Bioflex Laser treatments so far. It seems a bit "woo", but a couple of people I trust swear by it. I have benefit coverage, so it's not costing me much, and I can't see any way it could make me worse. I've not agreed to spinal "adjustments". I know someone who last December left her chiro unconscious in an ambulance after an "adjustment."
> 
> ...


Well, I hope this passes for you soon and completely. Nobody deserves to be in pain, but I just don't think you did anything that you should have reasonably expected to result in this condition.

If I had to blame something I'd say it's all that jazz you listened to. The big band stuff is good for you, but that bebop.....

I recommend weed and Pink Floyd (maybe a few strong doeses of Bytor and the Snowdog as a sort of booster).


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

I stopped listening to bebop as a preventative measure.

@Paul M All the best!


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Physio and chiropractic. My practitioners recommend both (they're not in cahoots, there are several decent local ones). I like some massage after the injury is repaired to deal with the muscular stuff around it.


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

Moving is a big thing in healing spine problems. Sitting still is the worst. Long walks would be beneficial.


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## gtrguy (Jul 6, 2006)

BGood said:


> Moving is a big thing in healing spine problems. Sitting still is the worst. Long walks would be beneficial.


The whole “walk it off” concept really can help. Our bodies evolved for walking and it’s a very healthy activity for the body overall. Start small and increase over time.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

BGood said:


> Moving is a big thing in healing spine problems. Sitting still is the worst. Long walks would be beneficial.


And a healthy dose of shoveling snow. I follow the ergonomic guide book for removing the white stuff. Grunt, sweat....reflect on the beauty of life.....grunt, sweat.....the pain is part of the beauty of life.....grunt, sweat....


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## BGood (Feb 20, 2015)

HighNoon said:


> And a healthy dose of shoveling snow. I follow the ergonomic guide book for removing the white stuff. Grunt, sweat....reflect on the beauty of life.....grunt, sweat.....the pain is part of the beauty of life.....grunt, sweat....


There's not much of that white apparel in my gym this winter. Waiting for a delivery this week.


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## jayoldschool (Sep 12, 2013)

Paul M said:


> I'm at the end of 2 weeks of this..... it's improved, but not back to normal. I haven't had any imaging yet, but the most likely root cause is a herniated disc.


Paul, please give the inflatable cervical collar a try. I really think it will help.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

jayoldschool said:


> Paul, please give the inflatable cervical collar a try. I really think it will help.


I'm wearing a soft collar at work, I do have an inflatable collar I wear at home. Mostly I find it is helping with my horrifically bad posture. Apparently "Sit up straight!!!!!" was good advice all along.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)




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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Got some xrays done Monday. I was supposed to have phone consult with my family Dr. this afternoon. This morning my wife dropped me off at the ER. 10/10 pain won't wait.

Two Er docs saw me, one a cyclist. While seeing them my family doc called. Three out of three think this is a muscle spasm. Imaging doesn't show stenosis or degenerative disc disease. There may be a herniated disc, and we will proceed as if there is.

So...... toridal and muscle relaxants for now.

Getting old sucks.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Paul M said:


> Getting old sucks.


Aging is certainly not for sissies!

Protective muscle spasms can be brutal. 

Take Good Care and let others take good care of you.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Get thee to the weed store. It won't help but the weed now will knock you into another dimension.


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## jayoldschool (Sep 12, 2013)

How are you feeling, Paul? Still improving?


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

player99 said:


> Get thee to the weed store. It won't help but the weed now will knock you into another dimension.


I've been using medical cannabis for years.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

jayoldschool said:


> How are you feeling, Paul? Still improving?


It's up and down. But the trend seems promising.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Well..... that was short lived. Back at ER with 10/10 pain.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

Paul M said:


> Well..... that was short lived. Back at ER with 10/10 pain.


I'm sorry you're going through this. Get better!


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

player99 said:


> I'm sorry you're going through this. Get better!


If you see @Milkman selling off some jazz boxes for a deceased friend, you'll know I didn't make it. ;-p

Holy $#!+ is this some pain. On to beginner narcotics now. (Tylenol 3, with cyclobenzaprine for a muscle relaxant. )

My mother-in- law's funeral is tomorrow, and there is no scenario where I am fit to go. Try to imagine how it feels to tell your wife you aren't going to her mother's funeral.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Paul M said:


> If you see @Milkman selling off some jazz boxes for a deceased friend, you'll know I didn't make it. ;-p
> 
> Holy $#!+ is this some pain. On to beginner narcotics now. (Tylenol 3, with cyclobenzaprine for a muscle relaxant. )
> 
> My mother-in- law's funeral is tomorrow, and there is no scenario where I am fit to go. Try to imagine how it feels to tell your wife you aren't going to her mother's funeral.


Yeah that's rough. My Missus threw her back out years ago and when it comes back every once in awhile, she's euchered, can't move without excrutiating pain. I doubt she has anything as severe as you do presently but it's incapacitating to say the least.

I hope it passes quickly and completely. We take much for granted.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Milkman said:


> We take much for granted.


Repeated for emphasis.

@Paul M All the best!


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Time for an update:

Between Wednesday and Sunday last week I went to the local ER 4 times in 5 days because of pain. Literally writhing, and crying uncontrollably pain. On top of the pain, I was starting to be scared that this was going to be my life. Based on my age, and my grandparents......I just might have another 40 years to go. I honestly could not endure 40 more years that would be like the last two weeks.


Today I am doing better, I stopped the opiods Sunday evening, (Tylenol 3 for one day, Hydromorphone for two days). 

Lyrica seems to be working for me. I still take naproxen 2x day. I've had lots of time to read studies on the pubmed site. I can't find any studies that show efficacy of hydromorphone for nerve pain. There is also no conclusive proof that it doesn't.

Lyrica doesn't work for everybody, but I'm hoping I'm in the lucky cohort.

Yesterday's EMG shows evidence of a pinched nerve, (ya figger?), and evidence of early carpal tunnel in my left hand. We didn't test anything on the right side. The EMG Dr. showed me a move to make when the tingles start. I've used it half a dozen times today, it seems to work.

I have an MRI on Thursday. I imagine you get quicker service when you have 4 ER visits in 5 days.

Fun fact: An ambulance ride costs $45. Our Ontario Teachers Insurance Plan covers 80%, so I am $9 out of pocket, and I can claim that as a health care expense on my tax return.

The cab I took home cost $15 including tip. It is quicker and cheaper to call an ambulance than a cab. Good to know.

I've also lost 10 #. When I start pooping again, I'll lose more. Beans and berries for lunch and supper for a while.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Thanks for the update. 


Paul M said:


> The EMG Dr. showed me a move to make when the tingles start. I've used it half a dozen times today, it seems to work.


This is a positive sign, IMHO. 

Wishing you all the best!

I know that we have not met but we came close when our photo with @Milkman and Amanda in Cambridge was cancelled
due to fear of rain. In addition, I contacted you several years ago about coming out to one of your gigs.


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## Midnight Rider (Apr 2, 2015)

Paul M said:


> Time for an update:
> 
> Between Wednesday and Sunday last week I went to the local ER 4 times in 5 days because of pain. Literally writhing, and crying uncontrollably pain. On top of the pain, I was starting to be scared that this was going to be my life. Based on my age, and my grandparents......I just might have another 40 years to go. I honestly could not endure 40 more years that would be like the last two weeks.
> 
> ...


I fully understand what you are going through. It very much sounds like a disc issues, ie. Degenerative Disc Disease. As the discs deteriorate things shift and obviously press against the network of nerves that work there way through the canals in the spine. My issues resulted in a two level discectomy with fusion. I did a detailed post early in this thread that you can search which includes imaging. My advice would be to have an MRI done which will clearly identify the state of your cervical spine. Best of luck.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

So.......

Xray showed spinal stenosis at C2/C3, and the start of degenerative disc disease. 

Ultrasound showed partial tear of the rotator cuff. 

EMG nerve test showed pinched nerve, and early stage carpal tunnel syndrome 

MRI showed spinal stenosis and degenerative disc disease for the whole C-spine, and a herniated disc at C7. 

I feel like I thought I bought my dream home, but the home inspector did his job.

I'm now at approx. 1/10 pain, I'd call it discomfort more than pain. The big remaining symptom is the numbness and tingling in my left index finger. What was my lifetime technique of sloppy guitar playing just got a whole lot worse. Either I switch to lefty, which means that I will just drop a LOT of picks, or I switch to slide.

But I did get back on the bike and do 30 minutes Zwifting..... that felt good.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

The imaging and EMG would be dollar signs if you'd been in a car crash.


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

Paul M said:


> So.......
> 
> Xray showed spinal stenosis at C2/C3, and the start of degenerative disc disease.
> 
> ...


Would it be rude to ask how old you are with all of this going on? That's a whole lot of ouchies.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Brunz said:


> Would it be rude to ask how old you are with all of this going on? That's a whole lot of ouchies.


Not rude at all....I'll be 56 in May.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

Brunz said:


> Would it be rude to ask how old you are with all of this going on?


I was gonna say that's usually the kinda stuff we see in the 55 - 65 crew...lol

I have back pain too from wrackin up too many cars and too many wingsuit events offa dirt bikes.


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

Paul M said:


> Not rude at all....I'll be 56 in May.


Well mate, I wish you the best for what it is worth. I have a herniated disc myself and have since I was around 24, I know the pain spinal issues is and I know it is a lot of not fun. I keep a bottle of hydromorphone and T3's around the house for when it acts up because I am too stupid to take time away from work. 

I really hope you get sorted the best they can for ya and find a manageable way to deal with whatever latent pain is left


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Pissy! Your plate's totally full. I can sympathize, being rather in the same boat with some of the same conditions and not having been on a bike for 2 yrs. It's mostly all fixable as far as I know but takes time and at this stage, time is precious. I know, being 68. Positive vibes.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Sooooooo, time for another update. 

I was off work for three weeks, I'm back now. Little to no pain, but a numb/tingling left index finger, with a bit of involvement in the middle finger as well. I have been assesed and am NOT a candidate for surgery any time soon. I have also been cleared to do whatever the hell I want, with clear instructions as to what indicates green light, yellow light, and red light level/type of pain. Basically....mechanical pain is one thing, electrical pain is another. I still plan to ride the 100 km Paris 2 Ancaster bike race in April. I have adjusted my time goals accordingly. 

I know that Lyrica cures nothing; I seem to be lucky that it does manage my symptoms. My dosage has dropped from 300 mg/ day, down to 150 mg/day. Next week it'll drop again to 100 mg/day. I think that I am slowly healing from the massive inflammation attack from the original disc rupture, and the Lyrica is helping with neuropathic pain. In retrospect, I don't think the Bioflex Laser did much for me. I tend to think it can work, but in my case it was like throwing water balloons at a forest fire.

Lyrica is not without side effects. I have a general full body ache/heaviness/tiredness that I have never had before. I hope that as I wean off the drug I'll feel less _meh_, and back to my active self. My fingers will likely never fully recover. Time to start studying Django Reinhardt techniques, I suppose.

I'll likely never know the root cause, but I am going on the assumption that my age, and a lifetime history of poor posture are key players in this little drama.

Anyway folks.....thanks for listening. I believe that sharing life experiences, good/bad/indifferent, helps us all manage and improve all our lives. The past two years have been challenging, the year going forward is not without concerns. I've read and re-read every reply in this thread, and I thank everyone for their help and thoughts.

As the great British magician Paul Daniels used to say: "You've made a happy man very old."

Peace,

Paul


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

I am glad that you found a level of acceptance in it all for what that is worth and even better is less pain. Less is less. 



Paul M said:


> I still plan to ride the 100 km Paris 2 Ancaster bike race in April


Not giving in to ever changing life conditions sounds like winning to me! Good on you for that and best of luck with the rest.


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## Midnight Rider (Apr 2, 2015)

Hope your path is less bumpy going forward. As you are aware I've posted on this thread previously outlining similar issues. Not sure if I had mentioned the use of CBD (Cannabidiol) cannaibis oil for pain symptoms and the numbing/tingling. I have been using it for 7 years with great results and it has replaced various pain medications I had used in the past with no side effects usually associated with pharmaceuticals. I use a strain with 20% CBD and less than 1% THC (Tetrahydrocannabinol) so I'm not walking around stoned all day, lol. 

However, I do use a couple strains with 12% CBD and 6% THC at night if necessary when the pain ramps up from time to time. Spectrum (Canopy Growth Corporation) and AURORA have very good medical grade products if you are ever interested in giving it a try.

Best of luck.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Midnight Rider said:


> Hope your path is less bumpy going forward. As you are aware I've posted on this thread previously outlining similar issues. Not sure if I had mentioned the use of CBD (Cannabidiol) cannaibis oil for pain symptoms and the numbing/tingling. I have been using it for 7 years with great results and it has replaced various pain medications I had used in the past with no side effects usually associated with pharmaceuticals. I use a strain with 20% CBD and less than 1% THC (Tetrahydrocannabinol) so I'm not walking around stoned all day, lol.
> 
> However, I do use a couple strains with 12% CBD and 6% THC at night if necessary when the pain ramps up from time to time. Spectrum (Canopy Growth Corporation) and AURORA have very good medical grade products if you are ever interested in giving it a try.
> 
> Best of luck.



I use Cannimed 1:20 and/or Spectrum Yellow during the day. Cannimed 10:10 and/or Spectrum Blue for bedtime. Cannimed 18:0 and/or Spectrum Red for extra THC. 

I've been a patient at The Musicians Clinic of Canada for 8 years or so now.


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## bentwire17 (Sep 7, 2011)

Hey Paul, hope you find some relief in your journey.
Did any Covid vax shots precede the onset of your nerve condition?
My elderly dad was active and fit before his vax shots . Past two years he developed pronounced neurological nerve pain in hands and feet .
He can barely shuffle now ???
There’s been an increasing correlation between these shots and neurological conditions.
There’s lots to read on the net .
You have to wade through the conflicted info out there.
Here’s a few :









Parsonage-Turner Syndrome Following COVID-19 Vaccination: MR Neurography


Vaccination is one of the several known triggers of Parsonage-Turner syndrome (PTS). This case series describes two individuals with clinical presentations of PTS whose symptoms began 13 hours and 18 days following receipt of the Pfizer-BioNTech BNT162b2 and Moderna mRNA-1273 COVID-19 vaccine...



pubs.rsna.org





F.D.A. Attaches Warning of Rare Nerve Syndrome to Johnson & Johnson Vaccine

Wish you the best ….


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Oh Lord.


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## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

Paul M said:


> Sooooooo, time for another update.
> 
> I was off work for three weeks, I'm back now. Little to no pain, but a numb/tingling left index finger, with a bit of involvement in the middle finger as well. I have been assesed and am NOT a candidate for surgery any time soon. I have also been cleared to do whatever the hell I want, with clear instructions as to what indicates green light, yellow light, and red light level/type of pain. Basically....mechanical pain is one thing, electrical pain is another. I still plan to ride the 100 km Paris 2 Ancaster bike race in April. I have adjusted my time goals accordingly.
> 
> ...


Onwards and upwards, or at least some sort of meandering maintenance.

Lyrica.....where do they come up with these names....a soft gentle breeze like sound on a beautiful summer's day. Of course it's just a mask. I remember it from my seizure days.

For heavy duty inflammation I ascribe to high dose intravenous Vitamin C. A couple tests precede to see what you can or can not take. I'm doing a round right now to deal with a couple issues. Of help also would be injectable medicinal ozone subcutaneously in your affected area. It's the shizzle. However if I remember, it's not allowed in Ontario (the usage of the unstable oxygen molecule). Both Vitamin C (in large doses) and ozone are basic oxidizers, bringing oxygen to help with healing.

As far as a general take daily anti inflammatory, NAC, N-Acetyl Cysteine, precursor to glutathione production is good stuff. It used to be a drug, then they made it a supplement back in the day. In some parts of the world (hint the US) they're trying to make it a drug again.....hmmmm? You can still get it in Canada.

All the best in your quest....keep on pedaling.


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## robbiedaug (4 mo ago)




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