# DON'T TURN!!



## fretboard (May 31, 2006)

Of course she did - directly in front of us while we're doing the posted 90...

Wife and I were taking the kids to Michigan Friday for a long weekend of shopping, baseball and as far as our kids were concerned, the highlight event of the season - Weird Al live and in concert. Being SW Ontario cagey veterans, we're off the beaten path and making our way to a ferry to cross the border when a lady in the oncoming lane slows, turns on her signal - then turns left in front of us and we go 90 to 0 in about 11 feet while sending her spinning. Kids and wife were fine with the exception of bruising from seatbelts. Your humble narrator was not as lucky, although having us all walk away was a blessing as our car was a smoldering write off.

7+ hours in the hospital Friday but able to walk and wave bye to the wife and kids as she found a "replacement" for me (her sister) to continue on the epic-for-the-kids weekend journey in a rental. No reason for them to hang around and watch me sleep stoned when we had all the tickets, reservations, etc.

Left arm in a cast, first of two surgeon meetings already to explain how they hope to reattach ligaments from what's left of my left thumb. Another surgeon on Wednesday to deal with the whole shattered left wrist. I don't see much guitar playing getting done the rest of this year. I will have metal detectors going off apparently by the time they're done.

Take a moment and strum a cowboy chord for me today if you could.


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## GuitarsCanada (Dec 30, 2005)

OMG sorry to hear that bro. Best of luck on the mending and at least nobody was killed. Bad drivers are everywhere today


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## Alex (Feb 11, 2006)

Wow, sorry to read this. All the best in your recoveries.


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

That is terrible. Did the idiot give any reason at all for not seeing you?

Hope the surgeons work their magic and you get back on your feet quickly. Glad to hear the wife and kids were none the worse for wear, it could have been really nasty.

Strumming an Am for you.


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## keto (May 23, 2006)

My nightmare. I drive as a regular part of my job and see tons of idiots. I've very defensive, and am accident free and not pulled over in 15 years. Ow, just bruised my knuckles knocking my desk, and I don't think it's real wood.

Dude, get well, do what they tell you to do. I admire your and your wifes guts and committment to the kids, my wife would never have carried on the trip if I weren't part of it.


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## bigboki (Apr 16, 2015)

Thank God, that you were not more seriously injured and so sorry to hear for such a terrible accident.
I remember when I got my license, my father told me - "remember when you are driving, it is the same like walking/running with uncocked gun in your hands - and also remember that all other cars are the same".

But really, it is getting completely crazy on the roads in GTA. I am not driving often (every weekend), but there is no weekend without seeing plenty of ridiculous nonsense.

I always lough when I hear people talking about danger and terrorism and safety and something being "not safe" and all that crap.
The single most dangerous thing that everyone of is doing is simply going out on the street (in the car or out) 

I wish you fast, complete recovery!

yours truly
Bojan


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

There are some catastrophes where one gets some great stories out of it, and it feels like a reasonably fair trade; some stories are like that.

I don't think this one was a fair trade.

Are you left or right-handed?


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## urko99 (Mar 30, 2009)

That really sucks!! I hope you make a speedy and full recovery. The cowboy chords are a comin'.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

Now would be a great time to pick up a lap steel and learn that in your downtime


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## amagras (Apr 22, 2015)

Strumming here @fretboard 
Good to know nothing bad happened to the kids, we all hope you'll be fine soon man!


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

Damn!

Well, to coin (and take liberties with) a phrase, there but for the grace of dogs go I.

Sorry this happened. I just got back from Columbus, Ohio on Friday and had at least three near misses.

I always assume other drivers are going to suddenly spaz out and do something dangerous / suicidal in front of me.

Every time you go out there it's a gauntlet.

I hope you heal quickly.

Glad nobody was more seriously injured.


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## Mooh (Mar 7, 2007)

Holy fuck, man! That's the stuff of nightmares! Glad to know you're alive and kicking and that the family is okay. Medical science being what it is nowadays, there is likely a tough road ahead but also as likely a recovery to normal or almost normal.

I'll strum that cowboy chord for you a whole lot.

Get well.

Peace, Mooh.


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## Merlin (Feb 23, 2009)

Best wishes for a speedy recovery. And get a dashcam...


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## dodgechargerfan (Mar 22, 2006)

Glad you're relatively okay!
Heal fast. Cowboy chords on the way.

Alex Lifeson is a cowboy. Right?

G#m(+5)
D6/9
Aadd9


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

That just sucks. Glad it wasn't worse. And while I felt for your post, I don't think a 'like' was appropriate. 

Like mooh said, this is the stuff of nightmares. I wouldn't mind being off work for a few weeks or months, but not being able to play? Yikes.

The good news is some guy named Lester Polsfuss badly broke an arm in an auto accident, and I think he went on to do OK. Good luck with your recovery!


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

This is terrible! 

I know it could have been a lot worse, but it is reminder as to what a huge difference a few milliseconds can make in one's life.

Keep us updated during your recovery and rehab. Hopefully, it will all go smoothly and in a timely manner. 

Take good care of yourselves. 

I only know 3 chords...but I play 'em real good! 
Sending them your way.


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## djmarcelca (Aug 2, 2012)

Hopefully you have a Dashcam to fend off the inevitable Lawsuit. 
I've seen 3 guys this year in mild fender benders that were similar to your description and because they were the trailing vehicle got hit with a lawsuit.
Out here in Alberta they have up to 2 years after the accident to files suit. 

Take care in recovery and keep an eye out for process servers. 
Dashcam is goin to be one my next things in my vehicle..... before a remote starter


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

I had a bad near miss on Friday. Came within inches of crushing a civic in a tandem truck. Tractor trailer decided to merge by brute force method and shoved her into our lane as we were passing her. She probably has no idea how close to death she was. I didn't have a chicken strap on, and I hit the windshield we braked so hard to save her


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## allthumbs56 (Jul 24, 2006)

Milkman said:


> Damn!
> 
> 
> I always assume other drivers are going to suddenly spaz out and do something dangerous / suicidal in front of me.


Me too - but it's pretty hard to anticipate what oncoming traffic might do. About all you've got is trying to read them changing their speed or maybe being able to see what they're heads are looking at - but it all happens at a converging speed.

Sometimes you've just got to rely on the odds.


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## cheezyridr (Jun 8, 2009)

sorry to hear this. for once i can offer someone good advice. acupuncture and deep tissue massage will have you playing again, eventually. my ankle was pieced back together with lots of screws and plumber's strap. at first i could barely walk. now i climb a ladder carrying tools and equipment, and stand on the rails of my lift, and do all the semi-acrobatic things i did before, just a little slower. every single gain i got happened after i started the acupuncture. i thought it was hokus-pokus b/s until i did it 3 times. you might be taking a break for a little while, but you'll get this back. 
p/m me if you want to know my doctor. i see your location is gta. she's in the city, but she's really good.


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## Budda (May 29, 2007)

Sorry to hear of your accident . I drive a lot and it's always in the back of my mind that *anything* could happen.

As others have said, do what's gotta get done to heal.


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## butterknucket (Feb 5, 2006)

Get well, and I'll play some chords in your honour.


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

Whoa, bud, speedy recovery.



Sent from my Other Brain


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## Milkman (Feb 2, 2006)

allthumbs56 said:


> Me too - but it's pretty hard to anticipate what oncoming traffic might do. About all you've got is trying to read them changing their speed or maybe being able to see what they're heads are looking at - but it all happens at a converging speed.
> 
> Sometimes you've just got to rely on the odds.


Oh for sure. There are situations you simply can't predict or avoid.

The best you can do is try to deal with what you can and minimize the threats wherever possible.

I guess that's trying to improve the odds.


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## Hamstrung (Sep 21, 2007)

Oh man that sucks! Thankfully your family was basically unscathed. Hope you're healing goes quickly and well.


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## WCGill (Mar 27, 2009)

Praanng! Maybe that was more like a jazz chord. Sucks, but hang in there, physio when the time comes. The same thing happened to my son in Vancouver a few weeks ago, fortunately he wasn't going as fast and he's unhurt. All the best.


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## sulphur (Jun 2, 2011)

Sorry to hear of this, glad that it wasn't worse.

Take it easy and wishing you the best in your recovery.


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## Scotty (Jan 30, 2013)

Dude you are fortunate to tell your tale even though you got pretty banged up. It could have been much worse....glad to hear the fam is ok...and that it wasn't a tragedy. Too many of those stories these days

Drive safe everyone


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

I understood that she turned across the road in front of him, he wasn't following her

E="djmarcelca, post: 739905, member: 11430"]Hopefully you have a Dashcam to fend off the inevitable Lawsuit.
I've seen 3 guys this year in mild fender benders that were similar to your description and because they were the trailing vehicle got hit with a lawsuit.
Out here in Alberta they have up to 2 years after the accident to files suit.

Take care in recovery and keep an eye out for process servers.
Dashcam is goin to be one my next things in my vehicle..... before a remote starter[/QUOTE]


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

I have been in one of those accidents before and fortunately was only badly bruised and they let me go home from the hospital that night. I'm sorry to hear you didn't fare as well. I hope your recovery will be quick and glad it wasn't more serious.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

Sucks that it happened--but good that the end result wasn't worse.
Here's to a full & speedy recovery.

This brought flashbacks of the guy who turned left in front of me without warning on my way to work one day.
I wasn't going as fast --and wasn't hurt as badly--but i was sore for a while--and it did affect being able to play for a short time.

Makes you wonder what people are thinking (or not thinking) when they get behind the wheel.


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## Chito (Feb 17, 2006)

Sorry to hear about this. Glad to hear that family is okay and hoping for you speedy recovery.


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## marcos (Jan 13, 2009)

Wow !!! Sorry to hear about your experience. Speedy recovery.


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## rockinbluesfan (Mar 3, 2008)

I think there's a blues song there somewhere! Get well soon.


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## bzrkrage (Mar 20, 2011)

zontar said:


> Makes you wonder what people are thinking (or not thinking) when they get behind the wheel.


On a brief off track, same thoughts as they play with their damn phones while driving.
What is sooooo important that you risk it all for a text/FB/emojis?
End of rant.
She wasn't on the phone when she turned was she?


Sent from my Other Brain


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

I'm not going to make excuses for an inattentive driver, but sometimes stuff happens, when circumstances don't cooperate. I recall one time in Victoria, where an older lady went through a red light and pretty much took off my left front fender. As it happened , she was driving into a sunset that was on highbeams straight down, and in alignment with, the street she was driving on. I was about to turn right at a cross street (with a green light in my direction) and for her there was simply this one big spotlight facing her. Happily, I was only edging out and not gunning it at the corner, so she only hit in front of the wheel well and did not T-bone me.

Like I say, sometimes accidents happen to folks that are both driving sensibly. It's not the stuff you can predict and control; it's the stuff nobody expects that'll get you.

In any event, it sucks, but happily "guitar season" goes 12 months a year, so one can always get back on the team. Tough to watch from the sidelines, though.


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

bzrkrage said:


> On a brief off track, same thoughts as they play with their damn phones while driving.
> What is sooooo important that you risk it all for a text/FB/emojis?
> End of rant.
> She wasn't on the phone when she turned was she?
> ...


It would be interesting to know--In my case the other driver wasn't--just in a rush & thought he could turn in the gap that wasn't as big as he thought.
But let's hear from Fretboard.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

mhammer said:


> I'm not going to make excuses for an inattentive driver, but sometimes stuff happens, when circumstances don't cooperate. I recall one time in Victoria, where an older lady went through a red light and pretty much took off my left front fender. As it happened , she was driving into a sunset that was on highbeams straight down, and in alignment with, the street she was driving on. I was about to turn right at a cross street (with a green light in my direction) and for her there was simply this one big spotlight facing her. Happily, I was only edging out and not gunning it at the corner, so she only hit in front of the wheel well and did not T-bone me.
> 
> Like I say, sometimes accidents happen to folks that are both driving sensibly. It's not the stuff you can predict and control; it's the stuff nobody expects that'll get you.
> 
> In any event, it sucks, but happily "guitar season" goes 12 months a year, so one can always get back on the team. Tough to watch from the sidelines, though.


I fancy myself to be a good driver and I drive for a living, but early one morning on my way to a call in I pulled out of my parking lot and hit a Mazda 6 just ahead of the drivers side rear door and spun him 180 degrees into the curb. I don't know if it was the sun shine, or he was speeding or what it was. I didn't see him at all until I heard the impact and saw him spin. I never had a chance to tap the brakes.


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## fretboard (May 31, 2006)

Thanks to everyone for the well wishes. I really appreciate it.

Too medicated to remember everything I wanted to mention, and right hand only typing on a keyboard blows - but lemme try. I'm right handed, so luckily I can still, uhhh, brush my teeth without it feeling like someone else...

Zontar a couple posts above nailed it - lady in oncoming lane slowed to a stop with her left signal on, truck in front of me passes intersection, she attempts to gun it and turn before we get to the intersection (we have right of way) - we hit her rear right tire, air bags go off, bit of fire but all doors can still open with some effort, no one knocked out. Truck behind us stopped and helped get one door open, took kids to ditch and out of harms way. He became witness #1 (certainly in our eyes) when police showed on scene. Youngest boy and I taken by ambulance, wife and other son taken by police to hospital after cop assisted with insurance, rental car (did I mention we had a rental to use up points - and we had full insurance? Little piece of luck there too...) Cop couldn't have been nicer to us - made sure everything was squared away in report before leaving. Other driver is at fault, no idea if charges pending. She is politely, a senior citizen. No idea about cell phone user at the time although I would doubt it. Happened a little after 11am so no sun glare on horizon, perfectly sunny day.

Still waiting on final assessment of what will need to done on thumb and wrist. Multiple appts, but head surgeon guy away until middle of next week so plenty of opinions but no cutting, bolting, reattaching yet. Old school plaster cast with thumb brace still in lieu of something lighter, comfortable and won't turn to mush the moment it gets wet... Hopefully by this time next week I'll be on the road to recovery.

Thanks again for the kind thoughts.


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

fretboard said:


> Thanks to everyone for the well wishes. I really appreciate it.
> 
> Too medicated to remember everything I wanted to mention, and right hand only typing on a keyboard blows - but lemme try. I'm right handed, so luckily I can still, uhhh, brush my teeth without it feeling like someone else...
> 
> ...


Man that is scary. Best wishes again and really glad the rest of the family is OK.


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## amagras (Apr 22, 2015)

Thanks for reporting @fretboard, still strumming here.


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## bw66 (Dec 17, 2009)

Yikes! You are living my guitar nightmare - left hand!

I was away for a bit and missed this at the first go-round - Hope your recovery is swift and complete!


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Wow that's a wickedly scary escapade. I wish you well and wish you a very speedy recovery! Thank god everyone was okay but you bore the brunt of it. I am so sorry that you have to endure this because of someone else's absolute stupidity!

Fretboard you have been amazing to me. This guy is my neighbor down the road and he has bestowed many incredible CD's of all my favorite bands on me and asking nothing in return!

If you need anything, you know where I live. I would be very happy to do whatever needs to be done to help you with your recovery!


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

He wants cowboy chords, Lola.



fretboard said:


> Take a moment and strum a cowboy chord for me today if you could.


How close are you? Will a full stack do it or will you need two? Rent a Hendrix rig and aim it in the right direction. We're all helping, in a virtual kinda way, but you could be having a real impact on his recovery. Either that or I just have a fascination with how cowboy chords would sound through a massive Hendrix rig. Please post clips.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

A cowboy chord he shall have! I am strumming some right now Fretboard in your honor!

Get well my friend!


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## Electraglide (Jan 24, 2010)

Just a few Canadian "cowboy" chords.


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## leftysg (Mar 29, 2008)

Just got around to reading this...sorry to hear about the whole damn thing. The other driver musta been listening to Dare to Be Stupid while they were driving. Best wishes for quick healing.

[video]



[h/video]


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## fretboard (May 31, 2006)

Little update. 5 weeks in and I'm on my third cast now. Broken scaphoid bone fusing back nicely - better than my plastic surgeon expected. Three fractures in my thumb aren't coming along nearly as well so added a metal splint in cast and more x-rays in 3 weeks and we'll see after that what needs to be done. Met with physio to start finger movement as best I can with cast and she gave me 90 minutes a day of stuff to do now so when the cast comes off my fingers won't need much attention compared to wrist and thumb. I can move them about an inch on my own for now, so stretching them/bending them is something I'm looking forward to. Aiming for making a thumbless fist in three weeks. Fingers are shockingly swollen still considering icing them 3 times a day, and it's been 5 weeks and they didn't suffer any bone damage. Just got the cast off when I took this picture so that might help explain why my mid 40-s hand has the look of a mitt twice that age. My index finger isn't normally that much fatter than my thumb. Thumb looks pretty good here all things considered.










Teaching myself right hand only piano chords so I can sorta play along with my kids. Tried some one handed tapping in the Jeff Healey guitar position but not for me after 30 seconds of excessive wankery. Those first 30 seconds were fun though.


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Thanks for the update. Good news that the scaphoid is healing well. Those carpal (wrist) bones can be (specifically) problematic after fractures. 

The hand is a delicate and complex mechanism (as you know). I think being careful not to "push" too hard with exercise while, at the same time, being consistent is a very reasonable approach. Sorry, too many years of being a physio. Please keep us posted.


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## fretboard (May 31, 2006)

'bout ready to give up on returning to my guitar room anytime soon. Was hoping to have my hand back by Christmas, call it maybe Easter now. 10 weeks from accident, 2 without cast and everything went to hell in a... hand basket a week ago last Friday. Couldn't take water hitting hand in shower, couldn't stand to touch it - constant pins and needles and burning sensation. Couldn't sleep with my hand touching anything which meant no sleep. Waiting to get a call from some Pain Clinic for CRPS - nerve damage in hand is causing the nerves to fire on high 24/7. Shed skin on hand daily, can't differentiate hot or cold with it - everything I feel with it is just wet to me - the tv remote feels wet, my pillow feels wet... Got some pills to help with the massive swelling (nice touch - first joints on my fingers have their own mud flaps) but this is losing the novelty very quickly...

My hand after my appt with surgeon last week.

On the plus side, haven't needed to change guitar strings in a while now. Not losing any picks either...


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## davetcan (Feb 27, 2006)

Really sorry about this, let's hope a minor miracle happens and the docs get everything figured out.


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## Hamstrung (Sep 21, 2007)

That's heart breaking! Hate to see a picker taken off line like that. Hope the healing starts to accelerate!


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Our empathy goes out to you, Fretboard. This must be a very difficult period for you to go through. Try your best not to get overly anxious about things although I can appreciate that must be difficult at times. The body is a very remarkable piece of engineering and has shown time and time again the ability to heal itself. It also sounds like the medical team you have is a good one. Please keep us up to date on your progress, even if it is slight.


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## bolero (Oct 11, 2006)

man..I sure hope you get your hand functionality back again

the nerve issue just happened recently? hopefully it's just a temp part of the recovery process

good mojo sent your way


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## fretboard (May 31, 2006)

Just following up, wish things were better but not really. Worst of the pain in my hand seems to have either tapered off or I'm just used to it after months. Pain clinic weekly, plastic surgeon every other week. Doesn't appear I will need to have my wrist rebroken, and the blood clot issue I was dealing with before Xmas in my shoulder has been addressed and not a major concern going forward they tell me. Another CT scan next week to see if surgery is required on soft tissue in wrist - pretty solid movement in wrist really, but still unable to make a fist or bend my thumb. My pain clinic has a chronic regional pain specific physio dude who I meet with after my weekly appt with the doctor and he gives me exercises to work on. Instead of playing guitar every night, I get 3-5 hours of physio a day I can do at home. Without being able to make a fist, I really can't fret anything on my guitars beyond a couple bar chords. Frustrating.

My wife and kids did pick me up this for Xmas. Not nearly the same, but can pull off a solid Free Bird intro slide solo along with a couple Seger things like Like A Rock or the sax parts in Turn The Page. Kind of enjoy some Smoke On The Water on it too. Getting an actual slide bar for it rather than using my typical slides I had made a big difference in sitting down and trying to get "some" level of mastery on it. Still weird as hell, but something to unwind with.


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

Feels weird to 'like' that. I think it sucks.

Keep up the good spirits, pal. My heart goes out to you. You are living through a situation all of us I am sure fear. I hope to hear positive things eventually in this thread. The best of luck in a recovery of some sort. 


(and I'll add this only because of the situation [email protected](*UY )


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## Steadfastly (Nov 14, 2008)

Good to hear from you. Stay positive and keep us updated.


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## Lola (Nov 16, 2014)

Your attitude is what's going to help you immensely. All the best and just keep that positive frame of mind and spirit!


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## zontar (Oct 25, 2007)

Hey--if you love playing it's good o find out what you can do...
And lap steels are cool.


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## fretboard (May 31, 2006)

To anyone still following along - and let's be honest here, you're all just a little glad it's me and not you. No offence taken - I know I'd rather hear about it from someone else than living it myself...

So I was up at my surgeon's last week and it was just supposed to be some x-rays and some time with her physio tech. X-rays are nothing to worry about, no new pain or abnormalities the previous week so basically looked at it as taking the car in for an oil change - maybe an hour and I'll be out the door. She pulls up my x-rays and gives a literal "gasp" in front of me. Mumbles a bit, pulls up my x-rays from a month ago and gasps again. Not good - similar I imagine to having the person cutting your hair make that sound - there's probably nothing good about to be revealed...

Quick show of hands - who knew Chronic Regional Pain Syndrome can lead to, in some cases, bone density deterioration? That hadn't come up with any of my docs before so it was news to me. The side by side of my x-rays clearly shows that the one from four weeks ago and the one from last week have a world of difference to them. Doc guessed 25% reduction anyway - probably closer to 35%.

Another MRI on the forearm/wrist/hand last night, meeting with my surgeon and another new doctor she's bringing along in a couple weeks once the results are back and they have time to do more research into how to proceed. My most recent x-ray was, as she described it "about what I would expect to see from a 75 year old woman with osteoporosis" so, yeah...

I have been able to pick up a guitar and hammer out a few things for a couple minutes the past week. Lotta bar chords using my index and pinkie fingers only. G chord is about the only first position one I can routinely get my hand to fall on, along with an Em. C chord is by far the hardest/most painful one I have tried so far. Tried it two different times, put down the guitar right after both times.

Don't be taking that guitar playing for granted. You may really miss it after it's gone for a while.


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## bigboki (Apr 16, 2015)

thank yo so much for the update and really sorry to hear about regression in your recovery


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## greco (Jul 15, 2007)

Thanks for sharing this. 

I hope the "tide" turns very soon and you start to get (ANY) good news.
Have you had some of loss of pain and improved function as time progresses?. 

I would be interested to know if the bone density is hopefully expected to improve naturally through time once you are nearing a reasonable level of recovery of mobility and strength. 

Take good care. 

All the best!!


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## High/Deaf (Aug 19, 2009)

fretboard said:


> Don't be taking that guitar playing for granted. You may really miss it after it's gone for a while.


Wow! Really sorry to hear about this from 'one of the family'. I'm glad you posted that last line. It's far too easy to think things will always be as they are.

I had my guitar playing taken away from me for 3 years nearly 20 years ago (chemo killed any feeling in my fingers and toes - so not as bad as you, but bad). I had a new appreciation for playing and move it up about 5 notches in my 'what do I want to do' list. Work took the biggest fall.


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## sorbz62 (Nov 15, 2011)

What did I tell you about fucking Canadian drivers!!


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## Guitar101 (Jan 19, 2011)

fretboard said:


> I have been able to pick up a guitar and hammer out a few things for a couple minutes the past week. Lotta bar chords using my index and pinkie fingers only. G chord is about the only first position one I can routinely get my hand to fall on, along with an Em. C chord is by far the hardest/most painful one I have tried so far. Tried it two different times, put down the guitar right after both times.


Keep up the positive attitude. Trying to type some words of encouragment but I can't even spell it let alone come up with something that may help you feel better.
I have been messing around with Chris Stapletons "Nobody To Blame" and "Tennessee Whisky" for awhile and having fun playing them. There both only 2 chords with one being a G. I think the other chords are D and Am if you can handle those. He plays them with a capo on 2nd fret and drop D tuning. I take the capo off to get them in my vocal range. Wishing you the best of luck down the road.


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