# Random Number Generator - Altoids



## p_wats (Nov 11, 2009)

I had this Altoids tin sitting around and figured I would see what could be stuffed in there. I'd seen people build in these before and thought the Random Number Generator would be a perfect fit (look around on Youtube to hear examples--sort of a bitcrushing fuzz sound that inserts random octave notes). It was risky going with a stomp switch (was going to use a mini-toggle, but this effect is so crazy I wanted to be able to stomp it on and off at will).

In the end it all fits (barely, had to bend the leads on the stomp and cover the inside in electrical tape) and sounds very crazy. I had originally intended to use it as a sort of bitcrusher effect on drum loops, but it's just so much fun that I think I'll use it all the time!

I opted for a trimpot instead of a volume knob, as this little guy gets very loud at the slightest touch, so I set it to just about unity and left it. This was also my first vero build, so I'm pleased that it works at all!


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## keeperofthegood (Apr 30, 2008)

:wave: pretty awesome dude!!

The RNG is a double integrator with a 10 second delay in the feedback loop. 
If you look up the use of integrators in chaos theory you will get to:

http://math.arizona.edu/~rta/004/bergevin.chris/sync.html

fun read and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerk_(physics)

http://frank.harvard.edu/~paulh/misc/lorenz.htm

http://home.comcast.net/~ijfritz/ch_cir1.htm

There are some other people in physics and mathematics that are doing some fascinating research into this who's sites I am just not coming up with at the moment (I probably have them bookmarked somewhere). 

These will show you some interesting ideas to pursue with the RNG, which is in essence a single channel of one of these. The important point to realize is this, these circuits are chaotic but they are also patterned and fall under the definition for being a fractal. They can be driven into non-patterned noise losing the fractal nature of them, which is where I think the RNG is operating.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

hey thats great!
looks really nicely built, and if it works, its all good!
ive been building whats often called the easiest of all circuits, a rangemaster.
should take an hour or two, but after a month, and 6 total rebuilds, im thinking ive got some bad caps.(only component i havent replaced). 
ive been soldering guitars for a lot of years, never tried an effect. not as easy as it looks!


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## p_wats (Nov 11, 2009)

Thanks for the replies, guys.

Keeperofthegood, that's some very interesting info. Thanks! I'm still pretty new to why all this stuff works. Give me a soldering iron and a layout and I can make it happen, but the why and how is still beyond me, but I'm working on that!

Fraser, was your Rangemaster a kit? That was how I started and it was pretty simple. That said, I definitely had a build where I was two weeks troubleshooting and it turned out I had a bad batch of capacitors. You'll get it working!

This pedal is so much fun, as it's pocket-sized and insane.


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## mrmatt1972 (Apr 3, 2008)

p_wats said:


> (look around on Youtube to hear examples--sort of a bitcrushing fuzz sound that inserts random octave notes).


I looked but did not find. Can you post a link.


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## p_wats (Nov 11, 2009)

mrmatt1972 said:


> I looked but did not find. Can you post a link.


Here's a demo by the guy who sent me the layout to build it (also in an Altoids tin): 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r6A6rqI9xo


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## keeperofthegood (Apr 30, 2008)

p_wats said:


> Here's a demo by the guy who sent me the layout to build it (also in an Altoids tin):
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r6A6rqI9xo


He is also quite involved in a thread on these on DIY stompboxes

The original drafter of the circuit has sorta passed into net entropy though, not able to find anything really current from him online.


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## p_wats (Nov 11, 2009)

keeperofthegood said:


> He is also quite involved in a thread on these on DIY stompboxes
> 
> The original drafter of the circuit has sorta passed into net entropy though, not able to find anything really current from him online.


Doug Deeper (http://www.midfielectronics.com/) designed the RNG and even posted the schematic on that forum himself for people to make. He's designed some really crazy effects (there are two videos on that site). 

He also posted the Clari(not) schematic for people to try and build, which is my next pedal project.


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## keeperofthegood (Apr 30, 2008)

p_wats said:


> Doug Deeper (http://www.midfielectronics.com/) designed the RNG and even posted the schematic on that forum himself for people to make. He's designed some really crazy effects (there are two videos on that site).
> 
> He also posted the Clari(not) schematic for people to try and build, which is my next pedal project.



Yes that is the fellow and those youtube accounts are pretty much dormant. His girlfriend of a few years ago, in 2 years doesn't mention him at all. It is also frustrating that he chose the name of a porn star as his user name, or that his real name is the same as that chosen by a porn star >.< in either case makes finding him nearly impossible.


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## fraser (Feb 24, 2007)

> Fraser, was your Rangemaster a kit? That was how I started and it was pretty simple. That said, I definitely had a build where I was two weeks troubleshooting and it turned out I had a bad batch of capacitors. You'll get it working!


hey bud, no im just following the geo fx instructions-
http://www.geofex.com/Article_Folders/Rangemaster/atboost.pdf
as a rookie, i assumed it was my stupidity that caused the failure, so i rebuilt it over and over lol- i try to avoid any unnecessary frustration in my life, so i keep setting it aside. one of these days itll work.:smile:


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