# Compensated nut



## guitarman2 (Aug 25, 2006)

I've been talking to a luthier about setups for my guitars. He mentioned that he does compensated nuts. I've never really heard of this before so I've been doing a bit of reading on the subject. Anyone out there ever had this done to their guitar? For anyone who has, I'd like to hear your opinions.


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## Rugburn (Jan 14, 2009)

I've heard of the Buzz Feiten tuning system. This actually moves the nut forward, and as such is an irreversible modification. This may not be the same thing your tech is discussing with you. The first few frets on even a well set up guitar will be somewhat sharp because of end tension. Of course the other side of all this is "close enough for country" and "it's only rock n' roll".


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

AFAIK, Feiten is one of several compensated systems out there. And as Rugburn alludes to, there are a bunch of things to compensate _for_. To the best of my knowledge, the Feiten system incorporates not only a change in nut position, but a small change in string spacing as well, so that the strings subtend slightly different angles from nut to saddle.

We assume that all strings are to be divided up, pitchwise, in identical fashion, but they're not all alike. D and G may proceed to the bridge relatively straight, but E, A, B and E are at a bit of an angle, given the differential width of the nut and saddle. Yes, we attempt to adjust for this via saddle position, but the frets are still perfectly parallel to each other and dividing the assumed string length up equivalently.

What we do to a string when we fret is a little different on those first few frets than higher up the neck. Fret above the 7th, and the string goes down "willingly". It might go down every bit as willingly on the first few frets if the nut were cut low enough, but then everything would buzz, right? So, because the nut has to hold the string up high enough to avoid buzzing, when we fret low on the fingerboard, we are simultaneously pulling the string back towards the nut (just like tuning upwards a bit), even as we press down.

Compensated nuts attempt to adjust for that. In some respects, consider it the complement to an intonated adjustable saddle.

I've not played such a setup, but what I've heard from folks is that having the only compensated nut in a multiple-guitar band situation can make everybody else sound out of tune. So, if you're getting it done to a guitar you play on your own, or if you play in a power trio, or with a keyboard, bass, and drums, OR with other guitar players who have also had their guitar nuts compensated, you're alright.

As an irreversible modification, though, it may put a crimp in the resale value or marketability. However, somebody somewhere has to sell a retrofit nut that adds a little spacing to "uncompensate", right?

With all of those considerations to juggle, though, people still have some very good things to say about playing guitars that_* finally *_sound intonated all the way up the fingerboard.


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## gtrguy (Jul 6, 2006)

GONE


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## bbigsby (Mar 23, 2009)

My guitar tech does them as well. He says once a customer upgrades one guitar, it does not take long before they come back asking to have the rest of their guitars upgraded.


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## TimelessInst (Apr 4, 2012)

We do Buzz Feiten, picked it up a few years ago and we are certified to train level one and two technicians. First off, Feiten's system, if you use their nuts uses a shelf that hangs over the fretboard. so if you keep your old nut it IS reversible. The theory behind all of these different systems is to get the guitar in tune as best as possible as you play all over the fingerboard. Standard intonation tunes each string to itself, and sounds pretty good for the most part. Feiten's system is based of the same theory used in pianos so that they can play in all keys and sound good (developed by Verchmeister, don't quote that spelling). It seeks to tune the strings harmonically to each other. it fixes some of those troublesome chords that guitars can sound just a bit off in. But we've found that in retrofits, it also has an effect of evening the temperment of the guitar in all keys and areas of the fretboard. Weaker strings come alive, notes that used to blare out among the others will blend a little more. We believe it's a better way of building, but that's the opinion of one shop. Some guys don't buy into it.


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## Jim DaddyO (Mar 20, 2009)

Good thread. I would really like to try to learn how to make compensated nuts, but, where do you start. Do you intone at the bridge first, and than make up the difference at the nut? or the other way around? Is it a standard measurement of compensation on each string? Etc. etc.


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## mhammer (Nov 30, 2007)

TimelessInst said:


> We do Buzz Feiten, picked it up a few years ago and we are certified to train level one and two technicians. First off, Feiten's system, if you use their nuts uses a shelf that hangs over the fretboard. so if you keep your old nut it IS reversible. The theory behind all of these different systems is to get the guitar in tune as best as possible as you play all over the fingerboard. Standard intonation tunes each string to itself, and sounds pretty good for the most part. Feiten's system is based of the same theory used in pianos so that they can play in all keys and sound good (developed by Verchmeister, don't quote that spelling). It seeks to tune the strings harmonically to each other. it fixes some of those troublesome chords that guitars can sound just a bit off in. But we've found that in retrofits, it also has an effect of evening the temperment of the guitar in all keys and areas of the fretboard. Weaker strings come alive, notes that used to blare out among the others will blend a little more. We believe it's a better way of building, but that's the opinion of one shop. Some guys don't buy into it.


Thanks for that. A very useful and informative post.


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## J-75 (Jul 29, 2010)

I've seen _brass_ compensated nuts (for Gretsch's) on fleabay. - just FYI, so you can have a look at them.


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## noman (Jul 24, 2006)

I have a telecaster that has a compensated bone nut made and installed by Michael McConnville (from Stratford). Works great and makes the guitar sound good. I will post a pic later.............


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