# So what's the best deal on a bare bones 5F1 Champ kit?



## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

Is there even such a thing (bare bones as in, no tubes, no speaker, no cabinet, not even the chassis or turret board; litterally just the bones aka electronic parts)? I also don't need pots and jacks and wire (got all that), but there's not likely to be a kit that doesn't include that stuff (and it's not the expensive bits).

All I see in my searching are a very few vendors selling _nearly _bare bones kits (at least includes chassis), but they're still like US$225-299 (currently about CA$300-400).

... So I did some research and it looks to me that I can buy all those parts, and not cheapo stuff either but decent if not the actual good stuff (Classic Tone transformers; F&T filter caps, Orange Drop coupling caps, Arcol carbon resistors, Kiwame for the higher wattage resistors, ceramic tube sockets etc) for < CA$155 before shipping (above kit price is also before shipping, so to compare apples to apples). And that's full price from retailers not even quantity discounts from retailers vs wholesale suppliers (which means it is possible to do better). PLus a chassis lets say that would be CA$200; litterally half. AND, I can get most of it (not the transformers) from a local Canadian supplier, so I might be able to avoid shipping altogether. I could get Hammond trafos in CA, but they're actually more expensive than the nicer ones I found, despite shipping form the US.

I've done a lot of the leg work, but it would still be a bit of a pain to follow through with this, so does anyone know of a kit supplier (preferably Canadian, but lets not restrict ourselves to that) who would have a similar bare bones kit for a more competitive price? .... and as I write this I may have answerred my own question - when looking at MojoTone's kit you can select the parts you want by clicking on the circuit layout; even then (and even though some of those parts aren't as high quality as the ones I sourced, but good enough) it comes to US$133ish (CA$180ish) ... plus more shipping etc (also that doesn't include the higher wattage resistors, cuz they are out of stock and it doesn't even show me the price; can't be that much more tho). That's pretty close, I guess, but if I can't do better than that I think I still rather go my own way.

I am looking at building this very small; mini lunchbox head (maybe even something that will fit on a pedalboard, large but still) with Herzog mods; essentially a tube rectified Herzog. The filter cap size is the main issue, but I am looking into some super-mini electros (so far can't find any without a stupid high min qty - there's some promising ones by Kemet).


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## dcole (Oct 8, 2008)

I ordered from here before for rebuilding a Valve Junior. They have a bare bones 5F1 kit here:

Fender components kits


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

Thanks - will check that out.


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## johnnyshaka (Nov 2, 2014)

I'll be following along as I've been kicking around the idea of building my own amp at some point. So, please, keep us posted on your findings. Good luck!


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

dcole said:


> Fender components kits


So this is even more bare bones than I am looking for - litterally only caps and resistors - I still need the iron and tube sockets. If I putrchase those seperately it still comes to US$138 (just a hair more than Mojotone).

Thanks for the lead though; keep em coming everyone.


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## Ti-Ron (Mar 21, 2007)

Drop a line to Trinity amps, maybe.
Their kits are well praised and I heard that the guys over there a really open to accommodate costumers.


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

They don't even do a Champ kit though - the Tweed kit is a larger push pull type amp, and the tramp, though single-ended, is a much more complicated afair with like 5 or more knobs; gonna be too big). The Trifly is close to what I want to accomplish in terms of size and form factor, but I definitely want a pentode in there not just triodes. I have been thinking that I might have to give up on tube rectification to get down to the size I am looking for here but not ready to give up on that just yet. I'm not building this for clean tones after all (will probably use it more in Herzog mode than as a stand alone amp). Even that Trifly kit is US$290 with a lower part count vs a Champ (also smaller less expensive caps; the iron looks about the same but not sure, and 1 less tube) so not even gonna bother them. Their stuff looks good (the Triwatt and TripTop models have caught my eye before ), but I just can't be paying that much for an unbuilt amp.

Thanks though!


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

5F1 Tweed Champ 60S Guitar Tube Amp Amplifier Kit & Chassis DIY | eBay


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

Looks like I'm much better off sourcing me own bits. ....I am a real sucker for punishment though; considerring putting a Garnet Stinger in this thing between V1A and B (looks like it could work). She ain't gonna be small; ah well.

.... might be better off with solid state rectification if I do that though. Would at least compensate for the extra space the parts require.


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## Lincoln (Jun 2, 2008)

Granny Gremlin said:


> Looks like I'm much better off sourcing me own bits. ....I am a real sucker for punishment though; considerring putting a Garnet Stinger in this thing between V1A and B (looks like it could work). She ain't gonna be small; ah well.


The 5F1 Champ chassis is a real bear to work in. It is such a small space......a little bigger might be better. Have you checked out next generation for transformers? I find I can buy Hammond from next Gen cheaper than I can bring Classic Tone transformers in from the States once the shipping is factored in. My go-to guy for boards is in St. Catharines. "Chuck0652" is his eBay handle. Great guy. 
Also check out "Seaside Chassis Design" in Canada


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

I'm not using the 5F1 chassis, so no problemo.

I checked NextGen - the ones I have sourced (a bit nicer than the Hammonds) would probably be about the same price or less after shipping (before shipping it's CA$126.46 for the Hammonds at NextGen; the ones I am looking at are C$99.96 - $30 should cover shipping, and if I buy nothing else from NextGen - doesn't look like they have anything else I need - then I still have to pay shipping on top of that anyway so might save some money AND get nicer trannies).

Considering using a Hammond style 1590DD super-ginormous (7.5 x 5 x 1.5") pedal enclosure ( hmmn, NextGen also has those, not the best price but that does bring me up to within $5 of the free shipping threshold with so maybe worth reconsidering). That'll be cheaper than any other enclosure (Seaside included - thanks for the tip; just checked them out). Otherwise I'll do me own metalwork (it's not rocket science). Same with the board. I'll probably use perfboard since I have plenty lying about; otherwise I can DIY some turret as I have a load of 1/4" masonite laying about as well.


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## keithb7 (Dec 28, 2006)

Boothill amps. Fave will set you up. You can order a 5F1 without cab, chassis, tubes or transformers. Google it.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

keithb7 said:


> Boothill amps. Fave will set you up. You can order a 5F1 without cab, chassis, tubes or transformers. Google it.


Wow those are great prices. His 5F6 Bassman kit is officially on my to do list.


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

cboutilier said:


> Wow those are great prices. His 5F6 Bassman kit is officially on my to do list.


That's what I thought too, but read the fine print: no transformers included (for the 5F1, the transformers are another US$100, which is pretty steep).


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## keithb7 (Dec 28, 2006)

You can buy your transformers anywhere you want. A pair of transformers from pretty well anyone will be $100. If made in Noth America. Weber sell cheap Chinese trannies. If you want you can buy them there. Hammonds will be over a $100 for the pair I'd bet.


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## keithb7 (Dec 28, 2006)

cboutilier said:


> Wow those are great prices. His 5F6 Bassman kit is officially on my to do list.


If you go find me on Tdpri you can follow along on a 5F6-A that I am building right now. Boothill kit. Going into a 2004 year Bassman '59 Ltd. with demo clips posted too.


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## keithb7 (Dec 28, 2006)

Double post


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

keithb7 said:


> If you go find me on Tdpri you can follow along on a 5F6-A that I am building right now. Boothill kit. Going into a 2004 year Bassman '59 Ltd. with demo clips posted too.


You know damn well I'm already following that. I'm keeping my eyes open for a blown up HRD or BDRI that I can caress into a Tweed era beauty


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## keithb7 (Dec 28, 2006)

@cboutilier Lol. I figured. There is a killer deal on a hand wired BF Deluxe Rev on Kijiji in St John's NL right now. Its a mojotone kit. I looked up prices. I estimate it'd cost $1800 delivered to Canada. Unassembled. The seller is aking $950. Working assembled amp. Been on there 5-6 weeks. $800 may take it. Killer amp.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

Why not just keep your eyes peeled for a 2nd hand Champion 600? They don't have the 5Y3 rectifier, and whatever comes with that, soundwise, but there is a whole helluva lot in common between the 600 and the 5F1, if you bypass the tonestack.


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## Granny Gremlin (Jun 3, 2016)

keithb7 said:


> You can buy your transformers anywhere you want. A pair of transformers from pretty well anyone will be $100. If made in Noth America. Weber sell cheap Chinese trannies. If you want you can buy them there. Hammonds will be over a $100 for the pair I'd bet.


Nope; you can get the same Classic Tone models for US$25 less (in both cases before shipping, but both are US sellers) from CT direct ... also paying shipping on 2 packages vs 1 from the states also makes things silly and kill the diff. With Shipping included Hammonds from NextGen would be cheaper (CA$126.50 shipped vs US$100 = CA$135+shipping which would be at least another 20).

Anyway, since I've decided to build a pretty customised device now vs what I was originally thinking (Champ with Herzog mods - output, input and deep switch; bright switch; Garnet Stinger circuit; switchable tube vs solid state rectifier maybe) and because I can do so much better on sourcing my own parts (been there done that; a bit of work but worth it) I think that's what I'ma gonna do. I can get all the guts (minus iron) from a place in the 905 (no shipping and better prices on large caps vs TheTubeStore; like better by 1/4 to 1/3rd) and local parts stores (e.g. Honson; Sayal). The rest I am still deciding on which way to go, but I have some good options. Thanks for all yer help and brainstorming.

Next: talking about the schem I am currently drawing in the technical forum.



mhammer said:


> Why not just keep your eyes peeled for a 2nd hand Champion 600? They don't have the 5Y3 rectifier, and whatever comes with that, soundwise, but there is a whole helluva lot in common between the 600 and the 5F1, if you bypass the tonestack.


Cool idea, but in my case (see above) not gonna werk.


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## cboutilier (Jan 12, 2016)

keithb7 said:


> @cboutilier Lol. I figured. There is a killer deal on a hand wired BF Deluxe Rev on Kijiji in St John's NL right now. Its a mojotone kit. I looked up prices. I estimate it'd cost $1800 delivered to Canada. Unassembled. The seller is aking $950. Working assembled amp. Been on there 5-6 weeks. $800 may take it. Killer amp.


That's a great price. If I didn't already have a handwired Deluxe Reverb on steroids I'd have someone bring that down for me. But if I really want a DR, I can just mod my Vibroclone for 6V6's and make it a close enough to a 1x15 DR.


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