# How much does this damage affect value?



## capnjim (Aug 19, 2011)

Hi guys, so I am looking at getting back into the acoustic guitar.
I love vintage and want something smaller than a dreadnought.
There is a 1960 Martin 000-18 for sale, but it has two major breaks, not really cracks.
How much does it affect the value?
Thanks


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

It looks like it was dropped pretty hard from pic #2. Is there any internal structural damage from the drop? I would definitely check that. As for affecting the value, I couldn't say but you might check Reverb for that model and see if you can come up with anything close. If you are a member of AGF, there are lots of acoustic experts there that could give you an idea.


----------



## capnjim (Aug 19, 2011)

I did post there, but you can't upload pics directly, so I posted here with a link so they could see the damage.
The seller is very reasonable. The last two on Reverb sold for 2000 and 2500$. I will be getting this for around 1500$. I just don't know much about acoustics and how much a repair like that will affect the value.
Is it equal to and electric with a re-fin or headstock break? Or maybe not so much.
Cheers


----------



## Guest (May 29, 2018)

capnjim said:


> I did post there, but you can't upload pics directly, so I posted here with a link so they could see the damage.
> The seller is very reasonable. The last two on Reverb sold for 2000 and 2500$. I will be getting this for around 1500$. I just don't know much about acoustics and how much a repair like that will affect the value.
> Is it equal to and electric with a re-fin or headstock break? Or maybe not so much.
> Cheers


I would check with a luthier how much it would cost to repair the damage. I would not pay very much for it. $900?


----------



## rollingdam (May 11, 2006)

I love old Martins,however I would pass on this one


----------



## mawmow (Nov 14, 2017)

I fear the trauma caused other hidden structural damages.
How are neck, action and frets ?
I would not buy this one without an expert luthier inspection and advice.


----------



## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Everything made of wood can be fixed. Side and back damage like that isn't that hard to repair. If the price reflected an adjustment based on repair requirements and cost, I wouldn't hesitate to make the purchase. But that's me, ymmv.


----------



## ronmac (Sep 22, 2006)

I would get a repair estimate and offer the going price for an instrument of that vintage minus 2x the repair cost.


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

capnjim said:


> I did post there, but you can't upload pics directly, so I posted here with a link so they could see the damage.
> The seller is very reasonable. The last two on Reverb sold for 2000 and 2500$. I will be getting this for around 1500$. I just don't know much about acoustics and how much a repair like that will affect the value.
> Is it equal to an electric with a re-fin or headstock break? Or maybe not so much.
> Cheers


As to being equal to an electric guitar, it's hard to say because each repair can be so different and take more time and also depends on how pristine someone wants it to look after the repail. 

I agree with this post from AGF.

*"I wouldn't buy a guitar with that kind of damage, there are far too many guitars without that kind of damage for sale."*

For the $1500.00 you are speaking of, you can get a pretty nice acoustic, even a very nice acoustic. Take a look at the Alvarez Masterworks, Eastman and the Yamaha. Those are all in that range for new ones and you'll end up with an excellent guitar. Just my 2 cents. In the upper echelon of pricing, Ibanez and Washburn have stepped up their offerings as well and getting praise for those models. 

For a few hundred more you should be able to find one of those Martins in good to excellent condition. Happy hunting!


----------



## Intrepid (Oct 9, 2008)

Not an expensive fix at all. BUT, such damage would cause me to determine if there are other issues such as does it need the neck reset, does it have original bridge and bridgeplate? Original nut, tuners, loose braces. If the guitar is all original and those 2 dings are the only problem with it, I would scoop it ASAP. Regular value depending on condition? $2500-$4000.00 all day long.


----------



## NashvilleDeluxe (Feb 7, 2018)

I would pass on that one. 
In addition to the "trauma," it looks pretty beat up. I know it's almost 60 years old, but some people take care of their things, and others don't. My HD 28 is almost 30 years old, and if I dropped it, it would be fixed promptly. In other words, the damage may have been accidental, but the neglect afterwards was on purpose. 
If it's really a good deal, the owner should put the money into it and try to sell at a higher price. This might be a good purchase for someone really knowledgeable, or an experienced luthier.
Caveat emptor.


----------



## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

I'm not into vintage or Martins, but here are my thoughts. If you buy it for $1500, and then it costs you X amount to repair it....say $500 just for an easy number, you are at the $2000 mark. That's if it costs $500 to fix not only the most obvious problems, but any side effects like a ruined neck, bent truss, fret work internal damage....etc. Are there other Martins of that vintage in much better condition for around the $2000 - $2500 mark with possibly only very minor adjustments to be made...such as a good setup and a fret dressing? I'd think it's a good idea to maybe weighing out the benefits of getting a good used one vs something that could cost a hell of a lot to fix by the right person for the right amount of expense for both the fix and your time to do it. Seems like the guy doesn't want to pay the price of getting it fixed himself. That could mean a number of things, including the price of the ACTUAL fix.

I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot guitar pick myself. Any more pics?


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

It is a Martin and will always be worth something. 

I paid a bit more than that for my 14 year newer D18S. The body is in great shape, lots of lacquering checking on the top (nothing wrong with that, IMO), plays well and sounds great. It will need a neck reset in the next few years. One of the tuners may need some work. Even if that runs me another $1k, I'm still into a nice older (not really vintage) somewhat rare Martin for what I think is a great price. And it will always be a Martin, much more desirable than any of those Asian guitars mentioned a few posts up.

Sometimes yous takes yer chances and get burned. But sometimes it works out and you get something special that gives you joy and some stories to tell down the road. Getting a good one certainly eases the tension (for more money, maybe lots more) but going the other way can be fun, too.


----------



## Guest (May 30, 2018)

A well preserved old Martin should increase in value as time goes on. A smashed up repaired one might not. Also the damage and subsequent repairs may affect the tone negatively.


----------



## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

I like it. If the neck and top checks out fine, and you don't intend to make a profit it should be a nice player.


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Jim: I am on my way to Ontario on Saturday and on my way back the following Friday.. Could you have this ready for me to play by then on my way through your area?

Please post some pics for us when you get it repaired. 

If your repair guy does a good job, I think you got a great guitar at a very decent price. I would like to compare my MD60 Alvarez with your D18 if there ever was that possibility. They are both mahogany back and sides.


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Steadfastly said:


> I would like to compare my MD60 Alvarez with your D18 if there ever was that possibility. They are both mahogany back and sides.


basically the same guitar


----------



## capnjim (Aug 19, 2011)

I have not heard back from the guy. Maybe he changed his mind. Its an 000-18, not a D-18. Its also supposed to be the last generation of Martins that were still made in the traditional way, with hide glue.


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

capnjim said:


> I have not heard back from the guy. Maybe he changed his mind. *Its an 000-18, not a D-18.* Its also supposed to be the last generation of Martins that were still made in the traditional way, with hide glue.


Right. I forgot that. I hope you end up getting it.


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

vadsy said:


> basically the same guitar


You can just put the Alverez through an mfx and it will sound like a Martin. Or a Ryan. Or a Lowden. Or a Dean Warlock. Or a 327 4 bbl with a pair of glasspacks. Or a crow. It's all about those amazing $300 pedals, dontcha know.


----------



## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)




----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Dorian2 said:


>


An honest review but he left out a lot of information. Which model Martin was that? I think he is telling us in the very beginning but only the end of the model number is mentioned. I think it is a DX1RAE or similar model with HPL back and sides and I think they sound great. He doesn't seem to know the new Martins have gone to the wider neck like the Alvarez. It does show how a little wider or narrower can make a big difference depending on your hand/finger size and what you are used to. The AD610 Alvarez has a Sitka spruce top with laminate mahogany back and sides.


----------



## HighNoon (Nov 29, 2016)

The damage in those pictures doesn't look that bad. If you play it and it sounds good, start from there. How much saddle left....how are the frets....original tuners...what shape is the board in....has the bridge been shaved down......any bow in the neck.....does it need a reset. I love vintage acoustics.....old wood is good wood, and most issues can be fixed. And always be prepared for surprises.....and of course the lovely smell of cooked hide glue.


----------



## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Quite possibly a BRW fretboard and bridge, as well.


----------

