# Mesa Boogie Express 525



## Eric1623 (May 20, 2009)

Hi Guys,

I am looking at getting an amp for my SG, I have been using my POD XT on set of high-end computer speakers for the past while. But I am now thinking of getting a small Amp (I live in an apartment style condo). I was looking at the Mesa Boogie Express 525 with the 10” speaker because it goes down to 5 watts and sounds great. Does anyone have one of these? If so what do you think of it? Are there any other Mesa Boogie models I should look at? Any other brads that I should consider (I don't want to spend more then $1500 new)? I don’t want to get anything to power full I don’t gig at all and don’t plan on doing any giging in the future. 

Thanks for your help,

Eric


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## dufe32 (Feb 5, 2007)

The 5:25 will be powerful enough, even with a drummer. I used to own the 5:50 and I was always using it on the 5 watts settings. At first, it's a dark sounding amp, like all Boogies I had the pleasure to own, but with a little tweaking - the contour knob is your friend - it opens up and reveals nice tones. Clean channel is superb and the dirt channel is classic rock all the way. Maybe more if you push it with your favorite boost pedal (metal territory). I play in a top 40 classic rock band and it did the job nicely, from Metallica to Steppenwolf. It's well made, like all Boogies I did own.

You might consider the Traynor YCS50 - switcheable to 15 watts - it's a very affordable amp, surprising quality of tone for the price. Great bang for the buck. Less dark than Boogie, has more of a Marshall taste and cuts nicely in a mix. Made in Canada.

I'm not saying the Traynor is superior to Boogie, they are 2 different beasts, but for the money spent, the Traynor is hard to beat.


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## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

Eric1623 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> (I don't want to spend more then $1500 new)? I don’t want to get anything to power full I don’t gig at all and don’t plan on doing any giging in the future.
> 
> ...


With your budget there is literally no end to the great low-wattage amps available to you. It comes down to what tone you are looking for and how quiet you need to play in your condo. 5 watts is very loud. With overdrive pedals and/or boost pedals my Blackheart amp can be painfully loud (ask my wife and neighbors) but set to 3 watts and played clean with a jazz tone it sounds fantastic and I can hear the sound of the pick on my strings.

If you are looking for rock and/or metal sounds a better option than simply a low watt amp may be to get the combo amp that sounds right and an attenuator to tame the volume. I speak from experience here.


Some good low watt amps in (or well under) your price range:

Orange Tiny Terror (5/7 watts)
Blackheart Handsome Devil (15 watt), Little Giant (5/3Watts), or Killer Ant (1 Watt)
Vox Nighttrain
Vox AC4, AC15 (even the heritage editions - nice!)
BadCat, Victoria, Dr Z and a number of other boutique amp makers make great low watt amps in your price range too.

The big name attenuator makers are;

Weber: http://www.tedweber.com/atten.htm
THD
Dr. Z

I'm sure a few other forumites will chime in with their suggestions.

Good luck in your search.

Matt

(P.S. I have a Peavey Windsor studio in good shape that I could sell you. It has the feature set you need, it is voiced for a rock/metal tone - not much clean there. PM me if interested)


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

I'm on a few forums, and the guys who've used this amp were pretty underwhelmed.

something to remember is that 5W is still stupid loud when you crank it up .

what sounds are you after?


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## Jimi D (Oct 27, 2008)

I must have missed the forums where the users are underwhelmed with the 5:25 Express... I _can_ say that on the Gear Page most of us who have them - me included - love them. I've had mine for a year, and it's a keeper, and I say this after going through pretty much every low-watt EL84 amp Mesa produced (Studio .22+, Subway Blues, Subway Rocket Reverb, F-30, I've owned 'em all!). I think Mesa's been steadily improving thier pre-amp designs with the EL84 power section over the years, and the Express is the best yet. 

Like most Boogies, the 5:25 has a highly interactive tone stack - if you sit in front of it and put all the tone knobs at 12:00 it will sound like crap. Use your ears to dial in your tone (pro tip: start with the mids and bass turned low, like around 8 o'clock) and there are many, many, many excellent tones in this little amp. It has a beautiful clean channel, and excellent grind and dirt... The "edge of breakup" clean sounds are some of the most dynamic and responsive I've played. At volume, this amp will keep up with the drummer for rehersal all by its lonesome, and the 1x10" isn't terribly boxy for such a small form factor... For gigging I run mine through an old Yorkville ported 2x12" loaded with '80s-vintage G12T75s and it sounds killer. Personally, I think this is one of the best amps Mesa has produced in years, and it mops the floor with the Tiny Terror and Blackheart stuff in terms of tone and versatility... It can do the Vox thing pretty convincingly too, especially in 5-watt mode. 

FTR, my other "keeper" tube amp is my vintage SF Deluxe Reverb that I've had forever and am permanently attached to. In the past I have owned a Boogie IIC+ Simul-Class, Rivera, Fender BF and Marshall JCM800 amps, so I think I have a pretty good ear...


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## Eric1623 (May 20, 2009)

Thanks for all the feedback;

I am looking for something that has a nice blues tube sound and a nice rock sound and also good clean. I have no plans to conect my pod to it but I might buy some boss pedals for it someday.

This Amp will be my only one as I don't have room for 2 amps in my place. So I don't mind spending a few bucks to get something good.

I have always liked Boogie amps.

The big thing is that I need something that will work in my condo and that is not too loud but I realy want something that is full tubes. 

I was going to look at Orange Amps too.

Thanks,

Eric


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## lbrown1 (Mar 22, 2007)

+1 on the previous note re: Traynor YCS50.......I had one on rental for a few months - $900 ish new it's well within your budget.....sounds FANTASTIC - especially for the application you noted.....looks a little ugly - and I prefer the controls mounted on top vs the front - but that's just my opinion...the master volume AND the ability to scale down to 15 watts will also fit your needs. It also has some cool voicing (brit/USA/Bright/Expanded) features as well.


another option worth exploring - the Peavy classic series - check out the 50 as I don't believe the 30 has a master volume control..nice tweed look.....and - they sound fabulous....

your POD XTL can also be used as just an effects bank - turn the output mode to "Combo Front" and make sure amp modelling is off on all your patches.....then feed it to the front of the amp.

I have not had much luck in getting a good tone with the POD in the effects loop...


great value for the $$ on both


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## avalancheMM (Jan 21, 2009)

I, too, have missed the sites that discuss the Mesa 5:25 as being 'underwhelming'. I have had mine about 10 months, and am thrilled with the variety of tones and control that Mesa engineered in to this design. It goes from clean to scream and every place in between. Go to your local L&M and try one - your opinion really is the only one that matters. 

Regards


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## starjag (Jan 30, 2008)

Jimi D said:


> Like most Boogies, the 5:25 has a highly interactive tone stack - if you sit in front of it and put all the tone knobs at 12:00 it will sound like crap.


This is the "feature" of the 5:25 that I did NOT like. I got one from L&M when they just came out, kept it for about 20 days trying to find settings that were useful to me with different guitars, but ended up returning it.

Personally, I prefer amps with simpler circuits with knobs that "get along" with each other well and produce useful tones along most of the sweep. Add pedals for extra flavor if needed.



avalancheMM said:


> Go to your local L&M and try one - your opinion really is the only one that matters.


... or better yet, buy it, take it home and test for a few days. Use the 30-day return period that L&M has. I always find it very hard to test equipment at the store. More so with the amps that require major knob twisting. Volume level is also an issue at the store... amps without a master volume like to be pushed a bit (or test with an attenuator).

Current production amps are much more consistent than guitars. If you return an amp and later find that that amp was _the one_, you can always go back to the store and order another one if they sold the one you tested. It is very likely that the one coming will sound the same. Guitars vary a lot more.


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## soldierscry (Jan 20, 2008)

+1 for the Traynor YCS50

I have the head on rent from L&M and it is awsome. not as dark sounding as the 5:25, the us/brit switch is nice but I wish it was foot switchable. the drive channel can get a very close heavy mesa sound.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

The thing about tube amps is, generally they sound best the more you push them. You're looking for a low-wattage amp because you live in a condo, but those 5W amps are still going to sound better when you get them above condo levels. I've been next to an epi valve jr pushing a 412 maxed out, it held up with the 120W JSX pushing the other 412 .

What amps do you have access to try? I think you should literally try everything.

Also have a look at the Zvex nano!


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## Eric1623 (May 20, 2009)

One quick question is there much difference in the volume (at 5 watts) with the 525 and the 550 they both go down to 5 watts the 550 has a 12" speaker and the 525 has a 10" speaker. I could see the bigger speaker being a bit louder.

Thanks for the feedback, I will think it over this weekend and try a few amps at L&M next week.


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## JimiGuy7 (Jan 10, 2008)

lbrown1 said:


> +1 on the previous note re: Traynor YCS50.......I had one on rental for a few months - $900 ish new it's well within your budget.....sounds FANTASTIC - especially for the application you noted.....looks a little ugly - and I prefer the controls mounted on top vs the front - but that's just my opinion...the master volume AND the ability to scale down to 15 watts will also fit your needs. It also has some cool voicing (brit/USA/Bright/Expanded) features as well.
> 
> 
> another option worth exploring - the Peavy classic series - check out the 50 as I don't believe the 30 has a master volume control..nice tweed look.....and - they sound fabulous....
> ...


I agree, I think the Traynor YCS' and the Peavey Classic series amp are awesome amps. They both sound great and are priced to sell but, I currently have a 1972 Traynor YBA 2B and it is 25 watts. Though it is loud enough to keep up with a good drummer, it is way too loud for my 2 little kids, even at low clean volumes. I had to buy a Weber attenuator so I could push it at a volume that would still be quiet enough for my kids to nap.


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## SUBnet192 (Mar 8, 2009)

We have a Mesa Express 5:50 for bedroom use (for now) and it's quite capable and sounds better than the 5:25 imho. I compared them in store and the 5:25 was a lot thinner sounding (10" speaker I think vs 12"). 

And man can this thing get loud if you want it to (and you will lol)

So my vote goes there


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## GuyB (May 2, 2008)

Last december, I hesitated between the Traynor YCS50 and the Mesa Express 5-50. Both are versatile, they are different in tone but I liked them both (but in particular, I like very much the clean channel of the YCS on the 15w and with the Brit voicing).
At the end, after comparing the two amps side by side, I choose the YCS because it is... quiet ! Even at full gain, it is quiet. On the Mesa thought, you get a very disturbing hiss (to my taste) as soon as you get to the first voicing of the lead channel.
It is true that the tone stack of the Mesa is different than other amps. I suggest to take a look at the User Manual to learn the basics because if you try to play around like you would with another amp, you'll get lost ! There is a logic in there, you just have to know how it works.
And, by the way, six months later, I don't regret at all the choice of the YCS !


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## lbrown1 (Mar 22, 2007)

couldn't agree more on the YCS50......if I didn't find a less expensive similarly toned option (used YCV50 Blue) I would have certainly snagged the YCS50 even if it is ugly


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## OddJobPeters (Mar 3, 2008)

Get your favorite amp, don't worry about the wattage. Then get an attenuator, either a Ho Attenuator or a Weber Mass (whichever version suites your needs or amp). Even 5 Watts is really loud when cranked to get power-tube saturation, so to play at talking levels you will need to get an attenuator regardless.

For $1500 you can get some great amps AND an attenuator. Then you have a usable amp if ever you play out with a band. Also, if you are inclined to record, make sure your attenuator has a line-level output. This allows you to capture the whole amp sound minus the speaker cab without your amp's speaker even running. You record that and add a software-based speaker cab simulator to it after - there are some great ones available. That being said, I have captured some great tones from miked speaker at conversation volume level, so you have some options.


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## Jimi D (Oct 27, 2008)

starjag said:


> ... or better yet, buy it, take it home and test for a few days. Use the 30-day return period that L&M has. I always find it very hard to test equipment at the store. More so with the amps that require major knob twisting. Volume level is also an issue at the store... amps without a master volume like to be pushed a bit (or test with an attenuator).
> 
> Current production amps are much more consistent than guitars. If you return an amp and later find that that amp was _the one_, you can always go back to the store and order another one if they sold the one you tested. It is very likely that the one coming will sound the same. Guitars vary a lot more.


Excellent suggestion and a really good point... You don't risk missing out on "The One And Only" if you get rid of an amp while trying others out and decide to go back to it later....


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## Bevo (Nov 24, 2006)

One better is to do the rental agreement and take it home for a month, then get a Traynor and so on till you have had a good amount of time on each.

I lived in an apartment and to keep any amp below TV levels was just Brutal. My Blackheart on 3 watts is still super loud.

A trick I use is to put my pedal in front of the amp then slowly adjust the volume of the amp up while adjusting the pedal volume down...Like a master volume.
The hard part is to balance it so you guitar output is enough to get your tone while the tubes are cooking.
The BH sounds good with the volume at 12 noon.

Also keep in mind that even with an attenuator or master volume the speakers are not going to move much, you loosing some tone there.

Bev


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## Eric1623 (May 20, 2009)

If a tube Amp is too loud for my condo, what sold state should I look at to get a nice clean sound? There are so many on the market!

I will talk to L&M and see what my rental options are (On tube amps). and look at getting one of those attenuators. 

Thanks for all your feedback,

Eric


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## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

Eric1623 said:


> If a tube Amp is too loud for my condo, what sold state should I look at to get a nice clean sound? There are so many on the market!
> 
> I will talk to L&M and see what my rental options are (On tube amps). and look at getting one of those attenuators.
> 
> ...


Solid state amps are generally poor sounding because they are intended to serve either the beginner market or the Death Metal market. There are some notable exceptions, but they are usually voiced for jazz and cost as much as a good tube amp.

Tube amp plus attenuator is the way to go. Especially because it gives you the option of using the amp you buy to play with other people in a louder setting.

matt


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## lbrown1 (Mar 22, 2007)

mrmatt1972 said:


> Solid state amps are generally poor sounding because they are intended to serve either the beginner market or the Death Metal market. There are some notable exceptions, but they are usually voiced for jazz and cost as much as a good tube amp.
> 
> Tube amp plus attenuator is the way to go. Especially because it gives you the option of using the amp you buy to play with other people in a louder setting.
> 
> matt


IMO - if you want crystal clean cleans - SS is a good option.......it's in the distortion where SS amps fall down.....it's either distorted or it isn't....no gradual staged overdrive....so to the ear - it can be harsh

I would personally agree though that a SS amp is poor sounding in comparison to a good tube amp - but only because I like my cleans to have a little filth.


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## Eric1623 (May 20, 2009)

mrmatt1972 said:


> Tube amp plus attenuator is the way to go. Especially because it gives you the option of using the amp you buy to play with other people in a louder setting.


What would be the best attenuator to get for the 525?

Would this one work fine?

https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/minimass.htm

Thanks,

Eric


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

there's definitely SS/digital amps that serve many people quite well...

look into a tech 21 trademark 30.


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## starjag (Jan 30, 2008)

Eric1623 said:


> What would be the best attenuator to get for the 525?
> 
> Would this one work fine?
> 
> ...


I personally would not get an attenuator with the 5:25. The 5:25 has a good master volume, it is rather pre-amp orientated (as other Mesa amps) and sounds very good at low volumes.

As mentioned before, you need to play with the knobs until you are happy with the tone. But you should be able to find settings at different volume levels that you like.

Attenuators are more suitable for amps that do not have a master volume, thus you need to crank them to achieve some overdrive.

If I remember correctly, the 5:25 has the option of a 10" or a 12" speaker. The 12" seems to be a better option for maybe a little extra cash.

The 5:50 not only has more power, but the tone is different due to the different power section.

Go to L&M and buy one of them... you will know what I mean once you start playing with it. I honestly believe that you do not need an attenuator with these particular amps.


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## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

Eric1623 said:


> What would be the best attenuator to get for the 525?
> 
> Would this one work fine?
> 
> ...


Yup, but if you go this route just do yourself a favour and spend the extra 25 dollars for the 50 watt minimass. Amps are rated using something called "RMS," which essentially means how many watts they push _before _power amp distortion. The _actual _amount of wattage you push out of the 25 watt setting on the 5:25 could easily be 50 watts because you'll _want _to play with power tube distortion - that's kind of the point of using tube amps.

Also, given your budget, you could get the 50 watt mass attenuator which adds the very useful feature of eq. Using attenuators (and the fact that you are hardly working your speaker) does alter your sound so having an extra eq post attenuator to fix up your sound is a very good thing.

https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/mass.htm

FYI you will not get the same sound out of the two different wattage settings on that Mesa. They will be close, but not the same. this is because full power uses all the tubes and runs them in pentode mode. 5 watts is half power (half the tubes) and triode mode. The above advise is especially important if you prefer the sound of the higher watt setting.

matt


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## 23cicero (Mar 25, 2008)

I have a 5:25 by the way and love it. I tried the 5:50 and really liked the tone - much fuller, richer sound certainly on the 50 watt channel but in the end I liked the 5:25 almost as much and the portability issue sold me. Great little grab and go amp. But giggable as well.

Just a note: there's no way that you need an attenuator for the 5:25. I play it all the time late at night with my girlfriend sleeping in the other room. You'll be fine in your condo.


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## Big_Daddy (Apr 2, 2009)

To the OP...have you considered just playing into headphones? If you don't ever plan on gigging and volume level is an issue, this may be the best option. I have a Digitech GNX-4 pedal board (bought on eBay for $350) that simply kicks ass through my Turtle beach headphones. It has a multitude of effects (amps, cabs, artist presets) as well as a built-in 8 track recorder that loops. It is the most fun I have had in my 40+ years of playing and no-one else in the house has to put up with my occasional need to blast the walls out. :rockon2:


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## Eric1623 (May 20, 2009)

Hi Guys,

I just wanted to let you all know I picked up the Express 525 tonight. L&M had a used one in stock and at $950 for one in mint shape, I could not resist! It sounds great, way better then my POD XT on computer speakers!

Thanks for all you feedback.

Eric


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## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

Good for you! nEW AMP DAY IS ALWAYS GREAT. eNJOY.

mATT


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## SUBnet192 (Mar 8, 2009)

Congrats and enjoy!


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## Jimi D (Oct 27, 2008)

Eric1623 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I just wanted to let you all know I picked up the Express 525 tonight. L&M had a used one in stock and at $950 for one in mint shape, I could not resist! It sounds great, way better then my POD XT on computer speakers!
> 
> ...


Congrats Eric! that's a great little amp you've got there, and at a great price! I know you'll find loads of inspirational tones in that little monster... 
:rockon2:


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## 23cicero (Mar 25, 2008)

Was that $950 for the 1x12 model or the older one with the 10" speaker. If that was $950 for the 112 then that's a pretty good deal and maybe I'll swing by the Calgary L & M and drop my paycheck on something that I don't really need...


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## Eric1623 (May 20, 2009)

23cicero said:


> Was that $950 for the 1x12 model or the older one with the 10" speaker. If that was $950 for the 112 then that's a pretty good deal and maybe I'll swing by the Calgary L & M and drop my paycheck on something that I don't really need...


It was the one with the 10" ($950 used) new they are going for $1450. They did not have any 12"'s in stock as far as I know, I don't think they are much more new (Maybe $100-$200 more) but I wanted the smaller one it is already way to loud for my needs.


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