# Advice on new Amp



## jfk911 (May 23, 2008)

Hi, im new to the forum My name is Justin and im from Ottawa. Anyways im looking at getting myself a new amp in the future. I want a tube amp preferably A/B, also above 50 watts 40 can do. Might consider going with a half stack but would much prefer a combo as its easier to lug around. Ive Been looking at the Mesa Boogie Dual rectifier Roadster (100w), The Orange rockerverb (50w), maybe the line 6 Spider valve(40w). I would like some other suggestions ive been looking at others but havnt been to impressed yet. I play mostly hard rock /metal. My main goal in the amp is to get nice cleans. Im using the Pod xt live as my pedal so distortion isnt as much of a huge factor. My guitar is an Schecter S1 elite. Budget is preferably under 3,000. Also for you tube owners will i tell much of a difference between a 50 watt and a 100 watt volume wise? I will be using this at home for shows and at church


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## SinCron (Mar 2, 2006)

The difference between 50 and 100 watts is 3 dB but you have more headroom with 100 watts. If you're going to use your POD for your distortion, why even bother with those amps and just get a tube power amp like a Peavey Classic 50/50?


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## jfk911 (May 23, 2008)

i was thinking about going that route, but the power amps i was looking at where the mesa's and the price for buying the power amp and either a 2 x 12 cab or a 4 x 12 cab would be close to the same price and then i would have to keep on using my pod where if i buy an amp i have the option to ditch the pod. or i buy a separate pre amp once i ditch my pod. but id rather stick to a combo amp.


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## starjag (Jan 30, 2008)

With a budget of $3K you can get a really nice all tube amp, with 2-3 or even 4 channels and ditch the POD's distortion. Move the POD to the FX loop and simply use it for time-based effects (delay/echo, chorus). Nothing better than tubes for overdrive and distortion.

I do not like the Mesa Dual-Recto tone personally, but lots of people do including some friends that I often jam with, which you can get in a 1x12 and 2x12 combo format with 4 channels going from pristine clean to metal. The same with the Mesa Road King... add the delay/echo, chorus from your POD in the FX loop and you have a killer rig.

I do not suggest going from the POD straight into the PA's board. The tone of digital overdrive + digital cab simulation through very efficient speakers is be very far away from true tube/cab tone from a good amp.


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## jfk911 (May 23, 2008)

Thansk for all the replys. I was intending of using my pod through the fx loop now a second question i had was i went to Long and Mcquades and played around on the orange. I really like the cleans but unfortunately it dosnt have a gain all you can adjust is the treble and bass. Now if i run a boost pedal on the clean channel to give it some grit how would that sound? A second thing i found with the orange is the distortion dosn't quite go heavy enough for me but it is something i could live with if i buy the orange. I tried the line 6 again and still wanst that impressed with it. Still waiting to try the roadster seeing as long's didnt have it in. I may also try a vox but i doubt that will work for me. As for the sound i want for my electric would be along the lines of Haste the Day, Bullet for my valentine, Unearth. Also id want a sound with less gain kind of grungy alice in cahins, stp ,pearl jam like. Now im hoping i can get these sounds out of the mesa seeing as it has 4 channels. the only thing im worried about is the clean, im going to playa round with it when long;s gets it or ill go to steves.


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## SinCron (Mar 2, 2006)

Ooooo. You want an Atomic Reactor amp. I can't believe I forgot about it. They're tube combos made FOR digital modelers. A lot of people swear by them and they say they make them sound a lot more "alive". http://www.atomicamps.com/ . Check it out. They have an 18 watt 1X12, 50 watt 1X12 and a 50 watt 2X12 combo.


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## bagpipe (Sep 19, 2006)

They dont seem to get a lot of love on many forums but I've been pretty happy with my Marshall DSL50. I particularly like the Clean channel on this amp. We play a wide variety of covers with this band, and I get a great clean tone from the Marshall. 
I dont play any Metal so I cant really comment on that, but I get a great classic rock crunch and lead tone from the dirty channel.


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## Hamm Guitars (Jan 12, 2007)

Try a Vox AC30. You can use your POD/Outboard gear to get your Metal sound and the cleans from the amp are really sweet. You don't have to even think about spending three grand on an amp. IMO, the AC30 is the best sounding guitar amp ever made.


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## dan_ (Feb 5, 2008)

Hamm Guitars said:


> Try a Vox AC30. You can use your POD/Outboard gear to get your Metal sound and the cleans from the amp are really sweet. You don't have to even think about spending three grand on an amp. IMO, the AC30 is the best sounding guitar amp ever made.


I'd second the AC30 recco, or maybe the Orange AD30 if you're into that kind of sound.


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## sliberty (May 17, 2008)

How do you define nice cleans? To some, it is the Fender Twin Reverb or Deluxe Reverb tone. To others, its a Vox chimey clean tone. And to still others it is a warm smooth jazz tone which frequently comes from a solid state amp. Decide on that, and you will be half way there.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

check out the traynor YCS100H.

whatever amp you get, you'll also want to boost it.

i think a halfstack will probably be overkill, man. other amps to look at (be prepared to see a trend lol):

mesa boogie DC-3
DC-5
F-30
Nomad
Rectoverb combo.

yes, those are all mesa's. could also look into an orange rockerverb 50 combo, but i dunno what kind of metal you plan on playing so i dunno how it'd handle that. rectoverb is probably your best bet, and will run under $1K on the used market (i believe they're discontinued).

you're gonna want to test out a lot of amps. and if you get a mesa, especially a recto - buy an attenuator. from what i've read from owners, they dont sound "mesa recto" good until you're pushing the power section. even at 50W, you're gonna be blowing windows w/o one lol.

also, for whatever amp you get - boost it. you want metal? boosting really helps. why, you ask? because it lets you run the gain lower, smoothens out the tone and tightens the low end. stock tubescreamers suck some low frequencies out of your sound - this is bad. with a good overdrive pedal boosting your amp, it really makes things scream and/or growl .

www.bodenhamer-electronics.com TS7ovChaos. 2 modes, clean boost w/ the drive on 0, only $85 shipped to your door. i own one, and i dont turn it off - i just have my neck volume at 3 for cleans. my gain is on 1.5 on my ultra channel of the jsx, and probably 5 (no gain knob) on the crunch. if you heard my amp, you wouldnt think so lol.


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## warplanegrey (Jan 3, 2007)

Shiva and a boost?


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## Alex (Feb 11, 2006)

I had a RV 50 head and they are great amps....the combo weighs in at 85 lbs. Another option is the Custom Audio Amplifier by Suhr and Bradshaw. I had the classic version which has less gain that the standard model but still lotsa gain on tap....best EL34 amp I've played. The standard model will do metal and has a GREAT clean sound (the RV 50 also has a great clean sound).

In the digital realm, check out the AXE FX....mind blowing unit...the line 6 stuff is quite good but does not come close to the AXE FX....good luck...


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## SinCron (Mar 2, 2006)

I still think the Atomic Reactor amp is the perfect way to go if you want a combo and you're keeping the POD. I've be wanting them to release a head version but the bastards never replied.


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## jfk911 (May 23, 2008)

so ive taken some of your guys advice, went trying out some amps the ac 30 as much as i like the clean its just not for me if and or i choose to get rid of my pod it just wont hack it for me. Now i played around with the spider valve 212 for about 45 min at the store and was quite impressed by it. Now i am currently running the spider 2 212 which dosnt have an fx loop, and neither does the Spider valve. Now will it be worth my money to buy an amp with a fx loop or will i not really notice a difference? I also have an old M80 chorus which has an fx loop but its a couple hours away and havnt been able to get a hold of it. Now the price difference between the spider valve and the other amps i have been looking at is 1500 give or take. what are your opinions?


edit

now if i get an amp with out an fx loop is it possible to wire in my own fx loop?


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## starjag (Jan 30, 2008)

The Spider Valve does not have an FX loop because Line6 wants you to use the included digital FXs and not outside pedals.

Lots of people play amps without an FX loop. Vintage amps did not have an FX loop, so you could consider this route the old fashion route.

Many newer amps will have an FX loop, some of them will have a line level loop, some others will have an instrument level loop. I understand that instrument level loops are preferred.

You could get a single channel amp with a great clean tone, without an FX loop, and use pedals or the POD for your effects.

You could also get a multi channel amp (clean, dirty, dirtier and beyond). In this case, if you want to use delay / echo effects with the dirty channel(s) of the amp, then an FX loop is recommended.

In the end, it all depends on what you are going after. I do not use effects, so for me an FX loop is not necessary. I do like a bit of reverb though, so I have a preference for amps that include a tube-driven reverb.

For many, a single channel amp that they can crank to the edge of overdrive and then get clean tones with the guitar's volume knob is tone heaven. Others prefer multi-channel amps to have very distinct clean and overdriven tones. For these people an FX loop might be necessary if they use delay / echo effects. And there is also pedal junkies that get everything from the pedals and their order in the chain and might only need a good clean channel. And, of course, there is also people that use everything in between.

Maybe I did not help at all with the stuff above :-(

Do you know what your guitar heroes play? Maybe understanding their rigs is a good place to start. Just do not follow their brands necessarily, but how the rigs are composed. That might give you a good sense of direction.


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## jfk911 (May 23, 2008)

i guess for my guitar heros i dont really have any per say, i really enjoy Alex lifeson, then again i love Brad Nowell, also Dallas Green w/alexisonfire. I want to create my own sound i guess. I use delays some times also i find the fx on the spider kinda cheesy which is why i would use the pod for fx but the amp modles most likly form the spider and maybe use some from the amp. unsure just looking at all my options. For my tones i want to possibly go from a john mayer clean to a jack johnson clean then some classic rock distortions then for my heavy stuff i want modern metal heavy leaning more towards a mesa heavy rather then a marshall heavy. Still unsure 100% what i want


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## starjag (Jan 30, 2008)

I often jam with a buddy that has a Mesa Dual Recto with four channels and more bells and whistles than Paris Hilton on prom night (this reference should imply lots of bells and whistles, although now that I am thinking about it, Paris Hilton might go naked to her prom night).

Anyways, he has two channels set for cleans and two channels with different overdrive settings. He can control pretty much everything from his pedalboard including the reverb and the FX loop. I do not like his amp, but he and many other owners do... and that is all that matters!

There are other brands with amps with four channels and plenty of bells and whistles. Alex Lifeson's Hughes & Kettner signature amp has six channels, but I think only three of them are footswitchable at any given time. I think that Long & McQuade is carrying Hughes & Kettner now.

If amps like these are within your budget, I would say get one and try it out. Long & McQuade has a 30-day return policy, so you have pretty much nothing to lose.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

if i had $1500 to blow, the ONLY line 6 stuff i'd even Consider would be the HD157 and the Vetta II. nothing else.

if you get somethign with a lot of tubes and a big speaker cabinet.. its not gonna be that light and all that easy to move around .

and you wont know what a mesa can do until you crank it up and hear that power section get working - the master on 3 is not that great an indication.

have you looked at traynors? peavey's? your budget also gets you into ENGL, Hughes and Kettner territory


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## ikkyu88 (Apr 15, 2008)

One amp that hasn't been mentioned yet and does get some really good tones is the Kustom tube amps. I have a 72 Coupe and it comes thru real well. Their cleans are great and they look really cool. Ever since they wooed James Brown over from Peavey, they've been putting out some nicer amps. 

http://www.kustom.com/player.aspx?MediaID=1112 

Another one that is good for cleans, but breaks up nicely is the "F" series from Mesa. They have been discontinued, but you can get them for a good price used. Actually, my L&M here in Winnipeg still had one the other day. I went for the F50 for a little more headroom while sticking with the 6L6 tubes. Even tho it is only 50 watts, its still loud. It's a Mesa. THe F30 uses an EL34 tube.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

i wouldnt get a kustom with that budget, and i've spent some quality time on the 36 coupe and a solid 20 minutes w/ the '72.

F-30's are apparently gorgeous, i really want to have a go on one.


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## Archer (Aug 29, 2006)

ikkyu88 said:


> One amp that hasn't been mentioned yet and does get some really good tones is the Kustom tube amps. I have a 72 Coupe and it comes thru real well. Their cleans are great and they look really cool. Ever since they wooed James Brown over from Peavey, they've been putting out some nicer amps.
> 
> http://www.kustom.com/player.aspx?MediaID=1112
> 
> Another one that is good for cleans, but breaks up nicely is the "F" series from Mesa. They have been discontinued, but you can get them for a good price used. Actually, my L&M here in Winnipeg still had one the other day. I went for the F50 for a little more headroom while sticking with the 6L6 tubes. Even tho it is only 50 watts, its still loud. It's a Mesa. THe F30 uses an EL34 tube.



The F-30 uses 2 EL84 tubes....how they get 30 watts out of that I have no idea but the amp uses 84's not 34's


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## Spikezone (Feb 2, 2006)

Here's my choice:








Traynor YCV50BLUE. Good dirt, good cleans, 50W, tubes, WAY LESS than 3G's.
-Mikey


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## BornUnderBadSign (Jun 10, 2008)

jfk911 said:


> Thansk for all the replys. I was intending of using my pod through the fx loop now a second question i had was i went to Long and Mcquades and played around on the orange. I really like the cleans but unfortunately it dosnt have a gain all you can adjust is the treble and bass. Now if i run a boost pedal on the clean channel to give it some grit how would that sound? A second thing i found with the orange is the distortion dosn't quite go heavy enough for me but it is something i could live with if i buy the orange. I tried the line 6 again and still wanst that impressed with it. Still waiting to try the roadster seeing as long's didnt have it in. I may also try a vox but i doubt that will work for me. As for the sound i want for my electric would be along the lines of Haste the Day, Bullet for my valentine, Unearth. Also id want a sound with less gain kind of grungy alice in cahins, stp ,pearl jam like. Now im hoping i can get these sounds out of the mesa seeing as it has 4 channels. the only thing im worried about is the clean, im going to playa round with it when long;s gets it or ill go to steves.


I find it funny that you really liked the Orange clean channel. Don't get me wrong... I'm an owner of a Rockerverb 50C and while I do enjoy the clean channel myself, it's not going to give you the sparkly John Mayer tone you're looking for... that's more of a Fender thing. The Orange is voiced to be a little darker/warmer... and as far as the issue with the [clean] EQ, the gain knob can be found on the dirty channel which does clean all the way through to some pretty hi-gain... and if it's not heavy enough for you, then perhaps Mesa is what you're looking for [perhaps???]. That being said, I can't comment on Mesa... I've never been a fan and I don't know a thing about them.

I'm not trying to push the Orange... $3000 is a lot of money and I would hate to have you end up with something you don't like... but please do me the favor of steering clear of any Line 6 nonsense. I've been there... it's fun to have all the effects, I know... but $3000 is a serious investment and ultimately, you should be able to end up with something that will give you a lifetime of enjoyment... please do not by a Line 6 anything.

Check out Fender, Vox, Mesa's... if the Rockerverb didn't do it for you the only other Orange product that might is the Thunderverb. But most of all... your ear is going to be a better judge than any opinion you will receive online so test everything out and pick what is right for you.


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## Steve P (May 9, 2007)

> Another one that is good for cleans, but breaks up nicely is the "F" series from Mesa. They have been discontinued, but you can get them for a good price used.


+1 -- really good advice here.

The F-series is very affordable and many are available on the second-hand market. It is a versatile amp that sounds great clean and balls-out distorted. 

You can't go wrong with a used F-series amp, especially if you aren't quite settled on exactly what you are looking for in a tube amp: if after a year or two of play you learn about a must-have $3,000 amp, you can sell the F30, get your investment back, and then settle on the amp you REALLY want after studying the market for a year or two. 

You can do an awful lot with a little F30 combo ...:food-smiley-004:


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## ikkyu88 (Apr 15, 2008)

Archer said:


> The F-30 uses 2 EL84 tubes....how they get 30 watts out of that I have no idea but the amp uses 84's not 34's


Yup, my bad on that one.... That's what happens when you get your 3's and 8's mixed up...


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