# Fulltone to close after 30 years



## Ti-Ron (Mar 21, 2007)

> Fulltone To Close It's Doors After 30 Years In Business 💔 Statement from Michael Fuller of Fulltone: “It’s with a heavy heart that I announce that Fulltone will be closing its doors in CA after 30 years. The building, which I own, is up for sale. Myself and my crew want to thank you for your support all these years and for putting up with my eccentricities as well. Do not feel sorry for me, I have made many mistakes and learned a lot in the past 30n years. The heavy heart is for my 10, 15, 20, and 26 year employees who are like family...I would have closed Fulltone years ago were it not for them. I've done well financially thanks in part to you, and to the many large years in the roaring 2000s and beyond plus real estate and some good investments, so it's time to enjoy the fruits of all that labor. I'm closing the Fulltone CA Shop because I will not start pumping my person money into a business that no longer turns a profit...this 4 year climate makes 100% made in the USA impossible. Fulltone will remain a valid Corporation, I'll continue to vigorously defend my $3M worth of worldwide Trademarks & Patent, and will build a few pedals here and there as I am vividly aware of what it takes to keep my brand from being stolen. My plans? My wife and I bought a well-known artist's 17 acre property and world-class recording studio outside of Nashville last year, so I'm going back to what I'm good at, playing guitar and recording my mediocre 70's rock. And I'll do the occasional outside project, particularly for unknown talent who could never otherwise afford to record through tape machines and great digital, let alone have 99 finely-tuned vintage guitar, 65 vintage amps, and a tone of the finest vintage microphones at their disposal. It's time for the old guy to move out of the way and make room for the geniuses of the next, more digital, generation. Thank you again, and feel free to reach out! Michael Fuller/Fulltone"


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

I have gone through most of his pedal lineup over the years. I still have a few keepers. He started off being very cool and approachable in the early days, but I can see how he could become a little bitter with all the internet experts out there. I wish him well in his retirement.

I still have a Mike Fuller CD around here. The guy can play too.


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## DavidP (Mar 7, 2006)

Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy... maybe my FD III will attain Klon-like prices in the coming months/years!!


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

Robhotdad said:


> Does Mike Fuller have any posts up anywhere calling any of you "assholes"?


Does an email count? Dude is one of the most arrogant pricks I have ever had the misfortune of communicating with.

TG


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## EchoWD40 (Mar 16, 2007)

markxander said:


> if you wanna lick boots be my guest. mike fuller has been publicly and obviously a cheesy rotten dude and i am not going to bend over backwards pretending he isn't


Quick, someone spot the virtue signaling lib!


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

Thunderboy1975 said:


> Like your homes arent full of shit made by assholes.😜


Hell, I’ll do ya’ one better…
Every single thing in my home is _owned_ by an asshole.


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## Mark Brown (Jan 4, 2022)

2manyGuitars said:


> Hell, I’ll do ya’ one better…
> Every single thing in my home is _owned_ by an asshole.


You sir have just made my day. Can't argue that logic.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

Robhotdad said:


> Does Mike Fuller have any posts up anywhere calling any of you "assholes"? I don't know the man, I don't know that he assaulted anyone, he might even have opinions that aren't popular. Popular by the way does not make correct. When somebody speaks to me to tell me that so and so, whom I've never met, is a #@[email protected]#$, I take a very hard look at the messenger first.


He made some remarks during BLM protests that were not taken well by the general public and then was conbative about it (just google Mike Fuller controversy). Obviously he pulled them down and apologized, but the damage had been done.

My issue is his blaming his lack of profitability on "the current 4-year cycle." Lots of other businesses doing just fine though. But, he made his political views known previously. 

And yes, he reportedly (not a pedal guy myself) made great stuff.

Agreed with all on the emoyees that he considers family (do they get drunk and yell at each other at Christmas?). I would not be surprised if they end up starting a pedal business.

I take no joy in Fulltone shutting down. Lots of people all over the political spectrum are being hurt by the current environment, when instead we could all just agree to disagree. But now it's all anger and hatred. And what does that get anyone?


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## BlueRocker (Jan 5, 2020)

I hope he manages to have a happy retirement without me giving a shit about him or his defunct company.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

2manyGuitars said:


> Hell, I’ll do ya’ one better…
> Every single thing in my home is _owned_ by an asshole.


Well played sir.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Robhotdad said:


> he might even have opinions that aren't popular





Rollin Hand said:


> He made some remarks during BLM protests that were not taken well by the general public and then was conbative about it ..
> .. Lots of people all over the political spectrum are being hurt by the current environment, when instead we could all just agree to disagree. But now it's all anger and hatred. And what does that get anyone?


I wonder if it came down to having the wrong opinion? like every one else being cancelled, doxxed, careers destroyed etc.








Fulltone founder Michael Fuller faces backlash over criticism of George Floyd protesters


UPDATE (12/6): We have changed the headline of this article to better reflect the nature of Fuller’s controversial statements. UPDATE (7/6): Fuller’s apology has been taken down from the Fulltone Facebook page. UPDATE (3/6): Michael Fuller has since given a statement in response to the backlash...




guitar.com




_A post on Fulltone’s official Facebook page, which uses Fuller’s picture as its profile image and regularly features the pedal builder posting in the first person on it, criticised the local response to the demonstrations, stating: “What is this like night 4 of looting with 100% impunity. The pussy Mayor and Governor don’t give a shit about small businesses, and it’s never been more clear.”

The original post was followed half an hour later with a comment on the original post stating, “Ahh I feel better, and flushed out some prissy boys who were raised to pee sitting down. Now I’ll delete.”_


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

Rollin Hand said:


> He made some remarks during BLM protests that were not taken well by the general public and then was conbative about it (just google Mike Fuller controversy).


I've read that tweet a thousand times and although crass given the timing, I still fail to see what about them would justify his ability to sell his products being cut out from under him.

I've heard the stories of his customer service and he probably isn't the most pleasant person to deal with, his press always came off as extremely arrogant to me, but it was very odd to watch an anti-looting tweet become the undoing of a stalwart pedal brand.

All that being said, I look forward to people trying to make huge amounts of money trying to sell pedals that by all accounts aren't rare or valuable.

As an aside, it's weird that L&M did a price raise on a bunch of his stuff like 3 weeks ago.


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

Looks like I made a pretty good buy last month…








Bidding starts at $1milllion.


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## Jaime (Mar 29, 2020)

EchoWD40 said:


> Quick, someone spot the virtue signaling lib!


I think your Fuck Trudeau bumper sticker is peeling. 



Okay Player said:


> I've heard the stories of his customer service and he probably isn't the most pleasant person to deal with, his press always came off as extremely arrogant to me, but it was very odd to watch an anti-looting tweet become the undoing of a stalwart pedal brand.


Making such a strong pro-police statement in the middle of a nationwide protest of said police murdering black people on your company page isn't a simple "don't steal shit" tweet.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Jaime said:


> Making such a strong pro-police statement in the middle of a nationwide protest of said police murdering black people on your company page isn't a simple "don't steal shit" tweet.


At the risk of being political, where does it state that 'anti-looting' equates to 'pro-police'?
Please provide links?


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## markxander (Oct 24, 2009)

laristotle said:


> I wonder if it came down to having the wrong opinion? like every one else being cancelled, doxxed, careers destroyed etc.


Did you even read what fuller wrote? He sure doesn't think he got cancelled or suffered any negative side affects from being a public shithead, so I don't know why we should wring our hands about it


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

As this thread amply illustrates, many folks (including Mike) have a hard time being civil and restrained online. If you have a problem with Mr.Fuller's behaviour, rise above it, don't copy it.


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

2manyGuitars said:


> Hell, I’ll do ya’ one better…
> Every single thing in my home is _owned_ by an asshole.


Its not nice to talk like that about your wife.


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## Thunderboy1975 (Sep 12, 2013)

Sneaky said:


> Its not nice to talk like that about your wife.


...and your cat.😛


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## markxander (Oct 24, 2009)

laristotle said:


> At the risk of being political, where does it state that 'anti-looting' equates to 'pro-police'?
> Please provide links?


do you have a serious good-faith argument that mike fuller was talking about something else?


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## JBFairthorne (Oct 11, 2014)

I’m not sure that I would describe someone bitching that the governor (and police) aren’t enforcing the law and protecting businesses from looters is pro-police. Exactly the opposite in fact.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

markxander said:


> do you have a serious good-faith argument that mike fuller was talking about something else?


no I don't. I'm not a pedal guy and have no idea who this man is, or his opinions.
but, from what I've read in this thread, I get the impression that many don't like him because he goes against the narrative.
seems that expressing one's opinion can be dangerous in today's society.


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

laristotle said:


> no I don't. I'm not a pedal guy and have no idea who this man is, or his opinions.
> but, from what I've read in this thread, I get the impression that many don't like him because he goes against the narrative.
> seems that expressing one's opinion can be dangerous in today's society.


Give it a rest. You're arguing yet don't even know what he said or did???


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## YaReMi (Mar 9, 2006)

I have no idea what kind of a character the Fulltone owner/creator is and I don't care. I love my OCD. I've been taking it every week to our local LMC Blues Jams in London for several years .. always just one pedal and it took me few years before I started looking in other directions.
I love my Fulltone OCD 🎯


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## markxander (Oct 24, 2009)

laristotle said:


> no I don't. I'm not a pedal guy and have no idea who this man is, or his opinions.
> but, from what I've read in this thread, I get the impression that many don't like him because he goes against the narrative.
> seems that expressing one's opinion can be dangerous in today's society.


if you insist on participating:

1. Read his rationale for closing fulltone -- does it sound like he's suffering literally any consequences of people not liking him personally?

2. Has anyone who got "cancelled" actually suffered any significant lasting consequences anyways? louis ck is selling out shows and filming specials like nothing happened. the recent alex jones civil trial showed that he actually made way more money after he was "deplatformed". it's been years of this and i am getting really bored of the "this poor rich guys life will be ruined" argument -- at this point, it feels pretty toothless


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Xx


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

Jaime said:


> Making such a strong pro-police statement in the middle of a nationwide protest of said police murdering black people on your company page isn't a simple "don't steal shit" tweet.


I didn't read it as being a strong pro-police statement. A lot of Californians were upset about how strict their lockdowns were and the way that their public officials flip flopped on gatherings during said protests. I just figured he was pissed about that. I know a few different folks who live out that way, and the ones who didn't move because of it are still pissed. That of course, is just my interpretation.


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## Okay Player (May 24, 2020)

2manyGuitars said:


> Looks like I made a pretty good buy last month…
> View attachment 433729
> 
> Bidding starts at $1milllion.


Part of me is like "I shoudl have held on to that Candy Red OCD" the other part of me is like "Good riddance".


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## amp boy (Apr 23, 2009)

Fulltone is like KISS, and Mike Fuller is Gene Simmons.


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

I've used the FT Clyde Wah for so long it's a part of my foot. It's an amazing product. I have 3 so I'm good for life. I had a long talk with him 15 or 20 years ago, and we got along fine on the phone talking gear. We never got into politics and at that time it wasn't on the front burner that it is now. I wish him luck with all his bags of pedal money.


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## jimmythegeek (Apr 17, 2012)

Robhotdad said:


> Does Mike Fuller have any posts up anywhere calling any of you "assholes"? I don't know the man, I don't know that he assaulted anyone, he might even have opinions that aren't popular. Popular by the way does not make correct. When somebody speaks to me to tell me that so and so, whom I've never met, is a #@[email protected]#$, I take a very hard look at the messenger first.


He may very well although I neither know nor care. I sleep fine either way. I am a bearded lefty libtard though and possibly even a “hipster”. On that note I would like to say that I disliked Mike Fuller before it was cool lol.

You are right for the most part. Shitting all over strangers on the internet is childish and in poor taste. I dislike the man but certainly don’t wish him ill.


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Guncho said:


> Give it a rest. You're arguing yet don't even know what he said or did???


Precisely. Read again. How does anti-looting equate to pro-police?
Not arguing, asking.
Please provide links to help me understand.


markxander said:


> Read his rationale for closing fulltone


From what I read in this thread, he wanted to retire.
If there's more to it, provide links please.


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## markxander (Oct 24, 2009)

laristotle said:


> Precisely. Read again. How does anti-looting equate to pro-police?
> Not arguing, asking.
> Please provide links to help me understand.
> 
> ...


so what's the connection between him wanting to retire and "I wonder if it came down to having the wrong opinion? like every one else being cancelled, doxxed, careers destroyed etc."? you're literally the guy that is doing the wondering.


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## TubeStack (Jul 16, 2009)

An interesting element of this story is that, so far, there has been no official confirmation as to whether it's true or not. The original source was an unverified post on TGP with no info about where it came from. Then MusicRadar picked it up, but the article still only referred to the TGP thread. And now there's a YouTube video from the Vertex guy, haha. 

Not saying it isn't true, but it's been interesting watching it grow without any verification and very few people questioning what they've read.

(There is a TGP member who found a for sale ad for the Fulltone building, which seems to back up the story, and which incidentally and bizarrely instructs interested buyers to not talk to any employees because they don't know the building is for sale.)


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## player99 (Sep 5, 2019)

And why wouldn't he sell the business?


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## EchoWD40 (Mar 16, 2007)

Jaime said:


> I think your Fuck Trudeau bumper sticker is peeling.
> 
> 
> 
> Making such a strong pro-police statement in the middle of a nationwide protest of said police murdering black people on your company page isn't a simple "don't steal shit" tweet.


Imagine thinking like you do, unironically. LMAO


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## jbealsmusic (Feb 12, 2014)

player99 said:


> And why wouldn't he sell the business?


It's more common than not for businesses with single owners/founders to close rather than sell and continue on without them. Or, they sell the pieces of it, but not the IPs (the name/brand).

The other possibility is that he tried to sell it, but couldn't find a buyer at the number he wanted for it.


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## Jim DaddyO (Mar 20, 2009)

I don't know Mike or ever met him. He has a reputation for being a bit of a "forceful" personality by some, others think he's just fine. That's pretty typical of everyone. Either way, he did have a reputation for a good product (ask Robin Trower) and perhaps to get the product made the way he wanted it made, he had to have a bit of a "forceful" personality. There are other successful business people that are of the same ilk (Elon Musk comes to mind, a bit flakey but has tech that works, and sells). Maybe he's a bit thin skinned and takes critisism of his product as a personal insult, who knows? Doesn't matter to me, if the chance came along, I would buy a Fulltone pedal at the right price.


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## traynor_garnet (Feb 22, 2006)

laristotle said:


> no I don't. I'm not a pedal guy and have no idea who this man is, or his opinions.
> but, from what I've read in this thread, I get the impression that many don't like him because he goes against the narrative..


Many don’t like him because he Is a rude arrogant a$$hole. His ‘customer service’ had turned many off the brand long before he posted anything on social media.

TG


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

traynor_garnet said:


> Many don’t like him because he Is a rude arrogant a$$hole. His ‘customer service’ had turned many off the brand long before he posted anything on social media.
> 
> TG


This is the truth of the matter. Old news, way pre pandemic.


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## Always12AM (Sep 2, 2018)

It’s really hard to make a difference in society. But I like to think that by proactively never buying a bullshit Fulltone pedal.. I have single handedly solved racism in the lives of all of the disadvantaged black people who live in 1.2 million dollars homes in my community and drive a Tesla 145km/h passed all of the homeless white people on their way to Starbucks everyday. #William #wilberforce #woke


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

I’ve got no axe to grind here, I really just love the word asshole.

(Yeah, the puns.)


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

From what I can see, the guy has been living rent free in a lot of minds for awhile now.

Ted Nugent is a major Richard Cranium, but I still love Stranglehold.....


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## laristotle (Aug 29, 2019)

Milkman said:


> Richard Cranium





https://fictspedia.fandom.com/wiki/Richard_Cranium


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## 2manyGuitars (Jul 6, 2009)

Milkman said:


> From what I can see, the guy has been living rent free in a lot of minds for awhile now.
> 
> Ted Nugent is a major Richard Cranium, but I still love Stranglehold.....


One thing I discovered about Ted…

He has a particular fondness for playing in a minor.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

2manyGuitars said:


> One thing I discovered about Ted…
> 
> He has a particular fondness for playing in a minor.


Unfortunately, he's on a rather long list of such artists.

If we stop listening to, or purchasing from all who have somehow transgressed social norms and morality, there won't be much left.


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## amp boy (Apr 23, 2009)

Mooh said:


> I’ve got no axe to grind here, I really just love the word asshole.
> 
> (Yeah, the puns.)


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Let's do some math.
How long has Fulltone been around? Thirty years. When do you figure he started it? Given the bankroll/loan required to establish it, probably not before he was 25 or so. So, the guy decides that he's had enough, can't compete with Asian minipedals, isn't keen on going digital and reinventing his brand, and is worth enough in assets that he can afford to retire in his mid-to-late 50s. Everywhere I go, I see "Prime 55" magazines, and ads for "Freedom 55". For those of us who worked past that age, because we needed to in some way, I understand the resentment of those who could cash out earlier. BUT Fuller is NOT that unusual. There's a HUGE distance between him and Martin Shkreli, so get over it. You don't have to like the guy as a drinking buddy or brother-in-law, but he's not a super-villain.

As for selling the business, in phone calls with Steve Daniels (who decided it was _finally_ time to retire in his 70s), after selling Small Bear Electronics (Brooklyn home of specialty parts for all boutique builders) to Synthcube in Boston, Steve conveyed that preparing a business for sale was a _lot_ harder than he imagined. He said he learned a lot about selling businesses in the process, but that it does him no damn good at this point in his life! Fuller seems to have sidestepped that, so good for him (although Steve merely rented space, while Mike has to find a buyer for the property).


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## Scottone (Feb 10, 2006)

I talked to Mike back in '95 when I purchased my orange Fulldrive II (serial #411). We had a good discussion about the pedal and gear in general and he sent me a great pedal. I cashed in when the price shot up on the early Fulldrives, but have had sellers remorse ever since.

I wish him good luck in his retirement


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## fogdart (Mar 22, 2017)

This thread can get political very easily. Arguably, Mike was forced to retire based on a comment he made on a controversial sociopolitical topic. Forum rules specify no political conversation, so please keep that chapter of the Fulltone story out of this thread.

I do not have the desire to read thru all of the flagged posts, delete them, delete any posts that they’ve quoted or been quoted in. So, if we can’t keep this thread politics-free I’ll be locking it for further discussion.

The post above mine is a great example of discussion about Fulltone that will be tolerated on this site. Thanks everyone.


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## jimmythegeek (Apr 17, 2012)

mhammer said:


> Let's do some math.
> How long has Fulltone been around? Thirty years. When do you figure he started it? Given the bankroll/loan required to establish it, probably not before he was 25 or so. So, the guy decides that he's had enough, can't compete with Asian minipedals, isn't keen on going digital and reinventing his brand, and is worth enough in assets that he can afford to retire in his mid-to-late 50s. Everywhere I go, I see "Prime 55" magazines, and ads for "Freedom 55". For those of us who worked past that age, because we needed to in some way, I understand the resentment of those who could cash out earlier. BUT Fuller is NOT that unusual. There's a HUGE distance between him and Martin Shkreli, so get over it. You don't have to like the guy as a drinking buddy or brother-in-law, but he's not a super-villain.
> 
> As for selling the business, in phone calls with Steve Daniels (who decided it was _finally_ time to retire in his 70s), after selling Small Bear Electronics (Brooklyn home of specialty parts for all boutique builders) to Synthcube in Boston, Steve conveyed that preparing a business for sale was a _lot_ harder than he imagined. He said he learned a lot about selling businesses in the process, but that it does him no damn good at this point in his life! Fuller seems to have sidestepped that, so good for him (although Steve merely rented space, while Mike has to find a buyer for the property).


Shkreli buying the one off Wu-Tang album while actively hating a number of the members and taunting them publicly would make him a grade A heel without the ruining of peoples’ lives with his pharmaceutical company.

Part of the dislike for Fuller is also probably tied to our tendency as a society to build up underdogs and then resent them when they actually succeed. I remember reading reviews of some of his early pedals and thinking “Right on! Taking the fight to the mega corporations!” Once he became part of the “establishment” I’m sure many lumped him in with companies far larger than his. This is quite unfair as, even at its peak, there’s no way Fulltone was shifting nearly as many units as Boss or Ibanez.

In an effort to shift the tone of the thread I’ll share a nice Fulltone related story:

When I was getting serious about building up a nice rig I desperately wanted a vintage Fender amp. It was not in the cards. A local player who was a friend of a friend was kind enough to lend me his super early Supa Trem. Just like that, all of my Bill Frisell dreams came true. I bought it off him eventually, as well as my beloved Doyle 1X12 cab. I later learned that this gear liquidation (he was selling a ton) was because he had cancer and had been told to “get his affairs in order.” A public school custodian’s pension isn’t huge so he was liquidating to make sure his wife would be OK when he was gone. Years later, the friend and I were chatting and we realized that he hadn’t ended up with anything of Nick’s. He had bought an amp off of him before but they had worked on pedal mods etc. together and been quite close. Even though he didn’t use tremolo much I wanted him to have it. He died about 2 years later. I have very fond memories of both men and the stomp box that tied us together. I’m glad Mike built it.


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## Paul Running (Apr 12, 2020)

I believe that Mr. Fuller will enjoy it more as a hobby now.


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## zztomato (Nov 19, 2010)

Mike F was never an asshole to me. He's made lots of great gear over the years and I've had my fair share of his products and still own a couple.
I don't think Mike is an outlier in business. He doesn't suffer fools.
Most of the hate is generated by trolls on that steaming pile of shit called TGP and other sites where you are not provided context for much of what is said. There's usually someone's agenda behind it hiding between the lines.


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## Rollin Hand (Jul 12, 2012)

Okay Player said:


> I've read that tweet a thousand times and although crass given the timing, I still fail to see what about them would justify his ability to sell his products being cut out from under him.
> 
> I've heard the stories of his customer service and he probably isn't the most pleasant person to deal with, his press always came off as extremely arrogant to me, but it was very odd to watch an anti-looting tweet become the undoing of a stalwart pedal brand.
> 
> ...


I agree, in the grand scheme of things, the backlash was somewhat unjustified. I don't think we should persecute or yell at someone because they disagree with us -- just like I disagree with him that profitability is impossible because of who is in power in Washington. Opinions are like what 2ManyGuitars calls himself... Fuller was expressing concern about looting, albeit with great indelicacy and more than a little smugness.

And there have been cases of people getting unjustifiably cancelled when a calm, "let's think about this before we react" approach would really save a lot of pain for people who don't deserve it.









'That's Not Who I Am': Lianne Wadi Fired By Father, Holy Land CEO, After Racist Posts Resurface


The CEO of Holy Land, a gourmet grocery, bakery and deli in the Twin Cities, has announced the decision to fire his own daughter after racist posts from her past resurfaced.




www.cbsnews.com


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## BadHiwatt (May 9, 2017)

It seems like the free market has spoken.


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