# Norman vs Blueridge vs Yamaha



## mede5 (Feb 3, 2018)

Hi everyone, I am currently looking for my first acoustic guitar. It's been almost 2 years since I started the electric guitar. I need a guitar to record and create songs. I currently have 3 models of guitars that I am looking for and I would like to have your opinion on which of these 3 guitars would be the best for me. 

Norman B20 Norman Guitars Canada - B20 
Yamaha FG830 Yamaha FG830 Dreadnought Acoustic Guitar
Blueridge BR-40 Blueridge BR-40 Dreadnought Acoustic Guitar
Takamine GD-51 product-details

Thank you very much!


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## AlBDarned (Jun 29, 2017)

I've had a B20 with electronics for years & years now. I love it. Back when I bought it I tried everything in & around that price range at Steve's music in Toronto, and the Norman, for me, was the clear standout in that it just sounded bigger & richer than the others I tried. Can't say how it stacks up to the others you have listed, or whether they're the same now as they were when I bought mine.

I think Norman put the emphasis on the right things for this guitar - the top & the general build, not the rosette or the finish or the fancy appointments. The laminate back/sides sound fine as far as I can tell, and I think they make the guitar more capable of a bit of abuse in terms of humidity etc compared to all solid woods.

I'd recommend testing the ones you're interested in head to head if at all possible and seeing which one feels & sounds best to you.

Norman's made in your belle province as well still I think, fyi if you didn't know


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## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

Lots of love here for the FG, especially considering the price point. I recently picked one up and am quite happy with it.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

I have two Yamaha acoustics (LS6 and FS830). 

Excellent value for and typically dependable quality of sound and 'fit and finish'.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I have a Norman B20 that I bought 18 years ago. I has no structural issues. Solid sitka top, laminated cherry back and sides. Neck is good, intonation pretty good for a $300 guitar. Plane Jane nothing fancy but nice bcs the wood quality looks good and the guitar is well constructed. Sounds good for what it is and runs better on 13s IMO.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

I always look to Yamaha first for acoustics. Great tone, great price, and extremely reliable.


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## Kerry Brown (Mar 31, 2014)

Tone is important but for me feel is more important. Those are all decent sounding guitars. Play them and see how they feel to you. They will all have slightly different necks and body shapes. Which feels the most comfortable to you?


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## Lord-Humongous (Jun 5, 2014)

Three Chinese guitars and one built in Canada. Just sayin.

The Norman is a great guitar, you really can’t go wrong. I’d suggest you check out a Seagull too. The neck shape is a little different on the standard S6 and you might prefer it over the Norman.


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## mede5 (Feb 3, 2018)

Lord-Humongous said:


> Three Chinese guitars and one built in Canada. Just sayin.
> 
> The Norman is a great guitar, you really can’t go wrong. I’d suggest you check out a Seagull too. The neck shape is a little different on the standard S6 and you might prefer it over the Norman.


I already looked at the seagull s6 slim, because I do not like the handle too big of the original. What made me change my mind is that the body is made of cedar wood, a much drier and brittle wood.


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## mede5 (Feb 3, 2018)

Lord-Humongous said:


> Three Chinese guitars and one built in Canada. Just sayin.
> 
> The Norman is a great guitar, you really can’t go wrong. I’d suggest you check out a Seagull too. The neck shape is a little different on the standard S6 and you might prefer it over the Norman.


Are the Canadians guitar better than the Chinese ones?


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## mede5 (Feb 3, 2018)

Kerry Brown said:


> Tone is important but for me feel is more important. Those are all decent sounding guitars. Play them and see how they feel to you. They will all have slightly different necks and body shapes. Which feels the most comfortable to you?


I'll go try them in a guitar store, thank you for the awnser.


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## mede5 (Feb 3, 2018)

Wardo said:


> I have a Norman B20 that I bought 18 years ago. I has no structural issues. Solid sitka top, laminated cherry back and sides. Neck is good, intonation pretty good for a $300 guitar. Plane Jane nothing fancy but nice bcs the wood quality looks good and the guitar is well constructed. Sounds good for what it is and runs better on 13s IMO.


Is it easy to play on it?


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## mede5 (Feb 3, 2018)

AlBDarned said:


> I've had a B20 with electronics for years & years now. I love it. Back when I bought it I tried everything in & around that price range at Steve's music in Toronto, and the Norman, for me, was the clear standout in that it just sounded bigger & richer than the others I tried. Can't say how it stacks up to the others you have listed, or whether they're the same now as they were when I bought mine.
> 
> I think Norman put the emphasis on the right things for this guitar - the top & the general build, not the rosette or the finish or the fancy appointments. The laminate back/sides sound fine as far as I can tell, and I think they make the guitar more capable of a bit of abuse in terms of humidity etc compared to all solid woods.
> 
> ...



Yes, I know that Norman guitars are made in Quebec, which is a huge + for me. I saw that they have a natural finish, which normally means that they only have a thin coat to protect them. I would like to know if the scratches appear very quickly on the guitar. I am very perfectionist, and as soon as there is going to be a scratch or something, that will obsess me.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

mede5 said:


> Is it easy to play on it?



Yeah, the action is good, neck comfortable and I think the scale length is shorter than my Martin guitars so the Norman has less string tension as well which makes it easier to play.

The machine heads on it are better than you’d expect for a cheap guitar.

Mine is nearly 20 years old so hopefully they are still building them as well now.

Bottom line though is that you have try a bunch of guitars and find one that you like.


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## AlBDarned (Jun 29, 2017)

mede5 said:


> I saw that they have a natural finish, which normally means that they only have a thin coat to protect them. I would like to know if the scratches appear very quickly on the guitar. I am very perfectionist, and as soon as there is going to be a scratch or something, that will obsess me.


Probably scratches a bit easier with the thin finish yes. Flipside of that, the story goes, is that the thinner finish doesn't interfere with the vibrations of the soundboard as much, so the sound is that much dreamier. Mine is not quite yet 'beat to hell,' but it's getting there, with plenty of scratches/worn off finish around the pick guard.

That said, any guitar is going to scratch up a bit or not, depending on how you play it. Best to learn to love the scratches & patches on a lower priced beater guiar - it's a tool not an object d'art.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

There's only one person who can decide which is best for you and that is you.

Go to store that has all of them, line them up and play them back to back. Play each one for like 10 seconds and switch.

That being said you might have a hard time finding a Blueridge in a store in Canada.

PS I decided the FG830 was best for me.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

To me they are all different animals. But they are all good animals. Try them all if you can. If you decide you like the Norman sound, you might want to go Simon & Patrick or Seagull in the same style guitar. While Norman guitars are quite good, they are not made with as good materials as their S & P and Seagull counterparts, all being made by Godin.


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## mede5 (Feb 3, 2018)

I just 


AlBDarned said:


> Probably scratches a bit easier with the thin finish yes. Flipside of that, the story goes, is that the thinner finish doesn't interfere with the vibrations of the soundboard as much, so the sound is that much dreamier. Mine is not quite yet 'beat to hell,' but it's getting there, with plenty of scratches/worn off finish around the pick guard.
> 
> That said, any guitar is going to scratch up a bit or not, depending on how you play it. Best to learn to love the scratches & patches on a lower priced beater guiar - it's a tool not an object d'art.


I just found on the Norman's guitar site that they have a norman B20 high gloss. It will probably be my choice!
Also: If you would buy another guitar, which will you choose between the Norman B20 HG and the norman B50?

Thanks


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

B50 looks to be Sitka over maple.

B20 is Sitka over cherry laminate.

You would need to play them bcs they will likely sound a lot different.


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## AlBDarned (Jun 29, 2017)

Yeah can't help you there. Play them if you can, otherwise check the prices, maybe make a call to the factory to someone who can explain any finer points on the differences? Otherwise check the prices, admire the looks, imagine what they will sound like in your head & roll the dice My bet is you'll be happy with what you get either way


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

mede5 said:


> I just
> 
> 
> I just found on the Norman's guitar site that they have a norman B20 high gloss. It will probably be my choice!
> ...


Guitars are like shoes. No one can tell you which pair of shoes will fit you best

You have to try them on.

Different acoustics sound very different from each other.

The Seagull S6 is brassy and loud.
The Yamaha FG830 has lots of bass and is chimey.
Etc


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## AlBDarned (Jun 29, 2017)

Guncho said:


> Guitars are like shoes. No one can tell you which pair of shoes will fit you best
> 
> You have to try them on.
> 
> ...


And that's the generalization before you feel and hear different examples of each.

Always play it before you buy it if you can.

Otherwise, roll the dice & hope all's good. It often is


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Being your first acoustic, you likely wouldn't be disappointed with any of them as they are all quite decent guitars. If you buy used and you want to change it later, you will likely get all or most of your money back if you sell it later on to get something different. Used is always a good way to go with your first one and often your 10th, 20th and so on down the road.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

AlBDarned said:


> And that's the generalization before you feel and hear different examples of each.
> 
> Always play it before you buy it if you can.
> 
> Otherwise, roll the dice & hope all's good. It often is


I'm not sure if you are agreeing or disagreeing with me.

An S6 and an FG830 sound like apples and oranges.

FG830 A and FG830 B while may not be identical are both the same kind of orange.

I tried three of them. Didn't hear any difference in sound between them.

Playability well that's a different story. One had such bad fret buzz I returned it.


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## AlBDarned (Jun 29, 2017)

Guncho said:


> I'm not sure if you are agreeing or disagreeing with me.


I'm agreeing with you in principle. I don't know the particular sounds of the specific guitars you're describing the sound of, so I can't 'agree' with you as to those sounds specifically. I do agree that different guitar models have different sounds! Not disagreeing with you anyway...

My point was more that, accepting that a particular model gives you a particular sound and feel, you can find even more different nuances in sound in feel comparing different examples of the same model one to the other.

So a strat does not equal a LP, nor does strat A equal strat B. Probably a lot closer to each other than to the LP, agreed!

No disagreement


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## Greg Ellis (Oct 1, 2007)

Even once you settle on a model, you might want to play several examples. Towards the lower end of the market, there's a fair bit of unit-to-unit variance. Fit and finish stuff, buzzy frets, things like that. 

A few years back, I played about 10 examples of the Yamaha FG700MS in three different stores before I finally found one that seemed like the best of the bunch and bought it.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

No matter what you buy, budget for a setup. Buzzy frets, a high nut or high action can usually be solved with a good setup and perhaps a fret dress. Too many new guitars don’t have very well-done frets, especially in the lower price ranges. And a low-priced guitar can often be made to play wonderfully with a bit of work.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

I think most stores offer a free setup with purchase.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Guncho said:


> I think most stores offer a free setup with purchase.


And you usually get what you pay for with those.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

jdto said:


> And you usually get what you pay for with those.


 I was going to say something like that but typing on my phone is a pain in the ass - although I just used voice dictation to say all this ... lol


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## Morkolo (Dec 9, 2010)

My first acoustic was a Yamaha Fg750 and what I liked about it most at the time was how well it played out of the box. So going by your list I'd pick the Yamaha. But... knowing what I know today though I'd recommend you ditch your list and look for a higher end acoustic (preferably all solid woods) on the used market for the same or possibly less money.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

jdto said:


> And you usually get what you pay for with those.


Really you think L & M, Cosmo, etc are going to do a different setup because it's free?

I wouldn't think so. I think the tech who picks up the work order or what have you would read set up and do exactly that.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Guncho said:


> Really you think L & M, Cosmo, etc are going to do a different setup because it's free?
> 
> I wouldn't think so. I think the tech who picks up the work order or what have you would read set up and do exactly that.


No, I think they do do a setup. The problem is more with how well they do it. I’ve had better luck with setups from someone other than one of those two shops you mentioned. Also, fret dressing is not included in the standard setup. I got better-playing guitars once I started giving them to someone else to work on. I’m sure there are good techs at those shops, but what if the good ones don’t do your guitar? If you’re looking for a great-playing guitar, spending a few bucks to get there is a good idea. I don’t even use the free setup anymore when I buy a guitar from them.


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## Wardo (Feb 5, 2010)

I think the free set up you could do yourself for the most part but when I got my HD35CS at the 12th fret they did the nut slots and set up while I was there - took all of 15 minutes to get it right. I think fret dressing would be the big one and they ain’t gonna do that for nothing. As for frets, the two Gibson’s that I have were great out of the box. My telecaster needs to be plek’d or dressed or something bcs it’s twangin out all over the place - once that is sorted though it will be a great guitar but I’m not expecting that the free set up will fix this.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

I'm cheap. I'll take the free setup.

I can't really see buying a $400 guitar and immediately spending $100-$200 on a setup and fret work.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Guncho said:


> I'm cheap. I'll take the free setup.
> 
> I can't really see buying a $400 guitar and immediately spending $100-$200 on a setup and fret work.


Hey, if you can find one that plays to your satisfaction without further work, great. But if a guitar plays like crap, it plays like crap. A $500 or $600 guitar might play equally badly. Paying to have it to play properly is money well spent. I’d rather spend $400+$150 and have a real player than spend $550 and end up with a so-so or crappy player.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

I don't know. I feel like we're talking about the difference between a Canadian Tire tune up and a Formula One crew tune up.

For most people the Canadian Tire tune up is quite adequate.

Guess I'm just not as discerning or just cheap. (as mentioned) lol


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Guncho said:


> I don't know. I feel like we're talking about the difference between a Canadian Tire tune up and a Formula One crew tune up.
> 
> For most people the Canadian Tire tune up is quite adequate.
> 
> Guess I'm just not as discerning or just cheap. (as mentioned) lol


Well, I’m no racecar driver , but I can feel the difference with a good setup/fret dress. I had a few issues with my J-45 until I gave it to this guy and now it plays as well as any guitar I’ve ever picked up. This was after getting the free L&M setup, plus another one at the 12th Fret several months later. I have had some problems with my left hand, so I take all the help I can get when it comes to ease of play.


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## Guest (Feb 5, 2018)

There are a lot of YT vids on how to do a full set up.
Once you understand the concept, it's not too difficult to do your own.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Can't you ask the store you buy it from to do the standard setup to your liking?


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

jdto said:


> No, I think they do do a setup. The problem is more with how well they do it. I’ve had better luck with setups from someone other than one of those two shops you mentioned. Also, fret dressing is not included in the standard setup. I got better-playing guitars once I started giving them to someone else to work on. I’m sure there are good techs at those shops, but what if the good ones don’t do your guitar? If you’re looking for a great-playing guitar, spending a few bucks to get there is a good idea. I don’t even use the free setup anymore when I buy a guitar from them.


Depends on the location. One of our local L&M has a very well respected guitar tech.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

cboutilier said:


> Depends on the location. One of our local L&M has a very well respected guitar tech.


Yeah, this is true. As I said above, it depends on which tech you get.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

People also seem to be saying fret work makes a big difference which of course it does if needed.

But fret work is not included in any standard setup.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Guncho said:


> People also seem to be saying fret work makes a big difference which of course it does if needed.
> 
> But fret work is not included in any standard setup.


True. That’s why I said “setup and perhaps a fret dress”. If a particular guitar grabs you, it may be worth getting the work done. It’ll have to be up to the player.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

Exactly so a Long & McQuade setup vs someone else's setup with fret dress is not really a fair comparison.


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## jdto (Sep 30, 2015)

Guncho said:


> Exactly so a Long & McQuade setup vs someone else's setup with fret dress is not really a fair comparison.


That was never a comparison for me.

Point one: “budget for a setup and perhaps a fret dress with any new guitar”

Point two: “setups at some of the big stores are not as good as the setups from my guy”

Two different issues and two different costs. Fret dressing is work above and beyond the scope of a regular setup and paid for as such.


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## Everton FC (Dec 15, 2016)

I had an old Yamaha for years, then another from the early 90's. They are great guitars... But I prefer the Godin line of acoustics. And, the money spent, stays home! 

Never played a Blueridge.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

If you get a chance, you should give Alvarez (Artist and Masterworks models) and Eastman guitars a look as well. They are excellent guitars that give you excellent bang for the buck.


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## WhiteFalcon (Jun 9, 2015)

I haven't played the Blueridge or the Yamaha, but I own an older, (1997) Norman B20, and it still sounds good, and we bought a Seagull and an Art and Lutherie for my daughters and they sound, play and look great. I'm in the Godin Camp.


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## Guest (Feb 7, 2018)

WhiteFalcon said:


> I'm in the Godin Camp.


Same here.
I've owned a Yami Fg180 for ~40 yrs before selling it.
Currently have 2 Norman CW's (one electric) and a Seagull.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

laristotle said:


> Same here.
> I've owned a Yami Fg180 for ~40 yrs before selling it.
> Currently have 2 Norman CW's (one electric) and a Seagull.


I've owned a couple Godin's; an A & L and an S & P. They were fine guitars. I also frequent the Acoustic Forum and am surprised how much love and respect they get there.


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## Ship of fools (Nov 17, 2007)

wow is all I can say no way will I mention what guitar you should get how in gods green earth do you expect any of us to say which guitar to get, firstly we know almost nothing about your playing what type of songs or anything or if you are just looking for a guitar to write songs with well anything in acoustic would really do so I will recommend what I told all the folk I started to teach.
GO OUT and play everything and anything forget about the name on the headstock trust your ears dont worry if its Canadian or Chinese as it makes no difference when writing music as they only speak one language [ MUSIC ] find the guitar you want by doing the leg work


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Ship of fools said:


> wow is all I can say no way will I mention what guitar you should get how in gods green earth do you expect any of us to say which guitar to get, firstly we know almost nothing about your playing what type of songs or anything or if you are just looking for a guitar to write songs with well anything in acoustic would really do so I will recommend what I told all the folk I started to teach.
> *GO OUT and play everything and anything forget about the name on the headstock trust your ears dont worry if its Canadian or Chinese* as it makes no difference when writing music as they only speak one language [ MUSIC ] find the guitar you want by doing the leg work


Your comment shows that you are "no ship of fools".


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## WhiteFalcon (Jun 9, 2015)

Ship of fools said:


> wow is all I can say no way will I mention what guitar you should get how in gods green earth do you expect any of us to say which guitar to get, firstly we know almost nothing about your playing what type of songs or anything or if you are just looking for a guitar to write songs with well anything in acoustic would really do so I will recommend what I told all the folk I started to teach.
> GO OUT and play everything and anything forget about the name on the headstock trust your ears dont worry if its Canadian or Chinese as it makes no difference when writing music as they only speak one language [ MUSIC ] find the guitar you want by doing the leg work



This is good advice, and exactly how I ended up buying my Norman. ;-)


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