# Why Are Guitars With Laminate Back and Sides Cheaper?



## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

It seems like gluing a bunch of pieces of wood would be more labour intensive than using a solid piece. 

Wouldn't that longer process cost more in man hours?


----------



## blueshores_guy (Apr 8, 2007)

I have watched the lamination process at Heritage in Kalamazoo for guitar backs:
Pick a piece of wood off the stack, lay it on the bench. This one's going to be on the inside of the guitar, so doesn't need to be #1 quality. 
Brush on a layer of glue. (Glop it out of a jar and spread it around quickly with a paint brush.)
Pick the next piece of wood. This one's going in the middle of the three layers, so doesn't need to be #1 quality either.
Lay the second piece onto the first, with the direction of the grain 90 degrees different from the first piece.
Brush on a layer of glue.
Pick the third piece of wood. This one needs to be presentable, because it will be what you see as the back of the guitar. 
Lay it onto the second piece, good side up. Grain is oriented the same as the first piece. 
Put the three glued pieces into a press, let sit until the glue dries.
The whole operation from stacked wood to press takes maybe a minute. 

I suspect the higher cost of a one-piece back is the wood.


----------



## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

Seems like the cost in time would negate any savings in wood. 

Guess not.


----------



## bluzfish (Mar 12, 2011)

As blueshores_guy mentioned, the laminating process is very quick and can use lesser quality woods in the lamination.

Solid woods come in a wide quality range and must be shed or kiln dried for weeks or even years for some private stock. There is a great deal of skill involved in how to dehydrate and then rehydrate the wood.

So a solid wood material needs considerably more processing than a laminate material. Good and bad quality instruments can be made of either. In fact one of my all time favourite guitar models is an early 70s Yamaha FG180 laminate construction dreadnought.


----------



## gtrguy (Jul 6, 2006)

Guncho said:


> Seems like the cost in time would negate any savings in wood.
> 
> Guess not.


Keep in mind also that most manufacturers wouldn't be laminating the wood themselves, they would be buying sheets of pre-laminated plywood to use for construction.


----------



## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

I think Martin does it themselves.


----------



## gtrguy (Jul 6, 2006)

Possibly, I was thinking more about companies like Yamaha, Epiphone, Ibanez, etc. Martin's HPL (High Pressure Laminate) is not a traditional type of laminated plywood- it's paper and resin with a grain pattern on the outside.


----------



## BMW-KTM (Apr 7, 2015)

Whether they do it themselves or buy it from a supplier it will still be mass produced and the lesser quality of the core wood (between the layers) makes it more economically feasible. Some would also argue (I count myself among them) less resonant than a single ply slab of high quality wood.


----------



## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Since the sound board (top) and the bracing have most of the job in producing sound, what the sides are made of will have very little effect on sound. In many cases it would take an anechoic chamber to tell the difference.


----------



## vadsy (Dec 2, 2010)

Steadfastly said:


> Since the sound board (top) and the bracing have most of the job in producing sound, what the sides are made of will have very little effect on sound. In many cases it would take an anechoic chamber to tell the difference.


Source??...


----------



## itf? (May 27, 2009)

Guncho said:


> Seems like the cost in time would negate any savings in wood.
> 
> Guess not.


Definitely not. A minute or 5 putting together the thin sheets to make plywood probably cost what, $10? And can be done without any real amount of sifting through the pile. The inside and middle pieces can even be made of several pieces of wood glued next to each other. 

However, getting a nice, solid piece to cut back and sides from can take a lot of picking not to mention the amount of wood that gets thrown into the "B-grade" pile.....the stuff that later gets laminated. Think of the extra man hours required to do so and all that extra wood that wasn't used has a cost associated with it as well. 




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## gtrguy (Jul 6, 2006)

Steadfastly said:


> Since the sound board (top) and the bracing have most of the job in producing sound, what the sides are made of will have very little effect on sound. In many cases it would take an anechoic chamber to tell the difference.


LOL.... 10 characters


----------



## jazzalta (Aug 3, 2006)

Steadfastly said:


> Since the sound board (top) and the bracing have most of the job in producing sound, what the sides are made of will have very little effect on sound. In many cases it would take an anechoic chamber to tell the difference.


 Begs the question then why some of Ramirez top of the line guitars use double sides?


----------



## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

Steadfastly said:


> Since the sound board (top) and the bracing have most of the job in producing sound, what the sides are made of will have very little effect on sound. In many cases it would take an anechoic chamber to tell the difference.



Could not disagree with you more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsNYEnF6lVE


----------

