# '74 Strat



## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

I just acquired a 1974 American Strat. I think I got a stupid good deal, which is not really important, as it is a nice axe anyway. There has been some of the usual 70s strat bastardization to the guitar, but here's what I am told is original

Pickups
Guard
Neck
Body

Here are the changes.

Some kind of trem system. Weighs about 19 pounds! Unfortunately some wood was hacked out to make it fit. Also a locking nut thing was added. You can see it in the picture. I plan to correct the routing issue and go back to a vintage style trem. Just not sure which one to use. Advice is apprecitated on this.

Tuners are newer. They are actually nice, but I may replace with something vintage correct. I don't know why people insist on replacing vintage tuners. They very rarely actually fail. 

I suspect either 1, 2, or possibly all of the pots are new. I don't know how to date pots based on their codes. 

The body has been refinished. Apparently with a paintbrush. It's goopy, but it seems to dent under the nail, so I don't think it's poly. 

My plan is to refinish the body again. I can't decide on white or black. Hendrix or Gilmour. Tough one, but I am leaning toward black. It'll be nitro of course. I also plan to get the rest back vintage correct ish parts. Thankfully I have vintage period correct knobs to get me started.

Here's bunch of pics. I'd appreciate any guesses on what it's worth, and if you think I am crazy to refinish it, or just get a new body. What do you think it's worth now, and what do you think it would be worth with a vintage bridge, and repaired, refinished body?


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)




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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)




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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)




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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)




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## noman (Jul 24, 2006)

Well, I hope it plays and sounds better than it looks! I saw the same add and personally wouldn't have paid the $1000 he was asking. Way too much has been changed and the hack-saw approach to the body reduce any value significantly. As I have seen and read many times, the mid-70's were Fenders' weakest moments. Sure there were some good guitars made, but they were in the midst of the CBS corporate mode and quality was not at it's peak. I hope for your sake that the guitar really is a player...........It may be vintage in age but most collectors would run from a guitar like this...........sorry, not too rain on your NGD but not a good find IMO!!!


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Any chance I snaked this from you?:smile:

Not sure why else you would respond with a post like that, and not include a number, or address any of my actual questions, outside of saying I bought a piece of crap. What is this, the Duncan forum?


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

While I agree that the guitar's value is lessened considerably by the mods done before you bought it--that alone doesn't make it a bad thing.
I'm not sure where I would class that price wise, if you're concerned about resale value. The main thing is whether or not you like the guitar, and could afford to pay what you did.

I can relate, as years ago I bought a Les Paul copy that had been modded. I modded it as well. It still has a Les Paul sound though, and I love it. I got it for a great price, even if you count what I paid for the mods I did. I knew before I bought it it wouldn't have the same resale value as an unmodded LP, but that was fine. I wasn't buying it to re-sell it, but to play it.

As to other questions you ask--I like the tuners you have on it--I have mini Schallers on the LP--I suspect they were half a right hand six-a-side set & half a left handed six-a-side set, but they work great. Schallers are great tuners.

I'd refinish it if you have the resources to do it properly. I'll leave the colour up to you. I think most guitars look good in black, but only a few look good in white--but one of those is the Strat.

So if you bought it play, and you're prepared to mod it to suit you better--great.
If you bought it as an investment, not so good, but it sounds like you bought it to play it.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

its a nice find- forget what people say, its a good guitar, and a vintage one at that. ive never had a problem with a 3 bolt neck..
shame about the trem rout, but that is extremely common. just fill it and paint over, no big deal. use your choice of colour- id just get a fender vintage style trem and some f tuners- the holes from that locking trem id just fill and leave, rather than **** things up further with headstock refinishing-
when i was a kid i put a locking nut and fancy trem on my 68 strat- hey it was 1980- after a few months i realized whammy bars are gay and went as close to original as i could- but the scars still show. **** it. and whammy bars are gay. always will be.
all of them. the bigger and more complicated they are- the gayer they are.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

noman said:


> Well, I hope it plays and sounds better than it looks! I saw the same add and personally wouldn't have paid the $1000 he was asking. Way too much has been changed and the hack-saw approach to the body reduce any value significantly. As I have seen and read many times, the mid-70's were Fenders' weakest moments. Sure there were some good guitars made, but they were in the midst of the CBS corporate mode and quality was not at it's peak. I hope for your sake that the guitar really is a player...........It may be vintage in age but most collectors would run from a guitar like this...........sorry, not too rain on your NGD but not a good find IMO!!!


if he got it for $1000- then he got a good deal. cbs era and all that aside, they sell reissues of these you know. for more than $1000
he coulda spent $1800 on a copy of this guitar, from fender.
or wait- is that what youd have done?
and btw- every guitar is a player- it just needs to be set right.


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## nonreverb (Sep 19, 2006)

Being a '70's Strat nut for years, I'd like to chime in....First off '74 was probably the last "best" year for '70's Strats. The body contours are similar to everything after '65. It has staggered pole pickups which is a big plus.
The question I think you're asking here is here is: Did I get a good deal/ what could I sell it for? If you paid $1000 for it, that's probably as much as it's worth parted out. Unfortunately locking trem systems destroyed the value of many strats. I think the question should be: Do you like the way it plays or sounds?
If yes then everything else doesn't matter. If your looking to make some money on it, I think your out of luck. There's just too much done to it to revert it back to something close to origional...I've been down this road myself with strats with carved out pickup cavities and they're a hard sell.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

fraser said:


> and whammy bars are gay. always will be.
> all of them. the bigger and more complicated they are- the gayer they are.


You and I will get along fine! 

From what I've seen, if this wasn't modded to hell, there's no way it would have been advertised at a grand, let alone what I paid for it. I frequently hit the big name vintage shops in TO (you know who they are) and unmodded 70's strats (total dogs at that) are worth 3 times this. 
Hell, I bet I could sell the neck for what I paid for this guitar.

I don't really care about the resale value too much. I was just curious as to what people know about these, and if repairing a body like this is a loss or not. If you disclosed all of these pics, and then a pic of a $300 repair to the body and trem, would the guitar then be worth say, $1300? I think so, but I am no expert on vintage strats. 

I may refin the body, or dump it for someone who likes that sort of thing, and buy another body. There's an unmodded beat up one on ebay right now for $1100 US, so go figure. But knowing whether or not you can get your money back does factor into doing all the work of a refin. I guess that's what I am trying to figure out.

I am leaning toward black, and I have no plans to refinish the neck. That is why I bought it. I just love that look, and no relic job can quite get there for me.


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

That neck is worth the price of admission alone. 2 screwholes just tell of its past. If it was mine i'd fill it & put a 5 screw bridge in their. If it's a bad refin so much the better! i think you really scored there!


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

So what are you gonna do with it?:rockon2:


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

that's a nice score...On the body finish, somehow it does'nt look original, so removing the Khaler Bridge, and filling the hole would'nt be a problem, and refinish it in nitro. Either a color from the 70's or a transparrent color. If it was mine, i would repaint it in nitro with a solid color from that exact period and put in a vintage style, aged, bridge. it's a bit of an investment, but well worth it i think. removing the locking nut wont be to much a problem realy.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

My thoughts exactly. Hell, I could likely get a road worn bridge and drop it right in!

I have decided to fill it in, and go solid coloured nitro. I was going to go solid anyway, 'cause I just don't bond with burst type stuff. I am really torn between white and black. I think I prefer black, although a friend raised a great point. Everyone wants a white one of these, so if I ever do sell it, white will likely go faster. Don't know....

I intend to use this thread to chronicle all of the work I put in.


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## Big_Daddy (Apr 2, 2009)

Hey, good find. Sounds like you paid less than the asking price and, anyway, all that really matters is if you like the guitar or not. There's a "60's" Strat sunburst body that keeps popping up on Kijiji Windsor that has original routs on it. Here's the link. It may or may not be what you are looking for as it has a four-bolt neck but the guy has been trying to sell if for quite a while so you may be able to talk him down a bit. Good luck with your new baby!

http://windsor.kijiji.ca/c-buy-and-sell-musical-instruments-1960s-Stratocaster-Body-Nitrocellulose-Finish-W0QQAdIdZ136899640


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Thanks. Much appreciated. Does that look real to you? The wear on it looks like a deliberate relic job gone wrong. Nice piece of wood though.

I think I may take the opportunity to do my own refin project, just for kicks. I don't think I'll lose anything on the deal. Worst case, I just grab a new body.


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## Big_Daddy (Apr 2, 2009)

The Usual said:


> Thanks. Much appreciated. Does that look real to you? The wear on it looks like a deliberate relic job gone wrong. Nice piece of wood though.
> 
> I think I may take the opportunity to do my own refin project, just for kicks. I don't think I'll lose anything on the deal. Worst case, I just grab a new body.


I hear you. I think you're right about the "relic" job. I went through a similar experience with my '74 Tele Deluxe. I purchased it on eBay, knowing it had been "modded" by the original owner. I almost have it back to vintage spec after a few months of parts hunting on-line. I just need to fill a couple holes on the body where the knucklehead added a stop-tail bridge. It has _almost_ replaced my vintage Strat as my favourite player. Good luck with your project.


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

That windsor body looks like a belt sanded refin.


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

fakeox said:


> That windsor body looks like a belt sanded refin.


my tough exactly. no way is this worth 600$ unless he can prove it's from the 60's. since the neckpocket was painted...no way of knowing.


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## the-patient (May 19, 2009)

Man, I don't know about originality or anything, but I think that finish is bad ass.

I personally would change the trem to something more original, but damn I like that dark woody colour.

I hope it plays well, and I'm very sure it does. I've never met a guitar that I hate once I put some love into working on it.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

One of the problems with having a stain finish on this, is the hole left by that bridge assembly. I intend to repair it, but it will always show under stain once I have a correct bridge back in there. Works for me though, because I have always been a solid colour man anyway. No idea why. The stains just don't look good on me.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Just ordered all the fixins for a black nitro refin. Thanks al3d!
I intend to keep you folks posted on the progress if you are interested. Next step is to figure out where to get some wood to plug the whole. The guitar is ash, but I am wondering if maple is a better choice where the bridge screws are. May be a little stronger?

Anyone know where to find a nice piece of ash in London? (Door wide open)


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## Big_Daddy (Apr 2, 2009)

Call Lee Valley Tools out on Oxford East (one of my favourite boy toy stores). They may not have any ash but will certainly know where you can find some and will also have any tools you may need (like plug cutters). Definitely keep us posted on your progress. There's also a great woodworking/custom furniture store up in the Hyde Park Rd/Hwy 22 (southeast corner in the industrial section) area that will have any kind of wood you can imagine. Sorry, can't remember their name.


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## Oakvillain (Mar 7, 2008)

I would replace it with the same wood as what was removed, and try and match the grain as well to do a real fine job. If it was ash, use ash. You have to be careful with maple. There is hard maple and soft maple. Be sure you have the right one. Hard maple is almost as hard a hickory whereas soft maple is not as hard as ash.

Plus maple has many colour variations from sapwood to heartwood. A consistent colour will cost a bit more but you need less than a boardfoot I imagine - you'll probobly have to buy the board anyway.

Make sure you get a real nice tight glue joint with whatever you choose. Very sharp tools are a must for any woodworking.

Good luck.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

THanks folks. I will look those places up. 

As for glueing this thing back together, there are 2 chunks cut out, and then a countersink of the kahler's entire route. Would it make sense to just fill both chunks up to the level of the kahler, and then lay a thin piece of ash over the entire hole and reroute? That way I could cut that piece more accurately, and line up the grain. 

This will be a solid colour so I think no gaps on the surface is the primary concern.


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## Oakvillain (Mar 7, 2008)

Need Pics

I could give more advice it if I had pics. But I would keep the wood the same. If the moisture of the woods is different, you may get different changes to the wood and that can cause separation etc., Keep it simple.

BTW. Make sure you buy dried lumber. Kiln dried may be best if you are not an experienced woodworker. Ask you lumber dealer (not home depot or anything silly like that) for a very dry piece at about 8-11% moisture max.

Good luck, I'm sure you'll do a fine job if you take your time.


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## archaeic_bloke (Jul 30, 2009)

real thing of beauty that is... congrats


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Oakvillain said:


> Need Pics
> 
> I could give more advice it if I had pics. But I would keep the wood the same. If the moisture of the woods is different, you may get different changes to the wood and that can cause separation etc., Keep it simple.
> 
> ...


uhh..

I could use an emoticon that reads "This post is useless without reading the entire thread!" Did you read my entire thread? Lots of pics there. Are there any other pics I can add that'll help?


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

So I ended up going to a local supplier to get a piece of wood for this guitar. He was adamant that this guitar was not ash, but rather yellow poplar. I bought a piece of kiln dried yellow poplar off of him for $2. 

I have heard of people making strats out of poplar, and I have played one that was very nice. My quesiton is, did Fender make poplar strats in 1974?? Any one have knowledge on this?


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## nonreverb (Sep 19, 2006)

Not to my knowledge...


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

I found this, but it's not clear about the years

http://www.stratcollector.com/newsdesk/archives/000204.html

Since 1956, most Strats had been made of alder, except for the ash-body transparent finishes. 

Dan Smith: "For a while, the environmentalists didn't want us cutting alder. There was an endangered species controversy, with some logging restrictions up in Oregon, so we had to use poplar. Leo had used it on many guitars "� Musicmasters and others "� and we later used it for the Bullet guitars. It's a good wood. We used it on some American Standards in the early '90s. From the beginning, poplar was spec'd to be used on the American Standard as a substitute."

George Blanda: "All the Strat bodies were alder up until about 1990. When it got so hard to get alder, we were faced with either using poplar or not making guitars. There's a misconception that poplar is not a good tone wood. Actually, it's fine. James Burton actually specified it for his signature Tele in the late '80s, after trying a lot of different bodies. We never regarded poplar as a second-rate wood, but a lot of people preferred alder so when the restrictions eased, we were able to go back to alder in '93 or '94."


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## faracaster (Mar 9, 2006)

The Usual said:


> So I ended up going to a local supplier to get a piece of wood for this guitar. He was adamant that this guitar was not ash, but rather yellow poplar. I bought a piece of kiln dried yellow poplar off of him for $2.
> 
> I have heard of people making strats out of poplar, and I have played one that was very nice. My quesiton is, did Fender make poplar strats in 1974?? Any one have knowledge on this?


I have never heard of that. Nor read it in any Fender books.

Pete


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

poplar?..fender!, wow, it's the first i hear about Fender using Poplar never heard or read that anywhere


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## Spankin Allison (Jun 11, 2009)

Well, i got a FENDER CYCLONE it is MIM and made of poplar...Read better books loll )
Frank


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

The more I search on the subject, the more I start to believe that it's possible to find a poplar strat that was a solid colour, at almost any time. They have made stangs and jags out of them, they admit to using it, and choosing alder over it on price alone. Not hard to imagine a cheap skid or two being used here or there. Or maybe the alder is on hold that week, so lets grab that skid of stang blanks. It is Fender after all. 

Apparently it's every bit as good a tone wood, possibly better than alder, but it's ugly. Solid finishes only. Who knows and who cares really, as a great piece of wood is a very random thing regardless of tree. But this has been a real learning experience so far. I've got the routes all filled in now. I will post some pics soon.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

So I spent this weekend getting started on the body of this beast. I cleaned out the hack route, so I could glue in a couple of blocks of wood, and then went about filling the top route with some more carefully crafted pieces of wood. I think I've got it about as close as possible. The wood that is in there now is above flush with the face of the body so I have to sand it flush now. Also, I need to clean up the edge of the route. I left it a little rough in a couple of spots. Any tips in this area are appreciated. Obviously I don't want to hit the surrounding finish, so I may do this by hand.

It seems to me, that the critical piece of this refin is going to be the filler I use to fill in the seams of my patchwork. Based on my experience in the past, I am guessing that Polyfill is not what I am after. Can anyone recommend a filler that will penetrate, stay put, and not shrink long after a nitro finish is applied? Also, I suppose it should not have any issues working with nitro. Since it's a solid colour job, I really only need to make sure that the route seam doesn't show up. That would really suck.


















Also, any thoughts on sanding vs chemically stripping the finish on this?


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

To me, it looks like a stain, which means it could be quite far into the fibers of the wood. 

I'd sand it, tho admit have no experience with chemical strippers. Sanding will enable you to better blend in your new wood with the old.


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## davesvintage (Mar 31, 2009)

*Some advice on the '74 Strat*

I will start first by saying that you got a decent deal and there are enough original parts to exceed the $1000 or what ever you paid for it.

From the pics I can tell you that the neck is dated thursday the 32nd week of 1974. The 8 digit code can be broken down as 0903 maple neck, the 32 is the week the 3 is the year and the 4 is the day of the week. Thsoe little rounf quality stamps look right aswell. Good news is that it looks like the locking nut is sitting on top of the neck and that can be removed and the holes filled. This is something I see a lot of on '70s necks, I call it '80s madness. The tuners could be kept on or removed and the originals replaced. It really doesn't matter and since the neck isn't 100% original there is no sense in forking over the coin for the original tuners. If you did put originals on you would have to get adaptor bushings, that era of F tuner has an 11/32nd bushing size. Most sealed tuners have around 10mm.

There seems to be a about a year lapse in when the neck was made and the rest of the guitar ie: the pickups and pots. By the look of it that pickguard is original and also the rest, those things go for big bucks so thats great news. The pickups look to be staggered poles so there is a another bonus, they go for decent money aswell. To date a pickup is easy enough, the frist 2 digits are the winder number, the next 2 is the week and the last 2 would be the year. All yours look to be 1974. 

The pots, it looks like at least the tone pots are original and so is the capacitor. To date the tone pots look for a 7 digit number starting with 137, the 137 is the code for CTS pots. The next for digits will be the year then the week. I can see that the bottom tone pot on your guitar is '74.

The neck plate looks to a 1974 and the 500,000s were used from 73 until even '75 so that is right.

Last of all is that body. That nasty clump of crap is a Kahler trem and I have seen this a lot and they are nasty. My best advice would be to remove it and fill the damage. There is enough original parts on this guitar to warrant fixing that body up properly. There is no harm doing the full refinish for the body since in it's current state it is not worth a lot.

I hope I have helped you out a little. As for a price it is hard to say because the market has gone a bit pear shaped, I can say that if you paid a grand then you did well.

Thanks Dave.

Dave's Vintage Guitars

www.davesvintageguitars.ca
email: [email protected]
Phone: 1 788 229 0045


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## davesvintage (Mar 31, 2009)

*the '74 body*

I see that you have already blocked in the trem cavity and it looks good. Your body most probably isn't popular and would be either ash or alder, I have even seen mahogany but that was a rare thing that ocurred around '63. They used northern ash and southern swamp ash aswell as alder. If your body is a nice light weight than it is either southern ash or alder. 

I see that that it has the classic squared shoulders on the pickup routs and also the worm rout in the bridge pickup cavity. These are all classic traits on a early '70s body. This era of body has a nice deep body contour aswell and most are of a reasonable weight also. If you are careful and heatgun that old finish you might find a 4 digit code in the neck pocket which would help date it aswell.

I would recommend refinishing it in olympic white and black. Olympic white strats sell for more even if they are refinished. Try not to go recontour it with sanding, that is a bad thing. I use a heat gun to strip paint and it works well. If you are going to do it in a solid colour then it doesn't really matter if the stain is in the wood. 

Send me a pic when you are done.

Cheers Dave.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Thanks for the info. You have confirmed a lot of my suspicions, and you are on about the weight and contours. The finish on it is really easy to remove. I wiped it with sandpaper lightly and got wood, so I was thinking of using chemicals rather than heat, especially in the cavity. What do you think about chem vs heat in terms of possible mistakes?

I have ordered the black nitro from Reranch. My wallet said O white for reasons you just stated, but my heart said black. Band of Gypsies.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

davesvintage said:


> I will start first by saying that you got a decent deal and there are enough original parts to exceed the $1000 or what ever you paid for it.
> 
> From the pics I can tell you that the neck is dated thursday the 32nd week of 1974. The 8 digit code can be broken down as 0903 maple neck, the 32 is the week the 3 is the year and the 4 is the day of the week. Thsoe little rounf quality stamps look right aswell. Good news is that it looks like the locking nut is sitting on top of the neck and that can be removed and the holes filled. This is something I see a lot of on '70s necks, I call it '80s madness. The tuners could be kept on or removed and the originals replaced. It really doesn't matter and since the neck isn't 100% original there is no sense in forking over the coin for the original tuners. If you did put originals on you would have to get adaptor bushings, that era of F tuner has an 11/32nd bushing size. Most sealed tuners have around 10mm.
> 
> ...



Great response. Thanks very much. I don't know how far you got down the thread, but I have been told by a wood "expert" that my body is poplar, and not ash or alder. Any thoughts on this one?


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## bagpipe (Sep 19, 2006)

*poplar was only used on Strats from 1990 until 1993 or 1994*

Regarding poplar in Strats, I remembered reading something about it in the book The Stratocaster Chronicles. I had to go back and find it and I've quoted it below:

http://www.amazon.ca/Stratocaster-C...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252449776&sr=1-1

In summary, poplar was only used on Strats from 1990 until 1993 or 1994:


From Page 202:

*Dan Smith*: For a while, the environmentalists didn't want us cutting alder. There was an endangered species controversy, with some logging restrictions up in Oregon, so we had to use poplar. Leo had used it on many guitars - Musicmasters and others - and we later used it on the Bullet guitars. It's a good wood. We used it on some American Standards in the early 90's. From the beginning, poplar was spec'd to be used as a substitute.

*George Blanda*: "All the Strat bodies were alder up until about 1990. When it got so hard to get alder, we were faced with either using poplar or not making guitars. There's a misconception that poplar is not a good tone wood. Actually, its fine. James Burton actually specified it for his signature Tele in the late '80s, after trying a lot of different bodies. We never regarded poplar as a second-rate wood, but a lot of people preferred alder so when the restrictions eased, we were able to go back to alder in '93 or '94."


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

bagpipe said:


> Regarding poplar in Strats, I remembered reading something about it in the book The Stratocaster Chronicles. I had to go back and find it and I've quoted it below:
> 
> http://www.amazon.ca/Stratocaster-C...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252449776&sr=1-1
> 
> ...



Yeah, I found that one as well. I think it also mentions that Jags/Stangs were made of poplar all the way along as well.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Another question for you strat guys out there. I am going to buy a new trem system for this, and I can decide between a RI70s one like this

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200380670308&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Or an aged one like this

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190333104639&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

I personally love the idea of a relic looking one, to go with the rest of the guitar. But having a period correct one would be nice as well. Any thoughts? What about spacing with my neck? Anything I need to look for there? I know there is a ton of debate out there about steel vs zinc blocks etc. This strat stuff is new to me.


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## davesvintage (Mar 31, 2009)

*More strat talk*

Sorry, I jumped in on the great '74 strat debate a little late. it has been a while since I posted on here. It sounds like heat is not needed on this body and that your light sanding is working great. I am refinishing a '76 body that has been through the ringer and what ever clown attacked it took off a nice aged olympic white. The original finish is still in the trem cavity and it is painfull to look at. The body came to me as a trade for labour so I am glad it came to the right hands. I am going to refinish it in black and find a maple neck. The contours have been mauled on this one so I am hoping it all looks ok at the end.

Black is a good colour choice anyway, I regret selling a nice deep contoured '74 body last year. If you can get desert sand or white as a primer then you would be right on the money. To get that paint out of the cavities I would suggest a little heat gun, just take it easy and waft it over the paint and it will peel and scrape out easy. You might even find some date stamps in the cavities. Chemicals soak into the wood and give me the creeps anyway.

As for trems there lots of good options. The original trems were made from a solid cast mazac alloy, and when those trem threads go it is all over. They are very expensive and on average they sell for $200 US and up. As far as block material goes I would recommend steel over zinc for sustain. There are lots of aftermarket trems out there that have steel blocks. If you can get a '70s reissue trem for a decent price then I would go there. Even a steel block GOTOH trem with some '70s style saddles would be ok. Aging chrome parts is very easy and there are plenty of forum posts on muriatic acid aging.

The difference between USA reissue and Japanese is not really a problem and string spacing is only a mm or so different and won't pose a problem. The spacing for the mounting screws into the body is the same anyway, or close to it. I have never had a problem mounting either of those trems onto a USA or Japanese body. The Squier SQ series was based on the '72 Strat and those trems are pretty much identical to the real deal from the top. The SQ being a better design with a removable zinc block. Check out the reissue section on ebay for those.

If you need and pointers or pricing on trems send me a line. I am a dealer for a few brands such as GOTOH, Fender and WDmusic.

Cheers Dave

[email protected]


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

thanks again. My buddy was talking me into going something aftermarket with steel as well, saying that it won't take away from the value anyway. My other friend has a road worn that he has loaned to me to see how things line up. I sure like the looks of the road worn trem, but if I can get there on my own. or possibly scoop up a cheap road worn and relplace the block? Save me some work.


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## davesvintage (Mar 31, 2009)

*Trems*

Your friend is right and aslong as the mounting screws line up there will be no hassles. My best recommendation would be to find an SQ strat trem, most guys wouldn't know the difference and they look the goods. They already have the same type of saddles, the olny difference is the part number on the base that the real ones have. For the purpose of the exercise it would be better to get by on a non original trem, the guitar collectability wont suffer too much. I had a 1980 Strat that was all original but the trem. It had a chromed brass Schector bridge. I replaced the Schector saddles with original '70s saddles and from the top no one would know any different.

Check out the 1980 Strat under sold guitars on my website, it's very pretty!

www.davesvintageguitars.ca

Cheers Dave


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## nonreverb (Sep 19, 2006)

The fact that "olympic white " got mentioned reminds me of this silly notion that people have about cream '70's strats being aged Olympic white. Olympic white DOES NOT go yellow in the hues that many on flea bay try to have the public believe. True Olympic white will be slightly off white.... never yellow. Particularly if the yellowish tint is under the guard.
Why mention this detail you ask? Because true Olympic white Strats go for BIG money thanks to the likes of Hendrix. For '70's Strats it's one of the holy grails. Along with others like Sonic blue (to '72 only) and Candy Apple till '73 or so.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

nonreverb said:


> The fact that "olympic white " got mentioned reminds me of this silly notion that people have about cream '70's strats being aged Olympic white. Olympic white DOES NOT go yellow in the hues that many on flea bay try to have the public believe. True Olympic white will be slightly off white.... never yellow. Particularly if the yellowish tint is under the guard.
> Why mention this detail you ask? Because true Olympic white Strats go for BIG money thanks to the likes of Hendrix. For '70's Strats it's one of the holy grails. Along with others like Sonic blue (to '72 only) and Candy Apple till '73 or so.


Well it's funny you should mention this, because last night, for kicks, I used paint remover on the inside of the body cavity and neck pocket, to see if there was any writing under the sheilding paint and whatever was under that in there. Looks to me that this was originally Olympic White. How's that for too bad?
Also found a stamp in the neck pocket TOM. Weird.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

So I spent the day doing some stripping and sanding. Whatever finish was on the body came off very easily, however, this is still no easy project. Not bad, but for a newbie, it still takes some time. I used circa 1850 stripper. I put it on with a paint brush, waited a minute and scraped it off. Goopy mess, but I think still faster than sanding. I used some steel wool to clean out the extra stripper, and around the horns. THat worked well. THen I followed the Reranch instructions and wiped it down with lacquer thinner. Next came the sanding with 220 paper. I used a palm sander for the top and back, and hand sanded the contours by hand. I got most of the stain, but I deliberately left the dents and holes visible because I think that will help me find them with the grain filler. Could use advice on filling these dents.

This brings me to my next question. This whole grain filler thing is killing me. I can't seem to find it here in London. I have been doing a lot of reading up on this, and there are quite a few opinions. Some even use crazy glue?? Don't know, but I'd really like to source some locally that won't interact with Nitro. I am trying to avoid more shipping charges/waiting for this stuff.

I can also find a lot of water based sanding sealer around here, but I don't know much about these either. It does see odd to me though, that I would go through all the trouble and expense of a nitro finish, and use a poly sanding sealer. Is that what everyone does? Anyway, here are some pics. I actually like the way the back looks right now!


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

Sure looks like ash from here..


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

Oh yeah.. NICE job!:bow:


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

fakeox said:


> Sure looks like ash from here..


Yep, I'm starting to believe my "wood expert"'s head is made of poplar.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

fakeox said:


> Sure looks like ash from here..


From here too, that grain is very ash-y.
The poplar I've seen didn't like that.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

So does anyone have any ideas on grain filler and sanding sealer that keep in the tradition of nitro finish, and I can find in london ontario. THere seems to be some debate on whether or not shellac is safe under nitro. I could REALLY use some advice on this.


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## Big_Daddy (Apr 2, 2009)

The Usual said:


> So does anyone have any ideas on grain filler and sanding sealer that keep in the tradition of nitro finish, and I can find in london ontario. THere seems to be some debate on whether or not shellac is safe under nitro. I could REALLY use some advice on this.


Did you find that woodworking place in Hyde park? It's called the Pine Mill. They seemed to know their stuff pretty well. Looking good, btw!


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

zontar said:


> From here too, that grain is very ash-y.
> The poplar I've seen didn't like that.


Me thinks it's Alder and you shouldn't need filler 


Ash 
http://www.mundyveneer.com/images/white_ash.jpg

Alder 

http://www.picframer.ca/images/alder.jpg


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

it's definitively Ash..alsder never has grain like that to my knowledge. If you can weight the body..could be helpfull. But wether it's ash or Alder, give it a few coats of grain filler and a few of sealer, that way, you can't go wrong basicaly.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

The Usual said:


>


kqoct...... look at the neck pocket.... endgrain on that looks like oak.... 


Ash


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Big_Daddy said:


> Did you find that woodworking place in Hyde park? It's called the Pine Mill. They seemed to know their stuff pretty well. Looking good, btw!


I finally got around to visting the folks at Pine Mill. Awesome guys! Great tip. They were extremely helpful. Funny, they don't think it's ash either. Couple of them thought birch! I think the problem may be that the fine folks in London rarely see a nice piece of ash.

Anyway, they gave me a line on some nitro sanding sealer that you can get from Clancy's Rainbow for about $7 a litre. Now I just have to get something to spray it with, or use a brush. Although, they really said life is easier if I spray it on. They also said that I don't need to fill the grain on mine, except for the seams and dings. They use Behlin's that they get from Stratford, or they recommened auto feathering bondo. They had big cans of it all over the shop. Guess I'll give that a shot. Nice to know I don't have a lot of filling to worry about, as this really seems to be the bigges pain in the ass of the whole project.

They also hooked me up with a pretty cool body blank that was laying around the shop. Basswood, from a 130 year old barn. That' is what I call a score. When the strat is done, I've got just the tele neck for that slab.

More work this weekend, I'll post some pics


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## Big_Daddy (Apr 2, 2009)

That's great. Looking forward to those pics.


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## Drazden (Oct 26, 2007)

Just read this whole thread. Very informative, and VERY COOL! Keep up the good work! MOAR PICTURES!


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## Big_Daddy (Apr 2, 2009)

The Usual said:


> ......the problem may be that the fine folks in London rarely see a nice piece of ash.


I did a double-take when I read this line..LOL. "Nice piece of ash?!"


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

So this weekend was all about wood prep, as was today. I wanted to post some updates but I had no batteries for the camera until today. That means that the grain filling stuff will be without pics, but I'll do my best to describe what I did. 

First let me say, that after 4 coats of nitro sanding sealer, I now get what grain filling is all about, and why it is so important. Despite all my efforts, the grain is very prominent, on something that didn't seem to have open grain at all. 

I used crazy glue to fill the dents in, and seams from my work. This works really well, but I can only wonder (not so well anymore) about how many brain cells I sniffed and swallowed. I used 2 types. The good old liquid stuff that comes in little tube, and the new gel stuff. I got the gel by accident, but it worked out great for the dings. I found that a litte liquid stuff first, to soak into the hole and give the gel something to bond to, followed by some gel, and then a little more liquid to fill in any remaining pits after sanding, was excellent for repairing dents and dings. I would over fill them with gel, wait 15 minutes or so in the sun, and then come back with a tiny block and some 220, and just sand them flush. Sometimes they need a couple of applications. The weird thing is that you can still see them clearly, but when you look on an angle, or feel them, they are completely gone.

I am very worried about the seam from the trem repair showing, so I spent a lot of time on this. I used the liquid ca (crazy) glue on this, because it soaks in so well. This took about 10 applications. Fill the seam, wait, sand and check. Repeat. Use your fingernail to see if you have a nice cover. The best tools for finding pits and seams are the mighty finger nail, ambient day light (dusk, dawn, shade) on an angle, and direct sunlight, in that order. I would not want to attempt this under artificial lighting.


As for proper body grain filling, I used the crazy glue as well. Mostly because I could not find anything else anywhere in London, and this gets rave reviews online. I almost went with Minwax Polycrylic, but I just couldm't do it. I just don't see the point in spending all this time and money on going nitro, only to lay it on top of a wad of poly. Anyway, I tried different things with the crazy glue, in different places to see how they'd work out. I figured I'd be OK, as my friends at Pine Mill were sure I didn't need to fill the grain anyway (more on that later). 

On the back, I used the gel and my finger to rub it in. You'd be surprised at how long you can spread this stuff around without sticking. You do end up with quite a wad on the end of the finger, and a bottle of acetone or your wife's nail polish remover is needed to wipe the thing off. Do it more often than not, as a huge ball gets tough to remove. I covered most of the back this way. It ended up more filled than other areas, but it still left a lot of grain open. I thought that at least rubbing some of this in, would allow the sanding sealer to sit on top of something. I don't know that that worked.

Here's the back after 4 coats of sanding sealer - Still grain showing









On the front, I was more apprehensive about trying crazy glue so I just did 2 small areas with the liquid and a razor blade. The process was pouring a little liquid on the guitar, and scraping it across the grain. You can see in this picture that the 2 little flat spots on the bottom left are this method. It worked great, but gummed up the razor unusable. This would be a huge amount of work on an entire guitar, and again, would be a crazy glue finish with some nitro on top. But it does look good!










In closing on grain filling, I'd say the ca glue for dings and seams and crap like that is great. As for proper grain filling I am still totally lost. I really wondered why I would need to fill grain if I was going to sanding seal. I no lonnger wonder why. I also no longer wonder why Fender uses poly under nitro. I just wonder why not just use very light poly. Now the sanding sealer.....


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Sanding Sealer. The Pine Mill team turned me on to some nitro ss at the industrial location of Clancy's Rainbow in south London. ES 390-001 is the product number. $7 per litre. No spray so you have to brush it on. 

Followed Reranch instructions and brushed on the first coat. When it goes on, you say, that crap is never going to lay down. Goopy fondant looking glue drooling all over the place. You can almost hear a horse crying out in pain somewhere. 30 minutes later, you get how this works, as every grain, scratch and pit show up like cats at a dumpster for the dinner service, and this is accompanied by a huge pit in your stomach, and the regret for all your poly trashing threads of the past. Is tone really that important? Those Classic Vibes are pretty nice. Thankfully the 2 brain cells that survived the ca glue, are now leaning on one another slurring "I love you man. No I love YOU, man". No turning back now.

After the hour recommended by RR, instead of just laying another coat, I used a bit of sand paper to knock down any bubbles from the brush, and any goops still around the horns. Then coat 2 goes on, and the guitar rests overnight.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Day 2, today. I was off work, so I decided to do some work on this bad boy while I could. I also think I may have been jonesing a little for some nitro. Either that or some PAM in a paper bag at the office. Seriously. I would NEVER do this indoors. 

One problem, it was raining here this morning. RR mentions blushing as a problem with paint, if applied in damp conditions. So before working, I called Pine Mill and asked their finisher if it was safe to work today. He said they do it with their doors open on days like today, and that blushing shouldn't be a problem with ss. 

I started by sanding down the SS from yesterday as per RR instructions. Then I applied today's first coat. Immediatley realized I had sanded too much off of the first coats, as there were spots that now had more grain showing. Lesson leared. Sand this light, and let it build up. However, the rest of the open grain is not getting better. Wait an hour, knock down the bubbles, and coat number 2. Grain still there. Where the hell is all of this stuff going exactly? I am really not getting this, but I will say this, it sure beats doing it with $30 a can RR product.

Now for the fun part. An hour later what does this look like to you?










I am referring to the opaque whiteness around the horn. Why is my heart telling me that is blushing? Damn you, Pine Mill! Is that what I am seeing? If it is, what next? Sand it all off? Wait? 

Here is where I am at. My big challenges right now are addressing the remaining grain, and this whiteness. I could use some advice on both counts. Lot of learing going on around here. School of hard knocks....


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

Hopefully an expert is gonna chime in again real soon.. I know for a fact around the curves is an easy place to hit too hard.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

Kind of looks like overspray to me. Is it kind of fuzzy? What is your spraying method. Does it sand off?


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

If it is blushing spraying again should activate the lac and release the moisture. When it's this damp some use more thinners.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

shoretyus said:


> Kind of looks like overspray to me. Is it kind of fuzzy? What is your spraying method. Does it sand off?


I used a brush for this. I contacted Scott Clark in Stratford, based on the recommendation of many folks. He was very helpful. He said that it is likely blushing from working in damp weather, and recommended Bushining Eraser. He sells it in spray cans. He also had some mahogany grain filler that I am buying from him. He just placed an order with Behlin's and he needs to have $1K per order, so I didn't want to wait for that. 
He explained why you need grain filler, and why using paint, lacquer or even ss in its place would take up to 50 coats. 

So my next step is wait 2 days for my order, and then hit it with some blusing eraser on a dry day. Then it's grain filling time. More pics to come.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

I have been trying to get some blush eraser.You have contact info? I haven't been able to find any.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

shoretyus said:


> I have been trying to get some blush eraser.You have contact info? I haven't been able to find any.


Think the business is called Clark's Refinishing. The owner is Scott Clark 519-246-9787. Very helpful guy, and considered the finishing guru around these parts.


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## davesvintage (Mar 31, 2009)

*Refinishing*

Frank, you are starting to scare me, remember my messy '74 Strat? I have a few more bodies lying around that I about to tackle aswell.

Cheers Dave.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Don't be scared. Just sell them! Kidding. It's not that bad, and I suspect if I do this again, I'll be faster. That being said, if someone said they'd do an all nitro body for around $300, I'd take the offer.

So today I got some product from Scott Clark. Grain filler and Blush eraser.










Showed up at the right time, because it finally dried up here. I first did the blush eraser thing. Just sprayed a mist over the blusing area, and waited an hour. Gone. Really cool, and I am told it's a great thing to have around to cure orange peel and other inconsistencies. 

Then it was time for the grain filler. I read a bunch of ways of doing this, and ended up using my finger and a credit card. It's basically drywall compound in oil. There was a huge ball in the middle of the can. Took me a while to realize the consistency was too thin with the oily top stuff I was using. Once I found the wad of peanut butter in the can, I just scooped some of it out, and used my fingers to rub it in. Then I wiped it off with the edge of a credit card. Like doing drywall.

I waited a minute or so, and then used a j cloth to wipe off the excess. This was recommended by Scott, who said that it is the moder equivalent to using burlap. Not that you can't get burlap, but j cloths are under my sink.



















Now I have to sand this crap off, and see if it worked.


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## Deef (Nov 5, 2006)

A lot of interesting things so far in this thread, I'm gonna be following this one through to the end, along with al3d's relic thread. 

Keep up the effort, you're asking questions a lot of people are interested in, and doing great work!

Later...


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Deef said:


> A lot of interesting things so far in this thread, I'm gonna be following this one through to the end, along with al3d's relic thread.
> 
> Keep up the effort, you're asking questions a lot of people are interested in, and doing great work!
> 
> Later...


Glad you enjoy it. As long as I am sharing my finds. Here is something I happened upon for sanding sides, and particularly the horns. I could never get an even sand in the horns, even using a small dowl. It was either too hard of pressure, or slipped around. I ended up taking a cylindar, and some craft foam. You can get it at any craft store for a buck. I use it to tie flies. Just so you don't think.... anyway. I wrap it around the cylindar and then the paper around it. Perfect. Like a smooth finger. No more sand throughs around the edges, and the perfect sand for the horns. Great for rounding the edges too.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Been a while, but I can finally add some updates. I finally got to spraying some primer today. The process of grain filling and sanding sealer was long and tedious, but hopefully will have paid off in the end. Also, I have started to build another strat body while I'm at this, waiting for the rain. It's posted under the tech section here
http://www.guitarscanada.com/Board/showthread.php?t=27167

So I just laid down my first two Reranch nitro primer. When you take the top off, the spray ends go flying, and you think you just broke your only, costly, wait a month to get, primer. Then you realize they are like that so you can choose the one you want.



















While shaking the can of primer, a couple of drops ended up on the surface of the guitar. I assume I can just sand them down. Also, Reranch doesn't get too in depth on primer. Do I just keep spraying until it's covered, sand and then paint? Do I have to wait overnight to start the black paint?


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

The dot of primer isn't showing very well, so nevermind about that. BTW this is two coats of primer. Do I do two more, then sand?


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

You know, if it's all the same to you folks, I am going to move the strat body I am building into this thread. 

The story is as follows. I found some nice guys who gave me some nice old barn board for a body. I was going to use it for a tele, but i ahve this vintage 70s strat copy that I love, except for 2 issues. It weighs about 12 lbs, maybe more, and the radius of the neck is too small. The neck itself is great, but too small. So I decided while I am doing all this work, I may as well put together 2 70s strats, and play beat the champ. 

Here's the wood, with my tracings on it, and the Rogue body it is replacing

















Check out the neck, isn't it sweet? Pretty much the fender spot on


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Now before going to the trouble of making this, only to find out is a dog, I routed it for a bridge and neck, strung it up and did a sound test. I actually did string it up btw. It sounds fantastic! I don't know if it's the 130 year old wood, or all the worm holes in it, but man, this build has to happen


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

So while it rained this week, I took a mini router, palm sander and jigsaw and went to town. I should have taken pics all along, but I just didn't have time.









Check out all of the worm holes! It's like swiss cheeze! Sound holes, is what I refer to them as. I bought some wood epoxy to fill them, but in the meantime, I am putting a dab of crazy glue in them, so they don't absorb the epoxy over time


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Now I know you may think I'm anal, but if you look at the pic from behind, you'll see that there is a slight flat spot on the bottom left, and that the contours don't quite line up on either side. I could have sanded doun the bass side to match the treble side, but that wouldn't be the deep contour strat shape I love, so .......

Back to the sanding board. 90% of this will be removed again, and the seam will be filled with wood epoxy. If you are going to go to all the work of doing this, you may as well get what you want.


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

Looks kinda kinky! Seriously that '74 body is coming along great. So aside from the bridge & refin it's all stock?


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

fakeox said:


> Looks kinda kinky! Seriously that '74 body is coming along great. So aside from the bridge & refin it's all stock?


Pretty close. The tuners are not stock, and either 1 or two of the pots. The knobs as well, won't be stock. Guard, pickups, neck and body.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Now back to the '74 Fender strat. 2 coats of black nitro. 1 small run. This should sand out nicely. I notice the top with that orange peel appearance. I don't intend to deal with this until all of the coats are on. If the paint is anything like the primer, 1 can of spaying and sanding is cutting it pretty close. I was thinking of using the blush eraser to deal with orange peel before sanding. I have read elswhere that this can be done.


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## davesvintage (Mar 31, 2009)

Looking good buddy. I am in the process of doing a relic nitro '50s Tele in solid blonde. I still haven't tackled the beast "Frank" yet. I will email you the pics of the Tele bod when it is done.


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

One can of black is WELL enough, i don't ever use a full can on mine. you don't need to wet sand either, just use 1000grit and do a VERY light rub, but you got to wait a good 2 weeks before doing that with nitro.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

al3d said:


> One can of black is WELL enough, i don't ever use a full can on mine. you don't need to wet sand either, just use 1000grit and do a VERY light rub, but you got to wait a good 2 weeks before doing that with nitro.


So does that mean I have to wait 2 weeks before I move from black to clear coating? The Reranch site isn't clear on this. I could use some advice.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Now back to something a little more hideous. I used Minwax wood epox tonight. Pretty easy to work with. Mixes and sets fast. Pretty hard stuff. How close am I getting to the right contour?


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

The Usual said:


> So does that mean I have to wait 2 weeks before I move from black to clear coating? The Reranch site isn't clear on this. I could use some advice.


no no...With nitro, you can go from Primer to color coat the next day if you want..but a few days cure time is always better. once your color coat is done, and you want to do a light sanding to remove some orange peel, a MINIMUM of 1 week in a dry room is required otherwise you'll get the rubbery effect happening. it might LOOK dry, but it's not. but i realy suggest 2 weeks personnaly. once that's done. you can clear coat once you've cleaned the body properly. with Nitro..no more then 3 coats a day...thin coat...then wait 3 hrs if the body is in well ventilated area with no more then 60% humidity.

It looks like it's a lot to take in..but nitro is not Acrylic or polyrethan, so can't treath it the same realy. 

Once you're done shooting the clear..wich should take 3 to 4 days, then you leave it alone 4 to 5 weeks at LEAST for cure time. I tested it after 2 weeks..and it's not cured enough..the wetsand does'nt work well. 5 weeks..was perfect for me.


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## Raven (Nov 8, 2007)

You can get a lot of good info on finishing guitar bodies here...

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/finely-finished/


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

THanks for that. I like that site, but I have not used it for refin advice.

So back to the basswood mostrosity. Here's what you can do with Minwax wood epoxy, if you so desire, or if you ever find yourself in a bind. It actually is very easy to work with, sets fast, holds up well, and sands beautifully. Also great for filling those worm tone holes! This body is a bit of a fun one for me. Wait until it beats the '74 on tone!

This is more like the body contour I'm after
















Some Sanding Sealer


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

A couple of quick updates.

I went on a search for black nitro paint for the basswood beast. Carquest has a line of lacquer paints in a spay can, and it's nitro. It's their house brand Col-R-Flo. Just basic colours and clear, but much easier to get than Reranch.
And if anyone knows where to find Minwax clear brushing lacquer in the black spray can, please let me know. This stuff is all the rage on the Reranch forum because it cures quickly, it's nitro and it yellows like the Reranch stuff. I just can't seem to find a supplier here.

Last night I thought I'd try something different. Instead of waiting a month and sanding off all my black paint, thought I would use some blush eraser to make the lacquer lay down a little. I laid the guitar flat and gave the top a decent coat of eraser. Very smooth. But then, in a couple of minutes, the guitar began to turn milky gray and you could see back to the primer! With only 1 can of black for the whole job, you bet I freaked! 1 hour later, the colour came back to the paint, and today, it is smooth as silk, and black as night. Not for the faint of heart, but I don't think I will have much sanding before the clear coat now. I don't know if this is bad for the paint or not, but it is kind of cool. I wish I had time to snap a pic while it was gray, but I was busy crying.


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## djfacile (Jul 31, 2009)

just great


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## montreal (Mar 25, 2008)

i know why you got a good deal on that guitar...i'd recognize it anywhere...although it looked a lot nicer before it was stripped of the blue finish and that stupid kahler was re-installed....good luck with it.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

montreal said:


> i know why you got a good deal on that guitar...i'd recognize it anywhere...although it looked a lot nicer before it was stripped of the blue finish and that stupid kahler was re-installed....good luck with it.


You know this guitar? Do tell. And I can tell by your sig that you are of discriminating taste.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

So I called Minwax and spoke to a very helpful rep. She said that someone else called this week for the same thing and explained the whole Nitro love to her! Long and short is that they can not ship the lacquer to Canada. 

But, they do ship Duplicolor auto paint lacquer, nitro, no inhibitors to Napa in Canada. She confirmed that the dist center in Cambridge ON orders it every month. Sounds like it is basically the same product. It comes in three gloss of black, white, silver and clear. I am heading to Napa now to take a look.
Model numbers
Black gloss CDAL1677
Clear CDAL1695

And I am also told by the folks on Reranch that Watco is yellowing, and it's down the road at Rona.


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

I found that MOHAWK now has a line of nitro in Canada. they don't have lots of guitar colors, but i ordered 10 cans of clear and it works very well, and you can get some nice checking after a month. 

Check www.richelieu.com and you can order it easily. 8.95$ a can of clear. they have a TON of tinted clear as well.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

By tinted, do you mean amber?


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

The Usual said:


> By tinted, do you mean amber?


amber is one..they have over 40 different tinted clear coat available. I tested the "light oak" version..and it's VERY close to the Reranch neck tinted clear.


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## The Usual (May 14, 2008)

Update.

I have not posted many photos lately, as there hasn't been much to see. I had a couple of runs in the black paint that I just left until it was done. It dried a couple of days, and then I sanded out the runs with 400 paper. Then I moved on to the clear coats.

While the fall sucks for humidity, once the furnace kicks in, it's a great place to hang the axe. I have been clear coating outside, and then bringing it in to dry by the furnace. Works great. I have almost one can of clear on it, following the Reranch 101 instructions of 3 light coats per day. I assume I'm going to want about 2 cans of this on before sanding and polishing.

For those of you who want to see what a light coat looks like, here's a couple of pics. It looks bumpy, but as you ad more, they just keep melting into one another. After a night by the furnace, they are usually quite smooth.


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## fakeox (Mar 31, 2009)

That is looking great!


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## bluecanoe (Nov 26, 2009)

*77*

FYI
I think the serial number puts it as a S7xxxxx I couldn't make it out, but thats a 77- ish number. (I've got a 75). Is that ash? I've always loved mine. nice tone from the pups and very comfortable neck. I'd try and make it as 'orginal' or 'period' as possible and it would be worth about 2 1/2 times what you paid for and and still be a sweet guitar.
enjoy
dave


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## nonreverb (Sep 19, 2006)

bluecanoe said:


> FYI
> I think the serial number puts it as a S7xxxxx I couldn't make it out, but thats a 77- ish number. (I've got a 75). Is that ash? I've always loved mine. nice tone from the pups and very comfortable neck. I'd try and make it as 'orginal' or 'period' as possible and it would be worth about 2 1/2 times what you paid for and and still be a sweet guitar.
> enjoy
> dave


Nope, it's definitely '74. The 'S' is actually a 5 which put this guitar in the '74 category. Plus, by mid '76 the serial number was moved from the neckplate to the headstock so a '77 would have a headstock serial number.:smile:


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## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

Come one..post some update man.....most have some progress by now..


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## Hypno Toad (Aug 1, 2009)

Talking about the original pictures:

I like that guitar. Wouldn't have paid _that _much for it (especially because that kahler trem isn't centered.) 

Installing kahler trems was apparently a big thing around that time because most guitars could easily support them. I like that sort of derelict look it has, but I'm sure many potential buyers don't. Though that kahler job was really butchered


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