# Frank Zappa - am I missing something?



## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

Frank Zappa - am I missing something?

I've started this thread as a result of reading the one about the person you would most like to spend a day with. I noticed a few people have Zappa on their list. I'm assuming it's because of his music and/or political views. 

Can someone please explain the love for his work. I've gone so far as to buy a couple of his CD's and listen to them repeatedly. I just don't get it. Maybe I bought the wrong CD's. What am I missing?


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Stratin2traynor said:


> Frank Zappa - am I missing something?
> 
> I've started this thread as a result of reading the one about the person you would most like to spend a day with. I noticed a few people have Zappa on their list. I'm assuming it's because of his music and/or political views.
> 
> Can someone please explain the love for his work. I've gone so far as to buy a couple of his CD's and listen to them repeatedly. I just don't get it. Maybe I bought the wrong CD's. What am I missing?




Zappa is an acquired taste. His catalogue is HUGE and full of brilliant music.

Not everyone will enjoy FZ, but his audience has always been largely comprised of musicians and intellectuals.


Listen to Peaches en Regalia from the Hot Rats album. If you don't like that, you probably don't like FZ.

Personally I think he was one of the very few individuals deserving of the term "genius".



People are often distractd by his satirical and political lyrics. Take all that away and the music is highly complex, yet entertaining.

He was simply WAY above the garden variety rock bands of his era and certainly of THIS era. He used twelve tone row (serialism) in a number of songs and parenthasized those passages with straight ahead tonal sections.


Yes, I'm a fan.


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## keeperofthegood (Apr 30, 2008)

Stratin2traynor said:


> Frank Zappa - am I missing something?
> 
> I've started this thread as a result of reading the one about the person you would most like to spend a day with. I noticed a few people have Zappa on their list. I'm assuming it's because of his music and/or political views.
> 
> Can someone please explain the love for his work. I've gone so far as to buy a couple of his CD's and listen to them repeatedly. I just don't get it. Maybe I bought the wrong CD's. What am I missing?


Missing the generations view point. If you look at a lot of the ICONS of the past with a modern eye, yea you wonder "wtf was that all about". But in his time, he redefined a lot of boundaries people had not passed. Either out of fear or ignorance, Frank broke those bounds. Moon Unit is just one of the bounds he broke too. SO many Johns and Toms and Janets and Alices and why? Because for 2000 or 3000 or more years those names have been cycled back and forth in families "Oh we named him after our great uncle Bill". Frank said "to hell with that noise" and did his own thing. I am not honestly sure who may have done that before him too.


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## lbrown1 (Mar 22, 2007)

because "watch out where the husky's go - Don't you eat that Yellow Snow"
and "Smack - upside the head with a a lead filled snowshoe" are 2 of the most brilliant examples of lyrics in rock history!!!


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## Starbuck (Jun 15, 2007)

I rather enjoyed his political views and loved his interviews, but his music, meh, not so much. However I really liked Joes Garage, I totally GOT that one and still enjoy it from time to time and I am not necessarily the demographic that Frank was after, if he was after anything at all.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

Stratin2traynor said:


> Frank Zappa - am I missing something?
> 
> I've started this thread as a result of reading the one about the person you would most like to spend a day with. I noticed a few people have Zappa on their list. I'm assuming it's because of his music and/or political views.
> 
> Can someone please explain the love for his work. I've gone so far as to buy a couple of his CD's and listen to them repeatedly. I just don't get it. Maybe I bought the wrong CD's. What am I missing?


See if you can come across the live King Biscuit Flower Hour recordings of Chunga's Revenge and Illinois Enema Bandit and if that does not hit you right between the eyes, then forget about Frank.


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## Stratin2traynor (Sep 27, 2006)

Awesome. Thanks for the recommendations and viewpoints. From the recordings I have, it's hard to get past the satirical lyrics sometimes. My son and I get a good laugh out of them. I'll definitely check out the recommended recordings. And...if I still don't care for it, at least I gave it a try.


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

Black Napkins.

Best. Guitar. Solo. Evar!


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

People love him for a hundred different reasons...often only 3 or 4 at a time.

Some folks love him because of the sarcasm and biting political wit ("I don't wanna get drafted"). Some folks loved his "dirty" songs (e.g., "Dinah Mo Hum", "Yellow Snow") or his tunes that made fun of easy targets ("Dancing Fool", "Valley Girl"). Some folks think he's all about shredding ("Shut Up 'N Play Yer Guitar" series). Some folks think he's all about being just plain weird ("Who are the Brain Police?"). Some folks love his use and citations of classic music from other places (e.g., the use of Holst and Stravinsky throughout the "Absolutely Free" album). Some folks love the way he uses doo-*** ("Reuben and the Jets"). Some folks think of him as a sort of jazz-fusion guy. Some think it's just wonderful that anyone would incorporate marimba into any sort of rock-based music. Some like him because he incorporates "musique concrète". Some like him because he can write melodies of surprising beauty that spring out of a thicket of notes clustered to be dissonant ("Zoot Allures"). And so on, and so on.

They are ALL good reasons to like the guy. The challenge is that, unless you are the totally adventurous type, the piece/s you listen to have to be aligned with the things you value in music. Some will be, some won't. If you like Frank for Frank's sake, then that won't matter. If your reasons are particular, then it requires a carefully engineered introduction (and not just a Dweezil Zappa show) to merge and come out the other side happy. I can pretty much guarantee that 70% of those who find some reason to like him are fans of only select portions of his total output. That's not a slag against them; merely a statement that his "oeuvres" covered a range so broad that it is rare for all of it to appeal to any single individual.

Frank was a "composer", not just a "rock guitarist" or even "songwriter". I don't say that in any pejorative way. It's just that the way he approached music was not the same as four or five guys that start out covering songs and jamming and then decide to formalize their jams into songs. Even when there were lyrics, the lyrics were simply one corner of a big canvas that included lots of other stuff. I strongly suggest listening to the "I am all day and night" program that CBC ran (and which I linked to earlier). It provides a lot of context which will create a lot more appreciation for what you hear. At the very least, you will never think the same way about marimba ever again.


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

mhammer said:


> People love him for a hundred different reasons...often only 3 or 4 at a time.
> 
> Some folks love him because of the sarcasm and biting political wit ("I don't wanna get drafted"). Some folks loved his "dirty" songs (e.g., "Dinah Mo Hum", "Yellow Snow") or his tunes that made fun of easy targets ("Dancing Fool", "Valley Girl"). Some folks think he's all about shredding ("Shut Up 'N Play Yer Guitar" series). Some folks think he's all about being just plain weird ("Who are the Brain Police?"). Some folks love his use and citations of classic music from other places (e.g., the use of Holst and Stravinsky throughout the "Absolutely Free" album). Some folks love the way he uses doo-*** ("Reuben and the Jets"). Some folks think of him as a sort of jazz-fusion guy. Some think it's just wonderful that anyone would incorporate marimba into any sort of rock-based music. Some like him because he incorporates "musique concrète". Some like him because he can write melodies of surprising beauty that spring out of a thicket of notes clustered to be dissonant ("Zoot Allures"). And so on, and so on.
> 
> ...


Well said. 

I may be in the 30% group. Although I love FZ for his music, I'm amused by his humour.

And yes, he was a composer, not a songwriter or musician. although his guitar playing dominated other players, including virtuosos in his own band, that was really a small part of what made him great.


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

Well said as usual, M Hammer. As a young teenager in the 70's I first got turned onto him by his wacky, and often "dirty" lyrics. But the first album I bought was Grand Wazoo which I guess would be considered one of his more obscure jazz albums. No poo-poo jokes or double entendres on that one. But it was still pretty cool stuff for a 13 year old to listen to.

By the time I was 15 I was experimenting with LSD and listening to Zappa almost constantly. Is it still called experimenting if you do it every day for 2 years? hwopv

I knew every song and obscure Zappa reference ever written. I saw him perform several times in his peak years (IMO ~73-81). 

That said, I don't listen to much Zappa any more. I still like to listen to a few tunes. Black Napkins in it's many different forms. Peaches. The solos in 50/50 (Frank & Jean Luc Ponty) still give me tingles when I hear it. I think for the most part his catalog is permanently burned into my brain, so I don't really need to hear it any more.

:smile:


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## dufe32 (Feb 5, 2007)

Milkman said:


> Zappa is an acquired taste. His catalogue is HUGE and full of brilliant music.
> 
> Not everyone will enjoy FZ, but his audience has always been largely comprised of musicians and intellectuals.
> 
> ...




This.




I am a fan too, been for a long time.


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## Fader (Mar 10, 2009)

Burnt Weenie Sandwich did it for me.


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## shoretyus (Jan 6, 2007)

I am still trying to do the Mudshark ...baby. 

Mr Hammer ... brilliant... You get the GC literary award of the year.


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## Robert1950 (Jan 21, 2006)

Back in 1970 is was Hot Rats that did it for me. It's still on my regular playlist. I love most of Frank's work. He was genius IMHO. I consider his work a genre unto itself.

[youtube]-cPg7z1pclA[/youtube]


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## Sneaky (Feb 14, 2006)

Robert1950 said:


> Back in 1970 is was Hot Rats that did it for me. It's still on my regular playlist. I love most of Frank's work. He was genius IMHO. I consider his work a genre unto itself.


Nice, Inca Roads. I saw that tour at McMaster U in Hammertown. My fave FZ era... One Size Fits all was his best album IMO.

Here's a little Black Napkins for y'all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c-NMnYhM3Q


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Stratin2traynor said:


> Frank Zappa - am I missing something?
> 
> I've started this thread as a result of reading the one about the person you would most like to spend a day with. I noticed a few people have Zappa on their list. I'm assuming it's because of his music and/or political views.
> 
> Can someone please explain the love for his work. I've gone so far as to buy a couple of his CD's and listen to them repeatedly. I just don't get it. Maybe I bought the wrong CD's. What am I missing?


I know why I was originally attracted to his music. At 17 or so years of age I was deathly bored with what we now call classic rock. Too much simplicity for a guy raised on classical and liturgical music. I loved some blues-rock and some prog-rock, but most rock music was kinda boring. I gravitated to jazz and jazz-rock. Zappa gave me more interesting harmonies, arrangements, dynamics, humour, instrumentation, orchestration, and subject matter. On top of all that, the press made him an interesting personality. Frankly (pun intended), he made me pay attention, and challenged my ears. 

Peace, Mooh.


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## Shiny_Beast (Apr 16, 2009)

to start there's the musical brilliance

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djXf9UwNKmA&feature=related

and then there's the shit only he could pull off

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0p3Ue3ncH3g&feature=related

and, well...unique combination of comedy and ripping guitar

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcm7uJ74XFI

and really funny shit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkBEh5dwNKk

it goes on...


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

That Stairway To Heaven bit looks like the last tour I seen him on. They did a 20 minute rendition of it and he was wearing those goofy pants. I remember at the time that me and the dudes that went to the concert were pissed that he wasted 20 minutes doing STH when he had a catalogue of 2000 songs to choose from. But that was thing with Zappa. You never knew what you were going to get with him. Whatever he fealt like doing that night was going to be your experience.


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## fret15 (Feb 17, 2006)

I think Inca Roads originally got me into Zappa, but I'm really into Black Napkins too. 

What got me pulled in was the great songs, although I had to look for them for a while (37032340 albums doesn't make it any easier), but for sure some great albums and a really good solo on Inca Roads that made me think "that is what guitar playing should really be like."


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