# Old acoustic - Top caved in



## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

This guitar got dropped off today. It's well worn and not well maintained, but it's the owner's left nut and he can't be without it. Old & dry, the front brace let go and top gave away.








In spite of the name on the headstock, it's not worth millions to anyone except to the owner/player.








It's a 1973 Gibson C-0 or C-1 Classical. The model number on the ID tag has gone away. 








It's really not as bad as it looks. Just by taking the strings off it, everything almost went back where it belongs. The old girl has had a hard life, but at least she got played.
The good thing is that all the cracks are right around the sound hole area so they are easy to reach & clamp.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

The finger board is really special, does anybody know what kind of wood this is?


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## ga20t (Jul 22, 2010)

You've definitely got some work ahead of you there. Haven't seen one of those Gibson classicals before.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

ga20t said:


> You've definitely got some work ahead of you there. Haven't seen one of those Gibson classicals before.


This is the only one I've ever seen. It's always sounded great too, the guy has had it as long as I can remember.


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## Blind Dog (Mar 4, 2016)

Lincoln said:


> The finger board is really special, does anybody know what kind of wood this is?


Brazilian rosewood imo.


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Almost anything made of wood can be fixed, lucky for those of us who like...ahem...wood ;-)

Cool guitar. Gibson has made some interesting stuff.


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## alwaysflat (Feb 14, 2016)

I had a guitar in similar condition, watch for the neck block to be loose from the body. I was forced to remove the back to repair the neck block whose glue gave way over the years, could well be the same conditions that caused the bracing to give way.
Used to have an inexpensive Sony camera was great for photo'ing inside guitars + macro, sadly, like all things, it went south a while back. A great tool for investigative work.


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## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

Geee ! Yeah ! It has really been played !
Look at the frets !!! Always played with nylon strings on ?


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

alwaysflat said:


> I had a guitar in similar condition, watch for the neck block to be loose from the body. I was forced to remove the back to repair the neck block whose glue gave way over the years, could well be the same conditions that caused the bracing to give way.
> Used to have an inexpensive Sony camera was great for photo'ing inside guitars + macro, sadly, like all things, it went south a while back. A great tool for investigative work.


I've got a plumbing inspection camera I use and I've checked out the neck block and all the braces. Block and tail peice seem sound. The sides are in good shape. There are several cracks in the top, I'm going to start on the bass side and work my way over, cleating as I go. Way less bracing on the top of this guitar than normal.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

mawmow said:


> Geee ! Yeah ! It has really been played !
> Look at the frets !!! Always played with nylon strings on ?


Every time I ever saw the guitar it had nylon strings on it. I didn't think nylon could wear frets, but looks like I'm wrong on that one. Its going to need the first 6 frets replaced. I haven't measured them yet, but they are wide and low. Hopefully somebody is still making them.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Here's what she's looking like now. Everything is back in place, the brace is re-glued, I glued some cracks, starting on the far edge of the bass side. There were 4 un-repaired cracks on that side. 








Next crack I do is the one close to the neck on the low E side. Then the three on the other side of the neck. The far one is long.........real long.
That crack running down the center of the top has been repaired at sometime in the past but was never cleated. I may do something with that later. 
Not sure what to do with that area below the sound hole with all the strum-wear. There's a lot of wood missing. I might clean it up and put some lacquer over it to protect it.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Say good bye to the last crack on the bass side of the neck.








two cleats on this one, it was a gooder.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Lincoln said:


> two cleats on this one, it was a gooder.


Following this thread with interest and admiration. Congrats!
This type of work requires skill, knowledge and a LOT of patience.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

greco said:


> Following this thread with interest and admiration. Congrats!
> This type of work requires skill, knowledge and a LOT of patience.


Well Dave, Word is getting out that I'm off work for a while, so friends are sending/bringing me their guitars all of a sudden. I guess they figure there's a chance they'll get them back in less than 9 years (my normal turn-around time). B#(*
No real skill, just patience and a love of wood. 

I want so badly to sand this top and re-spray it. It would make those cracks vanish.....but I don't want to risk losing any mojo.


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## SaucyJack (Mar 8, 2017)

Handy dandy work!


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Lincoln said:


> No real skill....














Lincoln said:


> I want so badly to sand this top and re-spray it. It would make those cracks vanish.....but I don't want to risk losing any mojo.


I was thinking the same ...but I totally get not wanting to risk anything...especially sacred mojo and/or the aesthetic of time and use.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

I've decided to fix this crack in the center before moving on to the treble side. Two braces here running straight across from side to side. Top dried out, pulled away from them and cracked. 








I'm going to re-glue the top to the braces, and then work glue into the crack before clamping.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

when I got the light and mirror inside to start working on the center crack, I noticed the brace just behind the sound hole was split from about half way to the side of the body on the bass side.
Glued that up too at the same time and clamped them both.








Wood heating is hard on guitars.


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## LanceT (Mar 7, 2014)

Curious on any tonal differences from pre repair to post repair.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

LanceT said:


> Curious on any tonal differences from pre repair to post repair.


well, the guitar was totally unplayable when I got it, so I have nothing to judge by. I'll do my best to put it back in playable condition without doing anything stupid that might affect the tone. That's why I don't want to spray a bunch of lacquer on it. There were so many cracks in the top, it felt mushy. With the top repaired and acting as one piece of wood again, the guitar has got to sound better than it has in a long time, "In my opinion".

The owner has 4 or 5 guitars. This is the only one that "looks" this way, because this is the only one that gets played. It's special. It means a lot to him, and that means a lot to me. He will have to be the judge on the post repair tone. I'll keep you posted.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Today's glue up








The rear clamp is on a brace that was split at the end. The front clamp is holding the first cleat on the big crack.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

I strung it up today. Sound is really good, it's a very loud guitar with loads of resonance.

I think I might go shopping for classical guitar........I'm digging the sound and the flat finger board doesn't bother me like I thought it would.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

That fretboard is wild, as is this story. I'm glad you are reviving this instrument!

Reminds me of Trigger.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Budda said:


> That fretboard is wild, as is this story. I'm glad you are reviving this instrument!
> 
> Reminds me of Trigger.


That was my first thought when I saw it too! Trigger II

That was by far the worst condition I've ever seen a guitar in.


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

Pardon my ignorance but what is a 'cleat' in this particular application?


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## Swervin55 (Oct 30, 2009)

Very nice work Dave! Your friend should be very appreciative of your time and effort because I know you just can't charge for this kind of stuff.


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## ga20t (Jul 22, 2010)

allthumbs56 said:


> Pardon my ignorance but what is a 'cleat' in this particular application?


Commonly a small diamond shaped wood patch that spans the crack being repaired to reinforce it, internally. Grain orientation of the patch is perpendicular to the grain of the crack to add strength in the direction needed and prevent splitting. If you simply glue a crack with no cleats on the inside to reinforce it, the repair is likely to fail and/or the crack likely to grow.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Swervin55 said:


> Very nice work Dave! Your friend should be very appreciative of your time and effort because I know you just can't charge for this kind of stuff.


Thank you  and you got that right. Friends don't charge friends for fixing their guitars.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

allthumbs56 said:


> Pardon my ignorance but what is a 'cleat' in this particular application?


@ga20t is right on the money. A cleat is a little patch of wood, glued across a crack on the underside of a guitar top/side/back. The most important thing is to get the grain of the cleat running across the crack, not with the crack.
For this job, I cut up a miss-matched sitka spruce guitar top blank. It was very fine grain, lot of strength there. You want to match your cleats as close as you can to the type of wood the guitar you're fixing is made of.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

I thought I put this picture up already, but I don't see it anymore. Did we have another roll-back?


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

I stumbled onto this today. Recognize this guitar? 

Mickey Maione | Steamboat Mtn Music Fest 2015


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