# ABR-1 Bridge Help



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

I've got bridge troubles on an old guitar that is a favorite of mine. I've got a couple of gigs coming up that I really want to use it at, but lately I've been breaking strings too often because the saddles are in such bad shape. One of the previous owners of the guitar installed a Gotoh ABR-1 style bridge (I think that's what it is - am I correct?). It came with pre-notched saddles on it that don't match the string spacing of the guitar, so some of the slots that were filed in it use some of the pre-notches and some don't (see photo). A few of the notches are now badly grooved. I'd like to either replace the bridge with a new one, or replace the saddles in this one (preferably with saddles that are not pre-notched so that the slots can be cut to match the string spacing). I bought a new Les Paul ABR-1 style bridge online, thinking I could replace it with that, but when I received it the post holes are much larger than the posts in the guitar (see photo).




























So, what do you guys recommend? If I need a new bridge, what do I need to order to get the correct size post holes. This is one of my favorite guitars, so I want the best solution rather than the cheapest. But, I would love to get it fixed quickly so that I have it for a couple of mid-August gigs. I thought of pulling the saddles out of the new Les Paul ABR-1, but they don't seem to be removable in either bridge. I'm sure that there is a trick to that. Thanks a lot in advance for your time and advice. PS: You may notice that I have the bridge on the guitar backwards now. I did that out of desperation at my last rehearsal as I ran out of spare strings. I didn't break any more strings with the bridge on backwards, but I'm sure the intonation is buggered. I'd rather fix it properly than try to intonate it with the bridge on backwards. PPS: The really keen may also notice that I've got two low E strings on it. Like I said, desperation. This is a supreme sounding guitar, and deserves the best it can get. Help us out please.


----------



## keto (May 23, 2006)

You *should* be able to find just saddles, got a Long & McQuade where you live? Take the guitar in and have them let you test fit a set of saddles on your existing saddle screws to make sure they are the same pitch.


----------



## al3d (Oct 3, 2007)

just replace with graphtech saddles..

http://www.graphtech.com/products/brands/string-saver/string-saver-originals-tune-o-matics


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

Agreed with AL3D. Graphtech saddles are an excellent option to replace saddles like yours.
The exact model you want is this one (Gotoh/Japan): 
http://www.lydian.ca/store/en/saddles-pins/113-japan-style-string-saver-saddle-set.html


----------



## kat_ (Jan 11, 2007)

+1 on graphtech saddles. They also have a non-notched version.


----------



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

kat_ said:


> +1 on graphtech saddles. They also have a non-notched version.


 Thanks guys. Any difference in tone with the Graphtechs? I checked the Lydian link, as they are in Canada, but they are all out of stock there. Will the non-notched saddles fit my bridge? http://www.lydian.ca/store/en/42-tuneomatic-saddles


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

The Graphtech saddles that fit the Gotoh are notched. That's the only option. The other thing you could try is a TonePros upgrade bridge.


----------



## kat_ (Jan 11, 2007)

ghynes said:


> Thanks guys. Any difference in tone with the Graphtechs?


I'm of the belief that everything changes the tone in some way, but it's often really tiny ways. I haven't tried the graphtech saddles on any of my electrics yet but I put their nuts on all of my guitars and their saddles on all of my acoustics. Best upgrade for the money ever. Canadian company too, so pretty easy to find a lot of Canadian retailers. Looks like you'll either be recutting notches or modifying saddles. Maybe take the guitar to some stores and look at which saddles they have and see what's going to be less work.


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

kat_ said:


> I'm of the belief that everything changes the tone in some way, but it's often really tiny ways. I haven't tried the graphtech saddles on any of my electrics yet but I put their nuts on all of my guitars and their saddles on all of my acoustics. Best upgrade for the money ever. Canadian company too, so pretty easy to find a lot of Canadian retailers. Looks like you'll either be recutting notches or modifying saddles. Maybe take the guitar to some stores and look at which saddles they have and see what's going to be less work.


Yeah, they will be changing the tone a little but in a positive way IMO. I've just upgraded a Gibson SG with them and there was more body to the tone and the high end was smoother.


----------



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

LydianGuitars said:


> Yeah, they will be changing the tone a little but in a positive way IMO. I've just upgraded a Gibson SG with them and there was more body to the tone and the high end was smoother.


Well, that sounds good. The guitar sounds brilliant now, but I'd definitely be up for trying them. It's gotta get fixed anyhow. Right now, some of the slots are cut into the side of the pre-notches. Not great. I may be able to get a better job than this done, but it is unfortunate that the pre-notches are there. Actually, they might be full on slots, are they? In which case, how can I narrow the string spacing?


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

I'm just wondering... what is the stock string spacing on your guitar? Do you know what make/model it is? Perhaps there's some specs out there. You could use that as a starting point. 
Personally, I would avoid getting notched saddles if they don't match your guitar. Some TOM bridges have 2" spacing as opposed to the usual 2-1/16".
You might as well do things right and get the proper bridge/saddles.

Another thing. That bridge is a Gotoh Japanese bridge. The ABR-1 is the original TuneOMatic (TOM) bridge that mounts over small threaded studs. Then came the Nashville TOM, which mount over a non-threaded stud and threads into bushings in the body, similarily to your Gotoh. Those are the three main ones and they are not interchangeable.


----------



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

LydianGuitars said:


> I'm just wondering... what is the stock string spacing on your guitar? Do you know what make/model it is? Perhaps there's some specs out there. You could use that as a starting point.


Thanks Lydian, and I agree with you 100%. Best to do it right. The reason the current saddles are so messed up is because they were pre-notched.

The guitar is an old Gretsch Corvette. I think it is a '62. Looks the same as this one: http://gretschpages.com/guitars/models/examples/1311/

There is quite a bit of info on the net about them, but I haven't run into the string spacing yet. It's got a little narrower than a LP. Is is something I can measure myself?


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

If its a little narrower than an LP, its probably 2". I highly doubt that it would be less than that. What is the current spacing you have on there?

Is the Gotoh bridge original? I'd be surprised if it was.


----------



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

I'll measure it this evening. The spacing will be from the outside of the high E to the inside of the low E? I doubt the Gotoh is original as well, only because I don't figure Gretsch was using any Japanese parts back in the early 60s, though I could be wrong about that. It was on there when I got it and it worked fine for a while but the saddles are getting too beat for me to trust it at gigs now. I play this guitar a lot as it is one of my favorites so everything is wearing on it. I figure I'll be putting SS frets on it in a year or two at the current wear rate.


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

If the string spread is the way you like it, measure from the e to E at the saddle, center to center. Measuring the neck heel at the 22nd fret would be useful too.


----------



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

LydianGuitars said:


> If the string spread is the way you like it, measure from the e to E at the saddle, center to center. Measuring the neck heel at the 22nd fret would be useful too.


I measured 1.897" E to E at the saddle using a set of calibrated digital calipers. It could stand to be slightly more than than, but any more than about 1.95 or 1.96" and I'd have problems with the high E coming off the bottom of the fretboard. I'm fine with it they way it is now on this guitar though. The neck is 2.145" wide at the 22nd fret. Thanks again!


----------



## Erich Walther (Jul 27, 2013)

Just a suggestion.. Is there anyone in your area who does guitar repair? I'm not implying that you don't attempt to fix things yourself. But it may be a good idea to visit an actual Luthier or "guitar tech" afterwards and get them to double check your job, to make sure you've got things set up properly.


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

Agreed on the luthier suggestions... and get references. The only bridge you'll find un-notched saddles for is the nashville style bridge (or ABR-1 but since the Gotoh has posts & bushings, the Nashville is the better option). Personally, that's what I would retrofit on a guitar like that.


----------



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

LydianGuitars said:


> Agreed on the luthier suggestions... and get references.


Thanks. Not aware of any good ones in the area that are still at it. Used to have a great one, but he retired, so now I am on my own. Not scared though. I know where to look for help. Thanks guys.


----------



## ghynes (Oct 12, 2009)

LydianGuitars said:


> Agreed on the luthier suggestions... and get references. The only bridge you'll find un-notched saddles for is the nashville style bridge (or ABR-1 but since the Gotoh has posts & bushings, the Nashville is the better option). Personally, that's what I would retrofit on a guitar like that.


 What about this one - http://www.callahamguitars.com/abr1.htm

Specifically this one, on the right hand size. My studs are 4mm and the spacing is 74mm.*Callaham ABR-1 Bridge
with Metric Studs
and Thumbwheels
$145.00*
[SIZE=-1]These studs are for mounting Asian copies of vintage Gibson's that use a 4 mm stud screwed directly into the wood top. Stud spacing must be 2.915 in. (74.0 mm) to work with our bridge. Studs and thumbwheels are M4 x .7. Many thanks![/SIZE]


----------



## LydianGuitars (Apr 18, 2013)

I was looking at the gotoh bridge I have in the shop here and although the saddles are notched, the notch is very shallow.

You could file down the saddle until that little surface notch dissappears and re-notch for your guitar.


----------

