# It's hockey season again!



## puckhead (Sep 8, 2008)

Wheeeee!


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## djmarcelca (Aug 2, 2012)

I don't watch hockey until after the Grey Cup.


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## hardasmum (Apr 23, 2008)

I don't watch hockey until I fall asleep


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

I can tell, I was already cursing at the Leafs last night!


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## doriangrey (Mar 29, 2011)

Giddyup... I start getting into hockey as soon as I get into my hockey pool  My Canucks looked pretty good last night - but then again it was Calgary ;o) I just want to see the Canadian teams do better...only one Canadian team making the playoffs is unacceptable


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

I haven't watched hockey since my kids quit playing and that was a relief.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

Good to get going again...
And good to see the Flames still beating the Oilers.
Too bad about Sam Bennett though.


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## Jim DaddyO (Mar 20, 2009)

I have not watched hockey in years. It is October now, does that mean the leafs are statistically unable to make the playoffs again?


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Jim DaddyO said:


> I have not watched hockey in years.


The difference in the sport is immense. It used to be a game. Now it is a regimented performance of 40 second long shifts executing a system. The players are faster (that should be better) and more skilled (that should be better) but the game is not better. It simply isn't as entertaining and it has lost a lot of its character through the evolution of being a game to a being a huge revenue generator. IMO.

I still have the game in my soul but it is mostly the game of old, not the modern version. I still can't help but watch a little and check out the highlights. Even the great Martin Brodeur said, when asked 'what he would say if he was talking to a team' - "I wouldn't be talking to a team, my agent would be". He said it half-jokingly but it was more like 90% half, not 'real' half.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

..........


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## surlybastard (Feb 20, 2011)

I always get a little excited for hockey, mainly because it means the return of my hobby job: Scorer for the Leaf games. I do about 20-22 home games a year, sit in the press box, eat free food and get to hang out behind the curtain. Yes the Leafs are awful and will be for the forseeable future (maybe forever), but I always get excited to go to the games, especially Saturday nights. Say what you want, but it's the biggest sporting event in this country every week and I love watching the spectacle whether the Leafs win or lose. It'll also be fun to see Crosby play tomorrow night. If nothing else, as a long suffering Leaf fan I go eat their free food as a way to stick it to them in my own small way


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Hockey would be great to watch if they would play and referee by the rules and rid the game of the stupid violence.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> Hockey would be great to watch if they would play and referee by the rules and rid the game of the stupid violence.


Yes! It's crowding out the intelligent violence...


(Sorry, I had to post that)


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

zontar said:


> Yes! It's crowding out the intelligent violence...
> 
> 
> (Sorry, I had to post that)


They could rename the game with:

Hookeying
Puncheying
Hookfighting
Triphockey or.........
Wedonotcaretorefereethegamebytherulesbecausethat
wouldallowtheskilledplayerstheabilitytoshowushow
hockeywasmeanttobeplayedandwouldembarass
usforthelast60yearsofstupidlyruiningthegame


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Steadfastly said:


> thelast60yearsofstupidlyruiningthegame


OMJ

What an Oscar Meyer.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> They could rename the game with:
> 
> Hookeying
> Puncheying
> ...


 So, are you a fan of the shootout then? It's probably the only truly clean, pure skills part of the game, yet so many so-called hockey purists hate it.
I actually enjoy it.

I think the only way to really clean up the game would be to remove checking, and make helmet cages mandatory....but that ain't going to happen, and no one wants it. If they did, they'd be going to watch women's hockey.

every sport has rules that get broken, penalties assessed, and dirty moves/dirty players.
football, soccer, baseball, basketball, don't matter.


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

http://blogs.theprovince.com/2014/1...lternate-angles-to-nhl-gamecentre-live-feeds/
What next, player cams. Or I know, how about puck and stick cams. 
Anyway, this is probably one of the first games I saw on t.v.. 
http://video.mapleleafs.nhl.com/videocenter/console?id=63667
Notice, it's a nice, clean game. There is checking and, no helmets. As I recall, no shoot outs either. If hockey was still like this I'd probably still watch it.....on Sat. right after Bugs Bunny.
And to the Leafs fans, sorry.


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## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

It's amazing to me what these corporate hacks try to come up with to justify their useless jobs. I remember the attempt to put blue streaks on the screen behind the glowing puck and trying to have 4 periods instead of three so the Americans would relate to it more. I can't wait to hear what kind of cockamamie "idea" the nit-wits in silk suits will come up with next. It's a never-ending source of humour for me to watch these idiots try and fix what ain't busted.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

bluzfish said:


> It's amazing to me what these corporate hacks try to come up with to justify their useless jobs. I remember the attempt to put blue streaks on the screen behind the glowing puck and trying to have 4 periods instead of three so the Americans would relate to it more. I can't wait to hear what kind of cockamamie "idea" the nit-wits in silk suits will come up with next. It's a never-ending source of humour for me to watch these idiots try and fix what ain't busted.


ya they miss the point a lot of times.
the "Martin brodeur trapezoid " for instance....other than 2-3 goalies in the league, most would get themselves in trouble behind the net often leading to scoring chances....which I thought (increasing scoring chances) was the mandate of the league to make the game more exciting.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Diablo said:


> So, are you a fan of the shootout then? It's probably the only truly clean, pure skills part of the game, yet so many so-called hockey purists hate it.
> I actually enjoy it.
> 
> I think the only way to really clean up the game would be to remove checking, and make helmet cages mandatory..._*.but that ain't going to happen,*_ and no one wants it. If they did, they'd be going to watch women's hockey.
> ...


Almost to the point where real sport has been taken out of the game of sport.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> Almost to the point where real sport has been taken out of the game of sport.


That's absurd.
hockey players were beating themselves bloody in the 50's, 60's, 70's and onwards.
in fact, there's fewer low skilled enforcer types in the league today than there ever has been in the modern decades.

and the skill level in hockey is higher than ever.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

Diablo said:


> That's absurd.
> hockey players were beating themselves bloody in the 50's, 60's, 70's and onwards.
> in fact, there's fewer low skilled enforcer types in the league today than there ever has been in the modern decades.
> 
> and the skill level in hockey is higher than ever.


Definitely old time hockey...
[video=youtube;BZnTwmabOxA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZnTwmabOxA[/video]
[video=youtube;7ke2CxedGKY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ke2CxedGKY[/video]


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## TA462 (Oct 30, 2012)

Steadfastly said:


> Almost to the point where real sport has been taken out of the game of sport.


Obviously you don't watch hockey or haven't watched it in decades.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

TA462 said:


> Obviously you don't watch hockey or haven't watched it in decades.


I only have watched where concussions have put people out of the game for weeks, months and sometimes for the rest of their careers, where goalies have been shown no respect and put out of the game with concussions and where the violence has gotten so bad, the NHL has implemented a safety department to look at all the violent plays to determine how much punishment they think the player should receive. 

I have also watched games where the holding, clutching, interference and tripping have crept back into the game, which ruins the skill level for the talented players. Those are the ones who can really play and the only way to stop them is by often doing something illegal.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

The mid seventies were pretty rough, remember these guys?

[video=youtube;fyk-SjoilwE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyk-SjoilwE[/video]


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> I only have watched where concussions have put people out of the game for weeks, months and sometimes for the rest of their careers, where goalies have been shown no respect and put out of the game with concussions and where the violence has gotten so bad, the NHL has implemented a safety department to look at all the violent plays to determine how much punishment they think the player should receive.
> 
> I have also watched games where the holding, clutching, interference and tripping have crept back into the game, which ruins the skill level for the talented players. Those are the ones who can really play and the only way to stop them is by often doing something illegal.


None of that is new.
concussions were always part of the game. They just weren't properly diagnosed, assessed or recorded.
players played through the pain.
improvements in medical care, and players rights have lead to taking injuries more seriously. As well as the much higher stakes involved (players worth millions of dollars).
tripping etc have always been part of the game. It doesn't take away from any of the skill. The skilled player then goes on a power play, often resulting in more scoring opportunities.

fact: it is much harder to defend against an offensive player these days (without drawing a penalty), as the refs and the rules are geared towards as little interference as possible for offensive players. The slightest hold of a player will result in a penalty. And an offensive player can pretty much camp out just above the crease with little that a defensemen can do to stop it-unlike the good ole days.
*if the game is worse today, it's for the opposite reason that you claim. There's too many petty penalties being called which kills the flow of the game*.

scoring is down today for 3 primary reasons: 
1)the skill of goalies has risen dramatically from the clumsy flopping oafs of yesteryear that had no technical ability.
2)3rd and 4th lines are significantly better today, and not just filled with thugs/scrubs, that can easily be dominated by another teams top line.
finally ,3) EVERY team short shifts.....30 second shifts, instead of the minute and a half shifts of the old days, which left exhausted players on the ice to make mistakes and get skated around often resulted in scoring chances.

you may have watched a few games, but respectfully, it's obviously not from the perspective of someone who has ever played the game in any sort of competitive situation.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

sulphur said:


> The mid seventies were pretty rough, remember these guys?
> 
> [video=youtube;fyk-SjoilwE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyk-SjoilwE[/video]


Add this one to the ones I posted and the many other videos online of tough hockey from the 50's, 60's & 70's and we have a good case.


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## ThatGingerMojo (Jul 30, 2014)

I can not believe how many people here are down on hockey. C'mon guys, Its Canada's true game (don't give me the lacrosse line here). Hockey is fun, its exciting, its fast, and its hilarious (cue the Leafs). I love hockey, I love hockey, I love hockey. Go Senators Go!!


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

ThatGingerMojo said:


> I can not believe how many people here are down on hockey. C'mon guys, Its Canada's true game (don't give me the lacrosse line here). Hockey is fun, its exciting, its fast, and its hilarious (cue the Leafs). I love hockey, I love hockey, I love hockey. Go Senators Go!!


I agree with most of that although the game is far from perfect and there's always room for improvement.
I also wouldn't think a team coached by a walrus would be in a position to laugh at the Leafs


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

ThatGingerMojo said:


> I can not believe how many people here are down on hockey. C'mon guys, Its Canada's true game (don't give me the lacrosse line here). Hockey is fun, its exciting, its fast, and its hilarious (cue the Leafs). I love hockey, I love hockey, I love hockey. Go Senators Go!!


You had to go & ruin the post right at the end?
:smile-new:


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## woodnoize (Jun 18, 2009)

its only been a week and so many great games! what's in store for this wknd? lookin fwd to the season!


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Diablo said:


> None of that is new.
> concussions were always part of the game. They just weren't properly diagnosed, assessed or recorded.
> players played through the pain.
> improvements in medical care, and players rights have lead to taking injuries more seriously. As well as the much higher stakes involved (players worth millions of dollars).
> ...


I'm sure you know Gretsky quit because his back was giving him more trouble than he could stand and Lemieux quit because of the slashing, hooking and other tactics that slowed him down and were not being called. 

If the game was called by the rules, and the violence was removed, it would be the great game it could be.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> I'm sure you know Gretsky quit because his back was giving him more trouble than he could stand and Lemieux quit because of the slashing, hooking and other tactics that slowed him down and were not being called.
> 
> If the game was called by the rules, and the violence was removed, it would be the great game it could be.


Who told you that was their reasons? Ive never read/heard/seen that anywhere.
Why do you make shit up?
The NHL has a long standing reputation for protecting its star players, even when theyre the ones committing sins.

Wayne Gretzky had an NHL career over 20 yrs and was nearly 40 when he retired. Do you think he should still be playing today?!
Throughout his career he also had enforcers (Semenko, McSorley etc) around him making sure no one took liberties on him.
Not to mention that he was a pretty slight guy. to look at him, you wouldn't think he was a professional athlete. Just an unassuming skinny guy. its a miracle he had a career in hockey at all.

Lemieux had health issues, but he was also a big guy that also played a physical game. He gave it as much as he took it. Here's a shocker for you, not every injury is the result of dirty contact with someone else. Athletes subject their bodies to some extreme forces. 
Oh and hmm.....do you think having gone through cancer near the end of his career might have something to do with retiring? esp considering the penguins had been unable to pay most of his salary for years? When some ppls net worths are in the 10's of millions of dollars, is it plausible that theyre thinking (or their wives are saying) "how much more do I/we need?" lets enjoy it. especially when in most cases their work required them to miss a lot of being part of their kids growing up.
Additionally, in his final years, Lemieux was both a player and an owner of the Penguins (due to the deferred salary before)...this was a conflict of interest within the NHL/NHLPA. You can bet there would have been pressure to pick a side.


if the game was so clean it had basically 0 physical contact ie no hooking /slashing, no one would watch. It would be less physical than what the girls play, or even the All-Star game, which most ppl agree, is not great in terms of hockey quality.

Steadly, I used to feel sorry for you when it seemed other members jumped all over you here, but I can see that you largely bring it on yourself by insisting on arguing about things you don't fully understand.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> Why do you make shit up?


It's what he's all about - being a 'know nothing know-it-all' and it is at the crux of why he and I have had such a "do not get along" past on this forum. It all started with a lie that he made up and then would not admit to. He's essentially pretending on the internet. 

Back to the hockey stuff...Gretzky planned to retire in '99. Not many thought it a coincidence. Lemieux had already shown that he was superman but that is very hard on the body and after all of those years and coming back from Non Hodgkins & all of the other injuries, retirement was right for him at the time. I always thought that Lemieux should have just pounded a few guys and then they wouldn't have taken so many liberties.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

On another note...anyone notice that the N.Y. Islanders have quietly put together a solid team? The proof is a couple of months away but their roster is looking far better than it has in many, many years and with Tavares out much of last season I think he is really wanting to prove something this season. I am not saying 'contender' or anything but solid for sure.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Diablo said:


> Who told you that was their reasons? Ive never read/heard/seen that anywhere.


Sports commentators who have interviewed them and have known them for years. You can believe me or not. It will not matter to me, one way or the other. Regards, Steadfastly


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Steadfastly said:


> Sports commentators who have interviewed them and have known them for years. You can believe me or not. It will not matter to me, one way or the other. Regards, Steadfastly


That's good for a *thumbs down* from me. Make something up, then say it's fact and then bow out. Wicked M.O.



Wayne Gretzky: *“But I knew it was time to retire when I was playing my last year and people I was playing against, before they would hit me, they would scream my name and I remember thinking, ‘Wow something’s not right about this.'”

*and Mario was diagnosed with an irregular heartbeat*
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/mario-lemieux-retires-from-hockey-1.618542

*but why would we want to let the facts get int he way when we have Steadfastly?I hope he cleans windows at a higher level than his social skills...though he can insert a smiley face with a dumb joke like no other.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

Steadfastly said:


> Sports commentators who have interviewed them and have known them for years. You can believe me or not. It will not matter to me, one way or the other. Regards, Steadfastly


Then you should have no trouble providing a source for all these comments/interviews.
I'll anxiously await.  Im certainly not going to go looking for them any more than Im going to go looking for the Loch Ness monster or Bigfoot ie other things we know don't exist.
Seriously dude, you have to learn when you've gotten in over your head, and bow out rather than dig in even deeper.

Smorg, perhaps in one of your links, Mario was mistranslated. "irregular heartbeat" in French, may sound a lot like "damn sick of being hooked all the time, instead of being allowed to score as many goals as I please!". im sure its an easy and common mistake to make  (I saved you from having to write that, Steadly).


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> On another note...anyone notice that the N.Y. Islanders have quietly put together a solid team? The proof is a couple of months away but their roster is looking far better than it has in many, many years and with Tavares out much of last season I think he is really wanting to prove something this season. I am not saying 'contender' or anything but solid for sure.


Ya, it's one of the perks of tanking- high draft picks.
if the Oilers were smart they could turn things around as well. But it would require them to be honest with themselves that their chemistry is bad and they are missing some very key pieces- which could be obtained by trading some of those key picks and getting some more mature acquisitions.


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## TA462 (Oct 30, 2012)

I agree that if the NHL turned into something like the ALL STAR game then NOBODY would watch. Hockey fans want to see end to end rushes, sweet goals, a open ice body check and yes, a good fight. Anyone remember Crosby and Giroux a few years ago in the playoffs? Great little scrap and these guts are the stars of their teams.


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

Diablo said:


> Ya, it's one of the perks of tanking- high draft picks.
> if the Oilers were smart they could turn things around as well. But it would require them to be honest with themselves that their chemistry is bad and they are missing some very key pieces- which could be obtained by trading some of those key picks and getting some more mature acquisitions.


You're right...I've watched all 5 games so far (worst start in franchise history, thank you very much) and we really have no chemistry. There's no anticipation of what the other guy will do with the puck, or that he'll hit me with a pass if I make *this* move. Lots of pucks in skates, icings on missed outlets. Too many opponents left open for easy scoring chances because 'the other guy was going to cover him'. I'm just about done watching, I've been a faithful watcher for most of the past 8 years of futility but I think the growing revolt of the fanbase has caught me too.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

keto said:


> You're right...I've watched all 5 games so far (worst start in franchise history, thank you very much) and we really have no chemistry. There's no anticipation of what the other guy will do with the puck, or that he'll hit me with a pass if I make *this* move. Lots of pucks in skates, icings on missed outlets. Too many opponents left open for easy scoring chances because 'the other guy was going to cover him'. I'm just about done watching, I've been a faithful watcher for most of the past 8 years of futility but I think the growing revolt of the fanbase has caught me too.


Ya, someone in upper management has to wake up and admit, that although it hurts to move some of this future talent and potential stars, you can only sit on the bottom for so long. And the market value for these kids will be high. So they will be able to get back some really good value.
heck, even Boston was smart enough to move a couple of their big draft picks ie Kessel and seguin, and it only improved them.
status quo for Edmonton shouldn't be an option.
edms goaltending is spotty as well, if nothing else they should be talking to Brodeur for his services this season. Should be quite affordable- and won't cost any young talent in trade.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> heck, even Boston was smart enough to move a couple of their big draft picks ie Kessel and seguin, and it only improved them.


I get what you are saying but I disagree on the Seguin deal.
Kessel? Yeah.
Thomas? Yeah.
Even Thorton gets a 'yeah' but I think Seguin was a loss. They got a good player but look at what Boston needs : goals. To me Seguin would be delivering more of those than Loui E. I have to think that given some more ice time Seguin would have been scoring a lot for Boston.

The main point though, is yes...Edmonton should round out their roster instead of having a bunch of highly touted finesse young players.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> I get what you are saying but I disagree on the Seguin deal.
> Kessel? Yeah.
> Thomas? Yeah.
> Even Thorton gets a 'yeah' but I think Seguin was a loss. They got a good player but look at what Boston needs : goals. To me Seguin would be delivering more of those than Loui E. I have to think that given some more ice time Seguin would have been scoring a lot for Boston.
> ...


Seguin illustrates the other side of professional sports. personalities.
yes he is a talented player with potential, but he didn't seem to fit in, and they didn't know how to use him. And sometimes coaches just have a hate on for a certain player (Carlyle: Kadri, Macarthur, Reimer).
It happens a lot.
JVR was underwhelming in Philly also. he comes to TO, makes some new friends, and now hes a big dog.
Macarthur goes to Ott and gets reinvigorated.
If a coach doesn't know how/want to work with/develop a certain player, you may as well move him and get something else in value.

Boston also maybe didn't expect their goals to dry up the way they did. Im sure Iginla threw them for a loop. They have a bigger issue than just goals though. They think theyre still bad and tough...and no one else does. Time for a big shakeup.


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## doriangrey (Mar 29, 2011)

I love watching GOOD hockey games but there are some real stinker games too...way too many 1 - 0 and 2 -1 games these days...what is this - soccer? and the shootout is a ridiculous solution... The goalies are better but their equipment has gotten so big - they should make the nets a little bigger to compensate for the growth in size of the goalie equipment. I do love the game and I've been watching it for pretty much all my 40 + years but there are some aspects of the game that frustrate me...in some ways it's gotten better and in some ways it has deteriorated...


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

doriangrey said:


> I love watching GOOD hockey games but there are some real stinker games too...way too many 1 - 0 and 2 -1 games these days...what is this - soccer? and the shootout is a ridiculous solution... The goalies are better but their equipment has gotten so big - they should make the nets a little bigger to compensate for the growth in size of the goalie equipment. I do love the game and I've been watching it for pretty much all my 40 + years but there are some aspects of the game that frustrate me...in some ways it's gotten better and in some ways it has deteriorated...


I think its more than the equipment really. Goalies themselves are soo much bigger than they were in the 70s and earlier ( and gasp! they actually workout in gyms, lol)
Other than Ken Dryden, the vast majority were under 6ft.
Today, goalies like 6ft 3+ like Luongo, Price, Gustavsson, Bishop, etc are the norm. Its pretty hard to find a goalie under 6ft in the NHl today. That's the way they draft them.
Granted there have been some "cheaters" in terms of oversized equipment, but considering how much harder players shoot the puck today vs 30+yrs ago, I think extra bulky protection is understandable and necessary.
If you want to shrink goalie equipment to 70s era sizing, make the players go back to wood sticks with no curve on them as well.

And I don't think enough can be said about the improvements in technique since, say Patrick Roy... watching disco era goaltending is pretty painful and embarrassing now. In that respect, it was a lot like soccer then as well.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> but considering how much harder players shoot the puck today vs 30+yrs ago, I think extra bulky protection is understandable and necessary.


Make it as thick as they want...just not so WIDE. Al MacInnis shot the puck as hard with a wooden stick as anyone with their new space age stick.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> Make it as thick as they want...just not so WIDE. Al MacInnis shot the puck as hard with a wooden stick as anyone with their new space age stick.


humans are round, not flat...if you beef up padding, its going to go all around the body, not just the front.
Besides, goalies sides need protection too, they aren't just cardboard cutouts. If you've never played goal, youd be surprised at how adept those dirty little pucks are at finding exposed areas and leaving huge welts. Once one found a gap between my pants and pads ie the top of my kneecap, that ppl in the seats describes as "sounding like a golf ball hitting a tree". I could barely walk on that leg for 3 weeks.
The pads, trappers and blockers have already been addressed and made smaller. for the most part, goalies have been accepting as it, as the smaller equipment has increased their mobility. I just don't think theres much more that can be done.


theres a reason not a SINGLE player uses a wooden stick today.
if the performance was anywhere near what the composite provides, you can bet some would....it would likely result in an INCREASE in goals, since composite sticks seem to explode at inopportune times far more than wooden ones ever did.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> theres a reason not a SINGLE player uses a wooden stick today.
> if the performance was anywhere near what the composite provides, you can bet some would....it would likely result in an INCREASE in goals, since composite sticks seem to explode at inopportune times far more than wooden ones ever did.


No argument there...they do everything a wooden stick does at a fraction of the weight. They don't make people shoot harder - but you said "If you want to shrink goalie equipment to 70s era sizing, make the players go back to wood sticks".
I don't see the connection. Bobby Hull was shooting bullets at guys with plastic plates on their faces and tiny thin gear...the guys now shoot 1 mile per hour faster and the goalies need to look like the Pillsbury Doughboy? No way. If they are going to keep the gear that size then F it - make the nets bigger by the same increment that the gear increased in size.


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> No argument there...they do everything a wooden stick does at a fraction of the weight. They don't make people shoot harder - but you said "If you want to shrink goalie equipment to 70s era sizing, make the players go back to wood sticks".
> I don't see the connection. Bobby Hull was shooting bullets at guys with plastic plates on their faces and tiny thin gear...the guys now shoot 1 mile per hour faster and the goalies need to look like the Pillsbury Doughboy? No way. If they are going to keep the gear that size then F it - make the nets bigger by the same increment that the gear increased in size.


I don't know exactly how hard Bobby shot the puck, but I doubt it was only 1 mph slower than Shea Weber. But id be interested if you can find the data. My hunch is, the average shot taken in the old days was a lot weaker than those today.
besides the "it was good enough then, so it should be today as well" doesn't really hold up. if things can be improved upon, then why shouldn't they? Again, we can dissect just about every piece of equipment players use today and revert back to the old days. unlike, say baseball, really nothing has stayed the same in hockey over the years. it shouldn't just be about goalies. Players shin pads today are almost as big as goalie pads were 40yrs ago. Shoulder and elbow pads that are practically weapons unto themselves. and so on. Maybe if they had smaller gear, they wouldn't be so apt to block shots and scoring would increase 

I think the need to increase goals is a red herring. I don't think more goals makes the game more interesting at all....more _scoring chances_ sure would though. But to see the red light go off more, meh....doesn't do it for me. Lacrosse or basketball already offer that, and I don't think either is a superior game (not to mention the size of the goalies in lacrosse!). But IMO, seeing a low scoring game, but with 2 goalies putting on a clinic ie 40+ saves, that's exciting entertainment.


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Diablo said:


> Once one found a gap between my pants and pads ie the top of my kneecap, that ppl in the seats describes as "sounding like a golf ball hitting a tree".


I can relate. The times the puck found that area on me didn't quite do that much damage to me but it was one of the most painful stops I've made as a goalie. I also played before the throat protector and got a slapshot in the throat during practice one day. I broke the Guiness book or world records in pulling off my masking and flopping on the ice trying to get my breath.


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> besides the "it was good enough then, so it should be today as well" doesn't really hold up.


I am not saying that it does or should.



Diablo said:


> if things can be improved upon, then why shouldn't they?


Improved is fine, but bigger isn't always better. Improve the protection as much as they want - less injuries the better but the huge gear has been bad for the game IMO.









That gear is huge!!

Bobby Hull had a reported slap shot of over 110 miles per hour. Technology wasn't like it is today so, what is the margin for error? I don't know. They measured it at 118.3 so, if the error was 10% it was still 107 miles per hour. His stick was 7 oz heavier than the weight of today's sticks.

Bobby on the farm:









- - - Updated - - -



Steadfastly said:


> I also played before the throat protector and got a slapshot in the throat during practice one day.


I actually leaped from my chair and screamed "YEEEEAAAAHH!!!"


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> I am not saying that it does or should.
> 
> 
> Improved is fine, but bigger isn't always better. Improve the protection as much as they want - less injuries the better but the huge gear has been bad for the game IMO.
> ...


Re: Lu's pads, yes, those are huge...congrats on finding a pic taken prior to the size reduction mandate. 
for comparison, something more recent:









I don't see the problem. Even more recently, Tim Thomas' gear, while highly questionable in taste, looks very proportional.










So I think this goalie equipment size discussion is about as timely as Nickelback hating lol.


Now, tell me how you justify this guys shin pads? Calves like Schwarzenegger?


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## smorgdonkey (Jun 23, 2008)

Diablo said:


> Tim Thomas' gear, while highly questionable in taste, looks very proportional.


It does. Let's see what he wears when/if he plays this year...if he'll get them to match the team or if he suspects they'll ship him so leave them red!

That pic does show a MONSTER catch glove though...let's just put a hoola-hoop on my hand and cover it with fish net.



Diablo said:


> Now, tell me how you justify this guys shin pads? Calves like Schwarzenegger?


Uh...'hugnasticifying'?


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## Diablo (Dec 20, 2007)

smorgdonkey said:


> It does. Let's see what he wears when/if he plays this year...if he'll get them to match the team or if he suspects they'll ship him so leave them red!
> 
> That pic does show a MONSTER catch glove though...let's just put a hoola-hoop on my hand and cover it with fish net.
> 
> ...


lol...I don't think the glove is that big really.Theyre always going to be a little bigger than a 1st basemans mitt. They did shrink those at the same time they shrunk the pads actually. Although pads can vary in height somewhat relative to the goalies height (the width can be no more than 11"), blockers and trappers follow a set "NHL regulations" size. Again, most goalies after playing with both the old and new equipment accept the tradeoff of a little more coverage for a little more speed. Goaltending evolves as well. Todays goalie is a mix of the somewhat passive "butterfly blockers" of 10-15yrs ago and the "reaction" goalies of the old times, so sheer bulk isn't as critical as it used to be.

For anyone who cares, the NHL equipment regulations are outlined here (and they are enforced by inspections):
http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=26287


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Pittsburgh, Tampa Bay and Montreal are all tied for first in the Eastern Conference. The goals for/against are very interesting since as of today, Pittsburgh is +28 (and played the least amount of games), Tampa Bay is +16 and Montreal (who've played two more games than Pittsburgh) is -5. 

With those numbers, it means Montreal is not scoring many goals. Do you think it is Carey price that is keeping Montreal near the top?


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