# Parts source/plans for building speaker cabinets?



## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

I am comparing building my own cabinet, to just getting one from Lopoline.

I just want to build a small, closed back 1x12" cabinet. Since I'd be making it compact I'd only put a handle on the top. I'd need feet, a grill cloth, and corner protectors. And I haven't decided if I would even tolex it yet.

A big factor in figuring out the costs is if I can get everything I need from Canadian sources. Does anyone know a site that has the above items?

I think I would just get the wood from Rona, or even check the recycling area at the dump and see what's there.

The Lopoline cabs are decent quality from all I have read, and only run about $150 USD unloaded. So I am trying to figure out if that would just be the easier route.


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## kat_ (Jan 11, 2007)

Steamco has grille clothe and tolex. http://www.steamcomusic.com/ Not sure about the other parts.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

I'm in the process of doing the same and have checked some local spots for tolex and grill cloth. Haven't found grill cloth yet but I did find tolex for $8.99/yard from a local fabric seller. Compared to to $25++ on the Steamco site that's a smokin deal. As for grill cloth, I'm going to bring the guy a sample and see what he can get. Good luck with sourcing, I'm finding it kinda tough.

Oh yeah. I'm currently trying to find some kind of grill (a little protection) to wrap grill cloth around. Did you manage to find something like that??


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Ya I was about to say, the prices on that steamco site are ridiculous. You could order from the States, pay taxes and duty and STILL have it cost way less.

I would just build a baffle I think, wrap the grill cloth around it, and staple it at the back. I am not really concerned about more protection beyond that.


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## Bevo (Nov 24, 2006)

Just a tip, check your local car audio shop that does the custom installs. They will be able to sell you or let you know where to pick up your materials.

I used to build the car sub boxes and we used MDF in 3/4 or thicker, this we found was the best wood. I noticed the most high end guitar boxes are now coming made from plywood.,,still prefer MDF

If I was doing it for myself it would be 1 inch MDF for sealed and 3/4 for open back..screwed ( drywall screws )and glued..no nails.

Bev


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## james on bass (Feb 4, 2006)

Where are you getting your technical specs from?

Keep us posted on the build. I'm curious about building a small bass cab.


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## Bevo (Nov 24, 2006)

Oh yeah, most car shops have the boxes built and ready to go for less than $100, no wheels.

Even future shop or Best buy have them..Just make sure that the speaker has the correct air volume behind it. To small no lows, to big sounds like a tarp flapping in the wind.

Bev


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

Bevo, do you know if there has to be an exact volume measurement or is there some give and take. I made a sub box years ago for my car and got the optiaml internal volume measurement from the manufacturer through my buddy who owned a stereo shop. I wonder if the same applies to guitar cabs? From what I've read so far at various websites, the internal volume doesn't matter that much but one cabinet make said something like "make sure that the cabinet measurements are not all even numbers. Sounded kinda weird but the person meant that you shouldn't build a cab that is say 20 x 18 x 12. It should be something like 19.5 x 17 x 12. I can't really explain the reason why but it kinda made sense. As for what website it was - your guess is as good as mine. I'll be doing more searching later and if I come up with something I'll post it. 

Caution: my explaination was based on a rapidly deteriorating memory....


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

I donno...the more I research parts etc. the more I am leaning towards the Lopoline route. You can get an unassembled cab with everything you need from them for like $89 USD. Since they are a US company, I am assuming you'd only have to pay taxes on that as well. If they will ship USPS and I don't have to worry about courier fees, that might seal the deal.

They don't have any unassembled kits on eBay right now, but I see them there frequently.

If I bought an assembled one from them though, it would be one of these: http://www.lopoline.com/catalog/item/4313138/4243763.htm Man that looks cool.


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## Hamm Guitars (Jan 12, 2007)

Q-Components - http://www.loudspeakers.ca
Trans Canada Hardware (TCH) - http://www.tchweb.com


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## Bevo (Nov 24, 2006)

The volume depends on the driver and its called the "Q" factor I belive. The air inside the box acts as a spring, to small and you dont get the full travel of the speaker and end up losing your lows..thin sounding. To big your speaker losses its dampening, meaning after a note the speaker bounces around till it stops.
The type of speaker makes a difference on the box, an open back box speaker will have a stiffer surround, harder to move quicker to stop. A sealed will have a softer surround with minimal dampening, the cone will also be stiffer to help with flex.

Box designs for amps are pretty basic, car or home stuff get into the unbelivable.
I listened to a home set of speakers with 2 6 inch drivers and one tweet. It stood almost 6 feet tall and were at least 100 lb each. Fed with 500 watts each this thing could recreate a concert if you closed your eyes, the bass was enough to move my pants!! $11,000 a set 

Search the net for 1st, 2nd,3rd, 4th, order designs..also look at a system called a "transit port"
Each is different with the transit being the coolest to me. It uses a port with a adjusted length to meet a frequencey response, the port can be up to 10 feet long or longer..Think pipe organ..or those old Cerwin Vega bass bins..the deep one that they used as a floor.

I made one with a 12 JL at 45 pounds tuned to 28hz using a 11 foot port. In the car with 450 Watts it would hurt your ears, bounce the steering wheel yet you could talk to your buddy in the other seat.. Worked well once capped at 32HZ and cut off at around 100HZ.

Hearing is back to normal after 10 years.

Bev..


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## [email protected] (Feb 14, 2006)

torndownunit said:


> Ya I was about to say, the prices on that steamco site are ridiculous. You could order from the States, pay taxes and duty and STILL have it cost way less.
> 
> I would just build a baffle I think, wrap the grill cloth around it, and staple it at the back. I am not really concerned about more protection beyond that.


Hi, just a little note on USA shipping and tolex pricing mentioned:

Here is an example of a typical 1 yard of Fender Black tolex shipped to Toronto with taxes from Steamco in Canada:

Fender Black tolex $23 yd + $15 Fedex shipping + Gst = $40.28

Here is an example of a typical 1 yard of Fender Black tolex shipped to Toronto with taxes and import fees from Mojo Musical Supply in the USA:

Fender Black tolex $15 yd + $16 UPS shipping x 1.15 (current conversion rate) = $35.65 + $20 Brokerage = $55.90 + Pst & Gst = $63.17

AS you can see, big difference.

The tolex that Steamco sells and the tolex that Mojo sells comes from the exact same manufacturer and is the same tolex that is used by Fender.

It is very common to overlook the added cost of importing from the USA or any other country. I justed wanted to show everyone an apples to apples comparison. Thanks


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

[email protected] said:


> Hi, just a little note on USA shipping and tolex pricing mentioned:
> 
> Here is an example of a typical 1 yard of Fender Black tolex shipped to Toronto with taxes from Steamco in Canada:
> 
> ...



Ya but you are factoring in brokerage fees. If you use USPS there is none. And if the Tolex is made in the USA there is no duty either. And not to mention if the other is under $50, there will likely be no taxes anyway. Especially if it's shipped through USPS.

Plus Mojo tones prices are ridiculous as well. Look at supplies from a company like Lopoline. Example: that $150 USD cabinet from Lopoline would have no duties because it's made in the US. They also ship USPS so there is no brokerage fees. So all you'd have to pay is exchange and taxes. I could find a bunch of other places in the US selling tolex and parts for cheaper then Mojo.

No offense, but I do a fair amount of transactions with people in the States so I am not overlooking anything. You just have to research where you are buying from. And I would never buy from Mojo. Their prices are high, their shipping rates are too high, and they will only whip with a courier which means brokerage fees.


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## Wild Bill (May 3, 2006)

torndownunit said:


> No offense, but I do a fair amount of transactions with people in the States so I am not overlooking anything. You just have to research where you are buying from. And I would never buy from Mojo. Their prices are high, their shipping rates are too high, and they will only whip with a courier which means brokerage fees.



Well said, TDU! Brent has a good point but he did stretch some of the factors into his favour. I never order from Mojo either. Antique Radio is not a price leader but they still offer the black tolex for 18.95 U$/yd. The post office seems to work well these days and over the past year has sped up from 3-4 weeks to less than 2! 

Still, we shouldn't forget his point while picking apart his model. Steamco offers great convenience to us ampheads while asking a reasonable price. We should support such vendors to make sure they survive and thrive. Ordering from the USA will always be more work. We've seen how our government signed a free trade agreement but kept all the damn paperwork!


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Wild Bill said:


> Well said, TDU! Brent has a good point but he did stretch some of the factors into his favour. I never order from Mojo either. Antique Radio is not a price leader but they still offer the black tolex for 18.95 U$/yd. The post office seems to work well these days and over the past year has sped up from 3-4 weeks to less than 2!
> 
> Still, we shouldn't forget his point while picking apart his model. Steamco offers great convenience to us ampheads while asking a reasonable price. We should support such vendors to make sure they survive and thrive. Ordering from the USA will always be more work. We've seen how our government signed a free trade agreement but kept all the damn paperwork!



Wild Bill, I know I won't be popular for saying this but I disagree. I shop with whoever offers me the best price and service. I don't have a lot of money and I can't afford to support a company ONLY because they are Canadian. If the company offers me a decent price and service, I will support them. And I will pay slightly more if I can support a Canadian company. But in my opinion that is a pretty ridiculous price markup on the Tolex at Steamco.

I will admit I am no businessman or financial genius. But IMO if you just blindly support companies because of their location, you wind up in a situation like with the American auto industry. They start relaxing and offering worse service and product. I want to support companies that give me value. There are a few private sellers I deal with in the States who give me the best service and price plain and simple. So I use them. They work for my sale instead of acting like I am putting them out by contacting them. That is way more then I can say for a lot of local places I deal with.

This isn't a huge point, but beyond they are selling parts from foreign countries anyway. I probably would pay a little more for Canadian MADE tolex if it existed.


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## Wild Bill (May 3, 2006)

torndownunit said:


> Wild Bill, I know I won't be popular for saying this but I disagree. I shop with whoever offers me the best price and service. I don't have a lot of money and I can't afford to support a company ONLY because they are Canadian. If the company offers me a decent price and service, I will support them. And I will pay slightly more if I can support a Canadian company. But in my opinion that is a pretty ridiculous price markup on the Tolex at Steamco.
> 
> I will admit I am no businessman or financial genius. But IMO if you just blindly support companies because of their location, you wind up in a situation like with the American auto industry. They start relaxing and offering worse service and product. I want to support companies that give me value. There are a few private sellers I deal with in the States who give me the best service and price plain and simple. So I use them. They work for my sale instead of acting like I am putting them out by contacting them. That is way more then I can say for a lot of local places I deal with.
> 
> This isn't a huge point, but beyond they are selling parts from foreign countries anyway. I probably would pay a little more for Canadian MADE tolex if it existed.


We're not so far apart, TDU. I consider a source being domestic as having added value. I can expect no brokerage fees and faster/cheaper shipping. It's a question of HOW MUCH of a premium will that cost me!

I remember in '77 buying my first new vehicle: a Dodge van. It had a 2 year warranty and in the 3rd year it nearly put me in the poor house. Electronic ignition units blowing up, catalytic converters failing a 100 kms past warranty and the rear end/differential grinding itself into pieces. I was on the hook for all of it. I finally dumped it and bought a 1980 VW convertible. Later I found out that there were secret warrantees on all my Chrysler problems. Secret warranties were a factory idea. The plan was that when you came to the dealer they'd tell you that out of the goodness of their heart the factory was going to cover it! Naturally, you'd be so grateful and impressed that you'd be loyal to them forever!

In true Dilbert comic strip fashion they screwed it up by letting the dealer be on the hook for 6 months or so to get paid by the factory. So no dealer wanted to do the jobs and they wouldn't tell any owners about how they'd get their vehicle fixed for free. Too late for me and who knows how many others, of course.

So the 1st spring my girlfriend and some friends go up north camping. The first morning my VW convertible is gleaming whitely in the morning dew. Some burly guy comes along from a neighbouring camp site, sees my car and asks "Is that one of those German imports?" So I tell him that yes indeed, it is and it's my brand new pride and joy.

He hemmed and hawed and then blurted out "Don't you feel a little guilty about taking away a Canadian job?"

It turned out he worked for Chrysler in Windsor. I just lost it! I told him that I had just been screwed royally with the poor quality of my van. He told me about the secret warranties. I told him how the dealer never told me. He then said I should have brought my van around back of the Windsor plant and they would have fixed me up. I told him it was a helluva long trip to get something done that should have been done through the regular channels.

I finally told him that his pay rate as an autoworker was 2-3 times more than I ever made in my life! So why should I go through expensive horrors with a vehicle to preserve HIS job?!

That kinda ended the conversation...

Anyhow, electronic parts distribution was my career for over 25 years so I know the challenges of being Canadian. It's a catch-22, in that you have to be over a certain size to be able to get the lines of parts in the first place, let alone getting a decent cost. Often my disti cost was higher than the resale from an outlet in Buffalo, NY! Everything is based on volume. Wild Bill's Speaker Shoppe selling a few hundred speakers a year will never get as good a cost as Uncle Sam's Hornblowers that sells thousands.

What really gets my goat is when someone picks my brain all about specs, buys the part themselves and then wants me to tell them how to install it!
Needless to say...

I agree with you 100% about poor attitudes with many Canadian salespeople. There was a great episode of the tv show Northern Exposure some years ago that highlighted Canadian retail service. It had me in stitches!:tongue:


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## MykelJ (Nov 3, 2006)

I built a 2X12 speaker cab last summer. For corners and handles I bought from 
email: [email protected]
web: www.loudspeakers.ca

The handles were the recessed "marshall" type - solid metal. The corners were metal as well. I bought the "small" size corners, which are actually quite large (bigger than fender, but smaller than marshall). The "big" size is more for PA cabs.
Also bought the back jack plate (metal).

Email for recent price list (which is very low prices)- you have to call to order. They ship quick via canada post (you have options) so no high shipping cost. I don't think they charged shipping and handling either. And they do the best packing ever - big box, lots of styro peanut padding (I bought speakers from them before as well). I probably got my order in 2 days.

They do have speaker cloth, but I've never bought it or seen it - you can ask on the phone though.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

Wild Bill, that's a great story. It's a good demonstration of how some companies have no one to blame but themselves for their problems.

MykelJ thanks for the link. That is the same place I bought an Eminence speaker from and I was very happy with their service, shipping time and price. The last time I used their site it didn't have that blurb on the front page about how they sell parts. So it's cool that they do.


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## torndownunit (May 14, 2006)

wow you guys should download their catalogs. Great prices and a pretty good selection.


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## Scottone (Feb 10, 2006)

Wild Bill said:


> So the 1st spring my girlfriend and some friends go up north camping. The first morning my VW convertible is gleaming whitely in the morning dew. Some burly guy comes along from a neighbouring camp site, sees my car and asks "Is that one of those German imports?" So I tell him that yes indeed, it is and it's my brand new pride and joy.
> 
> He hemmed and hawed and then blurted out "Don't you feel a little guilty about taking away a Canadian job?"


I assume he didn't have any problem buying imported TV and stereo equipment, thus contributing to lost jobs in the Canadian electonics industry


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## Wild Bill (May 3, 2006)

Scottone said:


> I assume he didn't have any problem buying imported TV and stereo equipment, thus contributing to lost jobs in the Canadian electonics industry


Ah well, Scotty. Beam me up! There is no Canadian tv and stereo manufacturing!

It was gone by the mid 70's. There used to be plants like Clairtone and consumer items produced by Electrohome and others. Also Westinghouse, where I worked during the last half of the 80's with the few old folks left from the tube and home radio/tv plant.

When the world went transistor North American plants kept chugging on inertia trying to sell the same old tube stuff while the Japanese converted their manufacturing completely over to solid state and literally kicked American asses off the planet! Our factories ran till no one wanted enough units anymore and then they were sold off to become parking lots.

Westinghouse tried to survive by re-branding tubes to their name and by buying Japanese stereos and kitchen radios and rebranding them as well. They sold them under the name "Lloyds", if memory serves.

So we had a double whammy. We had old fogey factories that couldn't change with the times and a population that didn't care about supporting home products anyway.

I've got mixed feelings, I guess. I still remember my van troubles with anger and distaste. Yet today I watch how our government signed a trade deal with China that has worked out that we sell a couple of million dollars to them and they sell us ZILLIONS! You can go to Princess Auto and buy a table saw for $50 or go to Wal-Mart and get a pair of snow tires for $5 or something almost as ridiculous! The trade deficit is so bad it's scary and nobody seems to know or care.

This can't go on! Simple math says that we end up with stores full of cheap Chinese stuff and no high-paying manufacturing jobs so we can afford it! Or even poor-paying manufacturing jobs, for that matter. Last year we lost something like over half a million jobs in manufacturing. That's a lot of guys 45 years old competing for jobs as greeters at Wal-Mart, 'cuz there's nothing else for them.

That's why I got so mad when I heard Stephane Dion claim we had nothing to worry about job losses with his "green" ideas. He stated we could just invent new green technologies, become a world leader in selling to other countries and thus create even more new jobs! 

He was a philosophy professor, for Pete's sake! What the hell does he know about employment in the real world? Maybe for the sake of argument we could agree that it could happen (and I don't) but he's talking about the overall view from the luxury of his secure income. For ordinary folks when your factory closes you're lucky to find any job, usually at a far lower salary. If you're in your late 40's or older chances are most employers won't hire you. Age discrimination is a real thing, particularly when your career was spent making things no one here makes anymore.

So even if job gains match job losses, it's not the same people in those jobs. Individuals suffer while statistics look rosy.

I'm actually a big believer in free trade but not with hidden advantages. China has virtually no anti-pollution costs in their manufacturing. This can be a big part of their price advantage. To have a level playing field I believe we should charge tariffs equal to the extra costs of our own manufacturers.

Enough! I should be in the "open mic" forum with this stuff!

Besides, I'm late "Dumble-izing" an amp for a customer...:rockon2:


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