# Road bikes (of the cycling kind)



## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Since I started on road back way back later 80s, but gravitated to MTB in the early 90s, I've always had a soft spot for road in my heart. My first real road bike was a Pinarello Catena Lusso with Campy Chorus. I just can't see anybody out on a stretch of road on their road bike and not feel that urge. Well, recently I got the chance to give in to those urges come riding season 2021. Well, trainer season early winter 2021 to more precise. I made a trade and now have a 2012 Giant Defy 3 Composite and a 2013 Norco Valence C4. Both carbon road bikes and both equipped with Tiagra. Tiagra is not my group of choice, but hey, it's instant cycling just the same. They came with 3 pairs of shoes, but the men's are a size smaller than I wear and the ladies fit my fiance a little large. Also came with Look Keo Carbon and 3 sets of cleats. Okay, instant road bike heaven...........almost. Ordered a pair of new Garneau shoes in my size with Boa and one velcro strap, and source a used pair of Mavic Ksyrium Elite set up with tubeless Giant tires. I also purchase a pair of Conti GP5000 kevlar and a a pair of Conti race light tubes. In case tubeless doesn't do it for me on the road. 

I got a seriously killer trade deal on the bikes, otherwise the upgrades wouldn't have happened. It was just shit luck both bikes fit my body size. I am 5'6", but I have a 30" inseam. Norco is a 51 and the Giant is an xs. Norco is an endurance frame, so longer more stable wheel base. Giant is definitely more race than tour. Twitchy no doubt. Now I can't wait for the roads to dry and the street sweepers to clear some crap from the roads edge.

The pictures are as I got them. I did my fitting, then after the pictures, went about removing reflectors and doing the upgrades. eventually I will find 105 or DA rear derailleur and brifters at least for the Giant.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Nice bikes. I've got a carbon '19 Defy w/ 12sp Ultegra Di2. My dedicated trainer bike is a cervèlo soloist w/ 3x9 Ultegra. I've got a Trek Boone for cx/ gravel. I'm without an MTB at the moment. 

Make sure you double check the Shimano compatibility charts when you upgrade. Tiagra 10sp is mostly not compatible with other Shimano 10sp. There are other quirks with different der. cage lengths being compatible w/ certain gearing combinations. 

I've not ridden your generation bikes, but now the Defy is the Giant endurance fit bike, the TCR is the lightweight race bike, (twitchy or responsive, depending if you hate it or like it), and the Propel is the aero bike. Fast, but heavier than the TCR. The best part about newer endurance fit road bikes is the ability to put 32 or 35 mm tires on the bike. Marginally slower, but waaaaay more comfortable. 

I really like tubeless, but it can be finicky. Inflate tires before each and every ride. I have the best luck when all of the tubeless bits are from the same mfg. My giant wheels have giant tape, valvestems, tires and sealant. My bontrager wheels have all bontrager bits. The newest Giant cadex wheels and tires will hold air without sealant. Tubeless has come a long way. In time, 5 years maybe, the only pros not riding tubeless will be cx or track cyclists. They will mostly stay on tubular tires.

The GP 5000 is an awesome tire, but we sell way more gatorskins. It may be slower than the GP5000, but it has way better flat resistance. 

Enjoy your new rides.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I use tubeless exclusively on my MTB, so well versed in tire pressure checks and topping up sealant. I haven't ridden them outside, but won't switch back to tubes until I do get a chance to ride them and see if I like them. As for compatibility, I'd only go 105 rear der if I get the same brifters. Like drivetrain. Di2 is nice, but far from necessary for a born again roadie beginner. 25mm is the widest I think I'll go on the Giant. 28mm might fit the Norco, but it's not vital as it's more for the fiance to ride or a commuter.


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## hondamatic (Feb 5, 2019)

Well done!

My wife has put ~10,000 km’s on her 2013 norco valence a2 (basically, the alum version of your norco). She's just about to wear out her 3rd chain.
We upgraded a few key pieces, but the shifters, crank and front derailleur are still original.
The Tiagra rear derailleur wore out; we put on a 105. (105 rear mech and Tiagra shifters work for us, but check the charts...)
Also, we put 105 caliper brakes on her bike. This was a massive upgrade; much stiffer and better braking power than the Tektro long-cage brakes stock on her bike. But note that the distance from brake post to rim is different on some bikes. The rear fit, but the front needed a 'drop' pad holder / adapter (we used these: Brake Pads and Holders | BDop Cycling)

I haven't tried tubeless on the road. My wife is waiting to receive a Liv Langma (Giant TCR) which comes stock tubeless. I might just do light tubes on my road bike.

The other thing you might want to look at is bike seats. Worth the investment every time!

Congrats on bagging a great pre-season deal on road bikes. I'm sure there's some great quiet roads in your neighborhood. The roads dry up an hour; the trails take longer...


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## hondamatic (Feb 5, 2019)

Lastly, tires... I use Vittoria Rubinos, which are similar to Gatorskins. 
They wear pretty well, and are decent all-around. Not too many flats.
I've run GP4000's before and don't find the Rubinos much slower.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

When it comes to road tires, I've always been a Conti fan from years back. Something about the rubber compound and content. I've never had a problem with a single Conti tire. On my MTB it's always Schwalbe or Bonty tires. I almost bought gatorskins, but when I went to get them, they were gone, so stepped up my game a little and went GP5000. I've read lots of great things about the tire.


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## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

GP4000’s were my tire of choice for years, switched over from Vittoria many years ago and love them. I haven’t tried the GP5000’s yet. My current tires are the Yksion tires that came premounted on my Mavic wheelset, they have been great so far and the first tubeless system that I’ve used with the road bike. They hold air surprisingly well, I don’t find them much different from running tubes-and no sealant so way less work.


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## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

This is my old school Ti bike, I built it up in 2019 from a custom order Lynskey frame (no decals or logo just the head tube plate). I had an old ultegra groupset kicking around that I had never used, it works really well and is very quiet and low maintenance.

It is old style but has some cool tech-6AL4V titanium, tapered headtube with a cane creek 110 and an ENVE carbon fork.


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## David Graves (Apr 5, 2017)

I still think Continental GP's are my favorite. Especially if you ride on slick roads. But you have to be somewhat cautious with them. The sidewalls can be prone to cuts. Early spring and fall, I pull out my collection of trusty Vittoria open paves (I stocked up when they were discontinued). But once the weather improves, it's right back t my trusty Contis.lol 
Funny, I have countless pics of my guitars, none of my bike.lol
Norco Tactic SLR. SRAM Red E-tap. Fulcrum racing zero nights and a Shimano Pro vibe carbon cockpit. Unfortunately, the way things have worked out in recent year. It's pretty much always attached to an Elite Drivo2.lol


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

zdogma said:


> This is my old school Ti bike, I built it up in 2019 from a custom order Lynskey frame (no decals or logo just the head tube plate). I had an old ultegra groupset kicking around that I had never used, it works really well and is very quiet and low maintenance.
> 
> It is old style but has some cool tech-6AL4V titanium, tapered headtube with a cane creek 110 and an ENVE carbon fork.


Titanium NEVER gets old or out of date. It's freakin' TITANIUM!!!! Sweet ride. I always loved the older Dean Ti bikes myself. Could never afford such exotic bikes.


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## fonziedog (Apr 10, 2012)

Sub’d!
Cervelo C3. Currently on my KICKR Core 👍🏻


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## SteveS (Apr 25, 2006)

I'm 58 and got back into biking last year. I love the peace and quiet tooling along a country road. It really soothes the soul. I don't go far, longest ride last year was about 80K. Usually 15-30K is fine with me.
I bought a 2012 Trek Madone 6.5 Ultegra and a new Giant Revolt 105 composite gravel bike for some trail use.
My wife got into it as well and bought a new Specialized.

Biking took off here last year in a huge way. I think the pandemic really drove people to look for outside activity's when it was allowed.

I bought the Trek online fairly early in the spring but bought the Giant later in the season, probably around July or August and I was extremely lucky to get it. There was hardly anything left in stores and they were saying no more inventory for quite some time.
There's a husband & wife owned bike store close by in Mahone Bay and they were just overwhelmed this year. Every time I went there it was standing room only.

I always loved biking and am glad I got back into it!


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Cycling is freedom. Low impact and gets you places you never knew you were going until you got there. It's a zen. It's you and the outdoors. You are the motor and control the speed. It's great for the mental wealth being out on the bike. There is never a bad ride.  

On my MTB, all my problems disappear. If I spend too much time thinking about them, I'll hit a tree.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

David Graves said:


> Early spring and fall, I pull out my collection of trusty Vittoria open paves (I stocked up when they were discontinued).


I loved that tire. Currently my defy has Giant Gavia's on it. If Vittoria ever brings out a new generation of the pave in a 32.......I'd be all over that.

Also..... love that red wall colour.


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## David Graves (Apr 5, 2017)

Paul M said:


> I loved that tire. Currently my defy has Giant Gavia's on it. If Vittoria ever brings out a new generation of the pave in a 32.......I'd be all over that.
> 
> Also..... love that red wall colour.


Thanks on the wall color!!
Vittoria has a new version of the open pave. It's called the Corsa Control. But unfortunately, it's not offered in 32. And it's not green.lol


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

David Graves said:


> Thanks on the wall color!!
> Vittoria has a new version of the open pave. It's called the Corsa Control. But unfortunately, it's not offered in 32. And it's not green.lol


I work in a bike shop, so I'm kinda up to date on that stuff. The Corsa Control just isn't the pavé, in the same way new coke isn't coke, (hey paul, the 80's called - they want their metaphors back!). 

I've be riding Schwalbe G One speed for my gravel rides, and Bontrager CX3 for actual cx rides.

This is more complicated than the "what strings?" discussions.


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## David Graves (Apr 5, 2017)

Paul M said:


> I work in a bike shop, so I'm kinda up to date on that stuff. The Corsa Control just isn't the pavé, in the same way new coke isn't coke, (hey paul, the 80's called - they want their metaphors back!).
> 
> I've be riding Schwalbe G One speed for my gravel rides, and Bontrager CX3 for actual cx rides.
> 
> This is more complicated than the "what strings?" discussions.


A fellow shop guy here. And yes. Discussing various tires can be quite time consuming. lol


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## zdogma (Mar 21, 2006)

Verne said:


> Cycling is freedom. Low impact and gets you places you never knew you were going until you got there. It's a zen. It's you and the outdoors. You are the motor and control the speed. It's great for the mental wealth being out on the bike. There is never a bad ride.
> 
> On my MTB, all my problems disappear. If I spend too much time thinking about them, I'll hit a tree.


I like both, I don't MTB seriously anymore-I find the big drops too hard on my old back even with my Nomad, which is pretty squishy. I do some trail riding and single track stuff, but nothing like my younger days in Kamloops-that was a great MTB scene back in the 90s.


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## LanceT (Mar 7, 2014)

I’ve been exclusively tubeless for a long while now and won’t even consider tubed tires. The benefits just far out way the downsides. Lower pressures not only give a better ride but are generally faster as the tire conforms better to surface irregularities instead of bouncing over them.
I put a set of 28C Conti 5000 TLs on my road bike that I also use on the gravel and dirt pathways and these have performed very well. I generally run 60-65 psi front and 75 rear as a point of reference.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

What weight bracket are we talking? I am in the 170 range and on my MTB I run 23/25. Not having done road tubeless, I was thinking of starting at 80 as I would tube. Is 65psi doable at my weight for road? I SHOULD be between 160-165lbs, but that's a whole other thread.


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## jimmythegeek (Apr 17, 2012)

zdogma said:


> This is my old school Ti bike, I built it up in 2019 from a custom order Lynskey frame (no decals or logo just the head tube plate). I had an old ultegra groupset kicking around that I had never used, it works really well and is very quiet and low maintenance.
> 
> It is old style but has some cool tech-6AL4V titanium, tapered headtube with a cane creek 110 and an ENVE carbon fork.


God Bless Lynskey's 6/4 trickery. Not allowed to use normal, round 6/4 tubing? Just bend your own hexagonal tubing (well, in his Lite speed days anyways) or make wild helix shaped tubes.


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## LanceT (Mar 7, 2014)

Verne said:


> What weight bracket are we talking? I am in the 170 range and on my MTB I run 23/25. Not having done road tubeless, I was thinking of starting at 80 as I would tube. Is 65psi doable at my weight for road? I SHOULD be between 160-165lbs, but that's a whole other thread.


What tire width? I'm 175-180 and my bike is not light by current road bike standards, maybe 23-24 lbs.
I run 19-20 front on my MTB bike and maybe 22 rear.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Mine are 25mm. Mine is 18-19 with the Mavics on it. Those are the tubeless setup. 
So I can try around 65psi and see what the outcome is.

My MTB has 2.3" on a thinner wheel. I don't want to drop below 23 or I could start getting tire rollover and get that really loose feeling.


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## fonziedog (Apr 10, 2012)

fonziedog said:


> Sub’d!
> Cervelo C3. Currently on my KICKR Core 👍🏻





fonziedog said:


> Sub’d!
> Cervelo C3. Currently on my KICKR Core 👍🏻







  








Cervelo C3




__
fonziedog


__
Feb 21, 2021


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## fonziedog (Apr 10, 2012)

Verne said:


> What weight bracket are we talking? I am in the 170 range and on my MTB I run 23/25. Not having done road tubeless, I was thinking of starting at 80 as I would tube. Is 65psi doable at my weight for road? I SHOULD be between 160-165lbs, but that's a whole other thread.


I’m 200+ and ride 70-80 on 35mm no problem.


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## fogdart (Mar 22, 2017)

Nice bikes Verne! My road bike has dirt tires on it . (It’s a cyclocross bike and that’s as close to road as I’ll ever get.) Tubeless on super light carbon rims. I run around 35psi front and rear 700x35c tires.

Like a few others who have posted here, I’m a former bike industry guy. 2004-2013. I’ll admit that I didn’t read every post, but I did skim thru. You should be totally fine at 80psi on the road with narrower tires, but I would not risk going much lower than that. Obviously different premium tire brands and models offer various advantages, but from my experience replacing thousands of tires at the bike shop, nothing holds up like a (premium) Continental tire. You might slightly prefer the ride quality of an offering from another manufacturer, but if durability is important to you than something like the Conti 5000 TL is your best bet. Though I must admit that I’m not 100% up on current road bike trends, it seems that slightly wider tires are popular (which makes total sense to me). Obviously the larger the tire the lower pressure you’ll be able to run without risking a pinch flat as the larger tire gives more volume of air (and more cushion before pinching). If you want to experiment with low pressures (I still woundnt go lower than 70psi) without going tubeless I’d suggest a 25c tire. Plus, I think you’ll love the ride quality of the slightly wider tire.

Here is some bike porn for you fellas. On my MTB I run 19psi front and 23psi rear (tubeless). On my fatbike I run 5psi front and 6psi rear in the snow. Fatbike is set up with RevoLoop tubes which are AMAZING. They feel very close to tubeless, and are actually lighter than a tubeless fatty set-up. Highly recommended.

I’m 5’9” 175-180lbs for weight/pressure reference.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Enve wheels. Now you're just showing off. hehehee 

I do have 25c Giant Gavia SLR presently on the Mavics. They look seated correctly watching the sidewall marking when spinning, but the the center of the tire has a lump or 2. Maybe that'll disappear when riding it finally. I got them with the tires mounted. If they feel like I am always riding on speed bumps, the GP5000 and tubes are going on. I am not racing, no immediate plans anyway, so as long as rotational weight is down, I don't really care which way. Both tube set up and tubeless setup will be 25c tires.


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## hondamatic (Feb 5, 2019)

I had to post a family picture, as others have...
Here's our side by side Zwift training setup, with authentic clutter. 
My wife kicks my butt.










Verne, thinking about your bikes... I'd just wear out the Tiagra parts, rather than hurrying to replace them. They perform pretty well.

Also, as I'm sure you've discovered, it's possible to score deals on nice old 10-spd rim-brake wheels. Both of our bikes have been upgraded to lower-end Fulcrums (found used cheaply), and the upgrades were worthwhile for the loud freehubs alone.

My road bike is old, but although I use it enough (training, plus 2-3 rides in summer), I'm not that tempted to upgrade it. It fits well and does the job nicely.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

I've Mountain biked for ages, I got into road bikes in the early 2000's. A good friend worked at a bike place and built me one out of spare parts (cheap) to see if I liked it enough to invest in a higher end bike. I did! I bought a KHS (forgetting the model) and rode the crap out of it. Babied it, kept it in tune, always clean & lubed. I hurt my my back in 2018 and could not ride anything for a year. Still not 100%, but I started riding mountains again. When I tried to ride the road bike, the aggressive angle did not work. I rode up the street and back and I had numbness in my toes. So I had to sell. Then a little thing like the pandemic hit and everyone was looking for bikes. I bought it new in 2008, I sold it in 2020, and I made money!!! I had a price in my head, I looked online for used, and they were through the roof! I consulted a local bike guy, and he confirmed. He then bought my even older Raleigh Serengeti... I bought a new larger frame KHS mountain bike and I rode it all summer. Can't wait to get back out there. I really miss my road bike though. Head down, flat, open road ahead... got a lot of really good "thinkin" done on my rides!


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

@hondamatic I am in no rush to replace, but will if the right deal comes along. I did upgrade the stock wheels to the Mavic ksyrium elite. Loud as hell rear hub as well. Can’t wait to hear it on its first descent. It’s an 11spd hub, but I have the spacer and now have upgrade potential for 11spd drivetrain down the road. Di2 DA would be sweeeeet!!! Yep


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## weaksauce (Mar 20, 2006)

Just bought myself a Landyachtz CityBike 2, my first new bike ever. More of a commuter/city bike, but Im looking forward to using it for my daily commute! I feel like I might be a little small for the frame I bought, but just barely. I can probably make it fit better with a shorter seatpost and stem. Stainless Steel tubing, Carbon fork, SRAM rival 1 drivetrain, with a shimano XT 11-46 cassette. Not as racy as some of the bikes posted on here, but I wasn’t looking for a pure road bike anyways.


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## jimmythegeek (Apr 17, 2012)

LanceT said:


> What tire width? I'm 175-180 and my bike is not light by current road bike standards, maybe 23-24 lbs.
> I run 19-20 front on my MTB bike and maybe 22 rear.


I way about what the OP does; often a bit more. I ride a CX bike as a road bike and still use tubes. I have run 25s around 80 with no problems. You are unlikely to get anything bigger than a 28 on those frames though, given the age and caliper brakes. Still, tubeless, you should be able to go pretty low. For reference I run my single speed MTB between 18 and 19 front and rear (it's rigid so I need the bounce somewhere) with no trouble. That's with tubes too.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

hondamatic said:


> I had to post a family picture, as others have...
> Here's our side by side Zwift training setup, with authentic clutter.
> My wife kicks my butt.
> 
> ...


Nice pain cave. I have my trainer bike on a Saris motion platform. It added a level of comfort that makes 6 hour trainer rides do-able. I rode the Uber Pretzel route on Saturday. 

I also ride rollers about an hour a week. My rollers bike has a power meter crank, so I get "honest" zwift miles, but not the controllable trainer experience. I may get smart rollers for next season. I was hoping to get a track bike and ride the velodromes this winter, but some guy ate a raw bat, and here we are. The good news is that Cinelli lead times are so long that I could get a Rickenbacker faster.


hondamatic said:


> I had to post a family picture, as others have...
> Here's our side by side Zwift training setup, with authentic clutter.
> My wife kicks my butt.
> 
> ...


Nice pain cave. I've got the Saris motion platform for my trainer bike. It makes the long rides possible. I rode the Uber Pretzel route on Saturday. 6 hours, 25 minutes on the bike. I also have a bike with power meter crankset for rollers. That gives me "honest zwift miles", but without the controllable aspect of a smart trainer. I may get the Elite smart rollers next winter. I was planning on a track bike, but covid made velodrome time very scarce. Again, maybe next season. 

The best part of zwift for me is the meetups. If I hadn't agreed to meet up with someone, I probably wouldn't get on the trainer. I have 4 or 5 regular meetups per week. I go chasing the route badges on weekends. I only have 5 or 6 left to get, and they are all the long ones. I have no hope of completing the running badges.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

So, after my HUGE motivational push with the new road bikes and my new found excitement for the coming season..............my usual late winter bronchitis kicks in. YAY ME!!! Now I'm sitting looking at the bikes waiting for this to pass so I can get back on. At least a week of "rest" before I hop back on the trainer. I hope I didn't lose much with the inactivity ahead. My job is somewhat physical, so exercise is inevitable, but laboured breathing (at work or not) is not a good feeling. I've though maybe hop on for a light spin, but I've been riding long enough that my body has created it's own natural rhythm. I have the absolute hardest time doing a light ride. ARGH !!!!


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## oldjoat (Apr 4, 2019)

keep the chin up , and muddle thru (as best you can)....
things will get better ... the winter will be just a memory in the fog come summer.


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## bolero (Oct 11, 2006)

I have an old Kona steel frame road bike I boot around on, now that I'm urban. Reynolds tubing I think? I used to be into mountain biking when I lived out west. +1 on Continental tires, have always been my choice

still have a Ti mtn bike frame I want to build up, but finding 26" parts is a drag.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

First ride outdoors today after work. I didn't get a lot of time in due to losing the light, but I did get some time on the Giant. That bike wants to mooooooooove!!! My Garmin says I hit 33.9kph on a flat bit of road. Wow. Now, if only my lungs and general cardio would keep up. Stoked just the same !!!!


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I just ordered the Control Power Unit for my Kinetic Rock n Roll. I also plan on subscribing to Zwift. I did some thinking, and rather than drop $2g on a spin bike with a $500/yr subscription for a video feed of a trainer and all that blah blah, why not spend less overall, and ride my OWN bike!!! Sooooooooo, I am going to. I really hope my expectations are met with this smart controller. If they are, Zwift will leave me hurting the first bunch of times using it. I've heard they now have MTB trails as well. Coooooool. Since I have either ready to throw on the trainer at any given point.

Soooooo, those of you with a wheel on roller smart trainer..........what can I expect?? I am also hoping Z has some beginner rides and programs. Last time I rode Z was in the beta stage and there was only the one road and no bells and whistles at that point. Must be at least 4yrs ago now. Maybe longer.









Kinetic — Kinetic Control Power Unit - Bike Trainer


Part of our newest generation of interactive, app-controlled trainers, offering the best power-training workout available and now featuring ANT+ FE-C and Bluetooth FTMS and a more accurate and responsive ride. The NEW Kinetic Control Power Unit installs in minutes and is the most affordable and conv




www.kurtkinetic.com


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

I used Zwift briefly and simply picked routes based on distance and how much climbing I felt like doing that day. One day I was feeling energetic and picked one not realizing it was Alpe du Zwift, which was probably a good thing as I managed to knock it out in a reasonable time.

I think you still get some free trial time with Zwift to check it out. Another one that has a free tier is Road Grand Tours which uses actual road video instead of virtual animation.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

In a related post, if anyone comes across an off road capable bike like a cyclocross bike not a full on “gravel” bike in 58/59/60cm. I want to have my son join me on rides and I’ve been keeping an eye out for the better part of a year and they are more scarce than hen’s teeth unless you are willing to pop 3-4K+ for a Cervelo or 3T. Wish list is Tiagra or 105 or maybe even 1X, discs, 35-40c tire clearance and anywhere between Ottawa and say Oshawa. 1-1500 budget


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

My daughter has been in the Zwift Racing League with pro and semi-pro riders from all over the world as there hasn't been much real racing.







She's been doing very well and I can't believe how exciting watching avatars race can be. The professional announcers contribute a lot, just like in the real world.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Verne said:


> I just ordered the Control Power Unit for my Kinetic Rock n Roll. I also plan on subscribing to Zwift. I did some thinking, and rather than drop $2g on a spin bike with a $500/yr subscription for a video feed of a trainer and all that blah blah, why not spend less overall, and ride my OWN bike!!! Sooooooooo, I am going to. I really hope my expectations are met with this smart controller. If they are, Zwift will leave me hurting the first bunch of times using it. I've heard they now have MTB trails as well. Coooooool. Since I have either ready to throw on the trainer at any given point.
> 
> Soooooo, those of you with a wheel on roller smart trainer..........what can I expect?? I am also hoping Z has some beginner rides and programs. Last time I rode Z was in the beta stage and there was only the one road and no bells and whistles at that point. Must be at least 4yrs ago now. Maybe longer.
> 
> ...


There are a lot more roads and routes in zwift since the Jarvis days. There are some I never ride, others I look forward too. The training programs in Zwift are notoriously difficult. I've never completed one. Too much work, not enough rest. I'm 55, a younger me might have felt differently. For pure training, Trainer Road or Sufferfest are better, IMHO. I use zwift for the social aspect. I use the meetups to hold me accountable. It's harder to stay on the couch when I've committed to meeting someone in Watopia. 

You're new load unit will be fine. Not as quiet, or able to replicate the steepest of hills like the Tacx NEO 2T, but it'll be a _HUGE_ improvement over a "dumb" trainer.

I run zwift on an apple tv box, on a big screen. I use the zwift companion app on my tablet, mounted to the handle bar. To gain access to the one mtb trail you will either need a steering turntable under the front wheel and the companion app open, and mounted to the h/bar, or,

The Elite Sterzo smart. The mtb section is a bit gimmicky. I don't ride it much.

The companion app is your path to finding all of the events in zwift. There are social rides, group workouts, races, tons of ways to participate. Having the companion app open and nearby makes it easy to communicate and engage with other zwifters while zwifting.

Zwiftinsider.com, zwifthacks.com and zwiftpower.com are useful too.

My name on zwift and in strava is Paul Monne. Make a friend request to follow me, I'll follow you in return, and we'll get you zwifting like the best of them.

Peace,

Paul


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

@Paul M I will add you when I get everything set up. "fnugen" is my tag. 

I do have the turntable wheel block I use. Even watching my own gopro videos I found myself instinctively turning some. I'll get the app and Z installed over this weekend maybe. I won't activate until I get the power unit. Not sure how long it'll take from Minnesota. Too long, really. HAHAHA


I'll be trying out easier rides to start out so I don't over do it with the new "toy". I myself am 56, so I won't be pushing it right from the start. I'm really looking forward to more interactive riding and the accountability that comes with this setup.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

@ZeroGravity I'm in London, so a bit far for a bike purchase, unless it's one hell of a deal. I'll keep my eyes open regardless. I do watch the bikes on Kijiji, Facebook, and Pinkbike daily.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Verne said:


> @Paul M I will add you when I get everything set up. "fnugen" is my tag.
> 
> I do have the turntable wheel block I use. Even watching my own gopro videos I found myself instinctively turning some. I'll get the app and Z installed over this weekend maybe. I won't activate until I get the power unit. Not sure how long it'll take from Minnesota. Too long, really. HAHAHA
> 
> ...


There are 2 or 3 weekly zwift meetups organized by the folks at the Forest City Velodrome. They are "rubber banded" so as long as you keep pedalling, you don't get dropped. I ride with them on Wednesday evenings. I'm hoping to ride the track IRL in the late fall, when vaccinations finally knock down covid.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Cool. I used to ride the FCV. I bought an Argon Electron 18 when All Season Sport bike shop had their closing up sale. I really enjoyed it. What ruined it for me was the competitive riders showing up at rec rides for training. Too many close calls and bumped elbows for my liking. Nothing was done when I made mention, I stopped going and sold my bike so I didn't end up injured by somebody else's doing. A friend of mine got knocked down on the corner banking and dislocated a shoulder. This is going back 8yrs now I think.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Verne said:


> @ZeroGravity I'm in London, so a bit far for a bike purchase, unless it's one hell of a deal. I'll keep my eyes open regardless. I do watch the bikes on Kijiji, Facebook, and Pinkbike daily.


Thanks, I’d be willing to ship or look at just a frameset too. It’s wild the dearth of bikes in that size. Plenty of 50-56 but nothing much for 6’ and over riders (he’s 6’3”)


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

how much is fair to ask for used bikes? now that they seem to be in higher demand. don't want to try and rip anyone off but I don't want to give it away either since I need to buy a replacement. give me a used vs new percentage....

it's a 2016 Kona. Shred 24. my kid just bolted in height and I gotta get him set up for the season with a replacement

looks like this


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

@vadsy I would say if the bike is in excellent condition, which kids bikes can be because of growth spurts, at $800 new, $600 isn't a bad asking price. Keep in mind though, there are a LOT of people who won't spend that on a bike for their kids. CTC or Walmart are more their style. You could even list at $500 and see what hits you get. You aren't exhibiting greed by asking either of those prices. If you were asking new pricing or higher, then you are in "ripping people off" territory. But.........if people are willing to pay it, are you really ripping them off?!? It comes down to your own personal scruples and business model. Like a guitar, just consider what you'd accept for it, and go from there. You could look around locally online and see what availability is like. Could help you decide on your asking.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

If there is one for your area, try posting it on bike specific FB buy/sell group or Marketplace rather than Kijiji. I find that the people on those groups are a bit more savvy as to what they are looking for and won’t be turned off by a reasonable price. Kijidiots are more likely looking for a cheap bike or something to flip and will lowball all day long


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

If there is one for your region, try posting it on bike specific FB buy/sell group or Marketplace rather than Kijiji. I find that the people on those groups are a bit more savvy as to what they are looking for and won’t be turned off by a reasonable price. Kijidiots are more likely looking for a cheap bike or something to flip and will lowball


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Sorry for the double post, can’t delete from my phone


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

With the new bike shortage, used bike prices are way up. The typical Canadian Tire bike that is advertised as Reg. $400.00, sale $229.00 is selling for $250 on Kijiji or fB marketplace in my neighborhood. Whatever new bikes Canadian Tire sells this year, I bet they won't be "on sale".


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I sold a single speed for market value, not the new supply and demand greed pricing that seems to be the trend right now. I realize getting new bikes is hard and needs patience, but I still won't price my sales in the area of taking advantage due to the situation. I absolutely can not stand seeing bikes being sold for upwards of 2x new price because they are unavailable. I hope these people sit and choke on their greed.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Verne said:


> I sold a single speed for market value, not the new supply and demand greed pricing that seems to be the trend right now. I realize getting new bikes is hard and needs patience, but I still won't price my sales in the area of taking advantage due to the situation. I absolutely can not stand seeing bikes being sold for upwards of 2x new price because they are unavailable. I hope these people sit and choke on their greed.


I agree, but if you sell under the current value, then your buyer will immediately become a seller. It shouldn't be hard to do the right thing.


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

vadsy said:


> how much is fair to ask for used bikes? now that they seem to be in higher demand. don't want to try and rip anyone off but I don't want to give it away either since I need to buy a replacement. give me a used vs new percentage....
> 
> it's a 2016 Kona. Shred 24. my kid just bolted in height and I gotta get him set up for the season with a replacement
> 
> looks like this


Pinkbike is a fabulous place to list your son's bike.






Mountain bike news, photos, videos and events - Pinkbike


Check out PinkBike.com for the latest in cycling and mountain biking news, freeride videos, photos, events and more. Submit your own biking pictures and videos online. Buy the latest biking DVDs and videos. Check race results.




www.pinkbike.com


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## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

well, as we all know the bike market is hot. took 9 minutes to sell the bike, for more than I expected. unfortunately shopping for one isn't as easy as it has been previous seasons but we ended up up with a Kona Dew Plus


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Found a CX frameset in 58cm that checks all the boxes from a shop in Poland on eBay. Hope this works out. Most likely going to be pulling most of the components off the road bike for this.

Now the hunt is on for post-mount, cable actuated disc brake calipers like TRP Spyres or HY/RD. Another out of stock everywhere part. Hopefully someone has some sitting in a parts bin


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Do you check Chainreaction in UK ? They can have some pretty good deals in CDN, and can often times have what you can't find. Of course, with the pandemic bike surge, even online sources are running out of the usual stuff.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Verne said:


> Do you check Chainreaction in UK ? They can have some pretty good deals in CDN, and can often times have what you can't find. Of course, with the pandemic bike surge, even online sources are running out of the usual stuff.


Did the usual rounds, no stock


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## LanceT (Mar 7, 2014)

ZeroGravity said:


> Now the hunt is on for post-mount, cable actuated disc brake calipers like TRP Spyres or HY/RD.


Did you try these guys: SJS Cycles Bicycle Parts and Accessories Store

Also why cable only?


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I'm thinking maybe cable only due to what levers he has on hand.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

LanceT said:


> Did you try these guys: SJS Cycles Bicycle Parts and Accessories Store
> 
> Also why cable only?


I am first hoping to find some on the used market and then new if they can be found.

As Verne said, I have mechanical brifters to go on the bike and not going to switch to hydraulic


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Lucky timing a pair of Avid BB5R came up for $20 on Marketplace. Not the greatest but a place to start. I think I’d still like to find some TRP HY/RD


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Mixed emotions today as I put my fixed gear track bike up for sale. Gone to the first guy who responded in 5 minutes. I love riding fixed gear but wasn’t sure I wanted to continue to ride brakeless as it demands a very conscious riding style to be done safely and I really couldn’t bring myself to put brakes on it so I sold it.

Upside is that it more than covers the expense of the new CX build for my son and a new refurb power meter from 4iiii for me


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I can relate. I used to ride the velodrome here (Forest City Velodrome) and after a few trips, decided to get my own track bike. Bought a brand new Argon 18 Electron. I rode a bunch of times but it got too wild with racers showing up for rec rides and making things far too nervous for us actual rec riders. I thought about using it outside, but since it was a track bike, there were no brake mount holes. I decided to sell it. Sold quickly and got what I paid for it. I do miss velodrome riding now, but still, if racers go and ride like a training ride, they scare those who are there for fun, and don't have the same skills on the bike.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Verne said:


> I can relate. I used to ride the velodrome here (Forest City Velodrome) and after a few trips, decided to get my own track bike. Bought a brand new Argon 18 Electron. I rode a bunch of times but it got too wild with racers showing up for rec rides and making things far too nervous for us actual rec riders. I thought about using it outside, but since it was a track bike, there were no brake mount holes. I decided to sell it. Sold quickly and got what I paid for it. I do miss velodrome riding now, but still, if racers go and ride like a training ride, they scare those who are there for fun, and don't have the same skills on the bike.


I just wish the closest velodrome wasn’t either 3.5 hours west or 3.5 hours east or I would have given it go. I know some make the trek but to far for me. I and a good number of others ride on the road brakeless but you have to constantly be hyper alert and I wouldn’t do it in any kind of traffic situation


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Nice bike. Yes, you have to be so much more aware when your brakes are your legs. Look pedals as well?!? You go hardcore. I don't trust London drivers enough to trust my life to them on a brakeless bike while clipped in. You are obviously pretty tall as well. 

This is what my bike looked like when I was selling it.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Verne said:


> Nice bike. Yes, you have to be so much more aware when your brakes are your legs. Look pedals as well?!? You go hardcore. I don't trust London drivers enough to trust my life to them on a brakeless bike while clipped in. You are obviously pretty tall as well.
> 
> This is what my bike looked like when I was selling it.
> 
> View attachment 356731


Yeah, clipless. Been riding them for over 25 years so it is second nature. Tried flats with straps and hated every second. Not tall at all but I think that picture and bike geometry makes it look that way. Just under 5’10” and that’s a 55cm frame


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

@Verne @ZeroGravity I gotta admit I'm getting antsy. I've got a Fuji Track frame/fork coming soon. I need _everything_ else. Miche is easier to come by, but Dura-ace is soooo nice. The tall flange hubs are to die for. I hope to have everything ready to ride by the fall when vaccinations are more widely spread. 






I went for my first outdoor ride Sunday, and the weather has finally turned so Tuesday am I begin my daily 35km before work. I feel 10 years younger after an outside ride.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Paul M said:


> @Verne @ZeroGravity I gotta admit I'm getting antsy. I've got a Fuji Track frame/fork coming soon. I need _everything_ else. Miche is easier to come by, but Dura-ace is soooo nice. The tall flange hubs are to die for. I hope to have everything ready to ride by the fall when vaccinations are more widely spread.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I built my son's wheels with Dura-Ace and they are nicer in many respects to the ones I had. Silky smooth with high-grade stainless or ceramic bearings but the biggest drawback is they are still cup and cone and not really sealed to the elements. They also are 32 or 36 holes so if you want a low spoke count then you can't use them. I started with Miche wheels but you have to use Miche lockring (or Campy) because they are Italian threading. The I built the wheels on that bike with DiaCompe Gran Compe Hubs from Japan - 24 hole, slotted for "real" bladed spokes and H Plus Son Archetype rims. The other thing about Dura Ace track cranks is they are 130BCD where nearly everything else out there is 144BCD so changing a chainring can be tricky.


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

@ZeroGravity I'm having a hard time finding a 36h rim I love. My problem is that I don't know what I want, and I won't be happy until I get it. 

This will be an indoor only bike, so I'm not worried about the elements. I was >thisclose< to ordering a Cinelli Supercorsa Pista in green. I tell people I shied away because of the Italian thread BB, but the truth is I couldn't bear to scratch the finish in any way. Those Cinelli steel framesets are gorgeous.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Paul M said:


> @ZeroGravity I'm having a hard time finding a 36h rim I love. My problem is that I don't know what I want, and I won't be happy until I get it.
> 
> This will be an indoor only bike, so I'm not worried about the elements. I was >thisclose< to ordering a Cinelli Supercorsa Pista in green. I tell people I shied away because of the Italian thread BB, but the truth is I couldn't bear to scratch the finish in any way. Those Cinelli steel framesets are gorgeous.


I’d always recommend the H Plus Son Archetypes for rims, deep but not too deep, sturdy but not too heavy, easy to build. I’ll try to get a picture or two of them With the DA hubs tomorrow, they are 36h

HED Belgiums also get good feedback but they are double the price of Archetypes ($240 vs $120)

Found one


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I have to ask. Why 36? Are you in the Clydesdale category? I'd think for a track bike you'd go 20/24 hole maybe with external triple butted spoke for added strength. On the street I can see it being more appropriate, but on the track? Just wondering is all. I myself am 5'6" and when in shape, around 160lbs. I'd find 36 hole to heavy for my sizing and also unnecessary.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Verne said:


> I have to ask. Why 36? Are you in the Clydesdale category? I'd think for a track bike you'd go 20/24 hole maybe with external triple butted spoke for added strength. On the street I can see it being more appropriate, but on the track? Just wondering is all. I myself am 5'6" and when in shape, around 160lbs. I'd find 36 hole to heavy for my sizing and also unnecessary.


Dura-Ace hubs are really designed only for track racing (Kierin) and only come in 32 and 36 and you almost never see 32's. I think there might be a 28 version but you'd have a better chance of seeing a unicorn. The higher spoke count makes for stiffer wheels for the track and since the bikes are so light anyways, the additional weight of 32/36 isn't a big deal to those guys.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Haven't had a bike post in a while, hope everyone been out or is ready to go. I haven't been out yet but busy in the shop. Tuned and overhauled my wife's bike, my road bike and my gravel/CX bike. Cleaned, brakes bled, tubeless sealant checked and topped up. 

I have also sold my track bike which I am a bit sad to see go but I probably wouldn't have ridden it as much as it deserves and built up a gravel/CX bike for my son. Sourcing a big frame (58cm) and parts was a challenge and had to scavenge the drivetrain from his road bike which he never took to for this one. It just needs a final fitting when he gets home from out west. I have a mostly complete 58cm "project" bike if anyone is interested as I doubt it'll get rebuilt complete.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)




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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)




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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I haven't been out in 2 weeks. I either have a pinched nerve, or a herniated disk. I get a sharp pain in the lower left back above the hip that radiates through my quad. Having just gotten back into road riding, I am wondering if it's the sudden change in position. My MTB position could be considered aggressive by many, but it's more relaxed compared to when I used to race. I wonder if my aging body reacted to the sudden aggressive road position. I'm giving it a few weeks to see if it works itself out, aided by ibuprofen. If not, I'm damn well jumping back on the bike anyway. Worst case is it hurts like a SOB and I literally can't ride. Getting old sucks.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Verne said:


> I haven't been out in 2 weeks. I either have a pinched nerve, or a herniated disk. I get a sharp pain in the lower left back above the hip that radiates through my quad. Having just gotten back into road riding, I am wondering if it's the sudden change in position. My MTB position could be considered aggressive by many, but it's more relaxed compared to when I used to race. I wonder if my aging body reacted to the sudden aggressive road position. I'm giving it a few weeks to see if it works itself out, aided by ibuprofen. If not, I'm damn well jumping back on the bike anyway. Worst case is it hurts like a SOB and I literally can't ride. Getting old sucks.


I’m not a physiotherapist but what you describe also fits piriformis issues, which plague me and are often overlooked by PTs and Chiros as it gets lumped in with sciatica. I get a pain right above the hip which I thought was facet joint but also pain down the inside of the quad - gracillus muscle. Try looking for piriformis stretches and heat on the glutes.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Sciatic was my first though. I tried the piriformis stretches, but it gave no relief. I will keep trying different stretches. I do know my left side is tighter than my right. I had issues with my left IT band and wouldn't be surprised to find it'll plague me for life. I was doing a 6hr race solo and my left IT band literally seized up. I could barely walk. Didn't finish my race and had to take an emergency week vacation. Took 3 days until I could walk comfortably again. If I could only get in to see my doctor physically that might help rather than self diagnosing using Google and some medical pages.


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## fonziedog (Apr 10, 2012)

Verne said:


> I haven't been out in 2 weeks. I either have a pinched nerve, or a herniated disk. I get a sharp pain in the lower left back above the hip that radiates through my quad. Having just gotten back into road riding, I am wondering if it's the sudden change in position. My MTB position could be considered aggressive by many, but it's more relaxed compared to when I used to race. I wonder if my aging body reacted to the sudden aggressive road position. I'm giving it a few weeks to see if it works itself out, aided by ibuprofen. If not, I'm damn well jumping back on the bike anyway. Worst case is it hurts like a SOB and I literally can't ride. Getting old sucks.


A professional bike fit session at my local dealer, Bow Cycle in Calgary, was the best money I’ve ever spent on ‘bike stuff’. The ability to ride pain free, as you obviously understand, is a game changer!


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Verne said:


> I haven't been out in 2 weeks. I either have a pinched nerve, or a herniated disk. I get a sharp pain in the lower left back above the hip that radiates through my quad. Having just gotten back into road riding, I am wondering if it's the sudden change in position. My MTB position could be considered aggressive by many, but it's more relaxed compared to when I used to race. I wonder if my aging body reacted to the sudden aggressive road position. I'm giving it a few weeks to see if it works itself out, aided by ibuprofen. If not, I'm damn well jumping back on the bike anyway. Worst case is it hurts like a SOB and I literally can't ride. Getting old sucks.


Yes indeed, aging is not a picnic. After my neurosurgeon gave me a fancy haircut I still have balance issues, hopefully soon they'll right themselves. I'm still riding in the basement consequently. Like you Verne, I've developed back/hip/leg issues. I've been diagnosed with "proximal hamstring tendinosis" not as bad as it sounds but it can take awhile to resolve. I can't sit for any period of time without experiencing excruciating pain in my glute. Walking is a challenge, bending over almost impossible, but still able to spin. I consulted with my kids' physio and more exercises, but very non-challenging for now.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)




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## fonziedog (Apr 10, 2012)

Verne said:


> View attachment 363397


Bwahahaha! So awesome, so true.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

No riding posts lately, hope people are getting out in this nice weather. Admittedly I am not riding as much as other years but today I bucked up and put in my longest ride this year, and in a while in general 87km, my place to Carleton Place ON on gravel trail and then road back (tailwind!). Too gassed to ride the extra 3 to get to an even 90


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

View attachment 369639


That is a pretty aggressive ride there. Just looking at the seat and h/bar.... you must be pretty aero. Ever do Ride of the Damned, or Hastings Highland Hilly Hundred?


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Paul M said:


> View attachment 369639
> 
> 
> That is a pretty aggressive ride there. Just looking at the seat and h/bar.... you must be pretty aero. Ever do Ride of the Damned, or Hastings Highland Hilly Hundred?


It’s actually a cyclocross bike rather than a gravel bike so it’s more aggressive and better suited to “groading” rather than full on gravel biking. It has 35c tires, could probably squeeze 38c but not the big comfy 42 or bigger. That being said, that hasn’t stopped me taking it on a few milder single track trails. Not sure I would take it on tougher rides like Hilly Hundred.

Todays ride on the Trans-Canada trail may as well have been on the road, it’s so dry and hard packed it was essentially concrete.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I had ridden my CX bike around some local MTB trails. Tight and twisty was tough with the front wheel cross over. I miss my CX bike, but nobody I rode with had one. I have my road bike for solo rides if I want. I lowered my seat a bit. Getting old, gotta watch the back. Used the Greg LeMond measuring for the seat height. Now I am messing with the handle bar height. I just haven't logged any rides here. I've ridden a handful of times, but nothing very long.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

Verne said:


> I had ridden my CX bike around some local MTB trails. Tight and twisty was tough with the front wheel cross over. I miss my CX bike, but nobody I rode with had one. I have my road bike for solo rides if I want. I lowered my seat a bit. Getting old, gotta watch the back. Used the Greg LeMond measuring for the seat height. Now I am messing with the handle bar height. I just haven't logged any rides here. I've ridden a handful of times, but nothing very long.


Since I am not riding as much, my flexibility is suffering. I have a couple of spacers to play with and I was thinking I might raise the bars.

I built a new CX bike for my some so we could ride together this summer but he ended up staying in BC instead of coming home.


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## LanceT (Mar 7, 2014)

Early 2000s Schwnn Fastback Elite that my neighbour was turfing so I grabbed it. I’m not much of a roady so I didn’t ride it until I figured out what to with it. I figured maybe I could make it into a gravel bike so I began researching what I could do and not spend a ton of money, which turns out is only partially doable.
The original tires were 23c wire bead, tubed and since I am a big fan of tubeless, I bought the largest tubeless compatible tires I could fit-28c- and spent an entire day and a half fighting with narrow wheels to convert them to tubeless which turned out better than I expected. Part of the attraction to tubeless is the lower pressures that can be run. Instead of say 95-100 PSI, tubeless allows one to run say 60-70 PSI depending on the tire size.
I picked the best tires for the money as I believe in not skimping on the little contact patch between you and disaster. I went with Continental 5000TL with the ‘black chilli’ compound. These tires are superb.
I also changed out the 11-25 rear cassette to an 11-34, changed the front big ring to a 50 tooth instead of a 52, installed a Wolf Tooth derailleur range extender to take advantage of the larger range in the rear, installed a shorter stem and some black bar tape.
I also was able to scrounge some Ultegra brakes and am also in the process of upgrading the drivetrain to 10 speed. Original drivetrain was Tiagra 9 speed.
There are 50+ K of gravel dike locally and I discovered this bike with the changes I made, really seriously hauls.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

LanceT said:


> Early 2000s Schwnn Fastback Elite that my neighbour was turfing so I grabbed it. I’m not much of a roady so I didn’t ride it until I figured out what to with it. I figured maybe I could make it into a gravel bike so I began researching what I could do and not spend a ton of money, which turns out is only partially doable.
> The original tires were 23c wire bead, tubed and since I am a big fan of tubeless, I bought the largest tubeless compatible tires I could fit-28c- and spent an entire day and a half fighting with narrow wheels to convert them to tubeless which turned out better than I expected. Part of the attraction to tubeless is the lower pressures that can be run. Instead of say 95-100 PSI, tubeless allows one to run say 60-70 PSI depending on the tire size.
> I picked the best tires for the money as I believe in not skimping on the little contact patch between you and disaster. I went with Continental 5000TL with the ‘black chilli’ compound. These tires are superb.
> I also changed out the 11-25 rear cassette to an 11-34, changed the front big ring to a 50 tooth instead of a 52, installed a Wolf Tooth derailleur range extender to take advantage of the larger range in the rear, installed a shorter stem and some black bar tape.
> ...


Well done! Nice catch


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

ZeroGravity said:


> It’s actually a cyclocross bike rather than a gravel bike so it’s more aggressive and better suited to “groading” rather than full on gravel biking. It has 35c tires, could probably squeeze 38c but not the big comfy 42 or bigger. That being said, that hasn’t stopped me taking it on a few milder single track trails. Not sure I would take it on tougher rides like Hilly Hundred.
> 
> Todays ride on the Trans-Canada trail may as well have been on the road, it’s so dry and hard packed it was essentially concrete.


I mostly ride a TREK Boone, with Schwalbe G-one allround tubeless 700x35c. I've got another set of wheels with Bontrager CX-3 tires, so I can hit the muddy trails too. Most of my riding is on well groomed or paved rail trail. I have a road bike that doesn't get enough use, and am still sourcing the parts for a track bike. I haven't found the right stem just yet, and haven't decided on the h/bar.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

@LanceT Nice catch!!! Sweet looking bike.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

Anyone have an indoor trainer for their bike?? I had a pretty high end spin-bike but I rarely used it, and the market was hot so I moved it a few years ago. No regrets. But, I want to get back into riding for well being more than my current love and havin' fun. I looked at a few of those stands, but I'm not sure I dig the way they attach to the bike. 

This is fairly common: 









But I do not like the idea of taking the rear tire apart in order to get the bike to attach. I would prefer to have little to swap, so I could ride indoors, or outdoors at any given moment without fiddling with this: 









Anyone have a good set up they are willing to share the specs on??


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

SWLABR said:


> Anyone have an indoor trainer for their bike?? I had a pretty high end spin-bike but I rarely used it, and the market was hot so I moved it a few years ago. No regrets. But, I want to get back into riding for well being more than my current love and havin' fun. I looked at a few of those stands, but I'm not sure I dig the way they attach to the bike.
> 
> This is fairly common:
> View attachment 383237
> ...


You can use that same quick release skewer indoors or out. However, it is advisable to use a specific trainer tire as wheel-on trainers will chew up a tire pretty quickly and the resulting mess of tire rubber “dust”. Unfortunately you can’t use trainer tires outdoors.

if you only have the one bike, it will be hard to get away from wheels swaps. The only answer I know of that would on-off no hassle would be a 4iiii Fliiight. They have a contactless system that uses magnets and eddy currents so no wheel swaps necessary (still need the trainer skewer but really is a non-issue). The previous models by STAC, acquired by 4iiii, had the Zero (non-smart) and Halcyon (smart). Same basic contactless resistance but they needed weights in the wheels for “feel” - most trainers have some kind of flywheel so the wheel keeps spinning if you let up on the pedals. You also need a wheels that has no steel in it, often a pinned wheel joint uses a steel pin.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

The perma-swap skewer is good news. I didn't know it was a one time switch to have the bike work in both settings. Ya!! 

The tire dust however... boo!! I hadn't thought of that.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

SWLABR said:


> The perma-swap skewer is good news. I didn't know it was a one time switch to have the bike work in both settings. Ya!!
> 
> The tire dust however... boo!! I hadn't thought of that.


It gets all over everything. Not recommended and replacing prematurely worn tires too.

Most pick up a second rear wheel for the trainer and swap, some will have a second bike dedicated that can be a somewhat lower quality than their main ride.

My indoor setup is a second bike (early 2000’s Giant TCR) which I have had from new and a STAC Halcyon. Works great with smart programs like Zwift and TrainerRoad.

If you are close to Ottawa, I don’t think I will be doing any indoor riding anytime soon and might just sell both to make some space.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

ZeroGravity said:


> It gets all over everything. Not recommended and replacing prematurely worn tires too.


Try to discover another way of applying friction to another component to save tire wear. A dynamo in the hub would do it.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

What is your trainer budget?? There are wheel off smart trainers, but they won't come cheap. Even 2nd hand they aren't cheap. No trainer or road tire to worry about, but cost is a big issue. Can always buy a second rear wheel and mount a trainer tire on it with the trainer QR to save swapping. Then you can easily jump outside with the bike without tire change hassles. Orrrrrrr, an entirely second bike specifically for the trainer. No need to worry about weight of the bike since the hills are simulated. Also, a fluid trainer for wheel on works better than magnetic IMO. More realistic ramp up and riding feel. Magnetic goes up notchy and has preset resistance. If you have trouble with say 3 but 2 is too easy, you're SOL. Fluid goes up or down with your pedaling input.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

Verne said:


> What is your trainer budget?? There are wheel off smart trainers, but they won't come cheap. Even 2nd hand they aren't cheap. No trainer or road tire to worry about, but cost is a big issue. Can always buy a second rear wheel and mount a trainer tire on it with the trainer QR to save swapping. Then you can easily jump outside with the bike without tire change hassles. Orrrrrrr, an entirely second bike specifically for the trainer. No need to worry about weight of the bike since the hills are simulated. Also, a fluid trainer for wheel on works better than magnetic IMO. More realistic ramp up and riding feel. Magnetic goes up notchy and has preset resistance. If you have trouble with say 3 but 2 is too easy, you're SOL. Fluid goes up or down with your pedaling input.


Budget? Well, not much if I can help it.
If simulating an experience on my actual mountain bike becomes more expensive than a stationary, I’ll buy another stationary.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

A dynamo hub will generate electricity. You could vary the load accordingly. While you are cycling, you could be generating electricity to power some electrical device such as a kettle or battery charger...converting your energy into something useful. A 1K2W kettle is equivalent to 1.6HP...don't know what your HP rating is but dynamos come in various ratings; of course there is a lot more applications for human generated electricity.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

Paul Running said:


> A dynamo hub will generate electricity. You could vary the load accordingly. While you are cycling, you could be generating electricity to power some electrical device such as a kettle or battery charger...converting your energy into something useful. A 1K2W kettle is equivalent to 1.6HP...don't know what your HP rating is but dynamos come in various ratings; of course there is a lot more applications for human generated electricity.


Can you build one??


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

I have only seen one video where a cyclist generated enough power to make toast. He was a pro track cyclist, known as quadzilla. It just isn't practical for regular humans. 

Smart trainers, especially direct drive trainers, are where it's at. For wheel-on trainers, either magnetic resistance or fluid, get a decent brand, (Tacx, Saris, Kurt Kinetic, etc.) There are a lot of very cheap trainers on ali express, and they are junk. My first Tacx smart trainer is 20 years old, and still working.


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## ZeroGravity (Mar 25, 2016)

At the less expensive, non-smart, end, if you can find a TACX Flow. It has digital control over resistance and allows for resistance in more granular steps, or power rather than just the 3-5 steps found in most of the cheap ones with a mechanical lever. I had one before going smart with over 23K on it. However none of the wheel-on or direct drive options get around the need for a wheel install or swap or a second bike for trainer duty only.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

SWLABR said:


> Can you build one??


If I had all the parts. I thought about this many years ago when I used to ride a stationary. I thought, I should be putting all that energy to good use. It never materialized. I was going to drive a modified auto alternator, remove the regulator so that you can generate 120VAC. I had a Mopar 80A unit in my junk-box; it was rated 1100W...the threshold of a kettle. I just was not motivated enough to gather all the parts together. The stationary that I had used a nylon belt, tensioned to a metal flywheel...that thing would get very hot from the friction, that's when I had the eureka moment of converting my wasted energy to electricity...never happened. It would be a cool project though.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Elite makes decent "entry" level fluid trainers if you can find one used, or have an MEC local. I've had 2 before.

I had this one before I upped my game. It uses your own weight as resistance because it pivots against the roller, not tension dialed in. It's fluid and quiet.









Elite Qubo Power Fluid Bike Trainer | MEC


Qubo Power Fluid Bike Trainer: Everyone loves the strong, silent type. The big, oil-immersed flywheel on this bike trainer generates high levels of resistance even at low speeds and keeps the noise lev




www.mec.ca


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

Verne said:


> Elite makes decent "entry" level fluid trainers if you can find one used, or have an MEC local. I've had 2 before.
> 
> I had this one before I upped my game. It uses your own weight as resistance because it pivots against the roller, not tension dialed in. It's fluid and quiet.
> 
> ...


That's a cool device, a smart application of heat transfer...good for home heating during the cold months.


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## vokey design (Oct 24, 2006)

Man do I miss cycling, and running for that matter. This was my baby, 2010 Cervelo S1 (formally Soloist), always on Conti GP4000's and never had an issue. Has flats on it in the pic but that was for test rides when I sold, I used Speedplay pedals which were also great. Stay safe out there!


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Wow that's a nice bike. My 2 kids in Vancouver both race and yup, all the speedy people are on Conti 4000's. My daughter has an R5 and loves it. I sold my R5 a few years ago, couldn't get comfortable on it, now a TREK boy. I haven't ridden in almost 2 years due to medical issues. Next year?


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Local London sale for trainer and wheel block. Seems a decent price for a very popular trainer. Not mine, just passing along. Someboby (@Milkman ??) was looking for a budget priced trainer.






Facebook လောဂ်အင်ဝင်ရန်


သင်၏ သူငယ်ချင်း၊ မိသားစု၊ သင်သိသောသူမျာနှင့် စတင်၍ ချိတ်ဆက်ပြီ မျှဝေရန် Facebook သို လောဂ်အင်ဝင်ပါ။




www.facebook.com





$225
Excellent condition. Includes skewer, Cycleops riser block and Continental trainer tire.


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

Verne said:


> Local London sale for trainer and wheel block. Seems a decent price for a very popular trainer. Not mine, just passing along. Someboby (@Milkman ??) was looking for a budget priced trainer.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It was me. But, I’d need a dedicated rear tire for this, no?? It was mentioned these will “shred” normal ones.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Comes with the tire. I would assume 700c


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## SWLABR (Nov 7, 2017)

Verne said:


> Comes with the tire. I would assume 700c


Oh, right I see that now. I’m not on Facebook so I didn’t open it, and, I guess I don’t have a shot at snagging it without an account either. Ha, ha…

Kinda bad timing for an added expense right now. Just got a new car this past week, and we’re heading off in vaca in a week. First world problems.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

Verne said:


> Local London sale for trainer and wheel block. Seems a decent price for a very popular trainer. Not mine, just passing along. Someboby (@Milkman ??) was looking for a budget priced trainer.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Neat product. The load device resembles a Mopar alternator. If the flywheel is interchangeable it would be easy to customize to the rider. The spec sheet rates it at 6.5lbs...would that be typical for your average cyclist?


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## Paul M (Mar 27, 2015)

Paul Running said:


> Neat product. The load device resembles a Mopar alternator. If the flywheel is interchangeable it would be easy to customize to the rider. The spec sheet rates it at 6.5lbs...would that be typical for your average cyclist?


That's typical for that level, (read: pricepoint) of trainer. Bigger flywheels are more realistic feeling, but the trainers become bigger and more costly. 

Just the trainer tyre is $50 or more brand new. That's a decent deal.


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