# Tube distortion pedals?



## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I am looking at an EHX English Muff'n and a Blackstar HT Dual. Are they worth the extra $$ if you have tube amps, or will it make any real difference in sound? The EHX is not as expensive as the Blackstar, and I can't find a H&K Tube Factor anywhere near what I could pay. Just curious if they are worth it, or just buy the "normal" distortion pedal and maybe a 2nd pedal with the same $$. I know I could buy it and see, but it could save me $$ for something else I like if the tube is more gimmick than anything.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Are you looking for a specific tone from a pedal, or to buy something for fun?


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

The same warmth that a tube amp gives would be awesome through the pedal, but if there isn't a big enough difference from one without a tube, then I could just get something else. If the tube makes the same sort of tone and warmth as the amp, would it not compliment the amp?


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

With the exception of the Kingsley pedals, I'm gonna say for the most part the tube thing is a gimmick. Just this weekend I tried the Fender MTG tube distortion after being disappointed by the Effectrode tube drive.
It actually wasn't a bad sounding pedal but no better than the countless good sounding solid stage drives out there. I didn't find it was dynamic and responded that great to picking attack like tubes should. But I was able to get a very good tone from it. 
On the inside was a small 6205 tube soldered to the board. No flexibility in tube rolling like the effectrode or Kingsley that just takes 12AX7 or similar. 
And I wonder what happens if\when the tube goes. 
Out of the tube pedals I've tried, a couple of different effectrode, a few of the Kingsley's, radial tone bone and now the Fender MTG, nothing comes close to the Kingsley pedals.

Inside the Fender MTG:

 https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

The EHX has 2 tubes. 12at7 orignal. So those tubes can be swapped out or replaced. I did reach an agreement of $135 for the EHX English muff’n


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## Guncho (Jun 16, 2015)

A tube distortion pedal is the same as preamp distortion which is not the desirable distortion tube amps can make.

Think bees in a can.


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## BSTheTech (Sep 30, 2015)

Mark Hammer.... Paging Mr. Mark Hammer... please attend to this thread please...thank you.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Get yourself a good booster to drive the amp


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Now THAT is my idea of popcorn for a movie.


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## BSTheTech (Sep 30, 2015)

Everything I’ve read said tube pedals were a gimmick. They might sound ok (as any pedal can) but it has nothing to do with the tube. Also pretty hard to get tube current and voltage out of a 9 volt for very long.


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## oldjoat (Apr 4, 2019)

Jfets sound the same as tubes ( similar but without the high voltage ) ... 
extremely high input impedance ( won't load down the source signal)
looks like a transistor ( generally speaking )

Tube pedals are a gimmick ... 
just like gold plated Monster cables for audio fanatics ( that can really hear the difference!, except in a blind test)
tweak the pedal's internal components and you'll be hard pressed to tell them apart.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

knight_yyz said:


> Get yourself a good booster to drive the amp


Thats exactly my next move. I'm putting aside the search for a drive pedal and looking at boosters. I'll be trying the TC spark booster (not the mini) next.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Will a boost not also drive my volume? I don’t want that. This is for basement playing. The EHX is distortion and can act as an eq as well. I don’t have an eq so it’s a bit of a bonus.


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## Guest (Aug 25, 2019)

If you don't want to have your tube amp volume up too loud, a Kingsley tube pedal will give you a great tone. 

Years ago I had a Mesa tube pedal. I was not into the tone of it back then, plus it had a volume drop issue.


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## Dorian2 (Jun 9, 2015)

I haven't tried one so I can't really say. I haven't hard great things about the Blackstar lineup of tube pedals though. I do wonder what they'd (tube based pedals) sound like in the return of an FX loop on a tube amp though.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I have a “master volume” (pedal of sorts) I put in the FX loop of both tube amps. Turn the amp up itself up, but turn this dial down. I am very happy with this setup and boosting volume is not what I am after. The tube pedal I figured would add some warm distortion. I am slowly building my pedal board up, so I ask here. Its not going to cost a lot, so I figured it’s worth the gamble. So far, it seems the info masses lean the other direction.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

guitarman2 said:


> Thats exactly my next move. I'm putting aside the search for a drive pedal and looking at boosters. I'll be trying the TC spark booster (not the mini) next.


I'm leaning towards the MXR micro amp.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

Dorian2 said:


> I haven't tried one so I can't really say. I haven't hard great things about the Blackstar lineup of tube pedals though. I do wonder what they'd (tube based pedals) sound like in the return of an FX loop on a tube amp though.


The Blackstar is no longer an option for me. It's priced higher than I want to go, and he isn't budging. The EHX gets good reviews online, plus it's a trusted name. I know that doesn't always mean a lot, but I've had a couple EHX and I have liked them. Still have a Soul Food on my board.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Verne said:


> Will a boost not also drive my volume? I don’t want that. This is for basement playing. The EHX is distortion and can act as an eq as well. I don’t have an eq so it’s a bit of a bonus.


Depends on how you use it.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

BSTheTech said:


> Mark Hammer.... Paging Mr. Mark Hammer... please attend to this thread please...thank you.


Now that the Als/Argos game is over (helluva good game, too!), I'm back on-line, by request.
Honestly, I doubt I have anything to add that hasn't been said already. Much of what players like about tube amps comes from the power section, rather than preamp. Sticking another couple of tube-based gain stages ahead of the amp won't necessarily deliver more "tube-ness". That doesn't mean it will sound _*bad*_, but the power section and transformer will really be doing the heavy lifting in terms of imparting whatever a tube-quality is. Pushing it with a FET-based, tube-based, or op-amp-based boost still pushes those same power tubes and transformer.

Realistically, applying boost ahead of any amp will generally reduce its touch-responsiveness because you're bringing the signal closer to the headroom limits. You can probably preserve some headroom if you pay careful attention to gain-staging, but it certainly doesn't magically emerge because things are tube-based. My advice would be that whatever you go with, make sure it is capable of providing enough treble-taming. Even great tube amps can lose their "warmth" if you feed them too much treble in a boosted signal.

Are tube-based pedals a "gimmick". Nah. It's never inherent to the components the design is based around, but how the design uses them. You certainly don't get "magic" from tubes just because they're tubes. I was sent an Eleca tube overdrive to evaluate. It's a clone of the old B.K. Butler Tube Driver. I thought it sounded awful, but I didn't spend much time with it, largely because it was hard to dial in a "warm" tone.

As for the 6205 tubes, Fender used them because they had a big stockpile. And from what I gather, such tubes are still in production.


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## Hammerhands (Dec 19, 2016)

I had one of these V-Twins. It’s pretty good but rolls off the highs and lows in a weird way. It has lots of transistors and stuff. I wish I had kept it sometimes, but not often.

https://guitarscanada.com/index.php...reamp-behringer-modeller.242864/#post-2505254

Some tube pedals are worth it, especially if you aren’t going through transistors or opamps anywhere else, but all the ones I know that do what they should are very expensive.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

I have a boutique 12ax7 starved-plate MIAB overdrive. Probably more gimmick than anything, but it is the most convincing JCM800 overdrive sound I've ever heard from a pedal. Too bad I can't seem to find it lately.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

I'd honestly like the Tube Factor (yes, I like H&K stuff), but they are expensive and hard to find 2nd hand locally. I can't buy one of these brand new, so after looking around, found these 2 specific pedals near me. I checked both out online, but not being knowledgeable, I came here for trusted input. I'd either like it, or not. If not, then it'd be sold.


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## Verne (Dec 29, 2018)

knight_yyz said:


> I'm leaning towards the MXR micro amp.


There is an MXR micro amp for $100 on a London gear FB page right now.


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## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

knight_yyz said:


> Depends on how you use it.


I am could be happy using the channel 2 on my amp for over drive as it sounds quite nice. My amp has dual attenuators but the drive channel attenuated to where I need it for bedroom level doesn't sound great. One click up from there sounds really good but too loud. So I'm hoping with a booster, perhaps like the TC spark I can attenuate where it sounds good and with the booster bring down the volume to equal where I have the clean channel set.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Verne said:


> The same warmth that a tube amp gives would be awesome through the pedal, but if there isn't a big enough difference from one without a tube, then I could just get something else. If the tube makes the same sort of tone and warmth as the amp, would it not compliment the amp?


Tube warmth comes from volume, and it seems like you cant really get a lot of that right now.

It might be a good time to start looking at affordable modeling options.

Unrelated, my fulltone ocd had people convinced they were hearing my jcm800.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Verne said:


> There is an MXR micro amp for $100 on a London gear FB page right now.


And there is one for 80 in Oakville


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

@Verne , the Budda Phatman is a great twin 12AX7 pedal, are floating around for a good price.


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## tonewoody (Mar 29, 2017)

The Seymour Duncan Twin Tube is a great unit. 250 volts on a military mini tube (6201?).

No gimmick, it adds two more channels of tube boost/overdrive/dirt to your amp. 

There are a few different Twin Tubes, my experience is with the copper colored one. Definately voiced for blues/rock. Some of the other models appear to be gainier.

While the Twin Tube may not beat out a Kingsley, it does some great things and plays well with other effects.


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## knight_yyz (Mar 14, 2015)

Klon vs Dual Boost. I think the dual sounds better


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